Why Jordan Pickford is the Premier League’s most overlooked world-class goalkeeper

Whether you rely on stats or simply your own eyes and judgement, Pickford continues to be a terrific keeper much admired by most of us and a true and inspirational blue.

Paul G - Feel free to point me towards another thread on Pickford being under-appreciated outside of Everton? Maybe I'm wrong, but I've had a look back to August and couldn't see anything similar?

Jonathan/Paul H - I think the media are beginning to give him his flowers, but I'm not sure any non-Evertonians would put him among their top keepers.

World-class depends on your definition (I'd probably say top five in your position). I guess the point is that if Donnarumma, Raya, Alisson etc are all considered world-class, and Pickford's arguably outperforming them, shouldn't he be considered the same?

Here's one from January, Harry #5

Still, a different question asked and we do need something to talk about during the international break, don't we?

Here’s your chance to tell us.

For years it used to infuriate me how much goalkeepers were overly protected and now I feel they're a bit hard done by with these packed six-yard boxes! Maybe that's just me...

Yes I have sympathy with how the goalkeepers have to cope with a packed six yard area but let’s be honest these packed areas are recent events Jordan was poor dealing with that area since he came here.

Luckily, he makes up for it in other areas.

Yes, he makes a mistake now and then, but so do all keepers. I wouldn't swap him for any other keeper, Jordan Pickford is dynamite.

If anyone would like to put anyone else up for the title then sobeit, but it wont hold water like Jordan holds saves.

Maybe the lack of recognition is because he plays for a "smaller" club, cited out of ignorance of course by those who should know better but don't.

I've always highly rated Raya, Sanchez, the Georgian guy for Liverpool looks like a exceptional keeper too.

There's a good few excellent keepers playing in the Prem.

With regard to all holding, pushing and shoving in the penalty area, it's down to the refs to stop it, if they give penalties it will soon stop. I do think they have become a little strickter lately though.

The tactic now is to stop the keeper reaching the corners by putting bodies in the way, I don't think you can blame any keeper for failing to get to them. Being 9ft tall would be a help!

Each season it seems like he's winning us more points with his saves, he's never going to be great with crosses or coming for corners but those who are, don't make the saves we've seen in the last few weeks, so ill take him all day, because we've a decent defence to deal with crosses and corners.

How do you become world class ? He will probably become England's most capped player at tournaments when kane gives up, add a couple of semi finals and a final to that, and you surely have a world class keeper ??

There's been a lot of uninformed debate recently around long ball play but, for people who watch the games, it's clear that a world class keeper like Jordan knows exactly when to vary his distribution.

I also disagree that Pickford, for all his experience, knows exactly when to vary his distribution because I think he still rushes and forces mistakes out of himself at times, but we all see a different game.

Other than his mistake at Arsenal, I do think that Jordan Pickford is coming into form at exactly the right time, both for Everton and himself, with us having a chance of Europe, and the World Cup coming up for him.

I agree with your take on his mannerisms, even when he has time and passing to a full back, his shape is too deliberate and exaggerated.

Love him as our keeper though, his saves make up for the stuff he is not so good at.

Sometimes his kicking can be awry, but he got the third goal spot on. And his spectacular saves spread confidence almost like a goal.

Maybe with confidence a bit higher now, we'll see more playing from the back, but it hasn't happened yet.

Every team, Subbuteo apart, plays long and high passes. The one that drives me away from football is the aimless boot we have been playing to a centre-forward without a team mate within 30 yards of him.

A tactic to gain throw-in and corners.

Keeping the ball and doing nothing with it, infuriates me.

Against Chelsea and Arsenal we didn't have all the possession but we created the best chances for 80 minutes, against Chelsea, they did nothing with all their possession.

Very patient of you to take the time to try to explain the difference between the aimless boot in the general direction of an isolated striker and a measured long pass like the one from Garner played for the first goal. I thought Garner made it clear when he told us about Beto's complaints every day about his service in the past.

You shouldn't have to explain on a footie website... but not everyone can afford to watch football. Times are hard in bedsit land. The fact that 52,000 Evertonians boo like fuck at one and cheer the other to the rafters renders debate academic.

I guess there'll always be the odd one who can't tell the difference, but nobody takes any notice of them.

We don't see that enough from O'Brien or Mykolenko.

Clear the lines, clear the danger, as the side won't or can't take the ball in pressure situations for a lot of the players we have -- Keane, Tarkowski, O'Brien, Gana, Mykolenko.

