Moshiri: We are executing a multi-year plan

Tuesday 9 January 2018  167 Comments  [Jump to last]

Everton's major shareholder and de facto owner, Farhad Moshiri has spoken of his confidence that the club are making significant progress on what he sees as a long road to getting the Blues back to their place among the elite of the English game.

Speaking in a rare video interview at Finch Farm, the Iranian-born billionaire shared his thoughts on the recent setbacks to his vision for Everton created by the team's unexpectedly poor start to the season and his determination to deliver a new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock, the new cost projection for which is now £500m.

The interview was released on evertonfc.com against the backdrop of the Annual General Meeting of Shareholders at the Liverpool Philharmonic Hall this evening where CEO Robert Elstone reaffirmed the Board's desire to complete construction of a new stadium by 2022-23.

“We had a very difficult start to the season. I don't deny it; it was a shock for me,” Moshiri admitted.

“After the very good season we had last year and the heavy expenditure, expectations were high. The fixture list was bad, we didn't have a proper pre-season, we had the [early start in the Europa League] but still the team didn't appear to have a shape.

“So we had to take action. Now the team is performing much better.”

'We have to have a [new] stadium and we will'

Moshiri talked about having a plan that will take a number of years to fully execute and one which began with investment in the playing staff and the infrastructure that supports it.

He cited the new deal with USM at Finch Farm, the sleeve sponsorship agreement with Rovio for Angry Birds, and suggested that more arrangements along those lines were in the pipeline.

“We have invested quite heavily in infrastructure. What you see is the visible part — buying — but there is an awful lot going on behind the scenes to make success sustainable.

“The commercial side is developing really well. There are a lot of other sponsorships which are coming in.

“On the stadium we have [also] made great progress. We have to have a [new] stadium and we will have a stadium. When the building work starts, that will be the proof of the pudding so we want to get to that stage.

“But until we get to that, we are in the preparation stage but we are progressing well. We have secured the land which is the most essential [part], we've picked the [site] that we think the fans would prefer.

“It's an iconic thing, something that Everton needs,” Moshiri continued, perhaps hinting at a desire to unveil a ground superior to Anfield, “to have a better stadium — and that's what we have to do.”

'We need to fight'

“I think the first part of the exercise is to make the team competitive so that the owner, the Board, the fans and the employees can be proud of the team,” he said. “We need to fight; we are not here just to make up the numbers. We need to fight in every game.

“Our home record must be strong and the stadium must be a fortress. [In that respect] the design helps us.

“We have a multi-year plan. There will be bumps on the road [but] the plan is intact and we will resolutely go through that plan to achieve it and there will be investment everywhere.

“An enormous amount of work is needed just to retain the status quo; to move above that will require extraordinary effort — whether it's effort from me, the Board, our recruitment [team] and also from the fans to work with us, understand where we are.

“I've put my had in my pocket, you know. I am the end of the chain. After that the whole process needs to ensure that the investment is used in the right way. We have taken all the steps to make sure we are efficient.

“We've made mistakes — everybody does — but no single step will derail us. We are on a road and we'll get there."  


Reader Comments (167)

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Will Mabon
1 Posted 09/01/2018 at 20:17:33
Thanks, but personally, I'll continue judging the actions. Retaining the status quo incidentally, requires retaining the best players.
Derek Knox
2 Posted 09/01/2018 at 20:23:11
Will, I agree but that is where these 'agents' are a scourge; they tout a player via the media; and then get in his head; about it being the best move etc.

Let's face it contracts mean very little these days; and as for loyalty; forget it?

Peter Laing
3 Posted 09/01/2018 at 20:31:39
Ross Barkley really is a snake, judging by Moshiri's comments tonight.
David Barks
4 Posted 09/01/2018 at 21:18:46
Total and complete nonsense. Do not forget for one second, in regard to Moshiri’s claim of “the heavy expenditure” or the Summer, that has the sales of Barkley and Niasse gone through on deadline day there would have been a negative net spend.

This Summer, the club sold Lukaku, Deulofeu, Barkley, Niasse and let Barry go. There plans were scuttled due to Barkley rejecting the move and Niasse’s deal failing due to agents fees.

Heavy expenditures? Please. Reading between the lines, it sounds to me that we have to wait until 2022 until we see the team we need. In other words, cutting costs to fund the stadium. That’s what I’m reading.

Will Mabon
5 Posted 09/01/2018 at 21:20:27
Agents are a problem Derek, but others have battled them successfully. Can't always stop the process but it would be nice to see some realistic effort!
Victor Jones
7 Posted 09/01/2018 at 21:38:57
e are on a road "and we will get there". That's what I've been saying since about the mid 1960s. And apart from a few very good seasons, I'm still saying all that. We are still on that road. And its getting bloody longer.

Promises... promises... promises. The roads that we have all been promised that will be travelled. Mainly in recent years. And all have had the engine stall at the start. The bloody start.

We just don't get things right. We just muddle along. Do just about enough. But not really enough. That's our Everton. Always falling short.

Anyhow, I sort of believe Moshiri. What else can you do. We just have to believe in what he says. He is this last link in the chain after all. In Moshiri we trust. Not really any other choice.

And he did get shot of Koeman. The old regime would still be dithering over that decision.

And although this has been a shit season. The threat of relegation is now eased. Bar a collapse. We are safe for another year. And we have a new forward on board. Untested yes. But it's a start. So we are on a road. Just like Bob Hope and Bing Crosby once were. Let's hope ours doesn't turn out to be a comedy. But still entertaining . Entertaining and successful.

Can Moshiri deliver? Who knows? But we have to just hope that he can... Up The Toffees. Moshiri's road-running Toffees.

Conor Skelly
8 Posted 09/01/2018 at 21:44:22
Great interview by Moshiri. Came across as honest, level headed, pragmatic and realistic while also sounding determined and ambitious. Why should he throw millions of his hard-earned money around? He's spent a lifetime accumulating it and why should he personally bankroll a football team in the Northwest of England.

Farhad Moshiri is a business man. He is here to make Everton a bigger business than when he found it. Some of the biggest companies in the world have been turned around by smart people running them.

Look at Steve Jobs reviving Apple. A company of firsts that was becoming a relic and being left behind (sound familiar). Now the largest company in the world.

Similar thing happened with Disney. In the 80's Disney looked fucked. Enter Roy Disney (Walt's nephew) and boom. Disney now by far the largest media conglomerate in the world.

Everton are an Apple and a Disney. Pioneers that are synonyms with their respective industries. Like Apple and Disney, we've spent 30 years almost going out of business. And like those two companies we can be brought back to the glory days with a top business man in charge.

Moshiri is a top business man and one of the most revered accountants in the world. I think we are in good hands. It'll take time and there are no guarantees but that's the fun of it. The not knowing, The journey etc.

The abuse some quarters give him and even Kenwright is actually a bit sad. I'd laugh if it were kids but we have full adult men, none of who are in a position to pay the wages of an apprentice, never mind a Rooney criticize the business acumen of somebody that could, if they wanted tomorrow buy your company out and turn it into a walk-in wardrobe.

Tony Sullivan
9 Posted 09/01/2018 at 21:54:21
I agree to a large extent with what Conor Skelly says. It seems to me that – no matter what Moshiri does or says – for some on here, it will never be good enough.
Bill Watson
10 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:08:28
David (#4):

Moshiri has injected £150m interest free with no pay back time thus releasing the club from onerous mortgages and interest charges. That seems like pretty heavy expenditure to me.

He's also restructuring the commercial side of the club which has been a shambles for as long as I can remember.

I'm not sure exactly what it is you want.

Liam Reilly
11 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:11:16
Well said, Conor; I think we've the right man on board. He's not got the Arab wealth but he does have a plan to regenerate the club and indeed some of the City.

I may be in the minority but I'd be willing to bet that history will look back favourably on his time at Everton.

Ray Robinson
12 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:15:57
Skimming across various posts, we've got Allardyce is useless, Kenwright's a fraud, Moshiri's a Kenwright Mk II, and Barkley's a traitor. And I thought I was cynical!

Of course, there's justification for some of this negativity but so many of these stances are based on pure prejudice and speculation. You've got to see some light at the end of the tunnel surely – else, why bother carrying on supporting the club?

Drew O'Neall
13 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:17:57
The expression is ‘the proof of the pudding is in the eating' and it pisses me off when people say ‘the proof is in the pudding' which means nothing and as for ‘when the building works start that will be the proof of the pudding' – well, that's just plum duff!
John Crawley
14 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:18:51
First lesson for following Everton is to ignore everything that is said and just focus on what actually happens.

So far, no ambition showed on the playing side, the scouting/backroom & player recruitment has continued to go backward, there is no clear structure in place, no strategic vision on how we are going to play/achieve success & the failed people from Kenwright's regime are mainly still in place.

Conor Skelly
15 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:20:46
You build the stadium then, Drew. Don't have the money? Then find investment. Don't have the credit? Then find private investors. Don't have that type of Social capital? Then pipe down.
Derek Knox
16 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:21:50
Yes, Peter @3, Barkley did speak with forked tongue; hopefully the truth will out and expose those concerned.

Where large sums of money are involved; you can bet your bottom dollar; that some greedy individual will sniff it out; and manipulate the situation to their advantage.

The irony is, they are on Monopoly money anyway, and still want more.

Brian Williams
17 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:35:20
Conor you're wasting your time mate. Some people just can't wait to put their own club down. They belittle, decry and denounce no matter what's said.

No wonder the RS call us "the bitters."

David Barks
18 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:40:41
Conor,

Are you suggesting that, unless we own the club, that we are not allowed to have a say? Moderators, is that what this site is all about?

Tony Abrahams
19 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:45:09
Moshiri, has come to build a stadium, I just hope he achieves his aim.

Brian, they call us bitter because they love to deflect, get on them mate, they fuckin hate anyone who won’t give them their own way.

Conor Skelly
20 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:47:10
David.

Nobodies stopping you having a say. I’ve had mine and you’re calling on MK and LL to moderate it. There’s a word for that. Starts with an I and rhymes with moronic.

Colin Glassar
21 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:53:48
Jesus Conor, pipe down mate. Everyone’s got an opinion and a right to express it. Just because Moshiri is rich you don’t have to be so deferential Jeeves.

I agree with you that he sounds like he wants to do a good job for Everton but that doesn’t mean the poor, huddling masses don’t have a right to question his lordship.

David Barks
22 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:54:14
Conor,

No, I didn't ask for them to moderate you. You said "Don't have that type of Social capital? Then pipe down." Clearly stating that unless you are one of the owners who would be building the stadium then we should, quote, "pipe down".

