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Everton News, Season 2011-12

Two set to miss end-of-season games

03/05/2012 |  69 Comments: First  |  Last
Phil Neville and Victor Anichebe could be out for the remaining two games of the season after picking up injuries in the past week.

Neville pulled a hamstring in training and missed the draw at Stoke on Tuesday, only the fourth time this season Neville has been unavailable to David Moyes.

Anichebe then limped out of the action at the Britannia Stadium with a groin problem which Everton will be hoping is not related to the groin injury he picked up on international duty for Nigeria that sidelined him for a good chunk of the early part of the campaign.

Everton face Wolves and Newcastle in their last two games but neither Neville nor Anichebe are expected to feature.

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Nick Entwistle
478   Posted 03/05/2012 at 17:37:31

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Knock a few thousand off the gates that.
Paul David
483   Posted 03/05/2012 at 17:47:29

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Whats going on with Gibson,nothing seems to have been said since he was taken off at half time at the weekend?
Joe Clitherow
486   Posted 03/05/2012 at 17:58:11

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Was going to post on a couiple of other threads where you and otheres asked about Gibson.

He was very heavily strapped with black tape which looked like it was supporting a groin injury and he looked injured just before half time.

So I suspect he was carrying an injury and aggravated it in the Fulham game.

No sense in any injury risks at this point of the season.
Tony Cheek
491   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:19:48

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Never been one of my faves, but felt really sorry for Victor when he got injured. He has done really well as a "super sub" and scored some important goals for us this season. He has waited patiently for his chance and when he finally gets it, the injury jinx hits him again.

Really dont know what the future holds for him though, if we hold on to our top players and strengthen, then I cant see him getting many starts next year either.

As for Pip, a great shame he will miss the last games, you cant help but admire his leadership qualities, and just wonder how much longer he can lead from the front. Not getting any younger, and he too could struggle next year. Moyes is not the clinical type though and seems to stick by the loyal players. Tim Cahill might have been put out to grass at other clubs.

But if Moyes is serious about moving forward, then a clear out might be the way forward. It will be interesting pre-season.
Jimmy Sørheim
492   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:40:01

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If Moyes does not use Drenthe now after all these injuries then he simply doesn't want to keep this 7th place.
Kevin Sparke
493   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:41:09

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Paul David - you should be ashamed of yourself 'woohoo' when two of our players get injured - one of whom who would sweat blood in the Everton cause (Neville).

Absolutely disgusting display of childishness... I'm not angry - just disappointed (shakes head)
Nick Entwistle
494   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:43:04

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Is that as lone striker or right back Jimmy?
Ian Glassey
495   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:34:54

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Time to get Barkley in, hopefully.

Just a thought: if we were to get 2 goals up, in one of are last games and got a pen.. What about letting Hibbo take it?
Nick Entwistle
496   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:44:44

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Oh, and dumb ass comment of the season award goes to Jimmy.

Not wanting to keep 7th... hanging out for that all important 8th is he?
Andy Peers
498   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:42:36

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I still don't understand not giving Barkley a start. Cahill is just not good enough to start and should be an impact sub only. Try Vellois with Jelly and not Anichebe, if you are trying the 4-4-2. I never fully understand Moyes team selections and I am sure I won't have the same lineup as him over the next 2 games so I am not going to try. Neville is easy to replace and when we play with Anichebe starting I feel like we only have 10 men. Not sure why Anichebe hasn't come good but he needs shipping out and replaced.
Graham Mockford
501   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:52:56

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Nick if there was a dumb ass comment of the season award Jimmy would have quite a few entries to choose from.
It's a bit like trying to pick Matt Le Tissier's best goal!
Ian Glassey
504   Posted 03/05/2012 at 18:57:25

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Jimmy 492

Give it up mate.
Paul Joy
506   Posted 03/05/2012 at 19:07:27

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Jimmy #492
FFS all Drenthe wants to do is get pissed and empty his scrotum - he had his chance(s) at Everton and every other club he has been at. He has been a huge let down because of this. I want to watch footballers with his talent not wasters with his talent. I pay good money to watch everton and personally I don't want to watch him again.
Ian Glassey
511   Posted 03/05/2012 at 19:16:52

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Well said Paul.
But i think we are wasting our time, i think Drenthe is
Jimmys love child..
Sam Hoare
512   Posted 03/05/2012 at 19:21:04

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Jimmy, surely you're not being serious.