The more measured pass on Saturday from Pickford, or when he has picked out wingers, is when he has time on the ball.

The Chelsea press was largely woeful. Brentford will be a lot different.

I don't quite buy the idea that a switch has been flicked. Part of it is the opposition, part of it is a return of better players, perhaps a preparation to play more football.

There are times in a game that every single goalkeeper has to go long and this is something I think Pickford enjoys doing more than most other goalkeepers because, when he gets it right, he could probably put the ball on a 50p coin, from about 70 yards away -- something I don't think either of our fullbacks are capable of.

I personally think in recent seasons those skills have diminished and he finds touch far too often.

You're right Ian, the idea that we're not playing any long balls suddenly after one game, as if it's a “sole tactic” that has been feverishly suggested by certain hysterical match-watching-dodgers isn't a switch flicked.

Chelsea had a backline that left the gap for Beto to drop a bit deeper to knock it on to Ndiaye. Brentford at their place will be harder. They have decent centre-backs.

I meant Pickord threads.

That said, he's the best shot stopper I've seen since big Nev.
I wouldn't say he's the best goalie in the Premier League, quite, but we're lucky to have him!

See my comment at @24 where I said I wish we had two full-backs capable of that.

You said we don't see enough of it; I said I don't think they are capable of it.

That's why we struggle against the shit teams. Let our full-backs have it.

He is suited to how we play away from home as a full-back, but I'm not always sure he is suited to playing that position when we have a lot more of the ball.

The big hoof has been absent since Beto came back as a starter and poor old statto Ian has been desperately denying it for weeks.

"Pickford wasn't pressed by Chelsea". Haha. Is that another one of Joe Cole's pearls of wisdom? It was a goal kick and all of our players had pushed up to the half-way line... How could he be pressed?

I guess it must be embarrassing for those who happy clapped the big boot and said it was the only way we could play. Even more embarrassing to listen to them insisting Moyes is still ordering the players to hoof it.

Arse, Chasing, own....up.

Wonderful entertainment!

We struggled against Burnley and Newcastle?

Try watching the games before making ignorant comments about them.

Sickener

Full-backs who can do that aren't exactly available on the store shelves. We've only had two in this century: Baines and Digne.

8

9

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😂

I've seen West, Rankin -- yes, Andy Rankin, who had it not been for Westy would have had a much greater reputation -- George Wood, Neville Southall, Nigel Martyn and Tim Howard all achieve brilliance, but none of them has been as consistently brilliant as Jordan behind a team of regrettably mediocre players.

Due respect though to Martyn and Howard in that regard. (And entirely courtesy of that shit Kenwright's pernicious conduct as his self-proclaimed, Trump-like, portrayal for decades as "Everton's Greatest Ever Fan". If the shit was alive today he'd be wearing and selling "EGEF" baseball caps to our more dopy supporters, believe me!)

I've seen all of the above 'keepers make crucial errors in conceding just a few soft goals but, like Jordan, I've rejoiced in seeing the lot of them make way more stupendous saves.

I treasure the bloke.

Andy Rankin in front of the Kop: Liverpool 0 - Everton 4.

Rankin v Hunt

I really rated Nigel Martyn -- cool. calm and collected.

Jordan has won me over in the last few years. Maybe one of the reasons is I think he is a nutter when he pulls on a blue shirt.

I suppose that one possibility is someone who 'dodges' watching the match? How do you 'dodge' watching the match: by taking Fido for a walk or sitting in the kitchen without the radio or tv on?

Anyone's guess. It's such an inarticulate and fuzzy term masquerading, I think, as something thought to be smart and clever.

Let's think about another possibility. Extremely poorly expressed, as his 'words' are, is it possible that the author is trying to say someone who in his word, erm, 'dodges' going to the match?

Well, that would be unfortunate for the author who himself rarely if ever goes to the match and was not there last Saturday.

If the author is trying to continue his obsessive vendetta against Darren Hind, he might remember that he himself qualifies to be an erm 'hysterical match-watching-dodger', and that Darren has been quite open in saying that for the best part of a month and perhaps longer he is recovering from surgery that has made movement extremely difficult.

Some of us have expressed sympathy and support for Darren making it very clear what a shitty nasty comment and post this is from our favourite TW hypocrite. The author needs to discuss psychological projection and narcissistic personality disorder with someone in the know who might be able to help, but I can't promise anything.

