Silva determined to do all he can to keep loan duo

Hopefully Mina comes good but he has his work cut out and the Columbian desperately needs a full preseason under his belt because right now he’s no further down the line than when he walked through the door in August last year.

I’m desperate to sign Zouma, I’d go as far as saying he would pip Gana as my Player of the Year to be honest.

Let’s hope we can weave a minor miracle and pull that one off for next season.

I hope you are wrong about that and I'd like to think that both Gomes and Zouma would have a wider perspective than just those two games against Fulham and Newcastle, if anything I'd be more worried if they looked at our bleak midwinter run and mini-crisis.

We must as a Club always strive to be better and sign better players to attempt to progress ourselves.

It's always been the way and one of the main reasons why this club has stood still or gone backwards is because it's lost players of quality and replaced them with lesser talented men, right back to when the management was breaking up the side of the mid '80s, players with class and character were replaced with just squad men, the same happened to a lesser extent in the mid '90s, selling off the likes of Kanchelskis and Stuart replacing them with Oster, Ward, Tiler etc.

Its crucial we don't stand still and just pay ourselves on the back but we move forward and seriously take advantage of the decline in the likes of Manchester United.

Zouma I strongly suspect will return to Chelsea. I don't think they have a better centre-back than him apart from Rudiger maybe who is now injured. He will be harder to replace though I do think we will see more from Mina next season once he gets a run in the team.

I still think we need strong centre-back with pace (like Zouma); some may suggest that Holgate will be that player but I'm not totally convinced yet. He needs a season where he plays 25-35 games as centre-back, it's a shame West Brom played him at right-back.

Gomes is another loan player and again no control over his future, and if he did choose Spurs it wouldn't be a surprise as all players now want to play in the Champions League so another reason why we might lose both Zouma and Gomes.

He knows how the fans and the club want him to stay, if he is waiting for better offers, maybe he is not the player we thought he was. While he was suspended was he really missed?

While I wouldn't be averse to him signing with us, if it is for silly money forget it, there are other players who would cost about the same, and would get more goals than he contributes.

While there is no doubting his technical ability, he does 'give away stupid fouls in dangerous positions' and that stamp on Mitrovic made me think twice about his temperament.

Yes we want players to have passion and a certain amount of aggression, but downright snide nastiness, No!

If not, for whatever reason, we need to find a just as solid player to slot in there. Mina's fitness cannot be relied upon and Mason Holgate, whilst he has a touch of class, is a bit too lightweight and inexperienced at the moment.

Brands is right in his philosophy to buy under 25s who we can improve. Zouma has to be signed if Chelsea allow it. Gomes has been excellent at times and poor at others and I'd be careful on price with him. As Derek points out, he has given goals away with needless fouls and we played very well during his suspension. I like him but no more than £20-25m max.

I expect to see some "intent" from the board they should offer Chelski £50M for Kurt, If they turn it down fine but make it hard for them to refuse at least give them something to consider.

Gomez for me would be a nice to have as opposed to a must-have, I would be happy if we got a Top Drawer striker in 20+ a season required. I would go for Lukaku myself but I think Brands and Silva will make good purchases, just depends on what which market they are competing in, a net spend of £100M + is needed at a minimum to progress

But I also think with a run of matches we will see his true qualities emerge. His strength, his composure, his leadership. He's only 24 and has years and years ahead of him. I worry slightly that his partnership with Keane may be too slow on the turn (both lack acceleration) but I have no doubts that given time Mina will become a fine player.

As for Lukaku, much as his goals would be nice his all round play does not suit our new style. Silva wants a striker who can run the channels, work his ass off for the team and implement the high press. That has never been and will never be the Belgian's game. Brands's challenge will be to find someone with that work ethic who is also a bit more clinical in front of goal than Calvert-Lewin (who I think has earned the right to start next season in possession of the striking role).

I highly doubt we will have a net spend of £100m+ and, for that reason, I doubt we will be able to offer £50m for Zouma. The late season form of Schneiderlin and Calvert-Lewin may have changed Brands's thinking. It will be very interesting to see which positions they prioritise. And who is sold and retained.

