Groundshare is not going to happen

Now I know my memory isnt all it used to be, but I am sure I read an article in the Liverpool Echo saying the Council had given Liverpool a month to decide if they planned to build a new stadium or not. I know the timescale for that decision is nearly up.

I wonder if Davie is trying to put pressure on Liverpool?

I've never been to an away derby match because I cant bring myself to set foot in Anfield so the thought of sharing a ground is the stuff of nightmares.

Stark choice. Skirt with relegation every season or share a stadium.

I can never understand why people will cheer
Kevin Sheedy
Johnny Morrissey
Peter Beardsley
Gary Ablett
Don Hutchinson
Dave Hickson
Dave Johnson
Dane Watson
David Burrows
Don Hutchison
John Gidman
Jose Baxter
Leighton Baines
Leon Osman
Phil Jevons
Mike Newell
Peter Reid
when they are in blue shirts and overlook their LFC connections and somehow find themselves defiled by walking the same ground every other week that "they" do. Do the people who object not use the same boozers, taxis, cross Stanley Park, use "their" car parks.

It's beyond me, really.

Anyway, this story is doing the rounds and all has someone already said from a Talksport interview.

Brian H

The Mail is just leading with a different spin, but they report essentially the same as the Mirror does.

Paul D

We are desperate, and why pretend otherwise. Any half-way intelligent KopShite knows it. We need to get a ground to get up to Liverpool and Spurs' level of income. The redshite need it to get close to Arsenal and Man U's income. Truth is that they are just a s desperate, except perhaps they would find it easier to fund.

I'd rather not and I know a lot of (most) Blues feel the same, the RS are not in the same boat as us because their ground isn't nearly as old or has had some money spent on it but I feel with some re-development we'd be better off than sharing!

I used to like going to the match for a 3 o'clock kick off on a Saturday afternoon. Still do - occasionally. Well, a bit less than that, actually. And as football is owned by a corrupt news corporation, all we can hope for is that 3am kick offs don't quite suit the future Chinese market.

So matches at at shared ground would have no spectators. Bollocks.

The truth is - and Moyes got close to it - we are skint. Groundshare would help us out. RSFC are somewhere only accountants understand. If they were facing bankruptcy - we can only pray - they would welcome us. But high on their wish list for decades has been the desire for us to disappear, via relegation and all that follows. Hatred? No - economics. A one city club, a la Newcastle.

So, a grounshare would almost enshrine the dual nature of the city's football heritage. Definitely not on their agenda. And until we get a sugar daddy/sheikh/kleptocrat it will remain on ours.

I used to be a shared stadium agnostic - but I now see it as the sensible option, as both our grounds are looking increasingly tatty. KEIOC's idea of a football quarter looks interesting but it doesn't look a goer.

You can't live your life on 'should haves' but every season that goes by, the Kings Dock opportunity looks a missed golden opportunity.

Which of course could never happen (although the reds are getting worse each year haha, the bastards)

Football isnt about logic otherwise why would anyone happily pay £40 to watch Everton early in the season?

Roberto

Yes we are desperate but why advertise it?

He got asked a question and answered it the way he sees it. He isn't advertising it.

If he refused to answer it, you'd be on here calling him a smacked arse or such like.

You don't have to find something to pull him up on every time he speaks.

So if that Billionaire investor is still out there, then with Liverpool refurbishing Anfield, that will leave the way open for our new owner to build us a new ground on Stanley Park, and will have no worries about the green light from the Council.

Well I am allowed to dream.

The economics world is talking of Britain suffering a lost decade - or two. Debts in Britain - usually talked of wrongly as a govt thing - are a, massive and b, not govt: they are consumers (you and me) and banks. That makes me pessimistic of finding a sugar daddy, unless we get lucky with a billionaire wanting a toy.

But the chances of that are vastly improved with a big bright ground on a park rather than sandwiched between a school, a chippy, a church and a row of terraced houses on one of the cheapest in Britain.

And don't get started on King's Dock. A far worse day than losing the Cup Final or even relegation.

Fact is that we are currently on borrowed time with an old stadium that does not garner enough revenue to enable any sort of team building. Hence the necessity to sell to buy or even sometimes sell to appease the banks.