I always read Darren's posts, whether I agree with them or not. They are always centred on football, they are well-written and interesting. He debates hard but it about the club and the game in general.

Some could learn a little about that, as Darren has earned his stripes on here over a decade or more by offering a clear point of view.

ps: Get well soon, Darren.

Over the years, I've watched a sequence of detractors try to catch attention by targeting Darren. They come and go but Darren remains and we wait for the next one.

This latest one is one of the weaker ones. Perhaps the weakest. Darren is currently running rings round him. It's fun to watch.

Thank you for your comments. Truth is; I have had far too much time on my hands lately.

It's strange: you make a really simple observation about the games which is actually complimentary and positive and you find so-called "positive people" frothing over their keyboards, raging against it across a number of threads.

Quite clearly, they are trying desperately hard to disagree with the person as opposed to the point. There is nothing quite so negative as a self-proclaimed positive.

Regarding the argument on this thread, which was meant to be about Jordan Pickford, but hijacked by the usual clown, people can simply ask themselves three very brief and simple questions and draw their own conclusions:

A) Has this team often been guilty of launching mindless boots in the general direction of an isolated striker?

B) Has this often been the primary, even sole, tactic?

C) Has there been any evidence at all of said mindless big boot throughout the past four games?

Job done.

But in my honest opinion, the answer to B) is No.

The key word in your post is "mindless". There is no point launching a goal-kick or long clearance to a sole striker when nobody is within 20 feet of the player. If we employ a low block with full-backs tucked in and wide men doubling up on the opposition wingers, then you can guarantee that we will just turnover possession by aiming it at Beto or Barry.

There is nothing wrong with long-balls in themselves. Brentford have played the most long balls this season and scored 7 more league goals than us, as they have committed numbers to the counter-attack. When they beat Liverpool 3-2, most of Brentford's long-balls were aimed at the wings.

I think we should use long balls properly against the redshite as they are really poor at dealing with the second balls, even if they win the initial headers. But, if they are mindless boots up towards Beto, then they will love it.

Over the top gets defenders facing their keeper; down the channels gets defenders turning away from their goalkeeper. I used to hate playing against lesser teams who used this as their primary tactic but it's definitely effective if you have got players prepared to run those channels hard.

My favourite tactic is getting an overload down the flanks (like Baines and Pienaar) and this is why watching Jake O'Brien playing as a full-back often frustrates me because this completely nullifies this type of play (ask Dibling).

My second favourite tactic is getting a midfielder with time and space in the middle of the park on the ball. I love watching midfield players driving forward through the middle of the park, especially when they can hit those lovely little through passes, down the sides or through the middle of retreating defenders, like James Garner did on Saturday night.

We caused Liverpool a lot of problems in the first half at Anfield with this tactic during last season's derby and should have been a couple of goals to the good. But we have got to beat Brentford before we play Liverpool, so it's one game at a time for me!

I wouldn't have had Newcastle down as a shit team, cloth ears. I think everyone would put down that Eddie Howe is a good manager, who plays good football. But I am sure you'd argue the toss that he doesn't.

I would have Wolves home, Leeds home and away, West Ham home, Burnley away, as shit teams, and you can chuck in Spurs as well whilst you're at it, given everyone else is pumping them.

If you don't think we need 2 new full-backs, you're in a minority. It is our limiting factor in tight games. Fact.

It's pretty standard to say who. It's a thread not a private conversation.

So we are both a fail on footnotes, when you come to year-end assessments.

I feel the same way these days and was made up to see him return a few months ago, he hasn't changed — he livens ToffeeWeb up for me.

I hope you are okay, Darren, and recovering well. I know you won't be bothered if some criticise you but will accept it and give it back when necessary.

Yes, I know this question has been asked many times and the usual answer is “How do we know clubs haven't come in for him?”

I haven't heard or read of any club come in with any concrete evidence that they have and been knocked back. Maybe some one will give me that evidence.

If Kenwright was still here, he'd give us a list of where and when a dozen clubs were going mad to sign him but he told them he wouldn't sell Jordan for all the tea in China -- like he did when told them he wouldn't sell Rooney!

A couple of weeks later, he sells the best player of his generation... for £20M.

I wouldn't argue with you about those fullbacks though, although I am a big believer that, for most players or teams, every time you gain something, you often lose something in return: this is why I think it's so difficult finding consistency.