Good riddance to Drenthe. I'd like to see Barkley, Junior, Duffy and Baxter get some game time though.

How about this team vs Wolves

Coleman Heitnga Duffy Distin
Baxter Gibson Fellaini Pienaar
John Ford
514   Posted 03/05/2012 at 19:26:10

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Drenthe is a slightly classier Coleman. A headless chicken....flashes of inspiration interspersed with dollops of crass stupidity and poor decision making.

James Stewart
540   Posted 03/05/2012 at 20:17:59

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Good. Neville or Vic only make the team weaker.
Wayne Smyth
542   Posted 03/05/2012 at 20:14:19

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John, you're doing Drenthe a serious disservice comparing him to Coleman. He has more footballing ability and talent than almost any of our squad. To my mind he's a faster, younger Pienaar.

Sadly, he's mentally not mature enough to ever make use of any of that talent and for that reason its best he not be in or near the squad.

Kevin(493), I also am glad that Neville is unfit to play. I'd love to see Moyes actually give youth a chance now that we're into the last few games and let Barkley or Vellios(or any one of our promising youngsters) have some proper game time, but that is unlikely to happen when his old favourites such as Cahill, Neville, McFadden etc are all fit.

Moyes normally needs to be backed into a corner with out any chance of playing his old guard before he'll give our youth some proper time on the pitch, as evidenced by straq(who isn't good enough for us and probably wont be here next season), being played ahead of Vellios.
Paul David
543   Posted 03/05/2012 at 20:13:54

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Kevin 493

Both players are shit and vastly over paid considering what they offer the team.I'm sure i've upset a lot of people saying that and they'll be quick to point out like you did (you really didnt have to point out it was Neville you was referring to) Nevilles leadership qualities and how he is a model pro.

I dont care if he is a dream to work with and he points his finger about during matches,he has never been good enough to play for Everton.
Tony Cheek
550   Posted 03/05/2012 at 20:36:39

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I cant believe people are still talking about Drenthe. Yes, he is good enough, but his attitude stinks and let us down before the semi. I, for one will never forgive him for that. We will finish in 7th without him....get over it!!
John Atkins
563   Posted 03/05/2012 at 22:37:43

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Paul # 543
Not so sure you'll upset a lot of people with that statement
Agree about Victor not being good enough and ok maybe Phil Neville is past his best but as for never being good enough you're talking b*llocks
Paul David
570   Posted 03/05/2012 at 22:50:30

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Neville cant dribble, pass or cross ? granted that's not really his job but the defensive side of his game is not good either.

He is not the worst right back in the world but he is an awful midfielder: he can't head a ball, is not a good tackler (I'm sure your going point out the one great challenge he makes a year that "changes our season") and it's amazing for such an experienced player how many stupid free kicks he gives away in dangerous positions.

I'm sure you and others think he isn't as bad as I say but I bet you would agree with this: in all his years at the club, he is rarely ever talked about after the game as being man of the match. How is that possible from someone who is our captain?

I fucking hate the fact he is captain of our club.
Jamie Barlow
574   Posted 03/05/2012 at 23:08:21

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I agree with John

You're talking bollocks Paul.
John Shaw
577   Posted 03/05/2012 at 23:22:00

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Paul (570) what complete and utter shite !

The role of captain isn't just about having the skill of a fuckin Ronaldo or Messi, it's also about being a role model and representing the club in the best possible light, something Neville has always done with ease.

As for him never being mentioned as MoTM, so what, good teams invariably have a player who very rarely gets plaudits, but who they miss for one reason or another when he doesn't play, and for me Neville is one of those.

He's very similar to Tiny Tim, they are both in the latter stages of their careers, but their drive and determination is something which can't be taught, you either have it or you don't, and those two have it in spades.

They have both been great servants to Everton and deserve better than the kind of shite you spew !!

