Bill, now it really is time to go

by   |   24/06/2022  251 Comments  [Jump to last]

There is a litany of calumnies against the Everton Chairman, Bill Kenwright – bad things that he has done over the many years during which he has been the prime custodian of Everton FC, but he still remains in place.

Perhaps the most comprehensive charge sheet was produced years ago by one of our readers, Colin Fitzpatrick: I'm more concerned about Everton.... It's a long-read so I'll itemize some key concerns here:

• Leveraged buyout of Peter Johnson, hidden in Other Operating Costs

• Advance spending of the never-to-materialise NTL media money

• Abysmal signings such as Alex Nyarko (5-year contract but on a 4-year work permit)

• Goodison Park would soon fail to get its safety certificate (back in 2007!)

• Sale at a knock-down price of arguably Everton's greatest talent of the modern era: Wayne Rooney.

• Failure to secure £30M funding for the Kings Dock stadium

• CEO Trevor Birch: ‘an insolvency practitioner who infamously lasted just 6 weeks before leaving‘

• Samuelson's Fortress Sports Fund and “the money will be in the bank tomorrow”

• The shady involvement of ‘shadow director' Sir Phillip Green

• Sale and rent back of purpose-built Finch Farm at £1M/year

• A myriad of lies over Destination Kirkby, finally exposed by KEIOC

Since that time (an astounding 12 years go!) the list has only got longer (well, it could hardly go the other way!)

• The shocking appointments of Sam Allardyce, then Rafa Benitez on his watch

• Jobs for the Boys at Finch Farm: Ferguson, Unsworth, Ebbrell, Tait, Baxter, Jeffers…

• Little Miss Dynamite installed as CEO in a blatant bout of virtue signalling

Some of our other posters seem to have made it their life's mission to do down the theatre impresario at every turn — so much so that their posts on any thread are likely to degenerate into a stream of frothing invective against the man for his crimes against humanity — or at least the Evertonian faction thereof.

The problem I see is two-fold: Such diatribes have the appearance of a lasting and unalloyed obsession, which immediately puts a lot of people off, and the corollary of this is that there is no real solution provided. Yes, he has to go, that would be a solution… but how? How does a man like him get removed from his post? How can the significant cadre of Evertonians who simply cannot stand him finally see their wishes come true?

Well, a while ago, he was reported to be old and sick. That was enough to tempt some to believe that the time was near and a natural solution would be found in the form of his untimely demise, or at least that he would be sick enough to step down. Not a bit of it. Despite being older, he seems not quite so sick. If that was a stalling or deflectionary tactic, it worked a treat and has given him to date another 5 to 10 years in post, but cleverly now too fragile to be challenged? “On death's door…” No, I don't think so.

What if he was to be bought out by new owners? Sorry but he's pulled a fast one there too with the ever-generous Farhad Moshiri not only buying down Kenwright's shares to a ‘paltry' 1.26% — and paying him an incredible £55 million in the process. Surprisingly, Moshiri thought he could get away with putting in just 5% of his time into running the club as he agreed to retain Kenwright in the exact same position and role within Everton Football Club – ‘looking after' the business for him. Stymied again.

Now none of the above litany of crimes have ever been refuted by Kenwright or the club or his supporters. Some foolishly think that means it's all true and he's guilty as charged, and needs to go: Kenwright Out!

Well, sorry but it's just not as simple as that. He remains the Chairman of the Board of Directors of Everton FC Co Ltd. He has hardly any shares really — although it would probably cost you a cool £5 Million to buy him out if the going rate of £3,000 per share is accurate.

And realistically, that is pretty much the only way this will end. If a different new owner comes in and finally terminates his disastrous spell as the leading figure who has overseen the abysmal decline of this once-great club to its pathetic current state.

Let's face it: he's not going to go simply because one or two keyboard warriors on an obscure independent Everton website that isn't even a part of the Everton Supporters Stakeholder Group (ESSG) keep trying to tell us how awful he has been for every aspect of the club — from terrible transfers and ridiculous recruitment to mad manager selection and the abysmal Academy — and how nothing will ever improve while he remains anything at all to do with EFC.

So what do we do as fans? How do we oust the luvvie limpet? Do we just wait for the latest round of takeover rumours to play out, and hope eternal that he will finally go?

