Season 2011-12
The Mail Bag

Crab football, False dawns and no hope!!!

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I can honestly say with my hand on my heart, I have not felt happy walking away from Goodison Park this season. I now watch Everton with an increasing gloom witnessing the negative football we play.

Please no-one preach to me that we play attractive positive free-flowing football or any of those elements of what we enjoy about football. We play negative sideways crab like football. With poor passing. No movement, infuriating back-passing, unbelievable punts up field by our stand-in captain, poor crossing of the ball, or ? if there is a quality cross ? no-one is there to connect with it.

Our goalie, whilst being a decent shot-stopper, has my heart in my mouth every time there is a high ball into the area. I yearn for edge-of-the-seat play; I yearn to be shouting from my seat "Great pass!" "What a run!", "Oh my god, what a shot!" "Brilliant play!"... No, none of that ? just boring backward crab-like shit with no pace no magic, no entertainment.

I worry that Fellaini will leave because on Sunday he became incensed with the lack of movement in the team and him not having anyone to pass to. I worry that Barkley will just decide to say, "Fuck this, why should I play for a bloke who is prepared to have boring almost safe older players stopping me from progressing in my career?"

Now I am not blaming Moyes... I actually have a lot of respect for the man. I know everyone blames Kenwright ? well, not everyone but a lot of people. But I am not sure either of them can be blamed for where we have landed in this football place where we are now. All I know is that I am coming to the decision that football isn't worth the frustration I feel when I am walking out of Goodison every other Saturday.

Is it Kenwright? Is it Moyes?? Is it the Players??? (No, I don't think so...) All I know is that I won't be renewing my season ticket next year ? and if I don't do that, I can't see me choosing my games and coming to Goodison again. That saddens me, but I am 56 and soon to be 57 and want enjoyable times ? good times ? and I have to say I want more to life.

My biggest passion in life has been Everton and the banter I have with Liverpool supporters. But I am sick of false dawns. Sick of expecting things will improve that better times will come again. I am now convinced there is only more disappointment on the way. No new money, no new signings, no new ground... False dawns, false dawns, false dawns...

I know this is a ramble, I know this is a grammatical load of shite... But this is also a very frustrated and disappointed supporter who will be leaving the Blue Heaven I have loved for so long...

This is a totally pissed-off Evertonian signing off.

Mike McLoughlin, St. Helens     Posted 06/12/2011 at 22:26:55

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Jimmy Sørheim
1   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:02:35

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Hey, why dont you do something about it if you really feel that way??? I agree that it is not worth spending your time watching dog shit dry up, but you can start protesting against Moyes and Kenwright, take Moyes out first, then Kenwright. Now that makes my heart on fire.

I get a little exited by the thought, who would imagine.
Colin Potter
2   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:22:31

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You sound a bit like a hitman there Jim.
Could you let us know what your rates are?
I'll definitely throw a few bob into the ring.
Paul Knox
3   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:04:26

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I am the same age as you but I won't be turning my back on Everton. I have been an Evertonian from birth and I'll die one.

I come away from games betrayed by the shite caretakers and manager of our club. But, one day, we will get a new owner, new manager... and maybe a new ground. Dig in and wait ? it won't be long now.

If BK wants to do good by the fans he will have to sack Moyes. And if Moyes wants the best for him he needs to resign (blame his crap management on the club to cover himself... I don't care; anything to get rid of him).

Before they all start saying "beware of what you wish for", I'll take the chance; I'd rather go down fighting than giving up and I doubt that will happen.
Chris Matheson
4   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:30:02

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Mike I agree with the senitments. To your list I could add a few of my own: When a cross comes in to the centre forward, there is nobody else around to support him.

There is never any variation in our play - just out wide then a high ball lobbed back in, hopefully.

We complain about being last on Match of the Day, but sometimes I can't blame them for putting us on last.

If I didn't support us I would never want to watch us.

