Season › 2023-24 › General Forum The Ups and Downs of the Original Twelve — Part II By John McFarlane [Senior] 12/07/2023 Share: Part I of this feature has apparently run its course, so I will continue with Part II. Bolton Wanderers Formed as Christ Church, 1874, Bolton Wanderers, 1877Ground: Burnden Park. What a club! Dark Days, fights for existence, a Football League club from the inception of that combination in 1888, five times relegated to Division 2, yet never down for longer than two seasons and only seven in all. Twelve times in the FA Cup Semi-Finals, twice Finalists before the First World War only to lose both, at Everton to Notts County in 1894, and to Manchester City at the Crystal Palace in 1904, both by one goal. Then to Wembley Stadium in 1923 before that huge mass of people, crowd mixing with the players, in that memorable game against West Ham United, and to win the Cup for the first time. Two more successful visits to Wembley in 1926 and 1929 to play Manchester City and then Portsmouth, and then a long spell until that extraordinary game with Blackpool in 1953, when a winning Bolton were first handicapped by an injury, and then mesmerized by the wizardry of Stanley Matthews, and to lose that most exciting match by three goals to four. Finally another visit to Wembley Stadium in 1958, when they defeated Manchester United (following the Munich disaster), with a team which did not include a single player costing a transfer fee. Such is the synopsis of the Wanderers' career since 1888. The club started as a Sunday School organization in 1874 under the name of Christ Church. The committee and the vicar did not see eye to eye, so they had to leave the church premises, and having no home they were certainly 'wanderers', and so Bolton Wanderers came into being in 1877. In 1878 they were founder members of the Lancashire Football Association, playing at Pike's Lane until 1895, when they moved to Burnden Park which was opened on 17 August with a match against Preston North End. An incident occurred on this ground in November 1883 which threatened to put an end to the club. The referee was "Hooted on the ground" and afterwards he was assaulted by certain unruly persons; the FA recommended that the club be expelled from football, but the County FA, who dealt with the case, adopted a more lenient view, so the Wanderers survived. The struggle for the legalization of professionalism brought Bolton to the fore, by chicanery they fooled the members of an investigation commission, but later they admitted the fact and confessed that they had wrongfully paid their players. The outcome was that, in 1885 professionalism was recognized. Although four times Cup winners, the Wanderers have never occupied either of the top two places in the League; they have been third four times, but the last occasion was in 1925. Six times between 1887 and 1927 they won the Lancashire Cup, a competition which they first entered in 1879. Burnden Park is club property and so is the land nearby, it has been gradually improved as the club's finances have been strengthened, but it can still do with more covered accommodation, its record attendance is 69,912 established in 1933 against Manchester City. Of its famous players, who are many, these have been outstanding: David Jack, Ted Vizard, Jimmy Seddon, Don Howe, and more recently Nat Lofthouse, Malcolm Barrass, and Stan Hansen. Burnley Formed as Burnley Rovers 1881, Burnley 1882.Ground: Turf Moor. Though then a Rugby area, boys connected with the local YMCA decided to play association football, and in 1881 they formed themselves into Burnley Rovers, and adopted the town name in 1882. Nearby was Accrington, and many good players, these with teams from Darwen and Clitheroe, came to Turf Moor and taught the Burnley lads the finer arts of the game the hard way. As one old player said long ago "Goals were so easily scored against us, we were thankful that records were not kept!" But despite many financial troubles, a good side was got together, mainly through imported Scottish players; these were paid 'sub rosa', with the result that Burnley was amongst the cubs which were outlawed before professionalism was legalized. By 1888, the club was considered sufficiently capable of meeting the best, and it was made one of the original members of the Football League. It retained its place in Division 1 until 1897, when it was relegated, but only for one season, for it was at the top of Division 2. Two seasons in Division 1 and it was down again for