Everton vs Stoke City

Personally I'd still like to see Kenny play as I think we'll need that attacking element out wide for this game.

I would also like to see Davies play too instead of Gana or Schneiderlin. But I don't think either will happen.

But whatever the team, COYB!! Let's get the first 3 points in the bag!

I hope Barkley stays; I have never wanted him to leave – this is the Season that could actually define him as the player we know he is... COYB!!

We have many more games (up to 19) due to the Europa League and two untried strikers (Calvert-Lewin and Sandro), plus a has-been in Rooney.

I was so excited for once and now I'm left thinking and feeling 'same old Everton'.

Hope I'm wrong...

I can see Barkley leaving on deadline day. No way would the club let him leave on a free. It would be just like Levy to get him for around £20 million.

I'd like:

Pickford
Kenny Keane Williams Baines
Davies Schneiderlin Klaassen
Rooney Sandro
Calvert-Lewin

But I'm expecting:

Pickford
Holgate Keane Williams Baines
Idrissa Schneiderlin Klaassen
Rooney Sandro
Calvert-Lewin

Subs: Stekelenburg, Jagielka, Martina, Barry, Davies, Mirallas, Lookman.

Quick, intelligent and incisive passing needed to beat that defence.

Relatively strong options to bring on from the bench.

Some great signings, Keane and Pickford in particular, but I'm still not sure Koeman knows how to break a team down.

Normally I'm over optimistic and we don't deliver, hopefully the opposite this season.

We badly need a goalscorer, so I'm going 1-1 against a pub team.

I'm unsure exactly how Sigurdsson will fit in this team and can't help but think we really lack pace up top.

After those two Europa League games, I have to say I'm not as confident as I was a month ago.

I find it galling that we are about to kick off the new campaign without a proper centre forward. The deadline on transfers should be the night before the season starts- it is ridiculous that the business is not concluded during the close season.

The club has been caught with it's pants down – take a look at all of the other teams who will be challenging for the top 7. They all have recognised strikers.

Expect nil-nil unless we get Davies and/or Lookman and/or Mirallas on in time to make a difference. But I'm predicting 1-0 the Blues.

Also, I think if Calvert-Lewin can get a goal starting up front again, Koeman will stop playing him out wide, given his comments last week.

Schneiderlin and Williams have been god awful for awhile now so it's the bench for them and Rooney needs to be surrounded by runners with pace.

The failure to sign a replacement for Lukaku, tie up a deal for Sigurdsson and the likely rejection of places for Davies and Kenny makes this opening fixture a real challenge but, with more than two weeks until the closing of the window, we must be careful not to over-react if we fail to garner full points.

Prediction: 1-1 and the first point towards that 7th spot.

Pickford and Keane both appear solid acquisitions hitherto, and should help to reduce the amount of goals conceded even further. We're still waiting on more from Klaassen and Sandro, yet they have now an assist and goal for Everton respectively. Rooney is still somewhat of a puzzle, mostly concerning his role playing for the team, but he should surely be a net positive.

My ideal line-up for this match would be as so (4-3-3):

Sandro
Mirallas Rooney
Klaassen Davies
Schneiderlin
Baines Williams Keane Kenny
Pickford

However, I believe Koeman will opt to play with two defensive midfielders (Gueye for Davies), and Holgate or Martina will play ahead of Kenny.

Just hope Butland doesn't have a good game.

I am only a fan but even I know a cock-up when I see one. We have let Valencia go, too. The pressure is left on our young potential: Sandro; Lookman; Calvert-Lewin, to dig us out of this mess. We face Stoke tomorrow, a team that sends shudders up and down the spines of the top 4, never mind the top 6 or7.

Cue the media, has been professional footballers, deriding Everton as mid-table mediocre, at best. One small consolation is we still have Bark's, for a time. Our new young-blood goalie, Pickford will be like déjà vu, as he was with Sunderland last season, but this time a record number of shots on target with be against Everton. I think we'll struggle without a pacy striker to stay in the mid-table never mind the top 7.

I think Pickford was worth paying the 30 odd million for him; as now that lad will really have to prove his mettle. Let's hope our defence are up to much because, let's face it, we know Stoke's defence is virtually impenetrable

She took me by the hand down Scotland Road with my big blue and white rosette

We still have time to finish off our squad. We're overall stronger than last season, no matter what you think. We should have got a leading striker in, of course, but there is still time to rectify the situation. If, come September 1st and we're in the same boat, then I'll be jumping overboard with you. But right now? Come on, give them a break.

Mark (#33). Really sorry to hear that and I hope she's watching down on us tomorrow when we're smashing Stoke. :)

I think Shawcross and Kouma (possibly Indis too) will see off our powder puff attack with Butland mopping up anything that trickles through. As Arnautovic has gone I think Stoke are also lightweight upfront. Stoke the more likely team to score from a set piece.

