The poverty of Everton's display at Bournemouth on Saturday and the need to put on a better show in the televised match against Crystal Palace was not lost on two of the Blues' players who have spoken up over the past couple of days.
Captain Phil Jagielka admitted after the 1-0 defeat at the Vitality Stadium that as a team performance it fell well below expectations and that Everton will need to consistently be at a much higher level if they are to finish in the upper echelons of the Premier League this season.
Ronald Koeman's side sit in fifth place after six matches despite the weekend's set-back and both Jagielka and the season's revelation so far, Idrissa Gueye, are eyeing Friday's game against the Eagles as an opportunity to get back to winning ways.
“Far too many of us were below par against Bournemouth,” Jagielka said. “We need to look at ourselves in the mirror if we are to challenge up at the top of the league. We need to make sure we go to places like Bournemouth and put a better display on.
“We will look at the video and iron out a few things that we did wrong and then move on to Palace. That's a massive game at home before the international break so it is important we get back to winning ways.”
Gueye, who was afflicted by the same torpor that pervaded the whole Everton team in the first half against the Cherries before he improved in the second, expressed similar sentiments, telling the Liverpool Echo:
“We didn't start well. They pressed us and scored early. After that they showed us how to play like a team. If you don't start well then it's difficult to get playing like you want to play.
“[Bournemouth] showed more energy and played well. If we had played to our capability we could have won but they caused us a lot of problems.
"We must hope we win the next game. Friday is at home and we have our supporters with us. Now we rest and then work hard. The confidence is still there. It was a bad day but we keep going. We never give up."
Reader Comments (143)
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1 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:05:58
Good. We all have bad weeks. Don't forget about it, but don't dwell on it. Work harder, win on Friday, and move on.
2 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:22:09
3 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:42:13
4 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:42:45
5 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:48:05
Saturday's result was a big wake-up call. We just need to learn from it, not dwell on it, and move on. I'm sure we'll see a different Everton on Friday.
6 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:49:41
Didn't see the game or highlights but I haven't seen much said elsewhere of Barry's injury and the fact he went off early 2nd half. Assume if he had been fit and stayed on, the second half could have had a brighter ending. That in itself is worrying as if he is the glue that sticks us together, then we might have an interesting season ahead.
Onwards to Palace on Friday and upwards to 2nd place.
7 Posted 26/09/2016 at 07:58:43
Time to put that right on Friday, just as Liverpool did after their similar outing at Burnley.
If they want to be at the top come May, then these must be the exception and not the norm.
8 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:16:52
Like many other have mentioned, it wasn't the defeat against Bournemouth that was the issue, it was the manner in which it came. That performance was atrocious and it's evident now that big Ron needs a complete clear-out in January and the end of the season.
We've made a decent start but too many players at Everton are not good enough. I've defended Barkley for seasons hoping he would come good but I hate to admit that he is shite and he's not up to the task. Some of the players we have won't be able to deliver the Moshiri ambitions so changes will come.
9 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:23:59
10 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:27:35
1) crap attitude... followed by 2) crap performance, followed by 3) senior player banality about how we are going to get it right next week, one game away from it clicking, blah blah... followed by repeated cycle ad nauseam.
11 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:32:43
With the blue cloud of doom descending the players will need to man up and fight for every ball from the first whistle to the last.
Koman will have realized after that game that most of his team are shit houses. How he motivates them this week is his biggest test as manager of Everton FC. Good luck, Ron I hope the crowd do their bit to help and not hinder this team...
12 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:37:15
Perhaps you can say things even themselves out. That little luck ran out in the last two matches.
13 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:38:32
We've had a very easy run of games, and I wasn't totally convinced with some of our victories in that run. The team has no cohesion or spine. Some of the top players put in a performance when they want to and if this attitude persists with the rest of the squad, we'll be beaten again by lesser teams than Bournemouth.
14 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:41:38
15 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:50:14
A win on Friday (which I expect to see) will put us back up near the top, we can't complain too much about that.
My main concern is about Ross Barkley, he just hasn't lived up to the expectations everyone had for him. I know he's still relatively young, and can still improve over time. But is it just me, or does anyone else feel that this could be a sign that he's been over-hyped, and this is as good as he will get?
I really hope not, because he shows moments of class, but lacks the consistency we see of other players his age in the league.
16 Posted 26/09/2016 at 08:50:22
Get your attitude right before the game, not afterwards. If the players go out and perform for 90 minutes, then that is acceptable; if you've done your best but got beat, then most fans will accept that. On Saturday, too many players were off form and did little in the way of effort and fight to try and get back in the game.
I think it would be much better if the players said nothing but concentrated on getting it right in the next game.
17 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:12:14
I will wait and watch on Friday, and I am far from confident against a Palace side that came back from a two-goal deficit to beat Sunderland.
18 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:32:43
19 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:32:44
I would like to see Deulofeu in the middle playing as a striker/No 10 playmaker as it's unlikely that he would be double-teamed as was the case with Bournemouth they gave him no space to play in. Bolasie had the same problem sometimes, he was crowded by 3 players and they stopped the crosses even when Coleman was up in support.
Our play was pretty predictable. Koeman should have been looking at a more direct style of play throwing Williams forward... just a pity Funes Mori wasn't playing as he normally gets on the end of a few crosses.
As much as I like Jags as a footballer, albeit a bit limited in the air, he is not captain material in the same way Phil Neville was. I don't have a candidate for the skipper unless it's Williams?