The only way for us to increase long term revenue significantly under the current ownership is to move into a more profitable stadium with more seats more corporate boxes etc. Sadly it seems the ONLY way we are likely to do this in the near future is by ground sharing. All very well being prissy about sharing with the neighbours but we are talking about the long term survival of the club here. If it were an option (which I highly doubt) we'd be mad not to jump at it.

There in lies a real lesson in commercial marketing from people who know how to market themselves and maximises their marketing potential. I am not talking about LFC, but their owners strategy. Its a striking alternative and polished / proven strategy that puts the amateur planning of the owners of EFC who have not actually got a plan.

Goodison will be redeveloped because its the only feasible option open to the club over the next decade.

Thats how the club should market its potential bt selling itself as a redevelopment plan of Goodison and maximise our commercial merchandising worldwide.

Unfortunately its still Wallyville at Goodison.. Wheres Wally? Take your pick, you can't miss them

Kenshite and his cronies are looking for a free handout, thats why in over a decade its never happened, I wouldn;t hold your breath on a groundshare as the useless lying toerag will be looking for a free ride on that too, never going to happen.

There are about 40 odd houses and Gwladys St School in that area, together with a used van lot and some other things. That space is significant.

When I go to Goodison, down Diana St I often see a house for sale - I wonder whether the club have ever considered buying these houses and trying to gain control of this area for future development.

I do not live in Liverpool but perhaps there are TWers who live in that area and would care to suggest a figure they would accept to move!!! He says - tongue in cheek.

Only one thing half the houses probably owned by RS so deal scuppered!!

OH yes and that chapel on the corner of GR , how much??

Liverpool City Council made it clear that the club had to develop within the existing footprint and the space became a housing estate and the boards came down.

I can't understand why LFC was allowed to demolish the streets adjacent to Kemlyn Road if the council claimed to apply the same standards, although Goodison Avenus was demolished much earler to allow some space at the back of the old Park End and its subsequent rebuilding.

I know that many people cling to the hope of a piecemeal redevelopment of GP but it isn't going to happen. We can't afford even that and we certainly can't afford the loss of revenue which closure of parts of the ground over different years would entail.

LFC may be able to afford the redevelopments, presumably they are thinking about their main stand, but they too couldn't take the hit on takings.

They could avoid that if they rented GP for a season though ..........

Just kidding.

We don't have a chance of achieving anything while he is in charge ? and don't give me the shite about "Well, who would you have then?" Its not my job to find an alternative (please god we have to find one somehow).

20 years ago, I wouldn't have entertained a discussion on a ground-share... but now, I'm not so sure.

Anyway, it's pointless; Bill and Co will still be here in 5 years, of that I have no doubt whatsoever.

I have to keep reminding myself that they have done this without winning the premiership

It is a tremendous site and the possibility of a new stadium there is
phenominal - given the money is forthcoming.

Just on the school issue. They listened, rightly, to parents and agreed with those parents who said they didn't want their children crossing trunk roads to school.

I repeat, we can't afford either the project or the revenue loss.

Brian, the American's integration of their sports, media and other interests is not new. I suspect that LFCs fantastic sponsorship deal with Warrior (a global brand that I'd never heard of but I was always a Gola man myself) may be a way of altering US tax liabilities.

The lack of progress both clubs have made in developing or finding new grounds will eventually turn out to be a huge blessing.

Any fans who don't want want a ground share are living in the past. That past was successful , it produced two wealthy and successful football clubs. It is now providing us with two desperate ,slowly decaying clubs.

Fortunately both clubs face the same situation at the same time in the same city. It's an opportunity that must not be missed.

This city is sports mad, it needs a super stadium for multi-use not just football only stadia. If the city wants successful football clubs it needs to think and act big, it needs to offer something unique and spectacular. It needs something that is going to attract huge investment and out compete all rivals.

If everyone gets behind a super stadium it will deliver the success we all wish for. The stadium can be designed to accommodate for the specific wishes of both clubs; it will attract major investment; it will increase each clubs fan base; it will have extra capacity (80,000) for major events; it will allow development of the surrounding area.

Who will pay for it? IMO the Man City route is the one we should all align with but two clubs together can go for a super stadium rather than a very good Premier league stadium.

