A good start thrown away

, 17 November, 136comments  |  Jump to most recent
Reading 2 - 1 Everton
No Phil Neville for Everton at Reading today, with Thomas Hitzlsperger getting his first start, behind Naismith as Gibson and Mirallas miss out; Hibbert and Anichebe failed late fitness tests.

An early corner was a gift for Jagielka, who failed to bury his close-range shot, but in the follow-up, a cross back in found Jelavic all alone at the far post with a golden chance that he somehow scooped high and wide. Should be ahead in the second minute!

Reading had a couple of set-pieces that could have been threatening. But Everton went ahead when Jelavic kept the ball alive at the far post and a fumbled ball dropping infront of Fellaini and a couple of defenders stood up nicely for Naismith to stride forward and slot home.

Pienaar got in a good ball for Jelavic who shot fractionally wide. Naismith was taken down at the side of the Reading area and there were screams for a penalty but the ref gave nothing as Everton in their all-black kits kept pushing the home side back.

Roberts dragged at the shirt of Baines who was on the counter-attack, and he picked up the first yellow card. Coleman the got a silly booking for booting the ball away after he couldn't quite get his foot around it to keep it in play.

Gorkks took out Coleman cynically and rightly went in the referee's book. A great run by Jelavic was followed by a not -so-great cross that evaded Fellaini, perfectly positioned. Hitzlsperger took a pop and forced a punch from Frederici.

Naismith played in Osman perfectly but the new England man fluffed his lines badly by failing to score when in on the keeper. Then there was a chance for Jelavic on another punch from Frederici but the Iceman's cool shot was deflected away by an arm... but again no penalty given. It was developing into another one of those games where Everton dominate and pepper the opposition goal with chances but make very few of them count.

Everton had to defend a couple of early corners after the break and struggled for the first five minutes to reassert their dominance. Indeed, a Shorey free-kick given away by Hitzlsperger was headed home with ease by Le Fondre, and it was once again all square, Everton with everything to do once again.

Reading threatened to score again with another dangerous free-kick as Everton tried to reconstruct their cool passing game, Coleman winning a corner taken by Hitzlsperger. But the pressure was soon back on, Jagielka tihs time guilty of fouling.

Pienaar looked to release Jelavic but his chance was denied by a perfect tackle from Morrison. But Howard had to be alert when Roberts played in Le Fondre. At the other end, Osman's attempt on goal was rather poor .

Some clever work between Pienaar and Fellaini set up a snapshot for Hitzlsperger but he volleyed wide as the black shirts finally started to get a better grip of the game again.

But another free-kick, Coleman conned by Roberts, saw a dangerous ball swung in that Fellaini defended well against Morrison's kamikaze attack.

20 mins left, and well past Moyes's normal sub time, there was no movement on the subs bench, Moyes believing there was little on their that could do better than the ones on the field. A couple of Everton corners led only to a Reading breakout that saw a brilliant covering tackle by Coleman on Le Fondre.

England star Leon Osman seemed to be in with a glorious chance but the man with the clever feet inexplicably stumbled and miscontrolled the ball instead of lashing it into the net and a nothing ball resulted.

At the other end, disaster as Coleman, who had been booed all match for some reason, drove into the back of and a penalty awarded was lashed home by Le Fondre to surely give Reading their first win of the season. Fellaini was booked, presumably for protesting, and he will now miss the Norwich game. Moyes reacted to the setback by swapping out Naismith for Oviedo.

Fellaini headed into the ground and off the post, back into the hands of Frederici. Moyes then puled Hitzlsperger for Vellios with less than 10 mins left... too little, too late, surely?

Everton huffed and puffed but the lack of crisp and decisive finishing in the first half would be the story of this game as they allowed Reading to steal all the points, condemning Everton to only their second defeat of the season, but at a crucial time as the come toward the end of what was on paper an easier run of games... if there really is such a thing in the Premier Leaue!

Reading: Federici, Gunter, Morrison, Gorkss, Shorey, Robson-Kanu, Leigertwood, Tabb, McAnuff, Roberts, Le Fondre. Subs: Stuart Taylor, Mariappa, Pogrebnyak, Hunt, McCleary, Harte, Cummings.

Everton: Howard; Baines, Jagielka, Heitinga, Coleman (Y); Pienaar, Hitzlsperger, Fellaini, Osman; Naismith, Jelavic. Subs: Mucha, Oviedo, Distin, Duffy, Vellios, Junior, Kennedy.

Referee: Martin Atkinson

Quotes or other material sourced from ToffeeWeb Match Reports



Reader Comments (136)

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Karl Dean
1 Posted 17/11/2012 at 07:40:46
Today is the day for for a big win!
Steve Smith
2 Posted 17/11/2012 at 12:40:09
Coleman is one of the weak links for me at the moment along with Pip in that midfield role, I know we'd probably be less of a threat down the right by replacing Coleman with Hibbert but I think that's where we are leaking a few goals.

I wouldn't be surprised today if Fellaini plays deeper with Naismith playing off Jela.
Paul Smith
3 Posted 17/11/2012 at 13:06:56
It will be interesting to see how we perform without Neville.
Colin Ryan
4 Posted 17/11/2012 at 14:04:14
The Hammer is starting:

Howard;
Baines, Jagielka, Heitinga, Coleman,
Pienaar, Hitzlsperger, Fellaini, Osman;
Naismith, Jelavic.

#COYB
Michael Winstanley
5 Posted 17/11/2012 at 14:07:25
That should do it. More than enough quality to get the three points.
Tony J Williams
6 Posted 17/11/2012 at 14:11:20
What's up with Neville, not even on the bench?
Phil Sammon
7 Posted 17/11/2012 at 14:52:45
Could be a really good oppotunity here. Spurs losing and West Brom facing Chelsea should hopefully give us chance to spring clear of the pack.

I might be in a minority of one here but I'm actually a little worried there is no Neville. Hitzlsperger looked well off the pace against Sunderland, I hope he can step up. It will be nice to have a player in the side who can really hit a football.

Jim Knightley
8 Posted 17/11/2012 at 15:57:44
Good to see Hitzelsperger apparently playing well. Will be fantastic to have another central midfield option.

Apparently we've been all over them, but only have the one goal to show for it...fingers crossed missed chances do not come back to bite us. Would be really good to see a clean sheet as well, especially as our defending has been the one major negative of this season.

James Morgan
9 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:37:03
What happens when you don't take chances, although we should've had at least one pen.
Ciarán McGlone
10 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:26:11
Terrible defending by Coleman for both goals..

Great style of play but our current problems relate to dodgy defending and failing to capitalise on good play and chances..

Oviedo on for Naismith..

James Morgan
11 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:52:40
Simply not good enough. Got to take your chances regardless of not getting pens.
Robin Cannon
12 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:57:17
Shit, complacent second half performance. Is there any team that can be so inconsistent within the course of a single 90 minutes?