20 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:36:47
I hope that's not the scenario but looking at our last two performances it's very likely. Nothing's going to happen overnight. It's going to be a long job for Koeman.
21 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:45:45
22 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:50:52
23 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:51:56
I managed to get over and get a ticket in the pub and I wish I hadn't cos that display was so poor it was unbelievable, even for us.
It is very sad to see first hand what Barkley has become at the moment, very sad and very painful to watch. He needs putting out of his misery cos he is just not worth a place in the team at the moment. Simple as.
Mirallas is not worth his place in the team. There have got to be young prospects who, whilst not world beaters at the moment, will contribute more to the team all round both in attacking play and defensive play. Whilst they might not be the overall answer, it has got to be an improvement in what, let's be honest, has been coming for a few games now.
24 Posted 26/09/2016 at 09:54:46
25 Posted 26/09/2016 at 10:13:02
No Premier League team are pushovers. And Bournemouth beat us in every department. That was the worrying thing. I can see us getting beat in many more games. The quality just ain't there.
But we should expect that, really. Especially as Koeman's expressed and said openly that basically we'll only do well if the teams above play as bad as last season.
If we get a draw against Palace I'll be happy. But it's how we get it that really matters. Blood and guts mean more to me. Pride in the shirt. Less words and more action. You get paid for a shift, so put one in.
26 Posted 26/09/2016 at 10:20:43
27 Posted 26/09/2016 at 10:27:19
28 Posted 26/09/2016 at 10:43:37
Valencia looks no better than Niasse from what I've seen of either of them. I work with a few Hammers fans down in Essex and to a man they think he's a bag of horseshit and can't believe we took him.
Hopefully they'll be proved wrong but I have my doubts.
29 Posted 26/09/2016 at 11:27:52
Totally disregarded because of years of this utter intent with no obvious improvement before our unfortunate Brown Shoes arrival!!!
30 Posted 26/09/2016 at 11:31:22
The Norwich game exposed the lack of quality in depth in the squad. Massive clear-out required. Early season optimism now well and truly evaporated.
31 Posted 26/09/2016 at 11:36:00
The players need to put a shift in on Friday and improve their performances but Koeman needs to step up to the plate and make some big decisions teamwise as, for me, one or two of them haven't been doing enough not influencing the game to help us win or working hard enough for the team off the ball and it's time one or two others got a chance instead, imo.
32 Posted 26/09/2016 at 11:44:04
33 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:05:24
We are one point behind Spurs in joint 3rd place who have played virtually the same teams we have bar the RS. It's a little early yet to hit the panic button. Trust our new manager.
34 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:29:02
What Saturday demonstrated yet again was that, in this league, the players have to be up for a fight from the first minute. The fact we might have been 1-0 down in the first minute on Saturday should have served as a warning but unfortunately our players just drifted through the opening half as though they thought eventually things would come right. We could have had no complaints if Bournemouth had scored three or four by half-time.
Apart from the Spurs match on the opening day, we have started every game very slowly. Repeat that on Friday and we will likely lose to a confident Palace team. Our team need to grab the game by the scruff of the neck from the first whistle and make things happen.
As for our new manager, he needs to get his selection and formation right from the outset. Having to alter the personnel and shape of the side halfway through a game is a good skill but not something to be relied upon every time we play.
35 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:34:10
Palace are on a good run, and we've a poor record against them recently, so what makes you think we'll beat them 'convincingly'?
36 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:52:38
Put on a real show for the fans or shut the fuck up and keep failing whilst picking up your big money for nothing!
37 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:56:04
No wonder Koeman was desperate to sign Sissoko (formerly of Newcastle, now at Spurs) before that last transfer window closed. The other problems Everton have is having only two really wide players in Bolasie and Lennon. Barkley, Mirallas, Deulofeu, Cleverley and Valencia are all No 10s of varying quality.
38 Posted 26/09/2016 at 12:58:31
It seems to be a consistency issue. Up to the Norwich game, the defence and midfield had been fairly consistent. Then it went to pot.
Hopefully we can get back on track, now with pressing from the start rather from mid-way through the game. That seems to be why Koeman has been getting them fitter, for this pressing game to be consistent. Similar to what Klopp has been doing at Liverpool.
39 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:06:23
When we don't strengthen again in the next window, Koeman will be looking for a way out.
40 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:10:09
Personally, I think they may have thought they'd made a good start to the season and accordingly, could afford to take the foot off the pedal a little.
41 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:14:33
This squad has ability and lots of it; it's the Manager's job job to sort it out, and he will do as it's early days yet and every player will be under the microscope, no matter who they are.
If they are not up to it professionally or ability wise, then Ronald will ship them out.
42 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:18:07
I also think by the end of this season he will have made his mind up if Barkley has a long term future under him. I also think that applies to many in this squad. I know Martinez was useless but finishing in the bottom half for the past 2 seasons shows that we lack the quality to even try and challenge for a top 4 place at the moment. Koeman is a shrewd coach and he knows that, despite a good start, we are nowhere near the level or the consistency that he will want.
But as fans we need to get behind the manager and the team. Yes, when the games finished, we can all have our moans but, while the game is going on, make sure we back them more than we are at present. At home games despite the good start Goodison is so very quiet, we need to change that and quickly. When Goodison comes alive, there is no finer place to play but I have only seen that atmosphere once against Middlesboro but that only happened after Mason allowed a goal that was clearly a foul. Then the crowd really got involved and what a difference.
