Report: Round to join Moyes at United

, 30 May, 107comments  |  Jump to most recent
Steve Round looks set to follow David Moyes to Manchester United with The Telegraph reporting that he has been offered a six-year contract to take a senior coaching role at Old Trafford.

With Moyes effecting a clearout of key backroom positions at Man Utd since announcing his decision to succeed Sir Alex Ferguson — assistant manager Mike Phelan and goalkeeping coach Eric Steele were let go, while first-team coach Rene Meulensteen turned down the chance to remain under Moyes as he evaluates management offers elsewhere — and the Blues' new hire likely to want to bring in his own people, the imminent appointment of his trusted right-hand man from five years of his time at Goodison Park comes as no surprise.

Quotes or other material sourced from The Telegraph



Reader Comments (107)

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Colin Oakes
1 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:07:13
Just goes to prove there is a god after all....
Jimmy Sørheim
2 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:03:15
I want Robbie Cooke and Chris Woods to stay with the club, along with Alan Irvine. I do not care about Round, Stubbs or Weir, they are fairly average and can be replaced.

We have a decent frame to go forward, but Stubbs and Weir are dragging the overall quality down, and they need to be replaced with attacking coaches. I think if Martinez comes to Everton then he has to freshen up the coaching and scouting team.

Neville would be a better option than Weir and Stubbs in my mind, since Neville has been coached by the best manager in Europe.

Phil Sammon
3 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:10:23
Pahahahaha!

Are they taking that guy who whispers sweet nothing's in his ear too?

Christ, Fergie must be spinning in his grave.

John Gee
4 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:09:45
I wonder how excited the Utd fans are now? 2 or 3 six year contracts are going to cost them a mint when they sack everyone in December!
Matt Traynor
5 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:13:14
Begs the question, given that backroom staff often leave / are sacked with the manager, where they all on the same contract length as DM?

If I recall, we actually paid Newcastle compo when we got Round from them.

Matt Traynor
6 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:14:35
John #128, I expect there's a fixed compensation amount in these contracts, same as Pardew got when he got that 8 year deal - if Pardew goes to another club, club pays Newcastle a fixed fee. Ditto if (much more likely) he gets sacked by Ashley.
Colin Glassar
7 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:16:29
Great news. Hope he takes his microphone with him.
Tony McNulty
8 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:17:09
Does anyone have any evidence - apart from a pair of ears for DM - of the value this individual might have added whilst with us?
Adolf Ng
9 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:22:07
Great News ...
John Gee
10 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:25:29
Matt, I don't think so. There is noooo way they would have had time to negotiate all those clauses because it was all 'done so quickly... with no tapping up... only heard last night... such a surprise... don't even know who Mr siralex is...'
Fran Mitchell
11 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:25:37
Why the dislike?

Does anyone have evidence that he was no good? Anyone trained under him? Read his tactical analysis?

Above comments seem rather childish and idiotic.

Phil Sammon
12 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:31:38
I did Fran.

He was shit.

Chris Bentham
13 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:25:48
I'm sure our new manager will want his own team just the same. Hopefully with the Addition of one club leg end.

At least we may get some compensation this time.

Eugene Ruane
14 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:29:20
Fran (143)

"Does anyone have evidence that he was no good?"

Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea, Utd away and just about any other game of any importance.

"Anyone trained under him?"

Phil Neville.

"Read his tactical analysis?"

Not sure but Wigan in the cup look like they'd flicked through it.

Andy Parsons
15 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:36:59
We should hire Rene Meulensteen at Everton, he's very highly thought of and would be a great asset to the backroom team.
Alasdair Mackay
16 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:33:41
Fran

I think most of the dislike of Round comes from the fact that he isn't Alan Irvine.

I don't exactly know why, but there is something very unEverton about Steve Round. I have always thought it, and was actually hoping that Irvine would get his old job back when he came back to the club after Sheff Wed let him go.

Of all the backroom staff currently at Everton that could go with Moyes it is Irvine and Chris Woods that I would most be upset to lose.

