CEO: Atmosphere will be central to Bramley-Moore design

Wednesday 26 July 2017  62 Comments  [Jump to last]

Robert Elstone has provided some of the most substantive insights to date into Everton's proposed new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock in a podcast interview with Nick Mernock, Chair of the Everton Fans Forum.

The club's Chief Executive touched on many of the salient issues around what promises to be a major chapter in Everton's history, one that could see the Blues kicking off in their new home in August 2021 if an aggressive timeline can be met.

"Proximity and steepness"

Elstone explained how the design team at Meis Studio have been asked to push the limits of what is possible for the Blues' new ground, within the parameters, Fifa- and Uefa-imposed safety guidelines so as to optimise the matchday atmosphere inside.

“The [criteria for creating] atmosphere will be around proximity and steepness; they're the two things. The designers have been challenged to bring the first seat as close as possible [to the pitch] and to make the last seat as steep and as close as we possibly can.

“They've already done some experimenting around cross-sections and they've done some really compelling [ones] where they're comparing them to existing stadia and our seats are all nearer, the seats at the back are all nearer.

“There's a really strong business case for that because probably the most important revenue stream that the new stadium will deliver is 35,000 to 40,000 season ticket holders who are going to come back year after year and who can't wait to renew their season ticket.

“If we can create something that is atmospheric and intense, I think that's really going to help with season ticket retention.

“The other business case is the need to create a fortress. What I've said to the design team is, if you ask me for one single design brief it would be to start every game with a goal advantage. Now I know that's a bit cliched in a way but if you start every game “with a goal advantage”… the biggest stream of revenue that we have is TV revenue and a big slug of that is a merit reward based on where you finish in the table.

“Every one of those places are worth about two million quid. If you create a stadium where opponents don't want to come and play and our players grow another 12 inches, we've created an environment where we're more likely to win games. There's a very strong commercial reason for doing that so we can get those merit payments.

Home end and capacity

The CEO also expressed his desire to avoid what he feels was an oversight at stadia like the Emirates and the Etihad by ensuring that there is a clear home section at Bramley-Moore Dock. In doing so, he tacitly indicated that the new structure would not be in the form of a traditional bowl or uniform rectangle.

“I think we'd like to try and create a very obvious and compelling home end and to do that, there will be a degree of asymmetry in the stadium. The home end could well be bigger and I think that is something that would work for us.

“We are still not absolutely decided on capacity and part of the consultation process [with fans] will help shape that. We're much more confident of being bold and ambitious on capacity than we were two or three years ago. We have got a genuine waiting list both in terms of general admission and premium seats.

“And we are flexing our muscles [in the transfer market] and showing genuine ambition on the pitch which will help.

“Ultimately, where we get to on capacity isn't decided yet but I think we'll be ambitious and I think the number will be a big one.

“The other aspect of this is Bramley-Moore Dock is an amazing location but it will be a tight fit so there will be an economically viable limit to what we can do. The design teams are looking at what might be achievable and we're looking at the incremental cost of adding those one, two, three, four thousand seats beyond where we currently are to see if it's economically viable.

“We won't be shy of ambition. The size of your stadium is a big statement of intent and ambition and as a club that's pushing for Champions League and wants to win trophies, we want a stadium that reflects that ambition.”

Commonwealth Games

Mernock asked Elstone if he could allay Evertonian concerns over potential compromises to the stadium's design and construction or simple disruption that might be caused by Liverpool hosting the 2022 Commonwealth Games.

The city is in the running to win a bid to host the athletics event and Mayor Joe Anderson has been trumpeting Everton's Bramley-Moore Dock development as being central to that bid.

The CEO explained, however, that the club's philosophy around accommodating the event would be just like any other non-football occasion and that for seven days, the stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock would host athletics but afterwards it would appear as though nothing had happened.

“If [Liverpool] is awarded the Commonwealth Games, Everton will undoubtedly benefit from a lot of the related development of infrastructure and building adjacent to Bramley-Moore Dock. That would be a big advantage to the football club.

“We have, however, said that we would be delighted to accommodate athletics in our new stadium so long as it doesn't compromise design and so long as it doesn't compromise timetable.