I'd have liked to have seen Lookman start with his pace and guile constantly run at their giants, inevitably get knocked down by them and someone (Baines, Rooney ???) bang in a free kick resulting from one of those fouls.

A dour affair lost in the middle third.

We will do well to get a win tomorrow, is my opinion. Lukaku going has certainly weakened our attack, unless I'm in for a pleasant surprise.

I can see us finishing 7th or below unless we are substantially strengthened up front.

I also believe our squad is overall stronger than last season, sure with gaps but hopefully, we'll fill most of those. But people are writing us off after two semi-pre-season competitive games is just mind boggling, even for Evertonians.

I hope I am wrong on Rooney but I feel we could end up carrying him this season, whether his influence in the dressing room will outweigh this...only time will tell.

Defensively Pickford and Keane are improvements but evened out by the loss of Seamus, Williams being awful and Jags & Baines slowing down

In midfield Morgan has been awful throughout preseason and Europa League and the loss (not being played maybe?) of Davies hinders the dynamism of the whole team.

Klaassen is as yet lost and not a patch on however good or bad Barkley was; Sandro and Rooney do not equal a Lukaku.

As said, there is time to put it right but, as we sit, it has been a depressing window and we are weaker than last season.

I still think we will win.

I'm still waiting for the Schneiderlin we thought we were getting to turn up. Without Barry we have nobody to pass out from the back.

I'm thinking we might start with a back 3 so that both Davies and Gana can play. It would also allow Calvert-Lewin to play through the middle.

I'm guessing Walsh went to Italy to get some chianti. The most important position to fill was a replacement goal scorer...

Shopping List:
Milk
Angel Delight
Van Dijk
Mahrez
Giroud

The initial transfers were promising (probably inspired by Walsh), but later transfers started to show the weakness of Koeman. That his managerial capabilities don't inspire confidence was confirmed by the preseason (Walsh input Sandro being the exception, if played).

What we are left with is depleted attack, a mixed-up midfield, and a weak back line. Rooney in attack has reverted to his previous failed roles at Man Utd. (He will prove a defensive problem getting caught in possession. ) We have no centre-forward.

Barkley, who wants away, is now a requirement to inspire midfield. Sigurdsson may not happen and Gods knows how he would shape up if he did. Jags may be better than Williams (God help us) and up-and-coming players are being messed about. I hope the goalkeeper is good, he is going to need to be.

No top-four finish (never achievable in slow motion, resulting from no pace and Europa League flight fatigue) and calls for a new manager in January. Anything otherwise is delusional and I am not delusional.

Meanwhile we have gained Pickford, Keane, Klaassen, Sandro and Rooney, plus there's three weeks to go. Stoke are shit, Hughes is a knob and we'll win – so there!

Just heard the great news that Coutinho has handed in a transfer request!

We will score more goals than we did last season and Man Utd will score less.

Also could do with more pace in the starting line up as Stoke aren't the quickest.

I would swap Mirallas for Calvert-Lewin and try to inject more pace and experience. Sandro will be making his debut and Calvert-Lewin is still just a kid.

Schneiderlin, Gueye and Klaassen should mean we keep things tight but scratching my head as to where the goals are going to come from. Not holding my breath on Rooney rolling back the years.

One thing he's not lacking is confidence.

A bruising opener plus getting (probably) nowhere in the following 4 games isn't the best way to start his season off imo. Let him come on around the hour mark when the defenders are a bit tired and if things don't pan out for the team, he won't be the one being shouted at by the fans.

We'll smash these for Mark's mum.

3-0 to the blues.

At present we do not have anyone capable of scoring 25 goals per season against any opposition, shite or otherwise. Indeed it will be a welcome surprise if Rooney and Ramirez reach that total between them. As for the rest of the squad, we will be lucky if any of them get anywhere near double figures.

Unless a quality front-line striker arrives in the next three weeks, we will struggle for victories against most Premier League teams.

Where is the creativity and forward runs, and support to our lightweight front runners, going to come from?

Furthermore, where are the goals coming from?

I sincerely hope we are proved wrong tomorrow –both in team selection and the goal department.

I know it's early days, but with the fixtures we have ahead, this has got to be won.

Rooney, Sandro and Klaassen

I would like to see Rooney get one on his return home.

I think his premier league stats (against top 6) are something like 57 Games, 15 Goals, 9 Wins.

Are we really going to miss him that much?!

Where did we finish for the 2 seasons before with a combined 28 league goals and a total of 45 from him?
11th.

We're not totally buggered without him.

We have a Spanish striker who out scored Neymar last season and the Ajax & Man Utd former captains not to mention England's U20 World Cup winning forward plus bags of pace in Lookman.

Yes we need another striker & yes we need another left footed defender but with the points & performance differential last season to those who finished below us we're still looking ahead and not over our shoulders.

