Moyes bemoans Manchester Moneybags

, The Telegraph , 5 May, 44comments  |  Jump to most recent
David Moyes is concerned Merseyside will remain in Manchester's shadow until the financial gulf between the North-West clubs is bridged.

David Moyes “At the moment, the strength of the Manchester clubs is overpowering,” said Moyes. “Liverpool have obviously been much closer to the Manchester teams than Everton, but we've had a longer journey. We're closing that gap but not close enough.

“Both the Manchester clubs hold stadiums with over 70,000 for one, 50,000 the other. The corporate facilities play a big part, especially with the Financial Fair Play coming in.

"So much is going to be about relying on marketing teams and how many [executive] boxes you can sell, season tickets you sell and dinners you sell.

“At Everton we have very few rooms to cater and very few boxes to fill. We're going to find it difficult to keep up because the marketing side is so important. Keeping up and then to catch up is going to be even harder.

“We've got to somehow generate revenue by even thinking about naming rights for the stadium. Obviously they could do that because the club owns Goodison. Things like this are going to be relevant to both clubs if we're going to hang in there with the top teams.”

Quotes or other material sourced from The Telegraph



Reader Comments (44)

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Robin Hunuki
1 Posted 05/05/2013 at 05:06:32
If only King's Docks worked out... but then again from reading articles about the Evertonian's disputing it (being out of the city of Liverpool [if I've got that correct]) maybe it was meant to be.

Either way, the sooner we get a new stadium, obviously the more revenue we can generate and the more revenue we generate the more competitive (presumably) we get... but then again, where the fuck are we going to get that coin to build a... Actually, I'm just going to stop and go back to sleep...

Tim Jones
2 Posted 05/05/2013 at 05:38:11
As I understand it we cant even fill the paltry number of Executive Boxes we already have every game so what would we do with more. Oh and throwing money at a problem does not always fix it and a prime example of that is QPR. What you need first is the right Manager and thats what we don't have.
Eric Myles
3 Posted 05/05/2013 at 06:14:29
Robin, King's Dock is a prime location in the city. The cowshed with no transport options that Kenwright wanted to move us to out of the city was Desperation Kirkby.
Eric Myles
4 Posted 05/05/2013 at 06:16:25
Naming rights for the stadium isn't going to get us much money, especially if the past record of our marketing deals are anything to go by.
Carl Sanderson
5 Posted 05/05/2013 at 07:12:48
This article sums things up well, in my opinion (although it will be dismissed, no doubt, by the usual claque as a "dreadful piece", or something).

http://m.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/may/04/david-Moyes-everton

Mike Green
6 Posted 05/05/2013 at 07:56:29
Carl - might be me but link doesn't seem to work.
Kane Green
7 Posted 05/05/2013 at 08:30:35
Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but isn't the revenue from corporate hospitality just a drop in the ocean compared to the money from Sky?
Even gate receipts for an entire season are dwarfed by Sky money. A generous 35,000 crowd at £35 a game for 19 games brings in about £24m by my, admittedly rough, calculations. Our lack of funds lies in our club falling way behind in terms of shirt sponsors, kit deals and the rest of the commercial stuff that the top clubs seem to make huge figures from.
The problem with the stadium issue is that we can't charge £60-£100 a ticket in the way Arsenal or Chelsea can. We simply wouldn't get the numbers through the turnstile that United or even Liverpool would.
Paul Ellam
8 Posted 05/05/2013 at 07:39:33
This is where a shared stadium with "that lot" may actually help both clubs (Stanley Park site would be ideal in my opinion)
Moyes is correct that the Merseyside clubs are way behind those from Manchester and it doesn't look like anything is going to improve any time soon so alternative ideas must/need to be looked at to bring money in.
I realise it is not a perfect scenario to share grounds but personally I would be prepared to accept it if it meant we started competing more and actually win trophies.
Perhaps with a new shiny stadium more people would use the corporate boxes and generate money for us. We won't know until we try, and let's be honest, Goodison is an acquired taste that only hardcore fans will put up with (restricted viewing, creaky stands etc)
The current situation where we sell our best players to keep the banks off our backs cannot continue forever and that would leave us in big trouble.
I cannot see any other alternative myself although I am open to all ideas that will help our club prosper.
Paul Ellam
9 Posted 05/05/2013 at 08:46:31
Kane, you're right. Commercially, we are hopeless!
I don't know how we can change that though, apart from changing sponsors etc. but whoever we get seem to give us the same deal.
It's very frustrating to see other clubs do so well in these departments and us fail so badly!
Brin Williams
10 Posted 05/05/2013 at 08:44:32
I'm sorry to throw a spanner in the works but corporate/fine dining/boxes/naming rights are all very well - so is the stadium development - but the money needs to be spent on the team FIRST.

