Sky Sports are among a number of media outlets that also includes The Telegraph to claim that the disgraced former England boss met with Farhad Moshiri this weekend and that he is the leading candidate to replace Ronald Koeman, perhaps for just the rest of the season or as long as 18 months.
Separate reports had suggested that Allardyce, eager to shed his "fireman" image of only being brought in to rescue failing teams, is holding out for a longer contract and is keen to bring a large staff on board.
Meanwhile, Sky and talkSPORT presenter, Jim White, says that following his chats with Moshiri at yesterday's victory over Watford, David Unsworth is among four managers being considered for the position along with a "top class" foreign boss and another Premier League manager, widely assumed to be Sean Dyche.
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1 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:07:28
2 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:08:50
3 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:11:17
4 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:13:42
And Paul - I'm not far behind you.
5 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:14:52
Unless, perhaps, the mystery foreign boss really is "top class"??
6 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:15:05
7 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:15:10
8 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:17:01
9 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:24:42
10 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:30:01
11 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:31:31
12 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:31:35
It was said, and not denied by Jim White who was with Moshiri and Kenwright at yesterday's game, that Moshiri is being highly influenced by Kenwright and actually has very little idea about running a football club. Kenwright seems determined to maintain the "old boys" network and keep the club like a family, looking after their own.
While this may seem laudible, and I actually think Kenwright's heart is in the right place, the sentimentality and lack of professionalism is stifling us and killing us.
Decisions in this day and age need to be made with the head not the heart and I don't believe Kenwright is able to do that.
He and Moshiri are obviously good friends and I think it's that friendship that will stop us being hard nosed, professional, and ultimately successful.
13 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:32:25
14 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:33:46
165 wins 192 lost drawn 131
A loss rate of 41% and a goal difference of - 92 and Everton board are impressed???
15 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:34:21
16 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:36:15
As for the next one, if its Allardyce (and I sincerely hope it isnt) then Ill support the team as I always have, safe in the knowledge that if he doesnt make the grade, hell also be gone. If by some miracle he does make the grade, were all happy regardless.
17 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:39:34
The "top class foreign boss" is intriguing and has my interest.
Sean Dyche is doing well at Burnley but is flavour of the month at the moment. Remember a year or two ago it was Eddie Howe.
Unsworth has had three difficult games, to begin with, and we may have got out of jail against Watford but it was the nature of the win and determination of the players that got us a much-needed victory. He is a Blue and knows our club inside and out.
18 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:40:45
True Will, if that happens.
Personally if it's not Unsworth 'til the end of the season then Alardyce 'til the end of the season MAY not be that bad.
I say that because if it was him (Alardyce) and he got and kept us clear of the drop zone and had a contract only 'til the end of the season it would give the club a long time to identify and attempt to get the right man for the mid to long term.
Dyche's not going to come for any less than 3 years and neither would any other manager already in a job so there's a much bigger risk than getting someone in to do a stabilising job in the short term.
19 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:42:01
He brings a whole team of staff to inculcate his horrible mechanical ethos. It wouldn't be so easy as just sacking him.
20 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:43:38
21 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:43:59
Imagine the talent we could attract, but no, Bill will want his daily phone chats will someone who will put up with his interfering ways.
22 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:45:16
Definition of a 'Mercenary Parasite' - Sam Allardyce
Definition of a 'Corrupt Mercenary Parasite' - Sam Allardyce
Definition of a 'Desperate Football Club' - Everton FC
23 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:45:44
If it were Allardyce until the end of the season, I would accept it. I wouldn't beat the club over it, it would be a pragmatic move in the circumstances we find ourselves in.
If Dyche does enough to convince the board, fair play. I just wonder whether in May- providing we stay afloat in the league- it would seem so clever, despite me being fairly favourable to him.
24 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:46:41
25 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:47:29
26 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:50:12
27 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:50:31
Gotta ask Kev. What talent is that that we could attract?
What would attract them?
This aint the 80's and we aint what we were.
We are no longer a top club. It hurts to say that but facts speak for themselves.
To get back to the top will take millions upon millions of pounds and more importantly TIME.
It could take us two seasons to recover from the shit we're presently in.
And Will. I don't think we're any where near being clear yet!
28 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:50:36
29 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:52:42
Come on, Bri - think positive!
30 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:52:54
31 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:52:59
32 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:53:07
33 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:55:34
34 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:55:54
35 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:59:10
Don't let him anywhere near us.
36 Posted 06/11/2017 at 21:59:38
Your idea of ambition for our great club is not mine, in fact it's so far apart I despair that this fantastic club with fantastic fans will never get near the top four or challenge for any trophy. Please leave us be. It is all smoke and mirrors once again when will it ever end. The Championship I suppose...
37 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:00:08
38 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:01:12
As much as I despise him, Allerdyce does have certain qualities and understands what needs to be done to win football matches.
But this squad does not have the qualities he would need to implement his pragmatic style of football. It would be an absolute disaster.
We'd do better with Martinez back instead of Allerdyce!
39 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:01:25
Bolton with Okocha, Djorkaeff, Hierro etc? I will hand it to you that he did play route one with Sunderland (Defoe no big man) but they were shit.
He is pragmatic, I grant you that. In every one of Unsworth's games we have conceded at least two. Let's not get carried away with where we are right now.
40 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:02:58
No to Moyes, No to Fat Sam. Neither of these two will restore our glory.
Don't know who to say Yes to at this point, just say No to those two.
41 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:04:01
42 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:05:04
The poor fuckers.
43 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:07:35
Bolton in the later years played some really attractive football.
Palace just last year played aggressive direct football.
England short time I know, but played aggressive attractive football
44 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:10:36
Checkout what Pellegrino earns a year in China it's over £15 million a year plus compo to get him. Yes mate very acheviable indeed.
45 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:12:05
Interesting you say that. Wasn't the reason Allardyce gave for jibbing off the Palace job that he could no longer put in the '24/7 dedication' a Premier League manager gig demands?
Of course, having already picked up his promised £2m 'survival' bonus despite seeing his 'improved' side get twatted in four of their last five games , he may have just wanted to scarper before anyone sussed his 'magic touch' extended to about six weeks or so of spawny results, bookended by the same old shite his predecessor was serving up.
46 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:12:53
No to Big Sam. Be interesting if ToffeeWeb did a poll on Sam Allardyce joining. I think over 90% are against him.
47 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:14:50
All the good work on ETIC will be gone, you've got a crook in charge. All the good work building a good youth academy into the best in the country will be gone. The kids will be got rid of so his son can make a quick quid on the next Koné (Sunderland one), and we will sign a load of 30+ players on high wages and longer contracts than they should have. The club will be bled dry.
Now ask yourself this, look at where Allardyce has been, and look what happened next. He doesn't build clubs, it is all short term and he creates a mess, a mess that usually sees the next manager go down. See Sunderland, West Ham, and Palace. He left them all in a mess. Bolton didn't last long. Blackburn went. Newcastle went not long after.
The guy is a crook. The guy is corrupt. He will plead us dry. He will sell off our expensive players for peanuts, he will sign old players. We will have a team of 6'5" gorcks. We will hoof it to the sky, and we will cheat our way to victory.
No thank you. Not my Everton.
48 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:16:09
49 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:18:35
50 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:19:01
51 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:20:29
Allardyce's personal record at Anfield is worse than Evertons, Tony.
His Palace side also got twatted 0-4 at home by a shite Sunderland side managed by David Moyes.
52 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:21:08
53 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:22:16
54 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:22:32
55 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:24:06
56 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:26:52
Where are your morals, Tony? Do you have no standards? Do you not draw a line?
57 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:27:13
58 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:27:38
I really hope the European manager is Tuchel and the premier league contender is Silva.
59 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:29:20
To throw the f.a. cup is just not in our ethos. Everton f.c has always been synonymous with f.a cup runs down the years.
60 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:30:44
The club have just wasted a shit load of money,why would they want to waste more on Allardyce and his staff.He'll probably want a big lump of a striker up front in January (Andy Carroll) that will cost a fortune who probably won't be in the plans of the next manager.
Just have a little faith and give Unsworth the job.When the players realize he has the job permanently he'll get them all working together more consistently.The one's that don't he'll get rid of.
That's what I think but I fully expect the club to bottle it and go for Allardyce.
61 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:32:20
Gomes's injury does not happen and we lose a 4th game in a row.
62 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:33:14
Appointing Allardyce is tantamount to treason in most Evertonians eyes.
When if ever, maybe Gordon Lee, would a new manager be ensconced without the majority approval of the fanbase?
I predict hed be hounded out before the calamity of this season ends. At that point any faith in Moshiri I had would have been completely eroded.
Even if he won the first 10, the hate for this fellais so deep that his first defeat would be met with derision. Non starter.
Smart business people with no experience in ventures they have no knowledge of get the best advisers to help them.
Our largest shareholder is making a complete horlicks of things.
Allardyce, jesus wept.
63 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:36:22
Dysche = hmmmm no
Unsy - willing to give him morw time
64 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:36:28
I'm not arsed either way if we get Allardyce or not because no matter who comes here nothing will change while BK is still in charges.
As for corruption what has Allardyce been charged with eh ?? Nothing that's what.Big Sam got fitted up by Rat Journalist for telling the truth about what goes on in football. The shitbags at the F A fearing scandal sacked him when there was nothing to answer for.
That is it in a nutshell.Get off your high horse and give your head a wobble .Kieth Wyness was a million times worse than Big Sam and he was Kenwrights mate!!!. Stop Talking absolutel nonsense.You would think we were s massive club going places with people banging the door down for the job..
Choir boys only need apply.
65 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:41:16
66 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:41:28
add up. The wins, losses and draws don't match the total number of games.
67 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:45:23
And no, Big Sam never got caught with his fingers in the till, but there was enough evidence there for a club with morals to steer clear. It is obvious to everyone who saw those videos what was going on. He didn't even learn his lesson, he was after even more money when he got the highly paid England job.
And I'll stay on my high horse and out of the shit where you want to drag Everton to Sam Allardyce's level.
What do you even say about his record and the fact that all his clubs get relegated shortly after he leaves, such is the mess he leaves them in?
68 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:46:24
69 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:48:52
Sky Sports Profile 2015
70 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:50:27
Please, please, please, anybody by Allardyce. I cannot imagine a worse fit. Surely we dont want him. His track record isnt as great as he makes out, hes a massive egotist and the very last thing we need right now is someone with severely questionable business ethics. If the board want to appoint a manager just to get us out of trouble, there MUST be somebody else. Id take frigging Pulis over Allardyce.
71 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:50:37
72 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:51:12
I am in 100% agreement with Steve Ferns, who hits every nail on the head - particularly the shambles Allardyce routinely leaves behind after his "quick fix."
73 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:52:08
With you all the way. One top 6 finish with Bolton eons ago. Just heart breaking if that is the calibre of manager we can attract.
My hopes as per the article are the ‘top foreign coach.
74 Posted 06/11/2017 at 22:52:51
75 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:05:47
You're telling me Tommy Tuchel is refusing to come to Goodison for £3m for 6 months work or £9m for 18 months work? Or worse still, he's being over looked in favour of a manager who's major successes are finishing 17th?
Moshiri sack your advisors, and if that's Walsh, then I take back every word I said in the defence of the guy, he's a moron.
76 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:07:14
Got to be better than Fat Sam I'd say
77 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:09:13
78 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:11:41
79 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:13:23
80 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:18:11
May God save the Hammers.
81 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:22:29
In almost 30 years of management, he has one trophy to his name (The old Third Division with Notts County in case it come up at the Pub Quiz).
People still hark on about his work at Bolton. That was 20 years ago. How about we give David O'Leary a crack? Quite some team he's assembled at Leeds Utd - they're really going places...
Let's take a deep breath, and take stock for a second: We are unlikely to be relegated. Honest. Despite our truly dire form, there will be at least 3 teams below us come May. Any manager will keep us afloat. We don't need Allardyce and his dubious credentials.
The Independent has just tonight run an article headed 'If Everton hire Sam Allardyce it tells you everything you need to know about Farhad Moshiri'. And they're quite right. It tells us that, at the first remote sign of danger, Moshiri is so panicked that he feels forced to protect his investment by hiring a man who merely guarantees 17th place. Downright depressing thinking worthy of Mike Ashley.
Keep Unsworth in charge until there is a manager on the market worthy of our great club, and one capable of delivering the bright new dawn that Moshiri promised.
82 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:23:07
Found that written in Uzbeki-Russian on the back of a screwed up Metalloinvest envelope with an Isle of Man postmark when I was brushing up the directors box last night.
Before anyone asks, no I can't read Russian but my blonde ex KGB girlfriend can.
Me, I want Enrique or Unsworth.
83 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:27:27
Why bother going out and getting Fat Sam when so many of our players arent suited to his template and we have no big front man? Its a waste of money and the players and selections will be changed yet again. Unsworth has to sort out the defence; its a mess and that is the one argument for bringing in Fat Sam but I think if thats where we are, we should keep with Unsworth because he will bring on the youth and so far thats worked well.
The games coming are far easier to win and we will be out of the EL soon. If we really are considering bringing in Fat Sam, I dont see the point. Keep Unsworth until the end of the season. Hes connected with the players, brought back those like Lennon and Lookman.
If the club brings in a mercenary like Allardyce, we will be laughed at by the clubs we usually rub shoulders with. We are not a Sunderland, Palace or a West Ham. Imagine what our loveable neighbours will say? Theyd respect retaining Unsworth because its similar to the boot room era.
No, Fat Sam is a big fat no from me.
84 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:38:05
85 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:38:42
West Ham fans had a poll between Moyes & Pardew , the latter got 95% of the vote and Moyes still got the job.!
Mark @ 61,
Brendan Rodgers has already been sounded out and has ruled himself out because "it's the wrong time".
86 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:44:03
You have to caveat all of the relegations that have happened to clubs post Fat Sam to be fair.
Newcastle - he was barely there and others came in and failed before they went down in 09
Blackburn - the Venkys
Bolton - he had them way above what they should have been and once he went, they fell away
Sunderland - he was yet another in a long list of managers who managed to prolong the inevitable
I don't want him as Everton manager but to suggest he left behind a mess at several clubs is unfair. He has managed several nightmare clubs.
87 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:46:24
How the hell is he even allowed to still be involved in professional football?
And hes number 1 on our list?
88 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:49:57
89 Posted 06/11/2017 at 23:54:27
90 Posted 06/11/2017 at 00:04:27
Dont know whether to laugh or cry tbh.
Were half way to becoming another Sunderland, West Brom or Villa. Mid table survival it is then with fk all happening in the cups
91 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:05:32
All of his clubs end up in a financial mess. All of his clubs go down within a few years of him leaving. It's cold hard facts.
Don't sell our soul to the devil to stave off relegation, when we're already out of the drop zone, aftter winning one game, which shows just how early in the season it is, how little we need to panic and how we can just breathe and make a sensible decision with the next 5 years in mind.
Anyone but Fat Sam.
92 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:05:59
If indeed we did interview a top class foreign boss it would be an insult to him to then interview big Sam.
93 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:06:43
94 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:09:55
The same self-heralded 'realist' who now suggests, at every opportunity, that 'Big Sam' squeezing his arse through the door will magically 'sort out' a shite defence, quick smart?
Apart from the one month period in which Palace achieved the three results you keep banging on about, did you pay any attention to the rest of his reign, Tony?
It took 'Big Sam' six games to even record his first win as Palace boss and then he followed it up with the aforementioned 0-4 thrashing, at home, at the hands of David Moyes and his shite Sunderland side. Pretty sure your head would have exploded like the bloke out of fucking Scanners if you had to sit through that.
His instant 'sorting out' of their defence saw them concede 16 goals during that initial seven game spell, with only 4 scored at the other end. They then finished the season in similar poor form, losing four out of their last five. An end of season slump like that is sailing pretty close to the wind for someone you seem to think strolls to safety like it's a piece of piss.
He won 9 games in total during his time at Palace and lost 12. At Sunderland he won 8 and lost 13.
I think he would be a near disaster here, short-term or long-term, especially shorn of the target man he relies upon to spearhead his team.
It would be a rash appointment, made from a temporary position of heightened weakness, and Allardyce will be well and truly rubbing his hands together at the prospect of leveraging himself into a position to take maximum advantage of the arse dropping out of those tasked with making a decision over who would be the best man for the job. A job whose remit should extend significantly beyond simply steadying the ship/ensuring survival, to encompass also taking us forward, laying foundations, ensuring the good young players we have are granted opportunity to flourish and giving the fans something to actually get behind and believe in for a change.
95 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:14:54
96 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:21:24
I was not advocating him, just putting things in context.
Bringing in Allardyce to Goodison is nothing short of humiliating in my opinion.
97 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:23:46
98 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:32:58
I watched Ch 5 championship coverage and I'll say that if we do go down we won't come straight back up, that league is too strong for the over paid slackers we have in the side.
99 Posted 07/11/2017 at 00:38:52
100 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:39:00
We've gone from wanting to progress from the Moyes style of play by getting in Martinez and Koeman, which ok, didn't work but there were signs it could of, to harking back to the dark ages with Allardyce.
