"We have some talented players that Moyes will not play".
I have watched every game this season and I am totally lost as to which player or players everyone is talking about.
Vellios? Give me a break. One goal against the mighty Wigan (fuck all else the rest of that game). Nothing else since. Barkley? He played well against an absolute shite QPR team who basically gave away the midfield area to defend deep after they scored. The next game against Blackburn brought him back down to earth. Drenthe? Yep ? noticed his sublime passing yesterday.
Hey, I cannot take much more of the shit turfed up at GP or at away games myself, but, what else can Moyes do?
If you have been watching for the past 5 years you will know that Moyes can put out a team that will win games: ? Pienaar, Arteta & Baines feeding the Yak or a fit Saha were more than a match for most. But hey, all bar Baines have long gone and as for Saha, he couldn't give a toss anymore.
I think most people need to get real because this is how it is and for the record, BK has got to be proud. But to keep yapping on about Moyes going to City with a Â£50k greek kid and the much sought after Drenthe, then playing for a win. Yeah, the mighty Spurs tried that one and got well turfed over.
It's going to be 4-6-0 all the way, keep EFC in the EPL and take it from there. The board knows there will be losses (the gates at GP are definately getting lower) but survival in the EPL is Moyes's number one aim. Hey, my guess is that Moyes will probably pick up a nice bonus for doing it.
Mike Gwyer, Posted 25/09/2011 at 10:01:51
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1 Posted 25/09/2011 at 15:40:23
Plenty of moaning - but I have never seen one decent credible alternative put up by anybody. I have seen plenty of names put up on managers who have since been sacked or foreign managers who are unlikely to leave clubs who are in and around champs league with prospects and cash to spend. So gone then - give me your best.
2 Posted 25/09/2011 at 15:41:26
The lad was on the pitch for 1/4 of the game and scored a goal -- there wasn't much of a "rest of the game" to judge him on, FFS.
He comes on against City and creates the best chance we made all game with what was his second real touch of the ball. He's a natural striker, at least, and has demonstrated he's up for it and is therefore worth giving more playing time to.
3 Posted 25/09/2011 at 16:08:50
I think Lyndon has made a case for Vellios and I agree. Saha as he must be fit and maybe look at Gueye and Drenthe. Oh and lets not forget Straq.
So that gives us some attacking options or don't the players above play a) in goal or b) in defence?
We could always ask the coach driver to play next week as I am sure he has more experience at parking a bus if thats the type of football you want to watch every week.
I gather by your post that you wouldn't consider the options above and believe that defence is the best form of defence. Are you David Moyes or what?
4 Posted 25/09/2011 at 16:18:28
For me the fundamental here is that there is a negative mentality at the Club at the moment. Off the field this has been covered in great depth and has divided the fans and alieneated many from the Club's management. On the field, Moyes admitted he set the team up to stop City playing; on MotD last night this was made very clear, we had all our 11 men in our penalty on many occasions and the fact that with a bit more luck we could have got a point does not justify the tactics (NSNO anyone?).
Moyes can get the team playing half-decent football, as we have seen over the last few years; indeed last year his success against the "big" clubs (having a go) made up for the many poor performances against the rest. Yesterday, though, he chose the tactics and they were wholly negative. "What can he do about it?" ? you ask; how about giving the other team something to think about (other than how to break us down)... play a recognised striker instead of the increasingly injury-prone and out-of-form Cahill.
We have a few difficult games coming up and the attitude and associated tactics need to change if we are to get anything from these games. Much as Kompany's tackle was a nasty one and he should have been sent off, he may have done us a favour if Cahill is now injured, as it will hopefully force Moyes away from this 4-6-0 crap.
5 Posted 25/09/2011 at 16:43:55
The football served up this season home and away except for Villa has been abysmal. I know we have no money, the board etc etc but any chance we could go out and try to be positive?
Moyes had lost us the match yesterday before the game with his comments ? and this feeds to the players. IMWT ? in mediocrity we trust.
6 Posted 25/09/2011 at 16:39:39
This might be "how it is" but, 'hey' it doesn't mean it's right or that people have to be in fucking agreement with it"
"Yeah, the mighty Spurs tried that one and got well turfed over."
Guess someone forgot to tell Fulham that it's futile to resist, 'hey' ?
"Hey, I cannot take much more of the shit turfed up at GP or at away games myself, but, what else can Moyes do?"
Well, 'hey', maybe he could, erm...try something different. Perhaps name a more attacking line up instead of being overly cautious every single game. Every time the team news filters through before the game the audible groans and utterances of "for fucks sake" fill the air. People are entering the ground thinking 'here we go again, same old shite' before the game's even started. No wonder the crowd at Goodison has been about as enthusiastic as a vibrating blow up doll with real bush but no batteries for the last 10 months.
