New hotel planned near Bramley-Moore Dock

Saves going to Southport for a dirty weekend.

The Echo is talking this up – for which, I suppose we should be grateful, but the planning application appears to make no mention of Everton or Bramley-Moore Dock.

Also, there is another even stranger Echo piece on Bramley-Moore Dock by Chris Beesley which kicks off with the bald and highly unrealistic statement:

"It has to be built now."

(I guess it depends where you put the emphasis...)

Their pitiful standard of junk journalism at times has me wretching, such is the appeal to the lowest common denominator in the structure and content of what passes for 'news items' these days.

Both are ultimately puff-pieces with little or nothing new (apart from this headline). However, am I alone in finding it somewhat ominous that both include a kind of ultimatum that suggests there is a possibility of the Bramley-Moore Dock project not happening?

“The Blues cannot afford to have any more false dawns, and nor should they be expected to put up with them either.

“On too many occasions in the past, [Everton] fans have had the rug pulled from under their feet when it comes to finding a suitable replacement for their much-loved but outdated home ground of Goodison Park.”

Why the... er... 'negativity', fellas? Get behind the project!!!

You might start the conspiracy theories going there M2

Maybe the new stadium has gone to far down the track to be a false dawn...

Then again, if it goes tits-up, they only have to wait a few years for the average fan to cool off then start it all off again... and the hopless sheep will follow in their predictable dreams of getting one over the RS.

I said years ago that the corrupted powers that be only want one team from Liverpool.

In my lifetime, we have gone from the dominant force on Merseyside to being in the dark shadow of those who reside in our first home.

We have a long way to go if were ever going to be up where most fans want us to be.

Personally competing and beating that shower on the pitch on a regular basis is more important than a new stadium.

I was 59 yesterday sadly; I don't expect to see us achieve the above in my remaining years.

I am grateful to have witnessed the success of the 80's up close.

Have we really made any kind of progress since our new multi-millionaire owner walked into town? Between him and the fat controller, I think not.

We're forever taking one step forward, three steps back... missed opportunities, bad management, and bad luck seems to plague us into a life of football misery.

However, nothing lasts forever so just maybe we will rise to the top of the corrupt shit-pile that is known as football..

Michael #2

I bet behind the scenes there is all kinds of leverage being used and tested in trying to get the best form of favourable loans from public bodies. Arguments that they are justified will be that the investment is fully part of an essential and overdue regeneration programme and infrastructure upgrade. One that benefits the local economy and social cohesiveness for many generations into the future.

The stadium is central to it all and we will be exploring all avenues for securing the most competitive finance package. Hopefully agreement can be reached that benefits everybody and the pin-striped testosterone doesn't take charge.

Mark @3 "...and the hopless sheep will follow in their predictable dreams of getting one over the RS...".

Was there really any need to include this? Was there?

Mark, it does two things:
Firstly, it needlessly taints those who hold opinions different to yours as "hopless sheep" (did you actually mean hopeless or hapless?).

Secondly, it implies that, in this regard, you are somehow superior.

In the recent "Keyboard Warriors" thread, there was healthy debate about such behaviour as this. Whatever your opinions are, surely they are not enhanced by needlessly denigrating others?

And as for "predictable dreams of getting one over the RS..."? Whilst I personally never use the term RS in full or abbreviated, name a single Evertonian who doesn't (predictably) dream of putting one over our neighbours?

Even if the message proves correct, the method certainly isn't.

Why would a planning application for a new hotel near Sandhills Station mention Everton and Bramley-Moore Dock? And why would this failure to mention Everton set alarm bells ringing on Bramley-Moore Dock plans going tits up?

Everton's Bramley-Moore 'project' is progressing as per schedule, so get a grip.

I can't see the point of hopless sheep.

Where would we get our woolly jumpers from if that's all we had?

Why would anyone even begin to try and build a decent sized hotel near Sandhills, unless they know something we don't?

I take what was written about “It has to happen now”, Michael, is just poor journalism trying to do as you say.

Kinell Mark – I bet your birthday party was a bag of laughs!

Cheer up, mate – I've got a year on you and I'm quite chipper about Everton's future as it goes!

Sounds like the start of the development of the north city docks area that's being kick-started by the building of the new stadium to me.

Agree with Tony, for what other reason would you need a decent hotel in that area for?

If I had shares in the company looking to build a hotel at a place like Sandhills, I would sell my shares – unless I saw some prospect of filling rooms through some relevant development in an area close to Sandhills – so, preferably at the northern end of the regeneration area.

Now I wonder what that relevant development could involve!

Of course, it's possible that given the increased need for hotels in/around the City Centre and the existing development plans of Peel Holdings, a hotel next to a train station that's one stop from the City Centre may be regarded as an obvious move.

It may have absolutely nothing to do with a football stadium.

Paul (#12);

That last sentence is similar to my thoughts and perhaps part of the whole regeneration plan may be from something close to the area's original intention, a Liner terminal.