If he comes on a 6 month deal how can we expect to attract a striker or any player of any note in January. Who would in their right mind come to a club knowing the interim manager wouldn't be there 5 months later.
Absolute joke of a club. We're run like a fuckin market stall.
101 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:41:10
It's just not Everton is it?
102 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:44:27
When there's little choice, you do kind of get used to it, and the moment you return, it's like you've never been away - however badly the team are doing, which has been the case.
I'm not going anywhere anytime soon, but if Allardyce gets into this club, I'm out, after fifty years. I've not logically decided this, I can feel it brewing inside.
Appointing Allardyce would be a huge betrayal of everything this club is about - as is being of a mind that we actually need him at this stage. Gutless. Other managers who've turned out poor were not appointed with the deliberate consideration of shoring up in a panic, and with such information to hand as nowadays to indicate exactly what we'll get from Bungy, during his tenure and beyond.
Forget winning anything. Forget the cups. Forget youngsters. In fact, watch the talented youngsters be picked off by the vultures; Allardyce won't use them. Watch talented anyone go if they don't fit his framework - and the truth is, many of them don't (thankfully).
Allardyce in, me out. Betrayal? Maybe. Tit for tat with the "Board".
103 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:48:39
Big Sam is a joke if being considered. Moyes consistently outperformed him and Pulis, I feel Steve Walsh having a hand in this and if its anything like his transfer business I see a disaster looming.
I just hope the unnamed foreign coach is Ancelotti. Experienced winner, man manager and tactician. Mature enough to handle Kenwright.
104 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:52:04
105 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:55:15
Ancelotti is a man that can run already wellrun clubs, clubs that pretty much run themselves. He does not now anything of how to handle a club in our situation. Ancelotti would be a total disaster for Everton.
106 Posted 07/11/2017 at 01:56:44
107 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:06:02
How can you not want a true Evertonian that has proven he can win a league as a manager?
Do not come with that bullshit that it is another thing managing premier league football or the U23. It is not. Either you know how to manage people playing football or you don't.
Managing a football team is about understanding how to put together a team of footballplayers to win football games.
You will need to have a mix of skills: football understanding, the ability to see who the good players are, and where the players will fit in a team to provide in the best possible way. And maybe most important, you need to be able to motivate the players at all levels, on and of the pitch.
It seems that Untworth got all those individual skills to make a good and solid job as a manager.
108 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:08:38
I hope it's Tuchel or Ancelotti, but I reckon it will be Gus Hiddink who would be a much better appointment than Big Sam IMO.
109 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:15:32
The biggest thing Koeman destroyed was the team spirit, and that's the first area in which we can see improvement under Unsworth. We have no way of knowing what Unsworth can do yet.
110 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:26:06
Until then Rhino keeps the reigns. We need a manager who gets Everton play with tempo, width and hustle.
Thats our identity. We are irascible, gnarly team allied with good technicans.
Tiki-taka, possession based football fails to sate an Evertonian. Blood, thunder and rapier is the drama we crave.
111 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:32:17
Beam me up.
112 Posted 07/11/2017 at 02:43:22
113 Posted 07/11/2017 at 03:08:46
(not that I know much about him but... the other 3 are a no for me. I'd love Rhino to work out but if he wants to manage he needs to manage a professional club first).
I've met Sam Allardyce. I think he has been pidgeon holed by the media as a hoof ball exponent and this has stuck to him - but it's not borne out by the facts. He gets the best from the players at his disposal. The bung taking etc..yes very distasteful but he's not been prosecuted and it was endemic in the game and considered acceptable, he's not a highly educated bloke so I wouldn't be too harsh on him for that. Crikey first time I have ever had any common ground with the ever hyperbolic Tony Marsh!!
But I don' want a get out of jail short term solution. I don' think we are likely to go down and we need to start re-building now rather than waste 12-18 months in panic/crisis mode.
So Marco Silva for me.
114 Posted 07/11/2017 at 03:20:39
Not for me, never.
I agree with your last paragraph, though; no need to panic. Personally, I'd start that rebuilding by leaving Unsworth in place for now.
115 Posted 07/11/2017 at 03:27:56
I support a football team, not a transmogrifried version of the Mother's Union.
Now while I concede Allardyce would be repellant under normal circumstances, reality dictates that we have to get out of this horrible mess pronto and unfortunately, I see no better available helmsman to do this than he.
Unsworth is as useful, by contrast, as a cardboard cutout, going by the 4 dismal performances he has presided over thus far, the freakery in winning the last of those notwithstanding.
Appointing him would seal our fate and at this point, it's all about risk mitigation; ergo, we need a relegation escape artist, not an emotionally invested but inexperienced ex player who thinks the best way to win a must-win game away at Lyon is to start the game with no striker.
116 Posted 07/11/2017 at 04:16:50
I support a football team, not a transmogrifried version of the Mother's Union."
Possibly the saddest little posting I've ever seen on here.
117 Posted 07/11/2017 at 04:33:05
118 Posted 07/11/2017 at 04:53:08
No ambition, no imagination.
If It isn't someone who offers potential to transform the team in the long term, then give the post to Unsworth.
119 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:02:45
Unsworth will ‘seal our fate.
Well definitely go down if we appoint him?
Ill have to stick a bag o sand on that then if we do. Such certainty.
If it was January and we were still in free-fall I would go for Big Sam, with some reluctance. Needs must though.
But now it seems foolish.
The closer this comes to happening, and I think it is, I just have this overwhelming gut response of ‘Shit! Shit.. NO SHIT! This is shit! This is a shit situation. Were being run by fools. Bollocks. Then just quiet resignation twat!
Who is this foreign candidate?
Has to be either Silva, Tuchel, Ancelotti, Hiddink, Fonseca or Nuno?
Cant be anyone else can it?
Doesnt matter anyway, I think the use of ‘top foreign coach with no specific name is just meant to make it seem as if theyre conducting an extensive search.
If its Big Sam, itd better be a six and half month contract.
120 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:15:06
Our present dilemma has to be addressed, to improve the prospect of enticing a quality manager in the future. It seems that the 2 candidates to the temporary position are Rhino and Fat Sam.
Personally I would prefer Unsworth, but if Allardyce gets the nod and saves us from relegation that is fine by me. Then we can start to rebuild again.
According to 90% of ToffeeWebbers they don't want Sam whether he saves our PL status or not. Some threaten to quit, others don't want Sam to taint the club that Kenwright has run for nearly 30 years.
121 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:35:26
I'm not happy with the chance of appointing Allardyce but he will probably save us from the realistic and terrifying possibility of relegation.
The only issue I have is now Bilic has been fired, others could follow (Pulis or Klopp) and this is the best time for us to appoint a top class candidate before anyone else does.
122 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:35:34
123 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:40:26
Hey but it's much easier to fall into the trap of accepting a media inspired narrative isn't it.
With 20 mins to go on Sunday, very few would have wanted Unsworth long term. Then thanks to an injured keeper, a defender's slip and a missed pen, all of a sudden he'd be the right choice? Come on guys, try digging a little deeper.
124 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:47:18
Its hard to see any top foreign coach, wanting any part of this team.
I would like also to of seen Unsworth given a chance, but recent results, and baffling team selections, have put me off.
125 Posted 07/11/2017 at 05:48:40
Reading JD's factual prosecution expose the feebleness of Tony`s pie-in-the sky defence. The jury shouldn't even need to retire.
Give "big" Sam the Everton job ? . . .The fucker should be grateful he has his liberty considering his crimes against football.
Whats happened to us ? We have just emerged from 18 months of stupefying zombie football and we already have people in the pursuit of Robotic percentage shite.
I seriously thought the Old Lady was dead. I thought it had lost the will to live under the monotony and predictability of TGT, many Evertonians lost their desire to fight when faced with the mind numbing possession obsession Martinez served up.
For the past eighteen months Goodison has looked like a scene from the Game of Thrones. The Dutch night king serving up soulless zombie football as we - The White walkers - filed in and out in total silence. . . and now we have people advocating Mr anti football himself ? . .Fuck that
I saw life return to the old lady on Sunday, despite the obvious flaws and shortcomings. Passion, soul, fist shaking defiance all around he ground . .raw emotion. It was as if the faithful had suddenly forced their way to the surface after having their heads held under water for an eternity. A huge collective intake of oxygen. We were breathing again.
I think the appointment of "Big" Sam would break what many of us thought was unbreakable
We scored three goals, When you think about the sitters missed by Baines and Sigurdsson and other half chances it could and should have been 5-6. Yes I know Watford could also have had that many too and they played better footy, but to create the chances we did would have been unthinkable a fortnight ago.
Rhino's inexperience will be exposed more than once if he is given to the end of the season, but he will have enough knowledge and generate enough passion in the team to ensure we move away from danger. . . Why the are we even considering "Big" fucking Sam ?
126 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:13:20
127 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:17:03
Nice coupling there, Paul. My views about Allardyce are wholly unrelated to Kenwright. I don't want Allardyce here, period.
128 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:21:53
Right on, brother!
Seems like Allardyce is happening though.
Unsworthd win us the FA Cup, and keep us up. Jesus, a crucial couple of days in the history of the club.
Go for passion, go for excitement and being emotionally engaged while watching a match for once.
All styles of football are risky, all appointments are risky.
Itll turn nasty on Allardyce very quickly.
Think Magpies, rather than Eagles.
And also, one win in 25 attempts at Anfield, so forget that delusion as well people.
129 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:29:19
130 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:33:51
131 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:37:04
I don't think there's any actual significant evidence that Unsworth is the right man for the job, just sentimentality towards a true blue. Nothing wrong with that as long as it's not used as a basis to form a crucial opinion about who manages our club this season
132 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:38:59
Please Moshiri, prove me wrong, give Unsworth extra time or bring in Tuchel.
133 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:41:34
134 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:43:36
I presume you accept that a process should be followed to gather evidence about the strengths and weaknesses of all the managerial candidates in order that an informed opinion about the suitability of each can be gathered? That guarantees nothing, but it does stack the odds in our favour.
135 Posted 07/11/2017 at 06:48:11
136 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:03:33
Unsworth, we don't know. The spirit and effort in the team has improved markedly. The performances may follow. With the state we've been in due to Koeman, I don't believe any manager would have done any better than Unsworth has, so far.
We may need another manager other than Allardyce, we may not. It could be another upheaval too far to change again, before we've given the team more time to improve.
There's no evidence someone like Dyche will give us any more than Martinez. There's no evidence to say a "Higher" quality European manager can deal with a dogged battle should things take a bad turn.
The knowledge of the players and club, plus that of the problems and failings under Koeman, give Unsworth a head start in that aspect. We may have what we need right here, and there are signs it could work. Some more time should be given, in my opinion.
137 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:05:18
For all of his faults, Kenwright has been a Blue all of his life, he can't be that naive to think that appointing Fat Sam would be acceptable even for a short term, surely not.
138 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:06:20
139 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:10:49
140 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:11:06
I hope he has been hired on very short-term contract, but I doubt it.
141 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:14:07
I believe thats why so many teams ultimately go down, as real, genuine positivity and belief, once lost - as admittedly they so easily can be - are very difficult mindsets to regain. Bringing in anyone already on a three-team losing streak should not even be a consideration for a great club, which has lost its way but is clearly trying to find it again, like us!!!
I would actually love to believe good old Davey could actually do it for us, and that with the extra money he'd have, he could in fact build on where he'd got us to last time round. But, it just ent like that!.. sorry to say, but he would have to be considered more like a 'Jonah' nowadays!!
After all, this the guy who went to Sunderland to hopefully save them, and quickly announced 'We're going to struggle with relegation all season' and promptly took them down!!! How much a show of negativity do we need to see? Even HE, in his heart of hearts, must have known that that sort of attitude could only influence the players to think that, 'Hey.. its pretty much accepted now, even by the new manager!.. fuck it!!'...
142 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:14:48
I would like to see him given more time in his current role.
143 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:17:50
Kenwright hasn't got a clue about football. That is why we are where we are. Moshiri has no idea at all and he thinks Kenwright is an expert.
Until Kenwright's influence is removed we will always be in the wilderness.
144 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:21:41
He will embarrass the club.
145 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:27:19
Even Moshiri as a businessman, must, you would think, examine any potential candidate's track record with a fine toothed comb. He would surely have noticed that every Club that Fat Sam has administered First Aid to, has later required Major Surgery and endured a long period in Intensive Care.
146 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:27:50
I don't think we're going to get relegated. We're not adrift at the bottom. We don't need a firefighter with no track record doing anything else.
We won't appoint him.
147 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:33:56
I don't particularly want Sam Allardyce, but who knows what style he would bring to the side. His Bolton teams generally played effective football...managed a few high profile players. Not so sure about the other teams he has managed. Seems to have been made the scapegoat most of the times. One reasonably common theme is that you hear plenty about the board and ownership issues at the clubs he has been. Always something going on. Owners getting involved. Commenting to the media. At Everton, he would get quite a bit of freedom.
As for Koeman, not too early to remove him. I can only assume that apart from his brand of football and his apparent surly manager, morale throughout the club was being quietly eroded.
I am sure, in the early days, morale behind the scenes with Martinez was at an all-time high. Look where that got us :)
148 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:34:18
I agree with most of what you say in post 136 with the exception that I do not believe many of us think relegation is 'nailed on'. I think there's a fair few like me who do think relegation is a real risk this season though and in recognition feel that we need an experienced manager to try to make sure it doesn't become reality.
149 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:42:51
Get him now before The Hammers or any other team go for him.
The others are all too risky or simply not good enough for a top 6 ambitious club.
Mancini = NSNO
150 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:49:49
I think there's time to let the players unwind from Koeman, and see if there is anything to pursue with Unsworth - even if that turns out to be further repair and preparation for the next guy.
It's opinion, ultimately, without guarantees. Honestly, at this stage, I know more about what I don't want, than what I do...
151 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:52:55
152 Posted 07/11/2017 at 07:58:29
153 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:01:10
154 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:12:51
Finally I'd like to say Fuck Off Joey Barton! An unbelievable outburst against Unsworth weight. Scumbag jail bird, keep your weight phobic comments in your tiny brain. Tit!
155 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:13:10
You would think that Kenwright 'knows' Everton after all these years but I would question that opinion. After all he preserved with an average manager for 11 years and oversaw the decline of the club in that time.
As for Moshiri I am not so sure that he will do the necessary research into Allardyce's CV as he will just take 'expert' Bill's advice.
What happened to that Everton that I supported as a boy? We were one of the great clubs of English football.
156 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:16:37
157 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:22:14
You my friend are a rarity, you want to bleat about us being lucky ? Would you prefer the alternative ?
Goalkeepers getting injured are part and parcel and lets not forget, without that "slip" Lennon would have been in behind them. You seem to be desperate to prove a point, so desperate you will claim a penalty miss by Watford was "luck" but you don't seem to think Watford were lucky when Baines and Sigurdsson missed even easier chances.
According to a TW survey (always a good guide in my view) 50% of Evertonians want Unsworth to be given the job, that's makes him easily the most popular candidate. You for reasons known only to yourself seem to think half the fan base would jeopardise the future of the club for "sentimental" reasons ?
Think again my friend. you clearly don't understand their reasoning
158 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:25:46
And don't buy the revisionism. There was a movement by the media to recognise his qualities ahead of his England appointment but it was bollocks. His teams, generally speaking, have played the most unattractive cynical football imaginable. Ok, so he had Okocha... he surrounded him with some horrible fkers and it was only for a couple of years. And Bolton never played great football - at its very, very best it was decent... maybe with a long range effort from Okocha thrown in.
And he's a crook. We knew he was a crook before the England fiasco. Not a good look for our club right now.
Plus, he's a dinosaur. He's actually retired! For the life of me I don't see what could possibly convince our owners to go for him.
159 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:31:46
Allardyce tarnishes the brand and it's a lot harder to lose the stigma than gain it.
My two lads are Palace supporters. I won't say they lost the red-and-blue will to live when he was appointed (a lot later in the season than we're looking at, remember) but match days were met with a resigned shrug rather than any spark of enthusiasm. If he's appointed then, believe me, that will be the sad, and avoidable, experience of a lot more than just those who post on TW.
160 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:37:26
The damage would be unthinkable.
161 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:39:17
162 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:44:02
Now everyone can say weve got the manager we always deserved. I hope the “new” Everton board - Kenwright, Walsh, Jim White and new club secretary, Farhad Moshiri, are happy where theyve taken our club. They all need shooting!
163 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:45:45
A manager who didn't want the Palace job because of the 24/7 demands. A man who plays football as bad as Koeman, if not worse.
I can't get my head round it. I really thought it was paper talk. My hope, it is still that but so many reports now it's hard to ignore. Anyone advocating him needs a sanity check. Fuck me. Everton, you really don't make supporting you easy do you?!
The shortlist should be two names. Unsworth and 'top european target'. Allardyce, Dyche and so on should not be anywhere near the job. Wake up Moshiri and Kenwright, you clowns.
P.S. Sorry for all the swearing, I'm just bewildered by this. Seriously. Sam fucking Allardyce.
164 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:47:17
Unsworth came in and has done as much as anyone could have done in the short term he was always going to be on a hiding to nothing.
