Manchester United vs Everton

"A win this weekend followed by another against Aston Villa and the whole complexion of the season could change very quickly."

I was not confident about this game but I'm loving the fact the fact the media are already saying Man Utd are gonna whack us.

We're gonna do 'em again. Pienaar fit and we'll destroy 'em down the left flank.

COYMBB!

I would have a bit more confidence if Coleman is fit because much as though I respect Hibbo I do not fancy him against Di Maria.

I would also like the MF to be more solid with McCarthy, Besic and Barry which IMO gives us a much better foundation to control the game.

I would start with Pienaar, Lukaku and Naismith and bring Eto'o on second half for one of them.

I'm hoping that these late fitness test are a smoke and mirrors scam to keep the Dutch manager guessing.

I think it could play out a cat and mouse for the first 15 but that would play into their mindset.

We need to be bold and test their back four to unsettle them, get their fans feeling anxious.

It's winnable so I will go for 3-2 Everton. One thing's for sure: there will be lots of TW posts, no matter what the result.

Howard
Hibbert Stones Jagielka Baines
Besic Barry
McGeady Naismith Pienaar
Lukaku

Subs: Robles, Distin, Browning, Oviedo, Gibson, Osman, Eto'o

In spite of the injuries to Barkley, Mirallas, Coleman and McCarthy, I think that is a fairly strong starting XI and subs bench.

We will likely be up against:

De Gea
Rafael McNair Rojo Blackett
Di Maria Blind Mata Januzaj
Van Persie Falcao

Their forward line is formidable, no doubt about that, but defensively, they have an inexperienced line-up and could be there for the taking.

We are scraping through games, we scraped through at Anfield and in Russia yet with Man Utd's goal threat, there is every possibility it could be another Chelsea if we aren't switched on.

I'd really love to be positive about our chances but injuries to so many key players coupled together with some woeful form from others is a very bad combination to have and is basically a recipe for not winning matches.

The midfield that we are currently putting out, especially the one on Thursday was as static and pedestrian as anything we seen during one of David Moyes's worst seasons.

Sitting here now I'd take a draw even though I know we need to start winning games. We need to get out of tomorrow with some kind of positive result AND a better display, then we have two more league matches left in October, at home to Villa and away to Burnley. Whilst it's only Autumn, I'd take a pretty good guess that failure to win in those games then the supporters will soon become restless.

Let's hope for a more promising month than expected.

Even with Mirallas, Barkley, etc we'd still struggle against that forward line as our defending as been shite this season.

I'm normally quite positive and I don't really rate Man Utd as a team. But I would quite happily take a point right now. Please don't let us get humiliated.

Howard, Browning, Baines, Stones, Jagielka, Besic, McCarthy, Pienaar, Naismith, Lukaku, McGeady.

These are here for the taking and big Rom should play on the defenders' shoulders and look to get in behind them whenever possible. I have only put McGeady in because of injuries; if Coleman is fit, I would put him in instead in front of Browning.

Now I understand.

Dixie will be due another turn in his grave!

So, mindset will largely determine the result. If we go there worrying about them and their expensive forwards, then we'll lose for sure. If we work hard and stay positive, we've got every chance of beating them.

But it's really important we actually have a go at them, not "try to escape there alive" like we did for so many years. I think and hope Martinez will have the players mentally better prepared for it than we've been under OFM.

Michael (7) – I'd be interested to see some information on why you think Coleman is a worse defender than Hibbert. Certainly in the last 2 years Hibbert has played only a couple of games, so quite how you can come to that conclusion baffles me.

Hibbert was ripped to shreds by Montero at Swansea and we conceded because of it, but that kind of thing won't show against him in any stat, like conceding a pen, for example.

That said, I thought Hibbert did well against Krasnodar, so perhaps he needs a few matches to get match sharpness, but he'll never have the quality of Coleman, who as well as being a good defender, is superb going forward. There is a very good reason why the rich teams are sniffing around him, and that's because he's probably one of the top full backs in Europe.