Or do we initiate a proactive campaign — one that will not rest until he has gone. If so, then what are the elements of that campaign, how will it be executed, and what are the measures of it being successful in precipitating the change that is needed to rid the club of this man and finally move us forward?

Obviously his removal would be the required measure of success but, by that measure alone, all the wailing and gnashing of teeth has been for nought because he is still here.

So come on, you posters who obsess about him on seemingly every thread, let's have some concrete ideas. Let's have some real action. Let's see a fan group set up, coordinated and going into action to achieve this goal.

Quite simply: put up or shut up.

I'll finish this plea with a quote from Colin Fitzpatrick which is of course still highly pertinent after 12 mostly painful years:

Too many Evertonians are ambivalent when it comes to identifying the root cause of our problem; unlike at other clubs where supporters actually care enough to do something, to get involved, too many Evertonians do nothing and allow this perpetual state of mediocrity to exist.

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Reader Comments (251)

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Mike Gaynes
1 Posted 23/06/2022 at 04:44:10

I'm impressed with the dedication (obsession?) required to post varying versions of the same message... time after time after time... year after year after year... no matter the subject under discussion.

Don Alexander
2 Posted 24/06/2022 at 01:45:03

Some of us still unable to address the problem at our hub may get a grasp of the decades-long abject reality in our boardroom. Kenwright prevails because of fan-based indolence after all.

The piece by Colin Fitzpatrick is 12 years old. As far as I'm concerned, it was 100% on the money then, and since then Kenwright's presence has reduced us to even lower levels. For Christ's sake, he's had 95% control after his horrible period with 100% control – the subject of the above.

When are Evertonians going to collectively act together to rid our club of a useless, self-promoting perpetually ingenuous "leader"?

Kieran Kinsella
3 Posted 24/06/2022 at 02:50:56

Colin Fitzpatrick makes Jay Woods (BRZ) succinct. Please don't quote him in full again without a fair warning.

Don Alexander
4 Posted 24/06/2022 at 03:42:41
Keiran, given the mess we're in now and for seasons to come given the ineptitude of Kenwright/Moshiri I'm sure the pair of them would just love to support your apparent wish to suppress discussion of the major dysfunction of Kenwright's "leadership" for decades.

"Kenwright's crap" is a very easy knee-jerk comment he can knee-jerk defend.

Searchingly forensic questions posed by Mr Fitzpatrick twelve years ago are way more problematic for the shyster. Hence no response from him at all.

He basks in our enduring complacency whilst we now go on and on about signing a bog standard Spurs reserve.

It's music to his ears.

Kieran Kinsella
5 Posted 24/06/2022 at 04:17:06

I share your loathing, I just don’t have the attention span to read War and Peace length posts lol

Laurie Hartley
6 Posted 24/06/2022 at 05:08:36
Well Kieran I read it in full and I applaud Don for posting it. I left England for Australia in 1973 and have to admit I took very little interest in anything other than our results on the pitch. I do recall, however, my late father’s abject disappointment when the Kings Dock plan fell through.

Last season I called for the removal of messrs Kenwright, DBB, and Brands because of the ongoing demise of our once great club. Having read that post I now understand the reason for Don’s ongoing campaign against our chairman. Bill Kenwright is the constant in our steady decline over the past 30 years.

If I still lived on merseyside I would be willing to walk round Goodison for 7 days with Don holding a placard proclaiming “KENWRIGHT OUT”.

As far as Harry Winks is concerned I wouldn’t touch him with a barge pole for no other reason than if we signed him then we would be helping Levi and Conte improve their squad by providing them with millions of dollars we don’t have.

I have an old fashioned approach to such matters - never arm your enemies. That is what we do every time we buy a player our enemies don’t want. Who are our enemies? - the other 19 teams in the premier league. We should be shopping elsewhere unless we come across a club in the same situation we currently find ourselves in - having to sell our best players.

Christine Foster
7 Posted 24/06/2022 at 06:41:30

It should have been framed and nailed to the entrance in Goodison Park. Time allows people the ability to smooth over the edges. For many years a number of posters, including myself, from around 2006 on, would go toe to toe with those who supported the shameless phoney.

Exposed for what he is, so many times over the years, I do not believe one single word he says. I never have since Kirkby, since Green, since Earl, since the deceitful premise of the vote to leave Goodison.