43 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:32:54
Where I sit, if anybody as much as shows agitation with a poor pass or cross, or more positvely attempts to 'get behind the team' in a vocal or animated manner, it is met with disapproving looks and 'tut tuts' by many who sit around and about. I'm not talking about the Directors Box or one of the posh lounges either. The game has changed for clubs and supporters and it's now a lot more passive on and off the field. I don't particularly like it but that's how it is.
44 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:45:13
Bolasie will have a point to prove; let's hope that bodes well for us and not against us. Lukaku will come good as the world will be watching. His agent will insist on it... haha.
45 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:46:09
46 Posted 26/09/2016 at 13:47:13
Having players in the team with the attitude such as Barkley and Deulofeu does meet those standards; they are a liability when we are up against it. Anyone can have a poor game but you have to put the effort in.
47 Posted 26/09/2016 at 14:03:52
48 Posted 26/09/2016 at 14:36:25
Not to worry, though... Koeman will have them back in the groove against Palace if he is any kind of a manager. The question is: Does he stick or twist? How many games do you give some of these guys before dropping them and giving one or two eager youngsters a shot?
Mirallas and Barkley are currently top of my list for the chop as neither are cutting the mustard but that's not to say some of the others haven't been great this season.
49 Posted 26/09/2016 at 14:45:25
No, Jags, hope has nothing to do with it. Everton, with this squad, should be beating the likes of Palace.
Put in the required effort and we will win on Friday. Do your talking on the pitch for once.
50 Posted 26/09/2016 at 14:45:35
It has been noticeable that some teams in the Premier League have adopted a practice of 'swarming' the opposition, especially those across the park, by not allowing them to settle on the ball or directing passes which is what Bournemouth did to us.
Like many, I don't believe Palace will guarantee us three points on Friday if we continue on the same 'Martinez mode' as we did last game we have to battle for 90+ minutes and actually EARN the big bucks the club is paying out.
51 Posted 26/09/2016 at 14:52:10
Meanwhile, what does the manager do when the players sometime perform well in training but screw up on the day? What does he do when they play well on the day but screw up regularly either in training or other day to day issues issues? What does he do with world class talent (step forward Ross and Geri) who only show up one game in three?
There is the problem. Everton are short of the key jigsaw piece. The replacement for Michael Arteta. The creative hub of the team.
We only have 2 players who can currently play this role (step forward again Ross and Geri). However, neither of them are played as a "No 10" in the true sense of the modern game requirement. To be honest, I can't think of any available who are. De Bruyne, Hazard, the Brazilian Redshite (can't bring myself to mention his name), are rarities. We might chase that off-the-radar young Scottish chap Ryan Gauld who pissed off to Portugal, never to be heard of again until... ?
I've said it before and I will continue to say it until I am 'blue' in the face; Ross is not a creative inside forward; he is a mesmerising talent who just wants to play as if he is still in the school yard. Martinez let him, but that was sheer irresponsibility. Geri however could be a true No 10, if only he could apply himself. The other alternatives on hand are Dowell, but it may be too soon, or the young lad Evans which is even too sooner!
The challenge is to keep our shit together until January and seriously scour the international market and bring in someone who can perform the No 10 role. Here I should list a lot of names, but I can't honestly think of anyone. Is there anybody out there? Are there any older generation examples similar to Cambiasso, or Pirlo, et al. who may be looking for a swansong season?
Over to you, Mr Walsh. Can you find another Payet? Meanwhile, I would take Geri to one side and tell him, train him, enforce him, reward him or whatever it takes, together with our young prospects Evans, and Dowell, including selected game time, to really focus on that key position and then see what develops.
53 Posted 26/09/2016 at 15:08:03
So clearly the players arent good enough. But Koeman should be fronting up as hes had to change things twice at halftime, bold yes but selection is his responsibility.
Saturday's performance was so far below what was is expected, that the scepticism is right to be explored. Is Koeman just waiting for the next window? Some talented players looking at the scrap heap, for one I welcome it.
Home win on Friday as you can't get any worse than Saturday
54 Posted 26/09/2016 at 15:13:31
4-4-2; Holgate for Seamus, Geri 'n Yannick as wingers, Valencia off Rom, which is his strongest position. Cross, cross, cross.
55 Posted 26/09/2016 at 15:15:24
One, we have not got the right players (forwards) to play a pressing game. The likes of Lukaku, Deulofeu, Mirallas, Barkley and possibly Bolasie can't defend from the front. To play that pressing game, forwards have to close down the opposition quickly. Ours don't; in some cases, they just saunter around after losing possession.
And Two: we have never replaced Arteta. Sad to say, Barkley is not the answer. Throughout our last manager's reign, we were short an experienced attacking midfielder, a proper back-up striker and a top-class goalkeeper. And three years on it is still the same.
As some have said above, Koeman really has his work cut out. It's going to take a few transfer windows to get things sorted,
56 Posted 26/09/2016 at 15:23:04
Evans is a striker, he has got good control and is a bit on the lines of Joe Royle. I hope he finishes up as good as Joe.
We are looking for young players with ability and fighting spirit: you've seen one with Tom Davies, Joe Williams is another but is just getting fit after a bad injury.
The one player I would put on the bench, and have no hesitation of using, is Liam Walsh: he'd put four or five of the team who played (or went on the pitch) on Saturday to shame. He'd fight 'til he dropped, like most of us would if we got the chance to play for the Blues.