Too many more lethargic looking displays just won't go down well; I'm becoming tired of hearing that he's not fit, thus his seeming lack of ability to look anything like mobile. The World Cup was an age ago now, we can't keep blaming that, and basically if he has been carrying a toe injury then he shouldn't be playing but recovering whilst Eto'o and Naismith hold the fort.

Tomorrow is the type of game where we are going to need our attacking players to do a fair bit of tracking back and defensive duty, failure to do so then we will be exposed, failure for Lukaku to gather the ball and hold on to it and bring others in to the game will not be acceptable.

Howard
Coleman (or Browning if not fit)
Baines
Stones
Jagielka

McCarthy
Barry
Besic

Pienaar or Oviedo (although he will start McGeady)
Lukaku
Naismith

The concept of 'thinking a win' being paramount is nonsense although one pedalled through the ages by coaches who, themselves, have less than confidence in their players to perform.

However much our lads 'want it', the outcome will (as ever) depend on the team's skill-set and physical ability to outdo the Mancs rather than any vague theory on mind games.

I have watched three strikers this week: Demba Ba, Danny Welbeck and Francesco Totti. All have them have been a reliable spearhead for their respective clubs; they have done what you want striker to do, which is keep constantly moving into space, attempting to drag the opposition defence out of position. They have taken balls played into their feet or chest under control and done a simple thing such as lay it off to a team-mate and bring others into play. They have all scored, and the reason they have scored is because they have worked hard to drag themselves into the match, by moving and looking alive, looking alert.

Romelu Lukaku was similar to this when he first joined on loan 12 months ago but he has slowly become less and less involved in games. Even if you’re not getting great service, it’s vital if you’re a striker to force yourself into a match a make your considerable size felt.

This for me is Martinez’s biggest challenge regarding Lukaku. Forget the £28 million we paid, what Martinez needs to do is get Lukaku playing like the powerhouse battering ram that he can be, but he desperately needs to work on many aspects of his game also – his ball control and hold-up play aren’t even up to Anichebe’s standards yet.

Let's just have a go at them.

Good point there. Their confidence is shot; if we get on the front foot early and attack them, hopefully get the first goal, we can get something out of the game.

A point would do me.

I do hope we get a win but I can't see it, not because Man Utd are a great team but rather that Everton seem incapable of putting in a 90-minute performance at the moment. A lot of what we have seen has been error-strewn and players who we previously thought could be relied upon have too often gone missing during any given match. I'll take a draw but really hope we can gain all three points.

My main wish is that Osman does not play unless it's for the final 30 mins.

Regardless of well or poor, Lukaku, or any striker is playing there is one serious thing that gives me the irrits and that's seeing our lone striker playing as a fucking winger. Why does that need to happen when we have wide midfielders??

Lukaku should channel all of his energy and raw aggression in trying cause as much trouble for Manchester United's central defence as possible – not farting around on the flanks while we don't have anyone on the box... well, Naismith the only one if we're lucky.

I hope we have a few changes tomorrow because, when you're tired, the last thing you need is a team with as much attacking quality as Man Utd coming at you. I don't like possession for the sake of it, but it might not be a bad idea tomorrow.

"Lukaku's sheer physical presence." — He doesn't have one. No use being a big lad if you don't use it.

The whole concept defies belief!

Every time I watch Man Utd, the opposition is having a go at them. Home or away. We must do the same thing. Utd's back line is awful. The bonus of Rooney not playing is also a big factor. A draw would do me just fine.

Having said that, Man Utd are going through a transitional stage, under Spongebob Squarehead, and with several players arriving, the correct team selection, a result is achievable.

If Seamus is not available, I think it would be folly to play Hibbert, who will get absolutely raped by Di Maria for pace. The midfield also must start to pass with purpose and at least find a blue shirt, linking the forward players would be welcome too.

Fingers crossed, we may just get something, and give a boost to our stuttering League start, and hopefully kickstart the machine into action.

COYB

Did you not see Lukaku tear Arsenal apart last season and score a wonder goal cutting in from... Hmm, let's see... the right wing? We won 3-0 and Lukaku was man of the match playing out wide... Short memory or what? As long as it not a constant tactic, it can be a weapon.

