Blues finally secure a win thanks to Calvert-Lewin's lucky block

My mistake, I thought James Garner wasn’t playing, but after reading through your post, I now realize he his playing instead of the second Gomes.

Onana is a big miss for us unfortunately - and our right flank might be the oldest in Premier League history!

Another unlikely swansong from Gomes please and DCL to pick up where he left off last time around with more goals.

COYB!

Gana's wife gave birth overnight so he has had a lot on his plate - congratulations to them. All is well but no sleep and that sort of thing.

And that young bloke, scoring a lot in the juniors, Ebere, on the bench might have given him some encouragement rather than a 40-year-old keeper whose contract I think is up this season.

Gana might be getting off light as I remember Harry Catterick giving Bally what for for turning up late when his wife gave birth overnight.

Dyche stinks, and his "not on my watch" mantra shows him for exactly what he is.

Nice to see one up front again too!!!

With Seamus, Young and Gomes we are lacking pace and that's a worry against these.

We seemed to be doing everything right and I won't say in slow motion but certainly looked to be without a great deal of urgency and then, just as I was wondering where the halftime whistle was, a bit of a daft goal, but they all count.

Burnley moving the ball around and causing problems in attack and in their own defence.

Everton just blocking things, pressing their defence and appealing for free kicks. That's pretty much been the sum of our contribution. There's been no obvious style to our play at all.

Then, in the last seconds, the respective approaches reap a goal for Everton. I'm not sure it particularly validates our approach to a must-win game but good on Dom for making it happen.

I can hardly believe it. Without that massive strike of luck — the ball could have gone anywhere — we never really looked like scoring.

But this will go down as a massive massive win in our desperate fight to avoid the drop for a third year in a row.

I don't think Dyche got his substitutions right as Calvert-Lewin was playing well and Burnley were having a hard time containing him and Harrison just seemed to make it 10 a side, for me Doucoure was the man who should have been subbed. Calvert-Lewin was probably our MotM but Branthwaite and Mykolenko had very good games.

3 points further away from the bottom two and a home win.

3 VITAL points.

The more I watch Dyche's teams and his abhorrent dislike of any kind of attacking football or cohesive football going forward though, I really don't think he should be here next season because frankly I don't think it will keep us up again if it does somehow work this time around.

He did a decent job for a while but his tactics are absolutely horrible to be fair.

I wasn't expecting anything different from Everton with the motley crew they have and knew that Burnley and all the other dross around us will be fighting like crazy.

Everton got some lucky breaks but finished on the right end of a scoreline at last. Other teams are now in the mix and I expected Luton to win so we need Spurs to beat Forest.

All the games are going to be ugly so let's not overreact.

If we were looking to someone who could provide fresh legs, a bit of youthful endeavour, and maybe even gain a bit from the experience then I know who I would have turned to. But it's very clear he's not getting near the pitch while Dyche is in charge.

The match was dreadful. Anyone who has played on a windy day will be familiar with players looking worse than they are... but that was something else.

I've no idea what this team is about when they're not defending. The effort is there but there's no discernable pattern to the way we play. It's just hit and hope.

A win is a win. The first this year.

Come what may, this club needs an incredible amount of change. It's pretty implausible at the moment that we open our new stadium with Premier League football.

A fortuitous goal, Burnley going down a man for the final quarter of the game and offering almost no quality and we're still hanging on by our fingernails. It is what it is.

Was the football good? Don't know and don't care, didn't see it.

We got three points, does that matter? Fuck yeah.

We are 4 points ahead of Luton with a game in hand. Their next game is Man City away.

So I can’t see how it is implausible at the moment that we open our new stadium with Premier League football. We have taken 4 points from the last 2 game so it is positive.

Lucky? After a season of zero luck it is good to see things evening themselves out.

Play like that though in the remainder of our home games and it will yield in very few points.

Relegation race is far from over and we’ll need a fair few more points especially if the points deduction is harsh. Now the winless run is over hopefully we may see something a little more confident and coherent emerge though I won’t hold my breath.

If Everton go down this year it will be down to historical mismanagement and appeal panels rather than Dyche and the players.

Shameful the gleeful berating of Dyche and co among some. Anyone with an iota of footballing knowledge can see how technically bereft we are but theyre trying and thats all we can ask for

The bad news / Their keeper didn’t have a save to make despite being down to 10 men for much of the second half.

I know the wind was difficult but they were 2 very poor sides today

I honestly can’t see Luton getting more than 33 points so 35 after the next points deduction should see us safe so we need at least 3 wins from 7 games assuming its a 3 point deduction and hope we pick up the odd unexpected point against the RS, Arsenal and just to be safe.

And too right Peter # 36 With our unfairly docked 6 points back we'd be chasing down a place in the top half. As it is, we're 4 points ahead of the drop with a better goal difference and a game in hand. Pressure is now all on Forest away at Spurs tomorrow - and Luton, Brentford and even Palace will remain nervous.

And I'm not really sure who you mean for the youthful endeavour Ernie. Warrington? A defensive midfielder who is only a year younger than Onana but has no recognition at any England youth level, and only managed a season at Fleetwood before an injury hit 4 appearances for Plymouth? I hope he has a good career but he's not exactly screaming "the solution" from the bench.

Anyway, keep creating chances and the obvious fouls in the box have to be given again. Well done to the lads on a win.

Also DCL looked very good and the best player on the pitch trying to force things going forwards. If Ashley Young could run beyond him it would an easy ball when Burnley were down to 10 men. But alas, those Kanchelskis days were a long time ago! Let's hope in the summer a winger that can fly down the right is added to the squad.

Until then, got to give praise on the results front and a very useful 3 points so well done to Dyche and the team.

We are fighting against a points deduction, and likely another one, compounded by a net spend of 27m in the last few years. (five I think). Here’s to a few more wins by whatever means, then hopefully decent new owners and a reset in the summer.

It’s criminal what Moshiri is doing to the club right now, and if we don’t get some stability, direction and strategy in before the summer window shuts, then next season will be an even bigger challenge. Maybe one too far.

Mr Moshiri needs to move on now from 777 ( seven months without being able to meet the PL conditions) and do what’s best for not just for the club, but for the whole Everton community. Hundreds of thousands of people most of whom live and breathe Everton.

Time to act Farhad, please do the decent thing and talk to people who can meet the conditions. According to Paul Joyce of The Times newspaper, they do exist.

9-10 points from our remaining games should see us safe despite the prems best efforts.

God I hate Luton. Why don’t they just give up? Buggers

Let’s see what noise Dyche hears heading to the Chelsea game a week on Monday, and what team formation and tactics he employs.

No doubt the coming deduction impacts psychologically but it's no excuse for football with absolutely no method, plan or ideology.

What do we stand for ?

Roll on survival at the end of the season, with a manageable point deduction, but something has to improve over the Summer.

Check the article in the Daily Fail.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-13271249/Premier-League-eyeing-ABOLISHING-points-deductions-introducing-NBA-style-luxury-tax-fears-stars-leave-rules-restrict-pay-Everton-Nottingham-Forest-lost-points.html

Yes you are right, once the PL have docked points from Everton, then they will change the rules but not before.

For those of us going through agony at home, can we just point out that we are 11 points better than last season (before the deduction). Our goal diff has improved by 12 compared to last season.

We complain about Dyche. WHU fans are complaining about Moyes. He has them 7th, a European Trophy in the Cabinet and they want sexy football. I enjoyed the Moyes years for the simple reason that we did not have the stress we have now about being relegated. If Dyche can return us to top half year after year I will be happy - and the cardiac wards will be quieter. Yes, sexy football a la City or Arsenal would be great but we have neither the players nor the money to do it. One day, one day, maybe.

777 also won’t be our lucky number.

Not much to day except a welcome 3 points and another awful display of how not to play football at home.

If we had our 6 points back, we'd be 10 points ahead of Luton who've played a game more, and Forest, definitely not in the relegation mix.

Dyche is doing a great job compared to the dross we've had for the past 3 years. Without the points deduction, we would be safe already.

If we are docked further points then tbh, I will no longer be arsed with football, especially if they then change the rules. What a farce that would be.

Dyche is watching them every week in training he knows what he's got. You have to admit we are difficult to score against..

Love the result and the 3 points, I f/c the score if we were to win, I don't think we are capable of scoring twice.

Fuck me, that was dire.

Was good to be in the ground at the end without listening to away fans celebrating.