“So, we are pushing on to get in the stadium as soon as we can. We're still aiming for August 2021. That will be very difficult to achieve but we still believe that if things fall into place and we push on hard, it is still potentially achievable.

“If the Commonwealth Games do come in in 2022, a running track will be installed without disruption to the infrastructure of the stadium, it will be pulled out without disruption to the core of the stadium, and it will be ready for us to kick off [again] in August 2022.”

Naming rights and heritage

On the topic of naming rights for the new ground, Elstone admitted that the location of Bramley-Moore Dock makes for an especially attractive partnership for potential sponsors and that Everton would have to be careful about “diluting the check” by trying to incorporate a more romantic name to the new development.

Instead, he says that Dan Meis' love for Goodison Park means that plenty of the club's traditions are likely to be carried over to the new design, words that will come as music to the ears of many fans.

“In terms of reflecting tradition, heritage, and bringing some of the features of Goodison with us, Dan has fallen in love with Goodison and Everton and he is constantly looking at ways of reflecting… whether it's Archibald Leitch signature architecture or the seats in the Gwladys Street or different views or the flavour of the concourses, he is looking to bring that with us.

“The most important thing we can do is make sure that this new stadium is adopted quickly; comes that new home quickly. That will be about design, atmosphere but it will also have an element of familiarity. Dan is really committed to that and we'll make sure he will.

“We want to hear fans' views. We are very conscious of creating a destination where fans feel comfortable and can get there early, meet friends and family, to mix and socialise in a very natural environment.

“There will be messaging about ways to get involved put out through the club's communication channels so fans should look out for the best way to do that."

You can register to be part of the consultation process at this page on evertonfc.com.

 

Reader Comments (62)

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Bill Watson
1 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:37:18
Good to hear that the new ground will be of a design that's unique to Everton Football Club and that the club appears to be looking at an increased capacity than that first mooted.

To enter the footballing elite, we must have a ground that's capable of holding a minimum of 60,000 and one that could be a venue for European finals etc.

Would we fill it every home game? Why not? A modern stadium with superb facilities, a fabulous location and excellent rail links is a start. Let's not forget, too, the ambition that gave us Goodison Park with a capacity of 78,000.

Even if the ground wasn't sold out every week, modern technology would enable seats to be released in a way that wouldn't leave the sort of gaps you see at Man City.

Bring it on!

Ben Collins
2 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:39:13
Wow, this rhetoric is literally light years away from the Tesco carbuncle that we nearly ended up with. The shape of the stadium sounds very interesting if not a bowl or conventional rectangle. All the right words coming from Elstone's mouth for a novel change. Rather excited.
Phil Bellis
3 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:42:16
I'd like behind both goals to be "home" ends.

Treat away fans respectfully, allocate good viewing locations, but stick them out of the way. Reduce any advantage to the opposition.

Brent Stephens
4 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:47:47
"There will be a degree of asymmetry in the stadium". Not a bowl or rectangle. Interesting!

"We're looking at the incremental cost of adding those one, two, three, four thousand seats beyond where we currently are to see if it's economically viable".

I read that as not one, two, three, four thousand above Goodison Park capacity, but beyond current draft designs. Hope I'm right. Gotta be, hasn't it?!

Dean Johnson
5 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:54:17
Sounds interesting,

I would love to see the Leitch criss-cross around a tier. Perhaps the running track could be installed level with the 2nd tier?

John Otway
6 Posted 26/07/2017 at 19:56:37
How has this bloke survived as CEO? He was only ever Kenwright's bully boy patsy fronting up the occasional, grudgingly granted, Shareholders' Meeting.

I'm staggered that he's still in situ in the brave new world of Farhad Moshiri and under the daily gaze of Sasha Ryazantsev. Surely bullshit doesn't truly baffle brains!

Colin Glassar
7 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:03:49
Standing home end please.
Mike Berry
8 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:08:39
I have read before that Don Meiss says the new stadium will be unique, and the most appealing in its design in the Premier League and will blow all the others off the map, this bloke knows what he is doing and that's why Elstone enthuses so much from what he has seen and heard.