As for Stoke...Choupo Moting has a conversion rate comparable with Stuart Barlow, Crouch is a year older, they no longer have Walters or Arnautovic, Fletcher makes Barry look pacey, Xaquiri turns himself inside out , and if Zouma was the beast some believe he'd still be at Chelsea filling the gap Terry left.

The future is bright, well more royal blue with darker bluey bits under the arms anyway... Hey, and no more Chang, what's not to love, eh?

On the subject of the Blues we are all reacting to some pitiful preseason performances but we have to remember we were unbeaten throughout pre-season.

I am finding it as difficult as Koeman probably is to decide on our best team. Schneiderlin and Klaassen did not look impressive in preseason and a number of others looked average to say the least. I was concerned about Rooney's fitness and suitability for a team with top 4 ambitions but thought he looked a bit sharper against Seville so he is a definite starter. Jags and Bainsey know each others game inside out so I would start them. Gana would be one of the first names on the sheet for me so here goes with my pick:

Pickford
Martina Keane Jagielka Baines
Davies Gana Klaassen
Sandro Rooney Mirallas

With Lookman and Calvert-Lewin to come on second half and get the 3rd and 4th goals.

4-0 to the Blues to get us off to an optimistic start.

No, didn't think so... Potential banana skin here.

Holgate as right back and both Gueye and Schneiderlin is fine defensively. But we really struggle in creativity. Holgate offers nothing going forward and neither do Gueye and Schneiderlin.

Hopefully Baines has got a bit left of his offensive qualities. But either he is getting a big old or he misses a proper partner because he appears to have lost the last 10%. Likewise Williams is really poor in his passing. Keane looks much better but is still a classic center back.

So basically we leave all attacking to be between our 4 front men. No matter who is playing where if these four they are asked to perform miracles. When we fail to score or score just 1 after another match with slow build up, these 4 front men will be blamed. Rooney will be too old, Calvert-Lewin too young, Klaassen too Dutch and Sandro too something. In reality it is the tactical setup to blame in that case.

I really hope he plays another right back than Holgate and that he plays only one Schneiderlin and Gueye and then plays either Davies or Klaassen as the defensive midfield partner. In fact, he could also play Barry since his forward passing is excellent.

He would find the Premier League could handle his height easily, and then he's got nothing else. He's like a dinosaur from the 1970s.

Pickford, Kenny, Keane, Jagielka, Baines, Schneiderlin, Davies, Rooney, Mirallas, Sandro, Lookman.

Schneiderlin only starts ahead of Gueye because of his extra height as I'm worried about us defending set-pieces. Against the top 6 teams. Gueye would start as well. Personally think Klaassen needs integrating slowly and possibly as sub for Rooney.

At least that front 3 looks mobile but I wouldn't be playing it away from home. We're still desperate for a pacey striker and, as I keep saying, that would be Inaki Williams for me who also works hard.

Our defence has been vastly improved by the addition of Keane and Pickford. Our defensive midfield remains exactly the same but I think Klaassen will score more than Barkley's 5 league goals last season.

So we get to the sharp end, and the loss of Lukaku is great, have no doubt about it. Again with the but, BUT what do we really need to replace?

His hold up play and movement were not the best so it's his goals, 25 of them. Although that will be difficult I think Koeman's whole plan is to not replace them with a single player but shared out amongst the team.

Can Rooney, Sando & Siggurdsson (if we get him) score 8 or 9 each? It's not beyond the realms of possibility in my mind. Add in another striker who can bang in 10 and we're suddenly looking at a positive comparison...

I love the optimism of the predicted 3- or 4-nil wins but let's be honest, we may not have 3 or 4 total by the time we play our 6th game.

I'm praying I'm wrong, but unless we strengthen the squad soon, I can see us struggling. But I guess being a lifelong Everton fan, this isn't exactly alien to me.

That being said, I'll hope for the best, like every season, and cheer the boys on regardless. COYB

But you feel the more this guy gets told something, the more stubborn and determined he becomes not to follow the popular consensus, he'd rather play a young centre half at right back, than a young right back at right back,...because it was his choice – whether it's for the good of the team or not, that appears to be irrelevant.

Pickford

Kenny
Keane
Williams (better in the air than jags I feel so better for those lumbering stoke beasts)
Baines

Gana (more mobile than Schneiderlin who I think has had an unimpressive pre season).
Davies for his energy
Rooney

Sandro out right wing
Calvert-Lewin
Lookman to terrorize their slow turning defenders

We will be a bit narrow but we aren't going to be getting crosses in so its quick feet and passes around their 18-25 yard line that I would hope does for them.

Anyway, heart says 3-0, head says a scrappy, uninspiring 1-0 with the ball going in off Rooney's arse.

Pickford, Kenny, Jagielka, Keane, Baines, Barry, Davies, Klaassen, Rooney, Sandro, Calvert-Lewin.