Yes Alan, in the last few months, my work has taken me to various places. I often end up in a hotel slightly out of town, handy for the tram/tube/train. You wake up to a lovely view of a building site/business park, but you've saved a few quid and it's a short, easy trip to work.

Absolute win-win in my book, regardless of what we do.

Alan @13

Are there any actual plans for a liner terminal that you have seen? I've seen mention of it on TW but only by us fans suggesting that it would be a good idea.

I think that, with the plans and presentation evenings with Meis, there is no way that this Stadium will not be built. I personally think that only the members of the Flat Earth Society have any real doubts, and then only because they're also terminally miserable.

M. Murphy I had a wonderful birthday with lots of laughs...

Ironically mr A Murphy my oppinion matters not to anyone but me its just a oppinion.

Football reflects the insane world we live in I have been a fan of the diverse oppinions here on TW for many years..

I can be both amused and bemused by all that I read...

I have no need to justify my words and welcome your response to my post.

I niether set out to bug myself up or hide behind the jeyboard warrier or should I say worrier.

I don't put any importance to things out of my control as in how Everton FC is run...

I do however find it amusing that football like religion or political idealism or what ever devides oppinion is just that...

The happless or hoplessness of lifes choices can easily be seen as ones own reality of how we percive this elusion or delusion of reality.

On the rare occasion I post on here its always very much tounge in cheek and always just a oppinion that my oppinion matters not...

Ray (15)

Link to vid of the proposed terminal. I don't read this as a concrete plan though?

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/heres-liverpools-new-50m-cruise-16804018

Ray (#15);

I know absolutely nothing of the overall plans for this area other than that I've read on ToffeeWeb but it is on the river and I recall many, many years ago (mid-late '60s) attending a reception on Elder Dempster's liner, MV Aureole which was docked down there somewhere.

I've also noticed in the last couple of years (although less in the last 12 months) more and more cruises advertising calling at Liverpool, most of which coincided with the refurbishment of the Cunard Building, the enthusiasm for everything Titanic and those four blokes in the band.

Mark @3, I'm kind of with you, I'm 50 in a few days and I'd always thought I'd see us in a shiny new stadium before I was 40.

It's a long road for us, as certainly the last 25 - 30 years we've slipped behind (rather a lot). Keeping with your theme, I'd be happy enough just for any cup and regular Champions League football. What Arsenal have had for years (and their fans moan).

When the day comes, Everton FC will finally have some presence again, rather than being an outdated relic.

Ray, Alan, That would be fantastic if a Liner Terminal could be built. Imagine if the Ferries started using it on match days as well? The video article also mentions a 200-bed hotel.

Ray (#20); Now steady on, Ray, next you'll be advocating the New Royal Iris doing match day lunch and drinks from Garston.

Alan, What a spiffing idea!!!

G and T's before the match! With the ubiquitous prawn sandwiches to boot...

Ray, none of that Pink Gin rubbish, you know, but being the NRI Mk2 more likely Gin Slings.

Whatever, it's your round anyway.

It's all very encouraging news for the future of the Northern Docks area, if Investment can be found and applied. What do they say, "Build it and They Will Come"?

It does need re-vamping, that area, which will only help as we have the New Stadium hopefully on schedule, I can envisage it now with aerial filming of the Stadium with the re-vamped Hotels and Liner terminal.

The Royal Iris Mk II shipping North Wales, Wirral and Cheshire blues to the match, a lump in my throat, I'd best wash it down with a G&T, get in there!

Derek, ''I'd best wash it down with a G&T, get in there!''
You're a Prince among men, I don't mind if I do! Cheers, see you later.

As others have said building a hotel next to Sandhills Station makes a lot of sense with or without a new stadium at Bramley-Moore. The hotels in the city centre are regularly fully booked. The location is within easy reach of the city, is next to a train station which also has lines to Southport, Ormskirk and Kirkby. Also the Soccerbus runs from outside the station on match days to both Goodison and Anfield.

Anyone paying attention to Laurie Hartley, will have read his links to the transformation of Melbourne Docks, which was also kick-started by a new football stadium.

The regeneration Started in the eighties, and is now two-thirds complete, has created between 80,000/100,000 jobs, 20,000 residents, and already around twelve billion dollars worth of investment?

I'd guess Moshiri never bought the Liver building, because it was up the road from Bramley Moore, but more because of this unbelievably big regeneration project, that is going to make some very rich people, a whole lot richer in the pocket... So let's just hope they can make us Evertonians, a whole lot richer with our memories!

In the future, we will be sailing the good folk of Cheshire and Lancashire from the shadows of the Manchester mills along the Manchester Ship Canal on barges where they can sip gin and tonics and eat prawn sarnies. They will chug up into the river at Eastham Locks and see the magisterial new ground in the distance.

The ferries and leisure craft will bob along to the Northern Docks, disembarking their contents into the streets and concourses.

Planning permission has already been granted for the new liner terminal and bedrock investigation work is ongoing. It's at the Princes Dock, right next to the current terminal.

WORK BEGINS ON LIVERPOOL'S NEW CRUISE TERMINAL.

https://www.liverpoolwaters.co.uk › work-begins-on-liverpools-new-cruise...