Dear, oh dear, oh dear.
Graham Mockford
580   Posted 03/05/2012 at 23:33:12

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Paul David

Never been good enough to play for Everton. What utter and complete shite. Over 350 games for Man U (SAF is a notoriously bad judge of a player!). 6 Prem medals, 3 FA cups, 1CL and 59 England caps.
Over 250 games for Everton and never hidden in his life. Football players come in all shapes and sizes, here's one that is undoubtedly not the most skilful ball player but more than makes up for it in other areas.
Derek Thomas
595   Posted 04/05/2012 at 03:47:29

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From a Forward and Midfield perspective, what ever the question is, they are NOT the answer, gives some one else a chance, maybe vs relegated Woves... Barkley.
Peter Barry
597   Posted 04/05/2012 at 05:27:45

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Whats with our 'Norwegian Blue' Jimmy's constant Drenthe obsession is he his part owner or something?
Paul David
695   Posted 04/05/2012 at 12:28:59

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John 557

I never said a captain should be like Messi; what I do think though is that the captain's place in the team should not be questioned and he is no better than Hibbert who I would always play ahead of Neville.

The reason people fail to mention him as a possible MotM is because there is always at least 5 players who have played better than him on the day.

Graham 580

Yes, Neville has won everything there is to win, which is part of the reason I expect more from him than I do Hibbert, yet he rarley impresses me. Plus he would never have got in Man Utd's strongest 11 in all his time there, most of his starts came when others were injured or rested,he was never that important to utd and as for England. We all know if you play for certain clubs your chances of playing for England are greatly improved... even if other players are better.
David Chait
699   Posted 04/05/2012 at 13:01:54

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Sam #512 .. perfect team for me for saturday.

Glad to see someone else punting more of Baxter as I have felt pretty lonely in that corner.

Per reports he always seems to shine in the reserve fixtures above anyone else including Gueye and often Barkely.

Never going to happen mind you.
Jamie Barlow
717   Posted 04/05/2012 at 15:00:19

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Paul, come on, you're just making things up now.

"Most of his starts came when others were injured or rested, he was never that important to Utd."

He played an average of 40 games a season for Manchester Utd between 1997 & 2003. During which they won the league 4 times, the FA Cup twice, and they won the European Cup (or whatever its called) Plus i don't know how many Charity Sheilds.

I'd say he was a pretty important member of their team.
Andy Meighan
720   Posted 04/05/2012 at 15:36:55

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Anichebe won't be missed, that's for sure. If there was ever a footballer who looks like he hates the game, it's him. In all the years he's been an Everton player, I don't think I've ever seen the miserable bastard smile... maybe that's why Moyes likes him?

As for Neville, he's been one of our best players this season. Yes, we all know his limitations... but he's been a credit to our club. He gets kicked everywhere but does he moan or whine? No, he doesn't ? just dusts himself down and gets on with it... unlike the aforementioned so-called striker.

I personally hope Anichebe never plays for us again. Never mind the last 2 games ? his goal record for a so-called striker is atrocious and his attitude stinks. Maybe Barkley might get a game now... oh no, hang on... Jinking Jimmy Mac is next in line, isn't he?!
Graham Mockford
728   Posted 04/05/2012 at 16:16:38

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Paul, sorry to let facts get in the way of your argument but in the 7 year period that he won 5 PL winners medals he played in 200 out of a possible 276 games so to say he was not important to Man Utd is more utter and complete shite.

You're right in stating you are more likely to play for England playing for a big club but five successive England managers picked him.

Excuse me if I prefer their opinion plus that of SAF and David Moyes of what makes a good player over your deluded ranting.
Paul David
745   Posted 04/05/2012 at 17:09:55

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He was involved in a lot of games,i'm also willing to bet a lot of them were from the bench and that Ferguson didnt think of him as one of his strongest 11,a usefull squad player more like.

I did say he's not the worst right back in the world and I did say he has never been good enough for Everton because I believe Hibbert is a better player (not by much).
Graham Mockford
749   Posted 04/05/2012 at 17:40:54

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Paul I know you don't want to let this go but unfortunately the evidence does not support your assertion. SAF does not have a strongest 11, that concept only applies to cash strapped paupers like us. They regularly rotate players because they have a squad.

If you refuse to accept that how would you explain him starting both the 96 and 99 FA Cup Finals, you think maybe they were saving their 'best' players for the Charity Shield!?