57 Posted 26/09/2016 at 15:39:31
"I know Martinez was useless but finishing in the bottom half for the past 2 seasons shows that we lack the quality to even try and challenge for a top 4 place at the moment."
At one point I would not have batted an eyelid at that statement, I would have been in full agreement. But as we all now know, Leicester City (in a time when it was believed to be impossible) went from the Championship, to a 14th place finish in the Premier League (after a late surge), to Champions. They didn't have the quality to win the league, and this season probably shows that but my god did they have a serious work-rate and balls about them. They barely used a sub and relied on a handful of decent players.
We simply don't have the balls for it. There is enough quality in my opinion in our first 13 players to do what Leicester did or something half close. Last season basically means I don't accept excuses for failure anymore.
59 Posted 26/09/2016 at 16:15:36
Instead of Everton having a more dynamic formation of 4-3-3 with the back 4 coming up to the half-way line, giving the team a more solid and compact look about them, with less gaps for the opposition to exploit, as Bournemouth did last Saturday.
60 Posted 26/09/2016 at 16:29:38
Koeman must be regretting missing the opportunity for bringning in more quality in defense and midfield while the transfer window was open, because Everton are playing far too deep at the back, which is a big worry, even against the Premier League's lesser teams.
61 Posted 26/09/2016 at 16:39:21
I also think it is unfair to pick out Ross Barkley for criticism as the whole team were off-colour particularly Williams, Barry and Gueye who have been our mainstays this season.
62 Posted 26/09/2016 at 16:45:31
"making the tight confines of Vitality Stadium — its five metres longer than the pitch at Goodison Park and just as wide) feel much smaller than it actually is.
63 Posted 26/09/2016 at 16:56:08
To those who point to the lack of depth in the squad Saturday had nothing to do with that. It had everything to do with eleven plus Premier League players not putting the very basics into play, ie, putting a shift in, pressing and passing the ball to a player in a blue shirt preferably after a maximum of one touch.
Hardly rocket science for the trained and talented professionals that they allegedly are. They were more or less all guilty of a poor attitude and even poorer application on Saturday .
Are we saying we need a full second eleven players as good as our first choice, so we can simply replace them when the ones on the pitch fail to understand the meaning of start the game strongly and work hard? FFS we are not talking complex tactics here!
Get a fucking grip of them this week, RK and a nod towards those of us who made the journey wouldn't have gone amiss either.
Rant over for now.
64 Posted 26/09/2016 at 17:25:17
Oh for performance-related contracts, you would soon see a difference if a player could be docked half his pay for not putting in 100%.
Seems to me over the last two defeats that the 'Martinez' excuse still exists. Players not trying or seemingly not fit enough to play for 90 minutes. This side should be having no problems against the likes of Bournemouth or Norwich reserves.
Is it attitude? Are there players in this squad who simply don't care if we win or not? Lukaku, Deulofeu, Barkley, Mirallas all look like they are not bothered; it should be in your DNA as an athlete to be a winner and want to win, whoever you are playing. Whether it's Wembley or Accrington, you should give 100% always.
65 Posted 26/09/2016 at 17:33:09
66 Posted 26/09/2016 at 17:34:13
I would play some kids, who I'm sure would be willing to run all day for the cause.
67 Posted 26/09/2016 at 17:43:20
I sometimes wonder, whether our players only pay lip-service to 'giving it their all' and "we'll do everything possible to finish as high as possible"... Loads of hot-air from the players and little to shout about for the fans.
It's not a recent phenomenon either, it goes back at least a decade. Everton FC is far too comfortable a place for our players: little in the way of expectation. No real competition for any of our 'star' players and they know full well that, as long as they win now and again, they will be safe in their comfortable footballing lives.
If Ronald can't or won't change that attitude, then I'm at a loss to see who will.
68 Posted 26/09/2016 at 17:56:51
I really hate to say it but the difference in us and the Red Shite is frightening. All their front players and midfielders are constantly on the move which means the ball can be zipped around at speed and is very hard to contain and defend against. I'm actually relieved that the derby is later than usual this season because if we were to play them at the moment, I fucking dread to think what would happen...
69 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:03:44
I don't agree with the analysis that our players are crap. We've seen them play fantastic football this season (although we've yet to see it for more than 45 minutes in any given game).
Saturday's capitulation was mostly about the playing staff not meeting expectations (Koeman made some mistakes too)... But without any credible alternatives in key positions, there is no big stick to beat them with...they still get picked and they still pick up their new Bentley.
Koeman has a hard season ahead of him.
70 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:06:16
I really wish I hadn't spent all of that money on a season ticket (again) when it is so bloody obvious that we are all wasting our time who needs to spend shed loads on advertising when Evertonians continue to promote and propagate the legendary RS for free.
71 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:14:48
Players today trot out at home games to regular sell-outs regardless of the football being offered. Perhaps they would feel differently if their poor show was rewarded with 20,000 fans to see them. Maybe they would pull their socks up a bit?
The demographic of fans has changed, especially in the premier league. It is only our away support that regularly gets behind the side.
The lack of standing and increased ticket prices, allayed to the propensity of season tickets has resulted in less young people at the game.
Today the atmosphere at Goodison is regularly ridiculed by the travelling fans, and rightly so.
72 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:18:27
73 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:22:14
I expect him to have an absolute blinder and get us back on track. I'd also give the captaincy to Williams as I think we need someone who'll throw a few fucks into the players.