I can't go along with Calvert-Lewin earning the right to start next season despite his overall game improving – he's only scored 6 goals in the league and just 3 since December, it's not enough to be where we want to be and we can't allow sympathy or sentiment to come into it.

I'd agree that Zouma could be the best investment - which makes him the hardest to sign.

I like Gomes a lot and think he brings an extra bit of class to our play.

If Gana stays, great, if not then perhaps that is some money for Gomes and we have to find another high-energy tackling midfielder to try and compliment him.

We've done well with loans so I don't think we should complain too much - e.g. Pienaar, Lukaku.

Transfers and loans - both are about a gamble - Chelsea are the masters of the spread-bet but don't seem to cash in.

In 10 consecutive games, Calvert-Lewin has been part of a team that has won 6, drawn 2 and lost 2, scoring 16 and conceding only 5 in the process.

That includes games against 4 of the big 6.

I hardly think that is sympathy or sentiment.

Would Manchester City have won the league without Aguero?

Would Liverpool be second with Salah and Mane?

Silva has a lot to muse on during the Summer and – much like Koeman, Martinez and others – he will be scrutinized big style after his first season.

He is sure to lose one or two decent players but will have the money available to try and improve the squad. Other players have not really shone and others have been really not been favoured by Silva such as Davies and Lookman so one wonders if these players will get a fair shake next season. The rumour mill will abound with possibilities over the coming weeks especially regarding Zouma, Gueye and Gomes and what happens to them could influence Silva's next moves.

On reflection, the season ended decently without being spectacular. They could have made the Europa League but the results at Fulham, Spurs and Palace put the kibosh on that (all games they could have gotten more points in). However, I think at this stage it's best to have a team that can prove itself in the Premier League among the elite before worrying about playing in Europe.

Kevin is right, it doesn't matter who is scoring so long as the team is winning and getting points. Of course we'd all like a striker who works as hard as Calvert-Lewin and scores a shed load but those strikers tend to cost the world and play in the Champions League. If Brands can find someone of that ilk, then great... but even so, they will need time to adapt.

Calvert-Lewin will be our starting striker, I expect, next season and, given how well the team have played in the last two months or so, I am happy enough with that. I also expect him to get more goals next season.

However, currently he plays a big part in both our attack and defence. He closes down from the front, is instrumental in the high pressing game we have and regularly occupies 2 centre-backs as they are aware of his pace and physical attributes. He also brings others into play with his unselfish work and gets the likes of Sigurdsson and Richarlison better scoring opportunities.

Compare that to Tosun, who only occupies 1 centre-back and, despite his effort, doesn't create half as much space for others.

Compared to Lukaku (mentioned by someone), Lukaku used to occupy 2 centre-backs, such was the fear of his pace and finishing ability. However, despite his goals, everything ultimately came through Lukaku, so when he didn't score, Everton struggled to score.

If Calvert-Lewin plays regularly next season, like he has done at the back end of this season, I'm confident he'll get 10-15 goals, while Richarlison and Sigurdsson would also get a similar amount.

He definitely doesn't get picked on sympathy or sentiment at the moment.

PS, Steve @19 – compare him to another former league winner in Drogba, who scored exactly 0 top flight goals at 22!!

That would suggest him and Rudiger will still be first choice with Christiansen and Ampadu as back ups. I'm sure with the amount of football Zouma has played he's not going to be happy with the bench.

The worrying part for me is when he does have a shot at goal, I reckon only 50% or possibly less are on target, at the keeper, or saved doesn't bother me that much, that can be fine tuned.

It's the shots from distance, that invariably head towards row Z, and I'm afraid at the moment they are all too often, to be corrected easily.

If Luiz signs do you think it will be on the condition he’d be third centre back behind Zouma/Rudiger? Very unlikely I think!

Zouma has played regular football for two years. If he was that good, and this is the key point, he’d already be a Chelsea regular.

