Idrissa Gueye refuses to wear shirt with rainbow number

Christy,

Bigger issue than Gueye may be the hypocrisy of PSG who are owned by Qatar where you won't find any rainbow shirts.

Christy:

I of course have no idea of Gueye's actual position. It's possible his actions are related to the principle of football/sport being increasingly used as a vehicle for political and social messages of change - with dissenters almost automatically subject to accusation of the relevant -ism.

I say this because it's my own view. It is unfair to impose the role of ambassador upon people this way. Particularly in an environment where they are subjected to justifying their position at the risk of their whole career and reputation.

Perhaps Gueye does indeed object to the intent, who knows. Should he not openly voice that or insult anyone publicly, then he is allowed to believe what he wishes.

Christy and Will, not much doubt about his beliefs. Gueye is a devout Muslim from one of the most homophobic nations on the planet. Senegal flatly outlaws homosexual contact and has been known to prosecute people for engaging in it.

This afternoon, the president of Senegal personally expressed his support for Gueye's actions and for his religious beliefs.

From the New York Times: "According to the team source with knowledge of PSG's internal conversations over the weekend, club officials had told Gueye that the team was committed to the campaign and that he had no option but wear the same jersey as the rest of his teammates if he wanted to play. When Gueye decided he would not, he was sent to the stands for the game, according to a person with knowledge of the incident."

There have been some suggestions here about bringing Gana back to Goodison this summer when he's out of contract. This would seem to eliminate that possibility.

I wouldn't pretend for a minute there's a straightforward answer, Mike. It's a huge area that would support and require huge discussion. Maybe for another time!

I will say just this for example, which reflects in no way my view of religion. If there was currently started a campaign to support the rights of people to openly practice Christianity, that required shirt messages or logos, and Gueye and other Muslims refused to wear them... I'd bet you my house they would not be forced to wear them, nor penalized.

This growing piggy-backing of "Messages" onto sport is fraught, and the compulsion to partake is not the way to get people to be more open and accepting of the various "Differences" among us.

Will, certainly there's no hard-and-fast rules about it, nor a clear line. But there's no "compulsion to partake" involved.

Gueye's employer, who pays him and provides his uniform, dictated that the players would wear a particular uniform for a game. Gueye declined and therefore did not dress. He wasn't fined, or fired, or forced to profess beliefs he does not share... just given the day off for not wearing the shirt his employer directed. It's entirely his choice. And choices have consequences.

My point is that his views would not be welcomed in the Premier League today. I don't think he can come back to Everton.

Mike, Idrissa hasn't shared any views. He's done nothing at all to offend.

I didn't raise arms against Russia. I didn't even change my Facebook profile pic to a Ukraine flag. It doesn't mean I'm pro-Russia or anti-Ukraine.

If people don't want to participate, or if they hold contrary beliefs, then why should anyone else care? As long as Idrissa is not running around shouting anti-homosexual abuse, then he's not really causing any problems.

Ernie, not true. He may have done nothing to offend you, but he certainly has offended people.

Eric Arassus, the president of France LGBT+ Sports Federation: “Idrissa Gueye is a great player, but religion is not a part of the sport. Every player took part (in the rainbow shirt initiative), except him. He should be sanctioned. Gueye's excuses show that the club (PSG) and league let homophobia happen.”

Rouge Direct, a French anti-homophobia organization: “Homophobia is not an opinion but a crime. The LFP and PSG must ask Gueye for explanations and very quickly. And sanction him if necessary.”

Travis Yoesting, footy columnist for the Houston Chronicle and The18:

"LGBTQ+ rights are human rights. Though many try to politicize the issue, human rights should not be up for political debate, just as freedom of religion should not be up for debate. If Gueye refuses to play in a uniform supporting those human rights, then he should be subject to sanctions. PSG has reportedly said it is handling the issue internally, but there has been no public statement on the matter, implying complicity.