Woy at Palace has definitely put measures in place to improve them and in my opinion, with the pace they have, they will get a few results.
There is no doubt that defensively Moyes will improve West Ham who at least have the odd player who can score a goal.
Our lot show no signs of getting out of the hole they have dug themselves into and we cannot expect as much luck in the future than that we got on Sunday.
Defensively we are a shambles and have nobody that looks like the can consistently find the net.
Short term we have to get someone in to turn things around and that someone should have experience.
Unsworth may well be the future but right now forget cups and all that shit, we have to concentrate on getting results in the league.
165 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:50:02
Whatever he has done, it is the tip of the iceberg. With any industry awash with money, without adequate monitoring, and with short term thinking being king, there will always be questionable practice. Let's not pretend that he is out there alone.
The fact that the early allegations in 2006 against Sam did not put off the image conscious FA from appointing him speaks volumes. Whilst his sacking from England was unsavory, it probably wasn't a sacking offence really.
2) Unsworth. I just don't think is the man in the short term. Our stars seriously aligned in a way rarely seen on Sunday. We could have easily/conceivably conceded 4 goals at least against Watford. Our penalty was fortuitous really as it was down to a slip. Watford's pen could, and probably should have been retaken. His selections have been questionable, as have his tactics. Behind him there is a distinct lack of experience as well. Ebbrell, Ferguson, Jeffers etc. are there for one reason. It probably isn't their coaching ability.
3) I do think we are in a relegation battle. Sorry. I see nothing to convince me otherwise at the moment. Watford included.
Sam is a decent manager who has miles on the clock. He isn't a long term answer, or a medium term one, but he will shore us up between now and May. His record at Palace and Sunderland has been questioned. 8 wins 13 losses at Sunderland, considering how poor they were, is fairly solid IMO.
With the added caveat that Walsh is in charge of recruitment and has a long term eye on things, I feel it isn't a bad call to bring him in. Now, to do that we are going to have to throw some money at it. On this occasion I am going to say this: It isn't my money. If Moshiri wants to leverage that sort of money on protecting his investment in the short term, so be it.
166 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:50:47
167 Posted 07/11/2017 at 08:51:00
The scale of the task facing Rhino is no different to that facing any other manager who may be brought in.
The debate therefore must focus on the ability of the managers shortlisted to surmount the challenges.
Allardyce for me is simply not an option, using this criteria. The challenges are not just short term in avoiding relegation , but medium and long term.
The new manager will need to work with Walsh on replacing an ageing back line and addressing a bloated squad.
Additionally, the new manager has to dramatically improve our away form and get the team to play in a consistent and entertaining manner, backed up by results.
168 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:03:36
Hence the reason that we have to give ourselves the best chance of getting the right man in the medium and long term.
If I was confident of Unsworth being able to steer us to safety, I would agree on Allardyce. I am not though.
Sam has kept far, far worse teams than us up. In the short term I feel him and Walsh can start to bring in some players. His transfer record isn't that bad.
169 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:10:17
I'd rather we had no manager and let the team pick itself.
170 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:10:42
171 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:12:20
If he knows nothing else, Bill will know more about the skeletons in the Big Man's cupboard than anyone on here and will be particularly concerned that the inevitable clearance of all his Everton Old Boys appointments to the backing team will see them swept away in a trice.
Perhaps, just this once, our revered chairman really will be the saviour of his beloved club !
Please ,please, Bill ,prevent the man who made you rich from shaming and probably ruining Everton FC
172 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:16:21
1. Demand high wages
2. Demand bringing in his own coaching team
3. Demand signing his targets (players signed on a high fee and high wages)
4.Be expected to be given time until it is too late if things go badly wrong
For DU, he will work with what he has got (meaning he will dip his toes into the U23s, if he thinks it necessary), won't cost us a bomb, the players seem to be responding to him, and we will still have time to get in a big name manager if things do not work out. In fact, I think he should be told that if he achieves more than 50 points at the end of the season, he will have a 2 year contract to manage Everton permanently.
Why are people convinced that DU is not good enough for the job? What evidence do they have? Every top manager has to start somewhere, why can't it be Unsworth at Everton, the club that he knows inside out? Add in the wealth of young talent that we have at the club, that he helped nurture and who obviously look up to him, and players like Barkley, Coleman, Bolasie, Funes-Mori, McCarthy who are all close to being ready to play in the 1st team in the next 4-6 weeks, I would say we have all the ingredients for turning this season around.
IMO, Unsworth is the best option available at the moment. Any managerial signing is a risk - a risk that didn't work out with our previous 2 'big name/ foreign' signings. DU is no more riskier or less riskier than any of the proven names, given that the transfer window is at least 8 weeks away.
173 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:16:37
I think people are advocating for Allardyce NOT for the medium or long term but until the end of the season.
We were happy to pay Koeman 6 million a year so Allardyce or another on 3 million is not the end of the world if we can stay up.
This would allow the Board to have more than enough time to look for and put feelers out for a long term appointment to be made whenever, hopefully lined up before the end of the season so he can have a good luck at the staff he will be inheriting.
174 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:17:05
The 2 league games paint a different picture. Two matches against decent mid table teams - one playing for a new manager - won one, lost won, scored 4, conceded 4, and an entirely different scenario both on and off the pitch. A raucous crowd, spirit and fight being shown on the pitch and after what seems like a lifetime, a good feel at the end of the game. Sure we rode our luck as you have to do in this game, and we have had our share of equally bad luck particularly against Chelsea, but this is football, not Chess, and luck will always play a part and determine outcomes from time to time.
Making a hasty appointment at this stage, unless it is a one time chance of a serious contender (Ancoletti, Mancini possibly, Tuchel?) and to jump at Allardyce of all people would be just wrong. Unsworth HAS to be given more games - to the end of the year at least before passing judgement. If he struggles it will not be down to lack of passion or spirit on the pitch and I believe the fan base in the majority will be sympathetic. If it comes to the crunch the board will have had more time to consider and approach alternatives and there will be time to improve things unless we are in deep, deep shit in which case we move earlier.
At the end of the day it is not the manager who is going to get the points we need - it is the players. We have a decent collection of parts which are not fitting together too well just yet and to get them playing with the passion and spirit we are seeing is crucial to our survival. Players DO play for managers (see Chelsea under Mourinho's last year followed by Chelsea under Conte with pretty much the same squad) and Unsworth is getting that reaction.
We talk about 'getting' Everton, 'being part of' Everton and I don't know about anyone else on here but of all our staff who do not feel to me like a part of Everton that is Walsh. He is a figure floating around in the background, getting well paid to do a pretty average job at best and if it is him behind any move for Allardyce and fucking Shakespeare for fuck's sake them I am done with him.
If Allardyce comes here it will be for Allardyce, not Everton, and the board HAS to recognise that. Unsworth will without a shadow of doubt be doing the job for Everton (would probably consider doing it for free!), and I would like to think he will continue to get the players playing for him.
He has to be given more time unless, as I say, a top name wants the berth. Not, JUST NOT, Sam Allardyce. Never mnd the man's moral compass, just his bloody legacy. I was astonished when he got offered the England job, tbh, but I suppose that just shows the state of that hierarchy.
It's Unsworth for me, for now, in case I forgot to say.
175 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:21:11
We have been piss poor since 1988 .we last won a trophy in 1995 with a team that we rejoice in calling " dogs of war". Flattering eh.
I remember when we were a top club and were linked with Clough, Robson and the like. That was a lifetime ago.
IF we are relegated we will end up like Sunderland but with a crappy stadium maybe in Gillmoss if we are lucky because we can forget about Bramley Moore.
If someone like Sam can keep us up so that we can at least regroup next summer then he will do for me. Unless Zidane is dreaming of cold nights in L4 that is.
176 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:22:59
18 Nov Crystal Palace (A)
. 23 Nov Atalanta (H)
26 Nov Southampton (A)
29 Nov West Ham United (A)
2 Dec Huddersfield Town (H)
. 7 Dec Apollon Limassol (A)
10 Dec Liverpool (A)
13 Dec Newcastle United (A)
16 Dec Swansea City (H)
23 Dec Chelsea (H)
26 Dec West Bromwich Albion (A)
30 Dec Bournemouth (A)
There's a lot of winnable games. A couple of congested pinch points, but if Sam or someone is finding their feet with the squad over these games... We won't be in a good spot at the start of 2018.
177 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:23:32
If we cant get him, then give Unsworth a chance... if results arent going well until christmas - then maybe consider a Allardyce or Hiddink to work along with Unsie until the end of the season.
At the end of the season we look at our options & go from there! If Marco Silva is still producing the goods, go for him.
178 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:28:03
We are very easily carved open, slow to recover, and are poor in the air at set pieces. In fairness to the players and David Unsworth they do seem to be playing with more heart now. Nevertheless, whoever gets the gig as manager has got his hands full.
I also watched the post match interviews with the players. If they really want David Unsworth as the manager I would advise them to start calling him "the Boss", "the Gaffer", or "the Manager" and not "Unsy" which sounds very unprofessional to me.
From what I saw Niasse made the difference in the game - he never gave up when all looked lost. He is a fighter of a different kind. He should start every game because we have a long road ahead of us.
179 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:31:04
180 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:31:58
The first thing we need is KENWRIGHT OUT and ROONEY, FERGUSON and other hangers on with them.
Without getting tough and professional, we'll continue to fail as w have done, apart from a welcome but lucky cup final win, for 30 years.
The club needs at all levels to be run by people with the necessary skills for their area of responsibility - if they're Evertonians, that's a bonus and great the most important criteria are their qualifications to do the job.
SAM ALLARDYCE? -NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
181 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:35:12
As for those condemning Unsworth he may or may not be the answer in the long term, some of the abuse he is getting on here is a fucking disgrace. What a reward for winning the PL2 lat year from fellow Evertonians. Players such as Davies, Kenny, Beni, Dowell to name but a few have all been developed in his under 23 team.
182 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:39:08
183 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:39:48
184 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:42:13
185 Posted 07/11/2017 at 09:48:21
As Im talking about Allardyce, the appointment sets a tone. Appoint a Dyche or Silva then you can buy into a long term idea of building something. Get Allardyce and your focus becomes avoiding relegation. It all becomes a sort of self fulfilling prophecy and while big Sam got a roasting on Tyneside, I dont think Evertonians would even buy into him from the outset making his time at the Barcodes look like a holiday in the Seychelles.
186 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:01:32
People keep talking about lack of ambition as though we have a shot at getting a world class coach in the Mourinho/Guardiola bracket. We don't! We have neither the status, nor the players, nor the money from what i've seen.
Dyche- could be an option but loads on here don't want him either.
Tuchel -would be a dream for me but seems highly unlikely, he's being lined up by Bayern according to some.
Silva- I would love (and I think may be the long term target) but is very unlikely to leave so soon into a new club that is going well.
Benitez - many would not want and he apparently has no desire to sully future RS opportunity.
Fonseca- could be an option but would be a pretty risky one.
Ancellotti- Unlikely to come and even if he did he has not managed a team in our position since the 90's. Would be there purely for the paycheck which would have to be considerable.
I'm not advocating Allardyce by the way but it seems to me that there is a clear lack of obvious unifying targets. The other options hardly inspire: Eddie Howe, Steve Clarke, Chris Hughton, Chris Coleman.
Perhaps Mancini might be an interesting option.
I have a feeling (based on nothing but my problematic gut) that Moshiri/Kenwright have a long term target who is not available at the moment (possibly Silva?) and are considering someone to safe guard the club for the rest of the season. Not alot of managers would want to come in under these conditions and so the decision might rest between Unsworth and Allardyce. That is a tricky choice as much as I love Unsworth he is very inexperienced and such promotions can often back fire. I'd probably be tempted to give him the next couple of months and if things look like they're going South then re-assess in January...
187 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:04:30
all like to play attacking football and far better than, Dyche, Alladyce or Unsworth.
we are going backwards fast if we are looking at that type of manager.
as mentioned previously it looks like Kenwright is probalby influencing Moshiri which means we are not likely to take a chance on anyone who will the bring big changes to the club that are needed.
188 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:09:19
The red newspapers seem to be all over him becoming our next manager. It seems fabricated.
If there was a TW poll I would say 80-90% of Evertonians would not want him as manager.
Through all of this malaise one person who as stood out like a shining light is David Unsworth. He loves the club , cares about the club and fans.
The situation has been tough for David with tough fixtures and a few disaffected players showing no respect for the club and its hierarchy.
Even though results and performances have been on the whole disappointing. David deserves massive credit and acknowledgment of his passionate efforts from all of us. Men like him are the beating heart of the club.
His inexperience at the sharp end make me want someone else to take the club forward as permanent manager though.
That leaves the Mystery man and Dyche . The mystery man has to be Nuno or Silva doesnt it? Or is it Benitez or Tuchel? Can someone shed some light on who it is.
The secrecy means he is probably already employed.
Anyway , with our squad and resources I think we should be looking at a manager who can not only get us organised (like Dyche would) but someone who can nurture an attacking flair.
That leave the ‘mystery man out on his own and probably still in employment.
Silva or Nuno.
Maybe just Silva for me.
189 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:09:38
190 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:11:35
191 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:14:12
192 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:14:21
193 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:14:58
Walsh, together with Koeman was responsible for the appalling debacle of the summer transfer window and should have been sacked along with Koeman. It's clear that he never really hit it off with Koeman, (Did anyone?), but it seems he now wants his mate, Fat Sam in the job. How the devil does this shadowy figure have that kind of influence with Moshiri?
As each day passes, I'm coming to the conclusion that Moshiri knows f-all about football in general and running a football club in particular.
I agree with all the criticism of Blair, over the years, but even he knows more about football than Moshiri in my opinion. What began as what we all hoped would be a bright new dawn with Moshiri as majority shareholder has already turned into a nightmare of Titanic proportions following his choice of Koeman as manager, but now looks like turning into double jeapardy if he's going to allow Walsh, the nowhere man, to influence the appointment of our next manager.
Most of us are still unclear about what Walsh actually DOES, yet now he seems to have assumed the role of Behind the scenes Kingmaker.
As many others have said, there is something very rotten at the core of our once great football club and somehow I just can't see the situation improving any time soon.
What the hell do we need a DOF for anyway? Why can't we just have a manager who manages the football side of the club? At least that way, we would know exactly who to blame if transfers go pear shaped. Just exactly who was at fault for the summer window is as yet unclear but I do recall Koeman saying that Walsh was in charge of recruiting new players while he (Koeman), was in charge of the playing side of the club.
If that was the case then surely as I said earlier, Walsh should have been sacked at the same time as Koeman, and not been elevated to what appears to be a new, even more exalted position the club's hierarchy?
194 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:15:20
195 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:16:53
196 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:20:04
197 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:20:46
We are no longer a squad of big Sam players. 10 years ago? Yes, he along with Pulis, Dyche, Hodgson, like Moyes would have been a good fit. We have moved on.
I don't believe everything I read but I believe Moshiri is willing to further invest and the next 4 years with Sky money and stadium decisions are possibly the most important ever. We need a manager for that timeframe, 4 or 5 years, so in my view Sam is not a consideration.
I can understand the British press getting behind Dyche but we've the wrong squad and he lacks top level experience. We are in November and therefore we have plenty of time to change our season.
There is only one top class manager with Premier League experience and a proven winner... It's got to be Mancini! Plus he's the right age, good media profile and temperament for a top 'Class' club. Go get him, Moshiri!
198 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:28:19
Most sense spoken on here since Robbing Ron left. Some of the shite and names being touted above is frightening . The lack of common sense being shown by our fans is frightening.Some Of the names being mentioned are beyond dillusional.
Sam the only problem with giving Unsworth untill January is it that by then it might be too late attract a decent manager to the poison chalice . From what I have seen of D U he is not up to this task yet. Same mistakes bring made game after game.
Yet again on Sunday we were a shambles and run ragged but the exciting finish and penalty miss by Cleverly glossed over it. Had the pen gone in or ours missed Unsworth would be getting lynched right now. Fine margins and all that.
It needs changing in the break with someone shoring up the defence and giving us a style of play we can adhere to. My opinion is it doesn't really matter as long as BK is still in charge as nothing ever changes regardless of who is manager.
All that matters is we stay up.
199 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:33:20
200 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:34:06
I do think we were lucky on Sunday and I'm not the only one who thought this, there were multiple posters expressing the same opinion as me on the post match thread.
If someone could actually set out the reasons why Unsworth would be the best choice then it could be debated. I think he knows the players, has the respect of the young lads in particular and will work his nuts off to bring us success as he lives and breathes our club. All positives.
On the other hand he's never had to deal with multi millionaires when they get stroppy, deal with global media when he's being blamed for poor performances, convince the very best players in the world that Goodison is the place to come. He's not set up teams to play against some of the best teams in the world week in week out, and react to tactical changes during a game made by opposition teams managed by some of the world's best football managers. These are the negatives as I see them, and I think they out way the positives.
Darren, I have a different opinion to you, deal with it mate.