We should bid for England's mid 2020s Commonwealth Games (just over 10 years away). I'm quite sure we would have the successful bid; huge area regeneration; a visionary city council; a sports mad city; two world famous football clubs ready to work together; The City of Manchester stadium is now a success.

Over 70% of stadium costs are paid by Sport England the council pays the rest. The clubs then pay a 250 year lease for the ground and pay for alterations. Agreements are made between the council and clubs about surrounding areas.

It's now over 20 years since both clubs have won the league. If you had predicted that in the mid 80s everyone would have said you were mad. This last Premier season was one of the worst I've ever experienced, two Manchester clubs fighting it out for the title whilst Liverpool and Everton ,over 30 points behind ,getting all excited about who would finish 7th or 8th. Is that our destiny?

Our identity now is a once-great club, in an out-of-date stadium, unable to attract significant investment but still miraculously punching above its weight by reaching 7th. Is that the identity you want to retain?

This fanatical sports city is screaming out for a super stadium. A stadium Everton would flourish in.

Ray your point about EFC never applying for planning permission is nailed on truth, such information is in the public domain and anyone that wishes to check it out can do so at their leisure at Liverpool's planning office, they'll have a waste of time though as no application has ever been made, another one of the club's fan splitting urban myths.

Unfortunately, though, it was put out before it could do any good.

I'll get me coat...

The normal Joe gets nothing - big corporates are supported for political capital end of.

Gary suggested Liverpool goes for the Commenwealth - that is the best idea i've heard and one way to rebuild an area of Liverpool that needs it, and bring the clubs together to address the age old stadium issue.

BK couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery so to suggest he could come up with a scheme encompassing a multiple usage arena is fanciful, the levels of funding to finance a regeneration project of the scale of a football stadia simply don't exist anymore, region 1 funding and other streams the KD relied upon have long gone.

Any scheme would have to be more than a simple stadium, absolutely. A Common Wealth scheme would open up more streams of finance.

Any project needs to have more than just a 19 days of usage (38 if it was shared). I guess if you were starting from scratch it would be on the water front with hotels developed near to the cruise terminal.

Ground Sharing

Here is my input and I hope you print the whole thing...

I am from Liverpool, I am an Evertonian, I grew up at the time when Everton were FA Cup Winners 1966, Liverpool won the League, England won the World Cup! Four years later, EFC were the Champions and Liverpool were just coming of age... My family is mixed. Everton my oldest brother, mum and myself; my dad and my middle brother were reds. The 3 girls in the family really don't care about football, but celebrate when one of them wins if not both.

We had arguments before, during and after the game... But when my mum said, "Put the ball away!" that was it... game over until the next Derby. Like I said, I love Everton with all my heart. But I watched Liverpool Dominate England and Europe during the 70s and I actually found myself wanting them to win... Why? Because I am from Liverpool and. if Everton or Tranmere couldn't win it, hen I wanted Liverpool to win it.

The problem today is that there are a lot of one-parent families in Liverpool so they are now either Red or Blue... and it's those people who are biased and call Everton and Liverpool shit.

They never had the same upbringing as us with parents who taught them about family life, football, music and most of all, how to be friends? Now it's all Everton or Liverpool. Most people who were old enough to go to the match them days, won`t admit now! But they went to both grounds week after week with their mates, One week at Goodison Park, and Anfield the next!

They don?t understand the fact that even though we support different teams, we are one. Scousers are No 1. We have the best sense of humour on the planet, most of that we picked up via the Kop! Anny Road, The Street End and The Park End...

Comics came from Liverpool, Singers like Cilla White (You would all know her as Cilla Black). The Beatles... The Merseybeat was rampant during the 1960s. Gerry and his Pacemakers came up with songs like Ferry across the Mersey, We'll never sell Labone! Which we all know he changed the words to a bit later (it's true)

Everton won the FA Cup in 1966, Liverpool won the league and England who had several players from both teams, won the World Cup!!!! The City came together, there were street parties, and it was the life of the north.

At that time, the docks were fantastic, I remember walking along the Dockers Umbrella when I was young. (That was the old overhead-railway for those of you who don?t know, or simply don?t remember ? you could actually walk all the way into the City Centre under it. It could piddle down all day and you wouldn?t get wet!)