"While Gueye could try to hide behind his faith as an excuse, the truth is every other player was fine with the rainbow colors, including many other Muslims and Christians, two religions that don't exactly have great track records when it comes to LGBTQ+ rights. In the past, Gueye has seemingly been fine wearing gambling or alcohol sponsors from his time in England with Everton and Aston Villa, but it seems LGBTQ+ rights are a step too far."

You may not agree with the views of these organizations and commentators, but they exist and are deeply felt. In many eyes, Gueye has aligned himself with intolerance and is therefore damaged goods.

Genuinely what has he done or not done?

I haven't looked.

As it happens, I don't think Gueye was coming back to Everton anyway. Why do we always want our old players back?

And anyway, if he doesn't like the rainbow shirt he should hear how his name is pronounced.

More seriously, I'm glad his teammates (including other Muslims) just got on with it. Surely the sport should be past all this by now. Ridiculous that the young lad at Blackpool coming out is even a story in this day and age.

Congratulations on your lack of tolerance. One man's silent and peaceful stance (did he broadcast any view or announce anything?) has led to people criticising and discrediting him with the "oh, he wore alcohol and gambling sponsors". Let's not pretend those comments are anything else... They're designed to claim he's not even a good Muslim so he must just hate gay people. And you're repeating them!

And Mike, I still don't see any offence in those releases. I see righteousness, which isn't the same. They want him flogged for not participating in what they want him to participate in.

I don't care what people do. They're all fine to me. Equal rights for all? Absolutely. Gay marriage, why not?

Is it great that we have campaigns to support a range of different forms of discrimination? Absolutely.

But a Muslim doesn't want to align himself with the LGBTQIA+ movement? Okay, well keep it to yourself, treat people fairly, and we won't have an issue.

I just don't see the offence he could possibly cause, unless people are desperately trying to find something to be offended about. He said and did literally nothing!

Ah yes. Freedom shall consist in the freedom to agree with us. Because we're right, as every decent person knows.

So goes the slippery, lethal, modern liberal mind.

Ernie,

Amen to that, live and let live.

So Gueye didn't join in on something others were supporting? I don't join the media bandwagon of supporting Liverpool. Okay, for me that's genetic, but you get my point.

I'm all for a free society and freedom of choice of opinion - obviously within reason. I've been to parts of the world where they simply haven't and still don't have that freedom.

Otherwise we'd all vote for the same political party and support the same football team. Simplistic view, but probably not far off. If it's not his thing, it's not his thing. It doesn't make him a bigot.

It's like the knee thing. Why is it excepted and people get outraged if individuals don't choose to do it? Why is it expected? And before anyone kicks off, do not accuse me of being biased other than my allegiance to Everton.

We have become a very outraged society, influenced by a liberal media. Outraged by things that really shouldn't bother us. We call it courage and I get that. It takes a lot of courage to come out, using the Blackpool player as an example.

But when you've seen young lads physically vomiting, crying and having to be convinced they need to walk out of the gate in Sangin, Helmand Province because they saw what happened to their mates 2 days ago it puts courage into perspective.

Sorry if that sounds dramatic and I know courage comes in different forms, but this society of ours is really concerning me.

Not as much as Everton, but it still frustrates me.

Wasn't Idrissa the only Gueye in the Villa at one time?

There was a time when football was a break from what was going on in the World, where now it's very much embroiled in everything that is going on in the World.

I have never been concerned over a player's religious beliefs or his political beliefs, or his opinion on anything; all I was concerned with was his performance in a Blue shirt. But now we have nation states owning football clubs and many have appalling human rights issues which should have precluded them ever having ownership of a club in this country.

We have other owners whose wealth and where it came from has also been questioned, but again the powers that be thought it would be right for these people to have ownership of clubs.

Now money is the over-riding factor in owning a football club, and while money is exceptionally important for someone wanting to own a football club, it shouldn't be at the exclusion of other issues that are more important than just money.

I know we can't turn the clock back but it worries me just where football is going, players are becoming even richer while the fans paying to watch are becoming poorer.

It's not where football is going Brian. It's where football has gone.

Now, for balance, the Sir John Moores backed Merseyside Millionaires can't cry wolf too loud.