No particular analysis, just frustration. The kind of game where my only real reaction at the final whistle is "Fuck off Everton".

Paul Olsen
13 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:56:18
That one really hurt. Game should have been buried before half-time, then we go on to lose.

Poor game defensively, Howard really not inspiring confidence today. Heitinga and Coleman also poor.

Jelavic is starting to worry me, he rarely succeeds with anything nowadays. Sadly we have no real candidate to take his spot.

Naismith just doesn´t cut it in the premier league. Got his goal, but he looks off pace most of the time.

Derek Powell
14 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:58:43
Coleman at fault again... He seems to be a liability in the team.
Paul Andrews
15 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:59:47
Poor defending results in the same player giving a goal a week away.
He was responsible for giving 2 away this week.
Drew Shortis
16 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:54:44
Disappointed and frustrated. Second half was just not good enough. We have battled back several times this year, but that would not be necessary if we were a bit more ruthless in front of goal when we are on top in a game. Must now get things going again against Norwich, but three points dropped here is very annoying. Well done to Reading for their first win, they deserved it for that second half display!
Tom Bowers
17 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:56:26
There are no excuses! Against a team devoid of a win, you can trust Everton to blow it and they did it in style after getting in front first for a change.

How on earth can they only score one against pitiful Reading? We need more goals from the midfield and we need to kill teams off when on top, as we usually are from the kick-off. Something is wrong with the tactics and discipline when you lose in this manner against a team like this.
Jim Harrison
18 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:05:36
Again the stat s look good, but the squad just isn't strong enough. Oh please let Hibbert be fit for the next match!!
Matty Dawkins
19 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:06:27
Coleman is a liability, he is NOT and never will be a defender.
Joe McMahon
20 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:03:13
Apart from the same old problem of lack of squad size, I'm also concerned that Jelavic just isn't doing it, forget being as good as Suarez, he's no Demba Ba either. (Andy Johnson started off scoring goals for us to)
I'm also concerned about Gibson being out for so long.
Moyes may be doing well without money, but we are losing points to teamsin the bottom 3 and have won 1 game in the last 6.
we won't finish in the top 4, how on earth are we going to finish above Arsenal, West Brom are playing well too. Moyes will not be going to Man U, I think it may be the current R-Madrid manager.
Roman Sidey
21 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:04:33
That second half was worse than Bolton at home last season. The mob of twats that just beat us hadn't won in seven months. Never thought one match could undo so much early work. At this rate, Norwich will slaughter us.
Anto Byrne
22 Posted 17/11/2012 at 16:55:17
What can you say, Atkinson is a fucking cunt. Handed it to them on a fucking plate.

You can't defend with your arms, it's handball, always has been and always will be. That would have killed the game off had that penalty been awarded.

Coleman, for all his effort, is not a fullback and Jelavic is so far off the pace it's not funny. Disappointing but what do you expect from Everton? Winless Reading — it just had to be, didn't it?
Jack Wilkinson
23 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:15:20
I counted up the shots to goals we've had this year and we've needed 217 shots to score 21 goals. This is not the standard we need to be meeting. Saying that, though, only a few more goals shared between two or three matches and we're sitting right at the top of the league. We have come too far to blame the ref on days like this. We need to acknowledge responsibility for our own downfall rather than projecting blame onto others.
Anto Byrne
24 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:15:46
I expect us to be 10 points adrift of Man Utd...
Phil Head
25 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:00:26
Hopefully Moyes will now realise that Coleman simply cannot defend, there's a reason why the opposition are scoring every time they enter our half, and he is it. Don't get me started on Hitzlsperger, no wonder he was a free agent, I really don't understand how 3 months isn't enough time to fill the gaps in the squad where we are drastically short, we only had 4-5 players injured for today's game, probably about average for a match day, yet we had the worst bench I think the Premier League has ever seen.

It was clear in the summer that we needed someone to play next to Gibson every week, not a squad player, a first teamer, and it was also obvious that we needed a striker, because WHEN Jelavic gets injured that leaves us with Vellios and thats it. What we didn't need, was to waste important funds on a rubbish left back/left midfielder like Oviedo when we've already got cover in those positions.

As for the 10 chances we are missing every single week, the whole squad needs to take responsibility for that, we can't solely rely on Fellaini and Jelavic, I've seen Jagielka miss 5 opportunity's to score this season, each one from only 4 yards out. Maybe if we start deducting wages for these dreadful misses, we might start getting the points are overall performances are deserving.

Patrick Murphy
26 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:11:11
I'm glad I didn't bother to watch today, but feel the headline of this match may well turn out to be the story of our season.

I delayed watching the N London derby and come on here at full time. Arsenal are the team even with their defensive weaknesses to get into the top 4 and if we can't win games at QPR, Reading and Wigan we can forget Europe never mind top 4. WBA beating Chelsea will also give them a confidence boost and are well placed to stay under the radar.

If our friends from over the road go on a run, we'll have to hope for an English club picking up 'old big ears'.

Football is all about scoring more than your opponents and if you fail to take your chances, you can forget any hopes of top 4 regardless how much good football you are playing.

But defensively 2 clean sheets from 11 tells its own story.

I stand by the point I made on another thread, Moyes should have body-swerved any talk of what may or may not happen in the Jan transfer window as those players with real ambition will start to look for another club.

Nev Renshaw
27 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:22:29
Too many players off the boil coupled with the fact we should have been awarded a penalty when we were one-up. Also hitting the woodwork again. Gutted.
Ciarán McGlone
28 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:26:46
Phil,

What exactly did Hitzelsperger do wrong? Or Oviedo for that matter?

Brian Waring
29 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:24:41
Jack "We need to acknowledge responsibility for our own downfall rather than projecting blame onto others" Thats a good shout mate.
Steve Brown
30 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:26:24
Woeful, woeful defending yet again from Coleman for their two goals, but overall an utterly complacent and wasteful performance.
Mike Oates
31 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:19:24
Too many players looked jaded, particularly the ones who travelled with Internationals during the week. Haven't seen such low energy performance from Baines for a long time and even Jags struggled to drive the team forward, saying that there is no excuse for Pienaar's and Jelavic's performances which were shocking.

Were was the overlapping full backs, the cut backs, the intricate triangles, the closing down, pressuring their defence - even when we were on top in that 30 min spell in the first half we never looked convincing.

The thinness of the squad is showing and to a lesser extent the players shoulders dropped as though they are forever jinxed with poor ref decisions and poor finishing.

ps: Get rid of that black strip — played 4, lost 2, drawn 2... ZERO wins!

Jackie Barry
32 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:30:12
People blaming the ref is pretty poor really. Yes he was bad but lets not mask the truth, we have been playing poor for a few weeks now. Baines and Pienaar are not performing well, Jelavic not getting the service he needs and Coleman looking more and more not like a RB. We are really missing Gibson and losing Mirallas today really did not help, he has masked our poor performances recently. As for Naismith I really don't think he brings anything to the team, I would rather see Velios picked ahead of him.
Andy Meighan
33 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:26:10
Where are all you Neville haters now? Conspicuous by your absence...