Given Koeman does not seem to want to play Kenny, I would prefer Holgate to the other options.

I'd also replace Barry with Schneiderlin after an hour.

Still, for anyone waiting to talk about 'worst start ever', here's a few first day shockers:

1975: Coventry 1-4
1978: Forest 1-3 (no-one thought they were going to win the league)
1984: Spurs 1-3 (punctured first day optimism after winning the cup)
0-1 Palace. Can't remember the year, Bilic scored a disallowed early debut goal, we lost to a dreadful Palace side.
1-6 Arsenal. Lescott. Oh dear.

Hope that cheered everyone up. We'll win tomorrow!

Holgate only got half a game last weekend so I guess 'our leader' will opt for his former Saint's lummox to get the gig. After all, he knows his qualities.

He's made two substitute appearances for us. His only lengthy first team experience is in League 2 on loan to Oxford. A lot of his reputation at this point comes from playing successfully in the U-20 World Cup. But let's remember the "U-20" part of that.

That's not to say he's a bad player, or that he won't be a good or great player for us. But it's not like Koeman is just wilfully overlooking some completely unquestionable claim for a first team place.

Pickford
Holgate Keane Williams Baines
Gueye/Schneiderlin
Davies .Klaassen .Rooney Lookman / Mirallas
Calvert-Lewin

I don't like us playing with 2 defensive midfielders's as I think it makes us too defensive. One is enough and I don't care which one. I go with Williams and Holgate because we will need all the height we can get.

I'm pretty positive. I don't see any reason we can't win.

About the game, I really hope we can start with a win of any kind to dispel some of the negativity on here. I agree that our pre-season has been uninspiring but we have got better defensive cover and nobody can match the support that the Goodison Park crowd and our overall support brings. Let's get behind the lads. COYB

In this case, one "young buck" would be getting blooded at the expense of another, also not signed by Koeman or Walsh, in Holgate.

Players 23 and under last season who weren't signed by Koeman made 56 league appearances. Players who were signed by Koeman made 19 league appearances.

I'm delighted to encourage "our own". Define that. Is Mason Holgate our own, or do we just ignore anyone who was signed from anywhere except school? And does encouragement equate to demanding their selection, or simply wanting to see them succeed and integrate into the team at an appropriate point?

Kenny
Jagielka
Keane
Baines

Schneiderlin
Davies
Klaassen

Rooney
Sandro
Calvert-Lewin

Vastly is stretching it somewhat Andy I'd say, maybe a little stronger.

Our defence was pretty solid last season, the reason we trailed the top 5 teams was mainly because we didn't score enough goals.

With the players we have at the moment, I'm struggling to see how we are going to score as many as last season, a season in which we were 15 to 20 goals short!

I may be wrong but I think his scoring percentage overall was excellent and probably similar to Tony Cottee in both respects.

I was at that game. Back in those days, it seemed Everton didn't lose at home to newly promoted teams on Day 1 of the season. The brilliance of Brian Clough.

Well, multi task wingers like Tricky or Sheeds, Curran lasted a few games but he got the crowd going. What a tache and perm. I'm sure he turned up in Brookie a couple of years later!

I think his best quote ever was "I'm not saying I'm the best manager in England but I think I'm in the top one."

Having said that, I suspect we shall again start the season without a single Academy graduate in the team which will hardly say much for this much vaunted establishment, will it?

As far as Holgate, Stones, Lookman and Calvert-Lewin are concerned, they only bear out my belief that, if you want to be an Everton first-teamer you don't do your apprenticeship here!

Very relevant when getting a centre-forward to replace Rom, Costa/Kane types, Yes; Benteke types, No thanks!

I think we'll start with Davies on Saturday, which means at least one Academy graduate (well, technically two, as Rooney will also start) in the first team. We've had at least one Academy graduate make 20+ league appearances every season for more than the past decade (Hibbert, Osman, Barkley). That's actually pretty outstanding in terms of consistent success for an Academy providing first-team players.

On Holgate, Lookman, Stones, etc...while I take your point, I think that's the nature of the game these days. Academies don't just look at the local area; promising youngsters are identified and bought at a much earlier age, before they've fully broken into other first teams. Still better that, and to "home grow" them from an earlier stage, than to not.

'Pass me that newspaper,' said the great man, pointing to the Daily Mirror which he carefully laid on the floor.

'Now stand on it' was the order -– which was immediately carried out. 'Right, young man, that's the only raise you're going to get – so bugger off!'

I see Liverpool are getting loyalty problems with Couthino. Surely it's time to look at ending long contracts and stamping out these greedy players and their greedy agents?

More worrying is the buy back clauses on players that the selling club aren't sure will make it and 'lend' to the buying club.