thirteen seasons, being promoted in 1913. It stayed in Division 1 until 1930, and after the First World War it had three seasons of great success, being second in 1920, League Champions in 1921 and third in 1922. Losing ground, it was in Division 2 from 1931 to 1947, when it once more joined the higher ranks, reaching third place in 1948. In Cup competitions, the foundations were laid in matches for the Lancashire Cup, which it won first in 1890, then in 1915, and more recently in 1950 and 1952. In the FA Cup, where it really started its career in 1888-89, by beating Old Westministers and West Bromwich, it reached the last eight in 1898, then in 1913 it was in the semi-final, losing to Sunderland in a replay. Its great day came in April 1914 at Crystal Palace, with Liverpool as opponents in an all-Lancashire Cup Final, honoured by the presence of KIng George V, wearing a red rose in his buttonhole. Bert Freeman decided the issue that day, just after half-time and, for the first time in football history, TW Boyle captain of Burnley, had the honour of being presented to the King, setting a precedent. Semi-finalists in 1924 and 1935, they came to Wembley in 1947 presenting an iron curtain to Charlton Athletic, until Duffy got in a winning shot, and Burnley had to be satisfied with runners-up medals after extra time, Turf Moor is a good example of a northern ground, rather on the 'dour' side. In 1922, it held 40,919 people for the match with Blackburn Rovers but the record was made in 1924 for the match with Huddersfield Town when 54,775 were there. Old-timers tell of Claude Lambie and Jock Abram, but later generations remember Edgar Chadwick, Jerry Dawson, and Joe Kelly. One of Burnley's outstanding players was Chas E Sutcliffe, later President of the Football League. Derby County Formed: 1884Ground: Baseball Ground. Football in or around Derby goes back to the beginnings of the game in this country, when Shrove Tuesday was the great day for football. Indeed, the term a "derby match" is an everyday expression to denote a game between local rivals, and is a reminder of the folk-football played in the town for centuries. The original Derbyshire County FC was an offshoot of the Derbyshire County Cricket Club playing on the Racecourse. It was deliberately formed in 1884 by local enthusiasts as a first-rate team to challenge the best clubs in the north. From its very beginning, well-known players have been proud to be among the "Rams", and before the days of League football, it had made its mark with such men as B W Spilsbury, Haydn Morely, George Bakewell, and several who had learned the game at Repton School. Selected as one of the twelve clubs to form the Football League in 1888, it remained in Division 1 until 1907, being once in second place and twice third, although it had two narrow escapes in the early days. From 1908 to 1912 it was in Division 2 when it gained promotion, but went down in 1914 for one season heading Division 2 in the 1914-15 season. It was in Division 1 until 1921, then for five seasons it was in Division 2, then from 1927 to 1953 it was a First Division club being second twice and third once in the table. But the black overcame the white of its colours in 1953, relegated to Division 2, it had two bad seasons and in 1955, for the first time in its history, it descended to Division 3 [North]. After two seasons, their promotion was gained to Division 2. In Cup-ties the fable of the 'gypsies curse' seemed to operate, and its lifting in 1946 ended a spell which had apparently affected the club since 1885. By 1894, the last eight was reached and the semi-final in 1896. In 1898, County reached Crystal Palace for its first Cup Final, having beaten Aston Villa, Wolverhampton, Liverpool, and Everton, but Nottingham Forest won 3-1. Next year, the 'Rams' were back having disposed of Arsenal, Wolves, Southampton, and Stoke, yet Sheffield United were the victors. A third visit was made in 1903, following success over Small Heath, Backburn Rovers, Stoke, and Millwall, but Bury defeated them 6-0 which is still the Cup Final record score. So the story went, until having been semi-finalists eleven times, Wembley set the scene in 1946 with Charlton Athletic in opposition. Luton, West Bromwich, Brighton, Aston Villa, and Birmingham had been beaten in that season of aggregate, Turner scored goals for both sides, the ball burst, and extra time was needed. What a final, then the hoodoo was raised, the magic of Carter and Doherty worked and Derby County won 4-1 in the