It was only in his final season that he got limited appearances and was not a regular. Being the type of individual he is, ie, a player with integrity, he left because he wanted first team football regularly. SAF was quoted as saying he did not want to lose him but, out of his respect for him, he wanted to give him that chance.

Saying "he has never been good enough to play for Everton" is not only one of the most ridiculous statements I have heard on here but quite frankly displays how much you understand about football.
Paul David
750   Posted 04/05/2012 at 17:54:12

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Graham i'll hold my hands up over his utd career because I do not pay them as much attention as I do Everton but is it such a shock that I rate Hibbert as a better player.
John Daley
752   Posted 04/05/2012 at 17:58:19

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"If Moyes does not use Drenthe now after all these injuries then he simply doesn't want to keep this 7th place."

By the hammer of Thor Jimmy, you must really love Drenthe (or 'that little nobhead' as he's now commonly known). You just can't stop banging on about him.

Do you scream his name when you're fucking your wife?
Graham Mockford
755   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:00:41

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OK Paul no we've blown that one out the water lets talk about your next opinion.

At least 'is Tony Hibbert better than Phil ?' gives you a sporting chance.

Is it a 'shock'? ......No , you hold some strange views,

Do I agree?........ Absolutely not. I have a lot of time for Tony Hibbert but let me explain

Phil is the better defender
Phil is the better leader
Phil is the more adaptable footballer
Phil is the better big game player

I suspect your opinion would be in the minority but that's not what irks me about your posts, it is your inability to see a footballer who embodies the values that I think are consistent with our great football club.
Maybe you would like him more if he had a Scouse accent!

John Daley
756   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:04:31

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Plenty of people on here kicking Paul in the bollocks for daring to berate Phil Neville. How many of those claiming the Cabbage Patch doll faced fullback has always been a top class player were jumping for joy when they first heard we'd signed the fucker? Not me, and not anyone I know.

Yes, he's a model pro and he appears to have taken the club to heart but, c'mon, he's average in every aspect of the game... except for passing, where he's below average.

If it was my choice, I'd sack him off as Captain straight away and give the armband to Heitinga.
Paul David
757   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:15:50

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I think Neville if anything embodies Moyes's values ? not necessarily the club's.

I think Hibbert is better; you think Neville is better... let's leave it at that.

Yeah being Scouse I automatically don't like Mancs, so that's me and nearly everyone else in this city.
Graham Mockford
759   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:25:24

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'Cabbage Patch doll faced full back' ...... That really helps your point don't you think, really adds to the quality of the debate.
You then move on to the classic argument for the bereft of originality. It can't be true because I don't think so (or anyone I know). Personally I think most normal minded individuals were fairly open minded when we signed him, I was but I wasn't jumping for joy I will concede that. However your use of 'fucker' to describe our captain probably gives us your measure.
Finally he's not an average Everton player, we have had a lot that have lowered that particular bar over the years.
Welcome to the kicking
Graham Mockford
760   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:40:41

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I had such high hopes when I read your second paragraph, genuinely a good point and a good comeback.

But then we get to your last paragraph oh dear where do I start.

You don't like people because of where they were born?

What about race, religion, sexual orientation you ok with all that stuff? Or is it just mancs? He's from Bury by the way just down the road from me.
John Daley
762   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:59:12

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Don't be so sensitive.  He's Phil Neville, not the Queen Mother.

How many times has this 'inspirational' leader actually inspired his teammates to victory? Oh wait, he went through Ronaldo once in a game we managed to draw. 

In my opinion, whilst being a good ambassador for the club is important, the key criteria for selecting a captain should be the influence he brings to bear on the actual football pitch. Take John Terry and Stevie G laa. Phil Neville is undoubtedly a better man than both of them put together but is less than half the captain of either of them. Both Terry and Gerrard, despite their odious natures, are strong characters that can lift and motivate those around them and have often drove their respective teams to victory when they've looked down and out. Phil Neville doesn't do that. He probably can't do that. He doesn't influence and impact on others by stamping his authority on a game. True, he leads by example in one respect by being a consummate professional but that's where his impact ends. His teammates may admire him for his attitude but they can't admire him for his ability.