Zouma has not been that good. Until this season where he has been very solid. This last few months especially he has looked like the defender people thought he was going to be. And they have seen that. At worst he is as good as Luiz. And alot younger.

Our only shot I reckon is that their ban is overturned and they buy a hot new CB. Even then i'd only put our chances at 50/50.

Sam #12, completely agree on Mina. In addition to his physical talents, the kid has bollocks like basketballs -- he's fearless. Remember, he made his debut AT CHELSEA, not where most rookies would want to begin, and turned in a man-of-the-match performance, including that tackle on Hazard. Result: shutout. Then, after a fine showing against Cardiff -- another shutout -- he was outstanding again at Mordor, which we all know was yet another shutout... until...

Anyway, yep, we'll see lots of raw mistakes from him, but I'm convinced that a year from now he'll be a star.

Sarri has said that he would like to bring in only 2/3 players to improve his squad, but if the ban isn't suspended he might have to recall the players who have been on loan.

Gomes I am indifferent about. He looked good when he first came but has been a shadow of that since. We should look for better options IMO.

A goalscoring forward is a must in this window.

Bernard is great on the ball but like a certain Stuart Barlow, nicknamed Jigsaw for good reason, he falls apart in the box. Walcott is not motivated enough and Lookman has yet to justify the faith we all have in him but I doubt he's a 90 minute player. Tosun is not up to it and DCL puts a great shift in but is not yet ready for the burden of being our leading goalscorer.

So if Sarri isn't allowed to buy a CB, Zouma is his only realistic option.

Seriously though Mike, Chelsea have taken their Appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport, as you probably are well aware. I have tried to 'ferret' some information as to their success/failure rate of Claimants, without much success, I don't suppose that you have anything to give us some hope in this direction.

Like I have said before, I think Zouma would possibly be our most important signing next to a regular goal-scorer, I am not that bothered whether we get Gomes or not, if he does fine, if he doesn't, we can, I'm sure do better for the proposed fee/wages.

We have just had Silva finish 8th like Allardyce did.

Yes, we finished in the same position as last year. This is true.

But it's nothing, zero, like "Allardyce did".

We're playing much, much better football. We're on the up. Under the big fella we were playing the worst football, embarrassing football, I personally have ever witnessed in my (no longer short) time.

The only comparison is the finishing number and place. And while you can indeed make an argument that's all that matters, I'd argue that's very short-sighted. We're on the up, and this season we were actually fun to watch at many points.

Unlike the paint-drying, obligatory viewing we were forced to endure under Allardyce.

Our trend is up. Our trend under Allardyce was hell.

That said, Gomes came to Everton in a real psychological state from his difficult spell at Barca, and was very unhappy as a consequence.

I was of the opinion that Everton were good fit for Andre to rebuild his career, and thought that both Everton and him could grow together in the coming seasons and challenge the best.

With a new stadium in the pipeline, and a few more quality signings to complement a decent squad, I still see a bright future for Everton; even if Andre doesn't.

To use an old quote: "be careful what you wish for".

In Moshiri, Marcel Brands and Silva I trust. COYB.

I think he can still have a big role to play over the course of the season but we must bring in someone more prolific who DCL can learn from if we are to have any chance of competing with the top 6 over the course of a full season.

It's hard to explain away why this was happening.

It could be the coaching, of which Silva is the head or the lack of a Peter Reid type midfield captain. I think Seamus is too nice a guy.

Injuries to key players don't help when there isn't much depth but some of the more experienced players had lulls in their form during that middle part of the season especially after that late winner by RS in the first Derby match.

Gomes and Gueye played a big part in the recovery but offensively Everton are still found wanting when teams are parking the bus.

And that was my point. Nothing against Silva as you would have liked, just a heads up for the board.

Believe me i love the fact you say we are on the up but substance matters to me more than anything.

I feel exactly the same if come August, every player we want is still here and we have improved.

The amount of times we have been "on the up"to see the squad stripped and ruined teaches me to wait and see.

Fingers crossed.

Unless we do get more firepower it will be the same as this year.