The whole area was buzzing with fruit carts, people and cars. The cars would all be classics today and worth a lot more than some of the new ones? Zephyrs, Corsairs, The Ford Poplar, Austin, Mini Coopers, Bedford and Old Morris vans and trucks!

It seemed at the time (1966) as though there was a Pub on every corner; also, if I remember rightly that we celebrated as kids with Salt and Vinegar Crisps (the only ones available at the time) and Real Lemonade for a whole year!!

My mum drank stout! Anyone remember that stuff? My older brother was allowed to taste it once and he had a permanent Perm afterwards, his hair looked like Kevin Keegan's during his early days at Liverpool?. Which my brother didn?t mind because he was a red?

Scotland Road was a-buzz, the life of the city before you actually got to the centre of the city itself! Everton and Liverpool supporters together... We loved it!!!

Remember it! Mixing with our own people... Visitors were made to feel Welcome, we had a strong Irish Community in Liverpool at that time and there was a welcome in the parlour for each and every one of us.

So let?s put our single-minded thoughts aside and let?s show the rest of the Country, the World in fact that people from the North West are different and that we can get along...

Let's build the best stadium ever, executive lounges, shops, hotels, car parks, restaurants, bars etc? In a Super Stadium that could host World Cups, FA Cup and League Cup semi-finals or both. It makes sense so why not do it? Merseyside ? Merseypride...

ps: For those of you who say, No! You do this every day in Liverpool, eat at restaurants, stay at hotels, shop in the new shopping centre, drink in pubs, park your cars? all in the same City. The only difference is that you would be doing it at our own Super Stadium? IMAGINE THE DERBY WITH A 100,000 SEATER STADIUM!

Richy Styles, 2010

A load of nostalgic sentimental horseshit, to be perfectly honest. And David Moyes is right for once: it is never gonna happen, so don't even sweat it.

At some point the uk will get a infrastructure national fund like that on the continent. The exhibition centre route is gone, so someone will need to come up with something imaginative to build in a stadium with something else that obtains regular footfall.

With Liverpool 1 built and town looking fairly bad in areas I don't think another mall is the answer.

Actually, John, it was more common than you think. My father went to Anfield regularly when we were away and so did many of his mates. He did this from the 1920's right thorough to his untimely death in 1976. Why? Because he was a football fan , as well as an Evertonian. I went several times myself, too, for a laugh with my mates.If you try to deny that that sort of thing happened then you are very wrong. I started actually going to Goodison in 1959. Richard Styles nostalgic, rose tinted view of the past has a lot of merit, things WERE different then.
Unfortunately, subsequent events, Heysel, bandwagon jumping red shite fans etc., have destroyed what was a much more convivial era, but let's not try to pretend it didn't happen.

Saturday for us as kids was a visit to the Atlas to watch Flash Gordon etc and then on to Queens Drive Baths and then, if our threepenny bits hadn?t been nicked, on to either Goodison Park or Anfield Road and the delights of the Boys Pens. And, if our money had been nicked, we still found ways to get in.

I know in an Ideal World our own Super Stadiums side by side in Stanley Park would be great but this ain?t going to happen. Stanley Park was donated to the people of the City of Liverpool for their enjoyment and recreation; but both teams originated out of a football club that was created in Stanley Park, so why shouldn?t both teams have the benefit of any new stadium there?

Deep down, don?t people from the City of Liverpool relish the thought of their own two great teams competing against each other in a ?Super Stadium? in the best league in the world? Could we live without ?real? derby games between two teams from the same city ? not Sky?s interpretation, the 'Merseyside' derby or Newcastle v Sunderland, ffs?

Who really wants to see the demise of the other? Gavin the Red from Fareham in Hampshire, or Jimmy the Blue from Oxford may... but, whereas they have every right to support either team, they (unlike exiled scousers) are not part of the ethos of the City of Liverpool; most couldn?t give a damn where either team plays and slag us off over hub caps.

We all have mates who support either side and, more importantly, we all have relatives in the same category. Hands up who hasn?t?