I still think he had a bit more to offer, hadn't really featured much in the Martinez reign thus far so it will be interesting to see if he was to start playing regularly how he and we as a team would perform.

Pienaar is one of the few midfielders we have that is creative rather than sideways, it's just a great shame the last 12 months have been lost through injury.

Taking a quick glance at the supposed line-ups for the match tomorrow, you see United with this star studded attack of Falcao, Van Persie, Di Maria and Mata and think "how the fuck do we stop that"

Of course United have been susceptible this season but you fear they will score at least twice tomorrow so we are going to need to be ruthless in attack ourselves.

Earlier in the week, I got £100/20 and even now the odds are £96/20.

Get in there.

COYB !

Thursday I thought the last 10mins he showed what he could do, picked the ball up 20 yards out and drove through defenders, but we didn't pay £28m for 10mins work. That game against West Ham he owned the box, and controlled our play. What happened to that player. The number of times Thursday we were in great positions on the wing, and drove the ball in to an empty box, I want to see him in there. Getting his head in, even the Eto'o goal he was nowhere near getting the ball. I am not questioning his ability or record, but his attitude at the moment is poor and he looks lazy.

Team wise

Howard

Oviedo - If Pienaar is unfit, otherwise Baines.
Stones
Jags
Coleman or Browning if not fit

McCarthy - Besic if injured and would ask him to do a job on the Di man
Barry

Pienaar or Baines (I would play Baines higher up, think he would create and could cover as defender. There right side is clearly the most attacking and going to have the most space in behind)
Naismith
McGeady

Lukaku

Nevertheless, the key I believe is to keep it tight for the first 20 minutes or so and hopefully come away with something. It is a big if as the officials tend to favour Man Utd when they play at home.

We hope and wait and see.

Hopefully Pienaar will be back, and I would play Eto'o behind Lukaku linking up the play. We've sorley missed players that can link up play of late... Naismith works hard for the team, is good at finding space around the box and is a good finisher but he lacks creativity. He often slows down our couter attacks and doesn't have the ability to play that killer pass. Naismith should be used as an impact sub for this game.

If Coleman is not fit, I think Browning should start. He will offer much more going forward than Hibbert and is less likely to be done for pace; Browning deserves to be rewarded for his good performance against RS... this excellant crop of youngsters need every opportunity to develop.

If McCarthy doesn't make it, I would go with Barry and Besic in the CM.

We won't get a better chance of beating Man Utd than this as they are in transition, playing badly and have an inexperienced back line.

My team:

Howard
Browning Stones Jagielka Baines
McGeady Besic Barry Pienaar
Eto'o
Lukaku

Great teams win things because they believe. Amply demonstrated by SAF who won the league with a side who with a more negative, less confident mindset managed just 7th place 12 months later.

There is a reason why having gone a goal up we often sit back rather than go for a second; and we've been guilty of this under Martinez as well as Moyes. It's because most of our players lack the confidence, bordering on arrogance, that you need to end up with 80 or 90 points in May.

If we want it more tomorrow, we've every chance of coming away with 3 points, regardless of the gulf in cost of the teams, or what formation we play. If not, they'll probably win. This is especially true given how fragile they're likely to be at the back.

Whether we can put in the physical and mental effort required after such a long midweek trip is a question, but I don't think we need to go there with an inferiority complex about the standard of our team compared to theirs.

Quite frankly, without McCarthy we’re in a bit of a mess. Besic will fill in but I doubt he will get past the 70 minute mark. Gibbo is nowhere near fit enough and can’t tackle and Ossie doesn’t have the legs or physique. Which ever way we bend it our midfield is lightweight and painfully slow. With McGeady, Naismith and Pienaar dropping back to help, the only one missing will be Snow White.

The fact that Di Maria bears a very strong resemblance to the Wicked Witch doesn’t help matters but, if I remember correctly, after looking like the winner she eventually snuffed it..

I would say it is highly unlikely that he would give Browning his first start away at OT but he might come off the bench later depending on how things go.