Lenny Kingman
17 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:38:15
Any chance of the kit man going too. His boat is so associated with Moyes reign. Just wondering.
John Gee
18 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:42:15
Moyes' secretary is rumoured to be considering her position too, something about being tired of being dictated to.
Michael Evans
19 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:37:54
" Not sure but Wigan in the cup look like they'd flicked through it."

The beauty of the stick men drawings was that if you flicked through fast enough they came to LIFE.

Look, they're really running ... back to defend their goal.

Eugene Ruane
21 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:43:20
Alasdair (158) - "I don't exactly know why, but there is something very unEverton about Steve Round. I have always thought it"

Brilliant - one of those sentences that I know is nonsense, but nevertheless I agree with completely.

Some things can't be analysed or explained, sometimes you just go with....a feeling.

Nelly Verdonghan
24 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:54:31
I bet the Man U fans cant wait to get Roundy, Woodsey & Lumsdeny on board...goodbye Premier League.....Goodbye Champs League....Goodbye FA Cup...in fact goodbye to trophies full stop..

Moyes has dismissed an entire backroom staff who have experience in and are used to winning numerous trophies over the last 26 yrs and replaced them with his own people who have experience in and are used to winning FUCK ALL in the last 11 yrs....what a fantastic manager he really is !!

Mark Tanton
25 Posted 30/05/2013 at 19:59:53
I YouTubed some old Everton footage earlier, and specifically went for the Fulham and Derby games which started the Moyes era. We were so fearless against Derby and almost gun-ho - Moyes seemed to have sent them out in those early days with the message "score more than them, stay up".
Ian Bennett
26 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:05:31
Moyes would do well not to surround himself with defensive coaches. Round always appeared to be a yes man, who would never be a number 1, or be the opposite to Moyes to balance some of the skills etc. It was certainly not a Taylor and Clough.
Dave Lynch
27 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:05:59
Round used to remind me of one of those OFSTED inspectors that sit at the back of the classroom analysing the teachers performance.

No fucking clue about teaching a gang of unruly wannabe hoodie gangsters and then tells a teacher of 30 years experience where he went wrong.

Man Utd fans should be shitting bricks because dour Davey has bought his whole entourage of master tacticians with him. Wait till they get a load of RVP running channels and defending corners.


Paul Andrews
28 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:24:46
Mark my words.
This will end up in tears at Old Trafford.
Joe McMahon
29 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:24:02
Brilliant News!! Man U fans welcome to the world of Defend, Hold, Keep it tight!!
Phil Sammon
30 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:27:15
Has anyone mentioned how annoying his voice is?
Richard Dodd
31 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:28:02
David Moyes obviously rates Round highly. The two were together for at least half of the manager`s tenure and is entitled to at least some of the praise for his achievements at our club.
Why do good Evertonians feel the constant need to swipe at any staff member who did not play for our club?
Paul Ferry
32 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:30:25
They will love Roundy's drawing at OT; so precise, so tactically aware, so full of formations, so sparklingly refreshingly on the nail .........
Richard Reeves
33 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:42:27
Woods has already left hasn't he? So that's Moyes,Round and Woods,just need confirmation on Neville going and I can cut down the rope.
Eugene Ruane
34 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:47:25
Paul (213) - "They will love Roundy's drawing at OT; so precise, so tactically aware, so full of formations, so sparklingly refreshingly on the nail"

I actually have one, it blew out of the dugout just over a year ago and I managed to lean over and grab it.

Never been able to figure it out but think it may have been some kind of visual tactic information for Seamus.

http://images.colourbox.com/thumb_COLOURBOX4466361.jpg

Kevin Tully
35 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:48:14
Moyes will be Utd's Hodgson appointment. Not enough support from the core fanbase. There is already a book open on the next ManU manager, and a book on how long he will last.
Carl Sanderson
36 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:50:53
Richard 212:

Couldn't agree more. This reminds me of when certain people were calling Moyes a "c**t", "shithouse", etc. They were and are an embarrassment.