The relationship has become strained over the years. At one time, one side would turn out in force to welcome the other back with the various and numerous trophies both teams had won; it probably still does happen. I do remember standing in front of St Georges Hall when the reds had won something or other when that ?Clown? announced to the world that Everton are tragic... that upset me ? was that the start of the rot? He?s gone now; forget him. The ban in the eighties also dealt us a bitter blow; some reds acknowledge the fact, others won?t.

We used to stand together and enjoy the banter, we mourned together over Hillsborough. Can?t we just mend our differences? We don?t have to love each other, but join together and share a stadium in Stanley Park, our spiritual home in a resurgent City, St Domingo Stadium sounds just great to me, the City of Liverpool Stadium probably would sound good to them, but let's talk about it I think most would be open to the suggestion.

You have touched on what I see as one of the main reasons for the divide that now exists between Us and them. The sheer number of "fans" who have hitched their wagon to the team with the most success. Liverpool FC have one of, if not the highest number of fans who travel most distance to watch their team play at home. Not all from Oslo, obviously, but from all parts of Britain too. We, on the other hand, have one of the largest "walk up" attendances. This is according to the EPL stats printed last season. I think it was last season, time is going ever quicker...

Consequently they have no empathy with real scousers and just "don't get it" in the way many of us remember the rivalry that led to the matches between the clubs being called the Friendly Derby. Meeting some of these plastics on holiday just underlines how little they know about the history of either club. Half of them couldn't point to Liverpool on a map.

Add to this the bitterness that we have all felt at one time or another following the Heysel tragedy and the resulting ban, and their attempt to airbrush from history all the occasions that they have let the side, and the City, down with their escapades ? it is little wonder that we wear the mantle of Bitters without shame.

"The problem today is that there are a lot of one-parent families in Liverpool so they are now either Red or Blue... and it's those people who are biased and call Everton and Liverpool shit."

What the fuck are you on about?

Ground sharing only makes financial sense, I hate the fuckers and would never ever want them as our landlords, which is what the arrangement would be, they can go fuck themselves, I'd rather we went broke.

My Dad used to go to whoever was playing at home during the sixties {although he was more red than blue},

With all the money sloshing around the P.L. they could charge a fortune in rent. If they were holding concerts and all kinds of other events, it would surely offer excellent annual returns.

Don't forget, the Echo Arena only holds 10k - even that arsehole John Bishop can get 20 thousand paying to watch him. God only knows why - can't stand the twat.

Your remarks regarding the gorundsharing. Well said.

Kevin Tulley.

I am once more impressed with your reluctance to fully expand on your feelings towards the odious John Bishop. He is actually a difficult man to hate. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

We could be given a huge, shiny, new stadium.. free of charge, and Kenwright would still manage to fuck it up and take out mortgages on it, operating costs like...

I'm well aware of the number of professional scousers who slithered away from Liverpool in the 60's in particular. Getting famous on the back of the Merseysound and all the groups who came from these parts. Bastards couldn't wait to jump ship.
Bishop? A twat of the first order. I wouldn't cross the road to see him. Unless I was standing at his bedside with his grieving relatives.
And you can add that prick Boardman to the list as well. A man who's as funny as genital warts. And less welcome.
I missed Carrs house. But I can live with that. Jealousy would sit uneasily on my shoulders..

As for the pathetic attempt to run EFC as a business. Words, for once, fail me.

You develop ESP watching their dullness - you know what's coming before the punchline.

Actually what punchline? 10 mins of their vids I tried, not a joke in sight.

Ray...spot on about the previous generation being "more" football fans
My dad was mates with Billy ("up the middle") Liddell and The Great Man and used to go to both grounds, though always a Blue

I take delight in talking to kopites who don't know who their manager was before Shankly and trotting out names of Liverpool reserves like Molyneux, Wheeler and dad's pal Phil Ferns(?)

Dad used to take me to games at South Liverpool as well as Goodison and I remember seeing The Great Man kick off a tesimonial game there in `67; something to do with Alex Young and a Costa Pereira X1

For my generation who've had to put up with the media bias and "jobs-for-the-ex-reds", LFC hooliganism, jaundiced referees, that dirge from Carousel and "professional Scousers"...
I'm with the Grand Old Ladies of Kemlyn Road - "the sooner they're back in the 2nd Division, where they belong, the better"

Why?!?! FFS!!!