extra time. County reached the semi-final again in 1948 losing 3-1 to Manchester United. The Baseball Ground has been the club's home since 1895, it is not one of the really big grounds, but in 1936, with Nottingham Forest as Cup visitors, 37,830 were present. This has been exceeded several times since, with 38,063 against Northampton in 1950 and 38,384 for the Birmingham Cup-Tie in 1951. What can one say of Derby players? John Goodall, Frank Sugg, Wm Storer, the great Steve Bloomer with wages of 2s/6d per week (15 pence in today's currency), Raich Carter and Peter Doherty. Acknowledgement: Association Football – The Caxton Publishing Company Ltd, 1960 Reader Comments (46) Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer () John McFarlane Snr 1 Posted 13/07/2023 at 10:09:52 Hi all, especially those who said that they enjoyed the 'Original Twelve' thread, part 2 is now available on the General Forum/messages thread. Jack Convery 2 Posted 13/07/2023 at 12:13:55 Thanks for these tales of the 12, John. I'm enjoying reading them. John McFarlane Snr 3 Posted 13/07/2023 at 13:54:06 Hi Jack, [2] your post is the only one so far, I think that the position of it, at the bottom of many subjects, plays a part.I accept that the situation that Everton are currently in takes priority, but I'm sure that those who read part 1 would be keen on reading parts 2,3,and 4. Thank you for your post, and it pleases me to know that you enjoyed it. Mark Murphy 4 Posted 13/07/2023 at 14:21:57 Lovely reading, John but you missed out one on the list of Bolton greats…Wither Peter Reid?? John McFarlane Snr 5 Posted 13/07/2023 at 15:40:10 Hi Mark [4], Peter Reid was born on 20 June 1956, and the book was published in 1960. I think that the location of the article may be the reason for the lack of interest. I trust that you enjoyed reading the information on football clubs from another age, but if there isn't enough interest in the subject, it would be pointless for me to continue submitting. Mark Murphy 6 Posted 13/07/2023 at 16:24:27 Ahhh I thought they were your own words, John… I enjoy reading them personally.I never realised how many trophies some of those clubs mentioned so far actually had in their past history. It kind of puts our claims to greatness due to past glories in perspective. Dennis Stevens 8 Posted 13/07/2023 at 18:12:01 I've only just caught up with Part 1, after being mystified by seeing a post for Part 2. Keep 'em coming, John! Kieran Kinsella 10 Posted 13/07/2023 at 19:02:22 JohnI don't know the ins and outs of ToffeeWeb editorial rules but it appears that your prior piece was designated as a Fan Article which warranted it's spot further up the page. This one is in the General topics, for which one criteria is "miscellaneous football discussion." Given that it is not about Everton specifically I would imagine it is probably where it is as it is a "Miscellaneous football discussion." Dale Self 11 Posted 14/07/2023 at 14:18:39 John Sr., thanks again for the history lesson. Bolton fascinated me for a while, had some afro haired Brazilian I think who was an interesting footballer but the long ball eventually got to me. Never did Derby or Burnley interest me. Spell check for ‘Debyshire' in P2 of the Derby section. John McFarlane Snr 12 Posted 14/07/2023 at 14:44:53 Hi Dale, I'm pleasantly surprised that you managed to find the site, and you're correct in reprimanding me for the misspelling of Derbyshire. I will be 85 tomorrow, and I hope that my claim of 'age' might get me by. Dale Self 13 Posted 14/07/2023 at 14:52:54 Please John Sr, that was a friendly notice not a reprimand. And you've got to stop discounting your acuity at 85. I want to continue believing that I will be as functional when I get there. Keep it going!I'll be back tomorrow to wish you a happy 85th birthday! Jay Harris 14 Posted 14/07/2023 at 15:34:55 Sir John I'm so pleased you continued to chapter 2. It is a fascinating read.Thank you. John McFarlane Snr 15 Posted 14/07/2023 at 16:20:01 Hi Dale [13] you may not believe this, but I'm actually having an operation tomorrow for what I've been told is known as "Dry Eye". They say that it is considered as a minor operation, which gives me a bit of confidence. I don't want to join the William Shakespeare club, which reports that he was born on the 23rd of April and died some years later on the same date.Hi Jay [14] Thank you for the Knighthood, I can now strut around with even more grandeur than usual, the next episode will feature Everton, Notts County, and Preston