If any of the above contributors can provide solid proof that Steve Round is "shit", "unEverton", etc, without referring to his face, voice, or whatever then let's hear it.

Knowledgeable Evertonians? Don't make me laugh.

John Ford
37 Posted 30/05/2013 at 20:56:48
Jesus boys take breath. If Moyes deserves any credit, which he does, than so does Round. I've no idea whether he was actually any good but just let the mousy haired sit com extra go with our indifference...it's not much to ask.
Brent Stephens
38 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:01:06
I have to admit that I don't know what Round did or didn't do. So what is the evidence against him? Other than where Moyes failed he must also have failed.
Nelly Verdonghan
39 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:00:15
Carl....how many trophies did we win with Moyes & Round at the helm ????

Oh yes let me see now......ZERO !!

Jon Withey
40 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:00:42
Richard, Carl - it's the internet forum way (unfortunately).

He did a decent job but Moyes managed just as well without and it makes no sense to keep him.

Carl Sanderson
41 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:11:07
Nelly:

Your post contains a lot of question marks, exclamation marks and capital letters - but no actual argument.

Again I ask: where is your evidence that Steve Round is "shit"? Your evidence, please.

Jon Withey
43 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:15:43
I'm mostly concerned about losing the chief scout, we got some decent players overall.
Nelly Verdonghan
44 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:16:31
the evidence is that he has achieved and won absolutely nothing in any job he's ever been in
Fran Mitchell
45 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:19:44
Fellaini : Tropies = 0 = SHIT
Baines : Trophies = 0 = SHIT
Jagielka : Tropies = 0 = SHIT
Neville : Tropies = 14 = BEST PLAYER EVER!
Tony McNulty
46 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:21:36
I can understand that DM needed a sounding board and someone to whom he could perhaps delegate some duties. My question was trying to ascertain whether his departure constitutes any sort of a loss beyond these simple basics. I am pretty sure this isn’t a case of Clough and Taylor, but I was looking for something like:

· Seamus Coleman said that he taught him a better positional sense and how to defend set pieces
· Degsy said that Round would spend hours on the training ground after everyone had gone home working with Jagielka on his positional sense
· He tended to notice weaknesses in the opposition which could then be exploited, for instance, blah, blah

On the basis of the above (apart from the drawing provided by Eugene – real evidence) it seems there will be a lot of dry eyes around Goodison when he goes (and maybe some wet ones when he arrives in Manchester).

Brent Stephens
47 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:24:29
Fran - clever, mate!
Fran Mitchell
48 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:24:17
Alex McCleish won silverware....how the fuck is he out of a job?!?!
Tony Marsh
49 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:21:07
Good riddance to them all.I feel we can now go to OT and other bogey grounds
with some attacking intent and a will to win.I agree that this mob wont last 5 minutes in Manchester even though Moyes is nailed on to lift a trophy in his first game in charge..Cue the whimpering and bleating from the Moyesetts when he lifts the Charity Shield..Told you he was a winner they will Scream.
Patrick Murphy
50 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:32:41
Fran because he lacks the flair of someone like Moyes'.
Patrick Murphy
51 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:33:42
Eugene #222 you silly bugger that drawing didn't originate from Steve Round that was from the in-house graphic designer if you had have handed it back to its rightful owner that would have been plastered all over Goodision as it was the choice of the handful of Evertonians who were asked what our new crest should look like. Them poor kids also lost out on a Kit-Kat and a glass of cola due to your selfish pilfering , shame on you.

Paul Ferry
52 Posted 30/05/2013 at 21:47:35
Love it Eugene (222)
Phil Hamer
53 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:20:32
Oh my word. What on earth do any of you know about Steve Rounds ability as an assistant manager?

Absolutely nothing.

I suspect the reason Moyes wants him at Old Trafford is because he recognises the role Round played in helping him turn Everton into the sixth best football team in England, as the Board of directors were simultaneously turning Everton Football Club into a skint, asset-less laughing stock despite hardly spending a shilling on incoming transfers.