Funny, it's actually you telling others to shut up, and then when questioned about that, you cry censorship. Well done. I was simply asking if telling those of us without the money to build a football stadium to "pipe down" with our questions about the owners of this club was reflecting what this site is all about. Simple really.

Kunal Desai
23 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:55:36
I would ask him right so if we are moving into a new stadium then what are the milestones to be achieved year on year. What is the expected target for years 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5. Telling us 5 years is like plucking a number out of thin air.

Bramley-Moore Dock has been the proposed site for well over a year, why do we still not yet have any top line sketches/drawings to at least indicate that the motions are in place and the wheels are turning slowly. 2022? Just somehow don't think so.

Soren Moyer
24 Posted 09/01/2018 at 22:59:13
Come on man! Do you think we are stupid? After selling Lukaku et al and pocketing TV money, how much have you spent on players? Unbelievable!
Mike Keating
25 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:09:24
My good friend offered me a ticket for the hospitality suite at Anfield for the cup game. The Cossack clad Bimbos on the escalators were a joke but I have to admit, we are streets behind them in terms of a stadium.
Derek Thomas
26 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:18:36
Conor; As I own a number of Clubs, I'll feel free to comment...

My favourite is the 4 iron.

Ray Robinson
27 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:19:52
Let us assume that Moshiri is telling the truth about wanting to build the stadium (I may be gullible but I know do), then how much money do you think that we can reasonably afford to plough into buying players?

We are not going to compete with Man City, Chelsea, Man Utd and Liverpool overnight – it's going to take time. Probably, nothing will really change until we have the new stadium.

It's a delicate line to be drawn. Yes we have above all to preserve our Premier League status – better still close the gap on the top 6 but don't expend mega bugs being spent on players until the stadium has materialised.

Arsenal are a good example of how money spent on players has had to be reined in while an expensive ground has been built and paid off. Some fans seem to want us to spend huge amounts on transfers and new ground – well, unless you've got unlimited wealth on the scale of Man City, that's never going to happen.

Give Moshiri some credit for tackling the ground issue while at least trying to keep us reasonably competitive in the transfer market.

The alternative is to blow the money on building up the team now but remaining in our antiquated, no longer fit-for-purpose current home.

Mike Price
28 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:26:28
Every time I see costs escalate, I can't help but revisit the Kings Dock nightmare. £30 million!! It wasn't that long ago either and now the worry is that half a billion becomes a billion and we implode.

Koeman's transfer dealings haven't helped and there's not one player we could sell for more than the fee he paid. Tens of millions down the toilet isn't nice even for billionaires and could weaken his resolve.

Don Alexander
29 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:35:07
Conor (#20), what's being "Icelandic" got to do with it mate? Or have I missed something?
Conor Skelly
30 Posted 09/01/2018 at 23:36:45
'Pipe down' in this case isn't intended to stifle debate. My intention is to provide some perspective. At the end of the day most of us are not very good at football yet spend 90 minutes screaming abuse at some of the top athletes in the world like we could do it better.

Sure, there is an area in football that requires rational and otherwise intelligent people to suspend those qualities. It's a characteristic of passion. But passion is more often than not irrational and the passion of a large swath of our support often denigrates into misguided and unnecessary abuse, rather than practical support and solutions. It's all well and good trying to save the world if you have the answers. Have them not and you are only a noise that if left unchecked would create anarchy.

Today Moshiri made all the right noises and we are not doing our own labour of love any favours when our default reaction to everything is met with cynicism, vitriol and negativity. I don't want our club to hate our fans. And I don't want our fans to hate our club.

Today is a good day. Let's get behind the statement and hold them too it. If they founder, like Bill eventually did, then any apologists won't be supportive for long and change will come.

Let's make hay while the sun shines.

Tom Barton
31 Posted 09/01/2018 at 00:02:55
Hey up... some good comments; some ridiculous... all opinions. I too have mine; they are:

Mr Moshiri's comments are not aimed to pacify anyone, he really has better things to do.

The majority of the old board / directors, from a legal point of reference, will soon be making the numbers up.

The new ground will be officially announced when the final planning is sorted, it is not ethical or fair to state this any earlier.

The Red Shite's 'stadium / ground / farmyard' will never, nor ever has been in the same league as Goodison. This is the case even as I post without a new stadium. Red Shite languish in a ground that is bereft of character, mainly filled with bigoted, angry people, spilling nonsense, falseness and other types of basic shite.

This is the polite version. Never forget the simple things. BABMAR

Eddie Dunn
32 Posted 09/01/2018 at 00:05:31
The problem we face is similar to that which first Arsenal faced, and now Spurs. How to continue to compete whilst financing a new stadium.

They have both been esconsed in the top 4/6 for some time, but our hopes of joining that group will be undermined by this need for revenue. Moshiri has secured our debts but our net spend is hardly as grand as the media have portrayed it.

How on earth can we hope to get quality players in and get into the top 6, if we are to finance such a huge project?

Stan Schofield
33 Posted 10/01/2018 at 00:39:39
There are no surprises in what Moshiri said. There was nothing to create negativity, and nothing to create positivity. It appears to be simply a reiteration of what he has said in the past.

I'm not sure what is meant by returning to 'elite' status. If 'elite' means actually winning trophies on a par with Man City, Man Utd and Chelsea, it's very difficult to imagine that being remotely possible without a much larger injection of finances to match the wealth of those clubs.

However, if 'elite' means simply progressing to being consistently in the top-6, like Spurs, Arsenal and Liverpool (i.e. not necessarily winning anything but being habitually in the Champions League, with the business benefits that stem from that), that seems more realistic (but still difficult) without those larger finances.

So it would be interesting to see a clearer vision of where the board reasonably expects us to be as time progresses – a clear plan for progression on the pitch. It's certainly difficult to discern a plan at the moment, particularly when our best players leave whilst still approaching their prime, to bigger clubs where they can win trophies, which they are unlikely to do at Everton.

Tom Barton
34 Posted 10/01/2018 at 00:40:29
Hello Eddie.

Fair comments: the 'project' may be huge but Everton are huge. The difference being the words 'may' & 'are'.

Things will come round, make no mistake.

Joe Foster
35 Posted 10/01/2018 at 00:44:50
Is the word "iconic", Connor?
John Beesley
37 Posted 10/01/2018 at 01:43:26
Just read my mind, Joe, ha ha, as I was thinking that and that is the only word that I could think of. Great minds and all that, Joe!
Conor Skelly
38 Posted 10/01/2018 at 03:39:29
I'll give you a clue Joe. "It's like raaaaaaain, on your Wedding Day" (if your marrying a Weathergirl, and she set the date).

Eric Myles
39 Posted 10/01/2018 at 04:47:52
Ray (#27), Moshiri can't pour unlimited amounts of money into player purchases as that falls foul of FFP. Player purchases have to be funded from income.

Pouring money into a new ground is not against FFP, so that's where Moshiri will focus his efforts.

Amit Vithlani
40 Posted 10/01/2018 at 05:31:50
"Total and complete nonsense. Do not forget for one second, in regard to Moshiri's claim of “the heavy expenditure” or the Summer, that has the sales of Barkley and Niasse gone through on deadline day there would have been a negative net spend."

What is complete and utter nonsense David Barks, is your refusal to drop this sell-to-buy criticism which is you ignoring reality. You refuse to accept that what the club is doing is sound business practice and necessary for its sustainability and you are blatantly ignoring restrictions on the club running up huge transfer deficits.

Read The ESK's analysis, the link to which has been posted on the AGM thread by the Eds. The club is not sell-to-buy. It is "buy well, sell well". This leads to a better outcome on net spend which is necessary for the following reasons:

1. The revenues relative to trading costs mean that running up gigantic player trading losses is not possible, as FFP would kick in.

2. The ESK and posters to that thread also point out that it is good business to sell players who are not needed. Had we flogged Barkley for £35m, that would have been a good deal for the club considering his injury and refusal to sign a contract.

3. Why should we not sell players who we don't want or don't want to stay dearly? Why should we over-spend on players who we do want? At the AGM there was a statement to the effect that all the acquisitions were made at below the asking price. Had the board wanted to show a positive net spend, they would have overpaid. Now, the fact that we acquired players who have performed poorly is another matter, but the principles on selling and buying prices are surely sound.

4. By all means, you can ridicule Moshiri for the disastrous mess on the playing side of matters and the Jim White interactions. But having injected £150m of equity which has strengthened the club's balance sheet and, as The Esk acknowledges, put the club on a solid financial footing, he has not turned us into a sell to buy club out of necessity. He is promoting buy well and sell well for sustainability, so the club stops depending on either debt or funding from an investor like him.

5. He is supporting the club's ability to buy players not only by providing money within the confines of FFP, but also making Everton sustainable by seeking to grow commercial revenues, providing interest free loans so that we do not waste £5-6m on annual interest, and introduce an operating model which ensures we don't sell assets on the cheap and we buy at a discount. That is good business practice and the key to sustainability, a model which has propelled Spurs into the top 4 without needing huge amounts pumped into the club each year.

The summer transfers, appalling mess that was the manager search, and the game by game mandate given to Unsworth which cost us in the 7 games certainly portray him and the team he and Kenwright appointed to run the football side in a poor light.

But, as far as putting his money where his mouth his, he has done that so far. And the practice of selling and ensuring net spend is as low as possible is a good one as it will promote sustainability which is what FFP is about.

I want this club to stand on its own two feet, like Spurs. A dependence on Moshiri to finance transfer shortfalls (whom I cannot see either having the funds or indeed the willingness to provide interest free loans forever), is not a good thing.

He has put his hand in his pocket and stuck in £150m as equity, so any concerns that he is a charlatan should surely be dispelled – real money has gone in, and a big chunk too, in a short space of time.

What leaves me uncomfortableis that he only owns 49.9% and is clearly the only source of funding shortfalls, from transfers, to running costs, to gaps in the stadium funding.

In future, if he seeks more shares before he agrees to inject more money - which is what a rational investor would do – and Kenwright and Woods make an unreasonable demands on him acquiring their shares – then the club's plans could stall completely.

If we are not sustainable on the operating front (including transfers), then that would be a serious problem.

David Barks
41 Posted 10/01/2018 at 05:56:45
Amit,

You wasted a lot of time typing all of that, in response to me calling bullshit on Moshiri's claim of a heavy expenditure this summer when there was in fact not a heavy expenditure. It's simple maths that you could have done and save yourself a lot of time. His claim of a heavy expenditure was not true. And in fact, the attempted sales of Barkley and Niasse would have meant that “heavy expenditure” would actually have been no expenditure.