201 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:34:31
202 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:39:33
How this man is even being talked about is a mystery to me, his win ratio at all his clubs is about 36% and done with the most negative football you can imagine. I see on the poll on here that David Unsworth is at 51% and the alternatives 49% this includes all other alternatives. I would love to see how the voting would look if it was a straight fight between Unsworth and Allardyce.
I think if Moshiri is stupid enough to appoint Allardyce then were usually a new manager lifts the spirit of the supporters this will have the opposite effect. And if the rumours are to be believed we will not only get 1 failed manager but he wants to bring another failed manager with him. You can kiss goodbye to seeing the kids any time soon under him, as I cant recall any youngster flourishing in any of Fagans teams. So good news for Rooney,Sigurdsson,Schneiderlin and even Mirallas.
203 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:41:09
Avoiding relegation will not
1. Magically make the medium and long term issues we face go away. Who is to say that we will not be in another relegation dog fight next season? Allardyce's legacy at every club he has been at has to be of great concern.
2. Magically make us more desirable to quality managers. Will there be a queue round the block for a side that finished 17th?
The short term appointment of Allardyce is no guarantee of relegation survival. He cannot do anything with this squad until January. At Sunderland he bought Kone and Kirchoff during the January window, at Palace Sakho, who was key. In both situations the uptick in form followed the transfers.
204 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:43:22
205 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:44:42
As for Unsworth I actually thought Sunday was the worst we have played with him, I thought we looked pretty decent in patches against Chelsea, Leicester and Lyon. Better than under Koeman certainly. At the end of the day he is dealing with a woefully imbalanced squad but at the least he illicited some fight out of them and although we got lucky we did win. He has, till now, moved us up the table. I'm a little baised as i've watched his U23s play some great football against more expensively assembled opponents and though PL is obviously a huge step up i'm enjoying seeing the likes of Banigime, Kenny, DCL, Lookman etc get some experience. He's had sod all time to actually train them thanks to Europa and i'm curious to see what he might achieve given a few more weeks...
206 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:46:22
Sam is only interested in his bank account nowadays. If hes an end till season appointment then I will take a deep breath, close my eyes and pray. Ive no doubt he (or anyone else) will keep us up but what happened to “the project”?
To me, sorry Phil, this has Kenwright written all over it - SUS (Save Us Sam).
207 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:47:16
208 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:48:39
209 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:48:50
210 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:52:07
Of course Allardyce would want paying so would Anchelotti or Tuchel. I think Allardyce actually likes proving his point over and over again by keeping teams safe. Who knows what else he could achieve if he had the one thing he has never had as a coach.MONEY !!!
211 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:53:00
Sam Allardyce on if he‘s had talks about the Everton manager job: “No, I havent, but if somebody calls, theres the opportunity to speak.”
212 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:53:41
213 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:56:49
214 Posted 07/11/2017 at 10:57:18
First of all there were concerns amongst the four us, about the position that the club found itself in and we all felt that if Koeman had stayed, we would almost certainly go down.
More importantly, the Board must have felt there was a danger that we would not escape relegation, otherwisethey'dt have seen the season out, or at least until December, with Koeman then send him on his way then.
My point was that, and still is, the threat of relegation is the number one risk the club has to face and do everything possible to avoid and that means we should appoint a manager as soon as possible.
If the Board have sacked Koeman because of the danger we could go down, then I'd hope they would have already begun the process of who to replace him with before the sacking. Business people call it "Succession Planning" I'd just hope whatever they call it, our Board have taken that step weeks ago.
This club has either the most, or the second most number of games in the top flight, a proud record, but records don't keep us up. I think the team is so short of players, who are either classy enough or strong and athletic enough, or both, that I can't see us winning enough matches to get us away from danger.
No matter how much the atmosphere has lifted after the match, and for the last half hour it was like the Proper Goodison Park, and brilliant it was too, we still have massive problems on the pitch.
We've got a raw young lad at right back, who's got great heart but I think it's unfair to expect him to be a fully experienced right back, ready made and Seamus is months away from being ready according to Unsworth.
We've got massive problems in the middle of defence. The two goals that Watford scored were 1) Jagielka was easily turned by that Brazilian forward, who did the same earlier but hit the side netting, and the next one was where Jags was well outjumped for them to score an easy header. That's not getting at Jags, he's been a good servant but needs replacing, as does Williams..they're both miles too slow.
Then there's Bainesy, another great servant but we need another left back urgently, as I think the days of him being able to gallop up and down the left wing, are gone.
Then there's forward (and I mean in addition to Oumar, not to replace him) the best that we can get.
None of these positions can be left unfilled , in my view, until after the January window. Once Seamus, Funes Mori, and Bollasie, then they should be considered as further reinforcements, but we cannot wait.
We need a manager, in my view, who can be given as much time as possible get used to the players and assess them, AND also attract the best players available during the January Window; and then mouild them into the most effective team we will have for just around half a season at the most.
I've nothing against Unsy at all except that he hasn't been a manager and we are in the postion of spiralling down without the players available now to reverse the process.
If he's going to make a manager, and I hope he does, then I think should learn the job elsewhere and if he makes a top man, then great. But now, well, some feel we aren't in danger of going down, some do, including me.
I hope we can get the best man available and bring him to the club, asap.
There are players to be bought as early in the window as possible, and I think the best available will likely be more attracted by a top manager.
One of the lads, suggested Ancelotti along with man Leicester have just sacked. I thought that sounded good to us all. If he'd come is another matter though.
But the overiding view of us all, was that we are in the mire and the situation cannot be left to drift any longer.
215 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:00:29
We've not spoken to him and I don't believe there is any serious interest in him.
it would be toxic with the fans , and could be counter -productive. If a few results go against him there would be open revolt.
216 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:05:56
One of the Lads mentioned Anchelotti did he? That was nice of him.just another deluded Evertonian mate. Play the name game all you like but they ain't coming. We are in the eyes of the elite a Mickey mouse outfit with a two Bob chairman. Koeman took the piss out of us and he was supposedly a massive name.
Our fans live in a permanent state of fantasy .A world were Everyone are a massive club and top name coaches fight over this job. Kenwrighitis has spread every where.Our fans have become deranged like Bill himself.
217 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:07:17
A combination of Koeman's woeful man-management and lopsided summer spending has knocked the club sideways.
Plenty of complaints about the performance on Sunday, but what do people expect? No manager can perform miracles in two weeks. Could anybody seriously see us turning around a two goal deficit under Koeman? In a matter of weeks, Unsworth has brought some spirit and fight back into a toothless team, and he deserves great credit for that. The performances will follow.
I'd be happy for Unsworth to be given a 6 month contract a la Tim Sherwood at Spurs. He did a reasonable job there, blooded a few youngsters, and left the club in a decent state for when the right man became available to take over. I've no doubt Unsworth could do the same until we find our own Pochettino.
218 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:13:50
219 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:17:36
I believe Koeman was amongst the top 5 best paid managers in the world. Now, most of the elite managers available would, imo, seriously consider us even if its just to have a massive pay day. Never underestimate the pull of big money.
220 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:20:04
I'm just waiting to be disappointed.
221 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:22:07
Anyone see a parallel?
222 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:25:24
223 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:25:54
224 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:26:45
We can afford a good manager but not the elite. And I guess some managers (hopefully) would be looking for more than just a pay packet...
225 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:27:20
226 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:31:19
My mate isn't deluded or being nice, nor are most Evertonians in a state of fantasy. It's a massive part of all our lives and I guess a lot, including me, are worried that we could well go down. There's bound to be a name game, it's like the bloody "Relief of Mafeking" time.
My own view is that we get the best man for the job, whoever it might be. The number one target of the job is, in my view, to ensure everything is done to get us away from the danger we face; relegation.
None of this, "we're too good to go down lark".
Don't be sweeping the canvas with such a broad brush and viewing most Evertonians as "deranged" for heaven's sake. Because some have different views as yourself, does not mean they are in need of treatment.
As for Kenwrightitis. No. I remember that we would have been faffing around in Kirkby if it wasn't for the fans, especially the Keep Everton in Our City group. I'll never forget the Kings Dock fiasco, and I'll be glad the day Kenwright stands down from the Board.
But we're all, I think, worried about where this club stands in the league. We are all only able to stand by and hope that the Board make a wise choice. No guarantees, is there, whoever is chosen.
I hope Moshiri takes over from Kenwright and brings in a professional team; but that's all I can do...hope. I go the m,atch; meet me mates beforehand and have a jangle. That's all part of supporting the Blues. I should imagine if you got ten fellers round a pub table, the conversation would be something like on ToffeeWeb. Emotions run high and we all want the same thing, just think of different ways of achieving it.
Personally, for the state we are in, if the Board picked Sam Allardyce, I'd get behind the team and support the manager. He would be my choice if we could not get Dyche. But as long as we get a permanent man in now, is a priority.
So don't go calling fellow Blues mate. You put some good points up but I think your emeotions get the better of you at times.
227 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:31:29
The issues within the squad that face David Unsworth will also face whomever the club appoint, no manager in world football has a magic wand, they can improve some elements of shape and formation bu they can't make the elder statesmen younger, they can't make the younger players more experienced and they can't impose team spirit at the drop of a hat.
If Everton FC / Moshiri / Board/ Walsh want Silva then damn well go for him immediately. if they want another manager who is in a job somewhere else then the same applies go for him, if he turns you down then go for the next guy on your 'list'.
if none of those people on the list are willing to move or their clubs refuse to allow them leave, then appoint Unsworth for the rest of the season and hope that a combination of good will from the supporters and the spirit shown by the team in the latter stages of the Watford match will be enough to gain the required to stave of the threat of relegation.
If the club are seriously considering Allardyce, it will not be for purely footballing reasons but for financial reasons, he will decimate the squad with his wheeling and dealing and he may recoup some of the cash wasted by Walsh and Koeman that will be his true remit. Kenwright the supposedly biggest Evertonian of us all cannot possibly ignore the supporters, he may not rely on them as much as in the past but Sunday showed that they still have a part to play in the fortunes of Everton FC.
Moshiri is beginning to look more like the guy played by Andy Kaufman in Taxi.
228 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:34:37
This time it's old chummy, Jimmy White, telling Moshiri he had a word with his mate Big Sam... Christ, it's as clear as daylight... we now take our Counsel from The Sun. Shameful.
229 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:37:52
230 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:39:34
231 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:47:22
232 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:50:56
Dear Mr Elstone,
With regards to the vacant managerial position at Everton football club. I read with horror in the press and see on television that the club are seriously considering appointing Sam Allardyce as the new manager of the club.
I, along with thousands of fellow Evertonians, do not want to see Allardyce appointed as our new manager. The man is corrupt. He lost the England position due to corruption, and yet Everton football club somehow deem him suitable to be our new manager?
The style of football that the fans demand will be non existent. All we will get will be the well phrased style of "hoofball"
I understand that Allardyce has a track record of keeping clubs in the Premier league, but I sincerely hope the club are not considering him just for this reason alone, because sooner or later, these clubs have been relegated, with the exception of Crystal Palace (so far). It seems he does not leave a club in a healthier position than when he took over?
I could expand on the points stated above, but I wanted to keep this e-mail short.
Believe me, Mr Elstone, if Allardyce is appointed, there will be thousands upon thousands of empty seats at Goodison park for the rest of this season, and even more horrifying, should he be appointed long term, then you will see a dramatic fall in season ticket sales. You only have to go on the various fans forums to see the reactions to Allardyce being considered. Quite simply, the fans do not want Sam Allardyce as our new manager!
I trust the board will see sense when making this appointment.
233 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:52:27
234 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:53:42
235 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:55:36
Our reach it becomes embarrassing.
I include myself in any criticism I give out because I have also been guilty of ideas above my station in the past but not any more. I realised years ago were we stand in the football world mainly down to BK.
EFC maybe located in the same City as LFC but we are nowhere near Liverpool in terms of pulling power never mind the truely Elite English clubs. At this moment in time all we can offer a new coach is a fat pay cheque .We don't have a recent history to talk about. No trophy cabinet to speak of. There lies the problem we are no different from the rest of the also rans in this League.
Fans Talking about Sam Allardyce in such derogatory terms need to wake up and smell the coffee. I'm not saying I want Big Sam but I prefer him over Dyche short term and forever over the likes of Moyes.
Do we really want another mercenary from the continent like Koeman to come here and take the piss?? Give me Allardyce anytime over a Koeman type again..Let Allardycr put out the fire and keep us safe from the drop then we can re assess in the summer..It's not rocket science.
The priority of this Football club is to avoid relegation, off load all the Deadwood and then give a new guy a platform to work from.No top coach with half a brain would touch us in this state..Hence my anger at the name dropping fans..
236 Posted 07/11/2017 at 11:59:47
I've posted more than once that Allardyce is the logical choice for the position that Koeman and others have left us in, he knows the Premiership better than ninety odd per cent other managers which counts for a lot.
Nobodies suggesting him as a long term appointment, but I'd be prepared to see how the situation develops.
All this we want/have to play attractive football and also finish top 6, top 4 would be only possible if we matched the spending of the present top 6, we don't chaps.
Until we do we are stuck in this no mans land.
Never mind the managers its the best players that we need, until we have parity we are destined to be also
rans and us fans disappointed each season.
Its winning football this club needs, personally at least in the short term I don't give a hoot how we do it!
237 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:02:09
238 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:02:09
Point is though, do you think Elstone, or anyone else at the Club, Management or Board Level consider, or care, what the fans think or want?
239 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:05:02
240 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:13:18
241 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:13:26
242 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:15:55
In fact, I think we are so disjointed, it's just like Everton were before Moyes came. In danger of relegation. It can happen so quickly and from the dreams we had when Mr Moshiri said that we have a short window top reach the top positions and Koeman was hired, I for onew felt, we were on our way, buying players like kids in a toy shop, but it didn't work at all, in fact selling Barry was a really significant factor in us getting the mess we're in.
Whoever is is the Boards choice, I hope it is with the direct number one charge of avoiding the drop.
If we want to climb that mountain, we bertter make sure we don't fall off a cliff first.
243 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:20:50
244 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:22:42
245 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:23:10
246 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:23:34
247 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:31:00
248 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:33:46
We are past dreaming of grandeur and success for the moment, we are now in a relegation fight. My hope would be that Unsworth could turn the tide but I really doubt he is capable. I also fear for Davids reputation if he gets time and is not successful. He will get castrated on TW by the usual lynch mob and some of that mob will be screaming for the unsavoury Fat Sam to save them.
249 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:38:16
Embarrassing. No doubt though that it gave Elstone a welcome chuckle with all the other shite going on. Never mind, all will be well once we get Ancelloti or hang on for Conte at the end of the season. Jesus wept.
250 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:45:12
Yeah, he's very likely to want to swap a CL campaign with Athletico for a relegation battle with us now isn't he?
251 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:45:50
Moshiri is a hugely experienced businessman let's give him some credit. He knows more of high finance etc than I do. Let's see the outcome; I would be happy with Allardyce or Dyche as interim (rather Unsworth) if the long term appointment was Simeone or Fonseca.
I really think Everton needs a root and branch clearout it's not just about the manager. It's also some of the players, the backroom staff.
252 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:47:07
253 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:48:49
254 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:48:54
Brilliant mate . Some of our fans are turning in to or acting like Bill Kenwright. Evertin are not a big club.Havent been for over 50 years.
255 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:50:32
256 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:55:09
Jabba The Hutt (Allardyce) meanwhile waits for the phone call from Palpatine... who is typing out a new script for Panorama.
257 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:55:12
The game may well be dodgy, it may well be populated by crooks like Roman Abramovich, morally dubious men like Sheik Mansour and the porn kings at West Ham, but there's no need for us to get down in the gutter as well.
We are better than that. The club can appoint any manager and I will get behind them, I didn't want Walter Smith, Roberto Martinez, or Ronald Koeman but I did get behind them. I will not get behind Sam Allardyce. I could not give a shit what he won or what he did, he's a crook and that's the bottom line.
And as for people telling us to aim low, Allardyce will be on £6m a year, pro rata. We're paying £2m compensation. That's more than the Barca and the Real Madrid manager earn put together. And you're telling me that Tommy Tuchel will not speak to us about earning £20m for 3 years work?
As for the Bayern job, him and Nagelsmann can't both get it. Nagelsmann is the one who is most likely and Tuchel is the one out of work. It's not pie in the sky to chase him, it's ambition. It's a complete lack of it to chase some bung taking, corrupt dinosaur who plays the worst football the Premier League has ever seen.
258 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:55:13
If fat Sam gets the job that will be the end for me, after the Philip Green fiasco you wouldn't think we could sink any lower but with Allàrdyce I think we will.
259 Posted 07/11/2017 at 12:57:06
Farhad has got his work cut out there, but at least it sounds like the board are trying to get something sorted.
260 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:05:03
My thoughts exactly Rob, and I know you like me actually go to the game, I would love to know how many of those advocating Allardyce actually go the game. I wish I was adept enough to be able to start a petition to stop them appointing Allardyce, but like you I will also send the same sentiments as you to Elstone.