"It's going to be 4-6-0 all the way, keep EFC in the EPL and take it from there"
I'm so glad I renewed my season ticket
7 Posted 25/09/2011 at 20:11:17
Without moyes we wouldn't be in the perm.
Oh yeah we could play and put a formation out like Blackpool did or try and play like martinez does at Wigan and we would be fighting delegation every season and eventually go down..great
8 Posted 25/09/2011 at 20:28:11
You would have thought Moyes would have learned from the West Brom game that Cahill should not be used upfront on his own because he can't hold the ball up when we play this long ball approach! If you're going to play these negative tactics you need someone upfront who's either quick and can catch them on the break or is big and can help retain possession, Cahill is neither (through no fault of his own).
9 Posted 25/09/2011 at 20:29:33
Absolutely agree, easy to say play an attacking formation as you point out Blackpool last year and Wigan are playing in that style. Even Man Utd play with Rooney behind a lone striker, so even they don't go gung ho.
I thought Joe Royle made some good points when he said that the trouble with playing Saha is he is injured more than he is fit so you get no consistency. Also, it is all very well bringing on Velios for the last 20 minutes, it is a lot to ask the lad to play the full 90 being so inexperienced.
Strange how the pundits were saying that many other teams who go to the Etihad may use the same ploy as Davie Moyes and employ a marker for David Silva. They rely very heavily on Silva creating things for them. But not many on here will say how tactically aware Moyes was to use this tactic, a ploy that almost worked till Ballotelli's deflected goal.
10 Posted 25/09/2011 at 22:08:39
Against Wigan he played roughly 15 minutes and turned in a good performance.
Same again against WBA in Carling Cup.
Yesterday he chased down several lost causes creating our best chance in the process, and I was just coming round in Arowe Park hospital after an op.
Next time you submit an article please get it right!
You're probably a decent bloke but came across as a complete tit because of this article.
11 Posted 26/09/2011 at 00:14:29
12 Posted 26/09/2011 at 02:39:49
Instead we were treated to 10-0-0
13 Posted 26/09/2011 at 03:22:41
14 Posted 26/09/2011 at 04:10:09
Just another example of Moyes not committing to all out attack.
15 Posted 26/09/2011 at 07:32:43
You may be happy with Moyes negative tactics Mike - but I am not. The object of the game is to score more goals than the opposing team - do you think David Moyes realises that?
Vellios and Strac may be the real deal - they may not - but there is only one way to find out and it's NOT by just giving them the odd 10 minutes game time is it ?
I have to laugh when I read in the press or see somebody on TV saying that Moyes gives young players a chance!!!! Really in the last 4 games Vellios has probably been on the pitch for about 40 minutes - I think he has posed more of a threat than Cahill in that game time. And that's not having a dig at Tim - Cahill has done very well - but he has been battling against the odds because he is NOT a striker.By playing him out of position it means we are not getting the best out of one of our main players.
And David - face the facts Cahill is not a striker, holding the ball up to lay off for others, playing as a target man isn't his game. Did you see the Wigan match ? Things started to happen when Moyes brought strikers on. The Man City game - we had 2 strikers on for about 10 minutes and in that time we looked more threatening than in the previous 80 minutes.
16 Posted 26/09/2011 at 09:03:10
Yes, we got what we deserved, Man City dominated from start to finish and it felt like it was just a matter of time before they broke through - deflected goal or not.
Whilst it was great to have 3 strikers in the squad, it is something of an indictment that none started. Our "attacking intent" was evident by the fact that on the rare occasions we got a corner, we'd often have 4 in the box, with 7 defenders.
I can just about stomach that approach away at a team like City, but as others have pointed out, starting like that at home against QPR is hardly going to have the crowds returning. It's still early days of course, but I don't see many other top flight clubs being about 3k down on last seasons average gate. Why is that?
17 Posted 26/09/2011 at 11:24:18
18 Posted 26/09/2011 at 12:00:53
Have you ever seen a boxer win a fight without throwing a punch?
19 Posted 26/09/2011 at 13:07:55
Nevermind who you think should or shouldn't be playing upfront, to slag this guy off is ridiculous.
"one goal against wigan then fuck all else". Not only is the statement false, but if it wasn't what more do you want from the lad? He came on and scored the goal that put us back in the lead.
I've had enough of these clowns - give the lad a break! He has probably looked our most effective striker in the limited time we have watched him this season. And that probably says everything you need to know about the strikers at our disposal.
20 Posted 26/09/2011 at 13:18:52
Factually inaccurate rubbish.