I don't think Oviedo has clocked up enough minutes to start but maybe he could come on for Baines later?

Mindset and effort go hand-in-hand and both of those are probably going to be chief determiners of who comes away with the points, I think. Not skill and not tactics.

I've watched enough football to realise that differences in ability count for very little if the players fail to put a shift in, or go out without the belief they can get a result.

Howard
Coleman (Browning)
Stones
Jagielka
Baines
McCarthy
Besic
Pienaar
Lukaku
Naismith
McGeady

Browning over Hibbert to give us more options going forward. Lets be positive and try and get the game won because they are terrible defensively! Pienaar would suit being in a 3 in the middle as he can still link up with Bainsey and also provide the forward thinking play to link up with Naismith. He also never gives up so would complement Besic and McCarthy.

Hopefully the injured are passed fit otherwise I just don't see where we will create enough to trouble them. Especially with tired legs after Thursday.

I can't see them working as hard as the Russians, or sitting deep and preventing us from working the ball forward.

I'm sure Rom would be licking his lips if someone could provide him with service. I'm expecting Rom to start on the right with Eto'o up top and Naismith as the 'false 9'.

So far this season, we haven't performed for the full 90 minutes; hopefully tomorrow it will happen. We'd better win because I am at my daughter's for lunch tomorrow and my son-in-law is a bandwagon-jumping Manc fan.

But hell, we are going to shock them!

Sunday is the end of a group of hard away games and, with a small enough squad with loads of injuries, I think results wise we've done pretty well. Defensively we've been awful but I think, when Stones and Jags get a run of games with Coleman and Baines, we will see more consistency.

Interesting how many of you were calling for Atsu to replace McGeady but aren't so sure any more. Barkley and Pienaar will add a lot this month If they stay fit.

Keep the faith, lads and enjoy the goals. I would be happy to finish top 6 and get to the Europa League final. If we win it and RS finish 4th, do they lose out?

Hope we can get a victory tomorrow; it is the right time to be playing Man Utd with all their injuries although we have quite a few ourselves.

I still can’t help feeling Jagielka is the problem, especially playing on the left side of defence. I hope I’m wrong but he can’t play the way Martinez wants him to play.

Things can turn around quickly early season but can't say I'm hopeful that such a turnaround will start tomorrow. There's just been so few good moments in our performances so far.

After tomorrow, we will have played 4 of the top 6 excluding us and we have Barkley, Pienaar, McCarthy and Coleman to come back into the team over the next few weeks. I think tomorrow is a massive game and we need a point to keep us within 2 points of Man Utd who are probably favourites for 4th.

Keep the faith as October and November look very favourable in terms of fixtures and then some people will realise how tough a start we had.

A side that has 2 points more than us having playing Burnley, West Ham, Swansea, Sunderland, QPR and Leicester?

On the flip side, we've played Arsenal, Chelsea and the RS. Admittedly we've not played well, but most of our dropped points have been because of shooting ourselves in the foot with individual defensive mistakes and we've been generally scoring quite freely.

Phil, you'll never hear me criticise a manager of ours for trying to get the team playing football in the right way, playing for the win and disregarding reputation. Martinez has made errors, and I dislike some of the things he does, but all managers have faults.

It's worth remembering the guy has had 1 season in charge, and although it may not all be working out on the pitch, in the first 6 games so far as I can tell he's trying to do the right things, so I'm going to give him my support. You're within your rights to come on here and slag him or the players off at every opportunity if you wish.

For example, the 3-6 result against Chelsea was difficult to take, but our lads gave it a fucking good go and but for some individual madness from Jags in the first few minutes, the game could've finished differently. I'll take the attitude over some weak attempt to hold out for a "respectable" loss any day of the week.

No reality check needed, as most posters recognize exactly this.

Another loss tomorrow would put us under a lot of pressure to pick up all 3 points against Villa, and with our confidence low I wouldn't fancy that scenario. So Roberto tell him to start high tempo and to get at a very young back 4 and claim all 3 points.

We can't start like that against the Mancs because they will destroy us.