Expect a larger capacity too, I will stick my neck out and say 60,000.

This stadium will be iconic and easy to get too on match days and will attract so many more to the area. Also, do not under estimate any slack space not being taken up by tourists visiting Liverpool. What better ways to spread the gospel across the world when as a tourist you can go and watch a Premier League game (if not already a sell-out).

We are in for something very special but a lot of the faithful are unbelievers... watch that space, down at Bramley-Moore Dock!

Liam Reilly
9 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:09:02
The good thing about being one of the last leading clubs to upgrade or design a new stadium is that a lot of lessons can be learned from what went before.

Going to be a long 4 years to wait, but it should be worth it.

Kevin Tully
10 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:27:55
Forget about 'the consultation process', Bobby.

In & out as easily and quickly as possible.
Massive pumps that pour 34 pints of quality beer at a time.
Boss pies & grub.
Cheap season tickets.
Hundreds of bogs everywhere.
Decent legroom.
Plenty of staff to sell more stuff.
No kopites – even on derby days.
Quality vodka offering.
A team not allergic to anything silver.
No kopite pundits.


Sorted.


Mike Connolly
11 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:40:40
Nice one, Kevin (#10).
Alex Kociuba
12 Posted 26/07/2017 at 20:51:29
Spot on, Kevin, I would also add that we don't go down the road of hiring 3rd party security and stewards.
James Marshall
13 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:17:12
By being a bit late to the party with a new ground, we're going to end up ahead of everyone else since we can learn from their mistakes, and design/build a more modern arena – as leaders from day one, it's fitting that our ground is going to be the most modern in the country :)
Robin Cannon
14 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:32:07
John (#6) – Honestly, I've always been surprised that he's stayed. Frankly being CEO of Everton under Kenwright was probably a pretty thankless task. Do some of the day to day stuff, but never be empowered because Bill drops in to take over any time there's something in the limelight.

What we've always needed, and didn't have under Kenwright, was someone genuinely in control of the running of the club. Bill always seemed (a) to not want to let go of the reins, but (b) to not be prepared to make running Everton his full time job.

He's tarred with the criticisms of the past, but I can't honestly identify much that Elstone has done particularly wrong. And, pretty clearly here, everything Elstone has spoken about in terms of the new stadium has been positive.

Colin Glassar
15 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:33:13
No kopites, full stop Kevin. Or, stick 'em in the top balcony, miles from the pitch, like the Spanish do.
Phil Bellis
16 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:40:48
They'll have a great view of the new ground from the top tiers of their loft conversion... Also when flying in to JLA..
Steve Ferns
17 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:57:54
Forget the talk, I want to see the pictures.
Jeff Armstrong
18 Posted 26/07/2017 at 21:59:14
I also believe we should have both ends behind the goals as "home ends", try to create a bit of competition at either end as to who can support the loudest, and again as previously mentioned, stick the away support as far away from the play as possible.
Mike Allison
19 Posted 26/07/2017 at 22:02:10
Time after time, they're saying the right things about this stadium. It's enough to make you nervous that it might actually happen. I just wish I wasn't so burnt from previous experience that I could actually enjoy this.
James Flynn
20 Posted 26/07/2017 at 22:11:12
Moshiri gave him a huge pay rise and made him an official member of the Board of Directors. He belongs to Moshiri now.

He mouthed Kenwright's line all those years. Now he mouths Moshiri's. That's his job.

The way he talks, though, seems to imply Moshiri has secured the financial backing for construction, once the design plan is what he wants.

David McMullen
26 Posted 26/07/2017 at 22:41:32
I'll say it straight – he gives me the creeps. Hope he/the club does not shape "the debate" like they shaped the design of the 2nd new crest (the one we have now) when they provided 3 options. With only one that really ticked the boxes.

Okay. Not shy of ambition. Statement of intent. I'm all ears. Saying the right things. For me, when you're talking about capacity and talking about statement of intent and ambition, you have to make it bigger than all the others. With the exception of Old Trafford. 65,000 for me.