But my god if we play like that for the rest of the season - regardless of points deductions - we are down because Forest, Luton and Brentford will murder us.

It was truly awful.

If we win all our remaining home games playing crap but winning them 1-0, I'll be more than happy.

Hopefully Spurs can beat Forest tomorrow.

Praying for a minimum points deduction.

UTFTs!

"Shame about Luton. They will be above us come Monday evening".

Erm, how? What witchcraft is at work?

Erm, Neil, who are Luton playing tomorrow or Monday? Give your head a good wobble and have a look at the table: this is the giveaway, Luton are four points behind us and we have a game in hand.

Love reading all the moaning doom and gloom on here. Would you have preferred a 1984/85 display and a 3-2 loss?

We won misery guts! That's all that matters! Have you seen us down there in the Premier League basement? We win, and you what, celebrate a crucial 3 points, our first win in 14 games? No! You fecking hammer Dyche and (fill in the blank) this or that player(s).

You scrap in the basement. And you are exactly the same old same old moaners who claim that we can't play the sort of footy you criticise us, Dyche and the players for not playing.

Words fail me.

And in other bad news for you: I have a hunch that we will be fined next week – not getting the North Wharf Road guillotine points cut.

Colin Harvey signed Ian Wilson to replace the brilliant Sheedy. I still believe he wasn't a footballer, he didn't even have a left foot.

McNeil hasn't got pace, but he can definitely use his left peg.

Obviously it all depends on the decision of the corrupt Premier League and any points deduction, but even a four-point deduction will still keep us above Luton.

I have never seen a slower midfield player than Ian Wilson. One would need to break the laws of physics.

Did you ever see Bilyaletdinov play? He wasn't just slow, he seemed physically incapable of doing anything but walk.

I remember a few times under Moyes he had a clear breakaway and not only did both teams catch up with and pass him, but by the time he reached his destination the last attendant was turning out the floodlights as everyone else had long gone home.

We've been on bad runs before (not many as long as this to be fair) but a win is a win. Confidence was clearly low (especially in the 1st half) but it will grow now the monkey is off our back.

We were never going to get a performance like the mid-80s teams did and I can't believe anyone would have expected different, it takes time to rebuild confidence. Let's just enjoy the win.

Didn't he score a screamer when we beat Man Utd 3-1? He was also called up to fight in the armed forces against Ukraine by Putin.

Luck? We are owed some. I just want to get to the 96th minute on the last game of the season with the Premier League flag flying above Goodison! Then off to the doctors to reduce my medication!!

Well done, lads and management today!

Those two useless crabs have ruined the midfield all season. Keep them out and we might string some wins together.

Strikers deliberately try to block keepers, not least in this day and age when so many of them try to dribble and play short passes. I think that it is possible that Calvert-Lewin put himself there on purpose hoping for a keeper error that would have included precisely what followed.

As has been said: Put the 6 points back and it's a better season than the last few. It's not going to be pretty but we're Everton, aren't we? UTFT.

Actually, MK, you are right, it was excellent closing down, Dominic making the effort to put pressure on the goalie, something we might not have seen a few weeks ago.

It was an ugly win. At times, that is okay. We've seen them when we've been winning Titles, the points are always acceptable. Move on.

After the match to the Bramley Moore, a real pleasure to meet Jonathan Oppenheimer, and Chris and Lindy, together with friends from here.

37% possession against a team reduced to 10 men for a third of the match, a team that has taken just 8 points from their last 15 matches since we beat them at Turf Moor.

Doucouré, Ramadan fasting since 06:30 this morning, was clearly exhausted after a poor game, but when the subs were introduced after a ludicrous 83 minutes with Calvert-Lewin, playing well, coming off.

In mitigation, Dyche has of course had a lot to put up with off the field but his game management is truly appalling.

Forest away to Spurs next, Luton away to Man City, so you'd think (hope) that's zero points for them. Our next game is a chance to get a bit more daylight, albeit it's Chelsea. I would gladly take a point now.

Today was massive but that home game against Forest in 2 weeks is mega! Win that and we're pretty much safe.

Great to finally win this year and two in two now for Calvert-Lewin formally takes that monkey off his back – at last.

Sell Pickford, Onana, Branthwaite and Calvert-Lewin.

I reckon we could get £180M.

Much as I think Dyche keeps us honest and is the right guy for our current situation, I wouldn't want him reshaping the side.

We needed 3 points and we got them, even though it was an awful watch.

MASSIVE!

That's the take. That's all that matters.

If we win, the shit football does not matter.

Yet again, I have to ask, though: if the players are shit, and the manager is shit, as some of the most negative on here aver, why are you so angry when the result doesn't go our way?

If we're as shit as you suggest, what right do you have to be angry when the result is inevitably poor?

I did learn though that Onana is most definitely better than Beto!

I know you're not a Gueye fan, and now Onana, but we need a defensive midfielder, even today. You are also not a Gomes fan, but I am, if he is in a 3-man midfield, with one of these.

No money to spend, and a dinosaur of a manager we can't afford to sack.

Any manager will be a miracle worker to keep us up. Who would be better than Dyche?

The performance does matter. If we continue to perform like that, we will lose regularly and continue to slide further into a relegation battle.

I'll gratefully and with some relief accept the 3 points. But I won't claim the performance doesn't matter, nor that Dyche is 'doing a great job', and certainly not that we are 'getting better' when we've got 4 months of evidence to suggest the exact polar opposite.

How can any Evertonian watch that shite and say it doesn't matter?

How can the performance matter when we lose and not matter when we win? Performances like that are the reason that we don't win very often!

The more I see Branthwaite, the more you know someone is going to come in for him; another excellent game from him today. Calvert-Lewin ran his nuts off and deserves praise, as does Gomes for keeping it calm in the middle of the pitch, shame the injury has slowed him down.

A good meet-up at the Harlech and some new faces, made up our American Evertonians got to see a win and to also see our new ground after the game.

A big thanks to Tony A and Neil C for the lifts, much appreciated.

Up the Toffees.

This is in large part due to being in limbo in the dark about too many things for comfort:

Who will be our manager on August 1?
Who will be our owner on August 1?
Who will be our chairman/board on August 1?
Will the takeover be finalised before August 1?
Will we be in administration on August 1?
Who will be sold over the summer?
Will we be sold over the summer?
Will we be in the Premier League on August 1?

No one likes doubt, ambiguity, fuzziness, not knowing. We all like clarity, precision, things being cut and dried, knowledge (but no one in the club actually speaks to us/in public, except for "guarantees" from one of the most slippery gobshites whose ever had a hand in our club).

Too many questions. Too many grey areas. Too many uncertainties. This could well be our most important summer ever. It might plausibly be the summer that breaks us, not this season.

In some respects, another scrap to stay in the top league is a distraction from some of the very real troubles that lie ahead in what will probably be a stormy summer. The by now annual survival dogfight keeps our minds off the day after survival Sunday.

That's why I'm more worried about next season than I am about the one we are in because there's this thing called summer in between them.

At least it gives us some much-needed breathing space, but for how long? Another Damoclesian Sword hanging perilously in the form of more points being deducted!

The people that have initiated all this misery, Mosh the (somebody else's dodgy) Dosh and others, don't give a tinker's curse yet sit pretty well financially. I don't believe Moshiri has a Council House in Monaco either!

I think "doesn't natter" equates to recognition of not being able to play any other way given the squad.

Everybody wants to play like Brazil 1970 but how are we going to do it with only a handful of Premier League standard players?

We are where we are because we can't sign good players. It's a toss of the coin whether we stay up because our options are so limited… but they're trying.

"How can the performance matter when we lose and not matter when we win? Performances like that are the reason that we don't win very often!"

Because, Ernie:

We desperately needed to win.
We had not won for thirteen games.
We were playing poorly and needed a win.
We are in another relegation dog-fight.

Clubs stay up in relegation dog-fights by scrapping —not by playing purring footy. Even if we could, we cannot afford the luxury of anything other than survival footy.

You have been on here – with a long list of others – saying that we are not able to play the sort of footy that you say we ought to be playing.

Ernie, please answer this direct question in a direct manner: What was more important for us today, a win or not playing "that shite"? An answer on direct lines is one or the other, not "Well, I'd rather we won playing much better footy". That is an utter cop-out.

The win or the performance, Ernie, what was most important today?