But in the past decades, it has taken a more sinister turn. Basically, we now have nation state backed clubs even if that has been by proxy.

I have literally thought of this as I'm typing, so no context, but given what I've just typed, I wonder if the politics is influencing the perceived corruption?

And I'm talking at Premier League level. FIFA and UEFA have been corrupt for as long as I can remember.

I think some are missing an important point regarding Gueye, he is a role model that many will look up to or could be used as a justification for others' intolerance or homophobia.

Therein lies the problem of high profile role models and their responsibility. They have ridiculously high pay, their every word or action is documented and analyzed, media slants put on every action.

In short, they are not their own people, they are not you or me, whose views mean little to anyone outside our circle. It's why organisation's employ PR to carry the message, whatever it is, to a hungry audience. It's done to mitigate any damage to a player's or a club's reputation.

Danny,

I am not against wealthy people owning football clubs, I just question how they earned that money.

You mention Sir John Moores… well, everybody knew were his wealth came from and, unlike many of today's owners, he paid taxes in this country. Sir John built his business by selling football pools coupons initially in Manchester and then the business grew through hard work into making Sir John one of the wealthiest men in the country.

Also, Sir John didn't plough millions into the club like Abramovich did at Chelsea; Sir John loaned Everton money to buy players on interest-free loans, which was all paid back to him.

So yes, we were called the Mersey Millionaires but the club were financially sound and never in debt, so I have no embarrassment over how the then owner obtained his wealth or how the club was allowed to prosper under his stewardship.

Brian, selfishly I prefer to try not to worry about it.

I obviously do, but if it got too far, I fear my love of sports would be over.

I'll be hoping Anthony Joshua can find a way against Usyk when they participate in a blatant sportswashing event in Saudi Arabia.

Everton are backed by whoever lurks in the background but on Thursday and Sunday that won't be on my mind.

It's not right though.

Christine, I always respect your views.

But to counter your post, where is the line on enforced compliance?

There is a fine line between tolerance and enforcement.

I'm a tolerant person who will give my view and respect those of others regardless of whether they agree with me or not. But I won't impose it on someone.

Otherwise everyone would be an Evertonian.

I find Liberalism interesting. Portrayed as tolerant and nicey-nicey. Until someone disagrees with them. Then they get nasty and outraged.

Christine, I understand and agree with that.

Except Gueye didn't say or do anything. He's being attacked for not doing something. He hasn't expressed any view for people to follow.

That's wrong. The media and, let's be honest, the LGBTQIA+ mafia, are on a mission. They'll ruin this kid based on his religion, and all in the name of tolerance. So it's okay then.

Ernie, Dave, shoe on the other foot. The LGBT community would tell you that they are beaten, killed and discriminated for being who they are.

They don't have to do anything to anyone, their very existence offends some, even without as you say, saying or literally doing anything. That's the society we live in.

As much as one may believe in live and let live, there is a significant wedge of society that don't believe that.

I fully support Gueye's stance on not wearing the LGBT rainbow colours. LGBTQ is an artificial construct with an agenda only to advance activism in those fields.

As a Muslim, he is absolutely entitled to refuse to comply as all of the components are haram. Ridiculous of course but he must be allowed to exercise his religious rights.

I'd switch the TV off if the screen was full of rainbows (is that LGBTQ or NHS rainbow?)

I refuse to watch players taking the knee at the start of a game too, the point was made long ago but is a joke now. They are fully entitled to do it of course.

Danny, I agree, but no matter what law is passed by any government, it's either accepted by the many or seen as enforced compliance by the few. It's democracy. Don't like the law, change the government.

Ernie, that's the very point I was trying to make, by him refusing to wear the shirt, the situation and message should have been managed. Instead, you end up with wild speculation by anyone and everyone including media and social networks, which is totally out of proportion, hurting the player and club.

I respect him for his belief and his choice but people in the limelight have everything they do or don't do dissected for different agendas.

Sorry Christine, I can't agree with that at all.