Like the idea of a larger home end, the new stadium doesn't have to be symmetrical Goodison Park never was. I'm a big fan of the Lucas Oil Stadium which is also not symmetrical for different reasons. This stadium has many attributes we would enjoy including a retractable roof and it is also below ground level which is useful considering we'd be infilling a dock.

I'm not bothered about naming rights as long as we Christen the ground such as Bramley-Moore Dock Stadium or something like that.

Mike Gaynes
28 Posted 26/07/2017 at 23:37:53
Kev (#10)... now that's consulting! Hell, they'd never be able to get most of us to leave at the end of the game! (You especially.)

I assume a "bog" is a bathroom?

Yep, you'd definitely need hundreds of them if you have 34-pint pumps going.


Tony Abrahams
29 Posted 26/07/2017 at 00:01:46
The only pumps I'm interested in, Kev, are big massive water-pumps that can turn the water in the river Mersey "Royal Blue".
Dan Davies
30 Posted 26/07/2017 at 00:06:13
If Moshiri and Ryazantsev have kept Elstone on board then doesn't that tell people something? Just maybe Elstone isn't the fool that people have been making him out to be for years?

These business men mean business and if Elstone was the idiot some make him out to be – he would be gone by now! I for one welcome your words, Bobby boy. COYB.

Simon Smith
31 Posted 27/07/2017 at 00:36:40
Kevin (#10), you forgot the champagne bar that will be needed for all those celebration evenings when the good times start to roll again! Lol!!
Trevor Lynes
32 Posted 27/07/2017 at 00:51:43
Are there any plans to draw revenue during the close season? Surely money coming in throughout the year should be a consideration.

Atmosphere was severely blunted when standing room ceased to be. I have been in Goodison three times with well over 70,000 fans attending and the atmosphere was electric. Being seated has definitely lowered the atmosphere and the noise from the crowd.

Lets hope that whatever accoustics are planned will help to bring back that Goodison roar. I would hate it to be as quiet as some of the other new stadiums.

The main priority is attracting the best players.

Laurie Hartley
33 Posted 27/07/2017 at 02:22:35
John (#6) – in answer to your question – "Surely bullshit doesn't truly baffle brains!"for my part, I was quite impressed listening to Elstone - he was all over it.

Dan Davies (#30) has got it right in my opinion.

Alisher to Farhad (over a glass of wine somewhere very private) – "How is the Megafon stadium plan going?"
Farhad to Alisher – "It's coming together nicely."
Alisher to Farhad – "Is Elstone up to it?"
Farhad to Alisher – "Sasha reckons he is, but we'll keep an eye on him"

After listening to the podcast and the answers given by Elstone, I am more convinced than ever that Everton Football Club is heading back to the top because we have some heavyweights pulling the strings.

Elstone, Koeman, and Walsh have been given the reigns on a huge project – they will have to deliver on all fronts.

One last point from me. If the club delivers on the plans for the community at Goodison, every Evertonian's chest should burst with pride.

It's a Grand Old Team to Play for – It's a Grand Old Team to Support.

David Ellis
34 Posted 27/07/2017 at 02:52:03
Mike (#28) "I assume a bog is a bathroom" – maybe what you would call a "half bath" – ie, no bath at all. But you're on the right lines.
Mark Andersson
35 Posted 27/07/2017 at 04:35:40
Interesting times ahead, I hope I live long enough to see it come to fruition. Let's see us win at Anfield this season and and smack their arses every time we play them so they get use to being Number 2 on Merseyside for the first derby at the new ground.

There will be a new generation of blue fans, how about a new boys pen named after Billy Boy?

Lee Brownlie
36 Posted 27/07/2017 at 04:57:13
Wow!!.. the sleeping giant starts to awaken.. an fuck me, is he gunna be happy with his new big, smart bed?!!!
Andrew Heffernan
37 Posted 27/07/2017 at 05:03:20
How very different does this feel than the horrible "at each others throats" feeling on multiple forums during the Kirkby saga – that made me walk away from ToffeeWeb as it was sad to see the level of vitriol being exchanged. I genuinely believe that would have been the downfall of the club, such was the poor planning and how it split the fan base.