The one thing we know about Unsworth is he wants to play a progressive style of football were Allardyce never has. As I have said before he was booed out of Newcastle and West Ham because of his style of football. But some on here think we are getting above our station for wanting better than Allardyce, its not that we still think we are one of the elite in the Premiership because we havent been that for decades. But I do think we have a right to voice our opinion over the style we want our next manager to try and play. But some think we have sank that low that we should be glad to have Allardyce.
261 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:05:18
262 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:06:54
As far as I'm concerned. The number one overiding priority, is not to go down. If Alladyce has been the choice for the England Manager's role, he must be considered a good manager, and not just for keeping clubs up.
I think that we wil;l have a choice of who we can get, not who we would want.
263 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:07:15
264 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:08:22
Anyway, what are we debating? Oh, Allardyce. Ah, I dunno. He seems sound enough. He was caught out though and so it's a bad PR move.
I'm not sure I really give a shite. I don't see the need to call him fat though. Why do people do that?
Anyway, he's 1/5 now so it looks like it'll be him, even though nobody's spoken to him.
265 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:09:41
266 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:10:20
Then England found him not fit to be England manager. But he is fit enough to be your manager? Are those your standards?
267 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:12:26
Maybe he loves a challenge, a bottom of the table scrap in the Prem, as opposed to boring CL and competing against Real and Barca. :-)
268 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:13:18
269 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:14:50
Ronald Koeman was the SEVENTH highest paid manager in any sport in the whole damn world. He got paid over £6,000,000 a year! Allardyce has been offered a contract on the same money on a pro rata basis. We will offer the new manager ridiculous wages. We can attract better candidates.
270 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:16:40
271 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:17:07
272 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:17:44
Tony, would love to see Simeone here but even I found it far fetched. Tuchel for me all day long. Not an easy name to attract given our standings but surely the money should be very attractive.
273 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:20:09
As somebody above as already pointed out, it could just as easily be claimed They were lucky is wasn't an even heavier defeat.
Not only did they concede three goals they were let off the hook by they glaring sitters we missed. Anyone who benefits from a Baines left foot miss from 8 yards and Sigurdsson right foot from seven yards can consider themselves well and truly reprieved - Unless of course we are only counting their bad luck.
Please lets put this silly claim that Watford were unlucky and their manager is the second coming. Unsworth inherited the most dysfunctional, unbalanced Everton team we have seen in years. one completely bereft of confidence. Yet they still opened up this marvelous Watford team often enough to inflict one of the biggest hammerings seen in the Premiership this season. How on earth is that being "unlucky"
It worries me when people latch on to these flavor of the month managers and want to entrust the entire future of our club in their hands.
274 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:21:50
275 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:25:13
276 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:26:01
If we appoint Dyche, who is plays similar football to Allardyce, or even Pullis, I could live with it. I wouldn't like it, but I would get behind them. But we cannot employ this crook.
277 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:27:40
278 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:28:57
279 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:29:12
Might all be nonsense but I have been told it directly from a tabloid journalist (I know, I know) who did call Koeman's sacking a couple of weeks before it happened.
Never been any mention of Simeone I'm affraid.
280 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:32:45
They can't both get the job, wave £6m a year at the one not likely to get it. Here's an article assessing both for Bayern:
281 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:35:56
The teams Sam takes over he keeps up in situations that appear already lost. Once Allardyce moves on and the club in question takes the drop it is the inevitable happening to them yet again. How can Allardyce be held to account for this. What a Moronic post.
I suppose by your crazed reckoning it is
the fault of Alex Ferguson that Moyes or Mourhinio haven't won the league with Utd since he left.??? What a fucked up way of thinking.Mind boggling in fact.
282 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:39:32
Really stretching that mate !
Newcastle, Palace and West Ham weren't exactly challenging for the Champions League spots when Allardyce took over.
283 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:40:20
284 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:41:08
Newcastle hadn't been in relegation trouble for a long time until Big Sam came along and fucked them up. This was his big chance and he turned them into relegation fodder.
285 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:41:46
286 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:43:51
Steve Walsh DOF watched Norwich midfielder James Maddison last Saturday!!!!!
You couldnt make it up, and if you did, no one would believe you!!!!
287 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:44:33
Look at what he did to Sunderland. He spent massive amounts of money and there was nothing left for the next season.
He did the same at Palace. It was all such short term thinking. The next manager never stood a chance.
He only thinks about himself. how much money he can make, and he does not give a shit about the club, what happens next, and he has no interest in building a legacy. He doesn't play young players, we may as well close the academy down.
Everything about that man is a disgrace.
288 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:44:38
289 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:45:07
I'm not one for conspiracy theories, you know me, but isn't this a bit convenient if the end result is Jabba The Hutt getting the job? You know, bungs etc and old Whitey being so close to the ear of Moshiri...
290 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:48:38
There's a list of four managers' as I understand it. They ask their first choice, tell himi what they want, what money is available and if we get him, well, that's it. If he doesn't come, and the next two don't, then we are left with the fourth choice, whoeve that might be.
There's another point, that some posters have said they will not support the team, if Alladyce if he's on the list and is the one who the Board pick.
I would support the team, if Alladyce is picked just as I'd support the team if anyone else is picked.
If it is true what David has reported Sky as putting out that Simeone is the one, well, great...if he comes.
291 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:49:49
Ronald Koeman has left us in the shit, and if Unsworth kept us up this season, but we went down next season and didn't spend a penny because Koeman spent it all, it would be Koeman's fault. And that is exactly what Big Sam does. He spends all the money the clubs have on shite. And they are left in dire straits and go down anyway. He got the hell out of Palace because he knew there was no money and he would take them down.
What on earth has he done to warrant the Everton job? What has he ever achieved? He's a shite manager, who plays shite football, and takes bungs. But that's ok with you guys?
292 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:51:15
I don't believe we need Dyche or any other manager in the premier league.
Unsworth is the best choice!!
The only one of all other managers I have heard about in the speculation it is only one manager that might be better than Unsworth and that is Diego Simeone. But I seriously think we can forget about him.
So stop the Allardyce, Dyche bullshit. They can not do anything that Unsworth can't.
293 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:53:28
I don't give a shit about Newcastle or Sunderland but I will correct you on one thing.We haven't been a big club for 50 years is a fact..69/70
We were top dogs since then we've been in the shadows of Liverpool .After Liverpool it was Manchester Utd who took over.Now take your pick..I'm sure you are the Ghost of Doddy from Fresh fields ??
294 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:53:30
I can abide the shite football he will play. I can abide his horrible personality, and the way he conducts himself with the media. I can abide his dreadful team selections and the fact that we will go from 8 English men on the pitch to 11 foreigners, I can stomach all of that. But I will not have a crook managing us. He is not fit for England, he should not be fit for any club.
295 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:55:36
296 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:56:06
297 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:56:09
298 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:56:49
I like Unsworth and I'd be happy to see him as Everton manager in the future - but is he really experienced enough for now ?
It's funny how little relevance some fans and pundits put in experience - but club chairmen obviously see it differently.
It's a tricky situation and I don't envy the board - if it was summer maybe they could put together a package for a coach with some European experience - but for now..mess it up and we might go down a division.
299 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:58:26
I would like Simeone but I fear that would imply a £200M warchest. The players at Everton are simply bang average; Simeone would not want three quarters of them. So you have another building project, massive outlay... that's why Simeone is unlikely.
300 Posted 07/11/2017 at 13:59:55
Front 1: The Kenshite's front want Alerdyce, Dyche, Unsy
Front 2: Mosh, wanting Simeone, Tuchel, and perhaps Silva
Also, it appears that we have to pay 2 millions to palace if we were to appoint Fat Sam.
301 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:00:39
302 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:02:34
303 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:02:57
304 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:04:04
Allardyce has no clue about how to play attacking football. We can't play his brand of anti-football in Europe or when trying to win games against teams who are happy for a draw. He's never experienced that.
Unsworth also has the inside track as he knows the players now, he knows what he's got in the youth system and he can get a tune out of them. And yes I still wanted him at 0-2 down. I still wanted him after Lyon if you read these boards. I knew we'd beat Watford, I told everyone me so, immediately after 0-2. There was something in the air for me. And I truly believe with certainty that we will beat Palace and then West Ham and we will then be top half. Then what good is the crook? He'd be out of his depth as a manager then anyway.
305 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:04:07
306 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:04:49
307 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:05:39
308 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:07:08
309 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:07:12
310 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:08:48
311 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:09:59
312 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:10:45
Look at Manchester City (that has a good manager). The reason for Guardiolas success is his work on the training ground. His team is not full of new buys (even though he spent money) as the new once are mostly sitting on the bench, except for Kyle Walker.
Guardiola has transformed for example Stones from being a weak defender that made awful decisions leading to goals to become a rock solid dude that has one of the highest passing percentage in the league with only 6 goals conceded in 10 games.
Also he decided to put faith in Sane although he made a lot of not so good performances last season. Look at this season. He has produced most points (goals and assisst) of all midfielders in the premier league.
Unsworth can seriously not transform a team that is totally out of balance that lack not only a striker but we also lack good wingers. How the hell on earth would it be possible to murder any team with the current squad we have?
We have potential but that will take time.
In the short term it does not matter if we get in Guardiola, Simeone or Mourinho. We need a couple of new players in and we NEED a manager that is good on the training ground.
Unsworth has only been a caretaker for 4 games and already he has pinpointed a problem (Schneiderlin and Mirallas).
Unsworth likes training with high pace. Seriously this sounds like music in my ears.
313 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:11:46
You have called me and others morons and other things if I could be bothered to scroll up and mark them all down.
314 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:11:56
Steve Ferns (275), I'd love to know how Brian Clough was bent and corrupt, never heard that before, he was however a great manager with Derby County and Notts Forest until he was afflicted with the same ailment as Howard Kendall.
315 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:12:15
316 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:12:27
Simeone is supposedly the foreign manager Moshi want, but he probably won't jump ship mid-season.
If all of this gossip is true, then Moshi has a choice - appoint a short-term candidate, probably Unsworth, and pray we don't go down, then get Simeone or the equivalent in May, thus making a massive statement of intent and saying what he thinks this club's future should be, or take the crooked fat fuck and his half witted sidekick on the suggestion of a discredited Director Of Football who got lucky at Leicester.
317 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:14:51
The Damned United was hated by his family. The reason was the book was scathing about him and his corruption and the film was much watered down.
318 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:16:04
319 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:18:33
320 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:19:09
However, it seems you're cracking up a bit on the hate against him and his management record.
The crap about it's his fault teams he's managed have been relegated is quite unbelievable.
He left Bolton in 5th place because Gartside wouldn't back him.
He left Newcastle half way through the season because the new owner - Ashley - say no more, wanted fans favourite Keegan in place.
Blackburns owners, the popular Venkeys, got rid when he was mid table.
Fan power at West Ham forced the porn kings to bin him mid table because they weren't playing this open spectacular attacking football apparently West Ham are famous for. Seems a few on here feel we are missing, though in 50 odd years I haven't seen a great deal of.
Sunderland he kept up and left for the England job.
Palace only had him for a season I think.
Steve for sure you can have your opinion like I said but this crap about him being responsible for Clubs relegation is just nonsense
321 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:21:17
322 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:21:24
If you mean that Sam has committed crimes against the beautiful game then that is a different matter.
323 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:23:11
324 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:23:42
325 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:24:27
It's about time someone at board level had the balls to think big.
Allardyce and Dyche my arse.
At least West Ham have taken a bullet for us with Davie and his pocket knives.
326 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:25:52
327 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:27:33
We're not anywhere near a relegation fight yet, so I don't see any need for him anyway - relegation is quite literally the only reason any team should employ him.
As for Dyche, well he's just another one who's taken a team down already - that would be us making the same mistake again, surely. I can't fathom why anyone would want him.
328 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:29:50
329 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:31:54
Well said and we'll pointed out.Its Incredible the things being said in here about Allardyce.I don't want the guy here but if he came here we would be in far better shape than we were under the Hollywood star Koeman.
Some of these fans in here slaughtering Big Sam lapped up 12 years of Deadly Dave. Go figure that one out.
330 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:37:00
331 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:38:37
I just don't see any reason for a manager of his ilk at this stage.
Simeone would be great, if a tad unrealistic at this stage.
Tuchel would still be my pick.
332 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:40:51
It's ALL pure speculation though, isn't it?
333 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:42:59
I asked you to look at the mess he left at Sunderland and at Palace. Speak to their fans and ask them how much responsibility the crook should take. Because you will be hard pushed to find someone who says he is blameless.
Yes Kim, you are right, I never said it was all his fault.
334 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:44:32
There are historically VERY few that have left when things are good!
335 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:45:47
336 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:47:14
337 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:48:31
338 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:50:05
339 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:52:53
340 Posted 07/11/2017 at 14:55:13
Holy Shit! Its actually happening...
341 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:03:53
Let me point out first Im certainly not a big pro Allardyce fan.
You state no clubs has survived 3 years in the top flight from when Allardyce.
Thats flawed ideology. The clubs were probably destined to go down and were poorly managed after he left. Allardyce did what he does really well. He kept them up.
His record in that respect is very good.
But hes a manager wholl bring a limited horizon ambition with pragmatic football.
342 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:04:47
343 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:05:39
Newcastle and Sunderland have been sad for years and flirted with relegation before and after Allardyce. The porn kings have had manager issues continually during their watch. Palace are yoyos.
But to somehow associate all their ills on Allardyce is ridiculous.
Nobody wants Allardyce here. We all want to see OUR team win and win well. Challenge for Europe every year. Have a great manager who can get us there, unfortunately the last 2 bone heads have navigated us to a situation which is embarrassing and precarious.
Before we can get this manager we must ensure safety and do what we must to ensure that.
The board will decide who that manager is and believe me regardless of the names everyone has put out they will get the man they see fit to get us out of these present difficulties. Our thoughts will have no bearing on their decision.
If they decide on Allardyce we can shout, moan, rip up season tickets, never support them again do whatever.
Most of us will accept it and support them every day of our lives.
344 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:11:07
The outrage at Allardyce is not because of his football, and yes that makes him highly unattractive, it is because of who he is, how he operates and what he will do the club and what legacy he will leave behind.
If you are desperate enough to lower your standards to accept a man like Allardyce, that's your choice, but have a look at the table, we are 4 points off 8th. Our next two games are against sides below us. Will you still be desperate if we win both of them? The time for people to lower their standards is with 11 games left, not 11 games gone and almost back into mid-table.
345 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:11:27
346 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:15:58
347 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:16:14
You say nobody wants Allardyce yet you set out to defend him, you and John Hughes and Tony Marsh have all said he wouldnt be your choice so why are you so vociferous in defending him.
I used to buy the Liverpool Echo every night but stopped years ago when it became the LFC paper. I do sometimes go on their website to see if anything has changed and it hasnt. Today they are mocking any suggestion that Everton would approach Simeone. But then go on to say why Allardyce is favourite and how it might benifit us to appoint him.
Now you know he is the wrong man when these journalists are writing this.
348 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:17:03
349 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:19:57
Our last manager who is supposedly a football genius far too big for our club brought in Klassen , Siggurdson, Gueye,
Bolasie and Keane.All have been useless. Stones out Lukaku out Delafoue out and Barkley and Niasse almost forced out.. What's your point??
All managers fuck up with signings.
350 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:23:52
351 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:28:10
In an ideal world there is no way I would want Allardyce as manager of our Club.
However, in my opinion, we are in a shit situation of which there are no real signs of rectifying by anyone let alone the Ancelottis of this world.
Given any encouragement I'd love Simeone here.
At this present time and in our present situation I think in the short term, say until the end of the season, of those available Allardyce might be our best bet to stabilise the team.
You or anyone else have got every right to argue against Allardyce for whatever reason.
My defence of him against Steve is based purely on Steve's assertion/insinuation that Allardyce has left every club he has managed in the PL in the shit. And, somehow responsible for their relegation.
The board will make their mind up whether Unsworth stays or someone comes in.
If it is Allardyce then so be it I will still support Everton Football Club, if it's someone else I'll still support us.
My only defence of Allardyce is Steves allegations which I still find ridiculous.
352 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:35:56
353 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:37:49
354 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:39:02
355 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:40:12
Like just stop and think about it , Alderdyce and Unsworth are the only two guys who really want the fucking job , not even Dyce is interested any more.
We sell our striker for below the going rate before we replace him.
We buy a load of players that aren't going to make a huge difference and fail to sign better players in the areas we really need them.
We sack our manager before we have a replacement sorted.
It's just plain negligence by the chairman , Moshiri ( who hasn't a fucking clue about what's needed ) in my opinion.
We continue to make bad decisions , it's no wonder we are in a fucking mess.
356 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:46:07
Did you see Moshiri on TV during and after the Watford game? Moshiri kept watching Kenwright celebrate and then begun half-heartedly trying to join in. It looked as if Moshiri didn't have a clue as to what he should be doing when we scored or when the game finished.
Moshiri standing there, blank expression on his face, taking his cues from Kenwright... Absolutely hilarious but very worrying. The guy looks lost in the world of football and I can imagine Kenwright knows this.
357 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:46:27
358 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:49:28
At the moment I think there is a fracture between differnet cliques and felt it was there when Lukaku was around.