I really hope that Osman gets nowhere near the first 11 with Naismith taking his place behind Lukaku. I've got nothing against Osman but it does my head when he gets a full 90 mins when he looks completely knackered after an hour, especially with the 90 mins and air miles after the Krasnodar game.

Same with Hibbo. I'd like him to start tomorrow but making way for Browning around the hour mark. I quite fancy Eto'o to be the big game striker he is and scoring after coming on from the bench. God knows what the final score will be. I can see us scoring and conceding, so maybe we'll get another draw.

Man Utd's defence is there for the taking but not with McGeady, Atsu, Osman etc. It's all about the fitness tests. What worries me is Martinez's statement midweek that the International Break will see our Irish lads fresh ready for the challenges ahead – this means to me that they won't be fit tomorrow.

I will expect to see Coleman at the start of November, Barkley the end of November and Mirallas on fucking Boxing Day.

And maybe Kone when the aliens have finally finished with him....

I respectfully disagree with anyone who believes that's the best way to turn over Man Utd.

Their defense is a shambles. We should go there all guns blazing and attack. I don't care if we win 8-7. Score goals - they're ripe for the picking.

Big game this one. A couple of winnable games after this.

I remember last season when we played well against Spurs and Chelsea but lost Martinez was getting slated yet we produced some terrible performances in March against a few weaker teams but got the results, ie, West Ham and everyone was on here worshipping Roberto.

Before a ball was kicked this season, I felt we would struggle to be in the top half after the Man Utd game due to the fixture list plus the extra burden on resources that Europe brings. If you factor also the rapid decline of Distin this season and Roberto purposely giving the World Cup players extra time off, then things aren't as bad as some are making out. We have looked more solid with the Jags - Stones axis at the back and if we play the same way as we did against Krasnodar and Liverpool against some of these weaker sides coming up, it won't be long until we shoot up the table.

Michael, Just because the masses say something doesn't make it correct; most in England say Gerrard is a world class player yet when faced at the world class stage with the Schweinsigger and Pirlo, he has continually proved out of his depth.

I couldn't care less as to where in the table Manchester United are compared to us, I feel it's only a matter of time before they improve as they have a lot of new players that need to bed in; we don't have that excuse. I hope I am wrong about Martinez but he needs to tone down the positivity a tad and be realistic as the performances thus far have been average at best. Man Utd are there for the taking but we need to keep ball and then hit them more directly which I think will help Lukaku. My team would be:

Howard, Coleman or Browning, Stones, Jagielka, Baines, McGeady, Besic, McCarthy or Barry, Astu, Naismith, Lukaku.

The front four will really need to start to play as a unit and help out the defence at the same time. Fingers crossed for a repeat of last season. COYB.

Pienaar gets a lot of criticism for not scoring goals but at least he reliably keeps hold of the ball in forward areas so we can work it around their box like last season.

With Rom on the right and no speedy winger or full-back, I really don't see us as a counter-attacking team – better that we play keep ball in their half and choose our moment.

It will be very had to keep a clean sheet. Man Utd have tons of world class players up front who will create chances.

Everton's best chance is to keep position, limit chances and move forward with pace when the situation warrants bombing a few players forward.

Eto'o has the skill to be a real plus in this game. Hope he starts or at least comes on early as a sub. I'm most worried about Di Maria. His pace and passing are difficult to contain.

Also, call me old-fashioned, but isnÂ’t a centre forward actually meant to play through the middle?

Team: Howard, Coleman, Stones, Jagielka, Baines, Besic, Barry, McGeady, Naismith, Pienaar, Lukaku.

The problem now, is that 2 of the 4 are unavailable.
Against the shite, Rom was effective out wide, but he needed....Lukaku to cross it to.

With the squad that’s available, he needs to be in the centre.

If they can start brightly and put Man Utd out of their stride, then anything is possible but the current injuries are really screwing things up, forcing too many adjustments.

Psychologically it is very important, even so early in the season.
We lose, and we will be under huge pressure in the coming games, which we would normally expect to win.
A win or even a draw, and we can look forward to building on a decent period, with optimism.