Without a team that produces results on a regular basis and gets us to Wembley and Europe you are not going to attract the crowds and interest in Corporate boxes and the fans will stick with their Scouse Pie and Pint of Chang.

Get the directors to plunge their hands into those deep pockets and pull out a few rabbits for Moyes to breed a team of thoroughbreds.

Kevin Hudson
11 Posted 05/05/2013 at 08:44:34
My Granddad's ashes were scattered onto the Goodison Park pitch.

Imagine therefore, my distaste at the notion of it becoming, say...the EasyJet Arena.

Tony J Williams
12 Posted 05/05/2013 at 09:03:56
Kevin, they can name it what they want it will always be Goodison to me
Paul Gladwell
13 Posted 05/05/2013 at 09:14:11
To fill corporate boxes you need to bring more people on our fan base, the boxes we have now don't sell out as we have a fan base with a very low income.
If we got a new stadium these exec boxes would be empty unless we become successful, so it's simple you have to get the team right first to bring in bandwagon fans.
Any new stadium I would suggest putting in pubs or suites like pubs, were fans can buy cheap food like the hot Wok in the old blue house, three course meal stuff are just too pricey for most Evertonians.
Trevor Lynes
14 Posted 05/05/2013 at 09:20:15
Brin... you are echoing what I have been saying for ages.

WE are the only investors in the club.
WE pay to watch.
WE pay for season tickets.
WE buy club merchandise.

The Board watch for free. Take any merchandise they want. >Hold shares so lose no money. Only buy so long as our sales exceed what we are buying.

This BOARD does not invest but expect outsiders to provide investment. A load of damn hypocrites if you ask me. I for one am disgusted and dismayed at what this board are doing (nothing) to improve our image and squad. We are just treading water and the only way is down so long as this board of latter day Neroes continue to fiddle whilst the team decays.

Eric Myles
15 Posted 05/05/2013 at 09:49:19
Mike #267, not just you, it doesn't work for me either.
Richard Dodd
16 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:11:18
Sorry to be a pessimist but I don`t see any real possibility of the gap EVER being narrowed. There must be a finite limit to the number of mad Russians and Sheiks whose lust for respectability and flogging airline tickets and gas makes them go this route.

I think what has happened to Tony Fernandes at QPR will have put a lot of prospective investors off the idea and for Everton the greatest barrier to a `good` takeover remains the stadium. For that reason, I am bringing my son up to see `seventhish` as `heavenish`!

Wayne Smyth
17 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:13:09
Moyes is right that they have an advantage over us, but it's not insurmountable. Kane is probably right when he says that the tv money is by far the biggest income stream.

But, rather than carping on about how everything is stacked against him(as usual), he should focus on what he CAN do to bridge the gap.

For example, he could get rid of the deadwood from the team, save £10M / season and give a few academy players some chance to develop.

Every season we might be able to sell a rodwell for £10M.

Not a perfect plan, but at least its sustainable and within our control to develop our own talent and occasionally sell a bit of the family silver. Instead we've too many players who contribute little and take huge amounts in salary.

What I'd like us to do is plan for a few seasons of mid-table football, focus on youth development and clear our debt. We'll then be in a much better position in the long term to exploit whatever income we do have which can be spent on the club and not go to the banks.

Peter Askins
18 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:02:35
A none-too-subtle inference from Mr Moyes that a bigger shared stadium is the single most important factor in bringing us closer to the promised land! On balance, I too have come round to this opinion in the last few years.

Of course, the tricky issue is paying for it, but a few more seasons of the RS being second-best to us (starting this afternoon!) may well persuade their rich American owners that a shared stadium would be mutually beneficial.

I also think that it's not a given that we would struggle to fill a 50,000 stadium, with dozens of corporate boxes. The product on the pitch is all important, but if we get this right, there is a case for arguing "if we build it, they will come"!

Yes, our support does largely come from a traditional working class demographic, but Premier League football is now cosmopolitan, and an acceptable way for the more affluent sports fans (and not even Everton fans) to spend their leisure time.

True story — I was outside Old Trafford a few years ago, two hours before the United-Everton game. An American bloke approached a large group of United fans, and asked if anybody knew where he could buy cigarettes. Of the fifty or so united fans in various groups, not one could help, as not one fan came from Manchester. Yes, this might be an extreme example, as it is well known that United attract fans from all over the world, but the point stands (I think) that a successful Everton team (and I'm thinking Top Six) would pull in plenty of "new" fans, willing to spend money in shiny bright new surroundings.

We too have supporters clubs all around the world, and progressive marketing (I know, I know !) could surely bring plane-loads of Evertonians to a big new stadium, and allow these fans to deposit their dollars, yen, and dongs into our coffers!