Having been fortunate to experience the dying days of the Moores era and the football riches of the 1980s, I have never felt more positive about the great institution that is Everton Football Club. The thought of a second opportunity on the waterfront, and the surrounding development – I can't wait to see plans/images.

Also good to see Bobby being enthused about taking the club forward, supported by his fellow Directors, without defending the impossible with his hands tied behind his back.

I can't wait to see the game tonight and enjoy Goodison's deserved final few seasons before an appropriate send off. Raise the roof fellow toffees, we're definitely in the ascendancy! COYB.

David Ellis
38 Posted 27/07/2017 at 06:09:38
This is, or will be, a dream come true. 60,000 please (and no roof). It will certainly change our status and I agree we have a late adopter's advantage since the new stadium revolution started around 25 years ago.

The status of clubs like Sunderland, West Ham, Stoke, Southampton, Bolton, Derby, Middlesborough, Blackburn, Rangers (at the time) and Arsenal all improve as a result of having new stadiums. Some of these have since been overshadowed, in particular some of them are too small and for others the location has been too out of town.

It looks like Moshiri gets that the stadium is a massive statement and an integral part of the New Everton Brand – essential for getting good players and good sponsorship and its not just about getting the most amount of seats for the least amount of money.

We must have a better ground than Anfield and it looks like we'll get it.

John Smith
39 Posted 27/07/2017 at 06:27:06
Fuck naming rights. We're rich now.

Call it William Ralph Dean Stadium. Dean Stadium for short.

Brian Murray
40 Posted 27/07/2017 at 06:27:49
Said before and will say again, away fans should be up in the gods like Newcastle but behind a perspex screen like Rotterdam's so noise is minimal
Stephen Dennis
41 Posted 27/07/2017 at 07:42:58
Yes coming late to the party means we can learn from all the others mistakes. The atmosphere at Old Trafford is poor, you feel miles away from the action.

This article is music to my ears, close proximity to the pitch, steep sides, fetching features of Goodison with us. I would also add, safe standing areas and very cheap tickets for children to lay foundations for our future support. Oh and a special viewing platform so we can see their 'conservatory '...

Will Mabon
42 Posted 27/07/2017 at 07:51:13
Hmm – the nearness of the seats to the pitch is now being compared to "Other stadiums" and not Goodison. I believe the FIFA and UEFA guidelines are indeed advisory guides, and not binding.

There is no doubt that the temporary incorporation of a running track will markedly impact the final design of the stadium, in terms of the view we get.

"Pressure is often put on stadium developers to increase the field size or include a running track. Occasionally, such requirements are unavoidable. Unfortunately, this will result in a much less successful facility than a football stadium that is specifically built around the football field's dimensions.

"Various attempts to provide a running track without destroying the football stadium's ambience have been proposed and built, including retractable seating along the sidelines, an example of which can be found in the Stad de France in Paris. Most are very expensive to build and operate and/or have resulted in compromised sight lines for one or both sports, even when the rake or angle of the seating has been made as steep as possible."

Quoted from FIFA Football Stadiums - Technical recommendation and requirements 5th edition.

We could really do without this running track...

Ray Robinson
46 Posted 27/07/2017 at 08:40:30
Brian (#40), I understand that, as of this season, new rules state that all grounds must provide an element of seating for away fans at pitch level (presumably to improve the atmosphere), so it isn't going to be possible to do what you suggest. It will affect the way that away fans are accommodated at Newcastle.
Laurie Hartley
47 Posted 27/07/2017 at 10:54:31
Will (#42) – I listened to the full podcast and as a result I am convinced that any running track will definitely not adversely affect either the "proximity or atmosphere".

They have found a way of doing this.

David (#26) – I am also a fan of the Lucas Oil Stadium but Dan Meiss has more or less ruled that out.


Laurie Hartley
48 Posted 27/07/2017 at 10:55:29
The retractable roof that is!
James Watts
49 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:04:54
It's hard not to get excited when listening to this. And I thought Elstone came across really well.

The proof now will be in the pudding, and if this comes off the way it sounds, wow. Just wow. It will truly be awesome being an Evertonian once again.