We are a very tolerant society. Very much more so than the one I grew up in during the 70s and 80s.

Yes, there are still idiots but they are generally the exception. I live in arguably the most multi-cultural city on the planet. I coached lads from west African, Somalian, Irish and Kazakhstani backgrounds as well as those from the local council estates. Never any issues in building them into a team. Contrary to perceptions, even in the military I would absolutely claim it to be one of the most accepting organisations of diversity since the 90s. We've moved on but some can't accept it and still look for faults.

There are places in the world we have both probably been to that are genuinely not tolerant (I won't list them), but where you and I live are not one of them.

We are letting the BBC led liberal outrage at just about everything take over the world. It doesn't mean we should not always strive for improvement, but we also shouldn't beat ourselves up about different opinions, and the progress we have made.

Especially when nothing has been said or done, as is the situation here. He chose not to participate. That's it for me.

Christine - that's completely valid. Raise awareness, push for better protections, educate. There are so many good things happening. We're living in a period of unprecedented change...

But this is vengeful beating up of the guy who didn't do anything. He's an easy target. Who's going to help the black Muslim kid?

I respect your view, Danny, and in general terms, I agree with it. Most people aren't bothered and are extremely tolerant of difference. Sadly as you say, there is a section that is intolerant, be it homophobia or racism.

As I said, I respect Gueye's decision, but as a club, it should have been managed better.

Ernie, totally agree, as above in my reply to Danny, the message or lack of it should have been managed to prevent damage to Gueye or the club.

Why have PSG decided to use their players' shirt numbers to 'supposedly' support the LGBT agenda? I abhor homophobia but it seems weirdly hypocritical for a club owned by an emir of an extremely homophobic state to be doing this.

I respect Idrissa Gueye's beliefs and people are saying he has burnt his bridges in respect of any potential return even to the Premier League. However, his beliefs are no different to what they were before, and by extension therefore he potentially could have been sanctioned for them before.

So this liberal anti-Gueye stance is simply not right, whether you agree with him or not.

In my opinion.

Agree, this is not a religious issue.

The issue here is what defines a proactive action, in relation to the club's definition of discrimination.

For example, if the club required that all employees undertake mandatory training on discrimination per their Code of Conduct, then Gueye would be in breach of contract by refusing to take part.

Standard employment contracts require workers to comply with the company's policies and procedures, such as mandatory training. Of course, the legality of that can only be tested via case law.

My own take on it is that he has not breached his terms of employment unless PSG's policies set out clear guidelines on the dress code, ie, wear what we require of you on a case by case basis. I doubt that is the case.

Without having read PSG's D&I policy, he has probably breached the intent of the policy if not the legal wording. Given that means he is not aligned with the values, behaviour and culture of his employer, that might lead them to decide he should continue his career elsewhere.

Everyone has equal rights under the law as they have equal rights to say yes or no, according to their personnel beliefs to what they are asked to do. The latter is broadly recognised in the right to religious or belief freedoms in most civilised societies and taken account of in lawful decisions.

Of course there are attempts to fudge this when it does not suit certain parties with different agendas. Particularly where there is media backing and a reluctance to accept No as meaning No.

Gueye has the right to say no and the right to expect his decision will be respected.

Doesn't it say everything you need to know about the performative nature of the game's anti-homophobia stance that, despite all the rainbow laces and three cheers for Jake Daniels smuggery, he's the first active professional footballer in the world to come out?

Clearly football is a hostile environment to be gay – although, interestingly, not lesbian as there are a number of out players in the womens game – despite all the rainbows and rhetoric.

And Gareth Southgate saying the group are so supportive of gay rights that they will make their feelings known at the World Cup (more rainbow laces I presume), is not stopping them going to the homophobic host country is it?

Gueye supposedly not wanting to wear a rainbow number on his shirt because his magic pixie in the sky tells him homosexuality is wrong is pretty irrelevant because this is all just virtue signalling anyway.