Out the side for one game and we lose to a side who haven't won a Premier League match all season. I'm not saying if he would have played we would have won but he brings more to the party than people give him credit for...

And can we please put this idiotic notion of us finishing in the top 4 to bed now? Two reasons why we won't: The squad isn't good enough... and the main one: we don't keep clean sheets. In fact, I can't remember the last Premier League game we did – can someone please enlighten me?

No, I'm sorry but for me there's not an earthly we're going to finish in the top 4. Even that Shite from over there have hit a bit of form that's starting to worry me... and WBA are playing out of their skin.
Jackie Barry
35 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:35:59
Mike I really think Jelavic's poor performances are down to him not getting good service. Our balls into the box today were abysmal, same as last week, the only player who changed that last week was Fellaini, but you can't expect that of him every week.
Paul Smith
36 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:33:12
I think enough posts on here have got it bang on. We need to convert possession into goals, the best way to do this is to score! So many shots, near misses, reffing blunders, oohs and ahhs but no cigar.

Take your fucking chances or we will be back were we were last season...

Eric Myles
37 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:40:05
It was all Neville's fault.

Well at least in the last 2 games when Coleman gave away goals some TWebbers blamed Neville so now Coleman's done it again it must still be Nevilles's fault.

Right?

James Stewart
38 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:41:28
We lost this for one reason. Coleman. A mare you can't account for errors like that. He isn't good enough defensively end of. Drop
Joe McMahon
39 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:43:53
Eric, not as simple as that as we didn't score last week until Neville went off. We just ain;t good enough, end of. It's not about millions all the time, Look at West Brom at the moment, they also thrashed us.
Gareth Hughes
40 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:46:52
Neville confirmed as out for 8 weeks so get used to Hitz and Coleman!
Ste Traverse
41 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:44:42
Yet again this side shows no killer instinct.

Coleman again costs us. The sooner Hibbo is back the better then this bloke can go and work on his defending.

Also, why is it when a team is on a bad run, as soon as they come up against us they win? And strikers who haven't scored in ages always net when they play us.

Things like this happens time and time again.


Totally pissed off.

Sam Hoare
42 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:37:05
A lot of games to go this season but I fear today represents in a microcosm the reason why Champions League will continue to evade us. Profligacy in front of goal, suspect defending, and a severe lack of options on the bench that are indicative of lack of squad depth.

Illogical as it sounds, did we miss Neville in midfield?

If we don't beat Norwich at home then very soon indeed our 'great start' will become a 'mediocre third of a season'.

Mike Powell
43 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:30:55
We should've been six up at half-time. Jelavic has been poor for a few weeks now and Naismith is just not good enough. Yes, he scored but he did nothing else all game.

How did we not get a pen today? Two clear penalty shouts and we get nothing from that twat — I don't even want to mention his name.

How bad was the defending today? Coleman was piss-poor... most of the goals we let in all come down his side. We have no chance of finishing fourth if we keep defending like that.
Phil Rodgers
44 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:47:04
Absolutely abysmal result. No positives to take. No chance of top 4 with a squad this thin. Fuck the ref. Yeah he is shite but that is not an excuse against a team as woeful as Reading.
Jamie Barlow
45 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:42:47
Blaming the ref isn't poor. Do you really think we would have lost if we would have been given both penalties in the first half. Possibly 3-0 up at half time.

The referee had a big part in our loss today but it's not the only reason.

Coleman, as good as he is going forward is fuckin useless at defending. Thick as fuck football is what he plays. He can't read the game for toffee.

Pienaar has been rubbish for months and Baines was just as bad today.

Did Osman play in the second half.

Hitzelspittle was better than Neville but that's not really difficult is it.

Heitinga can fuck off in January for all I give a shite.

In fact, at the moment I couldn't care less who goes.

Gary Mortimer
46 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:50:36
If we got the penalties all those missed chances don't matter, but it is about time we started putting them away.

So Neville is out for a few months, Fellaini suspended, Gibson still injured. Who's in midfield next week?

Michael Kenrick
47 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:57:39
Osman!!!!
Ciarán McGlone
48 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:54:11
Illogical as it sounds did we miss Neville in midfield?
-------------------

Inevitable comment. But the answer is simply no. There was nothing wrong with our midfield build up play today... It was defensive and conversion problems.

Hitzlsperger played very well.

Sam Hoare
49 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:03:22
Ciaran, I think you'll find it was a question more than a comment.
Ray Roche
50 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:59:14
I missed watching the game today, but listened on Radio Merseyside where Goodlass and Mike Hughes said that Hitzlsperger was MotM. Why is he getting stick on here? Was he crap or not?
Kunal Desai
51 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:02:18
Who replaces Felli next week then? Assuming Gibson and Mirallas are still out injured.
Brent Stephens
52 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:07:08
Ray, I think some people see a few errors by a player and then conclude all is shit. This might explain some negative comments about Hitz.
Ray Said
53 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:00:34
Hitzlsperger played well, neat and tidy and did the simple things well.
I can see he and Gibson providing a solid core.

Coleman is really a wing back and he just can't defend. When Gibson plays he drops in and covers Coleman's space, in effect making a back 3. When he doesn't play, then Coleman is an accident waiting to happen and I cringe every time he is near our box.

The Baines and Pienaar link has been poor recently and that has cost us; again, Gibson's covering allows Baines freedom to attack. The only answer is to move Felli back to provide the defensive cover but that lessons the attacking threat. I think that this is the only option though.

Brian Waring
54 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:12:26
I thought Gibson's injury was only going to keep him out for a few weeks?
Ray Roche
55 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:12:02
Thanks, Brent, I've just read the report on the BBC and Hitz was "impressive". Some people, eh?
Steve Carse
56 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:11:54
Defensively we are a disgrace – relegation standard. Why that should be with an international back four (in fact a team of 11 current internationals) needs sorting – urgently.
Mike Keating
57 Posted 17/11/2012 at 17:34:52
When our top players (Jelavic, Pienaar, Heitinga and Osman) were so poor, why are Hitzlsperger and Oviedo singled out for criticism?

The officials were poor but we should have had the game sorted by half time.

I have a horrible feeling that our post-Xmas resurgence has already been and gone... Worse, I watched this in a pub showing the RS on the other telly.

4th spot? You must be joking!
Jim Knightley
58 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:09:43
Phil, we all know we needed another central midfielder and striker, but what does Oviedo have to do with it? we signed him for less than 2million and he will be on low wages...how exactly were we suppose to buy a first team central midfielder and striker for that amount of money?

Everyone is getting at Jelavic, but despite his apparent dismal performances he still has scored 5 premiership goals this season... at his current rate, he is on for about 15-16 over the course of the season...he was also away in the summer, and plays in the qualifiers, and unlike the likes of RVP, Rooney, Aguero etc, doesn't get rested. Strikers have form periods, and off form periods, just give him time.