He seems an honest sort of guy and i'm sure if you asked him himself he would admit to being a limited player, but one always prepared to knuckle down and graft. Really though, that should be the bare minimum expected of any player so I don't think it counts as a valid reason to place him on a pedestal and make him exempt from criticism. 
Paul David
765   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:54:39

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That's the way it is, Mancs don't like us either but I don't cry about it. It's a rivaly between the two cities that's gone on long before there was any football clubs but now that's how it's expressed.

And by the way, I've never heard anyone in the flesh say Neville is good; the best thing I've ever heard anyone say about him is "He is not as bad as everyone says he is." ? A glowing refence indeed.
Mike Allison
767   Posted 04/05/2012 at 18:58:52

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I actually think Hibbert has become a better full back than Neville. Hibbert has improved quite dramatically in my opinion.

However, I have to stick up for Neville the captain, he's exactly the kind of person I want as captain as Everton. Yes, he is getting on a bit, and frankly, I wouldn't actually pick him most of the time, certainly not in a full strength first XI, but he deserves his status at the club, represents us superbly and provides a fantastic example to younger players coming through. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if Hibbert's improvement has involved Neville's input.
Graham Mockford
793   Posted 04/05/2012 at 20:30:58

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For the hard of thinking let me explain my thinking.

I joined this thread to disagree with a couple of statements made by Paul.

Firstly that Phil Neville has never been good enough for Everton. I think I put that one to bed.

Secondly that Tony Hibbert is a better player. Well as they say opinions are like arseholes and there's plenty of opinions on this particular thread.

I then objected to your vacuous and infantile insults about the captain of our football club. Unlike some he has always given his best and to be frank and call me old fashioned but he doesn't deserve being called a 'fucker', especially by his own supporters.

I would never claim he is a better player than Gerard or Terry, I don't think he is.

You attach the sobriquet 'inspirational' to him ,not me, but maybe he is. Certainly a lot of very good managers seem to have put faith in him. I think what you are missing and what gets to the very nub of the argument is your definition of 'ability'

Professional football is not just about defence splitting passes or scoring goals but also includes the hard yards ie stopping others playing, making space for others to play. That my friend is where Phil Neville excels and why he has played at the highest level for 16 years.

So no I'm not putting him on a pedestal , there have been plenty of better players but for me he is someone I'm proud to be an Everton player.
Graham Mockford
797   Posted 04/05/2012 at 20:48:23

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Paul David

So let's just be clear you don't like anyone from Manchester. Do you know how fucking simple that makes you sound?

You haven't heard anyone say Neville is good. Well that either proves it is true or you hang about with people who know nothing about football... you decide!
Paul David
800   Posted 04/05/2012 at 20:59:14

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It happens all over the counrty.

Glasgow and Edinburgh
Newcastle and Sunderland
Norwich and Ipswich
Nottingham and Derby

It's not like they have running battles and try kill each other, they just take the piss out of each other, get a fucking grip.

The fact I've never heard anyone say a good word about Neville shows not everyone holds him in the same esteem as you do.

He is an average player at best, sorry if I don't want to accept average players as good enough for Everton ? never mind being captain.
Paul David
804   Posted 04/05/2012 at 21:25:12

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When scousers say they hate Mancs and vice versa, it's in a pantomine kind of way. You seem to be the only person that needs that explaining to; of course I don't hate someone just because they was born in Manchester ? and you say I'm the simple one.
Graham Mockford
806   Posted 04/05/2012 at 21:35:48

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'Yeah being scouse I automatically dont like mancs,so thats me and nearly everyone else in this city.'

'That's the way it is, Mancs don't like us either but I don't cry about it. It's a rivaly between the two cities that's gone on long before there was any football clubs'

And now you say
'of course I dont hate someone just because they was born in'

Spot any inconsistency there at all.

Also because you seem to have led such a sheltered life I attach a few quotes for you.

SAF '"Phil is one of the special people in the game so I hope he is picking up that cup. Everyone knows his connection to Manchester United. He was here so long as a kid. I know he was captaining Everton in a semi-final but don't tell me there was not one small part in him that was saying, 'Christ I am going to knock Manchester United out of the cup here'. It goes to show you the integrity of the man. He is a fantastic person and no-one in the game deserves it more than he does."

Ian Snodin 'Nov 2 2010 Liverpool
I?VE never heard a footballer complain about being praised before ? but then Phil Neville isn?t your average footballer.