Ste Traverse
54 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:30:42
As he seems to be taking all and Sundry with him....can Mr Moyes take Kenwright and Elstone too??
Drew O'Neall
55 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:28:37
Mr Charisma.. I don't think I ever retained a single word the man uttered, I couldn't even tell you what his accent was. Good luck to him though.
Patrick Murphy
56 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:37:06
Ste that would be the deal of the century!
James Stewart
57 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:37:39
The wolly without the brolly they are welcome to him!
Paul Andrews
58 Posted 30/05/2013 at 22:35:00
Moyes: trophies= 0 = shit

Martinez: trophies =1 =.........:-)

Derek Thomas
59 Posted 30/05/2013 at 23:42:27
Found on roadside in Halewood; 1 clipboard, answers to name of Clippy, v friendly, well cared for, good with kids, seems to be pining for missing owner.

I spoke to neighbours, they said Owner had mentioned something about winning the lottery, hard decisions and having to go 'away'.

'Clippy' needs a good home, any offers, I would keep him myself but having 2 already I don't have the space and Knowsley Council would be all over me if I had 3.

Is this the end for Clippy, does the Green mile loom??

Patrick Murphy
60 Posted 31/05/2013 at 00:10:31
I still think that Roundy was on the blower to SAF's representatives asking if SAF had plans to retire and had the unenviable task of informing DM about it every 10 to 15 mins during the game. Note how serious DM looks every time he spoke to Stevie.
Chris Williamson
61 Posted 31/05/2013 at 00:24:41
Eugene: I will use your offering, from the Goodison dugouts, to inform my own footballing progress. A masterclass.

Roman Sidey
62 Posted 31/05/2013 at 03:24:20
Eugene Ruane 222, the best bit of that graphic is the word "Soccer" written below it. You can just see Short Round writing that below his doodles.

Tony Marsh, nailed on to win a trophy? I'd put a tenner on the Wigan in that game mate. If Moyes didn't prioritise the FA Cup or League Cup with Everton, what will he think of the Community Shield?

On Round himself, anyone who's watched Mike Bassett, I've one comparison to make: Doddsy.

Robin Cannon
63 Posted 31/05/2013 at 06:13:02
Community Shield isn't a trophy, anyhow. It's a friendly where they give the winner a pot; means nothing.
Richard Dodd
65 Posted 31/05/2013 at 10:06:53
Roman@407.I presume you are referring to the late Ephraim (Jock)Dodds who plied his trade for Everton 1946-48,scoring 36 goals in only 56 appearances rather than anyone who appeared in that awful film ?
Lee Mandaracas
66 Posted 31/05/2013 at 09:31:57
Woop Woop!!!!!
Darren Alexander
67 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:02:58
Will Man U have to negotiate separately for the earpiece?

For all the BK haters, there are also reports that Blue Bill fought very hard on this one - Man U couldn't have Moyes unless they took Round too.

Seriously though, glad to have this fecking turkey wing out of Goodison. If we are ever to push on we need to clear out hanger-oners like him. I can take Weir, Dunc and Stubbs employed as backroom staff as they're all real blues, but Round, Woods, FFS... Not only good news for us, but good for anyone else competing with Man U.

Richard Dodd
68 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:20:29
Darren,Can`t understand your anti Round venom. Surely,at our club, as in any other, the criteria should be competence and coaching skill over the trite `qualification` of being `a real blue`.
Some people have such closed minds. Hope that doesn`t extend to BK and his appointment strategy!
Roman Sidey
69 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:25:36
No Doddy, I'm saying that Round reminds me of Doddsy, Bassett's yes-man assistant coach who adds nothing to the running of the team.
Iain Johnston
70 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:03:44
Steve Round, a coach at Derby. Went to Middleborough with McClaren. Worked with England when McClaren was Manager. Sacked by Gareth Southgate for being too negative, (not rumour its from the man himself). A defender sacking him for being negative!!. Next, appointed by Allardyce at Newcastle. Don't get me wrong, he's probably a lovely bloke who's mum loves him dearly, But...
I can't help but notice a pattern in the above appointments. All he needs on his CV is a Blackburn job.. I'm glad he's hopefuly going.
Aidan Wade
71 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:17:45
Jesus, After all my time reading TW, I thought it was Moyes who was ruining Everton Football Club, apparently it was the quiet man on his shoulder. "MOB" must be a typo.