Kenwright Out.
Andrew Clare
5   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:30:42

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Now is the time for change.
Moyes has run out of ideas. He plays the same tactics week in week out. He plays the same off form /past it players week in week out. We are just so predictable and boring.
Get rid of all of them! Not the players- the management, the boardroom. They are failing our great club. Everton are one on the' jewels in the crown' of English football unfortunately after 20 years of mainly mediocre football not many people believe it.
Tony J Williams
6   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:36:49

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Jimmy, how about saying something different than you usual "protest against Moyes" tripe.

You start it off. You're like that little trouble causer at the back of a mob whispering in someones ear "he called your missus a slag, what are you going to do about it?"

Mike, I blame them all, the board for not supporting the Manager, the manager for his defensive tactics and the players for not giving a shit and not doing their jobs properly.

We all said the same as you about Fellaini on Sunday, he must be thinking that he can't wait to get out of this shit heap.

How many crosses went in and no-one was at the end to attack them? that is inexcusable, that I put on the players. You have to move forward with the play, not dawdle along and hope to catch up with it eventually.
Tony J Williams
7   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:43:25

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"He plays the same off form /past it players week in week out. We are just so predictable and boring.
Get rid of all of them! Not the players" - What? Even keep the past it players? Are they not to blame also then? Will they suddenly become not-past it with the arrival of a new manager?

We need about 8 new players, possibly a new manager and we definitely need a new board.
Danny Broderick
8   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:59:24

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Problem No 1 at Everton is the board/lack of finance.

Any other problems, i.e. Moyes's tactics, players etc, should be addressed after that one. Let's get rid of this incompetent board, and give Moyes some money to spend. If we don't see any improvement, then we can change the rest. There won't be a club left if we sack everyone!

Support the team, oppose stagnation.
Andrew Clare
9   Posted 07/12/2011 at 13:59:55

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Tony. Obviously get rid of the past it players as well! Yes you are right we do need about 8 new players a new manager a new board but, having said that we do have a nucleus of good players at the club.
Stephen Kenny
10   Posted 07/12/2011 at 14:07:49

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Jimmy,

Why don't you start the protest yourself if your so unhappy about Moyes.

Your on every thread saying we should do this an that except you live miles away and don't go the match.

I'm no fan of David Moyes, but I'm even less of a fan of people who grumble all day without ever doing anything about it!

There's more than one way to skin a cat and if your genuinely aggrieved lets see what YOUR gunna do about it?
Nick Entwistle
11   Posted 07/12/2011 at 14:11:41

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Stephen, Jimmy wants us to sign Beckham. Don't hassle the stupid. Sorry Jimmy.
Peter Laing
12   Posted 07/12/2011 at 15:26:05

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I'm one for taking action, I have been at all the blue union meeting's and marches, put my hand in my pocket to help fund their campaign and chose not to renew my season ticket as a sign of protest. Where has it got us to date? ? not very far, I guess... other than the sacking of Ian Ross and the usual lies and spin regarding investment trotted out before marches.

I'm honestly at the point where I am starting to swerve attending games and even my two kids aged 7 and 9 (diehard blues in a school full of plastic reds) can't be arsed going to the match anymore (their last two games Reading at home, QPR at home). Everything Mike says is right, I'm with him on these sentiments, sad times to be a blue.
Eugene Ruane
13   Posted 07/12/2011 at 15:56:05

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"Now I am not blaming Moyes... I actually have a lot of respect for the man. I know everyone blames Kenwright ? well, not everyone but a lot of people. But I am not sure either of them can be blamed for where we have landed in this football place where we are now".

Fuck me, NEITHER of them are to blame!?

Well that's certainly a..erm... different read on things.

Illogical, odd, insane even, BUT....very, VERY original!
John Hughes
14   Posted 07/12/2011 at 16:07:52

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Jimmy Sorheim #1

You say you get a little "Exited" by the thought. Does this mean you're off as well?
Mark Griff
15   Posted 07/12/2011 at 16:40:12

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Having watched us play sideways football all season and only Baines playing like any kind of attacking football, I have come to the conclusion that Davey Moyes has to walk.

This side is full of talent and up-and-coming talent who will be sold as soon as they reach a good price to keep Kenwright's profits intact...

We are boring to watch; we are never going to win anything (unless it will be on penalties), tactless... no game plan... no tactics.