21 Posted 26/09/2011 at 14:40:51
I?ve seen Fulham mentioned as ?proof? that we could have played better by playing differently... obviously these posters did not watch the match, but irrespective let's deal with the obvious differences first;
1) Fulham were at home;
2) City played in the Champions League, Fulham in Europa in the midweek before. Both us and city played in midweek, but we did not rest a complete team unlike City, and played to 120mins (resting some, but playing some again on Saturday).
Beyond that, for those who watched the Fulham game, City contributed massively to their own downfall, by going defensive and losing control of the game. The two circumstances are not comparable. Fulham would not have got a result at City playing like they did at home. The only chance for most teams, will be to park the bus at City and play on the counter (Napoli did a good job of it).
We spent nothing in the summer and are unique in that respect. We spent barely anything the season before. We have consistently been one of the lowest net spenders in the league in recent seasons (Compare us to Villa and Spurs, and those above.)
We always start seasons badly. Managerial blame? Perhaps? Because we go to America? Perhaps. Because we need the money that America brings in? Most probably. Irrespective of that, we have 7 points from 5 games. It?s not great, but it?s not awful.
Apart from Old Trafford away, City is the hardest place to go. Losing to QPR was poor, but undeserved, and QPR?s tactics (as anyone who followed them last season will know) are better suited to away football. We beat Blackburn luckily, but beat them nonetheless, should have beaten Villa and beat Wigan. We?ve also won twice in the Carling Cup. 4 wins from 7 seems pretty good to me, isn?t it? Given the doom and gloom that surrounded us before a ball was kicked, are the state of things so very bad?
Please bring some realism into this domain. If we played attacking football.... we would win some games we have drawn and lost... and lost some games we have won, we would lose. Barcelona wouldn?t win so many playing defensively... Greece wouldn?t have won the European Championship playing offensively. The poorer the team... the less easy it is to attack and be successful.
If we had Man U?s money or City?s, I'm sure we could and would attack and we would all sit pleased in the stands. Unfortunately we do not, and sticking two up front isn?t going to turn us into winners.
Please stop the blind praise of Vellios... he has looked promising yes, but nothing more. When strikers come on as sub, they inevitably change matters, especially at home. Even Bendtner looked ok as sub. But they do well, because they are a sub, because they are playing against tiring legs and are full of running. The Greek striker will not win us games from the start. Saha might, and let?s hope he gets fit and does.
Moyes has been successful. He has not won trophies... but success is relative. Where we have finished in the league, with our net spends, is success. When he goes, we will go. Please bring some realism into the domain. Please.
22 Posted 26/09/2011 at 15:35:40
23 Posted 26/09/2011 at 17:03:36
If we'd have tried anything other than contain City on Saturday, we'd have been embarassed....however - where we are playing a team like West Brom, at home - a team that came and parked two banks of four and showed little attacking intention except on the break - why the hell are we playing with two holding midfielders - Rodwell and Fellaini?
It took the usual goal on the counter to force Moyes into the more positive approach he should have taken at the start - pushing Fellaini upfront with Vellios. Suddenly we had options and openings upfront and the rest is history.
Its not the fact that Moyes tries to contain the likes of Man Utd or City with a careful formation - its the fact that he generally sets up the same shape against those sides we should be more confident of attacking.
I wonder how he'll approach next Saturday???
24 Posted 26/09/2011 at 20:11:35
John #6. Your response was a bit like the pub banter you would have with your mate?s, but the problem is, we ain?t mates. Keep your sarcastic bollox to yourself.
Anthony #8. The third goal against Wigan was created by other wonder striker Stracular.
Andrew #18. Applause accepted.
Tom #19. Regarding Vellios - fair comment, you see something I don?t and if I had Moyes?s hear I?d tell him that there are fans out there who think Vellios is the man. Though we all know Moyes is a stubborn bastard and that he won?t play Vellios just to piss them off ? absolutely fuckall to do with his knowledge of football.
Guy #20 and chum # 22. What the fuck is it that you two know that I don?t? Your opinion, regarding Everton, is based on what you see and that?s exactly how I would read it ? your opinion. To call my opinion ?factually inaccurate rubbish? leads me to think you know more and that you are not some fucking wooly back blue, getting pissed because Moyes didn?t play his Torres quality strike force at City.
25 Posted 26/09/2011 at 22:06:12
"Keep your sarcastic bollox to yourself."
26 Posted 26/09/2011 at 22:24:41
It's not pretty but this stuff about "We're Everton, we deserve better" etc etc is meaningless while we have a clueless board who will take us down the pipe. We've played good stuff under Moyes in recent years, via Arteta, Pienaar, Baines and Donovan but his job is getting harder if we keep selling our best players and not replacing them. Let's focus on beating the shite now.
27 Posted 27/09/2011 at 04:41:52
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