And clearly Silva does not agree with your assessment. He ran the rule over Holgate for five straight starts at the beginning of the season and then promptly banished him -- first to the bench, then the stands, and finally to the Baggies. And he never played a single minute at CB for West Brom. Always on the right.

Holgate may well have a bright future here, but I see no reason to believe it will be at CB.

Lots of deadwood to shift though !

He told us;

Everton would not win any of their home games after the Liverpool game - We won them all

We never win in London - Just before we beat West Ham

We would have a disastrous last day with us getting hammered at Spurs while the shite lifted the title at Anfield.

Told us we were in a relegation scrap.

Produced stats of where we would be WHEN we lost the games he thought we would lose - we won them all

Told us DCL should never be given a run up front - just before he was and we produced a run, which, if spread over a season, would surely have seen us qualify for CL

If I was Dominic Calvert-Lewin, Tom Davies or JJ Kenny I'd be far interested in informed opinion that any nonsense spouted by crank crystal ball merchants who seem hell bent on being eternally wrong

Much of this thread has also turned to an examination of DCL. I'm one who has said before that he's improved significantly this season - in his work rate, winning possession (largely in the air), in his hold-up play and distribution. But that missing ingredient, goals, he has to sort soon, an issue many others on this thread have flagged. Times running out if you're not careful, lad.

He needs more aggression in his game. And its hard to make a nice lad aggressive.

He needs support to do that, he has the attitude to make it in abundance.

In the meantime it is wrong for him to be in the firing line 24/7 at his age, we do need another proven quality attack player to share the duties of an arduous season. I am sure Mr B will be lining one up.

"Nothing against Silva as you would have liked..."

No. I wasn't seeking an anti-Silva argument, creating joy in my being for the opportunity to point it out. You miss my point.

You seem to lean towards the bottom line. Eighth is eighth and it's the same as eighth.

I just saying last year's eighth was lightyears from this year's eighth.

A more enjoyable eighth. An eighth with more hope for next year's improvement on this year's eighth. Despite all the false dawns we've (you more than I) endured.

If you take my meaning.

And yes, I just used the word eighth eight times. Well, now nine.

Just for grins, I looked it up. In Prem games where DCL started at striker this season (not LW), we were 7-2-6. Without him up there we were 8-7-8. Pretty much the same.

We had two stretches of excellent play this season. In the outstanding run in from March to May, DCL was leading the line. But during that eight-game, 16-point purple patch in October/November, he barely got off the bench. So no clear picture of his contribution there either.

To me, nobody can "nail" this debate yet. It's an open question. Like the player himself.

More goals, please!

At some point though and possibly very often, he is going to be the man we need to score when the game is going the other way.

IE Fulham away. He had the chances to win that game and I hope that turns for him.
He will need the substance a striker needs to continue playing for Everton when all is said and done.

We have absolutely nothing like Gomes in the centre of the park, I genuinely believe hes built for this league. He has the flair of Arteta and the strength and nastiness of Fellaini, that mix isn't easy for a none champions league club to find.

Both players will be around the £40m mark, imo Silva can turn Mina or Holgate around as he has with both Keane and Zouma who struggled massively at Stoke last season.

I cant imagine us having much more than £80m to spend no matter who we move out, therefore I'd rather we spend money on an attacking player who can add 15+ goals to our league total.

Your too right in how we have been playing lately and I have loved watching us since the fixture list slowed to a pace we could handle.

The last couple of months have been great for us and that has been down to having the best 11 for different reasons we have had since Martinez was manager.

The hunger has give me pride for a couple of months and the football is improving all the time

Going back to my original point lets hope Silva gets the backing he needs to start better and finish higher.

Allardyce (Fireman Sam) had some admirers on here. I don't knock them, by the way, because I had the fear my self at one stage. However, I think we are looking good. I think that David Unsworth got a raw deal but he has been magnificent since.

Going back to my original point lets hope Silva gets the backing he needs to start better and finish higher.

Amen friend. Amen.

I am one who also thinks that Calvert Lewin has the ability to be a very good player. Unfortunately he does not seem to be the striker that we desperately need. Can he be trained to be a better striker is still questionable.