I had a running battle with Richard Dodd (aka Doddy), that ran for years. I was proud that Colin and the KEIOC exposed for all to see the lies and the con.

The very fact the man is still chairman fills me with disgust. Until he has gone we are in trouble... so he can stick his strategic review where the sun don't shine. Only one move will improve the future, sadly he is still looking to entrench his position, whoever the next mug is.

In truth, to hell with those who say "be careful what you wish for" because singly-handedly he has been responsible for the abysmal leadership of our once great club.

I stopped writing articles when Moshiri came on board as I saw it as pointless. The puppet master is still pulling the strings and laughing at every single one of us. Unforgivable... yet some still, still think he is to be admired.

Tony Abrahams
8 Posted 24/06/2022 at 07:39:19
“Until the man has gone, we are in trouble” – say no more Christine.

I was talking to a man who was instrumental in KEIOC yesterday, and he was telling me that he'd heard that some Saudis (the day before the Leicester game) were looking at Everton, but wouldn't be making a move until Everton had pulled themselves to safety.

It's going to be speculation time, but until that man Kenwright has gone, Everton Football Club, will never move forward in my opinion, with it being obvious that he's waiting for our new stadium to open, so he can once again vainly take the limelight!

Tony Abrahams
9 Posted 24/06/2022 at 07:50:10
The biggest worry I had when I heard about these Saudis yesterday was what a few people have posted on ToffeeWeb over these past few weeks.

We should demand the removal of both Moshiri and Kenwright because, if these two stay on, it's obvious that Kenwright will have advised Moshiri to play his greatest trick once again. It's now definitely time for Everton to move forward and become a ruthless “professional outfit” once again.

This KEIOC fella also told me that Barrett-Baxendale is a very clever lady, and also a very passionate Evertonian, but also agreed that she's definitely not CEO material. And he then smiled when I said I've often thought Bill Kenwright was a Liverpool fan, telling me it isn't the first time that a genuine Evertonian has uttered those words to him.

I'm probably wrong about Kenwright, but how could I have such thoughts in the first place?

Andy Meighan
10 Posted 24/06/2022 at 07:58:54

Only just seen your post and the original Colin Fitzpatrick article. Absolutely brilliant.

As time passes, one seems to forget a lot of what's gone on in the past. How the man is still in situ is a complete mystery.

And wasn't this the same man who had serious health problems only a few short years ago? Not that I'm wishing illness on the man, far from it. It just baffles me that he's still roaming the corridors larger than life. No wonder we are the shit show we are.

And your piece certainly highlighted that. I applaud you for that post. Fantastic.

Danny O’Neill
11 Posted 24/06/2022 at 08:29:09
A takeover is always going to throw speculation and uncertainty into the fold, Tony. We all thought we'd hit gold when Moshiri landed.

The one constant over the years has been our current Chairman. Now I've never been as venomous as some but his time was done years ago; especially when Moshiri took over. That is Moshiri's biggest failing in my opinion. Leaving him effectively in charge rather than implementing change.

Change and new owners offer opportunity and risk. The Kenyon-US consortium may potentially be more ruthless and run us like a business. Could that rip the soul out of the club? I don't think we would let that happen. I'd like to see us more ruthless, less cosy and more effective off the pitch as much as on it. But it could impact on some of the things we cherish.

It could see ticket prices rise, which I think is an area the club has done well in even if it has been to the detriment of income. But then we complain about our lack of marketing strategy and brand building, so we can't have it both ways. There is always a balance.

The Saudis offer a whole new politically charged moral dilemma. I won't go there.

But then without wanting to get controversial, I do find the outrage over Russian owners and backers since the invasion of Ukraine sort of ironic. They've always been shady and intrinsically linked to the totalitarian regime that invaded Georgia in 2008, annexed the Crimea in 2014, has been fighting a proxy war in eastern Ukraine since the same year, pretty much ignored by the West, was probably behind or contributed to a passenger aircraft being downed over Ukraine, poisoned two of its own citizens in an attempted murder on UK soil.

Sorry, I didn't mean to get political. But my main point is moral high ground. I didn't hear many complaints from supporters or the Premier League until the understandable outrage this year. But why didn't it come sooner?