So go ahead and add point 6, 7, 8, 100 if you'd like. But it won't change that. He didn't claim that “the practice of selling and ensuring the net spend is as low as possible is a good one”. You said that. He said the exact opposite, that there was a heavy expenditure. There was not. Simple.

Duncan McDine
42 Posted 10/01/2018 at 06:05:00
‘Ironic' and ‘moronic' don't rhyme... close, but no cigar.

What is ironic is that a moron applauds Moshiri's comments when we've seen no evidence of improvement at the club since he became owner.

Okay, I lie, we do now have an Angry Birds sticker on the sleeve of our great historic royal blue jersey... hats off!

Jerome Shields
43 Posted 10/01/2018 at 06:21:47
Worried about his picture, he looks out of it.
Amit Vithlani
44 Posted 10/01/2018 at 06:27:51
Ah David, okay. So you want to stoop to semantics to defend your illogical position, which you continue to cling to.

Well, he did not say there was heavy net expenditure did he?

He said there was heavy expenditure. Heavy spending. Which is true. Simple.

Paul A Smith
45 Posted 10/01/2018 at 06:47:10
Some people will never be happy because some people can see right through nonsense. If you thought Kenwright was bad, this fella is in another league. He is even using Kenwright's pen by the looks of it.

This whole thing just sounds like be patient as usual blues while we send you stories about rising costs and pretend we are looking to have a top team going into a top stadium.

David Barks
46 Posted 10/01/2018 at 06:51:55
Oh Amit, with people like you around to slurp down that type of nonsense, it's no wonder Kenwright is still Chairman and we spent the first half of this season without a senior striker. Semantics? No.

There is nothing illogical about pointing out that he was doing some political double-speak, which you seem to have eaten up. Since he has owned the club, we've seen Stones, Lukaku and Barkley all sold. And we now have Allardyce as manager. I don't know how long you've been following this game, but old Sam tends to manage clubs at the bottom of the table, not those competing toward the top.

A heavy expenditure, based off of heavy sales of our best assets. If that makes you happy, then good for you. I'm sure you've been loving the 90 minutes of football without a shot on goal. Brilliant stuff that is. I expect to see an owner put a winning, quality product on the pitch.

Paul A Smith
47 Posted 10/01/2018 at 07:21:29
David, you're spot on. I am baffled at how often people believe there are any success stories or hope in there, after years of this kind of talk.

His speech on Tosun almost had me in stitches and "Bill miraculously getting a £35 mill bid for Barkley" – Only a man clueless about football would call that "miraculous"!.

Actions speak louder than words and expect more of the same because that is all that meeting sounded like.

Laurie Hartley
48 Posted 10/01/2018 at 07:41:57
David (#46) – it would be fair to say that I am "one of those people". Bill Kenwright might still be the chairman but from what I've seen Farhad Moshiri is running the show.

From what I can gather he has about 8.5% of his net wealth invested in Everton if Amit's number of £150 million is correct.

The clubs value has risen from sub 40 in 2015 (below West Ham when they were still at Upton Park) to 13th since he has become involved.

If he maintains or improves on that he will be getting bigger fish? than Angry Birds to invest in the stadium and that will put the club in with a chance of competing with the top 5.

In the past 17 Premier League seasons Sam Allardyce has finished in the top ten 6 times, won promotion for West Ham back into the Premier League, and rescued 2 clubs from certain relegation.

In a nutshell, maintaining our Premier League status has to be Farhad Moshiri's and our primary concern at this stage of proceedings – that is why he has brought Sam Allardyce in.

Like you, I would like to see better football from the team but right now if you offered me a nil draw at Spurs I would rip your arm off because I saw them run through us like a bunch of schoolgirls on my trip back to Goodison this season. There was no fight in the team.

I believe the football will come – we proved we are capable of it at Anfield with our equaliser. To see Jagielka spot the opportunity to hit them on the break then outstrip their £75 million man to make the assist has still got me scratching my head.

Feelings are running high, we can't agree on everything, and every one has a right to criticise, but if there is anything positive to take out of a game or any other development at the club, let's acknowledge it.

Brian Williams
49 Posted 10/01/2018 at 07:53:19
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-chief-farhad-moshiri-lifts-14134111
Dave Evans
50 Posted 10/01/2018 at 07:54:09
The old ToffeeWeb "you are all being mugged off" versus the "you are all bitter negatives" debate.

Moshiri is a businessman; he will, like anyone, protect their own interests. In my experience the best way to do this is to work to make sure the business is successful.

There is no billionaire Saint Bluenose out there who is going to give Everton all their money.

Thomas Lennon
51 Posted 10/01/2018 at 07:56:45
Quote from Moshiri with regard to retaining players: "As long as I am major shareholder, financial issues are irrelevant."

That is pretty clear and proposes a revolution for Everton.

Amit Vithlani
52 Posted 10/01/2018 at 08:02:33
David, like you, I have no control over who is chairman of the club.

Like you, I have no control over whether we bought a striker in the summer or not.

However, like you, I do have control over whether I post nonsense or sense on this website, irrespective of whether the posts are critical or in defence of Moshiri.

You posted nonsense in criticising Moshiri. You tried to pick up on semantics and were wrong there too.

I refuse to slurp your drivel.

You have now changed tack.

You did not criticise him in your post 4 for the lack of a striker, which is undeniably a stick he, Walsh, Kenwright and all have deservedly taken a lashing for.

You chose to accuse him of talking nonsense when it came to our heavy expenditure in the window.

The truth was it was you talking nonsense. Accept it and move on.

Whilst you are at it, try and remember the following:

1. Since Moshiri's arrival, £150m of equity has gone into the club. Why are you ignoring this and what it means for our ability to spend on transfers? Oh yeah, because it doesn't suit your shite argument.

2. We closed the summer window with a greater net spend than Spurs and the RS. I believe we were 4th overall in net spend? I guess this also is irrelevant, because your posts would be exposed as drivel? Had Barkley and Niasse gone, we would still rank ahead of Spurs and Arsenal.

Premier League net spend table (transfer fees)

1. Man City £138.1m
2. Man Utd £136.2m
3. Chelsea £89.75m
4. Everton £54.2m
5. Liverpool £54.05m
6. Brighton £39.65m
7. Huddersfield £38.9m
8. Watford £36.7m
9. West Brom £32.1m
10. Crystal Palace £31.3m
11. Bournemouth £30m
12. Newcastle £23.7m
13. Southampton £23.15m
14. Leicester £18.85m
15. West Ham £17.3m
16. Tottenham –£2.65m
17. Stoke –£9m
18. Burnley –£15.2m
19. Arsenal –£18m
20. Swansea –£19.5m

3. We closed the January 2017 window with a large net spend. Why ignore this when you say the club sold players to buy players? Don't answer. It's rhetorical.

4. Had Barkley and Niasse gone, you cannot be certain if net spend was zero as you and I do not know what fees were paid to Rooney, Martina and their agents to bring them to the club. Nor do we know signing on fees paid to all the other players who joined us. Or do you exclude these expenditures to suit your argument? Are you certain when Moshiri spoke of heavy expenditure he was not including all of the money shelled out in the various payments to agents and players to make transfers happen?

Ofcourse not, because you had to stick to your shite argument.

5. We made signings before Lukaku was sold. We made signings before Barkley and Niasse was sold. There was a risk that the deals would not go through. They did not sell assets to fund transfers; acquisitions were made first then players were sold. You are therefore wrong again when you said we sold assets to buy players. We bought first. Bullshit Bingo from you again!

6. Lastly, in accusing me of slurping up statements from Kenwright and Moshiri, you also ignore one critical point: it is in Everton's best interests to become sustainable, and to sell well and buy well. That allows the club to spend heavily, provided it is within FFP confines.

This point is wasted on you, so don't worry yourself too much about it.

I am critical of Moshiri for the Jim White crap, the fiasco over searching for a manager, Steve Walsh, Ronald Koeman, and the amateurish way we still behave in certain commercial matters (pictures of the kop on t-shirts).

The problem is therefore not the quantum of expenditure or financial restrictions, which you are wrong-headedly focussed on. The problem is that our hierarchy, including Moshiri, still do stupid things whilst spending huge amounts in the process. Now that is a worry.

What is also worrisome is how long he will keep pumping in money as a 49.9% shareholder. What if he wants more shares and Bill and Woods get very greedy?

If the club was sustained by Moshiri's injections because to appease you a large net spend was needed every year, we would be in the shit if Kenwright gets greedy.

Again, don't worry yourself over this. Keep in your deluded world where you think you came up with something new and original to post as a criticism of Moshiri... but in fact it was pure unmitigated shite.

Ray Robinson
53 Posted 10/01/2018 at 08:24:32
I'm with you Amit.

According to David "And in fact, the attempted sales of Barkley and Niasse would have meant that “heavy expenditure” would actually have been no expenditure." Erm.. if we're talking hypotheticals, what would the net expenditure have been if we'd signed Giroud, which was obviously on the cards?

I don't understand why some Evertonians are cynical about everything.

Hugh Jenkins
54 Posted 10/01/2018 at 08:30:04
David (41). Without wishing to be pedantic, no one can deny that there was "Heavy Expenditure" on playing staff in the past summer.

I believe the point you are trying to make is that this was at least partly set off by a substantial income from player sales in the same period.

I think the converse argument being put forward is that if Farhad Moshiri had not put his hand in his pocket and lent the club £150 million, interest free, to clear the previously crippling loans, then some of the expenditure on playing staff, would not have been possible.

Setting aside the financial arguments, I think what all Evertonians want to see is an improvement in the playing staff. What we all hoped, in the summer, was that this would be achieved with the signings made, irrespective of how that expenditure was funded.

That it turned out to be a debacle and parody, has more to do with the abilities of the Everton personnel responsible for player transfers and much less to do with how it was funded.

Personally, I think Moshiri is moving in the right directions and has the same ambitions as we do as far as playing staff capabilities is concerned.

If he is guilty of anything, it was of putting his trust in a manager that he had head-hunted and who did not truly have the interests of EFC at heart.That being the case, Moshiri, as I would have expected, took the swiftest and best action that he could to rectify that.

That, regrettably, leaves us where we are today, with the rebuild of the team having been set back by at least 12 months and, as much as I believe that Sam Allardyce is the right appointment at the moment, an interim manager in place.

Paul A Smith
55 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:00:08
Ray 53. Was Giroud on the cards. No bid accepted and no medical was taking so how do we suggest it was on the cards?

According to Wenger, Giroud was never interested. I think David is right. The club were gutted the other 3 didn't go deadline day.