One more point. Stephen (38) said that Gomes might want to go to a bigger club. As a supporter of Everton since the early fifties I strongly suggest that with 9 championships and a great History we are a far far better and bigger club than Spurs. They do have a better team right now but they will never be a bigger club than my Blues. They will only become bigger in my eyes if they beat the RS in their next game Even then my support will only last for one game.

With the money the other top clubs have we won't be able to compete for the top players to give us the potential of a top 4 place we all crave and that is long overdue. I think the only possible way of breaking in to the elite group in the modern game is through developing a squad of young players who want to die for the club. A little like the Ferguson squad of '92 and this years team at Ajax.

We can go and pay a bucket load for a player like Lukaku who is a mercenary and has no affinity for the club and uses us like a stepping stone and in reality poisons the well in the process just like I think he and Pogba have done at Man Utd. You might get one or two good seasons out of them and then they are on their way. For this reason alone we have to persevere with the likes of Calvert-Lewin and Holgate etc. If we are able to hang on to Zouma and Gomes do we really think Moshari will fork out another £50M for a decent striker?

I just don't see it. Calvert-Lewin will come good as will Davies and some of the other youngsters if they get game time. While this does not bring instant success, I have to think it is the only way. So I do hope that Silva will start to nurture some of the young talent in the club rather than flogging dead horses like Tosun and Shneiderlin.

The U23s won both the league and cup this year and so there must be some talent there for the future. At least I can dream!

I had to read that one twice... This place is becoming a hangout for people who prefer stats to facts. Foolish statements to considered opinion.
"So a pretty solid defensively record" ???.. . 'kinell.

We saw a big improvement throughout the team during the last dozen or so games especially in the protection given to the back four, but those Einsteins who seem to believe could finish no higher than 8th because Calvert-Lewin missed a couple of chances at Fulham need to give their heads a wobble.

Pickford, Coalman Mina, Zouma Keane have taken turns to throw away points this season Digne even managed to get us turfed out of the cup. Keane and Mina are woeful footballers.

No doubt the stattos will feel the the three goals we conceded in the games against Liverpool, Leicester and Brighton, represent decent numbers, A goal a game is quite respectable Right ?
Bollox. These games were all in the balance and we surrendered all three, not because the opposition broke us down, but because we gifted them the points with defensive horror shows. we did it week after week. I could still weep when I think of the game at St James.

There is no DCL debate. Baring injury he WILL start up front for Everton next season. Those naive enough to believe the club will be forking out 60-70-80m for a goal scorer are in for a very log and frustrating summer.
He's the least of my problems. I have every confidence that he will show natural improvement - he works too hard not to - I'm just as confident we will see no further improvement Keane and Mina and we have already seen the best of Coleman, Baines, Siggurdson and Gana.

"Lets get a new striker, get into the champions league the league and win a cup" . .Yeah ok

The reason why Evertonians are optimistic and look forward to the new season is not because of issues you have raised; but, because, they are beginning to see general improvement throughout the team which you stated in your second paragraph.

Thing is, the new players needed to time to adapt to Silva's football philosophies, as well as develop an understanding between each other on the pitch.

Everton are by no means the finished article but, whether you like stats or not, thd statistics reveal improvements in all areas of Everton's play: which is encouraging.

As for DCL, I expect to see natural improvement in his game which will mirror the teams natural improvement in the later stages of last season.

As for buying an £80 million repl6for DCL, Evertonians are not daft enough to think this will happen. That's said, I have complete confidence in Brands (which has been founded on his transfer business to date) to find the talent to take us up a level.

For the last 11 games we had a pretty solid defensive record.

Depends where you want to focus your attention.

During winter we had a number of players not necessarily used to the wet weather, the amount of games and the physicality of some winter games (ie Millwall). We also had a fairly new team who were always going to hit a bad spot at some point while they got used to each other’s style of playing. Add in a manager with a completely different philosophy from the last 2 and it’s not hard to see why we struggled.