Anyway, regardless of who takes over Everton, and if they do, and when, we need change. As with any change, we may lose some of the things we hold dear. But we need change. Starting in that board room.

That's why I was encouraged by the reports from Kenyon's consortium in apparently not entertaining suggestions that Kenwright wants to stay on. That's the deal he cut last time. Let's hope the next owners are made of sterner stuff and don't buy the sentimental bullshit. Just appoint me if that's what you want.

Brian Williams
12 Posted 24/06/2022 at 08:54:02

I think you've probably hit the nail on the head when you say Kenwright is hanging on to take some glory when we move to the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock.

Then I had a scary thought: What if he enjoys things so much there, he decides to stay on?

Gerard McKean
13 Posted 24/06/2022 at 09:03:28
Thank you, Don, for reminding us of Colin Fitzpatrick's demolition of the Kenwright myth. The golden opportunity that was missed at Kings Dock makes it difficult for me to understand how he's still at our club and why some people apparently still support him.

Tony, your KEIOC mate is right that Barrett-Baxendale is clever, but only in the sense of being street wise enough to know who to snuggle up to (Kenwright & Carter) and who to shaft (Elstone). He is absolutely right that she is not up to a CEO role, although she would no doubt argue that she came to EFC from a CEO role – albeit a very grand title for the only full-time employee of a very minor “charity” trust.

I suppose he could also be right about her being a passionate Evertonian but only in the same way that anyone believes Kenwright is a lifelong Blue who was with Eddie Kavanagh at Wembley in 1966.

She has used the Kenwright playbook to create a backstory that places her much closer to the club than she ever was. How convenient that she was able to reveal spontaneously after much research(!) that her favourite player growing up is now her fellow board member.

Brian Harrison
14 Posted 24/06/2022 at 09:12:30
I know that, whatever topic is discussed on T/W, it always mentions Kenwright, and such are the feelings of some supporters that he should step down from the board.

I don't care whether Kenwright goes or not, the most important people at any football club are the manager and the owner – everybody else is just on the periphery of things.

Let's be honest: the Usmanov - Moshiri ownership didn't want to be hands-on and therefore it suited them to let Kenwright carry on. So hopefully the new owners will be more hands-on and will appoint their own CEO.

I know Usmanov has bought the first option on naming rights, so do Everton give him back his £30 million or do we let him name the new stadium? We have had 2 great managers and 1 great chairman in the last 70 years, so maybe the 4 new stands should have their names on them?

I know Howard Kendall has already had a stand named after him but no Catterick or Sir John Moores stand… and maybe a Dixie Dean stand wouldn't go amiss. I don't want Carter's name or Kenwright's anywhere on our new stadium – both are liars.

As for Moshiri holding on to 10 or 20% of his shareholding, as has been suggested, definitely No. You had your time and it's been a disaster. I don't want you anywhere near our club.

Tony Hill
15 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:18:07
He'll go if proper new owners come in and deprive him of influence. He can simply be removed from the board. The fans have no influence in reality at this stage of events.
Brian Murray
16 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:18:30
I've said on too many occasions that Evertonians are a strange bunch who are far too passive and still crave a Top 6 Moyes mentality. Even those of us who saw the 1969 and the 1980s dominance.

We need a massive protest on the lines of the awesome last few weeks of the season with no hiding behind bullshit quotes, "He's one of us" etc. The 1878 Originals etc — please take note and act now or soon as.

Them other shower wouldn't let it go until they ousted them two yanks (more's the pity). Same with the Man Utd fans to this day.

Paul Hewitt
17 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:24:12
It amazes me how people still blame Bill for everything that goes wrong. I can't wait for him to go… and then see which other poor sod is blamed.
Mike Gaynes
18 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:27:30
Superlative commentary, Michael. Covers it for me, word for word. Through 15 years on TW, I've read a gazillion calls for the fans to rise up and oust Kenwright, and never a single solid suggestion as to how that would work if Kenwright didn't want to go (which he certainly doesn't).

Regarding your final quote from Colin's old column, which was written in reply to a query from me: "...unlike at other clubs where supporters actually care enough to do something ..." I have two questions for you.

1. Has it ever happened that the supporters of a large English club actually did force out a bad owner by sheer force of public opinion?