Therefore we need a strong experienced manager to recreate the harmony and togetherness and that man is definitely not Unsy,
Allardyce has credentials but we would have to turn aroungd his dogged philosophy once he's gone so we might aw well do it mow.
Personally I would go and get Ancelotti at any price. He has the man management, tactical ability and football philosophy required and has managed and won at the highest levels.
No pissing around with sticking plaster get him in now.
359 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:52:03
As John points out there are better candidates than Allardyce and for me thats who we should be persuing. John Keating I don't believe we are in a as bad a state as you think, in as much as I believe given till Xmas Unsworth could turn this club around.
Both my sons and my Grandson like me are season ticket holders but I have said if Allardyce comes then I wont go to the match which will break my heart. And after 60 odd years of going, the thought of not going to Goodison will kill me but thats the way I feel. And rightly other supporters will say you wont be missed and I probably wont. I have seen many bad managers and awful teams but I just cant go and watch Allardyces non football tactics.
360 Posted 07/11/2017 at 15:59:13
Because I would be happy to SUPPORT the club with Alladyce in charge, it is because it will have been the board's choice and I would back the manager and our team. I would go the match and I'd hope to the heavens that we move up that table.
You've made it clear many times that you don't want to see Alladyce here. You've said he's a crook and you wouldn't want him. Then you have laid out an argument to say that he hasn't really helped other clubs away from relegation: and if he did, they've gone down within three seasons.
I'm not on here to defend Alladyce as my first choice and if he's picked, I assume it's because the top class foreign manager wouldn't take the job
So it seems to me youre just reiterating your view that you do not want to see Alladyce here, under any circumstances. Fair enough. To you, it seems that anyone who accepts that Alladyce would make good manager for us in the situation we're in, is somehow a fan of him.
If you want to walk away should Alladyce become our manager, the fair enough. But all this about him not being a good manager is, in my view, being prejudiced by his off the field activities.
He hasn't been banned form managing in the Premier League has he? So he hasn't broken any code that they League have in place.
So as Charlie Lloyd and John Keating have said, so do I. If Sam Alladyce becomes our manager, I will support him and the team.
361 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:04:57
I've not been going quite as long as you Brian but in your time can you remember any time you have seen us so bad so early in the season ?
I can't, and I think the sooner we do something the better. The longer we leave it, like anything in life, it's usually more difficult to sort out and might be too late.
In the past we've had questionable defence but at least someone to score or vice versa. Unfortunately this time not only can't we defend we can't score either !
Unsworth or any new manager may not change things around but we have to give ourselves the best possible chance. Just the thought of a relegation scrap is horrendous.
At the end of the season we can hopefully get something sorted but right now we need action.
362 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:10:24
363 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:12:33
"not all of his teams get relegated three seasons after, most go down within 12 months. He leaves them in a right mess."
That is a LIE Steve, a totally false perception you are trying to push, which is strange given the high moral stand you are taking in regard to appointing Sam.
Check out these links.
First managerial job at Blackpool - Link
Appointed in the summer of 1994 after Blackpool finished 20th in the old 3rd division JUST missing relegation, in 2 seasons he took them to the play-offs but they lost. Bizarrely sacked by the very VERY dodgy Blackpool chairman Owen Oyston (see yesterday's High Court Ruling), Blackpool appointed such luminaries as Nigel Worthington, Gary Megson and Steve McMahon and were relegated in May 2000 FOUR YEARS after Sam left. Yet it was all Sam's fault, on your logic.
Next up, Notts County - appointed manager in January 1997 - Link
Already struggling, he couldn't save them from relegation from the old Division 2 to 3, but in his first full season with them County broke several club and national records, winning the title by a 19-point margin and becoming the first post-war side to win promotion in March.
In spite of a strict transfer policy, he kept them in Div 2 before moving to Bolton in October 1999. Subsequently, Notts County became a real basket case, tumbling down the league's and only fan intervention prevented the nation's oldest football club from being dissolved.
All Big Sam's fault, Steve?
Meanwhile, Bolton - Link
Despite being in the bottom half of the table when he took over, Bolton reached the old Division 2 play-offs, losing to Ipswich Town, reached the semis in both domestic cups.
The following season they returned to the PL where, in the next 7 seasons, he got the club into Europe for the first time and when he left for Newcastle in May 2007 Bolton were 5th in the PL with 2 games to go.
His replacement Sammy Lee didn't last 6 months. Gary Megson barely a year and then Owen Coyle oversaw their nailed on relegation in May 2012 - FIVE YEARS after Sam left. But all his fault, you claim Steve.
At Newcastle - Link
Sam got off to a flyer - 5 wins, 2 draws in his first 9 games. Unfortunately for him, he was appointed by Freddy Shepherd who in that summer sold the club to Mike Ashley. The barcodes had a difficult December and Ashley listened to the mob, sacking Sam in January 2008 and reinstating Kevin Keegan.
Newcastle became another basket case. Remember Keegan and Dennis Wise? Joe Kinnear? Alan Shearer and his assistant Iain Dowie who oversaw relegation to the Championship in May 2009?
And you blame Sam for that circus???!!!
In December 2008 Sam was appointed at Blackburn - Link
Paul Ince left the club 19th in the PL with just 3 wins in the first half of the season. Sam immediately had a 9 game unbeaten run and they finished a comfortable 15th. The next season they finished 10th and reached the semis of the League Cup.
The notorious Venky's took over in 2010 and with Blackburn in 10th, they immediately sacked Sam. Since then, they have had Steve Kean, Henning Berg, Michael Appleton, Gary Bower, Paul Lambert, Owen Coyle and currently Tony Mowbray as their manager. How has that gone for them? They were relegated from the PL under Coyle in 2012 and last season from the Championship to Div 2 under a combination of Coyle and Mowbray.
Clearly, all Sam's fault eh Steve?
In June 2011 Sam took over at WHU, recently relegated from the PL to the Championship - Link
He oversaw a HUGE turnover of playing staff, but still won promotion back to the PL at the first time of asking.
WHU finished 10th in their first season back in the PL, then 13th and 12th in his next 2 (as well as reaching the League Cup semis) before leaving in May 2015 when his contract was not renewed.
He was replaced by Bilic who, in his 1st season, saw the team break several club records in the Premier League era: highest number of points (62), highest number of goals in a season (65), the least number of games lost in a season (8) and the lowest number of away defeats (5).
And STILL you want to claim where WHU are today is all Sam's fault Steve?
In October 2015 Sam took over at Sunderland - Link
They were 19th in the PL with 3 points from their first 8 games. I won't remind you who they thumped 3-0 at the Stadium of Light to comfortably avoid the drop by season's end.
England called, that scandal broke, he went to Palace in December 2016 - Link
They were 17th having won just 6 of 36 PL games played in the calendar year. They avoided relegation under Sam with a game to go.
All Sam's fault that Palace remain in a mess today Steve?
Look Steve, Sam Allardyce is certainly not my preferred choice as the next Everton manager. But he is nowhere as bad as you wish to paint him and I find it really bizarre that you are somehow trying to make him directly culpable for what subsequently happened at the clubs he managed when quite clearly there were other considerable mitigating circumstances rather than your explicitly expressed opinion - that Sam Allardyce ALWAYS leaves clubs in a mess.
You've called this one badly, BADLY wrong, Steve.
364 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:13:33
Deadly Dave will raise the white flag in the Presser tomorrow. Just like he did at Sunderland... Bullet dodged by us.
365 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:17:37
366 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:18:46
Throughout his managerial career, Allardyce has slavishly played the percentages, pure and simple. He plays for corners and free kicks, which is why almost 50% of all goals scored by sides under his stewardship have come directly from a set-piece.
He has his teams set up in such in such a way that, once he's removed from the equation, any successor has to either try to replicate exactly what he's done or, inevitably, watch results falter as they seek to move away from his limited last resort methods, with a squad of rapidly assembled robotic grocks hand picked because they can run, jump and are the 'right height'.
If Allardyce were to be coming into the club, he'd want assurances that he could trawl the market for his sort of player when the transfer window opens. It's his first port of call. At Palace, he spent the most money of any Premier League team in the last January window. A year earlier he brought in five players to Sunderland at the same point. All signings made for the sake of an instant lift to secure a short-term goal of survival. On both occasions he pin pointed his mid season transfer manouvrings as being absolutely key to pulling his team to safety.
During his years at West Ham he was criticised by fans, ex players, and even the club owners for lack of forward planning, for not paying any attention at all to the academy, not attending any of the games or allowing any of the youth players to train alongside the first-team. The accusation was that he had no interest whatsoever in the longer term interests of the club. His response? To suddenly name a side stuffed with previously snubbed youth players for an FA Cup clash v Notts Forest that saw them get tonked 5-0. Afterwards, the academy players were said to be completely shellshocked with their confidence left flushed down the shitter. Still, Sam's first-team mob got a rest, it cleared the way for him to concentrate on the only competition he cared about and it was a cracking way to try and prove a point.
Handing him the reigns at a time when the club has just had a recent influx of overpriced selected-for-their-stats shite, and one of the few plus points to provide any hope for the future has been the progression of young players toward the first-team squad, would be as pointless as pouring poison in a fucking Peri-Peri Pot Noodle.
First sign of slipping into the shit and we could end up saddled with a dream team of 'I'm the secret behind someone elses success, honest' Steve Walsh, self-aggrandising 'I discovered stats a short while before anyone else, so I'm defo not a dinosaur' Big Sam, and snide 'it's not a knife boss, it's a back scratcher' Craig Shakespeare. Absolute calamity.
After the win on Sunday, and despite how shite we've been this season, we only sit four points outside the top half of the table (whilst being closer to the bottom three, I know), with games against Palace, Southampton, West Ham and Huddersfield next up. This league is crap in the main and two consecutive wins can change the entire complexion of a wiltering campaign.
Hysterical panic shouldn't pave the way for a hasty "he'll do" appointment of a bloke whose main attraction is simply hauling our arse out of 'trouble'. Not when a mere couple of results, from a more kind run of fixtures, could quickly render such compromise unnecessary.
367 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:19:23
If Moshiri thinks he can get Simeone he may have heard something from his agent.Hes probably getting some leverage for a pay rise.
Mr Mosh would be better off saying nothing until its a done deal.
And with the backdrop of the Giroud, Barkley and Niasse fiascos this wont be over until the ink is dry on the contract.
368 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:23:57
369 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:30:16
Firstly we've got two hopes of getting him: Bob Hope and no hope.
Anyone with an ounce of common knows it's pie in the sky so IF he's on the shortlist, why?
IF, and until it's confirmed for definite it is just an IF, he IS on the short list then my ever dwindling faith in Moshiri has taken a further knock because it certainly shows he's a complete dreamer and not being realistic and what was being suggested on Talksport the other day about him knowing very little and purely taking the advice of others may have some credence.
It's a very worrying time and the club's certainly in a crisis.
I think whoever takes over with the present squad will struggle, which is why I feel it may not be a bad idea to stick with someone who already knows the players well rather than someone starting from scratch, until the January window at least.
I think in that window we need a minimum of FIVE players that are way better than what we already have.
Every one of those players should have, as an absolute must; PACE!
Moshiri will have to be prepared to BUY our way to safety IMO.
370 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:33:26
Tony Marsh and the likes were pushing to get rid of Moyes for years because of his perceived negative long ball percentage football tactics. He gets what he wants and, lo and behold, we are in a relegation dog fight!
So what's Tony Marsh's answer? Bring in the undisputed king of negative long ball percentage tactics Big Sam who is also probably one of the most corrupt and highest paid managers in top flight football in the world.
In summary, let's not get Big Sam, it's a disaster in the making.
371 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:33:30
Did Newcastle go down within 3 years of Crooked Sam Leaving? Yes they did.
Did Blackburn go down within 18 months of Crooked Sam leaving? Yes they did.
Did Sunderland go down within 12 months of Crooked Sam leaving? Yes they did.
Are Palace bottom of the league and likely to go down within 12 months of Crooked Sam leaving? Yes they are
Are West Ham in the relegation zone, and if they go down is it within 36 months of Crooked Sam leaving? Yes it is.
And you point is what?
372 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:41:59
You are right that some positive results in the four games you list (I'd add the Huddersfield at home and Newcastle away fixtures as well) will see us sitting mid table and moving away from the threat of relegation.
However up until the last quarter of the game on Sunday it was difficult to see where the next win would come from. Sunday's result may well be a catalyst and I hope Unsworth stays in post for the immediate future but should we have 4 bad results against the teams around us then we will undoubtedly be in a relegation battle by Christmas.
Unfortunately we may well then be in a place where we need the "appointment of a bloke whose main attraction is simply hauling our arse out of 'trouble'."
373 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:42:29
It's like saying Fergie was a rubbish manager, look how shite the Mancs were despite £300m being spent after he left
374 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:43:15
Go to the game to watch an Allardyce team? I'd prefer to clean my oven with my tongue!
Watch an Allardyce team on the TV?? I'd prefer to watch Eastenders!!
Allardyce?? Seriously??? He's got to be the manager I'd least associate with a club like ours!! Pond scum for clubs like Newcastle, Sunderland etc who are laughingstocks of the football world!!
If Allardyce is the answer, what's the fucking question lads and Ladies???
375 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:44:08
We haven't heard a peep out of the club, standard operating procedure when things are going to shit. Someone needs to get a grip and fast. Players are downing tools, no matter what they say in the press. I don't think the respect is there for Unsworth and the rest of the set-up.
Sandro & Vlasic, who've had little more than 5 minutes at the club want away already. We have no idea who is in charge, where has Bobby Elstone been in our hour of need? The C.E.O. hasn't been heard from since the our last award for "Worst bogs in the Premier League."
We are rudderless, and our new investor seems to be a puppet for a richer, more powerful man. We are the only club in the League without a recognised number nine, after flogging our top scorer months ago. We've flushed around £230m in 12 months. No news on the new stadium, despite Elstone stating there would be a 'key principles' document published shortly - on the 26th July!!!
Apart from that, everything's fine.
376 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:44:59
These pages are a very good indicator of that.
And would after, heavy speculation, move away from Sam as a real alternative.
Id hope the club realise that the transfers window is more important than appointing a manager at this point. A good window to address the glaring deficiencies in the squad then review the options.
377 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:47:13
Youve just posted all the reasons not to have Allardyce, a lower league manager who has won nothing, we need a proven winner to take us forward not a loser to take us backwards, youll be championing Warnock next
378 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:47:44
379 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:54:01
ps: For those worried about Steve getting sued... he's a lawyer.
380 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:56:04
If gives the club some breathing space to contact and talk to the man they want.
Big Sam is a red herring on one end of the scale and Simeone is one at the other end.
Its all a smokescreen whilst they are manoeuvring.
The real new will come out in a few days time.
381 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:56:07
My dog died about 2 months after Allardyce left Newcastle. I know someone in Leeds got divorced about 6 months after he left Blackburn.
There was a guy in Stockport broke his leg only weeks after he left Sunderland.
That fucking Allardyce should never come near this club. You have definitely now proved your point. Brilliant logic.
382 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:56:35
Even then, it seems to me that we need at least another centre half, someone like Maguire, as we're shipping in goals at an alarming rate. It looks like Bainsey's days of bombing up and down the wing are gone, so we need another leftback as well by the looks of it. Then there's a goalscorer to find, I would imagine!
If we put unsworth in charge until the end of the season, we're still going to need some players to give us a good chance of getting away from relegation.
Then we will have to either keep Unsy on, or give the job to a "Top Manager" (if he'll come.) He'd then need to assess what we've got on the playing staff and coaching staff, then try and get in players to begin the following season.
It might well be the right thing to do and give Unsworth until then, or even to the January Transfer Window.
But the longer we leave making a choice, the less time any manager, other than Unsy, will have in trying to sort out the playing staff andf the positions that need filling.
So it's gamble whatever the Board do. It seems that they are going to make a decision in the next week or so, and presumably, it will be one of the four in the supposed short list, which is supposed to include Unsworth. So they must be looking at (presumably) possible better options, as they think, than Unsworth. If they pick any one of the four my guess it would be because of their experience of managing a team in the top flight, unless we get a "Top Foreign " whose supposed to be on the list.
Whoever, I think the sooner we get someone in place permanently, then the better. It's not so much a case of he'll do, but he'll do the job, in my view. Though there's no guarantees whatever happens.
383 Posted 07/11/2017 at 16:57:04
So, in your own words, by your own calculations, you have totally blown out of the water and disproved your own claim @ 306 that:
"most [clubs managed by Sam Allardyce] go down within 12 months. He leaves them in a right mess."
My point Steve? I really thought you were cleverer than that.
As my earlier post clearly references, there were a considerable number of other 'mitigating circumstances' other than your bald singular and ill-considered one: namely, a direct consequence of Sam Allardyce managing a club is that they end up getting relegated years after he leaves them.
Can you really not see the absurdity of your claim, Steve?
For someone taking such a high moral stance on the Sam Allardyce question, you are being curiously deceitful in your assessment of the subsequent history of clubs which he has managed.
384 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:00:03
385 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:00:04
386 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:01:06
Ok, maybe it's not.