Thats not a transfer but a glorified loan

Yes, we need to be honest and realistic about where we stand right now in relation to the so-called 'big clubs'. But when was the last time we went into a new season with so many new signings already under our belt? When was the last time we weren't scrabbling around on the last day of the transfer window trying to pick up other clubs' rejects on a loan? And importantly, when was the last time we had a management team with a clear and ambitious vision for the future of our club with the resources to finance it?

When Koeman was appointed manager I remember reading a post here by someone that went something along the following lines regarding his plans for 'the project'.

'Season 1: steady a seriously unstable ship;
Season 2: start building a squad in line with the manager's vision;
Season 3: push on to break into the top four.'

At the time I thought that was an astute observation. And I honestly believe it still stands. This is work in progress. Progress like we really, seriously haven't seen for nearly three long decades.

So here's a word or two of advice from an old fart who's been a Blue for more than half a century – a half century which has included some wonderful highs and some seemingly eternal lows. Please, just get behind your team and stop being so effing negative. COYB!

Just as a matter of interest, have you seen Kenny play a lot or just the fleeting minutes in the first team? If you have seen him a few times, how do you rate him?

The one thing we have in common: everyone's dying for tomorrow's game to kick off...

Umm.

Well he could be good?

Francis blurted out that he very much was, when Cloughie leant forward and unsmilingly said, "If selected, young man!"

The look on Francis's face! And bugger hurt feelings.

I would sacrifice the entertainment for top four, But I can't see any way of that happening.

You can still get 12/1 with Black Type on oddschecker for them to finish top six. Decent bet.

I want to see Sandro and Calvert-Lewin start up top and I want to see Davies playing midfield and then I will fancy us to get something from the game!

I'd play a 4-1-3-2:

Pickford
Baines, Jagielka, Keane, Holgate
Schneiderlin
Gueye, Rooney, Davies
Sandro, Calvert-Lewin

Klaassen doesn't deserve a start on watching his first few performances; Rooney knows what's required in Premier League!

It is all about opinions; just because I think Jonjoe is ready and good enough doesn't mean that he is. My udgement is based on watching the lad over the last three or four years, agreed mostly in the youth and U23s, but he looks to me he is well deserving of a chance to prove how good he is.

Not to be at least on the bench tomorrow is a bit depressing to me; I don't know how it feels to Jonjoe.

My argument isn't that he isn't good enough. But rather that 90% of the people making a big deal of how it's terrible that he isn't playing have –like me – really seen very little of him play.

What a game this is!

I honestly think he has earned his chance, because of his ability and, in the absence of Seamus, he is entitled to prove it.

At this stage of his career, he is twenty, to be in the position of being third choice behind a reserve centre back and a free transfer who couldn't get a regular game at his previous club is below the belt to me. The future will prove whether he should be playing now rather than waiting for his chance.

Hope we've made big strides since last week. We looked some way behind those two teams in terms of fitness and sharpness.

I suspect that we haven't bought a striker yet because we have been waiting for Giroud to make up his mind. Move on. He's not leaving.

Many think that the next evolution in football transfers is coming. Not so much of a revolution but normality with the freedom of movement.

Actually, a player should be able to give notice at any time in their contract as per a regular employee. If that's 6 months then fine etc.

Otherwise its pretty close to trafficking as you suggest. But it's their registration they hold right? They can leave but can't play!

As prices have no relation to the the players ability and are just the supply/demand market value, it has to end. Because eventually like Bosman, someone will get so fed up it goes to court. Its a cycle I guess, but it has a rather distasteful side to it all.

Another lad who I have seen play who I reckon has got what it takes to make it is Baningime but I'd be premature to be pushing for his inclusion in the first team right now.

No player, as far as I'm aware, has ever been forced to sign a lucrative contract against his will!

People who are trafficked have no contract, are subject to threats and earn little or no money! Not your typical footballer!

If footballers want freedom to move as they wish, then they should also accept freedom for clubs to terminate their contracts too but they don't. That is why Niasse continues to get £50/60 grand a week.

And it benefits the employee, guaranteeing them that salary if they have a devastating injury or if they just turn out to be not as good as originally thought.

Agree with you Beni Banginime is a great prospect and one for the future. Beni is 18, Jonjoe is 20 and ready now.

Long-term contracts protect the player against injury and being dropped. They agree terms of contract freely and when push comes to shove get their move if they want it anyway.

At the top they live a gilded existence and to compare it to people trafficking is as about as obscene as the rewards that these young men get.

I'm made up with Everton's crop of youngsters, but the thing with winners is they usually don't give a fuck for anyone, so if we are not careful with how these kids are treated, then I'm sure they won't give a fuck for the people that are in charge, and we might be the losers in the end?

Darren, 12/1 might have just gone out a bit, but I think,that would be a really sensible bet anyway, simply because Leicester are,definitely one of the most competitive teams in the league.

When you sign a contract, be it 2, 3 or even 10 years, then that is the deal you sign into.