I know there are plenty of people around who have their keyboard grafted to their arse but I'm still surprised by the amount of guff on this thread.

Brendan McLaughlin
72 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:51:01
Iain #503
Not being rated by managerial geniuses such as Southgate & Big Sam...no bad thing
Carl Sanderson
73 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:53:09
Richard 498:

Wonder what the reaction will be when Alan Irvine joins United.

Gavin Ramejkis
74 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:54:51
Yeeeeeeeeesssssssssss! Sounds like a big toilet being flushed at Goodison Park
Mike Green
75 Posted 31/05/2013 at 11:59:53
Our loss, and all that....
Peter Truin
76 Posted 31/05/2013 at 13:08:03
Steve Round reminds me of Phil Neal working under Graham Taylor for England......see ya Steve do us a favour can you put the bins out on your way out........cheers mate
Richard Dodd
77 Posted 31/05/2013 at 13:38:52
Yes, Phil Neal — forever after referred to as `Nodding Dog, nodding dog, boss!`
Robin Hunuki
78 Posted 31/05/2013 at 13:37:23
Eugene@222 - you didn't by any chance see rough drafts or free hand sketches of the new badge when Round dropped his tactical notes that day?

That picture you managed to get your mitts on and our new badge seem to carry a common theme... Can't seem to pick it though.

James Bowman
79 Posted 31/05/2013 at 13:37:29
Sacked by Gareth Southgate.... says it all really.
Guy Hastings
80 Posted 31/05/2013 at 14:21:58
Whether you mourn the departure of Moyes's team as individuals, does anyone know what sort of compensation we're in for as they head off to OT? Round I'm indifferent too. Irvine, whose departure appears imminent, is a different matter.
Darren Alexander
81 Posted 31/05/2013 at 14:34:54
@Richard #498: It's not just being a real blue that's the only qualification needed, but it helps, and much as I wouldn't like to see any of the three I mentioned get the manager's job, I think they can make a useful contribution behind the scenes.

For the same reasons, I think Neville will be better suited to a role at Old Trafford as for all his huff and puff and years of playing (dismal) football for us he is still quite clearly a Man Utd man at heart. I'm not so blinkered as to think you have to be a Toffee to work at Goodison, but surely blue deadwood is preferable to simply deadwood? Of course, if Round was actually any good, it'd be a very different matter.

I backed Moyes for most of his tenure, but now he's gone I don't feel at all bad about thinking/saying it's a good thing that his lapdog(s) also head for the exit.

Gavin Ramejkis
82 Posted 31/05/2013 at 14:54:27
It's an interesting question Guy but I am wondering, as it's standard fare to have teams' contracts in tandem, ie, running for the same duration, I wonder if these were due to expire at the same time as Moyes. Be sad if we had more examples of two jobbers though, we already have a very expensive one of those.
Kevin Jones
83 Posted 31/05/2013 at 15:46:47
I met Steve Round before the West Ham game, and found him to be a very nice chap, I actually said to my wife, "Hey, love – isn't he a very nice chap?" to which she replied, "Yes, sugar, he seems to be a very nice chap indeedy." In fact, all our party agreed that he was a 'very decent fellow' on the whole.

However, with me being one of the MOB, I can only say, "Goodbye and fuck you, you little sycophantic fucker!" As for the rest of the backroom staff, the only people I don't want to see leave are, Big Dunc and Sheedy, don't even know why, there's just something about them for the future. Something in my bones, in my water, you know how it is good vibes. A bit like Laurel & Hardy, Morecambe & Wise, Fish & Chips, you know, they just go together. Moyes & Round where more like Hinge & Bracket... ask your dads, youngsters!