Moshiri has no clue about football and its a good job Niasse didn't leave that day.

Tony Hill
56 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:15:52
Dave (#60) is surely right. Moshiri without Usmanov is very wealthy but is not so wealthy as to be a transformer of the club.

I share the doubts of those who fear that the stadium may not arrive but we can only hope. Otherwise, we just have to succeed on the pitch fairly quickly because that is still going to be the best source of renewed impetus.

Ray Robinson
57 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:19:50
I agree Paul that selling Niasse would have been a disaster. I guess the point I was making with Giroud is that nobody really knows who (if anyone) we were pursuing up to transfer deadline. If the answer is nobody, David's assertion that we have to sell to buy might be correct. If on the other hand, you think we had other irons in the fire, then maybe not. Without actual knowledge it's all speculation. The perpetual cynics will always assume the worst scenario.

Interesting thought. Liverpool sign Virgil Van Dyke for £75m (a world record for a defender) but agree to sell Coutinho for £142m. Does that mean they are a sell to buy club?

Paul A Smith
58 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:20:20
Correction, sorry – no medical taken regarding Giroud. The amount of times we near had him or just missed out on him or lost him last minute.

Same old stories while we patiently await another trophy. And, oh yes, like Moshiri says, while we sell Stones, Barkley & Lukaku.

Ray Robinson
59 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:26:03
Paul, yes like United sell Ronaldo, Liverpool sell Suarez and Coutinho, Tottenham sell Bale, Arsenal about to sell Sanchez .
Sam Hoare
60 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:39:20
Everyone has to sell their best players if they want to move to a more successful club. Eventually. You might force another year or two out of them (like we did with Lukaku) but players will get what they want in the end.

We will likely lose most of our best players to bigger clubs until we are getting into the Champions League places regularly, which is very hard to do unless you can build a consistent team around your best players. This is the disadvantage we are at.

Paul A Smith
61 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:39:44
Yes, Ray, it does, mate. They have profit hungry American owners.

They hate hearing it but they know it. It was obvious when they spent that Van Dijk money, Coutinho was a formality and they won't spend £100 million on a new Coutinho.

Having said that, I don't care what they do.

Tony Abrahams
62 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:46:18
I can see why people are disappointed because although we've been average for a long time now, getting back to really competing is not something that we really want to wait for.

Amit, some good knowledge of the bigger picture, and if I had put in £150 million of my own money, I would also be calling it "heavy expenditure".

David, you just want to see either a winning team, or if this is not always possible, at least an exciting team, which is what is so frustrating now?

Paul A, my favourite phrase is actions speak louder than words and some of the things I've read also have me more than a bit suspicious.

Laurie, great points made about the improvements that are going on behind the scenes. It does look like Moshiri, is at least removing “Kenwright's Quicksand” for a much stronger base!

Conor, imagine the people on ToffeeWeb, getting together for a tournament once a year? Walking football for the seniors, and Steve Fearns on the touch-line with his notebook, and his laminated instructions!

The thing that's got me most baffled is how us fans, have let Kenwright get away with it for so long. He had the £30 Million ring-fenced in the 90s, and now the same fella is uttering the words half-a-billion pounds 20 years later. If Moshiri, can learn one thing off Bill, it would be to stop The theatrics and just concentrate on what he his best at. The End!

Tony Everan
63 Posted 10/01/2018 at 09:50:01
Anyone criticising Mr Moshiri needs to think about what is the alternative.

He offers us hope, he has a plan, he is in the process of building one of football's greatest stadiums. He has relieved the club of punitive interest payments.

Most fans, me included, were delighted with Koeman's appointment. He let us down, and failed Mr Moshiri. His only failure so far was the complete naivety of failing to see the rank stupidity of the last transfer window.

It sounds to me that lessons have been learned. Errors are already being rectified; signing Tosun is a start.

Criticise the man by all means, but keep it constructive. He is our biggest asset, and is possibly irreplaceable.

Andrew Ellams
64 Posted 10/01/2018 at 10:07:41
Moshiri might not have the money of Usmanov or the people at Man City and Chelsea but what he does bring is business acumen. Unfortunately though, the Kenwright/Elstone mess won't unravel itself quickly. Plans are in place, one of which (Koeman) didn't go well but things are more positive off the pitch that in a long while.
Mike Price
65 Posted 10/01/2018 at 10:11:59
All of Moshiri's money would just about buy a world class team, each player averaging £150 million would bankrupt him, especially when you factor in salaries.

His money is today's equivalent of Kenwright's money a few decades ago. Unfortunately a billionaire doesn't cut it, you need a multi-billionaire like Usmanov or a country – see PSG or Man City.

Clive Mitchell
66 Posted 10/01/2018 at 10:34:11
Ray, 53 - good point, well made.
Brian Harrison
67 Posted 10/01/2018 at 10:39:28
Feels like a sketch from the Life of Brian but, instead of the "What have the Romans done for us?" it's "What has Moshiri done for us?"

Reduced the debt... yes, but apart from that

Got USM to pump money into Finch Farm... yes, but – apart from reducing the debt and getting USM to invest in Finch Farm – what else has he done?

Helped finance a new stadium... Okay, but – apart from reducing the debt, getting USM to invest in Finch Farm, and investing in a new stadium – what else has he done?

Now someone has posted "Look, he might be a billionaire but he is not as rich as Man City and Chelsea owners." Is this for real? We didn't have any credit rating at the bank before he came and couldn't spend till we sold.

Tony Williams
68 Posted 10/01/2018 at 10:43:23
I am of the opinion that we as supporters should have an impact on what we want with the new ground.

[Sorry for substituting the word 'ground' for 'stadium' but I am one of the old brigade which has always brought up with a football ground.]

Don Alexander
69 Posted 10/01/2018 at 11:09:52
I hope Moshiri has well and truly learnt from the debacle of the last window because another such episode will set us back even further from what he aspires to, and needs, in terms of a viable big stadium.

Whoever was responsible in summer seriously sabotaged his/our three year project, and not by a mere year or two, I fear. A repeat performance is out of the question but hopefully with the likes of Craig Shakespeare and Sammy Lee on board and active at Finch Farm we should be able to create a proper team providing we add to the attack, central defence and left-back areas in particular in summer. Tosun will be a miracle if he delivers anything like what Shearer did, as some have compared the two.

Lee must have done well at the training ground in Southampton in melding several new arrivals in successive summers, so well that Koeman seemingly got the credit alone. Shakespeare behind the scenes shaped the so-called ordinary Joe's at Leicester into Champions, leaving Ranieri to gurn for the cameras.

I just hope that Allardyce sees this job as the one where he can at last show credentials as a top manager of a successful club but I've always worried that his 18-month contract shows the football world that he's a very temporary measure indeed, and therefore risks further delay in acquiring the better players we'll need to progress.

After all, even Allardyce expressed the need to go face-to-face with the squad to judge their attitude given they'd mostly signed for Koeman, not him, and that to me indicates there may well be a real reluctance out there in Footy World for aspiring talented players to commit to a manager whose chief achievement for years has been to keep a clean sheet and hope to nick one, and little more.

The rest of this season poses a problem to Moshiri. Does he get rid of Allardyce before the summer window or continue on with the half-arsed contract? Or does he nail his colours to the mast in support of a Sam who's already by then started to show credentials to deliver?

As ever, it's the hope that does your head in.

Rick Tarleton
70 Posted 10/01/2018 at 11:10:07
If Moshiri delivers the new stadium without a diminuation of the team, he'll be a success. A new stadium is essential.
Paul A Smith
71 Posted 10/01/2018 at 11:22:03
I've only just heard on TalkSport about Moshiri Lukaku and the witch doctor. That's a lovely story thanks Farhad. I can't believe how we stand for this shit. This club used to be ours. The fans.

Now its a billionaire storytellers toys. Remember the Sissoko didn't sign because we realised McCarthy was family. Bill sits in a dark room when we lose. Now witch doctors. While we wait and wait and wait for real football success stories. These people all become fatter.

Another year passes with no trophy another derby we can't provide a capable 11 for and another window waiting for a wage to go so we can buy a striker. Then get the striker when the season has just ended in another derby defeat.

Let's talk Witch doctors and power rangers. Worst of all, some people are going with the flow yet again. Waiting and waiting and waiting like the NHS operation list. Also, all the mindset Allardyce haters are very likely to be disappointed next summer when he's still here.

Brian Williams
72 Posted 10/01/2018 at 12:13:42
Paul (#47),

His speech on Tosun almost had me in stitches and "Bill miraculously getting a £35M bid for Barkley". Only a man clueless about football would call that "miraculous".

Paul I think you may be doing him a disservice on that particular comment mate. I think he was being sarcastic, especially with further info that's come to light on that transfer.

Chelsea offer £35M for a player with one year left on his contract, a player who has an injury, and another which requires surgery, pretty miraculous offer you could say.

Fact may well have been that they made an offer they knew Everton would accept simply to get Barkley (and his agent) round the table so they could then collude on a plan which has since come to fruition.

I could be totally wrong but I don't think Moshiri was trying to "big up" Kenwright by his "miraculous" comment, more just draw attention to the whole Barkley transfer saga maybe?

Kevin Tully
74 Posted 10/01/2018 at 13:07:24
Can we clear up one misconception that's regularly regurgitated on these pages? Bill Kenwright is still heavily involved in the day-to-day running of this club. He is not 'just a figurehead' as many wanted to portray him.

As far as I'm aware, Kenwright & Elstone run the club (as chairman & CEO... amazing, isn't it?) and Bill himself said he was "responsible for bringing the players in."

So let's not hear any more crap about these two having nothing to do with running the club. They are as influential as they ever were. Moshiri will have the final say, but Bill will be giving his 'advice' – the poor fecker.

Dave Abrahams
75 Posted 10/01/2018 at 14:04:06
Despite the sceptics on here, and they have every right to be like that knowing what has gone on in the past, I go along with Conor Skelly. I also believe the ground will be built at Bramley-Moor Dock. I think Moshiri has a plan and that it will be a success; I would be a lot happier if Kenwright was in the background, because he will never go away, and nothing to do with the running of the club.

I went to the AGM last night and the main points of the meeting about Everton FC I was left optimistic about the future. The half-hour or so spent on Everton in the Community, and I appreciate the good they do, I could have done without, and I was left unimpressed with the few minutes Steve Walsh was on the floor. Was anyone who was there inspired by his very dull personality? He didn't speak like he was a football man, it was the second time I had heard him speak and he just doesn't come across as someone who could grab your attention and keep it. And he is The Director of Football... bored me stiff I'm afraid and that was just a few minutes of him.