Carl Sanderson
19 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:30:18
Mike 267 Eric 287:

Sorry, lads. Try pasting it into your browser or just go to the Guardian's online sports section. Or perhaps Mike could put the article up top?

(I'm a bit useless with technology.)

Nick Entwistle
20 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:30:14
My heart sank twice reading this. Second time on reading about naming rights. The first time? Closing the gap by selling dinners.

But if we build a new stadium and Liverpool want to rent it once a fortnight, clean up after themselves, have no music on the PA system - then I'm cool with that.

Barry Rathbone
21 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:29:22
Good old Moyes another reason why we can't.

Not sure as many "across the park" will embrace such defeatism and negativity.

Dreadful piece.

Ray Roche
22 Posted 05/05/2013 at 10:41:23
Barry, like you I get a bit fed up with all the negativity that surrounds pieces like this, but, to be honest, Moyes is just telling it like it is. But why can't he wait until after today's match? We all know how deep the financial shite is that we are in, why rub it in on today of all days?

I think that if we had a stadium capable of holding 50k it would still only need to cater for 35k on average through the season, with all the empty seats underlying our inability to fill it.

Kevin Hudson
23 Posted 05/05/2013 at 11:03:03
That's right Barry, as Man City were SUCH A FORCE with Shaun Goater & Nicky Summerbee at the old Maine Road, prior to the introduction of unlimited petro-dollars, weren't they..?

Tim Kells
24 Posted 05/05/2013 at 11:10:02
The article in the Guardian is well worth reading. We've all got different views about what whether we want Davie to stay but what is undeniable is the financial straight jacket he's had to work in. In addition the new tv deal is worth an extra £30m per year to all clubs, I wonder whether we will see an increase in other operating costs by Kenwright. I seriously doubt who ever is in charge will get any of it to spend.
Ciaran Duff
25 Posted 05/05/2013 at 12:31:38
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/may/04/david-Moyes-everton
Richard Dodd
26 Posted 05/05/2013 at 12:31:49
But every club will get the extra TV money so it will just maintain the status quo.
How much is available to the manager depends on what the banks say about reducing the debt.
I suspect they run the club-not BK!
Keith Conchie
27 Posted 05/05/2013 at 12:33:17
Great article highlighting the problems of Goodison and the financial restraints on Moyes.

Not too happy about selling the naming rights to our ground, but it is a way of generating much needed income.

We do desperately need a new stadium, with more seats, as I'm sure we could fill it. I know a lot of fans won't attend goodison because of the state of the stadium and the 4000 seats which have restricted view. A new stadium would also allow for extra corporate facilities and private boxes which bring in a lot of money, something which is very very restricted at our ground yet proves very popular.

Give Moyes what he needs and he will give us the success we want....

COYB!!!!! IMWT!!!!!

Colin Glassar
28 Posted 05/05/2013 at 15:41:26
We all know the limitations at GP but our commercial team are pathetic. £11m quid generated by off field activities. Ffs, there are like 3 billion Asians who are football mad and we have absolutely no presence in that market bar a shit shirt deal with Chang beer.
Patrick Murphy
29 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:02:42
I have one thing to say to David Moyes, if you don't think we can compete go to Manchester, if they'll have you. Defeatism or realism isn't going to improve our chances and complaining about what we haven't got doesn't help either.
Patrick Murphy
30 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:46:36
Even their fans buy into this fatalistic approach one said in reply to the article, "Liverpool are a worldwide marketing enterprise, Everton are virtually unknown." So much for what happens out on the pitch then eh!

Eric Myles
31 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:49:20
Richard #292, a good attempt at disguising a 'careful what you wish for' post but not quite good enough not to be seen through.

Seventhish may be heavenish for Kenwright but no goo good enough for the fans, we will only progress when Kenwright is gone.

Ross Edwards
32 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:57:41
Yep, Davey, you've praised the krauts now you're moaning about the Mancs. Instead of focusing on the good and bad of football why don't you announce your not before too long departure, or pile more purgatory on us by signing a new deal.

Anyway mate, You wouldn't be moaning now if we had City's money would you? More excuses for his dismal failures every year.

Eric Myles
33 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:55:23
Wayne #293, every season we DO sell a Rodwell for 10 mill, we need to so we can pay off the banks.
Wayne Smyth
34 Posted 05/05/2013 at 16:49:44
Shall we just close the club down and all do something else with our time? If there's no hope of competing and winning anything and its all about money like DM always likes to suggest, then we may as well.

Money isn't the only factor in being able to compete. Stability and squad harmony count for a lot. Its not all good stuff having a massive squad of overpaid ego's. QPR are a great example of what happens when there is no stability and too much money. Even sheik Mansoors billions can't get Man City close to Utd this season either.