If Martinez, who also seems like a very amiable gentleman, gets the job, he'll almost certainly bring Steve Jones and Graham Barrow with him; I think Matt Jackson has something to do with Wigan as well, so we could see him back... Goalie coach for me would be Nigel Martyn who I know for a fact is a lovely man. New Masseur could be Big Sally from Scottie Road, what that woman can do with her hands is beyond belief, even Pele felt the benefit.

So here's to the next manager whoever it happens to be. Good luck, thank you – and may your God go with you

Peter Truin
84 Posted 31/05/2013 at 16:10:04
Kevin Jones

"Goodbye and fuck you, you little sycophantic fucker!"

Now that's funny!!!!

Ross Edwards
85 Posted 31/05/2013 at 16:39:57
Well, Round seems a good coach, it's just that his tactical nous or advice wasn't required really.
Timothy Blanshard
86 Posted 31/05/2013 at 17:39:34
We as fans can't do much about what is ahead of us as supporters (shit fucking badge aside) however I am sure united fans will have a lot less patience with DM and his backroom staff than we did, it's going to be an interesting season ahead, I want Davey to do well but not too well and I hope when they meet us whoever is in charge we batter them and I mean really turn them over.
Bill you better get this right, Steve Round always seemed to come across as a pro but if he's toast so be it we are EVERTON. NSNO
Paul Andrews
87 Posted 31/05/2013 at 18:07:17
Every time we played a big game Moyes and Round were out thought and out coached.
It should be something to watch when coming up against the Champions League coaches next season.
I predict fun and games when the two of them produce their special mix at Old Trafford next season.
Ross Edwards
88 Posted 31/05/2013 at 18:17:45
Moyes against Bayern Munich and Barcelona! Now, I would pay good money for a fly on the wall documentary for Man U's next season.
Harold Matthews
90 Posted 31/05/2013 at 22:21:43
Thanks Doddy. Great reminder. I loved Jock Dodds. Big fella---big shot.
Carl Sanderson
91 Posted 01/06/2013 at 10:57:53
Paul:

"Every time we played a big game Moyes and Round were out-thought and out-coached."

Now that's simply not true. FA Cup Final 2009 – the opposition just had too much for us. Remember we missed Yakubu, Arteta and Jagielka, our first-choice spine.

Fiorentina at home – we absolutely destroyed them and would have won by about 6-0 if it wasn't for the best goalkeeping performance I've seen at Goodison for years.

Liverpool F A Cup replay at Goodison – excellent tactical performance.

Liverpool at Wembley – individual error.

Wigan in the F A Cup – 1-0 down was recoverable but it went to 2-0 through a gross individual error.

Under Moyes we beat Man United three times and Liverpool four times at Goodison.

Paul Andrews
92 Posted 01/06/2013 at 11:17:15
Carl,
2009 FA Cup Final: Moyes played Osman wide right In front of Hibbert. Chelsea immediately overloaded our right side; Moyes did not react and Chelsea had a field day attacking down that side.

Liverpool semi-final: we went one-up and Liverpool were all over the place. Moyes, instead of being brave and going for the killer second, ordered the team to defend deep, creating too much of a gap between our midfield and forwards, isolating Fellaini in the process.

Wigan: Martinez set his team out to play between the lines with players interchanging positions. We could not cope with their movement and Moyes again did not react.

By the way, you have highlighted 2 games in 11 years to show how you think Moyes is tactically aware.

Carl Sanderson
93 Posted 01/06/2013 at 11:59:24
Paul (988):  

"...Osman wide right In front of Hibbert. Chelsea immediately overloaded our right side; Moyes did not react and Chelsea had a field day attacking down that side."