2. Do you believe that the lack of such action by Everton fans may reflect a higher regard for Kenwright, or at least a lesser level of loathing, among the fan base at large than on TW? Is he perhaps less detested in the Winslow than he is on this website?

As you say, it may shortly be a moot point if there's anything to today's news reporting about the Kenyon/Yank group closing in on a deal with Moshiri. But it's still an interesting question to me.

Steve Brown
19 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:27:43
2003 was the time for him to go.
Chris Hockenhull
20 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:47:49
Though it was not club-related, the golden nugget he'd hidden was the one about wandering around the streets of London about 6am with Tommy Steele and Elvis Presley and not a soul spotted them!!!!

No noteworthy biographer ever managed to prize that one out re Elvis's only trip to England.

That's what happens after a lifetime of going around sniffing drainpipes whilst waiting for a lift on Uncle Cyril's handlebars.

James Hughes
21 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:49:05
Paul #16, you perfectly summed up the point of this article.

I really hope you were being sarcastic or ironic or maybe sardonic.

Tony Shelby
22 Posted 24/06/2022 at 15:50:58
I'm fed up of this “Kenwright Out” bollocks, to be honest. It seems to be the go-to rant of many on here and smacks of naivety.

I'm not going to start defending him because, as Michael rightly points out, his ‘crimes' vary massively depending on the accuser, and may or may not actually exist.

Frankly, I've been more concerned knowing that our majority shareholder is best mates with one of Putin's closest allies – possibly his biggest ally – and that we were relying on his funds, of Christ-knows-what origin, to move our club forward. By the way, I'm sure many of you will find a way of blaming Bill for this, just like you blamed him for not bringing in investment.

One positive thing I will say about Bill: When Benitez was appointed, he didn't say a fucking word. His silence said more about his opinion on the matter than words could.

Cue the hate, and detailed explanations as to why Bill was responsible for Collina disallowing Big Dunc's goal against Villarreal; his negative effect on the ozone layer; and why, on detailed examination, he might just be the person referred to in The Book of Revelation.

Danny O’Neill
23 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:15:58
I watched your comments on the other thread Micheal and didn't think it would be long before you put something on paper so to speak. A great summary. And well balanced too.

I'll admit to it taking me time, because initially, I was relieved to be rid of Johnson. So there's my lesson learned and also in line with the age old adage; be careful what you wish for. Not that I wished for Kenwright. I just didn't want Johnson.

We can go over old ground, but his time was done many years ago. I think I used a Putin analogy previously but he's more of a Boris Johnson. Bungling his way through and pretending everything is okay whilst the ship is steering off course towards the iceberg. Only to somehow have people pull it slightly back on an even course ahead of the next storm. But other people and this last season, the fans through sheer not allowing it to happen.

The time to go was years ago. But now, there can be no denial or obstruction. Interesting tweet on ToffeeTV:

"Peter Kenyon-led group is reportedly ready to commit £1Bn into Everton to build the club's new stadium and provide significant transfer funds their takeover bid is successful.

Source - Telegraph"

Dave Abrahams
24 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:18:16
There are enough reasons listed in Michael Kenrick's O/P for Evertonians to want the removal of Kenwright but unfortunately not enough Everton fans are interested in getting shut of this phoney Evertonian, they only really care about what happens on the field and – even with the last 27 years of desolate results – not enough are moved to do anything to get rid of him.

The illnesses he apparently suffered from were all reported by Kenwright's supporters and were all miraculously cured not long after he hadn't long to go.

Plenty of otherwise streetwise Everton fans think he is one of us. I have met and known hundreds of Everton fans over the years and never met one with the phoney credentials Kenwright has claiming to be an Everton fan. He describes how he used to go to Anfield with his uncle Cyril to watch Liverpool, never once has he described how he got to Goodison Park or whom he went with just that he went in The Boys Pen.

He has never confronted anyone when he is called a liar. I assume his Everton supporting days growing up are more lies. Like Boris Johnson, he just can't help it and it looks like we can't just get rid of him or the Board he has surrounded himself with. I wonder what they will do with themselves if the club is bought and they are disposed of along with their leader and breadwinner.