Trying to avoid further sanction terrifies me. Going into administration, as you say. Losing 2 or 3 of our top players doesn't bear thinking about.

What happens to the new stadium?

The current and previous “stewards” of the club, ie, Moshiri, Usmanov, Kenwright, Barrett-Baxendale etc, have destroyed the very fabric of the club. We will need a miracle to survive as a going concern unless some honest, competent, wealthy owners take over and a progressive, forward looking manager is found to replace the dinosaur currently in charge.

Those worried about off the field finances — don't!! We deal with now! Staying a Premier League club is paramount to our survival as a club.

Those worried about players being sold — don't!!! They will go and we rebuild.

To all Evertonians: small steps and today was one! We move forward as one. A win gives everyone at the club belief! That's the real win today with 3 lovely points.

But the problem for me is that I am certain that we will stay up, so the summer matters much more and therefore is much more on my mind. And, to boot, the summer "issues" are far more fundamentally structural and nuts and bolts.

If we stay up (we will) we can still be sunk over the summer (that starts in six weeks or so), unless something that we today cannot see changes things for the better and more secure future.

I don't share your confidence that "we rebuild". Who? What? Where? When?

I think you are being harsh on Beto who works hard and gives the defenders something to deal with rather than simply having an armchair ride.

A bit of rotation shouldn't put the players noses out of joint. Sometimes it will be about spelling a player or maybe just seeing how the opposition react to someone they don't know much about.

Confidence comes with results, and if Everton had lost today, a lot of people would have been screaming for the manager's head, even though, after all these years of mismanagement, and then a 10-point deduction, we are lucky to have such a pragmatic man holding things together; a lot of other people would have already folded by now.

Talk about getting ahead of yourself, the next 7 games and Premier League sanctions are what we need to be concerned about.

Worry about next week, not next season.

The School of Science has disappeared under the philosophy of a fucking idiot who believes in yard-dog football.

Same subs every game, whatever.
No change of formation.

You are fucking clueless! "It's never my fault" Dyche. You're so up your own arse. Fuck Off, Dyche.

There are seven games left, mate, and I am coming round to the view that we will get a fine not a points cut.

How can we not worry about the summer? It would be a dereliction of duty not to. We can only hope that someone somewhere in and around this club is worrying about the summer and what it might be possible to do in all potential scenarios.

I'm not worried about this season Jeff, We will stay up.

But I'm scared stiff about the summer and will continue to expend what is left of my Everton energy and emotion over the next six weeks or so to what they will mean and bring for the day after 19 May.

It obviously doesn't mean that. I'm happy to have a good chat with Blues but that statement is just silly. And repeated in various guises on this thread. Just be sensible.

Paul Ferry @109 — you want a direct answer to the question of whether a win was more important than not playing that shite? Obviously the win. Obviously. Direct enough?

But that's not the choice offered, ever, to any football team.

When you desperately need a win, it makes sense to me that you go and try to get it. 30 minutes at Newcastle aside, we've looked incapable of making anything happen for ourselves. By any kind of footballing style.

You seem to think we ground out a win by playing ugly. Did you watch? Have you watched us over the last few months?

We don't grind out anything. We don't play ugly – we don't play at all. We chase. That's the sum total of what we do. We chase teams and then at the end they either beat us or we lose.

Today, one of those chases yielded a ball being booted into our centre forward and deflecting into the goal. Great – we'll take those points. But let's not suggest that was us grinding out a win or playing some kind of efficient or effective football. We played very little football of any determinable style; shite or otherwise.

The acceptance on here is staggering. We all know the realities of our position and the lack of quality in the team. But the minimum we should expect is some kind of plan. We just offered nothing against Burnley at home and fluked a win.

You should be able to separate the 3 points from the performance. The performance can still be as unacceptable as what has gone before.

We failed to win a game in 13 attempts.

If that's not folding, then what is?

I don't see how doing the same thing over and over again when it's evident it doesn't produce results can be described as 'pragmatic'?

Complaining about bad luck in the face of every bit of factual evidence is not pragmatic. It's the opposite.

This constant belittling of our own manager, coaches and players though, is actually playing right into the hands of those that want us obliterated as a club.

For all the money they get paid, do the people that keep side-swiping our own not have any empathy at all? Dyche, Doucoure, Pickford, Gomes etc are human – this spiteful assassination every day is so damaging and hurtful.

The corruption brigade are succeeding in dividing and conquering. How they must enjoy reading the 'supporters' of the club pissing on the dignity and integrity of the very people that so obviously are pulling their tripes out.

Most of the faint hearts have abandoned ship already, all that's left are those who simply do care and do try best; otherwise, they'd not be human.

I am coming back for a visit, 19 to 28 April, and when I booked, I thought that Everton may have been in a more safer position, but then I thought "Get a grip, this is Everton you are talking about!" Still, the 3 games that first week will make it more exiting. At least I will not be bored.

As far as Dyche goes, I can't think of another manager that can come in this late in the season and suddenly change a team of misfits into a winning team. Maybe next season they may find a better manager to get them through the whole season and beyond.

See you all in a couple of weeks.

It's not hard Ernie, we have to play ugly and scrappy because that is what happens where we are where we are with what we have.

I love the way posters like you call that sort of pragmatism in the here and now "acceptance". It's not. It's far more realistic and intelligent than your "performance" ranting and raving.

Would I like us to "perform" better? Of course (although I am apparently "accepting"). But unlike you and like most of the "accepting" posters on here, I am aware that we are where we are and we must do what we must do to get out of it.

You want it all, Ernie, a win and good footy, when as you have said yourself, we do not have the equipment to play significantly better. The realistic among us accept (flirting with danger there) this in the current predicament and just want us to win.

They would love us to play better but they are not delusional like you who wants everything at once. Safety first in dire situations. I learnt that in school, Ernie.

And try to think of things like this before you come out with crass judgments that this is "accepting" of what goes on on the pitch.

I have a hunch that you will be feeling better about us when you get on the plane to go home. We are in a better position today than we were yesterday and that is all that we can ask for in our present predicament.

I hope that you have a great trip and see us win as I think you will.

Beside that, I have subscribed to various TV companies that give me every Premier League game. I have not been to Goodison Park for a while but I don't think I have missed a home or away game for the last 10 or more years.

I was a season ticket holder from 1970 to 1976 before I left Liverpool, and I am not sure how many times I have been back and it was always in September or October whichever had the most home games on.

I am somewhat surprised that you feel performances of late are a very ugly means to an end – survival in the Premier League!

Well, I suppose in some ways you are right, but there is ugly, and then there is coyote ugly!

I am of the old school, and have stated on here many times, I can reluctantly accept defeat, if we have played to the best of our team's ability (on the day), if we have been beaten by a better side or unfortunately been the victim of wrong refereeing decisions, disallowed goals, penalties etc, later proved as such, but never rescinded.

However, the absolute lack of any joined up football, simple passes, control (or lack of) schoolboy errors etc, on show is deeply worrying.

It's not exactly a one-off recently either, remembering of course, these players are not playing in a Sunday League, or for buttons. Decent Lottery wins to most of us, and every week, without buying a Ticket.

We all worry for our future, but the faceless bastards that have caused all this grief, are not only well rewarded, but don't give a fuck like we do!

I apparently want us to win and play good footy. They are your words.

Nowhere have I said that. Though obviously that would be something to aim for when we change a lot of things, including the coach.

I want us to go out for the win in a home game to Burnley. That's a long way removed from what you're projecting onto me. Long ball, for example, is fine by me. We're not playing long ball football. We're playing flick it to no-one and then chase the opposition football. There's a good reason that we create nothing.

I struggle to understand your logic. If we win, then all is fine. Presumably if we lose, then all is not fine. How can an opinion on a football team be so lacking in any kind of depth? Why even bother watching when you can form that opinion completely independently of how we play? How will we do in the next games? Can you have an opinion when you don't yet know the result?

We have gone out and played mostly non-winning football for 4 months. A ball deflects into the goal and suddenly Dyche is a pragmatist?

You understand that he clearly isn't, don't you? He's the opposite of a pragmatist. He's dogmatic in the extreme. He's going to continue to do what he does because he's convinced that the opposite happening is just a prolonged aberration.

He laments our bad fortune. Look at our last three goals. We're having extreme good fortune. These are the Dyche good times.