North End. [providing I can see well enough to use the keyboard]. Tony Abrahams 16 Posted 14/07/2023 at 17:29:57 I've just seen your reminder on the other thread John Mc, and will read it properly when I've got time to digest everything mate. I was just skirting through it but it deserves more time especially when I saw the words “The Baseball Ground†which was definitely one of my favourite grounds, when I was younger, and so much more atmospheric than Pride Park!I don't think The Reebok stadium, has done much for Bolton either, but when you move a club to far away from their spiritual home, then I don't believe there is anything to gain, as I shake my head thinking about Keith Wyeness, telling us “Destination Kirkby†was going to give Everton a much bigger footfall🤮So it was five years ago tomorrow when a few of us met in the Midland on that beautiful sunny day John? It seems like longer, I suppose the lockdown has made everything seem longer, so enjoy your day mate, and I will come back to you on this thread, mate. John McFarlane Snr 17 Posted 14/07/2023 at 20:42:01 Hi Tony [16] tracing the ones who said that they would be looking out for the next issue, was like searching for the "Scarlet Pimpernel." I've thought just now, what I should do, is to read the names from the initial post, and look out for any who can be notified. I don't think they would like to miss out on the next issue of, Everton, Notts County, and Preston North End.Yes Tony, it was excellent in the 'Central', the World Cup Final was on the television, and none of us were tempted to watch it. You, Your Dad, Steve Fearns, Bill Griffiths, George McKane, Gerard McKean, Peter Mills, and Myself. I ignored Doctors orders and from noon until 9-o'clock I had a bottle or two of Guinness. The highlight of my night was when the young Irish girl gave me a kiss, on learning that I was celebrating my 80th birthday. Tony Abrahams 18 Posted 14/07/2023 at 21:21:56 I don't think you can fail to have a good time in the character pubs dotted around Liverpool's city centre, John, and it was the same when Mike Gaynes came over for the Merseyside Derby, not long after.I rarely do it anymore and I wouldn't thank you for being in Town on the ale, after a certain hour, but I have always loved having a daytime beverage in Liverpool!I can't wait for the next instalment, John, for obvious reasons, but hopefully a few more people get to read this page because reading about the past can be very educational. Look at some of those gates from yesteryear? Although one of the reasons I loved the Baseball Ground is because it was such a tight little ground. Ian Jones 19 Posted 14/07/2023 at 22:05:32 John, keep these coming. They are fascinating.I've often thought a cup for the original members of the Football League would be a good idea, perhaps add 4 of the other 'older' teams to make an even 16. Keep out the so-called Top 7.Hopefully, we might be able to win it!Happy Birthday in advance for Saturday, hope the op goes well. Don Alexander 20 Posted 14/07/2023 at 22:36:42 Never mind soft-soaping you McFarlane - take a hundred lines for stating 2s/6p is equivalent to 15 pence today!As if!!2s/6p is merely 12½ pence today.Are you Moshiri's consultant on accountancy?:) John McFarlane Snr 21 Posted 14/07/2023 at 23:31:11 Hi Ian [19], I think that it's far too late for your suggestion of having a Cup for the Original Twelve, but I think that a special badge on their shirts could have easily been a possibility. Thank you for your good wishes regarding both my birthday and operation.Hi Don [20], you have every right to punish me for my incorrect conversion. I would be quite happy to take the hundred lines, but there's no guarantee that I would get that right either. David Currie 22 Posted 15/07/2023 at 00:59:06 John Mc Snr,Great read especially on Burnley, Turf Moor was the best pitch I ever played on. Also played on the other grounds you mentioned Accrington Stanley, Darwin and Clitheroe. Happy Birthday John have a Great day. Don Alexander 23 Posted 15/07/2023 at 01:25:21 John, fair enough, considering you were born on the same day as a mega Parisian piss-up following the sacking of the Bastille just prior to your birth. I hope you cherish that.As an aside, your posts delightfully remind me of all the football nostalgia I read as a kid from John Buchan's Football Monthly.Please keep them coming!............ and happy birthday. Joe McMahon 24 Posted 15/07/2023 at 06:06:39 Thank you, John, this is briliant reading. I live in Lancashire so the Bolton and Burnley reads were of particular interest. My wife is from the Burnley area so I do have interest in them, and the renaissance they are now having not only is a huge bonus for the town, but tickets for matches at Turf Moor are like gold dust. Danny O’Neill 25 Posted 15/07/2023 at 06:20:46 Informative read, John.I'll have to put my hand up and admit ignorance. Although aware of the "White Horse" Wembley final, I wasn't aware that Bolton were part of it.I think Bolton and Burnley, founding members of the Football League, have always struggled in modern times in the shadow of being in the same catchment area as Everton, Liverpool and the Manchester Clubs.Then again, in more recent times, we could say that about Everton, although our very loyal support base keeps going somehow. Although we are still mostly very localised and regionalised in comparison to the national and global reach that our cousins and Manchester United have achieved.With regards to Derby, I used to attend meetings at the Rolls-Royce site and drive past the old Baseball Ground site located in an area not too dissimilar to County Road and the streets around Goodison Park. The new Derby County stadium reminds me of many of those bland stadiums that all look the same with different coloured seats: Derby, Leicester, Sunderland, Middlesbrough, Southampton.Soulless. Bramley Moore Dock will be different and as iconic as Goodison.I think I'm looking forward to when you get to Everton. Although maybe I'm dreading it!!!Thank you John. Tony Abrahams 26 Posted 15/07/2023 at 08:04:17 Maybe a silly question, John, but that Don Howe wouldn't be the man who ended up having a great career as a top class football coach by any chance, would it? It was probably before his time.Burnley stopped Liverpool winning the cup, that'll do for me, especially as they had to wait another 51 years to win the greatest competition of the lot. What has happened to the FA Cup is pure sacrilege imo. Football now is more about the money than the glory?I didn't know Derby County lost a cup final to their great rivals Nottingham Forest, that would have really hurt them because there is a lot of hatred between both sets of fans, even if people never used to fight over football in those days.I remember going to Wimbledon and reading a matchday programme (it must have been my mate's because I've never been that interested in programmes) and there was an article about The Dons which claimed they had been just as successful as Everton. It was a fascinating read, because they had come through so many leagues to finally reach the pinnacle of English football, and it was something that made me angry when they were stolen by Milton Keynes. Brian Denton 27 Posted 15/07/2023 at 08:41:31 Don (23) I don't think you were reading John Buchan's Football Monthly, unless he moonlighted away from his spy novels, and from beyond the grave! John McFarlane Snr 28 Posted 15/07/2023 at 08:55:51 Hi David [22] you were obviously a better player than I was, although I did score a hat-trick at Wembley, but then I woke up. I'm pleased to know that you enjoy the theme, and thank you for your kind words, as a 'one finger typist' it takes me quite some time to deliver the goods.Hi Don [23] it's your turn to 'stand in the corner' with your hands on your head, I take it that you mean Charles [Charlie] Buchan. Thanks for your good wishes.Hi Joe [24] I'm pleased to know that you enjoyed the post, and the fact Burnley fans can enjoy their football again having gained promotion so quickly. When I used to go to away games Turf Moor was one ground I really enjoyed going to.Hi Danny [25] you can stand in the corner with Don [23] I thought that every man and his 'dog' knew who the teams were, and because you have 'two dogs' I'm surprised that you didn't. Although I haven't been to an away game for some time, I have actually been to Pride Park and the Riverside grounds, and if you fell asleep in one and woke up in the other, you would hardly tell the difference. Dale Self 29 Posted 15/07/2023 at 13:58:00 Happy Birthday John Sr.!Keep it going old man and show us how it's done! Tony Abrahams 30 Posted 15/07/2023 at 14:06:38 He's already told you Dale. He takes his time and only uses one finger! Happy birthday John, hopefully you're gonna have a couple of bottles of Guinness instead of fresh orange juice, today, mate Chris Hockenhull 31 Posted 15/07/2023 at 14:13:21 Hi John. Thanks for the contributions you put for us. Love old time footy and it's history. I'm 67 now