Virginia goes out on loan again with Tyrer joining Chester

Or god forbid integrated as 3rd choice with 56-year-old Lornegan being sent on loan to the Business Houses Sunday League to gain experience.

I understand Geri was a quality player who was clearly good enough for the first team, but we need to do something otherwise this is just another waste of money. I'd rather pay him to play for another team than have them pay for him to sit on the bench for another season.

He came on versus Burnley after Pickford was injured in the first half and didn't concede any further goals and, as Stephen says @8, he did more than okay against Man City in the cup game and wasn't at fault for the two very late goals that City scored.

I don't understand why we are retaining two ageing goalkeepers who must be on more wages than Virginia and Harry Tyler, I'd prefer we let Lonergan go and keep one of Virginia or Tyler.

You've seen Tyrer play. Do you think he has the makings of a top-class keeper someday?

To Mike Gaynes's point didn't we send Jon Ruddy off to the Conference? (Chester?) I realize we ended up letting him leave but he went on to be a Premier League keeper. So the experience evidently helped him.

But the other issue we have is that Pickford is in his prime (maybe a positive, not an issue, in fact) so, barring injury, assuming he signs a new deal, is there much likelihood of anyone displacing him? Probably not.

In which case, is it cost-effective for us or fair to younger goalies to stock like them for bench duty?

But Goalies can be a completely different category from other outfield players. Joao has the body and athleticism of a Premier League goalie already and he just needs minutes against decent competitions to refine other parts of his game (most notably Positioning, Communications & Commanding of the Defence) without the limelight.

Yes, we might have to subsidise his wages again so that SC Cambuur can take him on, which is always a negative. But for all the haters who trashed the Eredivisie as if it is on League One level, it is a decent league with its Big 4 (Feyernood, Ajax, PSV, AZ) fielding top-level talents.

Cambuur is also a solid lower mid-table team, so if Joao does his part, wins and keeps his position in its first team (ideally 30 Starts across the League & Cup games), it can be a great year for his development, for our evaluations and for pumping up his future sales value.

Even if he is not going to unseat Pickford (or even make it as a backup), there are worse investments than paying £500k per year for 2 more years to build up his value for a decent future sales.

On the other hand, love the move to Chester for a full season of non-league football for Tyrer. Training daily in subpar (relative to Premier League standard) facilities with veterans (some of them semi-professionals) who train & fight everyday for their next contracts should open his eyes up about the "Real World" and teach him to appreciate what Finch Farm offers (if he hasn't already).

Not to mention starting every game for the team and play in semi-professional grounds (aka hostile environment, to say the least). Even if he is not to be developed any further technically & physically, he will return to Finch Farm with a much more mature mentality and an even better work ethic.

Perhaps launching your own U23s team into the feeder leagues is still a better option?

By my count, we have nine professional goalkeepers on our books. With these two out on loan and Pickford in Qatar, we still have:

Asmir Begovic
Andy Lonergan
Jack Barrett
Zan-Luk Leban
Billy Crellin
Pat Nash

So, even if Frank wants two on the bench in Sydney, I think we'll be okay.

Leban has been given a years extension taking him up to June 2023. Hard to believe he is still 19 as he has a good stature and ‘goalie presence' when I've watched him, as well as making some great saves. It will be a big season for him with Tyrer going out on loan, more opportunities up for grabs.

The back-up keeper is usually a veteran who costs little and is content to warm the bench; seldom is a youngster entrusted with Premier League starts. We have brought in very little money from selling young home-produced keepers so – other than having someone to turnout for the U18s and U23s – why would a Premier League club have more young 'keepers than the bare minimum, especially if it is trying to cut costs?

I've only seen Harry Tyrer play at U23 level but I see a very competent goalkeeper. Maybe Chester is the only place where he would get regular football in a semi-professional league, who will he train with? Who will coach him? I‘d say he is better staying at Finch Farm training all week with goalkeeping coaches around him and playing with Chester on match days.

I'd also let the two senior reserve goalies go and keep Virginia as number two to Pickford, saving money but having a potential good goalie in reserve. He had a disastrous spell at Reading, where after two poor games he never really got a proper chance again.

It's early days with the new DoF so let him get on with the job and hope he impresses us in the rest of the transfer window. Although there is not much money to play with, maybe he will have a lot less money but more football brains than the previous DoF.

I think you just nailed it there, John. It seems managers want two old blokes on the bench for senior games.

Then you need two fringe players for the U21s, one playing and one on the bench – that would be Barrett and Leban.

And you also need two youngsters for the U18s, one playing and one on the bench: we have Crellin and Nash.

This approach has enabled the club to send out Virginia and Tyrer on loan. Whether those loans work out or not is a different matter but at least the club seems to be doing the right thing at this point.

I'm not convinced that we as mere fans have sufficient information to declare that the decisions constitute a dog's breakfast, but that constraint clearly won't stop some of us.

2012→ Darlington (loan) - 17 appearances
2013 → Alfreton Town (loan) 12
2013 → Burton Albion (loan) 12
2014 → Carlisle United (loan) 18
2014–2015 → Bradford City (loan) 33
2015–2016 → Preston North End (loan) 24

Billy Crellin was 22 last month, a bit too old to play for the U18s team!!

Dave #19, even at their level Chester train 3 times per week and will expect Tyrer to be there for it. He can't just rock up on match day, he needs to know if they play out from the back, who he aims his long kicks for, which side of the team is strongest to receive kicks etc. They need to know which foot he uses, how back passes should be presented to him for clearance, which crosses he'll come for, which ones they're better having an experienced defender clear away etc.

Personally, I'm disappointed Tyrer has moved so far down the pyramid, it suggests to me a lack of confidence from the coaches or a lack of any higher club wanting to take him. This time next year he'll be 21, closing in on 22 – would any other Premier League club buy in a young goalkeeper that age with only tier 6 experience?

Thanks for that on Pat Nash, Phill, I'd missed that. The last I saw, he had been offered a contract extension. Seems he turned it down, disagreeing with the Thelwell vision for him:

“Pat wanted a guarantee of a loan move to a men’s team for the new season, but the club were not able to do this. They didn’t seem to see the value of a loan move as much as we did. They also offered incentives for playing U23 football rather [than] gaining proper experience.”

Crazy as he only just joined in November from Reading. But obviously thinks a lot of his own ability, which has to only be a good thing... unless he is deluded!

It looks like the replacements are in already, the U18s keepers are more likely to be Dylan Graham and Seb Jensen with George Pickford probably coming through.

As for Harry Tyrer going to a club at Chester’s level, there is one thing certain, which is there is no hiding place. His every action will be noticed and commented upon by those standing behind the goal, and he will hear every word, good and bad. It could be a great test of him, and very educational.

I’m of the same mind as yourself in that there doesn’t seem to be a lot of belief from the coaches at Finch Farm in Harry Tyrer who seems to be a safe and solid goalie to me.

How many games did Andy Lonergan play last season in the first team and other teams? I’d say not many or hardly any, if I’m correct what else does he do at Everton?