I'll end on these notes:

"If we win, then all is fine". Quote me saying that. Give me back my words where I say that. I do say that ugly is necessary for where we find ourselves and that I don't like the way we play (Do you read things?), but I never once said "If we win, then all is fine". But don't let that stop you Ernie.

While I'm at it, find me anywhere where I call Dyche "pragmatic". Don't put fecking words in my mouth to suit your utter lack of "understanding" and "depth".

This is not very smart mixed up doggerel, Ernie.

"I struggle to understand your logic. If we win then all is fine. Presumably if we lose then all is not fine. How can an opinion on a football team be so lacking in any kind of depth? Why even bother watching when you can form that opinion completely independently of how we play?"

I do feel for you that you cannot follow my logic – such as it is – and it might help if you actually represented it correctly. Here's one sentence to sum it up for you:

I would rather we played better football but I can see that, with what we have at our disposal, in the situation in which we find ourselves, that the scrappy shite to keep us up in a messy dog-fight is something I can put up with for now.

Okay?

And now, finally, pure comedy gold:

"I apparently want us to win and play good footy. They are your words. Nowhere have I said that."

Erm, you said that the win was more important than performance. So, ergo, you would like us to win and play well. I'll quote you directly and will not put words in your mouth:

"You want a direct answer to the question of whether a win was more important than not playing that shite? Obviously the win."

This is also worth a good bellyache: "We don't grind out anything. We don't play ugly – we don't play at all".

Happy zzzzzzzzz Ernie. Nice to swap words with you. This is the first time, isn't it? You're quite easy to debate.

Agreed. I understand Tony Abrahams point about pragmatism but, for context, I'd say it was pragmatism that saw us have a long undefeated run against Liverpool under Royle, Smith and Kendall Mk III when they clearly had better players.

Scraping a 1-0 win against 10-man Burnley isn't grinding out a result – it's sitting on your hands and being negative. I was pro-Sean when we got him and early on was happy but those early games when we were creating 15-20 shots seem more like a fluke now.

Kinda like when under Royle we started playing “footie” but, the longer he stayed around, the more he reverted to dour long ball hit and hope and results suffered.

Obviously I'm not suggesting ousting the manager as we have neither the money nor the leadership to do so. But I am disappointed with with his overall impact and the performances of the team, especially versus weaker, less experienced sides, eg, Luton, Burnley etc.

But don't be "surprised", points right now are way more important than performance. That's just reality, in my view. I'd love us to win with some flair (and actually, we show some now and then), but we don't have the tools (carefully chosen) to play like that and a manager (who I would rather not have) whose relation to flair is as distant as Chester, UK from Chester, PN.

I would love to meet up one day sooner rather than later. You seem like a real nice and jolly fella in those Bramley Moore photographs!!

Gomes must keep his place. Gueye was missed, not so much Onana.

If we dodge a bullet regarding further points reduction, with a fully fit squad for the remaining fixtures, I can see us finishing the season safe and 7th from bottom.

You make no sense and it's not going to matter whether I point that out in detail.

But, as I said on another thread, how you set the team up, the way you play, the tactics used, all determine the probability of a win. Get them wrong and the Championship beckons.

Before Dyche, we were disorganized, players bought to fit several previous managers. Some well past their sell-by date, some should be here. In short, a mixed bag of round pegs in square holes.

Where are we now? We have a set of poorer quality players who are better organized. But there the good news stops. We have bought badly, lost much of the little quality we have, yet we know when they get their act together they can do pretty well.

The issue is not that anyone takes style over a win, the reality is we had been 13 matches without one.

Ernie's point is that if we had a better game plan we would win more with the same squad and I agree, I think we are defensively set up not to lose without any real attacking strategy or game plan. Much is made of the poor quality players, but hand in hand with this is what they are being told to do, how to play.

Play to your instructions, not necessarily you capability, for the greater good. Makes sense if it produces the required results, and if we had 6 1-0 wins, 3 draws and 4 loses in the past 13 then I would say it's a means to an end... but 13 matches and no wins is relegation form.

Keep doing what we are doing and hope it eventually comes right? Too late... draws are not enough; several more wins are needed.

So, we have to find the balance between attacking and defending that produces more wins. That's a gamble, but doing nothing different is leaving too much to hope.

It is simply an outcome of the quality of players in the squad during that period. For the majority of those years, financial constraints have prevented us improving while, under Moshiri, it was the appalling recruitment and financial mismanagement.

Dyche is not getting the optimal performance out of this squad, but I think that is partly down to the simple footballing fact that defeats kill player confidence. He had the performances without the results early in the season, then the performances and the results up to Xmas. Tough defeats and unlucky draws have sapped the confidence that the squad had built until mid-December.

That is why, yes indeed, the result is far more important than the dire performance.

We are facing an existential threat to this club right now – absent owner, no takeover, no board, huge losses, potential administration, two penalty point sanctions, no transfer funds, player sales, possible relegation – so the only thing that matters is we can continue the club as a going concern in the Premier League.

The win today was massive, the performance was irrelevant.

Ernie and I want the same thing, like you. We're all a tad upset, sad, and pulled in two directions or more. But we have to stay up by hook or by crook.

At this moment we must prioritise points over performance. But, to be honest, I'm not even sure that we have the manager and players for the sort of sustained performance that Ernie longs for.

I've genuinely never been more worried about us since my first game in 1975 than I am now.

The summer worries me much more than the next six weeks or so because we will stay up.

Even with allowing for a 2-point deduction, I would not be at all surprised to see a points deduction and a transfer ban which would cripple us next season with so many out of contract.

Your fears too are well grounded because, if the 777 Partners takeover goes through, I can't see them wanting too keep Dyche.

I suppose, Christine, that my optimism is still largely situated less in us and what we can do than in my strong sense that there are genuinely three worse teams than us who are going down.

We will not have that luxury next season - Leicester, Leeds etc.

We can get something out of Chelsea and let's give Klopp a Royal Blue send off.

It's there to play for. 35 or 36 points will do it.

We're staying up. Nailed on.

Now come on, Ernie, it's not how you play but how many points you've got, you must have read that by now. Many say that Man City are the best team in Europe and that they and Arsenal play beautiful football but using the points criteria then Celtic, or is it Rangers, have been the best team in the world for as long as anyone can remember.

What worries me is that I'm not sure that Mr Dyche has ever run up a lot of points in England's top flight and all our title and cup wins are, as Mr Moshirir said, "just a museum". School of Science, most knowledgeable fans, pure poppycock. Never mind the quality, feel the width!

I see we've won one.

Erm, that's not true, but the logic is so silly anyway.

Quick question, Alan: What will keep us up: "How you play [or] how many points you've got"?

Congratulations, Alan, you've out-Ernied Ernie. Your Boots gift voucher is in the post.

"I see we've won one". After 13 fucking games without winning. What a fucking asinine comment.

Words fail me.

“We just offered nothing against Burnley at home and fluked a win. You should be able to separate the 3 points from the performance. The performance can still be as unacceptable as what has gone before.”

We had a fair few debates earlier this season after matches where we had played reasonably well and created more chances and shots than our opponents, where you told me (and forgive me for paraphrasing) that it did not matter, and that shots were falling to people who would never score and that to talk about luck was misleading.

Now, you are saying after a win that it was lucky and that the performance was unacceptable. It appears slightly that you want to grumble both after a loss in which we've played well and a win in which we haven't.

The reality is that, without points deductions we'd be waking up to 14th place and being closer to 9th place than the relegation places. I don't think anyone on here is enamoured with the style of play but getting 35 points after 31 matches is a decent return with this limited squad and, as you have told me before, you can't put that down to luck.

You recognize your own sentiment then?

Of course it's asinine; it's how your posts are coming over.

Danny – with you there. We should treat both matches as ones to secure points and certainly give Mr Klopp a reminder Everton are not done yet!

I'll try one more time but it won't work.

Answer the question.

Quick question, Alan: What will keep us up, "how you play [or] how many points you've got"?

And here's another one for you, you raise it yourself.

Try and explain precisely in more than a throwaway hackneyed cowardly avoiding sentence, exactly how my posts on here are "asinine".

You can phone a friend or ask the audience.

Go on, I dare you, can you stretch to as many as, phew, six or seven sentences?

You can phone a friend or ask the audience.

But one thing that annoyed me, was the apparent lack of direction to the half-time warm-up by those players on the bench. For the most part, there was no-one from the coaching team with them, and to begin not even a ball to kick.