Ray Roche
50 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:13:12
Ray Robinson (#46),

But is there anything to say that the away fans can't be placed in a side corner just as they are at Goodison? I don't think so.

The last thing I want is to be facing the "away end" containing a shower of Norwegian and Japanese tourists with the odd scouser who doesn't require a song sheet, jumping up and down when the ref awards them the usual dodgy pen in the 7th minute of 5 minutes of added time so that they can get a lucky draw against 8-men Everton, the other three having been sent off for either: (a) Wearing a blue shirt; (b) Being too handsome; or (c) Making an attempt on goal.

Ray Robinson
51 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:19:06
Ray (#50), no absolutely not – as long as an element of the away contingent is "pitch side". However, they cannot be "up in the Gods" and certainly not behind perspex screens!!

As far as I know, it only affects Newcastle and would have affected Sunderland but they got relegated. All other grounds already comply, I think.

Ray Roche
52 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:39:56
Ray, I've always advocated a sprinkler system to be used if they start making a noise. Is that not allowed?
Ray Robinson
53 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:46:14
Ray – be careful what you propose.! Do you ever attend Everton away matches? What goes around, comes around!
Ray Roche
54 Posted 27/07/2017 at 11:51:10
Point taken!
David McMullen
55 Posted 27/07/2017 at 13:36:51
Laurie (#48) I get that the Lucas Oil Stadium is a good gauge of one with two different goal ends. Shame Meis is ruling out a retractable roof but you never know.

I do think Elstone's tone about the ambitious nature of the stadium has changed from earlier soundbites. He even intimated it himself. I felt overall the club were underestimating how big our fan base was but maybe they are now getting it.

Brian Wilkinson
56 Posted 27/07/2017 at 14:34:49
You cannot not have Reds supporters entering the stadium; we should welcome our neighbours with open arms, even give them the end near the Mersey, then operation Goodison.

Our new design will includes drop trap doors in the away end, the doors are voice activated and open with any bollocks or certain song spoken, the trap door will be activated and will ferry them below and at an angle, slide them into the Mersey water.

Will Mabon
57 Posted 27/07/2017 at 15:55:27
Laurie (#47):

I've not yet listened to the podcast but remain unconvinced. Nothing has been defined. As certain of the dimensions and geometry are inescapable, I already know what it would require anyway – and the cost would be prohibitive.

We simply will not get the same layout as Goodison if the track remains part of the plan. That closeness of seating at Goodison is a major part of the atmosphere and much would be lost without it, I feel. It could be replicated with no track involved.

I'm a fan of the Lucas Oil Stadium myself for many reasons. Still not as intimate as The Old lady, though!

Gary Edwards
58 Posted 27/07/2017 at 18:28:10
I would design the acoustics / atmospherics in such a way as to benefit us even to the extent of piping crowd noises into the part of the ground where the Main Stand mutes migrate to, create a cauldron of noise.

Conversely they could design the acoustics to muffle the away fans.

Roger Helm
59 Posted 27/07/2017 at 19:03:09
I will be glad to see the back of the horrible Goodison Park fan experience with tiny uncomfortable seats to watch the match and then a sardine like crush to queue for nasty pies, hot dogs, shit beer or £2.20 teabags.

Even the small stadium at Castleford where I am also a STH provides real ale, bacon rolls, pulled pork sarnies and espresso coffee. The club needs to visit any major league stadium in the USA to find out how to look after the fans.

All these outlets make profits for themselves and the club. Let's jump straight from the 1970s to the 2020s.

Will Mabon
60 Posted 27/07/2017 at 22:26:12
Roger, you're totally failing to tune in to the "Character."
Will Mabon
61 Posted 27/07/2017 at 22:31:45
Gary, agree about the acoustics for crowd noise (The old Maine Road stadium was particularly good, and one of the stands at Molyneux amongst others). Sound from physical design, though, NOT electronic trickery, as obscenely used in certain cars now – yuk.

Muffling the away support? Yeah, why not!