Maybe next time we play leeds, brentford, or norwich or whoever, we should remind them before the game that we're richer than they are and so they probably shouldn't bother putting out a team.

I think Moyes comes out with stuff like this to massage his own ego. I think he likes to keep reminding people what a miraculous job he's doing getting the 10th richest club in the land into 6th or 7th place on a consistent basis.

Truth is that we've not really struggled against the richer teams to the extent that we have done against teams assembled for similar or less than us. Its all the draws and losses against the lower ranked teams this season which have cost us, not the fact that we might lose at Chelsea.

Eric Myles
35 Posted 05/05/2013 at 17:03:43
Keith #332, selling the naming rights to the ground will generate less income than selling a player.
Eric Myles
36 Posted 05/05/2013 at 17:12:10
Ciaran, that link doesn't work either.
Carl Sanderson
37 Posted 05/05/2013 at 18:24:18
Eric 431:

Go to the Guardian's football page and scroll down to the Most Read tab. It's there at No. 8

Carl Sanderson
38 Posted 05/05/2013 at 18:28:54
Eric:

Or Google Moyes guessing

Noel Early
39 Posted 05/05/2013 at 20:08:31
Nothing in that article we didn't already know... well, apart from the worn carpets. Moyes will sign his new contract, I've no doubt about that, and he will continue to blow his own trumpet about how great he would be if he had money to spend. Let's face it, nobody is going to buy us and the best we can continue hoping for is to finish ahead of that crowd across the road.
Mike Oates
40 Posted 05/05/2013 at 20:11:23
For the umpteen time in last year or so – I live in the South and my mate is in private pension finance area for big-money earners and other Pension Companies. He does Corporate Hospitality for UK and Worldwide people. He goes regularly with clients to Arsenal, Spurs, Man Utd, Man City and Chelsea, Lords, St Andrews, Wimbledon, etc etc. There is no demand at all or wish by clients to come to Liverpool to watch LFC or EFC – it's is now a backwater in football, now the 3rd City in England and god forbid if Villa get there act together because it will become the 4th City.

The Company are already waiting for West Ham to get the Olympic Stadium and want all London clubs to get decent size grounds, which they will in time. Spurs planning one , so are QPR and Fulham aren't that far behind.

The only way for the Liverpool clubs to get back up there is by winning things, getting together to build a 60-70,000 joint stadium, getting a decent airport and hoping to God that there is something better to do and see other than the Albert Dock!!!

Chris Matheson
41 Posted 05/05/2013 at 20:48:41
I wonder if these comments by Moyesey are a coded rebuke to Kenwright to shape up or ship out? As an employee of the club, and an honourble man, Moyes can't criticise his employer. But he can send out cryptic messages such as this that we are falling further and further behind, that the board are doing nothing to sell the club (sorry, "find investment") and that the gulf is growing ever wider as long as the gentlemen amateurs run EFC.
Carl Sanderson
42 Posted 05/05/2013 at 23:15:51
Noel:

This section is especially interesting...

"Everton's average net spend per season in the Moyes years comes in at a mere £803,000. Compare that with Aston Villa's average of £10.8m over the past decade, Stoke's £7.8m and Sunderland £7.6m and their corresponding league positions: Everton pushing for a Champions League place until recently; Villa, Stoke and Sunderland fighting relegation."

To me, that signifies over-achievement by Everton on the face of chronic and severe financial pressure.

Bjørn-Ivar Pedersen
43 Posted 06/05/2013 at 08:30:38
There is no point in envying other clubs their financial situation, we have to make our own destiny.
Since it does not seem to come in some fresh money do to new owners, then we should pull a Lescott a season. We need to go out there and find them talented players, buy them cheap and turn them into top quality players and then cash in, then in a 10 years more time we should face a healthier economy.
And for this job there is no better man than Moyes....so this is kind of choosing between plague or cholera, titles or good economy.
But I have always wondered if there is not possible to bring in top people into the PR department, or are they also to expensive for us to hire.
During my travels in Asia I have yet to find the name of Everton around there among Newcastle, Tottenham, manchester teams, Arsenal, Chelsea....that marked is yet to be developed further. I bet it is the same for the American continent. Even Europe should be developed more, even here in Norway you cant find stuff with the Everton logo on, something witch was possible two decades ago.
Well go figure you who can, I am just so tired of this boring football shown to us from a team that used to go all out with no respect for anyone and win wherever they went. I miss those good 'ol days yeap.
Ross Edwards
44 Posted 07/05/2013 at 13:13:22
Hey Davey, if you can't beat em, join 'em!

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