74 Posted 26/09/2016 at 19:19:24
Let's do the talking on the pitch. I'm confident we have the ability to beat Palace, hopefully we go back to 3 CBs and bring Holgate back in. Could do with a bit of youthful arrogance in the side.
75 Posted 26/09/2016 at 19:26:45
76 Posted 26/09/2016 at 19:28:18
It seems a lot of our fans would rather crow about our loveable neighbours than praise our own side. Yes, it's been a poor week, we all know that, but to hear some on here, you'd think the title had the ribbons on waiting to be presented to them across the park.
It's a long season... a very long one so let's see what transpires. Every side will hit a lull, even Man City. It's how you respond that matters. Anyway, the last time I looked, the magnificent reds were on the same points as us and only above us on goals scored. So it's not all doom and gloom.
78 Posted 26/09/2016 at 19:55:13
We are beginning to pay for the much-vaunted transfer window. We knew Valencia wasn't up to it and he seems in a hurry to confirm that. We knew Bolasie would blow hot and cold and he's blowing hot and cold. We knew Lukaku offered nothing when he doesn't score and nothing is what we got apart from squandering another golden opportunity.
Why do we insist on giving managers a free passage? Bournemouth are probably the smallest club ever to be in the Premier League, they don't have a player who would get in our team yet they bossed us all over the park. People whinge about resources but look at theirs?
Eddie Howe would swap Koeman's squad for his own in a heartbeat, so can we have less of this poor old Ronald? He was out-thought, out-witted.
Not good enough.
80 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:35:51
Remember the style and mentality of the previous three years will take time to change. Koeman is giving time and chances to players to prove themselves. Koeman expects hard work. A lot players are playing for a future at Everton.
81 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:41:01
82 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:46:59
In the real world, new bosses with the pedigree of our two demand a drastically improved attitude from all employees, immediately. Professionals try to deliver it, immediately. Losers don't give a shit.
Over to you lads.
86 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:49:00
87 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:52:49
88 Posted 26/09/2016 at 21:52:55
89 Posted 26/09/2016 at 22:00:53
Ripping a team apart any team by at least 4 goals with little reply, as some have done already... now that would be fantastic in my book.
Hopefully we will but we've work to do!
90 Posted 26/09/2016 at 22:32:11
When Rodgers was sacked and Klopp took over, he started as Koeman has, getting the players to a higher level of fitness. At one point, he said they need to get used to it, because they're young professional footballers. He's had nearly a year, so obviously they're doing the 'pressing' game better.
Koeman is doing similar with us, and it's been working, but sporadically. He's trying to get them to do the pressing game over a whole match. The players have the ability. The transfer window wasn't great, but nevertheless our squad is not the big issue that some are saying it is. We do have the quality (in my opinion), we've seen it in action (until last week), and we just need to see it working as a matter of routine. A new routine that these players will get used to.
91 Posted 26/09/2016 at 22:51:58
92 Posted 26/09/2016 at 23:27:58
How refreshing it is to know we have fans prepared to stick their necks out THAT far.
Given the respective squads and resources, if Koeman does not finish at least 20 points clear of Bournemouth, we have the wrong manager. He has already been embarrassed by Howe in their head to head. Koeman gets paid around 4 times what Howe gets,
Even Martinez went close in his first season with this group of players, what was it, record points? Given that so many believe we we have strengthened, Koeman should be aiming to at least equal that...
"My moneys on Koeman's team to finish above Howe's" ?
93 Posted 26/09/2016 at 00:00:01
The goal this season is to get in the top 4; it will be a fantastic achievement if we do that. Koeman said it will take 4 windows to get the right team on the field; after this week, you can see why.
Everton have to many soft players on the books and that will change. The really fantastic news is that the defense is much improved that ,even on a bad day, we are not conceding much.
94 Posted 27/09/2016 at 00:11:36
95 Posted 26/09/2016 at 00:13:25
At half-time in the Sunderland game, after a dire 1st half, he read the situation right and made a change remarking 'I had to do something to change the game.' Something similar is now required, if he makes the right call I think we can win.
Failure to make changes could mean another defeat. Koeman has made a good start, but now he needs to show he's got some of the answers. Barkley needs a rest, that's obvious, but he's idolised in some quarters. Let's see if Koeman has got the balls to drop him on Friday.
96 Posted 27/09/2016 at 01:14:32
No, they weren't dominant displays and no, they didn't come against the quote-unquote "league elite" but they were still hard-fought wins that we 100% earned, largely through discipline, grit and mental toughness qualities that were sorely lacking during the Martinez era.
I know people are afraid this past week signals a regression to last season's dire form, but I, for one, am heartened at the clear positives we've already seen under Koeman.
97 Posted 27/09/2016 at 01:33:23
The first loss proved the squad depth is weak; the second loss proved that we lack creativity.
It may sound a little harsh, but if you look at most of the top 6 sides you will see a lot more players worth in excess of £20m than you will at our club. That's the truth of the matter.
We have a decent enough side, but if it's not going well, the subs are hit and miss. Deulofeu is about the best we have to offer and he can range from world class to awful, while players like Cleverly and Lennon are mid table Premier League players at best.
Koeman is a good manager, but he can only work with the tools at his disposal.
Hopefully Baines will be back and Ross will find his form; if that happens we will more than likely win more than we lose.