Against Liverpool at home or Brentford away, I don't mind seeing Jake O'Brien playing full-back but, if we are to really evolve, it's obvious we are going to sometimes need a lot more offensively from the players who are selected to play full-back.

ps: Anyone got a spare for Brentford? My usual source has dried up since the Arsenal game, zut alors!

My mate married a girl from Sutton, her owld feller was a miner. We'd go for a pint with him up there. Not many, if any, soft as shite men up there from what I saw.

Your comments humble me... and if I'm honest, I more than most could use a little humbling.

I'm amazed at the direction this debate has taken. 70-yard passes from full-backs??? Are you sure? How many of them have you seen this season? One? Two? ... More likely none.

There is a massive difference between just knocking a ball 70 yards, and doing it to a team mate without it being intercepted. 70 yards is just around the average width of a pitch.

Do you realise how long the ball needs to be in the air? Anyone trying it can expect a massive bollocking from his mates when the inevitable interception happens. Only goalkeepers try 70-yard passes.

We'd all like to have today's version of Carlos Alberto and Ray Wilson as our full-backs, but very few teams have even one world class full-back (although I can't think of one), let alone two.

O'Brien has been magnificent this season. Played out of position for over a year... but not many wingers get much change out of him. Same with Mykolenko. Neither of these players will ever be confused with Terry Cooper (ask your arl fella), but there are not many full-backs defending better than them -- look at the Goals Against column.

I know people want to see better football (nobody more than me) and more attacking full-backs would help us achieve that, but there is a pissed logic being applied by the ever growing bandwagon calling for O'Brien and Mykolenko to be replaced.

They want to applaud Moyes's excellent defensive unit (and it has largely been excellent), but they want to remove two people who have contributed so very much to that unit. It doesn't stack up.

It would be lovely to see Bainsey and Seamus stick a kit on and roll back the years... But we have far more pressing matters than the bandwagon's favourite scapegoats.

70-yard passes? Fuck me. It's not Sunday morning at Wally Hall Park. Those big midfielders we call athletes make them virtually impossible in professional football. And we want two full-backs who can do it regularly???

I am soft as shite though -- I'd run a mile if Dazza or Big Griff turned up in the pub.

I've seen them three times recently. They were booed off by their own fans in two of them and twatted in the other. A cursory look at what is universally recognised as a very ordinary league will show there are only 8 teams worse than them Draw your own conclusions.

TW had a poster called Rob Halligan who doesn't seem to post much these days. He is a tell-it-as-it-is kind of guy. He always found the words to describe "Real" Newcastle.

Mark.

You don't strike me as somebody who would run a mile from a pint that had just been bought for you?

😂

Good luck getting a ticket mate.

Talking of Rob Halligan, I've met him recently at a couple of games and he's well and hearty. For “real” Newcastle he would say deluded big club my arse club.

He's another of us who is less than enamoured with the Moyes style of play but never misses a game in support of the team -- not the man.

Is Moyes doing a good job? “Gary Lineker seems to think so.”

Come on, Philip, is that a compliment?

Can’t think of any to beat it.

What was it about having the best away record in the league that first started to grate on him?

I wouldn't like to lose either of them as contributors though as both talk a lot of sense amongst the insults.

I'm a champion grade critic in all things - just ask my wife - but I don't think its a good idea to get personal.

I've had my differences with Darren and Paul in the past but we seem to have called a truce now.

I've no idea why my posts always appear spaced like they do it must be a setting on my computer.

Oh, and the edit is now working!

I thought that clip was going to show all the goals from that lovely day when all the Kopites emigrated from the Kop with about twenty minutes left to play.

Agree with Don @ (48) Andy Rankin never got a real chance at Everton but more than proved his worth with Watford although he had a great game for us at Ibrox Park when we beat Rangers 3-1 in the first leg of the English v Scottish champions in clouding saving a penalty.

I think your “cool, calm and collected“ remark makes him just that bit better than Jordan who is mad, mental and nuttier than a fruitcake, on the pitch anyway but we've all got our faults!

It must be close.

September 1964, I think.

Moyes is doing the job we need at the moment and, in many ways, it's paying off. The aways make up for some poor homes, but we all go to the matches hoping to see improvement.

And in all fairness, we've seen that in the last few games.

He posts like a bag of Revels. The occasional toffee, but far too many coffee ones.