A new manager is needed to take us forward. I am sick of the way Moyes churns this same shite out week after week. I call for him to leave ? and leave soon... before the fans leave!!!

Ian Tunstead
16   Posted 07/12/2011 at 16:45:43

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Mark, why do we play sideways football all season with only Baines playing any kind of attacking football? Do you think it is because Moyes has been forced to sell his most creative players so our not so good attacking midfielders have to play but dont have the ability to split a defence or create as many chances? Or do you think Moyes specifically tells his midfield to only pass backwards and sideways but Baines should get forward to catch them out?

I think the most realistic answer is the first one.

Michael Brien
17   Posted 07/12/2011 at 17:23:46

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David Moyes is a good manager - but he has become a very predictable one. Most of us can predict what his tactics will be and also when he will make substitutions - usually in the last 15 minutes. Does he think it's against the rules to make a change at half time !!?

Perhaps he is running out of ideas - there have been many times in football when a different manager has transformed a squad. Would another manager get more out of our current squad ? I have to say that I think the answer is yes. I have hoped that Moyes would show some signs of changing his approach of being more adventurous and attacking - but he is still churning out the same old same old tactics.

Yes I know Vellios was not sucessful last match - but why is it Moyes seems to give the strikers just one game and if they don't score/have a good game then they are out - but a player like Tim Howard can get away with gaffs like at Blackburn last season - and still keep his place ?

Sorry to have to say this but I think Moyes has become a latter day Gordon Lee.
James Stewart
18   Posted 07/12/2011 at 17:39:59

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Moyes ran out of ideas years ago.

We are now experiencing the slow death as we did with Smith before him. It will get worst before it gets better but hopefully he will be gone by next season.
John Ford
19   Posted 07/12/2011 at 17:48:09

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James you can only implement ideas with the players to do it...we had them....and now we dont!

Mike you express the feelings of many of us. We can argue until we're hoarse, and often do, as to the cause but whatever anyone thinks of the managerial position we will never play consistently good football without major investment. Depressing.
Sam Hoare
20   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:03:50

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I know this sort of suggestion may be frowned upon but does anyone think this Jimmy Sorheim character might be an infiltrator?

He pops up on every thread. Makes one highly incendiary usually poorly argued point and then never returns. he seems intent on stirring up a revolt of sorts.

Can we check his credentials somehow? Maybe a top 10 Everton players checklist?
Wayne McNee
21   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:02:02

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Last season I would've backed Moyes for the foreseeable future if given extra funds ( from somewhere ).

This season... Not so much. The worst thing in the world would be to allow him to spend! He works better with no money & all those no money, genius deals he pulled off have all but gone. I doubt we'll secure Drenthe long term which is a shame. Then the last few times he has spent we've had poor return in relation to the cost .. Bily, Hettinga & based on salary & price even Fellaini to a degree. I expect any new recruits in January will be of the panic variety. Imagine being an exciting young prospect or established flashing forward... Would you look at our tactics, performances & attitude, then think "yep, this is a good move for me". I also imagine players at other teams talk & hear of the unique striker/defender positions available at our club. I'd rather have the Yak sat down, eating a Ginsters on the halfway than watch this... Whatever it is, certainly not football as I've known it.

I've asked before... Has anyone heard any feedback from any of our recent departures? Even the sisters, auntys milkman stuff would be interesting.
Ian Tunstead
22   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:27:16

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James we are going to see a slow death for every Everton manager until there is some major investment into the club. The only hope is to keep producing young talent and selling them on for huge profit and re-build a a new team like we did after the Rooney sale. Sadly Rodwell or Barkley will have to go next.
Paul Ferry
23   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:21:26

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Sam (#20), you are definitely onto something there mate. First piece of very strong evidence: Jimmy Sorheim comes from Red Norway. While I am 100% anti-Moyes, my eyes always roll when I see a post from the shit-digging and shit-stirring unhappy viking. (By the way, look how many times he not only shows up once on a thread, but nearly always in the first handful of posts.) It's easy sit in your Norway haven (not Heaven FFS) and issue calls for action, isn't it Jimmy. Why don't you do what countless others of your comfy nation do: hop on a plane to John Lennon airport, take a bus to Everton Valley, but don't get off just yet, stay on for a few more minutes until you hit County Road, get off the bus and put action where your mouth is.
Ian Tunstead
24   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:31:12

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Sam i think youn might be right about Jimmy, i have been chasing him for days yet still no response. He is doing all he can to cause unrest and stir up the bees nest.
John Ford
25   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:30:27

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Wayne, recent signings....Drenthe looks like a decent signing and so does Coleman (excellent given the price tag). The examples you point out actually highlight the fact that there's been sod all money available for a good while now.