98 Posted 27/09/2016 at 07:11:04
We played okay after a slow start against Boro and got completely outfought, outworked and outplayed against Bournemouth!
Let's put thing's into perspective: we have both been playing well, we have been getting results!
The defence has looked solid, Gueye has made a good start, but all the forward players have been pretty hit and miss!
For me, a lot of our attacking shortcomings come down to our shape and Barkley playing Number 10. He is not intelligent enough to play in that role; he slows most attacks down with his pass selection or 'dallying' on the ball.
Koeman needs to realise his squad's strengths and weaknesses quick and change the shape to suit the opposition and their tactics.
Palace will be a real test up against Puncheon, Townsend and Benteke amongst others. I'd like to see Koeman be creative with the shape and get Kone or Mirallas up next to Lukaku somehow as I expect them to sit deep and counter.
99 Posted 27/09/2016 at 07:17:40
100 Posted 27/09/2016 at 08:53:01
I lost respect for him when as Blackburn manager he deliberately singled out Tim Cahill before a game by insisting that the referee keep a close eye on him, because he was clever at getting away with fouls.
Deserves all he gets.
101 Posted 27/09/2016 at 09:10:55
They were bloody useless as well.
102 Posted 27/09/2016 at 09:37:05
103 Posted 27/09/2016 at 09:39:45
I have to agree with you. This game being judged pre-Norwich and Bournemouth, would have put us down as favourites. Seeing us being seriously exposed and exploited in our last two matches puts a different slant on the game.
I feel it will be a lot more nervy and will be more of a cup game for us. In fact, given the inconsistency and ineptitude of some players (who imo have been shown far too much patience), we are in for a whole season of cup games!
104 Posted 27/09/2016 at 09:50:46
Barkley cannot provide it on his own, and though Barry and Gueye can pass, we simply don't have anyone who can run the show. Oh for a Mata, a Cazorla, or Coutinho. We haven't dominated a game for 90 minutes, even the win at Sunderland was a second-half performance.
There is much to do, but the reality is that, much as we wanted to load the blame onto Martinez, many of the players that let him down are continuing their form under Koeman. The inconsistency is still there, the only difference is the defence , which Williams has helped to tighten.
Players like Mirallas, Deulofeu, and Barkley have shown that it was not the boss that was holding them back. Bolasie seems cut from the same cloth, but we suspected as much. A general lack of quality is what we are left with.
I watched Arsenal take Chelsea apart with a standard of football that was light-years ahead of anything we have played so far this season. Intelligence, movement and precision passing.
This manager needs to jettison 6 players and bring in better ones. A striker, two passing midfielders, another centre-half and another winger. We need to say goodbye to Mirallas, Lennon, Cleverley, Kone, Oviedo, McCarthy and obviously Niasse. Let's see more of Davies, and why not put Ledson and Walsh on the bench?
January will determine whether we challenge for the Europa League places or mid-table.
105 Posted 27/09/2016 at 10:15:59
106 Posted 27/09/2016 at 11:27:38
People are being incredibly impatient with Koeman. I can't believe the amount of so called knowledgeable football fans up in arms over a couple of losses. Did people really think Koeman had a magic formula that was going to make us instant title challengers?
We're in the mix and that is way beyond what we were last season. It will take a couple more transfer windows for Koeman to have his own team, and if he keeps us in the top 7 in the meantime, he'll be doing a great job.
107 Posted 27/09/2016 at 11:54:53
By the way, Eddie, Ledson has left the club... sadly no longer rated by those in charge.
108 Posted 27/09/2016 at 12:26:02
Lucky against Tottenham? We ran out of gas in the second half, then dug in and saw out the result. Stekelenburg had a couple big saves. Nothing lucky about it. Just a hard-fought, well-earned draw.
Barely scraped by against West Brom? We started poorly, but everything changed when Lukaku came on. We dominated the second half and easily could have won 3-1 or 4-1.
We were perhaps fortuitous against Stoke, both in terms of the penalty awarded and the manner in which it was converted, but we locked that game down defensively and barely allowed them to sniff the goal, after conceding four FOUR the last time they came to Goodison. That's progress, in my book.
Sunderland and Middlesbrough were uneven showings in which the outcome was never seriously in doubt.
It's inevitably going to be an up-and-down season and there are obvious issues the team needs to work on, such as slow starts and incomplete performances, but that doesn't mean we have to deny the existence of positive progress any time there's a setback.
109 Posted 27/09/2016 at 13:05:13
They consistently have failed to do this over a number of years. I can only conclude therefore that they don't want us to succeed and I don't see that altering any time soon.
As soon as the manager works this out, he will leave.
110 Posted 27/09/2016 at 13:21:55
111 Posted 27/09/2016 at 13:24:24
Chris, I think Koeman is doing a decent job, and he will be more aware than any of us, of the shortcomings of our players. We are in the mix, but have only played Spurs out of the better teams, so we might be in a different position come January.
112 Posted 27/09/2016 at 13:39:14
It's an opinion with no facts, just a gut feeling. If the board don't back Koeman then he will do the best with the resources he has. After all, that's what he did at Southampton except our fans want and expect more.
113 Posted 27/09/2016 at 14:16:21
Not until they ALL realise that it's a team effort will they fulfill their potential.
114 Posted 27/09/2016 at 15:38:45
115 Posted 27/09/2016 at 17:39:42
116 Posted 27/09/2016 at 17:52:11
I think they believe they have and are being successful, and like most businessmen/investors they'll tend to go for the cheap option rather than the best option. Ergo paying huge amounts in compensation to replace one manager with another.