Meanwhile, not a dickie bird was said when the Spurs crowd loudly and consistently sang "Yid Army" in their local derby last week. I know they use the excuse of "It's a Jewish club and we're reclaiming the insult", but that is utter bollocks. I would imagine only about 5% (if that) of the Spurs support is Jewish, so it's a bit like me singing "Nigger Army" at Everton because I once saw a black fan in the crowd.

Everyone is entitled to their views, I'm Irish Catholic, but I'm able to make up my own mind and totally disgusted with our church over issues regarding sexuality, people being discriminated and abused because of their sexuality is wrong.

Gueye refused to play for his club because the rainbow colours on his jersey, which was to highlight antihomophobia, that's nothing to do with religion, it shows he has no respect for those people, and for people to come on here and say he's entitled to say no, and should be respected for it, shows how you believe also.

Does Gueye also refuse to take the knee before games? If not, and he picks and chooses the political statements to participate in then it shows something about his beliefs.

If he doesn't participate in any, then he can't really be criticised.

Christy, being Liverpool Irish Catholic, I totally endorse the abhorrent stance our church has taken, but there will be millions who will not see it that way because the Pope told them so. We are assuming Gueye has taken a similar stance because of his religion, and what he is told by his religious leaders.

The problem of course is that the church and its leaders change views over generations, what was a mortal sin then is okay now… at the whim of a leader?

So you, me may or may not be good Catholics by not agreeing with everything we are instructed to believe. Thousands adhere to religious interpretations… Gueye is probably no different. I don't agree with his decision but I respect it is his to make.

Reflection always a good thing..as I said before.. this discussion best had over several drinks! Me done...

It's great, isn't it, being lectured to by the owners of football on what are the appropriate cultural norms to adopt? But make sure you only jump when asked.

No awkward questions when the circus turns up in Qatar later this year… Watch that grandstanding pillock Southgate say not one fucking word about his feelings then.

They can all shove it. A person's politics or religion are a private matter, progressives don't get to bully everyone else into line all the time.

Christine,

There is no reflection at Everton FC it is patently obvious all the Mirrors have been smashed.

It shows he has no respect for those people, and for people to come on here and say he's entitled to say no, and should be respected for it, shows how you believe also.

You're making too many assumptions in the statement I've cut and pasted above. You know nothing about how Gueye feels towards "those people" and you know nothing about whether "it shows how you believe also."

You've made up your mind on what you think, not what you know. Always a dodgy stance.

Given that there are 73 professional clubs, each of which will have squads (including youth etc) of about 30 players and 2% of the population is gay - it means that there are always roughly 45 gay professional footballers in the UK at any one time.

Since I can only think of the kid at Blackpool and the US player at Leeds a few years ago who were 'out' while playing, there's obviously an issue.

I said earlier that Gueye has been fairly restrained about it all - so these comments aren't really directed at him but football generally.

I heard an interview with Ian Holloway about it a few years ago in which he said something like he hoped players would come out and be themselves because it's not nice to be alone. I liked that.

Souness (for all he is a massive bellend) has also made encouraging remarks.

Gay kids got loads of grief when I was at school and homophobic abuse was the insult of choice generally. I feel ashamed of my own use of this kind of language in the past when it was just 'banter'. Hopefully it's improved in schools. Football is really far behind though - so I guess the liberal press / woke brigade etc aren't so forceful as is made out.

Anyway, we can all continue to disagree in the close season perhaps. There's a big game coming.

Robert, given the number of and widespread distribution of openly gay men I think the issue is more one of "Oh, really. Who cares? Isn't there anything more interesting about you than that?" nowadays, far more than of hostility.

My reaction to the Blackpool footballer was more: "Is this another Rashford or DCL whose agent has told him to try to boost his career and earning power through something other than talent?"

BLM is being exposed as a large scale scam with the leaders distributing the funds to family (a bit like the Bidens and Clintons) - but the EPL continues to require absolute obedience before each match.

Idrissa Gueye is perfectly right to resist being made to show support for something which (I suppose) he has no time for.

I would hope that most people would refuse to wear outward emblems of support for any cause if the reason for wearing them was authority imposed diktat and not personal choice, even if they supported the cause.