so some of this- if not a great deal- I understand and the bits before my birth-1956- educates me. Cheers again and wishing you a very Happy Birthday fir tomorrow. Keep these coming!! Dave Abrahams 32 Posted 15/07/2023 at 14:44:32 David Currie (22) Out of interest I put your name on Google, if you are the David Currie that came up you've had quite a good career and could relate some interesting stories on here about your football career. You would be sixty one if it's you. Dale Self 33 Posted 15/07/2023 at 15:13:57 Nice move Gramps! And don't be bashful David Currie, tell us some stories. John McFarlane Snr 35 Posted 15/07/2023 at 18:53:46 Hi all, I have had one eye done and the other one is scheduled for four weeks time, and to tell the truth I'm not looking forward to it. I'm not only typing with one finger I'm trying to type this post with one eye.Hi Dale [29] thanks for your good wishes, and I hope you enjoy the rest of the thread.Hi Tony [25] and [30] there were two Don Howes – one played for Bolton from 1936-51 and the other played for West Brom from 1955-63 and Arsenal from 1964-66, so you were obviously right in thinking that it was the second one. I'm not sure that a bottle of Guinness could do me any good at the moment, I'm typing this post to take my mind off the discomfort.Hi Chris [31] thank you for your good wishes, being able to bring something new to younger fans gives me pleasure, and you will be well aware that I get most of my information from books that I have obtained over the years.Hi Dave [32], I have just looked up the name David Currie on my book of Premier & Football League Records 1946 -1998 and it shows that he played for nine clubs. Paul Tran 36 Posted 15/07/2023 at 19:01:14 John Snr, keep well and best of luck for Round 2 when it comes... John McFarlane Snr 37 Posted 15/07/2023 at 20:17:51 Hi Paul [36], Thanks for your best wishes, I know that it is unpleasant but if I need it, I have to go through with it. I have bought my grandson Josh a season ticket since he was 6, we sit in the Park End, and he will be 19 in September. Sometimes when an Everton player has a goal attempt at the Gwladys Street end, I have to ask him, "Who hit that shot?" I know it's someone in blue, but can't identify him. Paul Tran 38 Posted 15/07/2023 at 20:34:00 Well, hopefully you'll be able to see more detail soon, John. And they'll be things you'll be happy to see! Danny O’Neill 39 Posted 16/07/2023 at 15:26:31 John, I have that at most matches and have to ask who scored.The most recent being Wolves away as Mina tapped it in.Before it hit the net I was grabbed by the person next to me and didn't see a thing as the away section erupted.It's Sunday and I'm sat in a "I'd rather walk alone" t-shirt. My own fault, but I keep getting asked if I support Everton. Sigh. I should have worn my 1878 The Originals one. They wouldn't know what it means. Or my Germany top, although that causes a bit more drama and attention down here. John McFarlane Snr 40 Posted 16/07/2023 at 16:34:20 Hi Danny [39], I'm struggling at the moment 'one eye covered' and the other one quite misty. The tale of your experience at Molineux, reminds me of the time I went to Bramall Lane, and a Sheffield United fan kept turning around giving my mate and I stick. While his back was turned to the pitch, Johnny Morrissey put in a crushing tackle on one of the Blades players. At this, the fan spun around shouting, "You dirty so-and-so!" I said "You didn't see that" and his reply was, "I know, but I've read about him." There are many things I have forgotten over the years but that's one that has made an impression. Phil Parker 41 Posted 16/07/2023 at 23:42:46 Great stuff John. You might like to look up a short film that was shown at cinemas, as it happens in 1960. If you put in Look at Life Saturday fever you will find a 9 minute film about the game and supporters who followed the game we loved, before it was ruined by Sky and Nation State takeovers. The good old days.Take care. Bill Watson 42 Posted 16/07/2023 at 00:14:12 Thanks for another great sequence, John.Burnley was my first away match in 1959 and they've always been my third team (the second is any club playing the RS). It was years later when I discovered my American born mum's family originally came from Padiham and Burnley.I remember the Bolton side of the late 1950s as being very, very tough. Apart from Eddie Hopkinson, the England goalie, a name which stood out for me was a crew cutted defender called, I think, Hartle. Tony Abrahams 43 Posted 