I am optimistic that the last 11 games will tell us more than the mid season slump, and next seasons slump won’t be half as bad.

Regarding Keane and Mina. You simply don’t play for England or Colombia by being a woeful footballer.
I played against some great footballers at county level and none of them got close to being international footballers. A bit of perspective please.

I think we have a lot to be optimistic about. Let's be clear though, this was not as good as Koeman's 7th. We had good reason to be optimistic that season, and the club appeared to be making the right moves in the transfer market, that was until Giroud turned us down and it all went tits up.

So this summer, we need to learn lessons. Too much disruption to the first team will undo all the progress. We need less than 5 signings. No, not because we only need a few players to make the top 4, but because we need a few players to close on the top 4, and continue with our progression.

Pickford, Coleman, Keane, Zouma, Digne, Gomes, Gueye, Sigurdsson, Richarlison, Bernard, Calvert-Lewin. That's a very good first XI. I'd say better than Wolves and Leicester. I'd also say that it's better than Utd's. Two of those players aren't ours. We need to sign them or sign better.

This season has been tough. Not just because we fell apart between the Liverpool games, but because the standard of the sides in and around us was much better than last season. Whilst Burnley were a shadow of last season, Wolves proved to be better than they dreamed of, Leicester were much improved, West Ham were better, Watford looked very good until they got in FA Cup mode at the end of the season. Without these sides, in a league with a middle section as weak as last season, we'd have got 7th easily. But that would not mean we had a better season.

We've improved in a lot of areas. Most importantly points won, games won, games lost, goals scored, and goals conceded. Whichever way you want to look at it, there's been an improvement. However, there is still much more improvement needed. Question marks still remain against Silva. Those who doubt him could argue a variety of things, as clear from what is posted above. What those who doubted him will now accept is that Silva does have a backbone, he is not a quitter, and he will work hard. Sure, they can doubt his overall quality for good reason with the mid-season slump, and despite all the reasons to be optimistic, that will cause doubts.

I'm a glass half full kind of guy, so I can see lots to be optimistic about. It's a real shame the season is ending now as I feel another 19 games could see us keep climbing the table and overtake more than just Wolves.

Why do people have to be so soppy and take anything as a go at Silva.

We all love to miss the point when it matters don't we and just so everyone knows, I will never be stupid enough to have affection for any manager or let anything cloud my judgement

Until Silva gets a wage bill like a top 6 side we will very likely miss out on the top 6. Its dead simple and I haven't been wrong when suggesting the same thing since Koeman came when most people thought he had bought a crop of class.

Forget managers and agendas and put your hopes and energy towards the board.

As for Mina I’ll wait and see, he didn’t play often enough last season to make a decision on how good he is.

My post is not contradictory. You've just missed the point.
I'm probably more optimistic than you about next season. I thinke we are on the right track. If you had read the post properly. .

It was claimed that we didnt finish higher than eighth because Calvert- Lewin didnt score more. it was also claimed our defence was "solid"

There is a determination by some people on here to hammer and lay the blame at the youngsters doorstep for our problems, "JJ's poor". "Tom Davies is crap" . . "DCL is championship". Davies and JJ havent even been playing and they're still getting stick.
I was sickened to see the usual suspect hammer away at DCL after our abject performance against Watford - He only came on as a late sub ffs. . The real culprits (the ones who played) never got a mention.

I'm not saying the young players shouldnt be criticised or shoulder their share of blame. They get paid enough. My post was about apportioning blame where it REALLY belongs. The simple fact of the matter is we finished no higher than 8th because big money signings and High earning loan's have systematically thrown points away leaving us with a mountain to climb.. . Now we're been told they're "solid"

Since that Watford game, DCL has been given a run up front and we have shown an improvement that has thrown his detractors into a state of utter confusion. We have been creating more chances, playing far better football, beating, even hammering the teams they claimed we could NEVER beat.. . Those detractors look complete mugs. If our defenders hadn't so meekly surrendered healthy leads at Newcastle and Spurs, our form since that Watford game would have resembled that of title challenges.