Eventually, they were put through some limited drills, but to me it all looked a little sloppy and ill-prepared.

When we are literally fighting for our lives, I think these things are important, and yesterday that aspect all looked too casual and unprofessional.

Maybe with a little more work at half-time we could have brought someone on 30 minutes earlier for Ashley Young who I thought contributed very little all afternoon.

Well how we've played so far isn't doing that well or is mediocrity your criterion? — poor football bringing poor results as previous managers have. But Mr Dyche could have had us mid-table with better accountants.

It is poor football with one win in 13, is it, try reading your own rubbish before getting on your high horse, parody.

The goal was a bit of luck in some respects, but you make your own luck by pressing a team that dallies on the ball in defence. A very high proportion of goals are scored by doing exactly that.

And there as a stonewall, Garnacho-style penalty in there too which wasn't given when Calvert-Lewin was tripped. And I'm sure Salah would have been walking the ball to the penalty spot had he taken the same tumble as Beto when clean through yesterday.

Our neighbours would probably have gone with the headline of "Nunez forces win after double penalty controversy".

For example, Pickford twice not opening his mouth, once in the first half that caused the pandemonium with players panicking, three times failing to clear the ball; then in the last minute of the game letting Colman head the ball out for a corner instead of shouting to tell him to let it go. They hardly played as a team for many minutes of the game.

Maybe that is due to the lack of confidence Tony is talking about; the lack of quality is also a big factor, a very big factor. So I believe Dyche is entitled to a lot more credit than he gets while recognising his faults. I can't name another manager, at the moment, who will manage this squad better than Dyche is doing now.

Yes, I noticed that and it is the same most games but, strangely enough, I don't think the Burnley players came out at half-time – first time that has happened if I'm correct.

I like Pickford (England's Numero Uno) and allegedly on £150k/week, but he does make a lot of howlers that contradicts his bounty.

Mind you he is not alone, there is too much, regarding reward/performance. I don't think or know of any player we have, who gives a toss whether we survive as a club (Seamus excepted). None will be signing on in their lifetime!

But why performance matters is the future, and not next year, but our remaining games. Play like we did yesterday and the chances of us winning many if any games, especially against better opposition, are in my opinion, slim.

In other words, while you can happily bank 3 points with a great deal of relief, what I saw does not bode well. And while we looked better and more threatening earlier in the season, our performances this calendar year have been almost entirely dire, like yesterday, and that closely correlates to our shocking results during that period – notwithstanding a somewhat fortunate victory against a Championship side playing a large part of the game with 10 men.

The aspect I am unsure about is whether it is because our players are truly that poor, except perhaps some in our defence, or they are being coached badly. I'm not looking for 1970s Brazil or Cruyff's 'total football' – just a semblance of a coherent plan and a more evident capacity to threaten the opposition's goal.

We've played 100 times better than that and got turned over. I'll take the 3 points thank you very much.

Dyche is not blameless but posters on here calling for the School of Science can't see that we have donkeys like Doucoure, Young and Coleman who couldn't pass wind.

Given we are about to have another points deduction, those 4 points from 2 games are so important. I just wish some of the more critical fans would look at the asterix next to our name in the table.

This squad has gathered 35 points this season so far. Last season was 36 in total! The most important thing is we all get behind our team at Goodison — we know how fantastic our away fans are.

Wonder what the odds would have been for two number nines to score the same type of closing down goal a couple of days apart?

Neither goal was lucky and came about by two strikers simply doing their job.

A player shots, hits a defender and balloons over the keeper. Fortunate yes but if the shot hadn't been taken there wouldn't have been a deflection made.

As to the quality of football let's avoid relegation and worry about next summer then and, as Paul F has said, there'll be plenty to worry about on the ownership front.

Those suggesting the Commission will simply fine us? We're skint.

If they do go easy, can they issue a suspended points deduction?

A quiz show once had the catchphrase that points win prizes. We won't win any cups but, bloody hell, we sure need points. At this stage of the season, I don't care how.

With regard to the School of Science, those students are now drawing their state pensions. It is a long time ago and ever distant memory unfortunately. It is gone, not relevant, no one outside of us ToffeeWebbers will even know what it once referred to.

My argument was along the lines that Dyche was conning our masses into thinking we were playing attacking football with extreme bad luck. I countered that I didn't think it was bad luck - I thought it was poor play and poor management. And yes, I gave the example of Gueye pumping shots from range into the Park End.

Dyche continued with that theme throughout a 13 match winless streak.

I ran across our esteemed manager's comments after we finally got a win against Burnley. I go out of my way to avoid them but they turned up in a match report. He's claiming that he was sick of us deserving to win and losing so he decided that if we played shite we might win.

Quote from Dyche "You’re nervous but the facts are the facts, they only had one shot on target which shows we dominated the game. Not with the ball but without the ball"

I stand by it Sam. He's a conman.

What do you think happened earlier in the thread, Paul?

I stopped engaging with you because, in my opinion, you make no sense. Not with your footballing opinions, which you are entitled to and I would happily debate, but with your strange arguments and associations.

If this was real life, in a pub, for example, we could have a great old football conversation or even a heated debate. That could go for hours. But if you started taking the piss, as you are in that post, then that wouldn't continue for long at all.

We're not in a pub. So I don't have that recourse available to me. So behave like an adult.

Dyche has faults, like the wrong subs and waiting for the inevitable to happen and concede, but maybe he doesn't trust the players. We need to win the home games – easier said than done, I know – and not lose at Luton.

This is down to “Dyche's pragmatic approach”, which has kept a squad of players (who have been getting criticised for years) going, even though people have been saying for years, that these players have not got much heart.

The School of Science died a very long time ago and, if I'm being totally honest, this is something that I can't even blame Bill Kenwright for.

Silky football is brilliant but, in my near 50 years of watching Everton, I have only seen two teams win. Royle's “Dogs of War” and Howard Kendall's great team – and both these teams only won because they always won the battle first.

Everton are currently in the biggest battle of their entire history. The club has no money, an absolute mishmash of players, that have been bought by about six different managers, leaving a squad bereft of any genuine skill or pace, and it's the manager's fault for having the gumption to make them competitive at the expense of things his squad doesn't really possess?

We all want more, but Everton Football Club has always been built on pragmatism, and if anyone doesn't realise this, they don't really understand our football club.

I'm not sure if Dyche is the long-term answer (his football is shite – but his attitude and approach have been admirable, and he also hasn't had any money) but he deserves enormous credit for keeping us up last season, and he deserves even more, for the way he has got us battling into the face of adversity this season.

I have no doubt when Ramadan ends, we will see the real Doucoure and you can guarantee he will pull a goal or two out of the bag before the end of the season.

With Ramadam ending 9 April, we just might get the likes of Doucoure, Gueye and Onana firing again which will be a huge boost to our run-in.

But we got 3 points.

We can worry about the rest later.

Right now, Sean Dyche is doing a job in the circumstances.

It's not always the sorts of goals Nunez and Calvert-Lewin forced, but it's the same principle. And like a well-worked set piece, it's not luck.

The most common issue is the straight ball played by the goalkeeper to a deep midfield player facing his own goal. This often leads to loss of possession and a goalscoring opportunity.

This looks like a goalkeeping blunder but pressing teams are deliberately blocking safer passing lanes to force this type of reckless pass. It happens time and time again. Dispossessing a goalkeeper is also pretty common.

We put Man Utd under very high pressure recently but unlike Muric, Andre Onana (who is talented but erratic) had an exceptional game with the ball at his feet and alas it bore no rewards.

You're probably right; I should take more care and deliberation in selecting the half-dozen or so words I choose to sum up the foregoing 2 hours of mind-numbing Dycheball that currently passes for 'entertainment' at Goodison Park.

I don't think I allow myself quite enough time at the end of the game for such finesse as you call for in producing the most eloquent or apposite summary of proceedings without some element of my own personal overwhelmingly negative assessment seeping through.

In this instance, I can accept that I was indeed rash to label Calvert-Lewin's effort as 'lucky', knowing that some observers would underline the desire, commitment and initiative required to anticipate such a challenge that proved so pivotal to the outcome of the game.

You say a high proportion of goals are scored by pressing a team that dallies on the ball in defence, although nowhere near often enough by us, unfortunately, despite previous efforts to force things in past games.

Subtly within the headline, I did actually give credit to Calvert-Lewin for the block. But I could not avoid calling out the luck involved in seeing the ball careen over Muric and into the Park End goal. In many such instances, the ball does not go in the goal. So when it does, I believe a huge slice of luck is involved.