Tony Abrahams
76 Posted 10/01/2018 at 14:21:03
I read something along the lines of Walsh saying that loads of clubs punted players at us, and I just thought???

I think Steve Walsh is One lucky man, I don't know what he offers to be honest, but what do I know?

Not blaming Walsh, but I saw his namesake come on for 25 minutes against Man City last night, and in those minutes, he had much more intent in his little forward passes than Schneiderlin has had all season.

Maybe Walsh has found us a couple of cracking kids, but we have spent a lot of money on distinctly average, so, some people have definitely not been doing their jobs very well

Dave Abrahams
77 Posted 10/01/2018 at 14:37:07
Tony (76), I didn't know he played last night; he was at Everton since he was in nappies and never got a chance. Two minutes after being at Bristol, found someone who believes in him and his ability.

Sam Allardyce was asked last night had he assessed Luke Garbutt yet? Sam replied that as Garbutt couldn't play until 1 January and hadn't been training with the first team he hadn't had a look at him yet. Same must have applied to Liam Walsh... hasn't he got a tongue in his mouth to ask some one about him especially when he is being transferred (Liam Walsh)?

The Director of Football might have been able to help him, or maybe even told him Everton were making a big rick in letting him go because this move, Walsh to Bristol City, will come back to haunt them.

Tony Abrahams
78 Posted 10/01/2018 at 14:55:00
I would be very surprised to see Garbutt get into an Allardyce team, because I don't think he likes defending, but I hope Walsh, does prove people wrong.

First time I had ever seen this kid play, and I liked his awareness, and that he wanted the ball, even if these two things should be top of the list for any central midfield player. Hopefully we have put a couple of clauses into Walsh's contract with regards to his future, and I also think Bristol's manager might be worth keeping an eye on in the long-term.

Stan Schofield
79 Posted 10/01/2018 at 14:58:24
I've just read about Moshiri's comments about Lukaku leaving. Voodoo?! Is Moshiri a complete idiot? I try to be positive about Moshiri's pronouncements about the 'project' and the stadium, but ultimately how can I take seriously the statements of a man who effectively discredits himself by making such stupid, crass, and totally unnecessary comments like the voodoo one?

With nonesense like this, I'm finding it difficult to believe that EFC is in safe hands.

Tony Hill
80 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:07:19
Yes, Stan (#79), it's worrying. Not least because of the impression it will give to outsiders including potential recruits. We are in danger of becoming ridiculous. We must acquire a competent PR front.
Dermot Byrne
81 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:10:44
Of course, as I keep saying, this is about a multi-year plan.

We will have continuing doubters hence his reference to importance of getting the building started.

Now some will believe, others not, some talk about their own years of angst and others will just call the Board, manager or anyone who pisses them off 'cunts'.

Myself? I think there is a plan and it will annoy us for a couple more seasons yet. So no change on TW for a bit.

David Barks
82 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:17:10
And now Lukaku will be discussing legal action against Moshiri. Brilliant. I was waiting to hear what Lukaku was going to say about those voodoo claims from Moshiri before commenting.

People had been saying lately that Everton aren't a joke in the footballing world because nobody even pays attention to us. Well, Moshiri just put us in the headlines with that voodoo shite and they sure as hell are laughing at us now.

Paul Holmes
83 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:20:09
Stan Schofield (#79) – get a grip, will you.... another political correctness convert! Free speech, we should all be able to say what we want without being told to shut up.

Fuck me, who needs a government to shut us up when our own fans do their job for them!

Moshiri, say what you want, what you said did not bother me one bit. The way society is going, we will have to go the match with duct tape over our mouths!

John Crawley
84 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:25:16
So he signed Koeman as manager because Barkley wanted him. You couldn’t make this stuff up! Reality and Moshiri parted company for most of last night. It’s entertaining stuff but very, very worrying.
Brian Williams
85 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:25:59
Dermot. I'm with you on that one. I'm optimistic, but then I usually am. I find being pessimistic just makes you miserable.

I know we've been let down before (sounds like a song) but, if you believe that, because we've been let down before, we'll always be let down, what's the point of it all?

Brian Williams
86 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:30:09
If you believe in Voodoo, you wouldn't be laughing, David. You wouldn't dare!!

On a more serious note (slightly) it will depend on who was present when what was allegedly said was, or wasn't, said. Witnesses, if it comes to that!

Jon Withey
87 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:34:15
He's quite a character, that Moshiri, isn't he?!
Stan Schofield
88 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:39:25
David @82: I don't believe that being shite on the pitch makes us a joke in the footballing world, since we're not interesting enough to get that attention (we're just a top-end of mid-table club at the moment). However, I think you're right that we'll be a joke after the type of comments Moshiri has been making. Such comments are fodder for the press.

He seems to be acting like politicians who are stupid enough to say or write unnecessary shite and thereby discredit themselves. When this happens, I tend to think that the people concerned aren't the sharpest tools in the box, but simply arrogant because of their positions.

John Daley
89 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:40:31
Voodoo magic may have grabbed all the headlines, but it was much more of a revelation for me to find out that Moshiri was only acting under orders from Ross Barkley when he appointed Ronald Koeman as Everton manager:

"I didn't spend as much time to keep Ross as I did Rom. When it got to the two years, I met his agent and said 'We need to extend the contract'. He said 'You need to get Ronald Koeman' and we got Koeman."

As if it wasn't bad enough a bloody witch doctor wading in when he was just about to blow Chelsea out the water, but poor old Farhad also had to contend with a kid from Wavertree coming over all amazing Kreskin as soon as contract negotiations commenced? The man must be cursed.

Next, he'll be sharing the story about the time he very nearly shat himself at Finch Farm, after becoming thoroughly convinced he was being stalked down the corridor by a real-life demonic Chucky doll....until the distance shortened and he was dead relieved to see it was only Sammy fucking Lee.

Jay Wood
[BRZ]

90 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:44:29
Like others, I winced last night when I heard Moshiri's 'voodoo' comment.

Not primarily out of 'political correctness' as it could be construed as (more than) borderline racist and institutionalized stereotyping, but knowing how the 'meedjah' works I just KNEW this would be THE story from last night's meeting.

And so it is proving. There was a LOT of good stuff come out of last night's meeting, but it has not been giving much if any coverage because of Moshiri's comments on Lukaku.

Now of course we have the consequences as the 'meedjah' add further episodes to the soap opera, with Lukaku considering legal action.

If Moshiri had left it at the "unbelievable" amount of money to stay and the "issue was not financial..."

If he had just kept it to saying: "I wasted two summers to keep him. First summer with his agent, him and his family we managed to keep him. Last summer we offered him a better deal than Chelsea - whatever they offered we matched but he just didn't want to stay..."

Then Evertonians could have been appeased and the resulting furore wouldn't have followed.

And what is now being revealed by Lukaku's agent as a result does not put Moshiri or the club in a good light.

"He simply had no faith in Everton and no confidence in Mr Moshiri's project. That is why he did not want to sign on any condition.

"He wanted to make the next step in his career and wanted the security to be able to leave."

This actually pisses me off more than the voodoo comment. Lukaku still had 2-3 years to run on his Everton contract.

At the same time as Everton played the obliging submissive to United's approach for Lukaku (including not insisting he returned for pre-season training as he was contractually obliged to do so, rather than part-aying with his new best United buddies in the US), Southampton refused Liverpool's overtures for Van Dijk and Liverpool themselves rejected each and every increased offer for Coutinho from Barcelona.

Look at how that stubborn gambit by both clubs worked very much in their favour last week. Why did we not play the same game?

Derek Knox
91 Posted 10/01/2018 at 15:45:25
I've just about heard it all now; Lukaku is seeking legal advice about the Voodoo comment by Moshiri. Rather than just laugh it off; he will attract more attention to himself.

Besides that; he is basically saying that Moshiri is fabricating, what was probably a one-to-one conversation; so how can he prove or disprove anything?

I don't believe in Voodoo, Mumbo Jumbo, or PooPoo either; but for two pins?

Regarding the message, it could have been misconstrued; it was a Voodafone message!

Paul Kossoff
92 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:05:48
What progress? We are losing major players, and under selling them, selling to buy, excuses already being made regarding the new stadium, alarming lack of form or team unity, over paid in transfers, just come out of a relegation position, sacked a manager who was supposed to take us to the next level and replaced him with a manager who nobody wanted!

Progress, really!!! I think Moshiri has been getting Lukaku's voodoo messages!!!

John Smith
95 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:13:16

An interesting article you all shoud read.

Everton shareholder reveals two demands Barkley made to stay

Paul Kossoff
96 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:19:35
John 89, three😁😁😁,s
David Barks
97 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:21:02
Just to provide the full picture when discussing the great “expenditure” over the summer. We were 4th in the league for spending at around £150 million. But, we were top of the league for player sales, number one in selling off players, at around £115 million. And when you add the fact that the club had agreed to sell Barkley for £35 million and Niasse for around £10 milllion, Moshiri's great expenditure would have resulted in him making a fucking profit of £10 million!!!

Christ, how is that so hard to understand, that he's pissing on your leg and telling you it's raining? Claiming voodoo for Lukaku leaving, after Lukaku had publicly stated that he was upset with the lack of ambition shown by the club and knew of players that could have been signed. Claiming that it was Barkley who wanted Koeman to be manager. And claiming it was Barkley that pleaded for him to sell Stones in order for him to stay.

He's just blaming everyone else for all that goes wrong, making insane claims. He didn't do that interest-free loan out of the goodness of his heart. He did it because he now owns this company and it saves him fucking money to not be paying out interest elsewhere!!! It wasn't a gift. It was an investment in his business.

Ian Linn
98 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:28:31
Funny – if we were 4th in the league, no-one would give a monkey's what this clown is saying. But we're not so everyone's giving him down the banks.

No matter how you turn it, football is a results-driven business.

Paul Kossoff
99 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:29:07
David 97, well put, I agree 100%
Stan Schofield
100 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:36:21
Ian @98: Yes, we're not 4th in the league, and the trouble is we don't look like being 4th in the league anytime soon. But Moshiri tells us about his ambitions for getting us there, at the same time talking shite about voodoo.

This is a man who has also talked shite in the past. I want to take him seriously about his stated ambitions, but it's difficult to do that when he talks so much shite. So being sceptical, giving him down the banks as you say, seems quite logical really.

Brian Williams
101 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:38:01
David (#97).

I think it was Barkley's agent that Moshiri said had requested the Stones to Chelsea deal, not Barkley himself.