I hope that Coleman is fit, as he is so key to our penetration.
Although we are facing some great offensive players, we must seek to put their rookie defence to the sword.

Remember lads, Leicester put 5 past them.
COYBs.

● We're scoring a lot of goals even when losing or drawing (bar Swansea in the League Cup).
● We conceded a lot of soft goals until Stones came in to his best position.
● Barry is walking a tightrope most games where he does lots of good things but his lack of pace means he's likely to give away penalties or get sent off.
● Lukaku hasn't hit form yet but Eto'o will score goals even if off form.
● We are missing some top quality players like Coleman, Barkley, Pienaar and Mirallas yet people are still expecting us to beat Arsenal, Liverpool and now Man Utd away.

I'll be happy with a draw but expect the Russia trip to take its toll. In my eyes, Palace was the only big blip in a very very tough month of games.

We are playing Man Utd (Away) – who, unlike last year, see us now as a rival for Champions League places. We are missing most of our best creative, attacking players. We are just back from an exhausting trip in Russia... yet here we are with total unrealistic expectations in my opinion.

Yes, they have a dodgy back 3 or 4 but they've spent big on midfield and strikers. I'd be happy with 4 all. ;-)

A big test for young Stones. The lad has been a revelation but he's short on experience and the wily Falcoa will give him plenty to think about. Let's hope he does okay. Not that he'll be alone. We'll have him well covered.

With Pienaar back I would expect Lukaku to operate through the middle with McGeady on the right. Indeed, the quick little Irishman may play a role which puts him close to the pacey Di Maria.

In the end it might come down to who wants it most. Who can sustain the closing down, win the 50/50 balls and keep on rolling. Let's hope it's us.

I'll give ye a clue. No 1 we love to hate him.

If we play like we have done for the last 3 games or so we will lose. Comfortably.

Conor, I'm all for a little blue-tint when I speak about my blues, but with respect!

We were not 'the better team' against Chelsea; at times if felt like Chelsea were toying with us and we put together another sequence of 20 or 30 passes.

'Magnificent' against Wolsburg? 'Magnificent? Happy to have it don't get me wrong, but that 4-1 scoreline was a tad flattering. We got battered in the 2nd half.

And sure we ground out results at their place and in Russia but if we play like that every week we will end up in the lower half of the Premier League.

We need to improve on all aspects of our game and pray for people to come back on time and the God of injuries to be kind to us. And, we need to get Bobby back: you know that fella who made great subs, great selections, great choices.

a

To steal an English phrase: Bollocks!

All I know is I have to wake up at 7 am to see the damn game. I don't like these noon kick-offs!

Sadly the spirit of the game has moved on & definitely have no affection for any of today's $$ clubs. Anyway, Busby's Babes got me thinking. Perhaps nothing less than a league/cup double + Europa Cup will do this season, but can we afford to be patient ? Blooding our youth now, (alongside some senior citizens), may well be in our better interests longer term.

Maybe forced upon us, but history favours the Bold. I'm sure our Bobby is no mug either !

COYB, make us proud today.

Westy was reputed to have asked him how they said 'Fuck me' at Eton !

But they are shoddy at the back so if we start well and get a foot hold in the game, create some early chances and take one early on, the crowd will get restless and United will get nervous and who knows, but we have to start this game better than we have our recent games!

I'm hoping Coleman is fit but there's no point risking him, and tbh, Hibbo as played well since coming back into the fold. Plus there's always Browning to come on if he's blowing after an hour, 70 odd mins.

I'm definitely hoping McCarthy is fit cos he's vital to us. He's energetic, gets about the pitch and is a big help to Barry. But I've got a feeling we'll go with a 3 man midfield again like at Anfield.

But if Pienaar, Coleman & McCarthy are fit, I'd like to see us go with :-

Howard

Coleman
Stones
Jags
Baines

McCarthy
Barry

McGeady
Naismith
Pienaar

Lukaku.

If we lose and QPR win Everton will drop into the bottom 3, not a happy prospect at all before the break.

Even a draw won't be much use

Tony Hibbert. Hero!