Erik Dols
62 Posted 28/07/2017 at 08:27:22
Be brave and bold – at least 65,000 with room for expansion. Bayern Munich to this day regret they didn't build the Allianz Arena bigger, they already expanded it to the max. Ajax are looking for ways to expand their stadium for years now; Arsenal should have done bigger in hindsight.

It is a fable that economic reasons dictate stadiums should have a capacity of 50 to 60k. Hell, even FC Köln, who just have qualified for Europe for the first time in 25 years, are looking to expand or build new towards 75 to 80k. I really think we will regret building anything smaller than 65k.

Iconic location, team going places, this is the moment to push on and claim our place amongst the big ones, where we belong historically.

Geoff Williams
63 Posted 28/07/2017 at 15:12:57
Please ensure there is enough leg space and the seats are big enough to accommodate the rather generous backsides of the current generation of supporters so as not to impinge on the space of those sitting alongside them.
Laurie Hartley
64 Posted 28/07/2017 at 00:07:53
Will (#57) – you are correct in saying that the dimensions and geometry are inescapable.

If they put a 3-metre safety zone around the temporary track, they will require a temporary podium footprint of 164 meters long and 80 metres wide.

Quite a challenge and one that fascinates me – but I remain convinced that they have a solution.

Tony Pemberton
65 Posted 29/07/2017 at 00:12:15
Surely making a stand as steep as possible means fans further away?

If each row averages a height of two foot, you're further away than if they average one foot.

You can tighten the legroom, but you can tighten the legroom on a less steep stand too. Do all stands want tighter legroom or just behind the goals?

Also, spot on Erik Dols they should be looking to expand, is there room though I wonder with him saying its a tight fit?

Is this tight fit the reason for the disappointing single home end and not two?

Will Jones
66 Posted 29/07/2017 at 00:36:25
The biggest thing to say at this point is for EFC to consult the fans about the new stadium. I think it would be reasonable with most fans to invest funds in the long term future. So just action this!! Don't spend £50 m on one player and then cut costs on the beers... sorry, I mean, facilities of the new stadium that will be used by our future generations to come!!

These situations come around once in a lifetime. I mean really, 1 player for 1 good stand that will last for 50 years??
Will Mabon
67 Posted 30/07/2017 at 00:35:20
"If they put a 3-metre safety zone around the temporary track, they will require a temporary podium footprint of 164 meters long and 80 metres wide."

Laurie, you're right. Some tracks have had less outer zone at the end and more along the straights. "Recommendations" often state more than 3 metres, too.

"Challenge" is a good word for it!

Julian Wait
68 Posted 30/07/2017 at 16:49:57
Safe Standing seems like a real possibility if we can time this right (ref. Guardian)
Terry Underwood
69 Posted 01/08/2017 at 06:10:08
So, the issue of standing at Premier League grounds has never really gone away, but it has now emerged that Liverpool fans have come out in favour of "safe standing." I mention them because, of course, they must have a strong voice in the debate. West Brom have expressed a willingness to pilot such a scheme if one were to be rolled out.

How would such a scheme work? My preference would be a strictly controlled number of standing spaces, perhaps limited by season ticket sales, with good safety barriers, not the old style gut-squashers, who doesn't have a horror story about those abominations? Decent terraces, not the crumbling messes I remember.

There can be no doubt that we lost atmosphere when all-seater stadiums were introduced. For me, football is best watched standing, it is a game of passion and emotion and it is hard to get worked up while sitting.

I don't want a return to the days when you couldn't move cos your arms were pinned by your side and there was always a danger of a serious crush. But safe standing areas, strictly monitored and with stringent safeguards in place? Yes, please.

Trevor Lynes
70 Posted 01/08/2017 at 07:23:40
Fully agree with Terry (#69). Atmosphere is greatly diminished with all-seated stadiums. I have been in Goodison twice with over 70,000 gates and the atmosphere was terrific. I would definitely be in favour of standing areas and would gladly use them in preference to being seated.
Alan McGuffog
72 Posted 12/08/2017 at 09:59:45
Just read the Red Echo. Don't you love articles that state that Everton fans needn't worry about progress so far. Hmmm... well I hadn't been.


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