One point, Moyes worked well on a modest budget, never on a 'nil' basis, which is pretty much where we're at.
Wayne McNee
26   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:39:10

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#25 John.. That's exactly what I mean? Drenthe=Loan, Coleman=Something daft £100k. Excellent, especially if we secure Drenthe permanent. My point was when he has spent.
Andy Crooks
27   Posted 07/12/2011 at 18:53:45

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Sam, if Jimmy is an infiltrator then, my God, he certainly puts in some shifts. I actually think he is at the extreme end of disgruntlement but, nevertheless, the moderate end of disgruntlement is certainly growing.

Since Sunday I believe there has been a shift in Toffeeweb. A few years ago I was a shouted down minority,defended by Dave Wilson (thank you Dave wherever you are) for criticising Moyes. Now, his valiant defenders seem to be in the minority (on this site).
Ian Tunstead
28   Posted 07/12/2011 at 19:21:28

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Andy that changes from week to week, this place is full of knee-jerk reactions. If Everton go on a good run for half-a-dozen games the balance will shift again, that is life in general. There probably is a bit of a difference in that, until we sell one of our assets like Rodwell or Barkley to build a new team, we are going to struggle more than usual unless we see some investment pumped into the club.
Graham Brandwood
29   Posted 07/12/2011 at 21:44:29

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This Sunday really gave me food for thought. I spend £500 on my season ticket to be thoroughly depressed. I then go on via the pub to the certainty of a thoroughly uplifting exprience of the Kasabian gig at the arena. Great experience, great atmosphere, before during and after, with people coming out singing like they used to at the match. Why not just buy a 15 concert tickets instead of the season ticket? Thing is I won't because the club is like a drug and I will keep going back against all logic.
Ben Jones
30   Posted 07/12/2011 at 23:50:05

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Haha yeah Andy, I remember them days. Strange how the support has suddenly turned.

Don't think it's true for non-Toffeewebber Everton fans though. Just everyone wants the same thing. Would be interesting to see what Moyes can do with some money.
Ben Jones
31   Posted 07/12/2011 at 23:55:58

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Good example was watching the game against Stoke. Was sitting in the Park End, some guy in the stand shouted "Moyes out" and everyone around me, sneered, sighed and even a couple shouted "Fuck off!"

The guy who shouted "Moyes out" must have been some guy on this site...
Jimmy Sørheim
32   Posted 08/12/2011 at 00:09:19

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The hate for the red shites here in Norway is a valid one, I agree. If you go into a pub, you are over-crowded by them. However, there are also people that support Everton who live all around the country, and who are members of the Everton Supporters Club, Norwegian Branch.

I certainly don't like you putting them down like you are one of the better fans Everton has. Get off your high horse, and start respecting a fellow Evertonian even if he is from Norway ? it does not mean we all support the red stinking arrogant shites.

By the way, Paul, was there a point in there somewhere in which you came across as a HUGE Moyes defender or what?

Problem is that, even if I did come across to England, that would not change the fact that I would be just one Everton fan protesting against Moyes, there needs to be a whole group of fans to do the same. Not my problem if you prefer to focus on me and Norway instead of looking at the real problem, which is Moyes and his downward spiral with regards to players sold and players brought in.