Pete Clarke
25 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:24:35

Football is riddled with owners who have dirt and possibly blood on their hands and it does sicken me. In fact, there's so much that sickens me about the game that I've been saying I've had enough for 30 years or more but, even here in Australia, where I'm enjoying a plethora of other sports shown daily on TV or played live when I can get there, I still cannot give up on the sport and club I love most.

As for Bill Kenwright, I absolutely detest his acceptance of failure for the club. He generally does stay silent which is even worse because what he should have said to Moshiri upon hearing about Benitez becoming our next manager was words to the effect of “I will resign if he comes near this club”.

He just accepted it because I believe that he thinks he's some kind of guardian angel but, in reality, he's just a scheming old fart who is hoping to be knighted by the club.

Jerome Shields
26 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:25:04
I have accepted that Bill will not be going anywhere. Kenyon had talks with Bill first in London before going to Monaco to have talks with Moshiri. Kenwright is therefore a gatekeeper in any negotiation.

My objection to Bill is simple – a successful team has a successful Chairman. Bill is not a successful Chairman and never will be.

His success has been being able to build a power base within Everton at the expense of the club and build up structures or a culture that supported that, which all comers cannot break down and find that they have to accept and work with.

It is not what he owns, but what he controls is the basis of his power, which ultimately is a greater power. Even a new takeover will have to engage with this and work with it. Bill has made himself a lot of money as a result, giving him great justification to continue.

Colin Fitzpatrick's post all those years ago told us how it was. Kenwright and his matey style has avoided direct attacks. Unlike Johnson, he does not appear to have a Mercedes whose boot a supporter can jump on.

The most meaningful fan attack was the #27 years campaign, which did rattle Kenwright & Co. It was subject to an unbelievable orchestrated manipulation of the fan-led review by the club, resulting in the ESSG and of course falling short of Board representation.

The problem is that the club and the fans live in parallel universes. The club is an investment vehicle supporting a costly and well-paid hierarchy and the long-term ambitions of those that own it and wish to own it.

The football is a secondary consideration to this as long as Premier League survival is maintained. The fans want honest endeavour, good football, good players, competition at the highest level and to win competitions.

The problem is that it's Bill's game and he has played it for years and bullshitted fans into acceptance and will continue to do so. It is him that has the cards to play – not the fans.

Hopefully Paul @16 we will be spared such a card player when Bill finally drops off his perch – which in my opinion is the only way he will be going.

Joe McMahon
27 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:30:10
Can someone please tell Kenwright that Kenyon won't be interested in anecdotes from the '30s '60s and '80s or that Big Dunc is one of us.
James Hughes
28 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:33:14
Tony Shelby, just like Paul, you miss the point.

I'm not going to start defending him

but then you clearly go and defend him.

Boys Pen Bill has consistently never said a word about anything. He even stopped the AGMs so he would not be called to answer any searching questions. So saying nothing about Benitez is hardly breaking his PR norm.

We all have opinions but defending Kenwright is a bit beyond belief. Lawn-mowers, Arteta money, ring-fenced, Whatever.

As for Moshri's source of wealth, do you honestly think any billionaire got there 'ethically'?

Brian Murray
29 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:35:45
Tony Shelby @21. Well done and here's to another 27 years of nothing, thanks to the oxygen you give. Blinkered clown, you and your teary mate.
Kevin Molloy
30 Posted 24/06/2022 at 16:47:13
I'm not a fan of Bill mainly cos of who he sold the club to. A 20-year search for the right owners ended at the doors of a Russian gangster… smashing. But he's a bit-part player now. Mere decoration. He will be gone in a few weeks, and indeed has had little influence for years.

I'm sure, when he sold to Moshiri, the plan was Bill would continue to run things. But Bill found out that Moshiri's idea of running things was for Bill to do the nitty gritty but that all or any major decisions would be Moshiri's. So he Skyped in for every purchase and appointment.

And this is the merry shit we've been left in. A daft arse phoning in every major decision from Monaco, and expecting Bill to coordinate all the hotel bookings when we're playing away.

Tony Shelby
31 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:09:30
James (27) - He's clearly an Evertonian, despite what many on here suggest to almost comic effect.

Brian (28) - Sorry Brian, I'd forgotten that you were the arbiter of what makes someone an Evertonian.


• Bill is Chairman with a negligible shareholding.

• A resolution by 50% or more of the shareholders means he's gone.