Neil Cox
102 Posted 10/01/2018 at 16:39:11
Brian #67. Very good. But has he got rid of Chang beer?
Anthony Hughes
103 Posted 10/01/2018 at 17:22:54
"A multi year plan" I love that PR flannel.

So that could be 2, 3, 4, 5, 10, 15 years?

Paul A Smith
104 Posted 10/01/2018 at 17:24:21
If we just sent Moshiri into the changing room after a defeat to tell some of these jokes, team spirit would be unrivaled.
Steven Jones
105 Posted 10/01/2018 at 17:40:11
Conor – Spot on; Post of the week.

I like opinions that enhance insight, but when it seems chronic, nark-driven bile that denigrates someone's character then it feels rather uncomfortable. When it is against our own club, then it feels even worse.

Moshiri came across as genuine and said all the right things.

Compare him to some of the owners that have ruined other clubs and I feel we have got lucky with him.

Bill Watson
106 Posted 10/01/2018 at 17:51:51
So, Moshiri is just out to line his own pockets by injecting £150m to eliminate the onerous mortgages and interest payments we were locked into?

He'd be a pretty hopeless businessman if he ran the club into the ground and then tried to sell it.

I don't care if he doubles his investment because if he does that'll mean we have been successful.

Some of the negativity and conspiracy theorists, on here, is breathtaking.

Keith Harrison
107 Posted 10/01/2018 at 17:55:20
Voodoo, snakes and executions? I can almost hear 'Live and Let Die' blasting in the background.

Time for Bond methinks.

Steven Jones
108 Posted 10/01/2018 at 18:02:51
Amit – Various.

You are a star. Lots of data points, well argued and most rational to a level that the other narks on here, who look to use exaggerated hyperbole, cannot cope. Well done, sir!

Let's be positive, guys – there is no magic wand but we have a half-decent hand at the minute. Two months ago, we were all worried we were going the way of the Villa!

David Barks
109 Posted 10/01/2018 at 18:07:57
Steven,

So Moshiri saying that Lukaku demanded to leave because of some voodoo after a trip to Africa, that Stones was sold at the request of Barkley's agent, and that Koeman was brought in as manager at the request of Barkley in order for him to sign a new contract is saying all the right things?

Wow, I'd hate to see what he'd have to say for you to believe he was saying the wrong things.

Ian Bennett
110 Posted 10/01/2018 at 18:35:18
Perhaps it isn't a poor first touch after all. It's just his Ma sticking pins into his foot when it comes his way...
Rob Young
111 Posted 10/01/2018 at 18:36:16
Brilliant, Ian!
Jay Wood
[BRZ]

112 Posted 10/01/2018 at 19:33:30
For any one interested, here are links to full YouTube videos of last night's General Meeting:

First, the Moshiri interview at Finch Farm before the meeting:

Link

Next, Robert Elstone's presentation:

Link

Then Dan Meis' relayed message from New York:

Link

Next, Denise Barrett-Baxendale:

Link

Can't find anything on the Sam and Steve show and their presentation from last night.

Terry Farrell
113 Posted 10/01/2018 at 19:36:28
You also need to factor in payments for and to managers and the Director of Football. Didn't we pay Southampton £3m for Koeman and £2m to Leicester for Walsh? We were also going to pay Watford up to £10m for Silva.

We will have a new dockside stadium and we will make progress. He does need to cut out the off-the-cuff comments. (Please tell me he hasn't rehearsed it!) Voodoo – give me strength!)

James Marshall
114 Posted 10/01/2018 at 20:29:44
I quite like the things he says – you can't get it right every time, and he seems pretty open & honest about the whole thing.

Everton has been badly run for years, we all know that, and it'll take years to put it right – he's the man putting his hand in his pocket as he says, and of course that also means selling players, and recouping money at the same time – that's business.

We ARE getting a new stadium this time, clearly, and for that I applaud him. He has a long term vision for Everton which has often been our downfall (especially us supporters) so I for one am happy to sit back and let it happen over time.

I reckon I might have about another 35 years left on the planet, barring incident, and that might well mean I get to see us win something!

Paul A Smith
115 Posted 10/01/2018 at 21:26:50
I just posted a question on Toffeetv and wonder if posters on here have wondered??

If Barkley's agent had said "get Koeman and Barkley will sign" after already saying "let Stones go and he will sign", then seeing a deal through for Barkley to leave at a very low price, is that not worse than what Joe Anderson has asked about?

There's a lot more evidence for his case if all Moshiri said is true? Whether that can all be proved is another matter.

We all know agents dictate what players do but us letting agents dictate what we do (as Moshiri makes out) is nothing short of more amateur business.

David Johnson
116 Posted 10/01/2018 at 21:50:43
David Barks makes some excellent points and there's years of evidence of shenanigans to back him up. Bill Kenwright brought Farhad Moshiri on board like he brought his friend and ours (Philip Green) on board. Enough said.

PS where's the new TV money ?

Roberto Birquet
117 Posted 10/01/2018 at 21:54:30
Bloody Hell! Everton has already turned Moshiri grey.
Jerome Shields
118 Posted 10/01/2018 at 21:59:07
The conduct of this interview, and the conduct at the AGM, in Moshiri's case, was unprofessional and naive.
David Johnson
119 Posted 10/01/2018 at 21:59:49
Maybe he could get a tint to match the wonderful blue cladding.
Oliver Molloy
121 Posted 10/01/2018 at 23:01:29
And now we have Kenwright saying he has no concerns over Barkley's transfer to Chelsea.

I wonder why... you really couldn't make it up!

Will Mabon
122 Posted 10/01/2018 at 23:09:31
Jay, 112 - thanks.
Jamie Crowley
123 Posted 10/01/2018 at 23:13:24
Someone back a bit (can't be bothered to go look) mentioned us in comparison to Liverpool. They had mentioned Liverpool selling Cuntinho and Suarez and explained it was due to having American, profit-hungry owners. (paraphrase )

Those profit-hungry owners over there know what they are doing. They run one of the most successful American sports franchises in the Boston Red Sox.

If they sold top players, believe me they have a plan in mind.

That's one well-run organization across the park over there. We'd do well to follow suit.

And I think Moshri is doing just that. He has a plan, and from everything I can see it's a good one he obviously believes in as he took $150 million pounds of his own money to kick-start the backing of that plan.

Rome wasn't built in a day. I think we have the right man wearing the crown.

Sell when it suits us, don't over-buy, and reinvest in a longterm strategic plan which includes a new stadium.

Not sure what else we can ask for?

Open-ended questions are usually such fun on this site

Colin Glassar
124 Posted 10/01/2018 at 23:15:17
I've been saying it for ages now, Kenwright found his long sought-after sugar daddy.

I have no doubt that Moshiri is a very good accountant, who's earned himself a few bob over the years, but I maintain my impression of him as a “football man” in that he comes across as a bit of a divvy.

Kase Chow
125 Posted 10/01/2018 at 00:15:09
Amit (#52),

What a fantastic post!

I agree with all of it.

Peter Lee
126 Posted 11/01/2018 at 09:10:38
I'm only going to get up today if the sun rises and conspiracy theorists abound on ToffeeWeb. Just checked, tick and tick.

Bounds from the covers.

Koeman was odds on to be appointed. Stones was always going. Whilst Barkley or his agent may have said what was reported to suggest that the club responded to this by doing it is nonsense.

Move on.

Moshiri may or may not be "a football man" (Is Kenwright? Just asking?) but he is not an Arab SWF, a dodgy Russian billionaire laundering his money, an American business group intent on lining its pockets, a German forklift company, a dodgy Chinese/ SE Asian consortium, etc.

He was involved at Arsenal for years and he had so far used almost a quarter of a billion of his own money at EFC.

That'll do me for now.

Brian Harrison
127 Posted 11/01/2018 at 09:32:32
Just out of curiosity, when did any of the following have an open AGM: Chelsea, Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool, Spurs? Just that I have never heard or read any reports of their AGMs.
Kim Vivian
128 Posted 11/01/2018 at 11:07:59
I have had to jump to the end of this thread because I can't stand reading all the to and fro betweeen Amit, David et al. It's driving me nuts (as the pirate with the steering wheel in his kecks said).

Simply to say Amit is speaking total sense, David is speaking total bollocks. You can tell who the accountant is.

Sorry if that offends you, David, but it is true in this case.

Dave Abrahams
129 Posted 11/01/2018 at 11:12:24
Nothing ever stays calm at Everton, where you can relax and know the club is in safe hands. After the AGM I was reasonably satisfied that we could move on and start to improve.

This morning? I read in the Mirror, Moshiri proclaiming his Fab Four... Rooney is one of them, so that's a bad start. Then the new striker, none of us know what he is like.

Bolasie is another just back from injury, hopefully he will prove to be a good player and signing and the last is Sigurdsson, got one right.

Then again in the Echo, Billy Kenwright is saying that, as soon as Allardyce got here he said he would have to assess Luke Garbutt. On Tuesday night, Allardyce said Garbutt wasn't training with the first team squad so he hadn't looked at him yet, that's six weeks after he got here.

Someone is telling porkies... maybe a left back is being ruled out of the desperately needed signings. I'm edging back to "What the fuck is going on owing on here?"

Going to church to light a few candles (again).

Stan Schofield
130 Posted 11/01/2018 at 11:33:28
Jamie@123: I'd be reluctant to cite Liverpool as an example of good business. Man Utd, maybe, but not Liverpool, for the following reason:

On another thread (Barkley moves to Chelsea), Brian Harrison points out that since 2008 Liverpool and Man Utd have each spent about £800M on players. But since 2008, Utd have won the league 4 times, averaged over 80 points per season, and won a number of other trophies, whilst Liverpool have won just the League Cup (I seem to recall).

On this basis, I would consider Liverpool to be anything but a good example of effective business. They seem hopeless in terms of what they've spent. No wonder their fans are frustrated and hate Man Utd.

James Flynn
131 Posted 11/01/2018 at 11:58:42
What if all those things Moshiri said are true?
Paul A Smith
132 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:06:46
Kim. In your assessment of Dave Barks and Amits chat you chose Amit as the winner. What did you learn from it?

Saying you can see who the accountant is sounds a bit crazy to me. Amit is using figures from the club and Sky etc. That hardly gets you a degree.

Dave could argue he can see who is gullible or easily pleased and not just from this debate.

James (#131). If it was all true,he has just let Stones's agent dictate our future and set us back 2 years. Shameful if it is true.

Anthony, I loved the multi-year plan statement. Place your bets.

Peter Lee
133 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:26:01
Brian, none of them do. Via various vehicles, they are owned outright by an individual (Chelsea, Spurs), a family company (Man Utd, Man City) or a foreign business group (Liverpool).