As ever, I think emphasising luck over endeavour was striking the right balance overall. But some would see negativity lurking under the surface. I would like to suggest that searching for and calling out such latent negativity is in fact the ultimate expression of the very negativity you decry.

I agree with your comment. Initially, it looked like a goalkeeping mistake.

But Calvert-Lewin deserves the credit for pressing and getting the goal.

You write in the moment.

I have to give myself time.

Keep doing what you do. It is always welcome.

Dyche gets mullered for his tactic (there's only one: Pickford hoofs it up-field) but the players need holding to account for poor control, misplaced passes and overall lack of movement and guile.

Driving home from the game, I listened to Sean Dyche being interviewed and he said he "designed a plan where we deliberately tried to play long and strong and make the game as awkward and ugly as possible".

What I found strange is he was talking as if he had been playing a different style for the previous 13 games: this was no different at all his long ball and try and win 2nd ball football.

Someone quoted a stat that, when Burnley went down to 10 men, we still only managed 37% possession, I think that just sums up how ineffective we are.

Thankfully we played against a side who are worse than us and for most of the game showed little desire to get the ball into our box. But the result wasn't achieved by Sean Dyche's tactics which, even against 10 men, created very little.

I think this team have got little or no idea how to create chances, we broke on a few occasions but, when we needed cool heads to create an opening, we played the wrong pass or hit the right pass too hard.

My worry is, and has been for the last couple of seasons, who is going to score the goals to keep us up? And is the style we play hampering our chances of creating many options?

All the teams round us seem to have more goals in them than we do and, let's be honest, our last 4 points were gained by a penalty and a goalkeeping error.

On a positive note, I thought Branthwaite was excellent, in fact the whole back 4 played well. Gomes played some delightful through-balls that could and should have led to goals, and Calvert-Lewin put in a shift. I do think Ramadan has had an effect on Doucoure.

I think due to us having a good defence, we will be okay.

Doucoure is dreadful whether he is doing Ramadan or not.

The forward line is awful with no idea on attacking play.

Also, the 3 points will probably be deducted by the wankers at the Premier League this week, so it's a good job we won.

As for the penalty shouts, my main gripe is not the headlines but with the players for failing to harangue the referee. Just like with pressing the GK, you make your own luck with that sort of thing.

Anyway, keep up the good work.

Maybe this is what Dyche meant with his description of how he wanted us to play? (I haven't listened to him though.)

Kompany has got Burnley players trying to play like Man City players – that was Danny O'Neill's description after yesterday's game. Maybe Dyche had already witnessed how passive they are, and decided to let them concentrate on playing their football, without really trying to hurt their opponents. But maybe I'm being a bit too defensive of the Everton manager, by suggesting such a thing!

I loved every minute, though, because it is the despair that makes the brief glory so sweet. I don't watch Champions League and I don't care how great the football is. Yesterday gave me more pleasure than watching any other team playing the best football in the world.

I don't want to spend the last games of the season in perpetual anxiety so I do not care how we accumulate points. Dyche is handling his dwindling pile of chips like an underdog at the World Poker Championship. Kompany and others went all in. Dyche will hang in, get us our stake back, and go again. That's how to play shit hands.

We were always taught to win your battles and then you earn the right to play football.

It's a funny one, that. All the defenders seem to try their best to not hoof it forward but invariably work the ball back to Pickford who's sole directive seems to be to drill the ball forward. How many goals have we got out of that?

Pickford would almost certainly have lumped it forward earlier, Burnley, as Danny observed, try to do a 'half-City', so you are in with a decent chance of such a mistake.

Actually, while a well organised press did in my view help create the goal, I felt we didn't press well enough for most of the time. Often you would have one guy haring after the ball but, for a press to work, the whole team needs to move as one, giving ever less time to escape. That happened all too infrequently. I don't think Dyche is a 'high press' type of guy.

In contrast, teams like our local rivals and Arsenal do it very well. One of the interesting aspects of last night's game with Brighton was seeing how they dealt with Arsenal's high press. Granted they lost 3-0 but they really do stick with the plan, are clearly coached in doing it, and have much better players than Burnley and so very often pulled it off.

Risky, yes, but the rewards are suddenly finding free space in midfield or down the flanks for a fast counter. Brighton didn't exploit that well enough last night, but they sure created enough opportunities. No wonder even the top teams are wary of them.

If we stay up then fantastic.

If not, there is nowhere to hide… having played exactly as he wishes.

We'll have Onana, Gueye and Danjuma available for our next game, and Ramadan finished as well, and with Calvert-Lewin back on the score sheet, is a big positive.

I still believe our best performance this season was against Spurs, and the 2nd half at Newcastle, and that's when Dyche brought on Gomes and switched to 4-3-3 which made us way more offensive than the stagnant 4-4-1-1.

The lad is quick, strong and mobile. Man City did it with Stones and the rs do it with Arnold. Moving players into different positions isn't unheard of in the football world but then you have to have a manager with a modicum of imagination.

Not that it mattered in the end but we had a stone wall penalty not given.

We should know our fate, points-deduction-wise in the week ahead. I am assuming that unless, we have a zero points deduction, we will appeal. Once it washes out at no more the 2 or 3 in total then we will be fine as regards avoiding the drop as there are numerous opportunities for us to pick up the points in the remaining games.

It's joyless to watch but needs must!

Respect to all those who made the trip to Newcastle midweek and turned up again yesterday.

Chelsea next, and with our defensive solidity, we can take something from that game.

McNeil (who I thought was responsible for Burnley getting out) a couple of times during yesterday's first half by not reading the press that others were trying to create got a standing ovation for sprinting after a ball back to the goalkeeper and then continuing to sprint right when it was played to their left back, but was then out of position, for Burnley to work the ball into a dangerous area down our left hand side.

Iwobi used to do the same and leave a similar gap to exploit so, unless you can get everyone on the same page, then trying to play a high press is a very dangerous tactic.

There is no way on God's Earth I would play a high press with the players we had on the pitch yesterday.

Thirteen games without a win, so let’s move our best defender into midfield. Sometimes I’m glad Sean Dyche, lacks imagination!

Seriously Colin, it’s easy for me to write this because Brainthwaith was absolutely immense yesterday, and It wasn’t until the clock was on 90 minutes, that he made his first real unforced error by getting under a high ball to miss the header, but that kids performance yesterday was the biggest reason Pickford, never got troubled all afternoon, imo.

But it was a poor performance from both teams, and felt more Championship than Premier League. A must-win game where only the result mattered.

29 points after a 6-point deduction makes it really tight. There are going to be a lot of twists in the road and we are going to have to pick up wins. This is something we aren't blessed in with the lack of pace and genuine threat in the squad.

I am not convinced on Dyche, and if he had failed to win yesterday, I think he was gone. Yesterday gives him till the end of the season. Then hopefully new owners need to sort out this mess.

My best mate is a Burnley season ticket holder and he would vehemently disagree with the idea that Kompany is a good coach. Playing out from the back like Man City is not very pragmatic when you have inferior players. A lot of Burnley's woes this season have been self-inflicted which shows that he has sacrificed pragmatism for philosophy.

The total opposite of Dyche. Our big dilemma next season, if we stay up, is going to be whether to entrust a complete rebuild to Dyche. With the enforced sale of the better players, return of loan players, certain players being out of contract or just too old, can Dyche rebuild a more exciting team on a shoestring budget?

Will we get the chance to find out? Or do we go for a philosophy-driven manager with all the risks that that approach entails?

Meanwhile, Dyche just does what Dyche does. It's awful football but, if it keeps us up, it's justifiable. The risk will be in trying something different. Are we prepared to try another approach?

When they lose possession up front, they always seem to be very quickly under the cosh as opponents break into Everton's half.

It has been like that all season and, until they get some really good tacklers or players who can get back quickly, they will always be vulnerable. Amazing how even Burnley can expose this.

A natural defender who is calm and composed on the ball, but anticipates danger and snuffs it out.

By far our best player yesterday, as he has been many times this season.

He is a Rolls-Royce in a field full of Ladas. He has to play at the back for us to stand any chance of staying up.

It held us together during what could have otherwise been a few dangerous moments. I thought the kid was a 9 out of 10 yesterday.