We have a very good first 11, but no squad depth. We will not be able to get top four, unless we invest in January. Our squad simply cannot take the demands of an entire season.

But, it is only one defeat. I think we will beat Norwich next week, and Fellaini's injury is perhaps a blessing in disguise; at least now we will have him for the Arsenal game, which will be one of the most important games of the season, as they our biggest challengers for the fourth spot. Mirallas will also be back next season, and he has become one of our most important players.

Shame about Neville. He has his critics, but he is a dependable and disciplined presence, and we will miss him. We need Gibson back big time, but good to see Hitzelsperger get through the match.

Ciarán McGlone
59 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:17:37
Sam,

It's quite possible for a question to provide a commentray on the opinion..

You obviously had some reason for raising it..

Anyway, for me, the answer to your question is, certainly not.

Brent Stephens
60 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:18:23
Atkinson's reffing – cock-eyed stunt (as Spooner might say). Okay, we might have won but for some decisions, but that would only have masked a failure to convert chances. As somebody said earlier, "We need to convert possession into goals, the best way to do this is to score!" Brilliant!
Jim Knightley
61 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:19:33
Mirallas will be back next week* (assuming he recovers within the 10-day frame).
Ciarán McGlone
62 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:21:27
Jim,

Watching Norwich at the moment and I'm not so sure..

I haven't seen a bad team this year... even QPR have a very good team despite Hughes's inability to get anything out of them.

Sam Hoare
63 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:24:08
Ciaran, it is possible but not implicit.

My reason, having not seen the game, was simple curiosity. I think perhaps you assumed something else, I could be wrong.

Thanks for your answer, i'm guessing we will be seeing more of Hitz in the next few weeks unless Gibson recovers from his long term injury.

Aiden Jones
64 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:32:01
Ciarán - I agree we did not miss Neville in midfield from build up play but I think we did miss him from a defensive view. Closing the space in front of back for and covering when full backs get forward. Often work which is only noticed when he is not there.
John Atkins
65 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:28:37
Squad is too small, little chance of top four unless we buy / loan 2 or 3 in January window, but with Moyes saying no business then we've defo no chance.

Does this mean the phoney will be working 24/7 again?

Andy Crooks
66 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:34:00
We should have scored more than one goal and the fact that we didn't isn't down to Seamus Coleman.
Christopher Kelly
67 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:37:26
Jim (#000),

I wouldn't depend on anything right now, esp a win vs. Norwich (who are putting up a good fight v the manure)

We have been leaking points for more than a month and a half – I guarantee you DM is not depending on 3 points at the moment.

Peter Thistle
68 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:37:41
We still haven't won a game wearing the black kit.... It's jinxed.
Ciarán McGlone
69 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:41:59
Fair enough Sam,

I wrongly assumed you'd seen the match.

Brent Stephens
70 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:44:09
Chris (#010) — I'm glad you "guarantee" DM isn't depending on 3 points. I wasn't sure, so now I can rest easy. And Norwich have just gone one-up.
Ciarán McGlone
71 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:44:13
Aiden that's a reasonable enough point,

However, our defensive failures were not due to a failure to cover... Hitz did that as adequately, if not more, than Neville ever has.

Our defensive failures were simply a direct result of bad defending.

Jamie Barlow
72 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:43:36
We should still expect our defenders to be able to defend, Andy. He can't. The tackle (whatever it was) for the penalty was a disgrace.

I like the lad but he's awful at defending. He might get better, who knows. At the moment though, I can't wait for Hibbert to come back.

Giving stupid penalties away and not picking up your man is down to him.

Steve Carse
73 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:44:17
Dropping points despite totally outplaying the opposition and dropping late points are signs of a side that lacks backbone. We urgently need a leader. A replacement for what Cahill used to bring.

At the moment, it's embarrassing when inferior players are making us pay for complacency and lack of grit. No wonder Moyes is furious. Not half as furious though as the fans who are in no position to try and put it right.

I fear for us when the tougher fixtures come along.
Andy Walker
74 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:51:11
If we'd had Hibbo or Phil at RB, we'd have won that game. Likewise if we'd been given 1 of the 2 blatant penalties in the 1st half we'd have won.

We lost today and Neville didn't play nor was he in the squad. I think his influence/motivation was missed.
Aiden Jones
75 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:01:39
I agree for the goals, and I only watched a feed but looked at times when Reading broke we lacked some cover. I thought Hitz did OK though considering it was his first start and we didn't get the silly free kicks Neville tends to do. I still think we miss him though which I think shows our lack of strength in this area.

Not sure which is more worrying: how defensively frail we look or our inability to put teams away.
Jamie Tulacz
76 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:08:42
Squad strength now starting to tell? Though in recent seasons we've actually done better with a thinner squad! It's a rare occasion you'll probably hear this on here, but I think most are now in agreement — bring back Hibbo! And Gibbo too..! Frustrating that we're still playing great, creating loads of chances, but seem to lack the killer instinct
Christopher Kelly
77 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:22:58
Brilliant game by John Ruddy - Thank God we let him go.
Sam Hoare
78 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:18:38
Well the result at Norwich just goes to show that even the top teams have bad days. Also shows that next weekend will not be a walkover, still with a tough run coming up 3 points definitely needed.
Paul Ferry
79 Posted 17/11/2012 at 18:58:13
Don't slag off:

(1) Jelly – not enough quality service and admittedly there was a howler in the 1st half but I was deeply impressed by his holding the ball and general play in the 1st 45

(2) Hitz. WTF a skewed shot that might however have been a pass (when it ought to have been a shot), but he was creative, looking forwards, not giving the ball away for the most part and he is not frightened to have go/shot.

(3) And dear Lord after what ten minutes or Ovideo is thrown into the slam hat. Dear Lord, went pear shaped well before he set his polished foot on the pitch. Take a long hard look instead at the 1st choices who did not show up in the 2nd half.

Do slag off;

(1) Fucking Howard. OK we have strong cases for liabilities, he is either #1 or #2. His charge out of the area, flapping, losing the ball, not bossing the box. He is a fucking liability. And priority #1 if we have any window sponds is someone good enough not just to keep the fucking flapper on his toes but to step into his shaky shoes.

I feel we might be being just a little hard on because he gave away such a fucking stupid pen:

(1) Coleman. Has anyone mentioned on here his simply fabulous tackle a few minutes earlier that defo stopped a goal because we have the fucking flapper on goal and one-on-one with him is usually a nice little shoe in for the other geezer on the ball. Kill me, hate me, call me a fool, I don't care. I felt that Seamus was having a perfectly decent game up until that fungus second that understandably is the focal point on here but shadows all the decent things he did before then.

1st picks defo worth getting shut of in next window:

(1) the flagging dutchman
(2) Coleman?