If Everton Football Club believe you are worth £60k a year for 5 years, then put that piece of paper on the table and ask you to sign it, then who is at wrong? It most definitely is not Niasse.

Let's leave other players out – arguments that do not involve them.

I hear the dark side are looking at Aubameyang, Costa, Sanchez and Lewandowski as potential targets, but who are we looking at?

As for today, I hope we get a great win to start this Premier League campaign.

He's making Moyes look chipper, I'm just waiting for the "knife to a gunfight comment" when we play Man City!

The only reason we managed 7th last season is because we had several soft games earlier on; this season we do not have that safety cushion. It was therefore football suicide to get rid of Lukaku (£75-90 million) as it should have been foreseeable that it would lead to hyper inflation, where every striker is temporarily valued at least £20 million more than their actual value.

Every game this season will be a struggle more likely than not... as we can only stop so many goal attempts without proven on-form strikers.

I dare say a player could leave a club but that club retain his license/registration. That's the bit that is perverse. You might say players are complicit in the whole thing, as both parties get very rich from it.

Don't care, plenty of mega earning people have contracts and civil way to dissolve them in place. Footballers and sportsman sit outside of this.

Clubs survive off television money to run their club, use the crazy transfer system & dodgy commercial deals to generate profit outside of those regulations such as Premier League Sustainability and FFP that they have no need to sell and effectively tie a player the club.

In the past, there were other reasons why a player might move on. Under these circumstances, a player is effectively trapped. He cannot work were he wants unless his 'Bondsman' says so.

Trafficking? No. Provocative? Yes... but restraint of trade? Deffo!

Don't be too quick to write us off – we may surprise a few top teams this season. COYB!!

By no means an easy start. If all goes tits up, we could enter October bottom of the league with 2/3 points.

But ever the optimist, I see this as a real opportunity. Liverpool last season started with tough games at Arsenal, Spurs and Chelsea and this was the catalyst to their (albeit short lived) title challenge and Champions League qualification.

the target should be 10 points from these five games, and I believe victory at Stoke is a given (while we can complain at some of our deficiencies, if we were in Stoke's boots we'd be much more pessimistic – lost best player, little investment, ended last season in woeful form, Mark Hughes).

So seven from the other 4 games, essentially 2 wins and a draw. Doable. Spurs could be stagnant. Man Utd under Mourinho are worth a point at least. Chelsea, who knows how the morale is. And Man City, well Guardiola is over-rated, and their keeper is suspect. We are not doomed.

New Season! We all start with the same points.

Lookman and Davies are gonna take the Premier League by storm. Sandro is gonna rip up the league. Rooney gonna find that fire and find his form. Klassen is gonna be like a Dutch Lampard and score from all over the place. Pickford is gonna be such a wall that Trump will try and buy him to patrol the Mexican border, and Keane is the new Terry.

It's the first game of the season. Football is supposed to be fun. Let's be optimistic

Come On You Blues!

Maybe you should give Koeman a pep talk too ;)

Koeman forgot football was fun 20 years ago. He is already managing expectation and telling the world how difficult it's going to be to make the next step.

£85 million for a striker who (to be fair to him) gave plenty of notice he was leaving... and Koeman spends a fraction of it on a replacement.

I said weeks ago that he wasn't paying enough attention to attack; I got shouted down. I'm saying it again at the start of the season and will get shouted down again. I will still be saying it when the window closes.

As football lovers, we want to see players do things with a ball that we can't/couldn't do ourselves, we want to see invention, guile, imagination... He's spelling it out for you before the gates have even opened.

I'm praying I'm wrong about Rooney and he does still have plenty of life left in his legs. Natural-born footballers will always rise above dour negative tactics.

They clearly do have a choice. They choose to enter into a situation where their registration is held by a club for a defined period of time in exchange for extraordinary amounts of money.

They can choose not to do that at any time. They don't though, just as I wouldn't.

I do wonder whether a player could propose a clause in their contract that says they can move where they want in any window? They'd have to accept that their wages would drop substantially but some teams might go for it on that basis.

Pickford
Holgate Jagielka Keane
Davies Gana Baines
Sandro Rooney Klaassen
Calvert-Lewin

Davies, Gana, Baines offer additional protection when Stole are attacking, and they initiate the attacks when they get the ball – Davies down the right flank, Baines down the left, and Gana down the middle. Sandro, Rooney, Klaassen and Calvert-Lewin offer enough pace, guile, interchangeability and attacking diversity to trouble the Stoke defence. Dead ball threats will come from Baines and Rooney.

Impact subs would be Schneiderlin and McCarthy to see out the game if we are leading, Mirallas and Lookman to break a deadlock situation.

Yes, you are right we should have got a good striker in, but you always forget there is still time for that to happen. Maybe we had one or two lined up but they didn't pan out? Who knows?