Osman in front of Hibbert was not ideal. But what were the options? We had lost the spine of the team to injury and, in particular, Arteta's absence disrupted the midfield. Chelsea took advantage and attacked Hibbert; he was booked early on and then couldn't make another tackle. Moyes did react: Hibbert did not appear in the second half. Essentially Chelsea just had a far better squad.

"Liverpool semi final: we went one up and Liverpool were all over the place."

We were in complete control of that game right up to the moment that Distin made his error. A second would have killed it, I agree, but to blame Moyes is just too convenient. It was a horrendous error, for which Distin apologised.

As regards Wigan, my view is that the second goal knocked the stuffing right out of the team – and it was down to another diabolical error, for which Neville apologised.

"By the way you have highlighted 2 games in 11 years to show how you think Moyes is tactically aware."

You stated that "Every time we played a big game, etc..." I merely identified counter-examples that rebut your contention. (Actually, I also mentioned seven wins against Man United and Liverpool, big games in which Moyes was scarcely out-thought and out-coached.)

Paul Andrews
94 Posted 01/06/2013 at 12:26:06
The options were to not play Osman in a wide position.

I blame Moyes for the negative defend the box tactics with 45 minutes to play.

Is "knocked the stuffing out of us"a tactical term.

7 wins out of a possible 22 at home (that's without cup games) yippee hats of to David.

Stephen Doyle
95 Posted 01/06/2013 at 12:21:06
Carl (994) I have to take issue with you re: the FA Cup semi-final, no way were we in complete control of the game, the moment the whistle went for the 2nd half, there was an air of 'sitting back and holding on to what we've got' when we should have been bombarding the Liverpool goal which was filled by the shite's 3RD CHOICE keeper, who is one of the puniest, shakiest goalkeepers I've seen!

Yet I cannot remember fashioning any clear cut chances at all after we scored, and indeed when the shite equalised, we went into "rabbits in headlights" mode, and the Moyestro again used one of his substitution masterstrokes and pulled off a forward for a defender which in effect cost us the game! And all this after the derby debacle at Anfield previously! Moyes should have been sacked at the end of that season!

Carl Sanderson
96 Posted 01/06/2013 at 12:38:40
"The options were to not play Osman in a wide position."

What was the alternative?

"I blame Moyes for the negative defend the box tactics with 45 minutes to play."
Depleted by injuries, playing against a far better squad, on that big pitch, in that heat, I thought the team did as much as they could.

"Is "knocked the stuffing out of us"a tactical term.

7 wins out of a possible 22 at home (that's without cup games) yippee hats of to David."

You have unfortunately reverted to the childish sarcasm that seems to attack people on this site. Please desist; it's embarrassing to see it emanating from someone like yourself who obviously knows a lot about the game.

Your original post stated that Moyes and Round were out thought and out coached in every big game they contested. You were wrong.

Carl Sanderson
97 Posted 01/06/2013 at 12:47:15
Stephen 001:

I agree with you to some extent; as I replied to Paul, a second goal would have finished them off. They were shite at the back and that keeper was, as you say, cack.

The Shite were showing nothing until Distin's back-pass and we were comfortable. Even their second goal was down to a stupid tackle by (I think) Coleman. (Individual errors abound in these games and we tend to make them. When have we EVER won a "big" derby? Not just under Moyes, but ever?)

Roman Sidey
98 Posted 01/06/2013 at 12:54:26
Carl, obvisouly your idea of a big game and an important game is similar. For me, the "big" Fiorentina game was the away game (the away game is always the "big" game) and we went to Florence to take in the scenery.

If Moyes had out-thought anyone in the semi vs RS, he would have seen their 'keepers absolute shockers in the previous games and said to the boys, "Fucking shoot! All day! Just give him hell!" That tactic, with their mediocre midfield and defense would have seen us through to another final.

Richard Dodd
99 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:19:42
Maybe they just had better players than us. As they used to say on here `You can`t polish..............`
Paul Andrews
100 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:31:42
Carl,

You are using the sarcasm jibe to get away from your lack of an argument. We were discussing tactical awareness,or lack of,you responded with "it knocked the stuffing out of them".