Sir Sainted Leon Osman prize for going missing in matches

(1) Nuts - congrats Lad
(2) er Osman
(3) Nay, Nay, thrice times Nay

Everton FC Ladies Team Prize for complacency after great 1st half

(1) Everton Mens Team: congrats.

Lord Martin Dobson Prize for midfielder who looks classy when all around him is failing and flailing:

(1) take a bow Felli

And last but not least: Gormless Mike Walker prize for gaffer should take some of the responsibility for a shocking performance by six or seven of his players who lacked motivation:

(1) Moyesie

Conclusions:

(1) We will not finish top-4, no way
(2) No sponds? then sell JH and get some decent loaners next window
(3) Hitz deserves a run in the team
(4) Nuts needs a rocket up his divine godly pious ass
(5) Jags has become a good central defender again, all of a sudden
(6) Nay Naismith, let's go down the Costa Rican route
(7) Duffy?
(8) drop Coleman for who exactly?
(9) Feed jelly
(10) keep Felli at all costs, kidnap him, disguise him (hair cut), keep Felli.

Tom Evans
80 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:22:02
I think today was somehow inevitable. It was just on the cards and the result did not surprise me. The main theme running through this thread is the one of the weakness of our squad, and it is there fall all of us to see.

The sad thing is, if we could have got three points, with Chelsea and Manure dropping points we truly would have cemented a top four position.

Time to regroup methinks.
Mark Wilson
81 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:06:31
We lose so rarely it almost feels shocking when it happens. Those who went will have the most informed view having seen the entire game. But it's not too hard to draw conclusions from the ranting on Twitter, the somewhat less sweary but often harsh commentary here and the often pinpoint radio reporting from Sharpy.

The wheels are coming off unless we convert more chances into goals. Distin needs to return and suddenly right back is a serious issue with no Hibbo and now no Neville to step in and give Coleman a much-needed break as the lad is making some clearly awful mistakes and looks exposed.

Very disappointing as even the shite are catching us and the good start is getting derailed by too many draws and this poor defeat by a poor team.

Depressing stuff emerging from Moyes re no resources to buy or even loan in January, and a bench today which had some exciting prospects but was a little on the young and inexperienced side to rescue a stuttering second half performance as key men like Pienaar, Fellaini, Baines and Jelavic have another bad day.

A good win against Delia's mob will be vital to regain momentum but December looks very tough. I dared to dream for a bit that we actually had something going on this year but all those draws and now this daft defeat suggest that the small squad, injuries, and loss of form could combine to damage the optimism. Shame, but this is Everton and who knows what's in store?

David Hallwood
82 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:46:49
I could point out that 3 of the top 4 lost today, which makes it doubly frustrating because, if we had won, we'd be a point behind Chelsea and 4 behind Man Utd.

Breaks your fuckin heart this game.

Paul Andrews
83 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:49:04
Sad to see teams targetting our right side for their main attacking threat.
I`ve said it before the lad should be learning his trade with the ressies.
Paul Dark
84 Posted 17/11/2012 at 19:56:19
We do miss Neville when he doesn't play – though we don't miss his play per se. Mirallas's absence was felt, too. I'd like to see Distin and Heitinga play together. A trooper as Jags is (great tackler and blocker but poor passer and positioning), JH and SD have a very good understanding and are solid together.

Osman was dreadful as usual. He reminds me of the clueless Mike Newell (despite the size difference). Newell never knew where he was on the pitch – and the England maestro is the same. Any PL team with him in the middle of the park is asking for trouble – unless you're 4-0 up with 20 mins to play. Then, he's just about OK.

Paul Andrews
85 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:02:01
Paul @ 025.
Can I have a pint of your usual please :)
Paul Dark
86 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:02:38
Yes, David, Everton do break our hearts...
Derek Thomas
87 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:00:48
Tom Evans #026 Time to regroup... well yes. It doesn't matter how you win, it does however, matter how you lose and how you deal with it.

So long as it doesn't mean a return to KITAP1, with our current form we would end up doing neither...

Sam Hoare
88 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:14:43
We had 21 shots with 11 on target and they had 12 shots with 4 on target.

No need to shake it all up just better finishing and goalkeeping please.

Jamie Barlow
89 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:25:53
No need to shake up, just shape up.

Too many players taking it for granted that they're in the side.

I suppose that's what happens with a small squad.

Paul Ferry
90 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:28:37
Fucking hell Sam (37), I quote; 'No need to shake it all up [where was the much needed and lamented comma?] just better finishing and goalkeeping please'

(1) has anyone said 'shake it all up': names, numbers, ID's please?
(2) you have managed to squeeze two fundamentals of the game into a trite few words, scoring and stopping goals as if some magic will come along and fuck me it's all rosy and the sun is shining again. Stone the bleeding crows, why didn't I think of that, the team virtually goes AWOL 2nd half but keep yer air on we just need to score and stop. It aint darn rocket science is it? Repeat after me, 'score and stop, score and stop, score ... '

Who'd Adam and Eve it, I feel so much better now after that acute analysis and diagnosis. Nothing else wrong, I see it now, 'score and stop, score ...' We have one of the shittiest flapper spur-of-the-moment-prone-to-insanity keeper and zilch back-up, but, no worries, we just gotta stop the other geezers scoring, sorted.

Hold on tight boys and girls, we're going tpo four with Hoare; 'score and stop, score ...'

Dave White
91 Posted 17/11/2012 at 20:52:52
That one was written in the stars really...I shuddered when I saw we'd actually scored first!

One small comfort, I've just noticed we've played two more away games than home.

Bad day at the office, pick up move on...and all comments agreed re Coleman. Hibbo get well soon!

Jim Knightley
92 Posted 17/11/2012 at 21:19:28
It is true guys, Norwich are playing extremely well...They are also on a fantastic run of form. But, their best results have come at Carrow Road, and I'm sure we will manage to win at home. I will be less optimistic if Mirallas doesnt make it though..

It is a strange season... City are top, despite playing badly for much of it...Chelsea, who looked untouchable to begin with, now look flimsy, and Norwich just beat United...Probaly puts out result into perspective a bit.

On the plus side, one year ago, we were playing absolutely shit...since then, we've cleared out most of the overpaid/poorly performing players, added Jelavic, Pienaar, Oviedo, Gibson, Mirallas, Naismith etc and are enjoyable to watch now. When Hibbert and Gibson return, i'm sure we will look a little more defensively solid as well. Just a shame about today, because we could really have done with keeping clear of Arsenal and Spurs before our results toughen up. West Brom are also playing fantastic, but they won't be able to maintain it for the season.

But we must strengthen in January. Loans will do, but we need numbers.

Aiden Jones
93 Posted 17/11/2012 at 21:30:49
"Osman dreadful as usual".
As usual ...jeez. Poor today, maybe.
Jack Wilkinson
94 Posted 17/11/2012 at 21:36:39
Gary Mortimer, 986.

You've contradicted yourself in your own statement there mate.

"If we got the penalties all those missed chances don't matter"

Penalties aren't given goals, they're just more chances. If we miss those too who do you blame then?