We'll wait and see if Mr Moshiri has real ambitions for the club long-term, we should know by this time next year. What's that... we've heard it all before?
117 Posted 27/09/2016 at 17:56:59
There are kids out there looking up to this lot as demi-gods. They are looking up to them like I used to look up to the likes of Labone, Ball, Kendall and Harvey. Those players used to leave the pitch like they had run a marathon. They played like their livelihoods depended on it because it did. It was their job.
I'm waiting to see that kind of passion and I suspect I will be waiting longer still but, for god's sake Jags, fucking stir 'em up or hand the armband to someone who will.
118 Posted 26/09/2016 at 18:28:18
The players after the game come out and say to the press that the performance was not good enough. Was this not discussed at half-time, and so the players came out 2nd half to make amends.
The 2nd half was not as bad. But not because we got any better. More because Bournemouth couldn't continue at the pace of the 1st half. They settled for holding on to what they had. At no point did I believe we had them rattled, and could get a goal back.
It reminded me of the England v Iceland 2nd half. We had enough of the ball, but no ideas. Extra touches before crossing that allowed defenders to get blocks in. Poor control & passing. So no build-up of momentum.
There have been spells of this in all the other matches. In some cases, 45 minutes worth. But we have been happy that the end result worked out for us.
Hope the players' comments act as the stimulus for a better performance on Friday. But, as I said, what happened to the improvement in the 2nd half on Saturday, that would give us that hope?
119 Posted 27/09/2016 at 19:00:24
Moshiri is a businessman. Kenwright is too, but not as successful. Kenwright loves Everton. Moshiri does not (no disrespect intended). Both businessman enjoy football and the business spin-offs of the current obscene wealth sloshing around the game. Kenwright loves the media; Moshiri is not so confident in that area.
Between these positions lies a balance. Businessman will invest into the team, the stadium, youth policy and whatever else will create more wealth. Ergo Moshiri is likely to have a deeper and more long lasting influence, whereas Kenwright, especially considering his age and health, will carry on at his 'hobby' and continue to exploit the position, withdrawing or redirecting funds on a regular basis etc) until the final curtain comes down. It will do so when Moshiri and his accountants see the swingometer on Kenwright's balance sheet move too far into the negative. Could take a year, maybe two, who knows...
Meanwhile Everton's stock will rise in line with the general market rise of the sport in general, or a bit faster, or slower, dependent upon our on-field success, or lack of. In any event it will rise. It's not rocket science.
I see Moshiri as passively active investor at a relatively big scale, and Kenwright as an actively passive investor at a relatively small scale. That is where the interests lie. They say opposites attract and in Everton's case they have, but whether they move forward together long term is doubtful. I don't think for a minute Kenwright 'sold' Everton to Moshiri. I think Moshiri wanted to invest into Everton because they were 'for sale' and because of the current and potential business wealth of the football market, Premier League especially, and in spite of Kenwright and his selling terms.
That is where we are, and until the Kenwright shackles are off, and the financial issues surrounding the Club are clearly reconciled, then the full steam ahead investment into the team won't be likely.
Also people are looking at the stadium investment as a capex millstone which it is. But don' t forget in property development terms, having the main attraction to regenerate an area is the main challenge and usually costs big time to be brought on board. Here we have Everton as a ready-made main attraction and they are making the land investment payment to the Peel Group for 'the privilege' of participating! If it happens according to plan, then the surrounding commercial spin-offs will run in parallel and, all being well, make the savvy investors extremely healthy profits and benefit Everton along the way.
This is not an anti-capitalist rant, by the way; it is just how I see the position is moving. In one of his early interviews, Koeman said he understands Everton's overall business issues (he's a clever guy so I'm sure he does), and he will be well rewarded for ensuring Everton's high profile runs nicely alongside the wider commercial issues. The symbiosis should benefit all. If the team performance dips, then more investment will be forthcoming. If it improves then great for all.
We are in for a roller-coaster ride and if anything assured me of the general business professional and exciting times ahead, it was the signing up of Koeman and Team and Walsh. Again, a business approach to the overall situation.
Example Gana Gueye; Cost £7.5m and 2 months later value probably quadrupled . . . . . . Meanwhile Sky money are paying the salaries.
What's not to like? Well let's hope the importance of the fans and EITC do not get lost in the process. We should be alright as after all the new stadium means nothing without the fans and the fans need the new stadium to attend the spectacle of the games, so we should be OK.
120 Posted 27/09/2016 at 19:14:51
At this rate we will never get a better ground or improve the team to the level we want! In January, if we don't splash the cash, I fear Koeman will have to do what he did at saints. Maybe we got Walsh in because we will never have any cash to spare.
121 Posted 27/09/2016 at 19:35:29
I can only assume there will be some very worried managers out there wondering if they have been included in this sting. The one thing that unites all the corrupt sportsmen is money; irrespective of what they earn, the greedy men still want more.
122 Posted 27/09/2016 at 19:54:13
That's so very true; when there are potloads of money available, there are generally very greedy people waiting to grab as much as they can of it, legally or otherwise. Let's hope the name of Everton FC isn't associated with any of the upcoming 'revelations' in any way shape or form.
123 Posted 27/09/2016 at 19:56:53
124 Posted 27/09/2016 at 20:06:50
Wonder if they'll call upon ginger whinger once the mackems have booted him out?