I'm very happy to be seen as TW's grumpy old man. It's not just a persona I like to cultivate. I really am a grumpy old man.

I've had some fantastic adversaries on here down the years and enjoyed crossing swords with all of them, but in a decade of posting here. I have never come across anybody who gets so little respect right across the board as poster 71 - His daily attempts to rile so many without even discussing the game are now well documented. No wonder he cant buy a response.

"Obituary" ? HeHe. Probably one day in the distant future, but the creepy little morons hiding behind their lap tops in bedsits wont get to read them.

Made up to see his latest creepy offering already taking a kicking.

"Two full backs who can regularly hit 70 yard passes" Hahaha.....No wonder he carefully steers clear of the subject of football.

Oh and "expect stuff in return and dont cry over It" .... Good luck finding that post

I know you won't, just making clear who your digital family is.

The pugilist gets that many knockdowns on here, I reckon he's got a cauliflower arse.

JC : Still standing, Johnny boy, still standing. Respect due to you, though, having a cage fighter for a missus must be fun, right?

Oh and by the way, lads and lasses, I'm reading in the Guardian that the Friedkins are planning to offer Moyes a new contract in the summer. Apparently, “any new contract for Moyes is likely to be accompanied by giving the manager a greater say over recruitment”.

Enjoy the rest of your day😁

Moyes reckons he missed a lot of his targets because he couldn't offer them European football, so maybe he's going to sign a load of experienced players and hopefully turn us into the Nottingham Forest team that won the league and two European Cups.

He has claimed at various times that the club would go into administration, the stadium would not be completed, it would be over-budget by £150 million, our premier league rivals would sue us for £373 million and the British government was investigating the 777 offer.

He got made redundant from the Daily Mail and has now washed up in the Guardian. In fact, he writes non-stop bollocks which is probably why you like him.

Were you part of the Forest set up at that time?

I think Moyes is doing okay but, I'm aware others think he's doing brilliantly. Something I learned on this website from Darren Hind, and was something that Dyche, often mentioned, is that there doesn't seem to be much middle ground with Evertonians.

We beat Chelsea, a loss would have put us mid- table, and although it was a fantastic day and performance, there hasn't been that many of them to be getting too excited imo.

And yes, Moyes will probably buy experience in the summer. John McGinn is a perfect type of a Moyes player. Doubt we'll see him in an Everton shirt, though.

I don't get why we bought Dibling, Aznou and got Tyrique George on loan when he had little or no intention of playing them. He says he has final say on signings, but clearly he doesn't.

He sure does divide opinion, but I don't get the entrenched extremes - if he does well, credit due, if he doesn't, he cops flak, that's normal. Never seeing the positives or negatives is a bit weird though.

Do you not think that in the last three games we've started to at least look reasonably exciting? “Shackles off “ as Daz Hind says?

If you think that all the players Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth have made, were instant hits. Think again.

Loads come in, bedded down and then delivered later, either at those clubs or on loan.

Caicedo signed for Brighton in February 2021. First 6 months, not one appearence.

Next season 8 appearances. 12 in belgium on loan.

Next season 37 league appearances.

Then sold to Chelsea for £115m.

George, Dibling, Aznou might all need that loan, just like Caicedo, Branthwaite, Garner etc.

I was talking about how I love to see midfield players with space driving forward and my view is that has been one of our weaknesses, when playing at Bramley-Moore Dock, because we haven't been playing tight and compact enough.

But this changed against Man Utd, and I think we have looked a lot more organised and seem to have a lot more belief in ourselves since then.

Chelsea won't loan him again to wither on the bench and his agent will find him a team that will play him.

He couldn't play against Chelsea but he should have been brought on much sooner at Arsenal.

I really think he can be a star but we need to make him feel wanted.

Tyrique George looked like a replacement for McNeil and he should be getting more minutes, but Dibling wasn't ready for a gaping hole that needed more experience. Easy in hindsight to see that now, of course.

Does George deserve to play ahead of Ndiaye and McNeil? Not currently. Does he deserve more minutes? Probably... possibly.

I take it as a good thing that someone is making a good assessment as to whether George is an upgrade on McNeil or not. If he isn't, then there's no point signing him and wasting precious resources.

Look at the money wasted over the last decade...

Before Chelsea, I was thinking he should play up front instead of Beto because he's got a good shot on him. Happy to be proved my musings aren't worth shit.

But appreciate the comment, none the less.

Says it all as far as I'm concerned.