Chris Butler
95 Posted 17/11/2012 at 22:30:46
I think some fans have got a little too excited by our decent start. The truth is, against Aston Villa, we should have scored 7; against Swansea we should have scored 6. We dropped 2 points against Newcastle in a stupid manner.

Against West Brom Fellaini missed a sitter before they went up the other end and scored. Against Fulham we created numerous chances, Naismith missing 2 sitters and we ended up drawing. We didn't deserve to beat Sunderland last week, Sunderland deserved a point.

Against QPR we were very luck not to concede a penalty when Coleman made a ridiculous challenge towards the end. Despite the fact Liverpool are absolutely useless, we still managed to only get a draw against them which isn't very impressive.

I think Felaini will leave in January unless we improve so we just have to hope we improve. We've got tough games coming up Arsenal, Manchester City and Spurs so it could get worse.
Sam Hoare
96 Posted 17/11/2012 at 22:39:58
Paul Ferry 043, despite the overdone sarcasm I don't really know what you're going on about.
Doug Harris
97 Posted 17/11/2012 at 22:44:37
A woeful performance today... how things have changed since early season when we all thought we are on our way. The squad has always been thin on the ground; for me, today proved how very true that is as our opponents know how to subdue our play

This game should have been finished within less than the 45 minutes of the first half. Suffice to say we blew it again... Sorry, lads, 6th at the very best is where we may finish.
Roman Sidey
98 Posted 17/11/2012 at 22:28:29
Baines' crossing and corner kicks are consistently shit. Our throw-ins take forever because only the fullbacks are allowed to take them, and we lost possession nearly every time. Howard waits until the opposition are back in possession before disposing. It's all too much.

So many of us said it, but those four draws against four teams we are much better than have cost us a solid top four spot. 20 points instead of 28, and now three dropped points to a team that hadn't won since April.

In a realistic world, next week we'll have the same squad to choose from, minus Fellaini. What do we do? Hitz did enough to get the nod...

Colman, Jags, Heitinga, Baines;
Naismith, Osman, Hitz, Pienaar;
Jelavic, Vellios.

is what it pribably will be. My 11:

Distin, Jags, Heitinga;
Coleman, Osman, Hitz, Pienaar, Baines;
Jelavic, Vellios.

I know people will jump at me, but Oviedo looked impressive again. Perhaps Baines needs a rest for a game.

Either way, with a back three Coleman won't be required to defend as much as he is now, and we'll have three decent halves.

I know Norwich are going to be difficult, but the timing of Fellaini's fifth yellow is as good as a bad situation can get. Better he miss this game than the next. Does it then clean his slate, or is he on even thinner ice?

Derek Thomas
99 Posted 17/11/2012 at 23:28:19
' A good start thrown away '....this sums up yesterday AND the whole season up to now.

WBA 2012-13 = Everton 2004-05

Everton 2012-13 = King Midas in reverse

Peter Jones
100 Posted 17/11/2012 at 23:33:47
Things that are a part of nearly every Everton match recently.

1. Everton dominating possession in final third.
2. Everton missing a boatload of chances.
3. Everton hitting the bar in one of these chances.
4. A dubious refereeing decision that influences the game in a major way.
5. Everton concedes from a set piece because of zonal marking.
6. A random error by Seamus Coleman provides fans a scapegoat for why we lost.

Our season so far in brief. We are fantastic but oh so infuriating.

Colin Malone
101 Posted 18/11/2012 at 00:36:47
Before Jelly's confidence gets any lower, let's get to the problem asto why?

It's no coincidence: it's been since when Marouane Fellaini has been pushed into a forward position. Felli goes for the balls in the box that Jelly would deffo score. in a nutshell, he has been pushed out of position.
Scott Stevenson
102 Posted 18/11/2012 at 00:41:27
Coleman will never make it as a right back, his decision making at the critical time is bloody awful.

Hurry up and get fit, Hibbo... the other lad's crap!!!!!!!
Paul Ferry
103 Posted 18/11/2012 at 04:22:03
In a nutshell, then, Sam (sarcasm was meant to be extended metaphor for rolling eyes), nothing at all wrong anywhere: just knock a few goals in and make some saves, nothing else wrong anywhere...

And your acute and shrewd diagnosis really works for yesterday's 2nd 45, right?
James Brand
104 Posted 18/11/2012 at 09:03:03
Didn't Coleman do the same thing at Wembley last year leading to the RS winner?

Clumsy ain't the word...

Sam Hoare
105 Posted 18/11/2012 at 09:07:00
Paul, not sure why I need to explain this to you but here goes...

If you had read the thread you would see my earlier post (005) stating that I did not watch the game and therefore am not in a position to give the 'acute and shrewd diagnosis' you seem to require.

Instead I offered a very simplistic and short observation based on the match stats and what I have seen in previous games. This observation highlighted two areas of concern in particular.

The first was that I think we are weak in the goalkeeper department, an observation that you seem to make yourself at 025!

The second was that we are being too profligate in front of goal, an observation that Moyes and countless others on this website seem to concur with.

Maybe I've ticked you off on another thread but really can't see why you are having a go at me for writing a short comment?!

Jamie Barlow
106 Posted 18/11/2012 at 10:10:24
Seems okay to me, Sam.

We need to tighten up at the back (whether it's Howard's fault alone, I doubt) and start hitting the target.

Pretty simply put but there isn't much wrong with how we are playing in general.

Even when playing as we did yesterday, we should have been 4 up in the first half and we hit the woodwork AGAIN in the second.

It's the effort we put in second half that pisses me off. Non-existent.

Jon Cox
107 Posted 18/11/2012 at 10:30:43
Sadly Moyes doesn't seem to motivate when required. Until he finds this quality, we'll always be the "nearly team".

He needs to learn how to put teams to the sword. He seems to be able to motivate when 2-0 down but can't do it when 1-0 up.

Strange.

Clive Rogers
108 Posted 18/11/2012 at 11:02:37
It's now obvious we are going to be nowhere near top four. We need signings in January but it won't happen because Kenwright is too busy buying up shares to consolidate his position. He has never put a penny into the club, but can find the money to prop his own position up. He's there till he dies. God knows where we'll be by then. It will be interesting to see who will still be there next season.
Bobby Thomas
109 Posted 18/11/2012 at 10:57:43
With Coleman it certainly appears he could do with a break, but all this "he's got no chance" is way off beam for me.

You have to bear in mind where he has come from and how long he has been exposed to top-level football without coming through the system. What you are seeing is a lad cutting his teeth defensively at the sharp end and he is currently feeling the heat. Going forward he is great, provides us with an extra dimension and he can learn his trade defensively. But he could probably do with a few games of watching, learning and working on the training ground to give him a rest mentally.