I don't think that too many of the Premier League clubs are much different in terms of ownership. Haven't heard of other AGMs.

Incidentally, a fellow STH working in the City, comes up for every game, bought a share last year. His comment on detail in the reports/accounts was that it was much more complete than those he was used to seeing from other AGMs.

Peter Lee
134 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:36:57
Stan, understand what you're saying but in a grocery context the better business is not who had the most sales but who makes the greatest profit related to investment.

That's manure, certainly, but the shite won't be far behind. The Glazers paid a lot more than the other yanks. Both of these owners care solely about the bottom line. Winning things only features as a priority in that it impacts on the "brand awareness" and how much they can sell/charge to watch.

Globally those two are miles ahead of anyone else in the Premier League. Trace it back and its all down to Ferguson and Paisley.

Paul A Smith
135 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:37:45
I don't see why them 'elite' clubs would do an AGM. They don't usually have to explain to their diehard fans why they haven't done this or waiting on that.
Clive Rogers
136 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:40:05
James (#131), we could do with a little voodoo help. We should appoint an official EFC first team witch doctor.
Kim Vivian
137 Posted 11/01/2018 at 13:57:03
Paul - It's from a business stand point. Amit's post speak business sense.

All businesses buy and sell. They have to sell to be able to buy. Net expenditure in business is going to translate into profit or loss, and of course it would be suicide to simply keep hemorrhaging liquidity, however big the available resources.

Businesses have a choice to buy. They can keep hold of their money and accrue it or they can re-invest it. If they choose to re-invest it in stock, plant and machinery, property, marketing or whatever with a view to keep the business turning over, that is their expenditure.

If business owner grosses £1,000,000 and then reinvests £999,000, it would be fair to say he has spent pretty heavily in that period, and to say if he had managed to sell say £10 grand more his expenditure would have actually been zilch is nonsense.

David's argument almost infers, that without Moshiri's financial input (or his perceived lack of it) things would be no different. Clearly Moshiri has invested his own money into the club – in addition to money he spent acquiring his shares which did not of course go to the club.

He might, in the future, increase his stake in the club by investing in a new share issue in which case the club would benefit from that cash injection.

Aside from that but on topic, there is also the prospect of USM lurking. Can anyone else envisage the "USM Bramley-Moore" stadium in 5 years time?

Bill Watson
138 Posted 11/01/2018 at 14:47:03
Brian (#127),

The clubs you listed won't have AGMs because the are wholly owned by one person, family or business.

For example, LFC don't have them because they have no independent shareholders. The scenario whereby a shareholder could ask the manager, at the AGM, about Luke Garbutt could not happen at Liverpool, Chelsea, Man City et al.

Moshiri was asked if he was considering increasing his 49.9% stake to obtain a controlling interest. His reply was that he didn't need to as he had a controlling interest anyway due to 4% of shareholders being untraceable. He cannot be outvoted.

I wouldn't rule out a new share issue, though, as a way of raising funds for the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock.

Stan Schofield
139 Posted 11/01/2018 at 14:58:09
Peter (#134):

You say Liverpool won't be far behind Man Utd, but I can't see any evidence for that. And at the end of the day, the most important thing for fans is winning, which is the aim of football games.

On that front, Man Utd are elite, whereas Liverpool are mere nearly-men who talk about winning stuff but seldom do. I'd much rather emulate Man Utd's business model.

Peter Lee
140 Posted 11/01/2018 at 18:08:29
Stan, Man Utd were bought for about £800m in 2005, 2015 profit was £190m, club's current value in the region of £1.8bn.

Equivalents for LFC: £300m in 2010, £119m, £1.2bn.

This is crude but, for all United's relative success over the period, the percentage returns for FSG are impressive. Need to take account of the fees paid to Glazer family out of the top line though.

By contrast, the Blues are valued at around £270m.

Colin Glassar
141 Posted 11/01/2018 at 20:05:15
McCarthygate, Immaculategate, Voodoogate, FabFourgate, Holgategate... will Farhad Moshiri (and his puppy) please shut up and stop embarrassing us?
Laurie Hartley
143 Posted 11/01/2018 at 21:18:13
Dave (#129) – take heart from the fact that the press have gone from feeling sorry for us to having a pop at us at every opportunity. I see that as a sign that we are becoming a threat.

I see the Guardian has joined in today, undermining Sam Allardyce, having a snide swipe at Farhad Moshiri, and attempting to drive a wedge between the two men who will put us back on the football map.

Sam Allardyce heads to Wembley with nothing to lose except an Everton future

Ask yourself this question: Do you think we will get hammered tomorrow?

I have checked my PAM (personal anxiety monitor) this morning regarding our trip to Spurs tomorrow. To my pleasant surprise it is has risen above the line from the Pessimism to Optimism. That in itself is a huge step in the right direction.

So, for me, it's bollocks to the press... unless of course they decide to print something positive about us, in which case, I will exercise my right to take some notice of them.

UP THE BLUES!!!! (Not the Chelsea Pensioners.)

James Flynn
144 Posted 11/01/2018 at 22:17:23
Paul (132) - "James 131. If it was all true he has just let Stones's agent dictate our future and set us back 2 years. Shameful if it is true."

Lighten up, drama queen.

Unless you've just woke up from a 20-year slumber, agents in England and across the continent have a major influence on players' comings and goings.

Stones's agent dictated nothing. He did his job. His boy could make a massive wage increase by leaving, so set it up for him. Twice. The second one took. Stones wanted to leave.

Me, I'll need to see at least 2 seasons' display of young John's "brilliance" before thinking we didn't play Man City for chumps.

David Johnson
145 Posted 11/01/2018 at 22:37:23
No matter the rights or wrongs of any particular arguments on this thread, the degree of scepticism is telling and speaks volumes. In fact, the apathy concerning anything stadium-related speaks volumes.
Filipe Torres
146 Posted 11/01/2018 at 22:46:32
Hi to all,

It seems to me that this guy has been running the club like he wants to sell it, sometime in the future. His commitment to the stadium being built will only make him get a bigger check when he sells out.

Meanwhile, he will still have his £150M to be paid by the future owner, that is why he didn't bother too much with a timeline or interests, in fact as far as I know, in a club with a board that hasn't got a penny to throw in for a wish, that should scare the crack for any of them or even another investor.

You could say that a future investor would have to deal with that as well, yes!! A sound yes!! But for now, Everton haven't got a new stadium, and the commercial and financial muscle isn't in place, so no-one would touch the club, no matter how many 24/7s you look, so Moshiri is no fool and he knows no-one can buy him out.

As for Everton being competitive, I think most of you seem to forget that is Liverpool City Council that will provide a big chunk of the money, with Everton repaying it and this, along with the increase of TV revenue, will no doubt help toward the stadium being built without Moshiri risking a penny; it's the lack of debt and the balance of the books that will provide the money to purchase new players – that's why he paid the debt in such a hurry (and then said he had £100M to spend), which to some extent I think is kind of cool, because it will be the acumen of all involved, on the club's running on the pitch, that will make or break in the league table. Unfortunately, it has been 'break' so far.

In fact, Moshiri strikes me more as backer than an investor; he doesn't want or need to put his money, or a big part of it anyway (which is kind a genius) while still selling the club for an enormous profit sometime in the future.

Stan Schofield
147 Posted 11/01/2018 at 22:52:00
Filipe, I don't think Moshiri said that he had £100M to spend (the so-called 'war chest' of last season). It was the media who put this about, and people ran with it, as they do with media rumours.
Filipe Torres
148 Posted 11/01/2018 at 23:05:47
You could have a point there, Stan.

God bless ya!!

Don Alexander
149 Posted 11/01/2018 at 23:21:15
Felipe, I suspect in my honest, accountable way that you may just be right. Moshiri can indicate I'm wrong by signing better players, of course, which is his unarguable responsibility as de facto owner.

Hmmmm.

Filipe Torres
150 Posted 11/01/2018 at 23:53:14
Don, banks buy players – not owners; it is the club turnover that determines just how much they lend to you.

Only increase in income, or decreasing of expenditure (or debt) will make them lend any more money, unless you put money in the club and say it was an increase in income from marketing, popcorn selling, or whatever reason you may think of.

There are many other ways to do this (all illegal) but the beautiful game, as we all know, is a snake pit.

Jamie Crowley
151 Posted 12/01/2018 at 02:16:44
Stan,

Your point about the shite not winning anything since 2008 – when did Fenway Sports Group / New England Sports Ventures take over? I don't think it was that far back - 2010 possibly? The barometer has to be since FSG took the reigns, as that was my point. I don't think, since FSG bought the stink, that they've been poor owners, and LFC presently is playing what I would define as excellent, entertaining football in the main.

Having a quick look, the stink have finished in ascending order since 2010-11: 6, 8, 7, 2, 6, 8, 2, 4. That's three top 4 finishes in the last 8 years, inheriting an English team that has a history to be sure, but one that was clearly a train wreck at the time they took over. And honestly I don't see how, from what I've seen with my eyes, they don't make it three years straight of top four finishes this season.

And before anyone gets all jacked, I fucking hate them. Credit where it's due, even if it hurts. Look at it this way, I'd cut an arm off if someone told me Everton would have Champions League football three years running.

Peter – NESV care a fuck-ton about money. You are correct. But they also care a FT about winning.

2004 World Series for their flagship enterprise in the Red Sox. First in 86 years (now that's suffering...). Also won it in 2007 and 2013. They've won three World Series in the last 14 years. That's impressive in the world of baseball over here. Believe me, they are in it to win.

But enough about them. Let's talk about us...

And my original point was, both Liverpool-based clubs seems to be running in a similar fashion – don't overpay, sell high and reinvest with players (Cuntinho and Suarez, Lukaku and pick another), own your own fucking stadium, etc. We'd do well to follow the FSG growth plan IMHO.

Sacrilege? Nah. I just want to fucking win. Don't care if I copy the devil's business plan. Just make it happen.

Thomas Lennon
152 Posted 12/01/2018 at 06:58:29
On shares, I remember at the time of welcoming Moshiri into the business it being made clear that Moshiri & Kenwright had set up a schedule for Moshiri to buy more existing shares triggered by certain milestones, presumably set up around the achievement of various stages of building the new stadium.
Stan Schofield
153 Posted 12/01/2018 at 10:25:15
Jamie@151: You're right, they are regularly in the top-6, and being in the top-6 makes life more interesting, especially if the footie is entertaining. We've been like that in the past, near the top even when we haven't been winning trophies. And of course, it's financially beneficial, with the Champions League and all that. I suspect that's where Moshiri wants us, up there without necessarily being on a par with the 'elite' (Man City, Man Utd and Chelsea). Once you're in the top-6, the next step is being part of the elite.