387 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:09:50
We are crashing out of Europe with the worst ever record for an English team. We have one point so far from our games against the "Big 6" with 3 goals scored and 15 goals conceded. And as for entertaining football how much of that have you seen over the last 3 seasons?
You ask what the question is if Allardyce is the answer perhaps it's "How are we going to stay up?" I'm sure that no one ever wanted to be associated with him and I understand the fear that has caused some to consider him as an option.
388 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:11:01
If his level of mediocrity is what you want for Everton, then good luck to you. Everton are meant to be chasing down the top 6. Allardyce cannot do that. 11 games into a season and now it's all about staying up? That's ridiculous.
With a decent coach we can turn this around. We don't need to sign more than a striker. Moshiri in his comments to Jim White made it clear he wants a manager who can get the best out of this squad. I doubt Moshiri will be happy making a load of signings in January.
389 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:11:03
Presuming the Jay you address is me, can I also presume you are hard of reading?
I am not championing Sam Allardyce to be our manager!
Similarly, I would NEVER champion Warnock as our manager as you snidely state.
You evidently overlooked this line in my post: "Sam Allardyce is certainly not my preferred choice as the next Everton manager."
Indeed, like many, I don't see the NEED for Sam's 'relegation dog-fight' skills he allegedly brings at this time.
There are 27 PL games to go still. We are a long, LONG way from being in the Last Chance Saloon. I'm looking up, not down. There is certainly better options out there than Big Sam for both our immediate and longer term future, if the gig is not offered to Unsworth.
I was addressing one poster, who in this thread has repeatedly made a false claim about one of our possible managerial candidates. Nothing more.
Do try and be a bit more attentive, Eric.
390 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:12:33
391 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:14:42
392 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:16:16
John Daley #365 - the qualitative analysis.
Together, they scream out at me - let Sam bounce elsewhere.
393 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:17:21
394 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:26:27
Sigh! You really aren't getting it, are you Steve? Like Eric, seemingly, to who I've just posted a response.
I am not championing Sam Allardyce to be our manager!
I said as much in my original post in this thread @ 362 when, addressing you directly, I wrote:
"Look Steve, Sam Allardyce is certainly not my preferred choice as the next Everton manager."
So don't try any slight of hand with me by accusing me thus: "If his level of mediocrity is what you want for Everton, then good luck to you."
A truly twattish falsehood to project on to a fellow poster.
Read what I've just written to Eric. I'm in agreement with you about it being just 11 games into a season. I categorically state I don't see the need for Big Sam because I am looking up. I don't consider there is a 'need' for Sam's alleged relegation dog fighting skills.
As for you stating you said 3 years (in reference to the 'mess' Sam leaves behind). Yes you did Steve. Across several posts.
But then @ 306 - YOUR post that I referenced and directly copied and pasted - you wrote this:
"Jon, not all of his teams get relegated three seasons after, most go down within 12 months. He leaves them in a right mess."
You are wrong about 3 years. You are most definitely wrong about 12 months.
Steve ole son, you seem to be struggling to recall what you have claimed in this thread and having even more difficulty justifying those claims.
I am not alone in seeing this.
395 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:30:29
I've no problem there Jay. None at all.
396 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:30:54
397 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:32:08
398 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:32:31
399 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:33:07
400 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:39:14
401 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:39:29
402 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:43:30
No acknowledgement from you - none whatsoever - that there were, as I and others have pointed out, a considerable number of other determining factors that were possibly far more influential in seeing clubs that were managed by Sam relegated.
And you go further, in a lame attempt to 'bulk up' your exposed numbers you now project relegation on to 2 clubs who, like Everton, also have 27 games in which to redeem their season.
So sorry Steve, but as you have presented your case, it doesn't constitute FACT as you claim. Just made up opinion by manipulating data and arriving at a false conclusion.
403 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:44:09
Get well soon, Sam!
404 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:44:54
405 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:46:32
Acai and fish on the menu.
406 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:47:43
The worst possible outcome is a fudge with someone appointed on a short-term basis and with undefined prospects of a big summer change or with a general fog hanging over our plans.
That sort of mish-mash will find its way onto the pitch and will drain what little coherence we retain at a crucial time.
There are too many cooks again. We need a clear appointment, quickly.
407 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:47:48
408 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:48:09
Could do with some salt & pepper wings from the blue dragon though. Do they deliver?
409 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:48:10
410 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:48:35
Give it up, Steve, or come back with real facts not Fernsy Facts.
411 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:49:38
412 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:51:16
413 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:51:33
414 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:53:27
415 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:55:42
416 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:56:00
As your post is there for all to see I assumed anybody could reply
417 Posted 07/11/2017 at 17:58:59
“The one that's really, really interesting, the dream candidate we're being told is Diego Simeone the Atletico Madrid manager,” Solhekol said on Sky Sports News.
“We understand he is the No 1 choice of Everton's owner Farhad Moshiri, a man who has a lot of money. He's the man who Moshiri wants.”
Liverpool supporters think it's hilarious their rivals are targeting Simeone. Do they now? He who laughs last laughs longest! 😋
418 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:01:12
Does short-term to end of season count as a Yes??
419 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:01:52
420 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:02:56
421 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:05:20
Tony, what no Chang? Come on, all profits to Bill.
422 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:07:47
The talk of Simeone, Tuchel , Ancellotti et al reminds me of agent Johnson promising us a pleasant surprise and a world class manager followed by Howard Kendall mark 3. Its assumed as well that the going rate for an Everton manager is £5-6 million. Again looking at the sustainability of the club it shouldn't be. And after the expense of Martinez and Koeman and their coaching teams I query whether it is possible.
So David Unsworth? Someone mentioned the boot room. The difficulty with that is that he would be the first occupant and beyond his fantastic achievements with the U-23s and the conveyor belt of talent we just don't know. From his games to date, they give me a mixed picture and I would like to think that our board (though I have little confidence there) would be doing that type of analysis. Areas of concern in all 4 games with the way he has started games, balance, lack of striker at Lyon, etc but against that an ability to react and to change and a lack of sentiment too in making hard choices from the bench. But I don't know and I think most of us on this site would honestly say that. Certainly has generated effort and passion but again not consistently through games. And some of the football against Watford, successful though it ultimately was, was some of the worst I have seen since I started going in the 1960s.
I would take Dave Unsworth but only if, in addition to one or two old Evertonians he feels comfortable with (and who may or may not be coaches of fantastic potential ), there is a serious appointment of an assistant and, personally, although associated with Allardyce during the brief England tenure (before the morals side of Allardyce came to the fore) I think Craig Shakespeare would be a great appointment. Much admired at Leicester as a tactician and training ground organiser/coach and someone who got the best out of sometimes limited players and a lot of disquiet when he was sacked..but not necessarily right to be the manager. My main reservation is his closeness to Walsh on whom the jury is very definitely out.
Anyway that's my view. But what do I know (like the rest of us).
423 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:09:10
We were sick of Moyes and his KITAP1 football when he consistently got us top 8 placings. We're now considering appointing a manager who advocates percentages and places a massive emphasis on getting goals from set-pieces. He can almost guarantee safety but not much else. Surely we have more ambition than this?
Appointing Allardyce is saying to every other club that we are content to be in the Premier League and make up the numbers. That the only thing we value is being in the same league as teams like our noisy neighbours. That we will sell our best players and just exist. Mike Walker, Walter Smith, Kendall Mark III were dark times but the day that Allardyce is named as manager is the day when anyone who quotes our club motto will be laughed at with complete justification. We must accept better than this.
Some fans want to question other fans for saying they'll stop paying the club money or will stop going to the games if Allardyce is appointed. Maybe empty seats and slower season-ticket sales will finally awake the board that we won't just give our hard-earned and put up with anything.
424 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:13:03
I have already pointed out that Lee's stats for Allardyce at 14, do not add up. I don't know the correct figures, but just pointing out that those stats don't match up.
425 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:19:29
426 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:21:53
Please let us, for once, be decisive.
427 Posted 07/11/2017 at 18:49:17
If yes, they will go for Alladyce till the end of the season. They have too much at stake to go down.
If no (I really hope they do) then by all means lets put someone in place with the skill and the ability to take us back up the table and playing to a plan with a style of football that we would like to see.
If they are unsure then they will err on the side of caution and be pragmatic.
Frankly, as I have said before, surely their number one priority is ensuring we stay up. If they think we have enough about us to ensure we can, then its not Big Sam or SD, but if it is one of them is selected then the board must believe we are in serious trouble.
We are now having to deal with the consequences of a negligent board, Koeman was bad news, but he wasn't the only culprit and they are getting off scott free, lost in the panic of finding a new manager.
428 Posted 07/11/2017 at 19:19:18
This from his Wiki page: Allardyce has been labelled as a long ball manager by some analysts, though has disputed this perception as "totally and utterly wrong". He takes a modern, technology and statistics centred approach to tactics and coaching, and has been praised for his organisational and man-management skills.
I actually had no idea he was heavily into the technical analysis side of the game - I thought he just went out Mick McCarthy style and told them to kick it to the other blokes in the same shirts, run about a lot and hope for the best.
429 Posted 07/11/2017 at 19:25:24
"Everton board's muddled thinking explains the delay over new manager"
430 Posted 07/11/2017 at 19:44:45
Regarding what type of club are we? One of six clubs never to be relegated from the premier league? One of the teams that's played the most top flight football... ever!
A club with supposed long-term plans and ambition? A club with a large, global, loyal fan base? A club who undertakes extensive community charity? Ah never mind
Derek (#381), duly noted!!
431 Posted 07/11/2017 at 20:12:46
You are so far out there that you can be.
Look at our team. What do we lack? We lack strength in the air. Considering we have one of the best freekick takers in the whole league we produce almost nothing from set pieces (apart from one goal last game and Rooney against Stoke).
How the hell on earth can anyone want a manager that I known for scoring on corners and freekicks to come to our team???
Since we do not have a single player strong in the air I say that would be the most stupid hiring of a manager in Everton since I was born. And I was born 44 year ago.
How can you not see that Unsworth have much more potential than Allardyce will ever have?
432 Posted 07/11/2017 at 20:28:58
433 Posted 07/11/2017 at 20:44:16
Now, I believe that Kenwright (who I would have out of our Club tomorrow) does have some influence within EFC but a genuine question to those who feel that he "calls the shots" do you seriously think he would favour Allardyce as our manager when Moyes was still available (and he was until earlier today)?
Tony Marsh (#310) "I haven't called anyone anything". Really? I think Steve Ferns, amongst others could challenge you on that claim!
434 Posted 07/11/2017 at 21:41:53
Yes you are correct the number of wins, losses and draws are adrift of the number of games by 20. I checked that and just assumed (rightly or wrongly) that the total of games was wrong, Thanks for pointing it out, Mike.
435 Posted 07/11/2017 at 21:46:15
436 Posted 07/11/2017 at 22:26:08
Long term plans and ambitions? Staying in the Premier League is probably the sum total of our ambition right now.
437 Posted 07/11/2017 at 22:35:47
We are a mid-table Premier League team. We are light-years away from the top 4, and probably will be for some time. So Allardyce, Unsworth or Dyche, are the best we can hope for.
438 Posted 07/11/2017 at 23:27:53
I am curious as to why people want Silva? What has he shown in the EPL? He was part of Hull getting relegated. His side leaked goals. With Watford, his side leaks goals at a rate of nearly two per game. They couldn't hold a 2-0 lead, against, uhmm, Everton. His style of play works in lesser leagues and with a team with the players and money like Man City. Everton are not that team. He is also currently below Burnley on run of form and in the table. I fear that he is more Martinez than Pochettino.
I favor Dyche. He can integrate players and is a good man-manager. His teams take points from the big 6 and currently are sitting on 19 points tied with Arsenal and Liverpool. His team scored 72 goals (tied for most) in winning the Championship playing multiple styles of football in 2015-16, when everyone was raving about how impressive Middlesbrough was. Dyche finds a way through balance, organization, and tactics. Dyche is adaptive and resourceful but he realizes games are won by a good defense.
As for Unsworth, well I just don't think he has enough experience for the job. However, if the choice is Silva or Unsworth, I take Unsworth. Drop the interim from the title and turn him loose. If the choice however is Dyche or Unsworth, I take Dyche and let Unsworth learn from him.
If the choice involves Big Sam, well I will start watching Leicester and squinting at the tv until the blue players look like Everton and then just pretend that it is.
439 Posted 07/11/2017 at 23:39:23
This manager hunt is another of Everton Football Club's endless farces.
440 Posted 08/11/2017 at 02:13:08
Does anyone remember him doing it to us in 2010? The game where Tim Howard dropped the ball for the winner.
I've never seen a more cynical performance. Blackburn defended and didn't bother leaving their half until they won a free kick - at which point they threw the centre backs forward and the keeper pumped the ball into the box.
Tactically, it worked well. As a spectacle it was awful, and at their home ground too.
There is more than one way to win a football match. I'd much prefer we find a different way. And while the Venky's can be vilified, don't tell me that Sam's style improved Blackburn's PL survival chances - they were doomed as soon as he went.
He's kind of like standing someone on a rocky stool, putting their head in a noose, then being hailed for providing the stool.
441 Posted 08/11/2017 at 15:05:06
We are not Crystal Palace, no disrespect. Will someone pinch me and end this current nightmare? We Are Everton... we are a squad of great players who, with two world class centre forwards would be top 5.
Spend the money on a Number 9. Not that big horrible twat.
442 Posted 08/11/2017 at 21:11:41
One minute it's Dyche, then it's Silva, then it's Tuchel, then it's Allardyce, then it's Simeone (as if!) and then it's back to Unsworth... What is going on?
You could argue it's just newspapers fuelling rumours to create internet traffic and sell papers. But right now we have an U23 coach in charge of the first team. As much as I dont doubt Unsworth loves the club, bleeds blue and wears blue pyjamas, he is not the long-term answer for the club. It's almost as if the club simply has no idea who to hire or approach as manager.
It's now obvious that firing Koeman was a knee-jerk reaction as there seems to be no proper plan in place to replace him.
This season we have had the full spectrum of incompetence:
- Inability to sign a striker;
- Odd Jim White soundbites;
- Panorama Investigation;
- A squad in total disarray;
- Senior players sent home from training;
And to top it all off, we are now effectively managerless and pulling names out of a hat.
Kenwright, Moshiri and Co are not fit to run a five-a-side team at the moment – never mind one of the biggest clubs in the Premier League. One has to ask “What the hell is going on at EFC right now?"
443 Posted 09/11/2017 at 09:18:51
444 Posted 09/11/2017 at 17:58:15
Tactics Explained: Why Everton Should Hire Thomas Tuchel
445 Posted 09/11/2017 at 18:53:12
My team based on their analysis would be:
Lookman Sigurdsson Davies Lennon
Baines Jagielka Keane Kenny
446 Posted 10/11/2017 at 17:12:43
But it's not innovative. Have a look at what I posted on the Tom Davies thread, particularly about our 1970 side. The 4-1-4-1, becoming 2-3-4-1, discussed in the video, was basically what we played. Labone and Hurst were the solid 2 at the back, Wright and Brown/Newton were the two full-backs who could push forward. Kendall was a very intelligent player, he was the more defensive midfielder behind Ball and Harvey, who were simply brilliant footballers. Morrissey and Husband played wide but would drop back to help the midfield, Royle led the line.
I find your tactical posts interesting, they make me think about the game. But a lot of this stuff is not new. The key is players who can operate in different areas of the pitch whilst remaining disciplined. If that can be aligned to skill and tenacity you really are onto a winner. I will get mocked by some for saying so but I genuinely believe we have the basis of a very good side at the moment.
447 Posted 10/11/2017 at 17:23:48
448 Posted 11/11/2017 at 11:57:51
Football is circular. Defences constantly go between back threes and back fours. Midfields between 3s, 4s and 5s. Attacks between 1s, 2s and 3s.
There's the continuous struggle between attack and defence. Attacking coaches try to find a way to exploit the system of the season and create overloads against it. Defensive coaches look for ways to block the overloads and then try to catch the attacking team on the bench.
As for the current manager, we've got 2 days to appoint someone. If no one is in place by Monday, then Unsworth is in charge for palace. If Unsworth is in for palace then he will stay in for Atalanta, West Ham, the trip to Cyprus and before you know it, it's Christmas.
I believe the board want to stick with Unsworth. It appears nothing better is out there, ready to take over and so they wish to wait and see. Meantime Unsworth hasn't had the results to justify it, so they're gambling he beats palace and picks up a few results so that they can appoint him in the interim.
In one of these cosy chats with uncle bill, I bet they've told him as much. I think that's represented in his overly attacking team against Leicester, and his clear orders to rest players against Lyon.
449 Posted 11/11/2017 at 18:39:30
Ommiting Vlasic altogether is perplexing. Lookman was in virtually every fans' team to start... not Unsworth's. No width or pace again, and we had to be 2 down before we got somewhere near the correct team.
Basics really. He needs to learn his trade much further down the ladder. The board needs to stop dithering and get a proper manager in.
450 Posted 11/11/2017 at 18:57:27
451 Posted 11/11/2017 at 19:25:56
His team selections have not been great but the players have shown a little bit more motiavtion which I would expect.
