Kevin Thelwell: “Stick with us”

The poorer you are, the bigger the gamble. While Liverpool can shrug their shoulders after spunking £85M on a single striker who doesn't score, we have a steward's inquiry about four of our strikers who cost us a total of £50M.

Nobody on this thread or any other I have read has made excuses for abject performances or poor results. That's just the tired old excuse trotted out by those who think battering away at a very sick horse is the best way to get it to win a race.

This thread is about the DoF trying to educate people about the difficulties of running a club which has been kicked from pillar to post and is on the bones of its arse. If you want to complain about the performances, there are matchday threads to do it on.

What I'm sick to death of is people calling for the manager to be sacked when they know there is nobody to sack him. They know he will still be here until a new owner arrives and they know that's unlikely to be this side of Chrimbo. Yet they still think it's a good idea to batter away thinking they have spotted something nobody else has noticed.

We don't need people relentlessly telling us our manager is dull and unadventurous — No shit, Sherlock?

There will be no changes. Not today. Not tomorrow. This is what we have, at least for the foreseeable future. You can either show your vast football knowledge by stating the blindingly obvious every 20 minutes, thus kicking your club into oblivion in the process…

Or you can recognize the only chance we have is to get behind what is in essence a very poor team put together on a relative shoestring with a limited manager who is doing everything in his power to get you to the new stadium with our Premier League status intact.

No Coleman (soz lad), Young, Keane, Harrison or Doucoure.

Broja will help big time as he is a Premier League level forward all day long.

Priorities surely???

I understand trying to rally the troops and I very much understand the terrible position he and Dyche have been put in, no leadership above them, but the truth is, we don't look close to Premier League quality and I think player morale is shot.

In another world, I'd be regarding a visit to the Leicester of today as a likely win, but I agree with the bookies, we are outsiders.

I understand the argument that bringing back a manager we appointed 22 years ago reeks of a lack of forward-thinking but all I know is that this club has massively gone backwards since he left, bar Martinez's first season. I saw the Moyes interview with Liverpool Echo and you can tell he would love to come back to Everton and finish what he started.

Clearly, Dyche needs a bit of luck to get players back and results and quickly. Fans won't put up with his poor substitutions and poor in-game management much longer. Add to the fact that he continues to pick his favourites. I think he's on borrowed time.

COYB – I would be made up with a win at Leicester today. Good luck, chaps.

I am unwilling to endure 3 more years of his boring football – probably worse than Dyche's style. I would rather that we go down and rebuild the ethos of this club with a fresh, forward-thinking manager.

In any case, I think that, with more players coming back from injury, sickness and bereavement, we will be in a much better position.

As Thelwel says, the best position to take is to support the players and the staff to work through this sticky patch.

It's his favourite players, or square pegs in round holes, all the time. And his in-game management and substitutions are pathetic.

But I wouldn't trust this shower of imposters with the exception of 3 or 4 as far as I could throw them.

I honestly don't think we will win another game with that crew in the dugout running things.

Moyes has form for taking on short term contracts with bonuses for achieving his goals. He did it with his first stint at West Ham when they were in the relegation zone, and comfortably kept them up.

For those saying never go back.

Just like Roy Hodgson did at Palace, when he went back for the second time, after they were in the shit after the progressive Viera. He got them safe and was replaced when they were more comfortable.

Brendan Rodgers currently enjoying his second stint at Celtic.

West Ham then decided on Pelegrini, a bright young new manager to take them forward, only to bring Moyes back when once again they fell back into the relegation zone. Once again Moyes kept them up and took them into Europe. What followed was regular European finishes.

Also, don’t forget that Moyes wasn’t sacked by either us or West Ham. Living down south now I know lots of West Ham fans, most are complete tools, none of them were pleased when Moyes left, having just won a European trophy, some of them were genuinely worried. It’s a myth that West Ham fans all wanted Moyes out. They will finish in the bottom half this year.

I get that people won’t like Moyes as an option because he ‘jilted John’ us before but I’m afraid it’s needs must and he is a much, much better option than Dyche. This squad is definitely good enough to stay up providing it’s managed properly.

The only blot on his copy book was Sunderland, the worst squad of premier league players I have ever seen anyone have to work with.

3 year contracts are the norm now anyway for Managers, what price relegation. We need the best ship steadier there is.

We offer him a three year contract with a view to paying him off when we are in a position to do so and ready to take the plunge with a new younger, more progressive manager.

In terms of us, I think Moyes would probably do what Sam Allardyce did - demand a 2 yr contract knowing he might be sacked about about 8 months and replaced with someone we actually want when the takeover goes through. It also gives him a chance of a longer deal if he does well, or well enough - which he might. Although he was a disaster at Sunderland, he is a pretty safe pair of hands. Limited definitely but fairly safe.

Anyone wanting progressive winning football is going to have to be a bit more patient unfortunately.

On a separate note, my cousin, whose family "emigrated" to London in the 60s, is a mad Chelsea supporter. Apparently there is growing resentment amongst the masses about their owners.

On a separate note, my cousin, whose family "emigrated" to London in the 60s, is a mad Chelsea supporter. Apparently there is growing resentment amongst the masses about their owners.

Should we go back? In my opinion, no. Our hand would need to be well and truly forced to pull the trigger on Dyche this season, either by results or the atmosphere in the dressing room.

The concerning thing for Dyche is that we're approaching the former – odds are we will end up on the losing side today. That puts huge pressure on the Palace match.

But Dele will be back any year now. No wonder Dyche has a threadbare squad.