For me, he is aggressive, pacey, dynamic and as he develops has all the tools to be a very good right back in the division. Trappatoni seems to rate him, Holloway loved him and Moyes seems to think he can have a dart at it. The lad is a good player but naive and currently being exposed. I would expect Hibbo to give him a break when ft as we need to tighten it.

Defensively.... we need to stop the set-piece goals; however, we are very "open" in style at the moment and the need for a holding payer is paramount as the centre halves are getting exposed. If we can get to the window and get one in, then when Neville is fit again (and we will miss him badly, he will be more appreciated when he's back) we can go with two holding players to be tighter, hopefully. However, we are hostage to injuries and suspensions and even yesterday, when they are only just starting to bite, the bench looked thin.

This period is crucial and we have to consolidate. Home form will be vital. We need to keep in around 4th/5th/6th and keep digging points out, there is no outstanding team for 4th place. Stick in there and get to the window and hopefully Moyes can work in a couple of loans.

If we can loan in a holding player and some extra up top, that would be great. I'm hoping we can stay in range and then freshen it. We need to get back to grinding points out even if we aren't playing well and rekindle some of our general Moyes solidity with the new-found flexibility.

Brian Dagnall
110 Posted 18/11/2012 at 11:48:32
It all comes down to level of expectation. I think Everton are the best kept secret in the Premiership. Motson and a few others may fancy our chances but many people on this site either suspect or know that in fact we only have 4 or 5 quality players and he rest are just ordinary at best. Take Jagielka, Baines, Moralles and Fellaini out of that team and we are middle table, workmanlike, and that's it.

Maybe Piennar could be included in the quality list, but he and Baines are playing poorly just now ....but have patience they'll be back. But no matter what Hodgson says a lightweight midfielder who falls over, with no speed, no shot and who couldn't head a sponge, cannot be considered quality. You know who I mean, but I must admit he is playing better now than I have ever seen him play before. But still not a real threat going forward.

When will an Everton midfielder run at a defense and "dare" a defender to trip him? Only Moralles. And when did we see a shot (apart from Hitz) from a midfielder coming up to the penalty area. Never. Only Baines comes forward threatening something.

So I expect not too much. We are doing pretty good considering the limited quality we have

Terry McLavey
111 Posted 18/11/2012 at 11:58:45
2nd Half Who are you ? and what have you done with EVERTON !! I think Vellios should replace Jelavic for a while, when he's brought on he never gets time to get going, although that header WAS a sitter ('spose easy for us to say from the armchair !) We have too many players who "fade" as the game progresses. Lesson learnt today , Don't underestimate Norwich, no game is a done deal!
Peter Bell
112 Posted 18/11/2012 at 13:26:33
Coleman, never has been, never will be a footballer no matter where he is played. Woeful defender and a one trick pony going forward. Head down and run, once the opposition have that sussed he is nothing and offers nothing.
Ian Allaker
113 Posted 18/11/2012 at 14:12:10
I wish people would get off Coleman's back, we all know he is a squad player that was a cheap £60k punt. He is our 3rd choice RB that is only playing because Hibbo and Neville and Gibson are injured.

He's doing his best and has added some exciting moments down the right. He is still young and learning, he can only learn by making mistakes, that's why Moyes preferred to send him on loan and then play him right midfield but has now been forced to play him at RB.
Anthony Garvey
114 Posted 18/11/2012 at 14:46:25
A clear penalty right in front of the referee: handball... Was he still pissed off about getting reprimanded for wrongly sending Rodwell off in the derby game?
Andrew Ellams
115 Posted 18/11/2012 at 15:10:40
The wheels seem to be coming off our supposedly great season. 1 win and 7 points in 6 games is bottom 6 form.

I am starting to believe that we will start next season without Moyes or Fellaini and the rot will set in. And the shadow of our nearest and dearest is starting to loom all of a sudden... with our fixture list of the next few weeks, expect that gap to shrink.

Patrick Murphy
116 Posted 18/11/2012 at 15:05:54
I know that the team are responsible for the chances they miss and the goals they concede, but how disheartening must it be when you realise that the Refereee is not only going to be looking to book you for the slightest misdemeanour but will turn down blatant pens or see non existent off-sides when you score but allow the opposition the benefit of the doubt in similar circumstances.

The big-moneyed teams don't need help in winning games but week after week, season after season they get that help in bucketloads from Mother O'Riley's handmaids.

Admittedly Everton should have buried another team away from home but when Referees and their assistants are making up their own rules to suit themselves then the game is a complete waste of time and isn't worth the effort and time involved. See the Man City penalties against Villa yesterday for example, would we have been awarded them flimsy decisions, I very much doubt it.

Imagine if Suarez played for us (God Forbid) , he would spend more time being suspended than he would out on the pitch , and that is the problem with the officials and the media , it's not who you are it's who you play for.


Andy Walker
117 Posted 18/11/2012 at 15:23:05
Andrew Ellams 152. Have you been on the Absinthe? Jeeesss.....
You never know the sun may rise tomorrow!
David Holroyd
118 Posted 18/11/2012 at 19:59:45
We had some shocking decisions given this season. Not to mention hitting the woodwork about a dozen times. But you have to take your chances...

What has happened to Jelavic? Let's hope his loss of form is not to long. We may have lost Neville but Gibson looks like he may be back... But Fellaini is suspended.
Nathan Jones
119 Posted 18/11/2012 at 21:15:06
Just been reading through the comments on here, and thought that I would give a quick summary:

Our goal keeper is rubbish
Our defense if shocking
Our Midfield doesn't have a decent player
Our strike force doesn't deserve the name.

We have no chance of finishing forth.

Hmmm that's strange because when I look at the league we are 4th. FOURTH. The fourth best team in the land. We have lost fewer games that Man Utd. We have had more shots than any other team in the Prem.

I understand the frustration that and that we want more, but this is the best team we have had for 20-25 years. yes I know we finished 4th at the start of Moyes managerial reign, but I don't think anyone would argue that this this is a better team.

I think the fight from 3-6 will be competitive this season, anyone from us, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Spurs and errrr West Brom. I know that is 6 teams and four places, but I think the league will be tight this year, apart from first place where I think Man City will waltz it, and Man Utd will chase them through SAF bloody stubbornness rather than the greatness of the team.

So my summary, we could finish anywhere from 3-6, but we definitely are not shite.

Gavin Ramejkis
120 Posted 18/11/2012 at 21:30:39
Nathan we are fifth - F I F T H, the fifth best team in the Premier League NOT the land.
Ciarán McGlone
121 Posted 18/11/2012 at 21:28:27
We're 5th. FIFTH.
Phil Rodgers
122 Posted 18/11/2012 at 22:55:36
I am not proud of this but my main concern is Liverpool catching us up. I don't think I would hear the end of it if they do. I really think some of these dropped points are gonna catch up.with us. I think how we react against Norwich will define our season.

Sorry for the half empty outlook. But let's face it we have all been here before.