• Moshiri, in essence, owns Everton.

• Moshiri is meant to be a highly successful (i.e. astute) businessman. That means little room for sentiment, as shown in his appointment of Benitez.

• Moshiri has, to date, chosen not to sack Kenwright.

Bill may or may not be a bullshitter, have the gift of the gab, be a ballooner etc. Regardless, he's still where he is because the owner of the club wants him there, or at least has no strong urge to sack him.

This hatred of Kenwright is, at times, irrational, and, occasionally, bordering on delusional. If he is Beelzebub incarnate then it's Moshiri's fault that he still has any influence over the club. He's the owner. Moan about Moshiri, Bill is a legacy problem (if he is a problem).

Our current owner has chased managers like a kid wanting autographs, allowed half a billion quid to be spent on chopped fucking liver – nearly getting us relegated in the process – and, worst of all, tied our finances to a man who is best mates with the 21st Century's version of Hitler.

But, hey, Bill Kenwright, eh!

Brian Murray
32 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:17:06

At best, it was a gross error of judgment by Moshiri to entrust this Board with the running of his club. You are a totally different type of Blue from me. No better or worse.

I have seen (probably like yourself a long time ago) a certain standard of Everton. Enjoy your summer.

Robert Tressell
33 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:23:42
I have supported Everton since 1988. We finished 8th that year. I have never seen us finish higher than 4th in 2005. I have never seen us look better than the 5th place team in 2014. I have seen some truly awful football and not a lot of good.

The rot had set in before the start of the Premier League and pre-dates Kenwright.

But I do now firmly believe that Kenwright must now go so that we can modernise, professionalise and capitalise on commercial opportunities that we have not done over 30 crap years.

Tony Abrahams
34 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:23:56
Comic effect, Tony? I'm not blaming Kenwright for anything now either, but I do think that Everton need a new beginning.

How about a sickening effect? Which is now 27 years and fucking counting.

Jay Harris
36 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:42:37

You seem to be missing the point. Kenwright has been deceitful since before he came into the club. His litany of lies and incompetence would have seen many a chairman resign in disgrace but not alligator skin Bill.

It is pointless reminding you of the serial deceit of this man for his own personal gain and the demise of Everton as a top club because you choose not to see it even though every fact has been laid out over many years – including a taped interview with the man.

Christine Foster
37 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:44:18
"Put up or shut up"

Really Michael?

KEIOC exposed him, The Blue Union mobilized against him, the 27 years campaign got under his thick skin. Even the media in general turned on him and Moshiri. To me, that was the beginning of the end for him, having always stage-managed and manipulated the press for so long.

The press rattled both. To the point that Moshiri has had enough and wants out. Kenwright will try to convince whoever the club is sold to that he is integral to the running of the club, his roots and influence in place. But it will be money that's ousts him.

Moshiri wants the best deal he can get, if that means Kenwright is out ,that will be okay with him and the club will be better for it.

Dale Self
38 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:50:14
Nice work, Don, for inspiring this and, by the way, I lost some layers of skin from my index finger scrolling your post. And of course well put, Michael of yesteryear.

At what point is it obvious that the Dyspeptic Duo are out of their league, if not now? There really was no better test of their mettle than what was just experienced — and some would like to give it another go with the bloated one and his stranded Man from Monaco?

Just for the sake of entertainment, let's hear the arguments for staying with Bill in positive terms rather than labeling fair criticism as blame from the hoi-polloi. I'm guessing there is not a lot of material for that which is why the ridicule kicks in.

Tony Shelby
39 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:54:19
Christine (36) - Oh come on, Moshiri has lost his money man and now has to work under the constraints of FFP.

How you conflate that to be linked with Kenwright, I don't know.

Find me the quotes from ex-Everton players that precede the Kenwright era, criticising him and his tenure. Let's say people like Neville Southall, who speak their minds and don't care what others think. I can't find any but I'm happy to have my eyes opened.

If the people that actually won cups with the club and know how it was run back in the day aren't blaming Bill, why do you know better?

Tony Everan
40 Posted 24/06/2022 at 17:54:58
Mr Moshiri should not do a deal with anyone who would have Mr Kenwright as a Chairman of their business.

Allowing that is an admittance that failure is acceptable and they shouldn't be anywhere near our club.