I like your opening statement @25, Christy, and your comments on the wrongs of discrimination, but would disagree with your accusative closing remarks.

I have thought for some time that a whole bunch of gay players would probably join together and make their announcement as a group rather than perhaps individually. On reflection, that idea would have probably got more attention.

Fair play to Jake. Good timing too. As for Idrissa Gueye, love to see him back at Everton.

Charles # 36, society has moved on as you say, but I don't believe football has particularly.

A lot of people won't bat an eyelid at the Jake Daniels thing, true, and that's probably a good thing. But I'd agree with you more if there were hundreds of other examples going back many years. There aren't though. Like I say I can only think of two. Fashanu too, I guess (before my time) and he killed himself didn't he?

Ian Jones 43 exactly my thought as well. In fact I anticipate a group of players to come out during the World Cup in Qatar. Would there be a better opportunity than to do it in a Country who does not allow it and everybody is watching.

He absolutely has the right not to endorse a political message he doesn't agree with.

In the same way James Maclean had the right not to wear the poppy.

Funnily enough a lot of those criticising Gueye would support Maclean and vice versa.

Given that Gana has not broken the law in relation to this issue, the only criterion that I consider relevant to whether Gana might return to Everton, is whether he'd be of significant benefit to us on the pitch. If the assessment is not, then he shouldn't return, but if the assessment is that he would, then a return to Everton would be good.

We could certainly do with him at the moment!

From the BBC website

"Crystal Palace's Cheikhou Kouyate and Watford's Ismaila Sarr have posted on social media in apparent support of their Senegal team-mate's stance.

Kouyate posted a picture of himself alongside Gueye on Instagram, with a caption calling Gueye "a real man". Watford winger Sarr posted a picture of him and Gueye accompanied by three heart emojis and the caption "100%"."

So the question of whether Idrissa would be welcome back in the prem is an open question.

Charles #41, are you really of the opinion that coming out as gay is a lucrative career move?

And more to the point, why do you doubt Daniels' honesty when he says he came out so he wouldn't have to live a lie?

Why do you ascribe a crass profit motive to it?

And by the way, your own crass political cracks look pretty hypocritical, considering the presidential family you undoubtedly support lined its collective pockets to the tune of over a billion dollars in four corrupt years. The Trump Organization directly skimmed $151 million in taxpayer revenue just for Bleach Boy's golf vacations, and Jivanka reported $500 million income and a $500 million real estate bailout loan from business activities inside the White House itself. So slide your political slant someplace else.

Charles,

Out of interest, do you support Kapernick's right not to stand for the National Anthem?

A world without hatred seems impossible, and so does a world where people can live and let live.

I worry for mankind, because slowly but surely, free thinking is getting eradicated imo. Hopefully Gana Gueye gives his reason for not wanting to wear the rainbow colours, because he always came across as a very hard working and respectful human-being, whenever he represented Everton, and his opinion might not be fueled by hatred.

Mike Gaynes@7 My feeling about that quote is that there are no such thing as LGBTQ or even human "rights". Rights are confused with privileges afforded to any group by the rest of humanity. If individuals have rights then society at large does too.

With regard to the issue under discussion, if the player is not forbidden to refuse to wear the number by his contract or by law then he can refuse to wear it. Because of religion? Isn't it sad that it still exists in the 21st century?

Wow, we've gone already from whether Gueye was right to wear a slogan / emblem he doesn't want to the full on “Biden vs Trump” shite already. Exactly why all politics should be kept out of sport.

The world is dividing into two very entrenched camps. One that believes in big government, globalist socialism, enforced woke ideology and that both social media and the general people need to be ruled and governed. The other are often nationalistic, anti-New World Order, low rules, capitalist, believe wokism has lines, and support free speech (even if offensive).

Apparently one is called a “liberal” but I got no fucking clue anymore which or why? To most in one of those camps, the others a Nazi, Commie, Fascist, or something else filled with hatred. The merest mention or sniff and they're all over it (à la Mike). Funnily enough demonstrating their own prejudices and intolerance.