I am angry because I feel that by selling Arteta and Yakubu we have sold a BIG part of what Moyes did very good!!!! Now if you don't see that, I find no interest in debating with you as you then have your eyes closed to what is going on.
Gavin Ramejkis
33   Posted 08/12/2011 at 00:28:33

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Ben I sit in the Park End and Moyes has been on the receiving end of plenty of calls against him for a good while with little support, plenty near me didnt renew as they were fed up with him and BK
Anto Byrne
34   Posted 08/12/2011 at 01:57:58

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TAXI
Michael Brien
35   Posted 08/12/2011 at 07:20:29

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If Moyes could change his tactics then he would get my support and respect - However 4-5-1 in virtually ALL of our games.How many strikers has Moyes signed and then discarded ? Have all of these players been bad players? Do you think that say Lineker would have scored his 35+ goals if he had been played as a lone striker?

The same tactics over and over and over. The Yak didn't track back - well I thought he was in the team to score goals. If you apply the same standard to all the players then could be critical of some of our defenders for not scoring. I don't recall Bob Latchford covering every blade of grass on the pitch and tracking back - I do recall him doing what he had been signed for - scoring goals.

The problem is Moyes stubborness. Maybe he doesn't have shed loads of money - but he is not the only manager in that position. It's time to show us what he's made of - to show that those coaching badges actually mean something.It is up to the manager to give the team direction and leadership - time for Moyes to show some leadership.
Sam Hoare
36   Posted 08/12/2011 at 08:14:15

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Jimmy, apologies. No offense was meant if you are a genuine everton fan.

Though would suggest only inciting people to revolt if you are prepared to put your money where your mouth is. Did you attend the BU protests?
Steve Sweeney
37   Posted 08/12/2011 at 08:38:35

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I have also turned my back on BK and his cronies.
Yet I still love EFC you could say we are on a break.
All those saying he had to sell his best players etc,
were the same ones on here moaning about Arteta being past it and good riddance to Pienaar.
Arsenal have not lost a PL game since Arteta arrived.
If Moyes had a wish to go to another club he would have told BK where to go by now, but he is content to plod on picking the same old with the same old tactics each week and collect his pay packet.
He has ruined every striker we have ever had,plays in a style that is now so outdated its painful to watch and continues to pick out of form favourites who have passed their sell by date.
The fans will soon start walking and once they get used to doing something else on a matchday they will be a long time coming back.
Tony J Williams
38   Posted 08/12/2011 at 09:15:09

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"He has ruined every striker we have ever had,plays in a style that is now so outdated " - Can't be that outdated, Ferguson, the one who holds the most trophies in England, played with Rooney as a lone striker. I wouldn't call him dour and defensive, especially seeing as this was such an important game.
Nelly Verdonghan
39   Posted 08/12/2011 at 11:18:23

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Sorry but there is only ONE MAN and ONE MAN alone responsible for the tactics of the team and that is ...THE MANAGER !!

I gave up my season ticket 2 seasons ago (after having one from 1968-1980 & 1996-2009)because I could no longer watch the tripe that he dishes out....doesn't mean I don't love EVERTON FC...I do and always will...I just don't love Moyes or his awful tactics.I just can't understand how a manager can be considered great when he has NEVER won a trophy during his manargerial career.

I won't deny that he has done a decent job after the Walter years but now I believe his days are done.

I love Everton I really do but I refuse to go the match again until he either changes his tactics to those that try to win games from the off or he is replaced....and I think more and more supporters are beginning to feel the same.
Ricardo Gimpardsle
40   Posted 08/12/2011 at 11:31:32

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Jimmy Sørheim 32

Nice defensive work there young man. Cant believe these "have a go at another blue" fans on this website. We are all on the same side, divided on issues, yes but all as equal as the next.
As for tactics and players, we wont win we have little hope because we are no longer pushing forward in an attempt to bridge the gap above us, instesd we are levelling out to those below us and becoming part of the crowd of also rans.
Ben Jones
41   Posted 08/12/2011 at 11:58:54

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Gavin,

I'm sure you're better placed than me because I am unfortunately not a season ticket holder.. mainly go and watch them around six times a season. It's just generally I have seen that people mainly support Moyes, rather than criticise him. That example I said backed that up really.

But then again, that is a tiny proportion of a 40,000 seater stadium.
David Holroyd
42   Posted 08/12/2011 at 12:44:54

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You don't have to be a season ticket holder to be unhappy about the tripe that is served up at Goodison.