Tom Bowers
123 Posted 18/11/2012 at 23:12:59
So right, Phil. An all-too-familiar story but even more galling this season when we started so well yet seem to be struggling to get the wins against lowly opposition. Even the Soton and Sunderland home wins were full off questionable defending.

Just maybe the return of Mirallas and certainly Gibson may get it turned around again. If the Hammers win tomorrow, we are down to 6th.
Ian Linn
124 Posted 19/11/2012 at 04:30:08
Fuck me I'd hate to go to the match with most of you lot - even if we won you'd be moaning about something.

Do anyone remember the 90s - abject fucking mediocrity with one bright spot of 1995 when we finished 6th and won the FA cup. Other than that, we were shite. No the shite that people think is shite today - 13-17-15-6-15-17-14-13-16-15 were our Premier League finishes until Moyes came along - including that fucking nightmare against Wimbledon where we could have gone down. Put it in perspective - we're so much better now than we have been in years.

Paul Ferry
125 Posted 19/11/2012 at 06:06:50
I hear you brother Phil (206): after so so long and so much suffering and so much hating the shite – I'm 48 – 4th is nice, 5th is worse, but Satan's spawn are still 5 points Benituz and that was my one warm glow after that fucking disgraceful 2nd half at the Plastic Madjesjki whatever.
Peter Bell
126 Posted 19/11/2012 at 08:13:24
Cannot understand those who cant see the problem with Jelavic. He is a class striker, the best penalty box forward we have had for a long time. He is starting to suffer the same problems all our forwards have since Tim Cahill arrived.

Cahill arrived with Marcus Bent and Moyes hit on a formula by chance that got us a champions league place. One up top with a mid fielder joining the attack, before this he always played two upfront. Since then we have had:

Beattie : Lone Striker
Johnson : Lone Striker
Yakubu : Lone Striker
Saha : Lone Striker
Beckford : Lone Striker

And now Jelavic looks like the next one to be isolated. Get this man the support he deserves and he will net a bagfull
Phil Rodgers
127 Posted 19/11/2012 at 08:11:42
It's precisely that we're not shite, Ian, that is so vexing. But we keep shooting ourselves in the foot every week.

It's all relative anyway. People are always gonna complain. If we finished 2nd we would moan that we didn't win the league.

I'm 30 in a couple of weeks so I remember the 90s like they were yesterday. We may have been shit but it still gave me the best moment of my Everton supporting life.
Tony J Williams
128 Posted 19/11/2012 at 08:58:35
I couldn't give a flying fig about what those walking abortions across the park do or if they are closing the gap. I am interested in Everton and what they do.

Possible explanation for a lacklustre second half could be that most of them had played in an absolutely pointless friendly all over the globe so tiredness kicked in. That and the fact Coleman doesn't seem to know what to do with his body and just jumps into their player... God knows why?

Add that to the ref screwing us again and the post stopping us and the fact that whenever a team shoots against us, it's seems to be a 50/50 whether it goes in or not. We must be one of the most "unluckiest" teams in terms of shots against and goals conceded... is this Howard's fault?
Ray Roche
129 Posted 19/11/2012 at 09:23:03
We have failed to score in only one game this season, away to West Brom, the same West Brom who have won 6 and lost 1 of their home games in the League. It appears to me that keeping a clean sheet is by far our main concern (refereeing decisions apart). The return of Hibbert and Gibson will help considerably on that front.

And maybe Forrest Gump playing right mid instead of right back .... Dear Lord, how silly all the shouts for Coleman to be playing right back look now. He's about as effective as Anne Widdicombe would be. But without her defensive strengths.
Andrew Ellams
130 Posted 19/11/2012 at 09:53:48
Andy Walker @155, I have definitely not been drinking absinthe. Us finishing 4th was always going to be a tight one if it happened and I think that the points we have thrown away recently will probably tip the balance at the end of the season, especially with the games we have coming up between now and Christmas. And I honestly believe finishing 4th or not will be the make or break between Moyes siging his new deal and Fellaini staying at the club.
Tony J Williams
131 Posted 19/11/2012 at 10:48:09
Peter 225, it could be construed that way but it doesn't explain the double figures he scored last season for us in half a season and the fact that he is still scoring a goal every two games when he is going through a poor patch.

I would say that the form of Pienaar and Baines has a big impact on the scoring stats for Jelavic. They have both stunk the place out the last 3/4 games and crosses and passes aren't getting to him.

Brent Stephens
132 Posted 19/11/2012 at 11:42:23
Ray Roche: "How silly all the shouts for Coleman to be playing right back look now. He's about as effective as Anne Widdicombe would be. But without her defensive strengths".

I hadn't considered her. I think she's a free agent. Nice piece of lateral thinking – in fact, there's plenty of lateral there.

Ray Roche
133 Posted 19/11/2012 at 11:55:42
Brent, it'd take five minutes to get around her.
Drew O'Neall
134 Posted 19/11/2012 at 15:04:49
Peter 225 - Sorry I don't subscribe to that point of view.

Players like Jelavic love being the focal point of the attack. He has three attacking players around him (as well as Osman) and they all have only him in the box to pass to.

He has suffered a little from Mirallas intent on over-shooting occassionally but otherwise he would have had to share his supply with another striker.

You can't argue he hasn't had the chances either, for some reason he's just not put them away this year, perhaps he's gotten complacent because we do seem to give him so many damn chances to score (probably why Big Vic has the hump too!).

Steavey Buckley
135 Posted 19/11/2012 at 16:44:29
Teams like Everton were not alone who suffered a reversal in fortunes at the weekend, Chelsea and Man United also suffered away from home. Against teams who had few or no players away on useless international friendlies, so could train and focus all week on their weekend games. Everton basically 'ran out of steam' in the second half.
Gary Heywood
136 Posted 19/11/2012 at 16:35:03
It was a brilliant first half display but Everton's finishing was shocking.

I think psychologically Everton are a very weak team. They came out in the second half feeling sorry for themselves and Reading just took the game away from them. They lost the will to win against a team who will be relegated.

Everton have now dropped so many points so far this season when they shouldn't have done and I think they are getting more disheartened as the season plays out. They haven't got the inner strength to win at all costs. We also try to hang onto slender leads which is also shows mental weakness.

My most disappointing match of the season so far was the derby match. I was hoping for a big reaction from the nervous shambles of a defeat against Liverpool in the FA semi but from the start of the match they dominated us and quickly went 2-0 up. We are still mentally frightened of them.

I think Everton have the football ability to be 4th but mentally they are one of the weakest teams in the Premier League. I think this reflects on Moyes ability as a manager. He can spot a good player but I don't think he can make him a winner.

Andy Walker
137 Posted 19/11/2012 at 18:44:28
Andrew Ellams. Nothing is impossible, but your very downbeat predictions involve jumping so many steps forward and thinking the worst case each time. The club does not revolve around 1 manager or 1 player, never has and to presume we are now looking at a dire future is extremely premature. Even if they did leave it certainly doesnt mean were doomed.

I guess some of us are natural worriers though.


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