Although all of this is true, my simple point is that, ultimately you want to win trophies, that's where there's glory, memories, etc. From a supporter's perspective, that's what matters. Trophies, with entertaining football, like in the 60s and 80s. Well, with a comparable spend to Liverpool, Man Utd have done that, and are still doing it, whereas Liverpool aren't.

The media portray Liverpool as an elite club, but in my view they, like Spurs and Arsenal, are not elite (but they are better than us). The true elite clubs are Man Utd, Man City and Chelsea, the ones who win trophies consistently.

Bill Watson
154 Posted 12/01/2018 at 13:46:10
Thomas (#152)

Yes, that was discussed at the time but it wouldn't be of any benefit (cash-wise) to Everton as, of course, the money paid for shares goes to the seller and not the club.

As previously mentioned, Moshiri already has a controlling interest so I'm not sure what advantage buying more shares would be for him.

Of course, if there's a shortfall in funding the new ground, then a share issue would be an option and that money would go to the club.

Amit Vithlani
155 Posted 12/01/2018 at 15:42:10
"As previously mentioned, Moshiri already has a controlling interest so I'm not sure what advantage buying more shares would be for him."

The advantage is he can have an even bigger slice of the pie when the rewards of investment are being doled out.

Having control with 49.9% shares still means he has to share the returns generated with all other shareholders pro-rata with his shareholding.

He would be stupid to continue putting interest-free loans in forever as he gets no shares or indeed any interest. If he does continue, he is effectively paying more for the same 49.9% share of the returns. It becomes benevolence.

Moshiri is an important source of cash, and until the club becomes self-sustaining – ie meeting all expenditures from its revenues – he will back-stop our funding needs.

He would be within his rights to seek more shares for providing more cash injections to the club and one assumes the shareholders agreement sets out the terms for him to do so.

If it is not set out and a dispute arises as Bill gets greedy, Moshiri turning off the taps would be a big problem if the club is not self-sustaining.

Anyone wanting an example look at AC Milan. Bought using expensive debt, financed using expensive debt and now facing financial meltdown as the colossal summer net spend has back fired badly.

Moshiri meanwhile clears our club's debts and funds us with equity. I would say we are on to a good thing with him in this regard.

What would be really perfect is if he shut his mouth, and used his hand to sign Steve Walsh's and Elstone's termination, whilst ushering Bill out of the building. At the same time, appointing a few people who know a thing or two about football.

Unfortunately, this part may not happen soon so he will deservedly kop flak for these particular issues.

Jamie Crowley
156 Posted 12/01/2018 at 17:50:08
I agree with that, Stan. Cheers.

Here's to a win tomorrow against one of the “almost” teams in Spurs.

Tony Abrahams
157 Posted 12/01/2018 at 20:54:07
Amit, what would you say the chances are of Usmanov waiting behind the scenes?

I was at the wind-up, with a few reds today because they were saying that no way would we be building this new ground now the cost has risen so much. I just repeated what I'd read off some on ToffeeWeb that maybe the club have known it was going to cost this much from day one.

Maybe, we have been clever I said, maybe we've been clever and stopped Liverpudlians kicking up even more of a fuss? Think about it for a minute, I was saying, why would Usmanov come on board just yet, with so many financial fair play issues in place?

I reckon he's sent the accountant to get the ball rolling, get these much better loans off the council, which will move our club along, and he doesn't have to show himself just yet, because he wouldn't have anything to gain, until the time comes that everything is up and running?

Steel has gone through the roof they said, I know, so wouldn't Peel want to be close to a man who owns one of the biggest steel companies in the world, I said? They all went quiet, but it might have been because they think I'm a crank. Maybe that's my problem?

Paul A Smith
158 Posted 12/01/2018 at 21:54:05
James (#144), I don't know about lighten up. Wake up comes to mind.

For a start I didn't make the case or care how Stones agent behaved. You missed the point. I wondered why after acting on 2 suggestions from Stones/Barkley's agent, ie, "Let Stones go, Get Koeman". Barkley was still not signed up.

We have let Stones go as you asked. We have got Koeman as you asked. Now sign. These are things Moshiri said. He should have been signed on the first request in my opinion, ie, getting Koeman. So in all this, they are suggesting Barkley's agent conned them, are they not?

Fooled once, it's regrettable. Twice is just plain stupid.

Steavey Buckley
159 Posted 12/01/2018 at 22:06:13
At this moment in time, after very disappointing management under Ronald Koeman, who wasted money that Everton could ill-afford to lose, it is very hard to see Everton getting amongst the top 6 clubs, who are better financed and have better players. 7th at the moment is the best Everton can achieve in the short and medium term.
Bill Watson
160 Posted 12/01/2018 at 22:07:53
Paul (#152),

Are you seriously suggesting Everton sold Stones and engaged Koeman just to get Barkley to sign a contract extension?

Barkley may have wanted this to happen but it would have happened anyway. To suggest Moshiri was fooled is absurd.

Brian Williams
161 Posted 12/01/2018 at 22:44:19
Barkley's agent, according to Moshiri, agreed he'd persuade Barkley to extend his contract if Stones was allowed to go to Chelsea!
Paul A Smith
162 Posted 12/01/2018 at 23:37:37
Bill, are you crazy? Did you even see the statements? Read the posts properly – it is what Moshiri said.

I knew nothing of Stones agent before (I say again) Moshiri said it. I didn't know him and Barkley had the same agent until it came out of yesterday's chat with Moshiri.

Brian, thank you for having the normal ability to read between the lines.

Bill Watson
163 Posted 13/01/2018 at 00:33:47
Paul; I was at the AGM and Moshiri reported what the agent said. I heard him quite clearly as I was at the front. I'm not disagreeing with what you say he said.

What I don't recall him saying is that he agreed to sell Stones and sign Koeman solely to keep Barkley. I don't recall that because Moshiri didn't say it. He was merely disclosing what the agent had said. There's a huge difference. Whether Barkley wanted it, or not, these two events would have happened.

Stones was sold (but not to Chelsea and there's a clue) because Stones wanted to go. Koeman was engaged because Martinez would have taken us down.

To even suggest these two things were done to appease Barkley is ludicrous!

David Ellis
164 Posted 13/01/2018 at 02:04:50
Amit 5; Barks 0

Great post #52. Total knockout blow.

Laurie Hartley
165 Posted 13/01/2018 at 02:15:48
Tony (#157) – It doesn't matter what they think you are – you silenced them. Keep at them.

Many a true word however, is spoken in jest.

Amit Vithlani
166 Posted 13/01/2018 at 05:16:05
Tony @ 157 you are no crank sir. Unfortunately re: Usmanov I simply do not know. He has given his name to Finch Farm so that could have been the first step.

Your theories sound totally plausible to me.

Paul A Smith
167 Posted 13/01/2018 at 10:31:17
My God people are really turning into robots.

I would have thought being sat at the front would enable you to smell the bull a bit quicker.

John Daley
168 Posted 14/01/2018 at 21:38:16
I don't know if this has appeared elsewhere on ToffeeWeb, but I've only just come across it.

Moshiri's 'explanation' of why he regularly relays info about Everton to supporters via his mate on Sky:

"As it happens, Jim White is a friend of mine.

Sometimes late at night he calls me. Sometimes there is no caller ID and I think it’s Bill. Then, if we’ve had a bad game and I’m upset, he gets to me and he gets something out of me.

All the conversations are between two friends, they shouldn’t appear on Sky but that’s the world we live in.”

Seriously, I fucking love that.

Jim White, withholding his number, getting on the blower and giving it his best Bill Kenwright impression with a load of bog roll scrunched in his mouth in order to blag a scoop?

Does that mean Farhad wouldn't pick up if he knew it was really Jim White phoning? Bit of a shitty way to treat a 'buddy'.

Why would he automatically think whoever was calling "late at night" was Kenwright? Is Bill in the habit of bothering people at all hours?

Is it purely because there is no caller id that Moshiri becomes convinced it's Bill? Why would Kenwright want to continually hide his number from Moshiri? Does he disturb his other mates in such a manner? Is 'midnight caller' Kenwright the reason Michael Crawford now only communicates through carrier pigeon?

David Barks
169 Posted 14/01/2018 at 21:51:59
John Daley,

Quite pathetic isn’t it. But what it also does is put to bed this idiotic notion that so many keep claiming that Kenwright has nothing to do with the running of the club anymore, that he’s just a figurehead Chairman. If that was the case then surely he wouldn’t be in conversation with Moshiri so often that he would expect a caller ID blocked call be Kenwright.

We are in very deep trouble given the ownership and top brass at this club. This is scary. Incompetence on a massive scale. Maybe we should all start practicing voodoo, since Moshiri seems to be a big believer in it’s impact on events.

Will Mabon
170 Posted 14/01/2018 at 22:00:56
John, David - I don't believe it. The notion that Moshiri would accidentally keep giving little scoops to Whyte, and be powerless to change it, and that he wouldn't have his communications nailed down.

I think it's condescending we're-just-like-you bullshit to the little people, which is very patronizing. The media has a sickening amount of power to influence people, just not quite yet, as much as some at the "Top" seem to believe.

Colin Glassar
171 Posted 16/01/2018 at 19:53:04
Stavely, and PCP, takeover of Newcastle has broken down. Can we get her, and her money, on board?
Brian Hennessy
172 Posted 16/01/2018 at 20:03:29
I had a missed call earlier with no caller ID - I wonder was it Bill or Jim White.??
Colin Glassar
173 Posted 16/01/2018 at 20:53:07
Farhad said he’s no longer calling his former BFF, Jim White. He’s leaving his embarrassing outburst for future AGMs.
Matthew Williams
174 Posted 17/01/2018 at 15:22:48
For me, the plan begins with a League Cup win. Winning a trophy we have never won, something tangible to show for our efforts.

The trophy drought ended, then onto European football next season in the Europa League; that then becomes our priority, to win another Cup we have never won in our history.

Onto the Super Cup Final with belief, hope & new-found confidence to go up against the best team there is in Europe, a benchmark to set ourselves against... win that & the club has new found hope & belief that anything is possible. Three Cups on the bounce... imagine it folks!

As it stands, Moshiri & Co could build our new stadium on the banks of the Royal Blue Mersey out of gold & make it 100,000 capacity but who will fill it ?!.

One thing I do know – if the above happened our trophy cabinet would still be fucking empty!

Looking like we'll just plod along...sigh.

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