It'd be a hope too far to say “keep all the political shit” out of football altogether. It's even a hope too far to ask it to stay off these forums… but how about some mutual respect? If Gana wants to not wear something, good luck to him. If someone wants to criticise him for doing so, fill yer boots.

I agree Gueye has the right to refuse to wear the kit as it was not specified in his contract. I reserve the right to despise him as he has disqualified himself from the set of people who deserve any consideration. Should he choose to come to the mic and explain I will reconsider my position, until then Bye-ya Gueye.

And Gary, you've not exacty set yourself up as an arbitrator on this matter. Show some patience for others to say what they want. Then slam them if you see fit, whatever.

Gary #54 You have my vote.

Dale your post is a good example of cancel culture in action. Set up a test, force everyone to obey upon pain of ostracism. What a lovely tolerant society. This is the thin end of the wedge, in a couple of years it will be in Gueye's contract that he has to bend the knee, on pain of cancellation. And onwards we move to a more tolerant society, sort of.

Martin 52

So I don't have a human right to expression, freedom from political imprisonment, freedom from torture, right to equality before the law etc etc

I'm expected to see that as a privilege?

Catch your self on feller.

Robert #40 talking about "the woke brigade", there's a hilarious James O'Brien interview with somebody who is anti-woke.

Link

Dale, I waited over 50 posts, and until the entrenched views started to do what they absolutely always do……veer off onto an ever widening attack on each other's tranches.

How many posts would be “showing patience” in your view? When are you arbitrating that I am allowed to express my view to “stay on the subject and don't slip into entrenched” stone throwing?

Gary #54, not exactly a great example of keeping politics out of sport right there.

In my view, politics is a part of every aspect of life today.

And if the Gueye situation wasn't a political issue, his nation's president and politicians wouldn't have inserted themselves into the debate. Clearly it is.

Kevin, well said. Dale's even attacking those who try to “arbitrate”… how dare anyone just not do as Dale thinks they should.

Absolute Nazis the lot… cancel them!!! SMH.

It's the summary overview that I was choking on Gary. I have no problem with your posts as long as you can bear the response.

Kevin, where did I cancel Gueye? What the hell is that about. I have a right to support whatever I wish just like Gueye don't I? Idrissa doesn't want to wear a particular kit and reveals a dimension of himself that I don't support and I take a proportionate action in response.

I think you're using 'cancel culture' to mean what you want it to mean in a rather fluid way that really isn't how English is supposed to be used. But I'm a colonial, what do I know?

Gary, are you really going to recycle that sad Vlad Nazi thing? Cmon, maaaaaaan. I thought you had better material than that.

By the way, watch yourself. It's a slow day at work and I have time for this. Your move.

I'm very disappointed that nobody acknowledged Peter Carpenter's post.

Going off on a tangent. We lost the media in the early 60s that lot had a Panorama special about how bloody wonderful the Kop was. We were being g demonised for smashing up football specials. ( not that there was much to smash up )
So now it's former Everton player blah blah blah what the hell has this got to do with us ?
I'm expecting former Gwladys St season ticket holder, Fred West, buried lots of people under his patio.
Guess it's inevitable...they are the Prince Charmings we have to be the Ugly Sisters.

Shane, you're right. It went over my head as I was scrolling through, but it's a gem of a pun.

Dale - you've embarrassed yourself enough already. Cant even answer simple questions.

Mike - unfortunately, to those in the trenches, EVERYTHING is about furthering their political cause. The fact you and Dale are both jumping on someone trying to say “keep on subject” shows just how pathetically deep seated the idealisms are. Sad.

I log onto ToffeeWeb and with the threat of relegation and a vital 3 points tomorrow I find Evertonians dominating the posts with arguments over Idrissa Gueye sticking to his principles. OMG we are supposed to be together not scoring points about political correctness.

Brent - anyone who quotes an Obrian radio interview as ‘funny' is at least a little bizarre.

I'll raise you……

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