However if we have serious ambitions to be great again we need an experienced and progressive tactician and a man manager that can handle big egos.
452 Posted 11/11/2017 at 19:47:29
The gamble with "a name" is that he'll cost a fortune and will demand a few signings of his choice in January (Mancini's reportedly said to want £15mill p.a. to return to the Premier League!). Whoever it is may well see fit to sell, if anyone wants them for acceptable money, at least as many from the current squad. And in the summer he buggers off to allow the next one to come in, get rid of a few more, sign a few more, try to impose a system that doesn't offend the squad and, oh yes, win a few games and perhaps even play entertaining football for those people, whoever they are, that happen to be around the pitch when the pro's, about whom he will always gush despite what we've all just seen, try to do their stuff.
Who'd be a billionaire owner relying on a self-serving serial-failure for advice?
453 Posted 11/11/2017 at 20:48:58
It's also amusing to see them jump on Rhino's results when seemingly oblivious to the fact that he inherited a team in total free-fall.
Support the big oafish buffoon as he blows a small fortune on second-rate players, drives away top talent, alienates his players, alienates the crowd, plunges our great club into free-fall with a brand of football that would have Tony Pulis watching from behind the couch... but slag off and criticise the loyal guy who steps up to pick up the flag.
It's staggering that people who apologised for the most inept performances week after week are now picking holes in the victory which finally stopped the rot.
Each to his own, I guess, but if it's so difficult to watch the guy from downstairs step in and eclipse the "global name", it's probably best to start looking the other way.
More to come from Unsworth. The soft-arsed superstars who were guaranteed a place when Korporal Klot was in charge, now realise this guy is not afraid to drop any of them.
454 Posted 11/11/2017 at 21:03:33
One would imagine that under Rhino, Ross will walk (limp) back into the first 11 immediately.
We still don't have a proper striker though, and no manager can change that until January at best - even then I'd warn all fellow Evertonians not to expect too much in the way of a top class signing.
You don't need me to tell you the reasons why a top striker is highly unlikely to join us in the transfer window and while we argue the toss over the new bloke with his head on the chopping block, our squad will still be exactly the same - motivation from any manager isn't going to address our alarming lack of firepower, and paper-thin defending within this squad.
455 Posted 11/11/2017 at 21:24:44
456 Posted 11/11/2017 at 21:28:34
It's their responsibility to act and they're fucking it up.
457 Posted 12/11/2017 at 00:43:00
As for "picking holes" in the Watford victory, well, come on. Most Twer's are of an age where objective assessment is aligned with a certain maturity. The victory was welcome but the performance was mostly worrying to me, and others, and that's not a criticism of Unsworth but I think I can imagine what our squad, stuffed with international players who've spent their entire professional lives having smoke blown up their arses by their managers and agents, will now be making of being dropped and ordered around by a guy they mainly know as "that bloke over there who looks after the kids".
Again, it's not Unsworth's fault, but maybe our ire should be directed not against fellow fans, as you always do, but towards whoever's responsible for the state of affairs as they are.
458 Posted 12/11/2017 at 08:02:43
For some time now you have been trying to undermine Unsworth by peddling this nonsense about players not respecting the guy you now refer to as "that bloke over there". What you really mean is YOU don't respect him . .Tough, he's got the gig
These is not a squad full of superstars. Take Rooney out of the equation and add up the medals they have accumulated - I think you'll find "That fella over there" has probably won more than the fucking lot of them.
You may not get it (clearly you don't) but every single person at this club will know what a monumental effort winning the league against the youngsters of some of the words richest clubs was. They will be filled with respect and admiration for him. You can only win the league you are in. . .Do you think Koeman could have done it ? don't make me laugh, neither could half the clowns masquerading as coaches in the premiership.
If you stopped guessing what you believe the shirkers who have been dropped are thinking and started concentrating the very positive comments about Rhino from the senior pro's you will be closer to understanding the situation.
As for nobody on TW slagging him off, You really are having a laugh. I logged on to the live forum for the three away games and I had a look through the comments when I got back last Sunday (very amusing) . . Lets just say I know differently.
We as a club are in deep deep shit. There are no "obvious" choice's. Nobody who can guarantee safety and no young coach worth his salt would jeopardise his reputation by risking being the guy who took Everton down. We are the proverbial poison chalice.
The options are simple. we either go with Unsworth (inexperience and all) or we take a chance on bringing in an ageing mercenary looking for another big pay day. One who may, or may not give a flying fuck as to whether we go down or not.
As a self proclaimed positive (whatever happened to them ?) you should be getting behind Unsworth, being less negative.
459 Posted 12/11/2017 at 09:11:29
460 Posted 12/11/2017 at 09:23:57
I say build from within and back Unsie!
461 Posted 12/11/2017 at 09:48:34
Anyone else that's brought in NOW would have to get to know all the players, their strengths (stop it) and their weaknesses and literally how they play.
It would be a big learning curve for the new man and It could take a new man weeks before he could actually do any good and then it really COULD be too late.
At least we know that Unsworth is in his dream job and he's going to do everything he possibly can to get us safe at the very least.
As for the club "keeping us in the dark," or however numerous people have put, it because the club isn't coming out with announcements about who they want and where they're up to and who they're interested in. That's a ridiculous view IMO.
It's business and business should be conducted privately and professionally (again stop it).
The adage of say "nowt til you've got something to say" should stand.
I think some people are too used to social media telling "everything" even when the latest flavour of the month is taking a dump.
I'm sure when there's something to say it'll be said.
If the club made a hasty decision and it turned out to be the wrong one they'd get slaughtered for not taking their time.
They're damned if they do and damned if they don't.
462 Posted 12/11/2017 at 10:05:28
We need to pray.
463 Posted 12/11/2017 at 10:17:14
I'm not convinced he's the man, but I struggle to name an available choice instead.
464 Posted 12/11/2017 at 10:37:42
As one of the top coaches unemployed currently he must surely have been sounded out?
Perhaps he's weighing it up or would rather come in January with the chance to fill in holes in the squad. Or maybe he or we are just not interested.
Tuchel as manager with Unsworth assisting him seems an appealing if unlikely combination.
465 Posted 12/11/2017 at 10:50:08
As they are backing Unsworths appointment 100% the alarm bells should be ringing. Most of them break out in a big smile when you mention his name.
We are in a state of civil war because the owner's and supporters are divided on who should be the next manager, what a mess. Sort it out quickly ? I doubt it this will linger on till the new year. By then it might be too late.
466 Posted 12/11/2017 at 10:56:02
It's not undermining of Unsworth to point to his record but he is competing to be in the big-boys league in charge of a squad in need of a manager RIGHT NOW (not early next year) that they mostly respect.
You might be surprised to hear I agree that none of our squad are "superstars" but I have the belief that some of them believe themselves to be more or less that, on account of their egos and the never-ending sycophancy that seems to envelope footballers in the system as it is in this country.
If Unsworth is appointed (or whoever else come to that) I'll give him my full support but, like Tony Hill, I am thinking we may need a bit of experience to allied with pure hope.
And if I ever have a chance meeting with our manager, he being a guy I actively reviled at the time, I hope I'd have the courage to tell him to his face rather than just creep away to endlessly rail against him on a keyboard.
467 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:03:06
I think hes more of a coach because like Koeman, hes chopped and changed, and after the way we set up and then played in his first match at Chelsea, then I thought that was a big mistake.
Read Steve Fearns, he loves tactics and formations, and John Mcfarlane, who has seen a lot of football, said most of the language used in some of Steves posts, would only really be needed if you was taking an examination?
I agreed with John, and think its much more important to get the players, to play a system that suits them, rather than setting up your teams formation around the opposition, which is something that most coaches will try and do.
I think management is different though, and think most good managers will try and concentrate on getting things right for there own team rather than worrying about the opposition?
Dyche does this, he keeps it simple so everyone knows their own job inside out, and I think him and Unsworth could get along, so I would make Unsy, Dyches number two?
Not everyones cup of tea, I know, and Im not even sure myself, but if Dyche, was to get the job, I could honestly see a really good partnership develop between these two fellas, but then again, what do I know!
468 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:13:28
Is it then fair to say that the problem facing the board is completely the same as the issues we all have between ourselves?
This very thread in & of itself feels like the Everton boardroom - completely split and full of opinion, with no resolution...you can see their dilemma.
469 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:18:48
If Dyche is as good as you think he is he won't have anyone telling him who is number two will be. All managers bring there own team in don't they?. Imagine Bill K saying to Dyche ok son the jobs yours but you've got to give Rhino the right hand man Job. Never going to happen mate.
470 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:19:01
Ray (463), you are of the mind that Unsworth has consistently got his starting line ups wrong. I see it differently. To me it's evident even after only 4 games at the helm that Unsworth has already recognised the severe limitations of the playing staff he is having to work with and as a result has so far opted for starting selections and tactics aimed at trying to make sure that we are still in the game at half time.
471 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:28:11
472 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:37:38
Until then, as far as the coaching debate is concerned, a motivator who can make the best of the tools at his disposal is what is required. I have no idea if any of the outside candidates bring this, but our board has shown with the last 2 appointments at being seduced by two managers who were all mouth and no trousers. These two spectacularly lost sight of the basics and the team paid a heavy price.
Defending and attacking set pieces, defensive organisation, managing squad morale have all been badly neglected.
Off the pitch, the role of Walsh has to come under more scrutiny. The man who proposed the purchase of Belfodil - rejected by Koeman and now a flop at Bremen - and who cannot be disassociated from the shambolic transfer policy, has to be given a narrower mandate.
He should not have a say in the next coach. His job should be to arrange a trimming down of the bloated squad and shipping out players who are surplus to requirements at the best price.
He needs to convince Giroud's missus to let Hubby play for us, or find a better alternative. He needs to focus on securing a solid but pacey CB and a solid LB.
If he fails to do this in January he should be fucked off too. Perhaps then it will be time we returned to the model of letting the manager take charge of player recruitment.
473 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:39:54
Against Leicester he went for it from kick off. He had had a good session and an inflated view of what we were capable of and it cost us. Leicester countered us easily until he changed it at half time and made us more solid.
Against Lyon, he made us solid to start and then said he wanted to “open the the game up”. He said he was forced to do this earlier because of their goal. Then he said they became too open as they had to win and so were forced to chase it. He was looking to bring wingers on with their defence tiring at about the 70 minute mark.
Watford was the same game plan. Keep it tight and level. Then bring on the wingers for the last 30 minutes. He threw that plan out of the window and brought players on earlier because of the goal.
474 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:41:20
I dont know how good Dyche is either, but he has got a decent record as a manager, which is what my real point was, “hes a manager” whilst too many fellas with the top job now, are actually better suited to coaching?
Its just a hunch, but Dyche, is not really averse to taking stupid risks, (Joey Bartons words) so he might actually think it was a common sense move, to bring Unsworth in alongside him, if there is any chance he either wants the job, or if Everton actually want him.
475 Posted 12/11/2017 at 11:54:24
I dont think we would have had “the time of our lives” in the eighties if Kendall hadnt brought Harvey on board. Colin was obviously a much better coach than he was a manager, and Howard was probably much better at managing people?
476 Posted 12/11/2017 at 12:22:51
Since he took over Unsworth has had 3 away games and 1 home game which we won, he now has another 2 away games coming up.
I just wonder if they aren't going to give Unsworth an extended run are they waiting to get the next 2 away games out of the way, then appoint a new man with 2 home games on the bounce. Which would hardly have given Unsworth a fair crack as of his 6 games in charge 5 would have been away.
477 Posted 12/11/2017 at 12:24:49
478 Posted 12/11/2017 at 13:32:04
As I said last week you may well be right, The board have got one hell of a decision to make, they only have themselves to blame. We as fans can only go by what our instincts tell us. I expect Unsworth to be given his chance. because they will be terrified of the backlash if they didn't give him it and we went down anyway.
I cant answer for you Don. When I had the chance I took it. I told Koeman his football was very poor . . .to his face - maybe that was another post you didn't understand
Whether you would list Rhinos shortcoming to his face as you seem to be doing every time you post, is something only you could decide. I suspect you would tell him its not his fault, or start off by saying "Joey Barton said" . . .
Breaking News . . .EVERYONE knows its not Unsworth fault . . even the ones who don't fancy him as manager.
I don't know anybody who would even listen to Joey Barton . . let alone be influenced by him. Like I say, it takes all sorts
479 Posted 12/11/2017 at 14:02:33
Now that you've expanded on what passed between you and Koeman, in contrast to what you stated in the relevant post, I'm just surprised you were so reasonable in your words. Like to see more of that on these threads, because very occasionally you are capable of it, and I've said so on here.
And like you, again, I hold Joey Barton in contempt as a man. His comments on Unsworth were beneath contempt but he just happened to be with the commentator on an Everton match I was listening to, otherwise I'd have switched him off. Still, it gave you grounds in your own mind to imagine a basis to have a go at a fellow fan, again, eh?
480 Posted 12/11/2017 at 14:14:58
Fortunately, we did win it and Unsworth now has that experience behind him. I bet he is using this international footy break to look through the whole squad and work out (with the help of other backroom staff) which players in the squad are going to be useful to him for this very difficult season.
I'm also sure that scouting for players will go on including that special striker (or two) we are going to need in January. Decisions have to made and I would rather Unsworth and co make them than most of the names being thrown around who would not think twice at throwing $40 mil at some average 30-year-plus-aged target man.
The next game is massive and this will go on until we see the points piling up and not the goals against. Let's get behind Unsworth and hope BS is just a media spin.
481 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:00:35
482 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:17:56
A decent player in his time and always articulate when interviewed.
I didn't expand on anything Don. I told the whole story at the time.
You were the one who brought Joey Barton into the debate. I'm more than happy to leave him out of it
483 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:29:48
484 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:45:13
I know it could be some hack's bullshit theory but I'd be bloody annoyed if Unsworth had all his, good work with the kids undermined by a hoofball merchant.
Also Andy Dunne is ridiculing the fact that Moshiri wants Simeone, more or less saying he isn't going to give up a top 3 Champions League Team in a brand new stadium to come to a decrepit ground to fight to keep Everton from relegation.
But, then again, if someone offered £millions for you to give up your top of the range Beamer or Merc for a couple of years and drive round in an old Moggy MInor then you can have a Bentley Continental and a Ferrari for your Mrs I could be tempted. But then again my Ford Angela and my Raleigh Blue Streak 10 speed are well past their best.
485 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:50:57
486 Posted 12/11/2017 at 15:51:24
No-one surely can contest that Unsworth has had a difficult run of games. And in both cup games he had the extremely difficult task of tempering the need to get a result alongside having to leave out a number of players to save them for Premier League games. In respect of Premier League games alone, he's won one, lost one. Continuation of that would leave us comfortably mid-table at the season's end.
Gordon (#483), not sure where you're getting your rumours from. My understanding is that the Board are some way away from consensus.
487 Posted 12/11/2017 at 16:02:32
I remember Ian Woan playing for Nottm Forest after being signed by Brian Clough and was given his chance by Clough not long after. His sister or auntie (Woans's) worked for the Liverpool Echo.
488 Posted 12/11/2017 at 16:15:44
489 Posted 12/11/2017 at 16:31:46
490 Posted 12/11/2017 at 16:38:24
491 Posted 12/11/2017 at 16:42:24
[Don] born Liverpool 7/11/1927 Clubs [Liverpool] League appearances 2, goals 0.[Leyton Orient], League appearances 25, goals 5.[Bradford City] League appearances 21 goals 4 Tranmere Rovers], League appearances 27, goals 2
[Alan] born Liverpool 8/2/1931. Clubs [[Norwich City]
League appearances 21, goals 7. [Northampton Town] League appearances 119 goals 68. [Crystal Palace] League appearances 41, goals 21. [Aldershot] League appearances 108, goals 44.
[Ian] born Runcorn 14/12/1967 [Nottingham Forest] League appearances [188 starts] [29 subs] goals 31.
492 Posted 12/11/2017 at 19:13:40
I think they will have been mates for nearly 30 years since Woan signed for Forest, but I didn't know Woan was a blue. If he was, then anything is possible because we all know that Everton very rarely leaves you... and, as Darren says, he is quite a clever lad, so I wouldn't rule out common-sense!
Wouldn't see a problem with those three working together but I'm not sure there would be any room left for Duncan Ferguson though?
493 Posted 12/11/2017 at 19:42:06
I look forward to apologies from all those Huytoners who called me a woollyback from St Helens...
494 Posted 13/11/2017 at 08:16:03
When we end up getting rid of the next 'latest and greatest' (oh the irony when Allardyce, Dyche and Silva are being mentioned), Unsworth may well not be available if he's having success. And regardless, if he does return in 5+years, he'd have little connection with any up and coming batch of players... Of course some of his winning U23 squad may remain, but how many Mustafi's will have gone elsewhere.
Koeman showed bringing experienced players en masse doesn't always guarantee results... So exactly why do people expect a 'proven manager' and his team is going to arrive and change things instantaneously?
The club should release a statement though if Unsworth is to stay until Christmas or the end of season.
495 Posted 21/11/2017 at 05:53:36
Odds slashed on surprise contender for vacant Everton job
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