Personally, I'd be glad to see the back of Dyche and Thelwell. I believe Moyes would be a safer short-term solution taking us into the new stadium. He did a lot more good than bad with regular 5th, 6th or 7th place finishes.

He showed at West Ham he is still capable. Longer term, maybe David Weir as DoF and a young coach like Lee Carsley.

Lack of defenders on the flanks; lack of pace everywhere.
Goals… Goalscorers? Yes. There's a thought. How about some of them? A forward who scores. I know it is alien to you and all the management. But try it. You might like it.

Nuff said.

By the way, when you turned over one of those stones, did you find Ashley Young? The fact we re-signed him, and gave a new playing contract to Coleman is what, £50k, at least, per week we could have given to someone under a stone from outside of England, assuming we scout that far.

I watched the interview with Moyes around how good the scouting department was during his time – I can't see any evidence of it now, or for the last few years, as they're all British-based, formally British-based, or someone we have played against.

Why do you think there is nobody to sack the manager in response to an article by the Director of Football – who's job it would surely be to sack the manager?

We can sign players, we can sack a manager – simple as that.

Jamie, what do you know of the Southampton squad?
Enough that you can actually state the team on Tuesday was in anyway less talented than the one for their previous fixture? I doubt it.

It's been shown over and over again that mounting up a mammoth possession percentage is not necessarily the same as dominating a game. So two parts of your statement are actually meaningless rather than telling anyone what they need to know.

Hoofball! I've been itching to see one of Sean Dyche's endless ‘hoofball' extravaganzas ever since people started endlessly complaining about them on ToffeeWeb. Problem is every game I get to see in full or extended highlights (probably 95% of them) has a relatively low number of times when the ball isn't played to someone's feet or for someone to run onto. It seems like mass hysteria to me.

My personal take is it's not been a good start and the crumbling finish against Bournemouth could have been mitigated by better proactivity by the manager, but full judgement needs to be postponed until we see what we get when everyone is available and has been tested in competition.

I've seen enough from Sean Dyche's in-game management and his persistence with Young and Keane in the back that says "No, I won't stick with him." His substitutions are the reason we don't have 9 points, but rather, 1.

I appreciate your attempt to get the fans to back him but he's made his own bed here.

In the Leicester game, Everton got a point. That will be seen as a turn around. Everyone does need points before November. It is going to be another relegation dog fight and the club is well aware of that.

I know it's unlikely, but I've got to cling onto every scrap of hope.

Why would you want Man City relegated? Look who will be their closest rivals for the title this season.

Liverpool or Arsenal – and no Evertonian in their right mind would like to see our beautiful neighbours winning the title at any time.

I love to hear them carping on about how Man City and their rich owners have made it an unlevel playing field.

The bastards are green with envy how City dominate the domestic game and how it's so unfair how they've spent untold zillions on players.

I tell them this, every player regardless of the fee has to be coached and trained well; Guardiola has done that with nearly every player he's bought. Witness the amount of work each game his players put in, nothing gets left on the field.

In my opinion, long may City continue because the last thing any of us want is them winning a thing.

To be fair, City have spent big, but so have Liverpool and Arsenal and still can't touch them, sometimes it's not all about money.

He did a decent job when he came in and nearly won us a trophy. Nearly.

But just when the expectation was there, he often bottled it, especially towards the end, And he left on bad terms in the eyes of many Everton supporters.

Personally, the two that stick out were Wigan in the FA Cup and that surrender to them in the semi-final when they where there for the taking.

I like Thelwell. Let's face it, we couldn't afford new players in every position, so he focussed on bringing in forward players. Those who watched on Saturday would have seen a classy through ball from a lot of people's least favourite full back for Ndiaye to run onto. We're going to like him.

If we are going to change manager, Moshiri could do it. He's certainly got form in that area.

But for now, lets focus on beating Palace on Saturday.

Win a few games and the talking will stop. I am in the "Let's keep our nerve" camp, stick with our manager, and take a look at things at the end of the season.

However, no wins from 7 going into the next International break might result in a change.

Anyway, I expect Thelwell and his scounting minnions to be on the look out for bargains come January, just s Newcastle are with DCL.

All the players listed below are out of contract in 2025.

Forwards.

CF : Moussa Dembele 28. Career 383 games - goals 168, assts 49.

CF : Facundo Colidio 24. Career 233 games - goals 49, assts 33. Inter are sniffing around him.

Defenders.

RB : Devyne Rensch 21. Ajax. Career 200 games. Can play RB and CB. Decent goals and assts record 17 / 16.

LB : Tyrick Mitchell 25. Palace. Career 154 games. Can play LB and LM. G/A 3/9.

LB : Leif Davis 24. Ipswich. Career 138 games. 5 goals 38 assts.

CB : Yarek Gasiorowski 19. Valencia. Career 26 games. CB and LB. Spain U19 Int.

CB : Zeno Van Den Bosch 21. Royal Antwerp. Career 74 games. Belgium U21 Int.

CB : Olivier Boscagli 27. PSV. Valued at £27m. Left footed. An ideal replacement for Branthwaite. Old head - been there and done it. With Keane leaving we will need an old head as Tarks aint getting any younger. Can play CB / LB / DM. Career games 245. 11 goals and 13 assists.

Midfielders : Mykola Shaparenko. 25. Dynamo Kyiv. Ukraine Int. Career 196 games. goals 27 assists 29. CM and AM.

I agree with Danny about David Moyes. He did a very good job with us for eleven years but he would do no more with our current squad than Dyche is doing and will do in the coming months. We will soon start to climb the table.

He's #37 in red. At 2:51 of the video, Francis is pressuring the ball which starts the sequence where he winds up with the ball and away he goes:

Link