You champion Moyes's tactical awareness, then ask "what option did he have" when questioned why Osman played wide right.

I think you have answered my point. A tactically aware coach would look at the players he had available and adapt the formation to suit. Not play people in positions that they were not suited to because he was rigid in his preferred formation.

Carl Sanderson
101 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:14:25
Roman:

"Carl, obvisouly your idea of a big game and an important game is similar"

That is correct, yes. A "big" game is one on which something is riding, be it a trophy, qualification or mere bragging right.

By that definition the Fiorentina home game was "bigger" than the away game. (I don't agree that the away leg is always "bigger".)

The second half of your post does make a lot of sense. There must come a point, though, when the players have to take some responsibility for on-pitch events. We lose to Liverpool: it's Moyes's fault. We lose to Wigan: it's Moyes's fault. That Wigan defeat was as much down to Fellaini's appalling performance as anything else, in my view.

Carl Sanderson
102 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:39:54
Paul:

"You are using the sarcasm jibe to get away from your lack of an argument."

No, not at all. I merely made an observation politely and without rancour.

"You champion Moyes tactical awareness.."

Not at all. I merely supplied you with twelve counter-examples to your contention that Moyes was out thought and out coached in "every big game".

then ask "what option did he have" when questioned why Osman played wide right.

Not at all. I asked, "what was the alternative?" You still answered that question. Paul, what midfield formation would you have selected on that day?


Your original post stated that Moyes and Round were out thought and out coached in every big game they contested. Do you continue to hold that view?

Carl Sanderson
103 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:49:14
Paul:

Erratum - You still haven't answered that question.

Apologies.

Kevin Tully
104 Posted 01/06/2013 at 13:48:59
Whether you agree with it or not, all managers are eventually judged on their trophy haul, and performances in Europe. The minutiae of the odd win or loss, or good transfer business does not go into the history books.

McClaren & Hodgson both got to European Finals, and were rewarded with big jobs.

Moyes is a very lucky man to be sitting in the OT hotseat, whichever way you want to spin it.

Barry Roberts
105 Posted 01/06/2013 at 15:16:06
There's going to be a fantastic bonfire night at OT, this year, with all the deadwood that Moyes is planning to take with him.
Paul Andrews
106 Posted 01/06/2013 at 15:40:44
Carl,

"What midfield formation would you have selected on that day"

Give me £70,000 a week and I will tell you

Kunal Desai
107 Posted 01/06/2013 at 15:50:37
If Round is that good, then why isn't he in the running for the Goodison hot seat?
John Ford
108 Posted 01/06/2013 at 16:17:10
No one suggesting he's good Kunal, just a half-decent assistant.
Carl Sanderson
109 Posted 01/06/2013 at 16:40:18
Paul:

"Give me £70,000 a week and I will tell you."

So, you still haven't answered the question.

What about my other question? You haven't answered that one, either.

Do you continue to believe that Moyes and Round were out thought and out coached in every big game we played?

Paul Andrews
110 Posted 01/06/2013 at 16:51:23
Yep
Carl Sanderson
111 Posted 01/06/2013 at 17:07:09
Paul 070:

"Yep"

Then there's nothing more to be said. Over and out.

Paul Andrews
112 Posted 01/06/2013 at 17:19:39
Okey dokey.
Paul Melarange
113 Posted 02/06/2013 at 12:13:55
Maybe our chairman and directors can also join the exodus to Man Utd? It would also be good if all the catering staff in our stand also go as they have not got the first clue about serving people, along with the ridiculously hot pies and sausage rolls that can't be eaten at half-time or through the second half... and you remember you still have one in your pocket when you get home after a few pints. Also the Chang that seems to taste worse every time you purchase a pint of it!!

Hopefully tomorrow we find out who is the new manager and which bunch of backroom staff are coming in through one door as the departing back room staff go out of another door!


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