17/07/2023 at 07:59:10 Funny story, John. Everton still get a raw deal from the media, although it's a dirty, horrible, biased, red sycophantic media nowadays. John McFarlane Snr 44 Posted 17/07/2023 at 16:22:41 Hi Phil [41] I hope to be at the Sporting Lisbon game, but I'm likely to be having another eye operation for the visit of Fulham. It's my intention to be at the food-bank for half an hour at least, before kick-off chatting to Dave Kelly, and it would be great to see you again. Phil I don't take care of myself, that's my 'Young Lady's task and it has been for, sixty years' and I must say that she does a good job. Hi Bill [42] Roy Hartle was an absolute animal, I went to Burnden Park in the early 60s and he wiped out Everton's entire left flank. Later on I read that there was a Roy Hartle ward, in the local hospital, and I'm not surprised because he was a machine. [I may be a little sarcastic there, I think it may have been a children's ward] Hi Tony [43] another memory that has lingered, concerns Bolton Wanderers, on the night that I've told Bill about Roy Hartle. Dennis Stevens a former Bolton player was getting plenty of stick from the Bolton fans, I was the sole Evertonian amongst them and when Stevens played a tremendous pass I shouted "Good goal Dennis" and some old Bolton fan said, "Aye lad there's now't wrong with the ball" but in a more colourful way'. Peter Mills 45 Posted 17/07/2023 at 17:55:47 Belated happy birthday, John, and best wishes for your eyes. John McFarlane Snr 46 Posted 17/07/2023 at 18:22:21 Hi Peter [45] thanks for your birthday wishes, I removed the padding from my eye this morning and I'm hoping that the small amount of blood was a natural event. I can't believe that it's five years since we met to celebrate my 80th birthday. In my 'wisdom' I say to anyone younger than I am, " Whether you grow old gracefully or disgracefully don't worry, just grow old "slowly," but nobody has managed it yet. Mike Gaynes 47 Posted 17/07/2023 at 18:29:03 John, belated birthday wishes from me as well. Hope to share another Guinness with you when I come over in September. Please be well. Christine Foster 48 Posted 17/07/2023 at 19:00:38 Hi John, a belated Happy Birthday to you from down under! I trust your well and the black eye sustained from Gordon Wests handbag ( see other post) is healing well. Interesting article too, seems to me that I must be so one eyed I rarely remember the other clubs and their history, my Nan was like that, could tell you anything and everything about Everton but next to nothing about any other club! I don't even have a favourite second club, it's Everon and only Everton for me, always has been, so I am often amazed at my own lack of knowledge of other clubs players etc..I would say though that's it's not strictly the case as I have the word infamy etched on my soul with regards to the other lot and remember many of their players with begrudged respect, remembering others with mild distaste.. others, like Dave Mackay bordering on hatred for his tackle on Jimmy Husband who was never the same afterwards..I was very fortunate to see the world cup games at Goodison, and it will be with great sadness to see it no more, for it holds personal memories of mine, standing on the terraces of Gladyws street on my wedding day.. lesson to kids, always get your priorities in order! Lol.The good days, the poor ones, the heartbreak, the caging in of fans, the lined streets decked in blue..standing as a nipper on the pitch staring up at the team with the league championship trophy. Ray Wilson and Roger Hunt doing a lap of honor with the world cup..You may be the generation before mt John but your memories eclipse mine by light years! John McFarlane Snr 49 Posted 17/07/2023 at 21:03:00 Hi Mike [47] thank you for your best wishes, it quite a while since we shared posts. I read all of yours, and you will be aware that my posts are mainly what some people would describe as dinosaur posts, but the way I think is that I have more to look back on than to look forward to. My doctor would be angry if he knew that I was back on the Guinness, but I am prepared to risk his anger, and I would be delighted to share a bottle of Guinness with you. I will be looking forward to September. Add Your Comments In order to post a comment, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site. » Log in now Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and Talking Points submissions across the site. How to get rid of these ads and support TW © ToffeeWeb