"yeahbutnobutyeah. . we might be hammering teams who have been used to hammering us, Bullying their defenders, instead of them bullying ours and DCL might be responsible for most of that, but HE isn't scoring all the goals. . If HE'd have scored, we might have got six points instead of three".

Sigh

One of the reasons English football has lagged so far behind that of our European counterparts is that they have produced wonderful ball playing center halves who can step out of defence and distribute the ball intelligently.
We, on the other hand, have produced a steady line of stoppers. Light houses who only know how to "get rid" Yard dogs who are only getting paid to play because they are bigger, stronger and more Athletic than the rest of us.
These stoppers are not exclusive to the English Game. Mina is walking proof of that.

If you are unsure which category Mina and Keane fall into, just listen to the collective sharp intake of breath from all around Goodison next time an awkward ball comes their way as 40,000 people dread to think how far their first touch is going to bounce away from them

I don't know if he was referring to them as men or footballers, there is a very large difference between them in footballers, in my opinion.

I also think Mina will turn out better than what many posters seem to think.

Like you, I'm hoping that Mina will turn out to be a good signing. I don't think I've seen enough of him up to now to make a judgement.

Like you I saw Brian Labone and also had the pleasure of meeting Brian socially on many occasions. Labby was a great centre-half but, like Keane, lacked a turn of pace. I do think Keane has come on leaps and bounds this season and looks more comfortable on the ball, but I don't think he will be a ball-playing centre-half (sorry, centre-back).

I always think it's difficult to try and compare players from different eras, also sometimes our memories often remember all the good things from players of the past and tend not to remember their weaknesses.

I can't say I noticed Labone lacked a turn of pace, maybe it was because the game was definitely slower. Keane's lack of pace is standout, especially when he is turning. His awareness of where he is, or lack of awareness, also is evident every game he plays. He made five basic mistakes in the first minutes of the Man Utd game, giving them, in one incident, one of their rare chances of scoring.

He will never do for me, I'm afraid; he has my heart in my mouth every time the opposition attack, but each to their own.

Keane has improved despite his lack of pace... also, his reading and positional sense. Whether he turns out anywhere near as good as the skipper I was named after is another matter. As for Mina, there is a colossal centre-half in there somewhere (in both boxes). Here's hoping.

As for not scoring many, check out his goals/minutes on the pitch stats - you may be surprised. And how many good chances are his team-mates creating for him? I don't recall him missing many sitters.

Also - he carries the burden of being the sole striker; pressing, target man, link-up play, all by himself - and you want him to bagging hatfuls of goals as well, at his age? If he did, he would be worth £100m! Stick with him and he will turn out to be our Harry Kane.

I accept that he needs to improve sharpness but I don't accept that he's not a natural finisher. He has an ungainly look about him sometimes and he can seem right off it, which understandably makes people think he's going to struggle longer term. But I think that's a mistake.

We'll find out.

Mike

Mina - fine ball skills ? You're joking right ? The guy poses a threat to the opposition for dead ball situations, but he poses a even bigger threat to us when he is the last line and he has the ball at his feet. The guys looks clumsy even without the ball.

Rather than submit my own examples, which you will dismiss in your certainty, I quote from the club website regarding his debut at Stamford Bridge (repeat, debut at Stamford Bridge):

"One fleeting episode inside the opening 10 minutes told us about the giant Colombian's cool under fire. With Willian bearing down on Mina at the edge of the Everton penalty box, the defender simply feinted - Willian completely removed from the picture in an instant - and nudged a pass forward. The Evertonians stacked behind the goal emitted a throaty roar of appreciation."

I saw him do that several times this season.

And another:

"It was an early ball from Brazilian Luiz, in fact, that enabled us to have an early glimpse of Mina's comfort in possession. The obvious - and easy - move when Luiz's errant pass alighted with Mina was to plant his foot through it. He controlled first time and then steered a pass left for Digne..."

Hmmm, seems I'm not the only one who thinks Mina is nice and comfy on the ball. But if you see "clumsy", hey, whatever.