Many have said it: "This is dire, turgid football." Why would we aspire to more of the same next season, simply watching more horrible football?

I'd like him moved on whether we stay up or not.

We have a crap midfield because we have inadequate midfielders. No up-and-down players capable of carrying the ball at speed, taking shots at goal etc.

Moving a centre-back there isn't going to solve anything, no matter how versatile he may be.

Yesterday we were overrun several times in midfield due to the absence of Gueye and Onana. Burnley were hardly a threat, were they? Godfrey or even the abominable Keane could have sat on a deck chair yesterday and would've looked comfy.

Branthwaite, imo, could play either role, he's that good. I'm not suggesting he plays there on a permanent basis but, when you see Garner and Co getting outmuscled, he could be an option to stiffen the midfield when needed.

A bit of imagination can go a far way.

Any aspiring or proven manager will look at our team and want a complete revamp, I'm guessing.

Personally, I couldn't watch another season of this dross, it's just not worth the money, effort and emotional pain.

But right now, taking the kingpin out of defence when the best hope of a win is 1-0 scoreline, just doesn't make any sense.

Yes it was McNeil who was in my mind when I said that. Whether he was acting on instinct and/or trying to get a cheer, or maybe, just maybe, assuming he would be the trigger for a proper press, I'm not sure.

You are probably right, we don't have the players for an effective press. Partly because we have so many really quite slow players. Our lack of pace really stands out.

Why do the top teams break the bank to sign the best players they can find every season? It's a damn sight easier to win games when you have superior skilled players than the opposition.

Dyche has decided that we've a better chance of avoiding relegation playing a defensive game – there's only the Top 3 sides that have conceded fewer goals than us – than playing an open game poorly.

We will stay up this season, we would have easily but for the 6-point deduction and the near certainty of another one to come.

If you think this season is bad, I don't know what you will make of next seasons when it seems very likely we will be forced to sell 2 or 3 of our 'stars'.

A squad of players bereft of confidence because they are mentally tired?, (because of the point deduction and the absolute uncertainty around our club) Or a squad of players drained because they have been getting mismanaged by a manager who simply refuses to play to their obvious strengths? Take your pick.

Reset in the championship, or continue to struggle by grinding out enough points to remain in the premier league?

My guess is that Kompany, will bring Burnley back up again, and be a lot more prepared for the premier league, the next time, but I’m only really interested in Everton!

We were gifted a goal and gifted a red card, even though they seemed to play better with 10, probably because we didn't try and finish them off.

People are talking about the midfield being overrun, but I thought Gomes did pretty well considering he's hardly played. He can't run but at least he can make a pass, which is beyond a few. Branthwaite was MOM again and he was bent over in exhaustion when the final whistle went, I hope he's not getting burnt out because we'll need desperately need him for the run-in.

One to forget, take the gift and run.

We'll probably hear what points deduction we'll get tonorrow. My guess is no more than three.

I think calling him a conman is pretty harsh. Absolutely fine if you see it a different way but it's more than plausible that he saw positives in the amount of chances we were creating and the xG style statistics.

As did I and many others. If nothing else, I think it can often suit a manager to find the positives and boost the player's confidence. And our players need boosting more than most.

Where would you have expected this squad to finish this season? My personal view at the outset was that 12th/13th would have been a sort of success (given the low bar) and anything below 17th was failure.

The defence is a positive, however, if we actually tried to be more positive, then that stat would suffer.

We just haven't got the players with the ability, the squad is shocking!

I'm sure Luton could improve their goals against by not trying to win matches and scoring goals, but that's how you win games by scoring and you can't win if you can't score!

Fast forward to April 25 when Forest come to our place and let’s imagine we’re still 4pts to the good, I’d put money on Dyche’s approach being, it’s the 33rd game, if we come away with a point, they’re running out of runway.

I was watching the Palace v City on MoTD, spoiler alert, they play football on a different universe to us, nevertheless, they were 1 down away from home and when they went forward they had 5 in the box with 2 out wide, the fact that Palace have quick players and can do them on the break, didn’t concern them; who dares wins-and they did.

Now before anyone says, yeah but that’s City, I’ll say footballers should be able to run; when I was playing, and at a very a low level. I could run into the box, and if the move broke down bust a gut to get back and defend.

I’m getting totally sick of seeing Dom or Beto going forward without a player being within 30 yards of them; it’s not rocket science why, if we take out the set-piece goals, we’re the lowest scorers from open play.

I agree that the players aren’t as bad as the table suggests, maybe the slowest but not the worst and being 1 up at home to a struggling 10 man Burnley, and it was still squeeky bum time, is frankly unacceptable when we were desperate for all 3pts thazt we didn’t press the advantage. We got away with the 3points yesterday as opposed to handsome win.

With a limited squad clean sheets are generally the key to survival. So far we have nine which have yielded twenty three points. Four more should be enough to make us safe.

It is interesting to note some supporters criticise Dyche for not making substitutions while others criticise him for taking Calvert-Lewin off with six minutes left.

It's a balance, and I'd say Dyche can see he doest have the creativity, pace or ability in the forward areas he's tried playing to our strengths.
If you could add a few goals to the defensive solidity then we wouldn't be near the drop zone !

Not sure if it had anything to do with Ukraine, sounded Greek then half way through Viva Espanya.

Any idea, ToffeeWebbers?

Italian commentary through week sang it about Calvert-Lewin when he scored and it was all over social media.

After you've had a pint, a fag, taken or deep breath or vented to mates, it's a lot easier to produce a more measured “big picture” view of any game, as Lyndon does an hour or so later.

But if the live forum is any judge, then Michael's in the moment “negativity” is pretty balanced when compared with what most of us say or think in the moment over the last 30 years.

There is a reason Mr Positive Danny O'Neill's immediate post-match reaction is usually “I'm too raw to talk, I'm taking the dog out.” God knows what he might say if he let it off the leash right off the cuff?

Is it really true that all we ever do is back-pass to the keeper, who then just hits it high and handsome to no-one in particular?

Then we have those who see no attacking intent at any point, ever. Pressing isn't something positive or potentially valuable – it's just ‘chasing'. Funny how the best teams in the world get praise for their work-rate off the ball.

There is plenty to criticise but the debate is still-born when people give no credit whatsoever.

As for the long balls from Pickford. Yes, if I was looking for a pattern of what we do more than anything else, it would be that. We play back to Pickford and he (sometimes Tarkowski) launches the 'attack'. He's actually very good at it, so more credit there.

My only issue is that, when the ball goes back to Pickford, it's not like we suddenly commit players forward to play off Calvert-Lewin who, again, deserves credit for the amount of headers he wins even if they typically just go to a defender.

When it comes to our press, I'm not sure it's quite the high press most would think of where the whole team moves forward and pressures the defence while cutting off the next ball. We get one or two chasing but most stay home. Great effort, maybe even heroic effort at times, but not particularly coordinated. We're not a team that is going to take a chance on committing players forward.

The best teams get praise for their work off the ball. Then they get praise for what they do with the ball.

Our players deserve praise for what they do off the ball. We're a non-event on the ball. I'm not even really expecting decent football, just something that could offer a threat.

There'll be many games where that's a means to an end and maybe even just a way to avoid a confidence-sapping hiding. But we were playing Burnley. That was ultra-conservative.

Ah yes but why does the players' inability to do the basics get portrayed as the manager's negative tactics?

As others consistently point out, we've seen the same failings from (most of) these players under a wide range of leadership and yet, when the results don't go our way, there's plenty who go after the manager first, last and always.

No-one thinks we're being told to get midfielders on the ball to play a more progressive style of football do they? Or that someone is getting directed to get close to Dom as soon as our defence have the ball so we can play some kind of meaningful long ball game? Or that he might be picking a different formation due to our lack of wide players but they just keep reverting to a 4-4-1-1?

It looks to me like they are directed to stay in shape, to get men behind the ball, and to be hard to beat. And credit where it's due – we are very hard to score against.

I don't see the basics when we have the ball either. Who's job is it to get them doing that?

Even Garner has been caught up in our frantic defensive system and is not getting on the ball a lot. Gomes didn't have a great game on Saturday but it's a risk we need to take by playing him I feel.

Dom and Beto are both bang average but for us to survive they need to start converting some of the chances they get. There's not many chances I admit but, for fuck's sake, they are paid to score goals.

The points deduction, has had a massive detrimental effect, on Everton’s season, and even Dyche’s biggest critics, must surely understand this?