Also the team is getting older: Neville, Distin, Cahill, Howard, Saha... With no money to buy, Moyes is going to have problems in the next couple of seasons: without Cahill and Neville, there are no leaders on the pitch.

Moyes has run out of ideas, fifteen years without a trophy. And no prospect in the next fifteen years at this rate.
Steve Cotton
43   Posted 08/12/2011 at 13:36:26

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If I was Everton manager but only earning £2k a month and had just seen our most creative players and only recognised scorers sold then I would have pissed off, however if I was getting £65k a week and a guaranteed contract for 4 years then I would stay and put up with it..

There in a nutshell is why he continues with no flexibilty to bring in players he wants.
Jon Cox
44   Posted 08/12/2011 at 19:24:48

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I think most people would agree that Moyes is a bit lacking in the stratergy dept.

I think he has one stratergy way up his sleeve.

And that is, keep calm, carry on, keep picking up the dosh till such time the board call for a taxi.

As is normal in this day and age compensation, for failure in any top job, if any, will be humbly accepted and the rounds of Sky and the British Bullshit Corporation will do very nicely until either the Scots National team or Celtic,

come a calling.

At this point in time he may be shite as our manager,

But an idiot he is not.
Brian Waring
45   Posted 08/12/2011 at 21:15:39

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Ian (#16) and John (#19) How is it Swansea and Norwich can play football?
Blackpool played football, hardly teams full of multi - million pound players, most of the Norwich team came from the lower leagues.

And before you say ' Where are Blackpool now ? ' and ' We'll finish above Norwich and Swansea ' The point is, you are saying how can we expect to play football when we have lost outr two most creative players, and I say the teams I mention seem to be able to play football, even with average players.
Gavin Ramejkis
46   Posted 08/12/2011 at 21:49:23

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Tony #38 someone made a similar response in an old thread about Barca also playing 4-5-1 and its a world of difference playing that formation with an attacking midfielder or two behind you as opposed to Moyes' version with a midfield overloaded with defensive midfielders or before that defenders twatting the ball over the midfield to the strikers to chase to the corner flag

Ben #41 my response was to let you know the experience you had was just relating to where you were sat and not relfective of the entire ground, there are mixed pockets in the same stands or pro and anti Moyes and don't forget there are also 5,500 ish that simply no longer bother to go
Chris Butler
47   Posted 08/12/2011 at 22:16:31

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Personally I believe Moyes is to blame for the mess we're in. He is the one who kept underperforming players, refuses to change tactics. He wastes money on players like Billy and Heitenga for around £17 million and blames lack of investment.

He sold Yak and Beckford and brought in nobody to replace them. He insists on playing sideways football and playing a system to suit an underperforming Cahill. As Andy Crooks pointed out, he takes this shit every year, which suggests to me he's just happy to keep us up.

Attendances have dropped this season significantly. 32 000 against Villa 4000 fans that didn't attend. 36 000 against Manchester United and only 39 000 against Liverpool. Fans are becoming sick and tired of watching boring football and watching us sell players every season.

I'm sick of Moyes sending our team out like headless chickens, I now understand what Liverpool-supporting mates said to me: Moyes has no tactics. You never know ? we could go to Arsenal and get something... but it is unlikely. I believe attendances will drop even lower soon if things don't change. The club have alienated a lot of fans.
John Maxwell
48   Posted 08/12/2011 at 22:15:47

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The answer is a simple one, we need new owners. Money talks in the premier league, just look at the table the top 6 or 7 all have spent vast amounts and then theres the gap to the rest. Just two wins and a draw between 8th and 17th.

The premier league is constantly improving and we aren't, in fact we've probably gone backwards since losing Lescott, Arteta, Pienaar etc.

A new manager won't solve things long term until we have major investment or a takeover and I would expect Moyes to be replaced when/if that happens.

If we did get a new manager I'm sure things will all be rosey for 4-5 games and then we will be back to same shit going on now...

Who would want the job anyway ? Job description would read something like this, ok so we wont give you any money and you'll have to sell your best assets and still qualify for Europe... !

So tough times ahead for the impending future and the loyal fans spending their hard earned money going to games up and down the country.

Unfortunately thats the reality of it all until someone comes in and starts spending some money.

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