The Blues skipper said he was embarrassed by all the attention he received for nullifying the Gareth Bale threat at Tottenham and stopped buying the papers for a few days!

All the players I knew enjoyed getting a pat on the back from the manager or seeing nice things written about them in the papers.

But Phil seems to be one of those supremely level-headed individuals who, like the words of the famous poem, treats success and failure the same way.At the age of 33 he is playing as well as ever ? and when you consider what he has won throughout his career that?s a pretty high level. You don?t spend as long at Manchester United and have the medals he has without being a very good player.
Paul David
808   Posted 04/05/2012 at 21:56:59

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No, I don't spot any inconsistencies at all.

Scousers don't like Mancs, there is a rivalry.

I then had to explain something that I thought was obvious and what everybody already knew: that it's not a genuine hatred.

When we play Liverpool, I'll say "I hate these red shite bastards" (as you probably do) but do I really mean it? No, my dad and his side of the family are reds and so are half my mates. It's the same thing.

By the way, after I read the first quote about Neville, I didn't bother reading the rest because there was no point: he will always be nothing more than an average player to me.

Yes, you might think it's childish the way Scousers and Mancs say they hate eachother but when I said "I'm Scouse I automatically dont like Mancs." I honestly thought you would not take that statment as gospel and I my opinion of Neville will never change so can we just agree to disagree and call it a day on this.
Michael Kenrick
809   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:08:27

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The thing is, Graham, and perhaps you've noticed this: footballers and indeed managers NEVER (or very very rarely) talk ill of each other. It's this whole Mutual Appreciation Society dynamic going on through the media...

Only when you step away from that BS and engage with committed fans, who can provide some more critical analysis, do I think you get anywhere close to seeing a real picture emerge. Yes, some fans are fed on a diet of cloying pap from the likes of the Echo and Official Website, but there are plenty who watch the games, who watch the players perform, and who are well capable of reaching their own conclusions.

That's where we come in. We provide a vehicle here for committed fans to compare notes, if you like, on things like "How good is Pip, really?" I don't think you should be so quick to devalue those opinions and call them stupid. You can disagree by all means; but that's what it's all about.

By your posts, you put the opinions of the fellow professional above those of your fellow fans; I would do the opposite, simply because I know which one is going to be more genuine.
John Daley
811   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:27:46

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Jesus Christ. Give the mock outrage a rest Graham. No pun intended.

"because you seem to have led such a sheltered life".

Obviously if you take such umbrage at a slight on Phil Neville's Adonis like appearance, go all Ned Flanders at the use of the word 'fucker', and are left reeling by  a jokey comment about Mancs then you're the one that needs to get out and about in the real world a bit. Do you wear a balaclava and ear muffs when you go to Goodison?  That might explain why you never hear any audible groans about Neville and the back and forth baiting between Scousers and Mancs when City or Utd come to town.

Coincidentally, nice little article online for you today:
Graham Mockford
812   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:19:29

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You're right, Paul, but let's face it.

I challenged you on Phil Neville's Man Utd record and you backed down; you have changed your position on not liking Mancs and you openly admit your opinion is so set you don't even read my arguments.

It's a bit like shooting fish in a barrel.

But in the spirit of friendly debate, the final word is yours if you wish.
Paul David
817   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:29:07

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I've tried to end this civilly but your determined to drag it out.

Yes I did back down over his utd career,only because I cant call on facts (as I dont care enough about utd to know anything about them) like you did about him playing in certain cup finals but I dont care what you say I doubt Ferguson thought Neville was in his best 11 and he does have a best 11 like you seem to suggest he doesnt,all clubs do.van Persie rarely gets rested or Rooney or any clubs best players(age and fitness permitting),its the players that are similar or seen as squad players that get rotated.

I didnt change my position on mancs at all,I just had to explain myself over it because you seemed to think its something more than banter/taking the piss or something thats ingrained but generally harmless when everyone else knows thats all it is.
Graham Mockford
818   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:28:41

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The 'stupid' comment was not in relation to the relative merits of Phil Neville but about this nonsense of disliking Mancs.

I have attended at least half of the 250+ games that Phil Neville has played for Everton so I think that makes me entitled to an opinion but I also recognise others will take a different view.