My own view is that the club would not even be in the premier league, if it wasn’t for Sean Dyche, and when you look at the present financial situation of Everton football club, then it’s apparent that he has been a true saviour.

His football might be shit, but he has genuinely kept us going imo, and anyone honest and sensible enough to understand this, will surely give him the credit he deserves for steering the biggest shitshow in Everton football clubs, very long history.

Football is absolutely about the here and now, and under normal circumstances then Dyche’s current football, just wouldn’t be acceptable, but these are not normal circumstances, and Everton are very lucky to have had a manager who has just kept his council, and got on with the most difficult job in football, even if he’s probably being paid a fortune for his troubles!

But it's all supposition.

What I do know is that the last few months haven't been good enough on the pitch. There's no excuse for just how bad it's been - it's been generationally bad!

The top 3 defences currently are found in the top 3 places in the league.

However, joint second worst (with Burnley) for goals scored.

Hmm. I wonder where the issue with the team is.

Ok, I like to point out the obvious.

It's not called a relegation scrap for nothing. Has good football ever got a team out of a relegation battle?

In the run in we are playing teams around us, these games will be terrible to watch and nervy for all involved.

Burnley are nice on the eye, they walked away with the championship last year. They have spent a lot more money than us and will almost certainly get relegated again.

On Saturday I thought Branthwaite was our Motm, Tarks was having a right nightmare first half whilst Jarrod kept sweeping up for him. Garner had a great game filling the gaps that Gomes can't get to whilst Myko kept their right winger very quiet. A bit of luck for a change went our way and we got a rare win whilst Oliver was refereeing.

The garner pen, Beto push in the back are fouls given anywhere else on the pitch. Fast forward 24 hours and lpool get a pen with very little contact. United got one against us and the lad celebrated the decision. Var and this current crop of refs must be good for the TV as they are shite for the fans and game in general.

We have played some decent stuff this season and not got the rewards for it. How many times have we come away from games where we have missed lots of chances and the opposition have done a smash and grab, wolves, Fulham and west ham spring to mind. Spurs away we should have won after a slow start and another bad refereeing decision.

Dyche is the club at the minute, there isn't any other leadership.
Under Frank we where definitely going down. We have since lost 3 attackers and replaced them 1 loan player.

I am not defending the style of play and dislike it as much as the next fan but I do think the penny dropped with Dyche very early on to play to the players strengths and not a philosophy.

I also don't get the calls for Patterson to get game time. The lad can't defend and very rarely delivers quality. A spell on loan will be sink or swim for him next season.

If we ever do get taken over the usual pattern will emerge, Dyche will be sacked as the owners will want their own man in charge.

Unless we find a way of unearthing attacking talent we will be in the same or worse position next season whilst Chelsea appoint a new manager and let him spend another few hundred million!

I sometimes think, what would I do differently, and if I’m being honest, there are definitely one or two things, I would have tried to do.

I love width, so I would have probably concentrated on this a lot more, and I also believe there is a decent core, but I have never known a squad bereft of pace as much as this team, and because modern football is mostly all about pace, I think I would have badly struggled trying to make us a more offensive unit.

Of course it would be possible, but you also need confident players, and since the club got punished and the team went and got those points back, I believe we have been running on empty, because we have a very small squad, and slowly the confidence has drained away.

We played Spurs and got a lot of plaudits, for playing very good aggressive forward thinking football, (some people would say Michael Oliver, robbed us once again) and then we played City, in a thoroughly intriguing game, and might have even hung on, but for another very debatable penalty kick?

I doubt we would of, because I personally thought Manchester City, gave one of the best attacking performances I’ve ever witnessed at Goodison, but Everton were aggressive and competitive that night, and I thought Phil Foden, was being genuinely honest in his after match interview, when he said Everton are a good team.

I don’t think he would have said this in previous years? (I might be wrong) but since the exertions of December, we have made him look like a liar, because we haven’t looked like a good team.

Mentally tired and lacking confidence, has anyone ever sailed through their job or just life itself, when suffering with these thoughts?

Totally agree about our lack of pace, especially in the majority of our front 6 players. McNeil has no pace so is most reluctant to take on his fullback, and the same applies to Harrison and being predominantly left footed he always wants to come back onto his left foot before making any crosses. Young when he was a lot younger had pace and used to go past players at will but he no longer posses that pace. Gueye, Garner and Onana again no pace in these 3. I watched our neighbours on MOTD and what was noticeable was how they attacked with pace and numbers. Beto isn't blessed with any pace and although DCL is quicker than Beto I would hardly describe him as pacy.

Maybe if we could get Danjuma fit he could add a bit of pace and the same with Dobbin.

I think most of us will be glued to the sports news outlets today and tomorrow to hear what decision the commission will hand down to us. I fear if its around 6 points which would put us in the relegation zone, that might be a step to far so late in the season. Maybe if we only get 4 we can still escape, but whatever points we get deducted it will be a massive lift to those clubs in and around us.

I’d love to be a fullback in this Everton team because you don’t half get a lot of help from the player in front of you, but I’d hate to be a wide player because it is very rarely reciprocated in return.

As well as having no pace, we have not got many players who possess the individual quality to do anything with the ball, so this is probably another reason that Dyche prefers us to play without the ball.

The great Ancellotti used similar tactics with much more quality in his squad, but he his Italian, so pragmatism always comes naturally, I suppose?

They would have done well to watch Gomes at times especially in one movement in the first half just on the edge of out penalty area, he calmly chested the ball down to his feet and looked around before making a pass to a teammate and out of danger.

Gomes is not my favourite player, far from it, but he mostly had a good calm game trying to get passes forward or taking control and slowing the game down and playing the ball back to a defender in plenty of space or even to Calamity in goal, when is he going to talk to his defenders, he screams at them when the ball has gone out of play rarely when they need a bit of advice like Colman in the last minute of the game to just ‘ leave it’.

I think you some up my criticism of Dyche perfectly when you said Dyche prefers us to play without the ball, I think that goes against everything I believe in. I think he has got a decent back 4 but I believe the tactics he uses doesnt help us as an attacking force. Now as we have agreed he doesnt have a lot of pace to call on, but they don't look comfortable on the ball when in the opponents half, and he seems not to want his central midfield players to get into the opponents box which limits our options.

Trust and confidence, isn’t that what most things are built from?

Given we know that, why are we still going out there with ineffective wide players? There are other ways to setup and we've tried precisely none of them. This isn't me calling for 'expansive' football. I'd have gone down the cynical Allardyce route with this lot long ago.

Again I call out the idea that Dyche is pragmatic, as he is often credited with. He is sticking to his approach regardless of all evidence pointing to it being ineffective. That's not pragmatic.

Good remarks on players keeping calm, it is supposed to be part of being a professional footballer. I know he gets a lot of abuse about being lazy but to me Onana is one of the few who is aware of another Everton player to pass to before he is tackled.

As one of the many TV watchers I complain, but I realize that our view is not the same as being at the game, as the TV just follow the ball where at the game you can see the movements off the ball. I may have not been a great amateur footballer but I was taught that unless the ball carrier was in your immediate vicinity, watch for the movement of players around you and look for danger.

A minor adjustment to bring the wide players in a few yards from the touchline -playing more like inside forwards with more liberty- may mean the opposition full backs and centre backs are more uncertain if our wide players are going outside down the line or inside towards the centre and may create more space to attack.

Bill, it is a different picture and that's no insult to those who can't get to the match. I don't get to them all.

When I am at the match, just as when I was coaching, I'm not really focussed on the ball. I'm looking at where it might be going next, so space and movement.

It's probably why I miss half the goals we score and have to often ask who scored. When we do score them that is!

The Commission accepts that Everton is entitled to credit, in mitigation, in respect of the following matters: (a) the fact that the Club has already been penalised in the Everton FY22 Proceedings for losses in years which overlap with the years at issue in these proceedings.

And further down:
In relation to the double jeopardy issue, the guidelines promulgated by the EFL set out the position the EFL would take where a sanction has been imposed previously. Those guidelines are undoubtedly a helpful and compelling benchmark. However, the Commission does not consider that they can be transposed directly into the Premier League Rules.

So double jeopardy taken into account by the EPL - but not in the way the EFL would do?

I don't think Dyche is over pragmatic, rather than over cautious Ernie, but when you mention the Allardyce route, I'm intrigued to what you was thinking with this squad of players?