But if we were on Sept 1st, then absolutely your posts will have some merit. Whatever your opinion of Koeman, he is no mug. He knows we need a striker. But I have a feeling unless we get in Ronaldo or Suarez or Mbappe you'll be on here moaning about the striker we brought in any way! Then again, even with all of those 3, you'll find some thing to whinge about.

I have my worries too. I'm a little bit nervous about the season. I'm nervous about Koeman's ability; however, I feel optimistic & excited as we seem to have bought pretty well and we can hopefully push on.

You have been to over 1,000 games but you also seem to hate everything Everton or Koeman do, why do you bother? If something made me as miserable as Everton / Koeman obviously do with you, I would find something more enjoyable to do with my time.

Wind your neck in with judging other Evertonians. It's getting old.

Everton made a mistake in signing him but they are contractually bound to pay him for the duration of his contract. He is protected because of this.

If footballers want to have freedom to move as and when they see fit, then maybe the price they pay is to lose the contractual protection afforded to them in return?

I don't have a problem with you, David. I agree with a lot of what you say. I also agree with the odd thing Darren says but when he starts talking like that, then well, this is a forum where I can defend Fran, myself or anyone else I see fit. And in my opinion, Darren deserves to be questioned as such.

Also one question to you, David. What other Evertonians have I 'judged'? If I disagree with an opinion over the team/tactics/manager/etc I'll say it. If I agree, I say it. I rarely make it personal or judgemental.

Been doing that for over 50 years before this manager got here and I will be doing it when he's gone. No manager has stopped me doing this – and we have had a few beauts down the years – nor will any dumb-arsed post from somebody who can't quite understand the difference between loving the club and criticising a manager you feel is very wrong for it.

Full of optimism for the new season, glass is always half-full for this Blue... otherwise, what is the point?

Looking forward to the game with the usual butterflies even after all these years.

COYB

But I too remember some god awful managers and players. I was also a season ticket holder for over 10 years. I share the amount of love you have for this club.

Unfortunately living in Australia now means my Goodison days are now few and far between but I'll be watching, and raising a beer to the team when Z-Cars ring out. And I'll be bloody excited and positive about it too!

COYB!!

You say Koeman is managing expectation, but I don't see it like that. I think he's simply holding the board to the promises that were undoubtedly made when he signed his contract and I find that refreshing.

You say he's dour and, yes, I too struggle with two holding midfielders but he's changed a culture where players weren't even fit enough to complete a game and where many were not giving 100%. With time and the right backing from the board, he'll have a wonderful team. The fact he doesn't carry passengers is a bonus.

You seem to complain in every string that you're being "shouted down"... you are not. You're being disagreed with by considerable numbers of respondents. That's all.

The deal with being a contrarian is that the majority of people will argue against your minority viewpoint. You embrace that contrarian role – hell, you give it big wet kisses – and then you complain about feeling persecuted when you get the expected response. And let's face it, you're frequently less than generous with your assessments of those who disagree with you ("baying handful" comes to mind).

So please stop portraying yourself as being under siege. Ain't happening.

Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Yeah we all shine on
On and on and on on and on.

The point you and your ilk appear to be missing is that responses to Darren (and others who criticise Koeman) is invariably tainted with ad-hominem... you know, classic phrases like "whining", "negativity" "hating Koeman"... "Contrarian" etc. Only yesterday you went on the offensive about the number of games he's been at, resulting in a fairly cringeable U-turn.

Here's a helpful rule of thumb, if you can't (or don't want to) address the points he's making about Koeman, then don't respond. Darren clearly doesn't have a problem engaging with and responding to points which are "contrary" to his... (He is not the only entrenched position in this argument about Koeman.)

Hopefully we'll see a cracking display today and the resulting match thread will be a veritable orgy of joy. Personally I can't see it myself. Underprepared, lacking in crucial personnel and a manager whose abilities are up for sensible and reasoned debate.

Contrary to the popular view on here, there aren't that many of them. That means that they can pick and choose clubs, which means that it'll probably go close to deadline day.

People's distaste for Martinez blinded them to the fact that our squad needed a wrecking ball. Their distaste for 'shit' Lukaku blinded them to the fact that if top strikers grow on trees, its a very rare tree. I suspect we have looked/asked about plenty of strikers, who will be a very expensive gamble or will be taking Giroud's view; looking at their options near the end of the window.

Koeman will have failed if he doesn't bring at least one decent striker in, but these are the hardest players to find and I'm not expecting them to be banging on the gates at Finch Farm yet.

Don't do whining, don't do "being persecuted" would allow myself to be a victim. Some people will engage and argue against the points I raise about the manager, I enjoy that.

Then there are some who don't have an argument and will simply get upset because I criticise him. They are the shouter downers, just because they don't succeed, doesn't mean they don't try.

Can we get back to talking about the match?

Long time coming but now the snow is gone.