I still think people who have played or managed at the highest level cannot be dismissed as being a 'Mutual Appreciation Society'. Yes, some of it goes on but the reason to quote them in Phil Neville's case is they are more likely to notice the things that in my view go unnoticed by a lot of fans.

If I was a bit hard on Ian then I apologise, I was accused of mock outrage but genuinely it is something I feel fairly strongly about.
Graham Mockford
821   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:54:03

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John Daley ? that's about par for the course. No pun intended.

I have no problem with swearing (read my posts!). As ever, it's the context.

Liked the article you linked but, without opening a whole can of worms, I like most of those players (except Dirk Kuyt of course!)
Michael Kenrick
822   Posted 04/05/2012 at 22:59:03

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Oh okay, Graham... coz I see Lyndon has yanked it. On account of "pissing match", I assume...

Pity you play that silly credentials card... that works negatively in my view, that you see the need to tell us how many matches you've watched, as if that somehow promotes your opinion over someone else's.

And what's this: "they are more likely to notice things that in my view go unnoticed by a lot of fans"? Like what for instance?

"Ian"? Do you mean John at 756?
John Daley
825   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:17:12

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That's one thing we can all agree on. Dirk Kuyt is an absolute *#^#
Graham Mockford
826   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:08:01

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It doesn't make my opinion any more valid, you just said it was 'committed fans'' who can provide critical analysis. I think 20+ games a year for 30 years qualifies me on that regard.

On the subject of professionals' opinion, I would contend they are a little less dispassionate than us average supporters and having made a career from the game, do understand what makes a good footballer. You are right however that many are not critical enough because of long standing relationships. You only have to listen to that idiot Hansen. But I suspect there is a good reason MotD and Soccer Saturday employ former players, they bring a perspective that can't be gained from just watching the game.
Graham Mockford
827   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:20:41

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John Daley

I second that and would also like to amend your motion.
He's a boggle eyed Dutch *#^#
Paul David
828   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:23:30

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A Dutch *#^#

Why mention thats he's Dutch,should it matter where he was born? Notice any inconsistencies?
Graham Mockford
830   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:30:32

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Paul I offered you the final word!!

And I remain true to my word
Michael Kenrick
831   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:27:19

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There you go again, Graham. Drop it, FFS.

There is no definition of 'committed fans'. I use that in this context to apply to all Evertonians (without qualification) who use this website to share their views.

I see you're one of the ones on here who like to throw around the "displays how much you understand about football" jibe (#749) as another way of demeaning other people's viewpoints. There's no need for that nonsense, please.
Paul David
832   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:35:22

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Yeah by using lesson 1 in reverse psychology.
Graham Mockford
833   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:34:32

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Fair enough Michael maybe not much point using the adjective at all. Just call them fans.

As I said earlier I apologise if I was hard on Ian, I still think the statement 'Phil Neville has never been good enough to play for Everton' beggars belief but as you say it's all about opinions.
Graham Mockford
835   Posted 04/05/2012 at 23:46:12

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Paul still not biting!!
John Atkins
842   Posted 05/05/2012 at 00:12:01

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Paul David

Opinions are all important and you are rightly entitled to yours, however I'm not so sure yours isnt influenced somewhat by Nevilles birthplace and former club?

Let's not forget your initial response to 2 of our players being ruled out of Sundays game through injury ........ WOOHOO ...... Disgraceful statement and the likes we come to expect from that shower across the park!

We need to be clear on the Neville argument, sadly I believe he is no longer good enough for our club but to say he has never been is utter shite IMO!

FFS over the last decade I could give you 50 players plus who have not been good enough
Paul David
844   Posted 05/05/2012 at 00:50:19

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I've had all this before and cant really be arsed going over it all again. I would think Neville is crap no matter where he's from, I used to like Hinchcliffe and he was a Manc. I did explain that Scousers (me included) usually don't like Mancs but that it's a load of wank really.

Sorry but I am happy if players I think should not be in the team are not available to play.

Yes, we have had loads of average players who we should not accept as good enough for our club; I think Neville is one of them, you don't... fair enough.
Will Leaf
848   Posted 05/05/2012 at 02:22:48

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Interesting article John Daley (811).

Can anyone confirm that Pip's dad is indeed named Neville Neville?

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