125 Posted 27/09/2016 at 20:37:37
126 Posted 27/09/2016 at 21:15:14
127 Posted 27/09/2016 at 22:28:09
128 Posted 27/09/2016 at 23:52:23
Big Sam has been hung out to dry, but I wonder why the journos went for him? Also makes me wonder why the FA went for him in the first place. Are they so out of the loop that they don't have an inkling about the gossip in football circles?
129 Posted 27/09/2016 at 00:04:03
130 Posted 28/09/2016 at 02:59:25
Meanwhile, in the wake of the Big, Fat, Greedy Sam fiasco, could be that finally the football money pit will be looked at more closely?
Meanwhile I see the BBC featured articles with one highlighting how the shining examples of quality managers acting with professional integrity, Guardiola, and Klopp (obviously...)
I hope just as we are getting started circumstances prevail that pull the rug from under us don't prevail? Given our history of being scapegoated by events unrelated to the Club, and bad timing, I feel a bit nervous...
131 Posted 28/09/2016 at 04:10:51
The assistant manager of a high-profile football club accepted a £5,000 cash “bung”
Ten managers were named by players agents as taking bribes to fix player transfers
Two well-known managers discussed becoming ambassadors for the same fictitious firm as Sam Allardyce
Another high-profile manager admitted his players broke FA rules by betting on their own games but he failed to report it
A senior figure at a Premier League club helped undercover reporters to formulate a plan to bribe managers
If it's naivety and ego at the centre of this, then I start to feel a bit nervous for our former manager.
132 Posted 28/09/2016 at 05:20:21
133 Posted 28/09/2016 at 07:36:33
Didn't they look to Saturday to make amends after Tuesday's debacle and look where that got them.
On the money they are getting they should be looking at giving 100% everytime they put the jersey on (and obviously in training too) and not just after they have taken yet another knock.
I realise how difficult it must be playing professional football and having to live on a paltry £15000 plus a week (dependent on who you are and who you believe) and then if you sort your finances out properly be able to retire or get paid to chat on TV at the ripe old age of 35ish.
Us as supporters should have more sympathy for our team, after all they are only human and asking them to give 100% for 90 minutes over a week is extremely difficult whilst having to worry about things such as when the pool will be installed, did my children get into that private school, is it a diamond or a new Range Rover for her birthday
Blah Blah Blah..
Get a grip FFS!!!!!!!!
Rant Over - roll on Friday, so that they can put it right!!!!!!!!!!
134 Posted 28/09/2016 at 07:55:56
Theres no maybe about it.
Remember - "You knew full well that Kenny Dalglish had engineered for one of his unsavoury friends to come and facilitate this meeting,' Lord Carlile, Hylands' barrister said in court. 'It was you who brought the heavy mob, wasn't it?" - Link
Or - “Gerrard wished it to be known that he had 'the utmost respect' for the man who stood in the dock. Never mind that the defendant, John Kinsella, was a known gangster charged with tying up a security guard during a £41,000 robbery” - Link
Just two (ahem) random stories.
135 Posted 28/09/2016 at 08:21:07
Clattenberg is the ref for Friday's game, talk about kicking someone when they are down.
136 Posted 28/09/2016 at 09:05:41
137 Posted 28/09/2016 at 09:17:34
138 Posted 28/09/2016 at 09:23:49
139 Posted 28/09/2016 at 09:59:16
140 Posted 28/09/2016 at 12:04:39
Of course most of it is unilluminating and occasionally annoying. Let's hope they have more positive things to say after Friday. This game will tell us a lot about the ability of Koeman and the players to learn from defeat and move forward.
141 Posted 28/09/2016 at 12:35:43
Excellent totally my opinion, I just count myself to be so lucky having personally witnessed "blueboys" of the quality of Ball, Kendall, Harvey & so so many more.
Our existing players, unfortunately are just "rented" & so we do not have the same affinity to them, for example Lukaku, Deulofeu, etc. The game has moved on and, to a large proportion of all players, is devoid of total personal "effort" and unfortunately... a win bonus!!!
142 Posted 28/09/2016 at 13:36:05
All I ask is for my pound of flesh just as does my employer!!!! Of which he more than gets .
147 Posted 28/09/2016 at 20:43:17
How many players must be offside before the goal is deemed offside?
148 Posted 28/09/2016 at 21:48:23
Dembele, who I believe Martinez watched, bullied City's defence from the off and made Otamendi and Kolorov look inept. Why pass on this kid and buy Niasse? ridiculous!
149 Posted 28/09/2016 at 21:57:57
Regarding Dembele, I think with him going to a Scottish club there would be no transfer fee involved, he would get an excellent signing on fee and wage, plus putting himself in the shop window in all the European games.
150 Posted 28/09/2016 at 22:21:05
151 Posted 28/09/2016 at 23:12:54
152 Posted 28/09/2016 at 23:24:10
It is a very thorough and explicit explanation by Jags, comparing defensive training (and expectancy) under RK, contrasted to that under RM. Well worth a read.
Revealing and reassuring.
153 Posted 28/09/2016 at 23:44:33
154 Posted 29/09/2016 at 06:42:51
The team as a whole were awful, I really thought we would put that right against Bournemouth,
I would like to think come Friday, we will have got over our blip, the players respond and put a shift in, that's all I ask as well Ralph, getting stuck in and having a bloody go from the first whistle.
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