Anyway, as Darren said, let's get back to the game. I'm personally going for a 4-1 win, Rooney hat-trick and a tactical masterclass from Koeman. And we'll all be asking 'who needs a striker?' COYB!!!

Nothing wrong with dreams, George, we all have them, especially daydreams. I wasn't too fussy on Blanche du Bois, all she seemed to do was dream, got to have a bit of action with your dreams, George.

Then again, I'm dreaming we are going to have a much better season starting today. Will we?

I thought that the whole point of ToffeeWeb is that it provides a forum where we CAN all argue with the likes of Darren, who is a bit of a Pantomime villain on here... or is it a Pantomime Dame?... whatever, it would be a duller place if we couldn't get a bit red in the face and all General Melchett now and again when Darren gives Koeman some stick.

Darren out!

Gonna get a lift home in a minute and get ready to go to my second home, which always brings a little tear to my eye, on special occasions, simply because of how much Everton football club, means to me.

I'm not dreaming though, honestly not expecting that much, and just playing with a bit of drive and pace, will do for me right now, and might even help give me time to reminisce, which is what going to Goodison for the start of a new season always makes me do.

I will think about the characters, that are no longer with us, and hope that the team, makes us proud! COME ON YOU FUCKIN BLUE BOYS!!!

This is my final post of the day. I shall spend the rest of it drinking shite watered down beer on a Brazilian Beach, telling ALL the Brazilians that Everton are better than Manchester City and How we're gonna Win the league, bofore finding a dodgy stream to watch us Put 7 past stoke.

Fuck opinions. Fuck our obvious problems. Fuck the debate about por manager. Its the First day of the season. Let Optimism reign!

We've got 9 months to moan. For at least one day, let's be positive.

As

Phil Walling is to Martinez

As

Tony Marsh is to Moyes

Solve the equation.

Bon Voyage my friends.

I went to watch a Tyson fight in Las Vegas with the lads. Top hotel, great bars (including The Crazy Horse) best of everything. One lad with us moaned every morning for the full week about the state of the bacon at breakfast.

It's in some people's nature to be miserable even in the best of circumstances, other people's nature to be happy in the worse circumstances. That's life.

You could put Miss World on a plate for them and it old be "I'm not going near that, the fuckin state of her earrings!" 😀

It's a grand old team to play for, it's a grand old team to support .

PS - Rave on George!

It is not Koeman 's fault that we have not been able to get our striker targets up to now. We still have a slim chance but letting Lukaku go without suitable replacement/s was not negligible but negligent.

I've got a tenner on him scoring 4...

You didn't read all of the posts?

Read your post at 195 three times.
It got better every time.

Onwards and upwards COYB

Up the Blues!

And the thing about moaners is, everyone of them I've met, they all have a brilliant smile, they just don't do it often enough.

Anyway, seventh of 20 is nigh top third and thus my glass is two thirds full. And I'm no pessimist. Just a realist who over nearly 60 years has learned to be so.

A point today will be a good start.

"And the thing about moaners is, everyone of them I've met, they all have a brilliant smile, they just don't do it often enough".

Imagine my smile behind that!

However, the Stoke game represents a significant opportunity for our current crop of forwards to stake their claims for a first team spot. Against the Stoke back four, perm any three from the five of Rooney, Sandro, Mirallas, Calvert-Lewin, and Lookman, and they could have a field day if we keep the ball on the deck and our midfield players fire up.

Personally I hope we start with a front three of Sandro, Rooney, and Mirallas. I think Rooney's experience will stand us in good stead for this particular game.

Jobs and reputations are on the line both on and off the field as the rewards can be financial windfalls. We all feel the passion and a decent start is what we wish for.

Hopefully the atmosphere and the impetus will be there from the first whistle and they beat one of the most boring teams in the Premiership.

COYB.

Dave, A gang of the greatest Evertonians and men you could ever meet went under the name of "The Groaners". Fantastic company non better a pleasure to be in their company so I take your point.

You know the lads anyway.

It would be fabulous if the team gels for the 90 odd minutes and we find a way of getting some goals today.

It is a tough job against Stoke and the realist in me suggests a draw is likely, but whatever happens it is our first chance to see how this team deal with a proper game.

We will learn more today about our hopes for the new season than from any of the warm-ups and Europa ties.

Koeman must be as anxious as the rest of us to get in a good front man.

I wonder if the pace of Sandro and the guile of Rooney will be able to open the door against the Stoke bouncers?

Nearly 3 months without league football. Opening day of the season. First game at Goodison. New signings aplenty. Everyone starting on equal footing.

If you didn't wake up this morning with a tingle in the bones in anticipation of the game, when can you?

Put the razors away and save the slit wrists for now.

At least --- until around 5pm.

Gerinto 'em!

COYB!

I would take a 1-0 today for us, scored in the 9th minute of injury time at the game's end.