Makes good business senses; would be a hell of a lot cheaper to build a hotel before a stadium has been built.

Seems good to me but have some concern for a group of fans who may be excluded.

Whilst the likes of me from Cheshire may enjoy sipping our gins as we cruise to the match, I would hope that the architects have made arrangements for late buses, a decent route to Lime Street to fight along and a bar that sells a decent brown over bitter!

Heritage.

The cruise liner terminal is a definite. The company designated to manage the build have recently leased premises at Princes Dock to be close to the works. There is also a hotel planned to be sited at Princes Dock to cater for the new terminal.

Dermot, where in Cheshire are you? I'm in Chester so if near let me know. You mentioned Brown over Bitter there. Not quite the same but there are 2 Samuel Smith's Establishments in Chester, The Falcon (Bridge Street, which is steeped in History.

The other is less salubrious but commensurate on the prices The Boot Inn on Eastgate Row, a characterful pub which is like walking back in time. They have a strict NO Mobile Phones or Electronic Devices in both Pubs, which strikes a lot of people as being strange in this day and age. At least people talk to each other.

Anyway I'm digressing slightly they do a Stout very similar to Liffey Water, I tend to go for the Stout with Mild 50/50 £1.82 they do a bitter for about the same price Sovereign. Cheaper than Wetherspoons and decent Ale.

Derek are you making your last post before stringing yourself up after watching everybody's favourite ex Evertonian start the rout at Hampden?

Derek, Dermot is carried to the ground in a sedan chair.

Brian, and Andy, it's painful I must admit, he doesn't wear a white robe with a red skull cap and a gold chain does he Andy? Drinks crème de Menthe by the pint? No wonder he 's in a Sedan Chair.

Oh 'eck.

What have I created!

Near Northwich Derek and closer to a bath chair to be honest!

I believe that the Titanic Hotel next to the old Heritage Market site and close to Bramley-Moore Dock was initially developed to encourage further development for the Liverpool Waters Project.

A lot of people laughed then saying that it was a waste of time and money to build a hotel of that quality in such a run-down area, but it has been a major success and attracts many Premier League teams when playing at Goodison or Anfield. As such, no major surprise to see other investors now following suit.

Thanks Dermot, you can always tell when the International Break is on, we tend to tangentially deflect from the main subject matter, into all manner of diversity.

A bit like the Live Forum on Match Day when there is not a lot happening on the pitch, or we are playing a killjoy team, the Mexican Wave or fish puns tend to kick in, all good fun though at the end of the day.

Derek (#35); "Stout with mild 50/50" - A Black and Tan?
What is becoming of Scouse language like what we used to chew?

I had a snakebite for the first time in 35 years last week.

I was having a pint of hop house 13 lager and my brother a pint of cider.

I decided I wanted another top up half pint before we left to the next pub so got 2 halves in.

My brother unwittingly then proceeded to pour the cider into my lager.

Couldn't really taste the difference too much, think my taste buds must be ailing [aleing?] now too.

Amazing how people still don't think the new stadium is going to happen!!

Pete, @44, having read your post, and re-trawled through all the previous ones, there is only one that appears to have a degree of skepticism as to the New Stadium being built at all, so not quite sure what you are alluding to.

Derek, I think it was to.

Do with the ‘implication' by the Echo “Surely it has to be built now” that they were suggesting there was a chance of it not happens. And of course our previous ‘cheques in the post' spectacular failures...

On scouse ale names - A Pint of Golden anyone? Half bitter half lager... also know. As a Mickey Mouse (by Southerners I think?)

I used to occassionally like 'an arf n arf' mild and bitter mixed, sometimes wrongly referred to by some as a black and tan.

Derek @45,

There's still scepticism on this thread as well as many others over the last few months (even further than that) where – no matter what the club says or does – because the physical building work hasn't started yet, there's a belief amongst quite a lot on here that it won't happen. So I'm not sure what you're alluding to either, to be honest.

James @47

A “Leg opener, or a Cherry B and Cider, designed to get your girl “In The Mood” so to speak. Not that I ever resorted to such underhand tactics, of course.

Ray (#50); Like you, I am inexperienced in such exotic drinks but is what you describe the same as a "Universal Leg Opener", Babycham and Brandy, or are we now getting completely out of our depth?

Alan, I think they're both similar and both are bought with the same desired, (and hopeful) affect. However, I have yet to meet a Liverpool girl who COULDN'T drink me under the table.

Ray (17) - Reading the article at that link, I found another link to something called the 10 Streets Project I don't know which 10 streets referred to but they seem to start at the Tobacco Warehouse conversion and then South of there.

Talking about the project, Mayor Anderson said, “The whole area is on the brink of a very bright future, especially when you consider the investment the council is making in the surrounding infrastructure as well as Peel's investment in Liverpool Waters and Everton's intentions for nearby Bramley-Moore Dock.”

It would appear that the area's regeneration is now past the "Pie-in-the-Sky" phase and everything is about to happen.

Moshiri probably can watch the new terminal going in from his office window, canny fellow.