Christine Foster
41 Posted 24/06/2022 at 18:07:14
Tony, exactly why did Moshiri lose so much money?

Ask Tony Hibbert how he found out about his dismissal from the club?

Ask why Kenwright thought Sir Philip Green was so wonderful with money.

Hang on... no Tony, sorry mate, it was all a figment of fertile imaginations... he never took a penny from the club after all.

Wonderful man... it's 5 am... I shouldn't have looked at my tablet and should've stayed asleep – not much chance of that now! Ah well, Everton, can't live without you.

Brendan McLaughlin
42 Posted 24/06/2022 at 18:11:15
Not from Liverpool and not a regular attender at Goodison but I've often seen posters who are (regular attenders) opine that Blue Bill remains popular with the majority of match-going blues.

Given all Blue Bill's failures and the fact that we have the most knowledgeable fans in the world, you have to wonder why Blue Bill remains popular?

Gareth Prytherch
43 Posted 24/06/2022 at 18:38:31
Sorry, can't read past the unashamedly mysoginistic ‘Little Miss Dynamite'. I assume you're referring to Professor Denise Barrett-Baxendale. Exactly how many PhD's do you have Michael?
Nick White
44 Posted 24/06/2022 at 18:42:50
From Michaels original post: “So come on, you posters who obsess about him on seemingly every thread, let's have some concrete ideas. Let's have some real action. Let's see a fan group set up, coordinated and going onto action to achieve this goal.”

In all my time going to the game I can only remember 1 actual protest, the Blue Union. My dad and I joined it and can still remember the chant “if you love the club, let it go” or something to that effect. At the same game Bill appeared on the big screen and got a big applause from the crowd. After that everything seemed to just die down.

I’ve not seen or heard of anything since then that actually got any momentum.

So, I suppose same question Michael asks, what’s the plan?

Dale Self
45 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:01:17
I think many of us would like to take up some digital pitchforks if available but we also understand that we drag the club through the mud in doing so.

What appropriate pressure can be brought to bear on the gentlemen who should know to see themselves out the door at this point is not obvious in tactics but it is entirely obvious as a necessary condition for this club to progress.

Tony Shelby
46 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:05:15

I know you're well thought of on TW, and I've got no reason to disagree, but I'm judging you on this subject. You are obsessed with Kenwright and have affixed almost all of the club's failings on him. It's practically an illness.

TW often resembles a group meeting for those in some way ‘abused' by Bill Kenwright. I'll be honest, it's embarrassing at times, but you're consistently that group's enabler.

You're entitled to your opinion, and you'll find a decent echo chamber here on TW (hence Michael's article) but it doesn't make you right.

Oh, and Tony Hibbert… is that really the best you've got? Peter Johnson sold Duncan Ferguson behind the back of the manager and the player himself.

Dave Lynch
47 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:06:51
He's our very own Boris Johnson.

Un-shameable, a liar and will not stand down for any reason on god's earth.

Christy Ring
48 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:11:58
He shafted Paul Gregg, didn't he or his wife loan him the money to buy his shares? He brought in Earl and Green – all leeches, who never put a penny into the club, and ran the club into the ground, that was Kenwright & Co's legacy.

He also sold the merchandise deal to Kitbag, a total disaster.

I know Moshiri hasn't a clue about football, and his decisions and the money he's wasted is unreal but, in my opinion, there was a certain person advising him, and whispering in his ear…

Tony Shelby
49 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:21:56

Is that the same Paul Gregg who abandoned his son but sold his shares ‘before the scandal over his past came to light'?

Son of Everton millionaire claims dad ruined his life

So far, we've got Tony Hibbert and Paul Gregg as character references. Who's next, the ghost of Harold Shipman?

Danny O’Neill
50 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:28:28
Robert @32, I have more respect for you than I do for my generation. I am the oldest of 5. My middle brother was tied to the ledge on the Gwladys Street and watched us win league titles alongside me. Like me he's seen everything other than actual relegation. But he was probably the last generation that remembers it.

My youngest brother was born in 1989, my son in 1994. So technically they've seen Everton win a trophy. But my brother was so young he probably has vague memories and my son clearly doesn't recall. They are part of what I often refer to as the lost generation.

As I've said time and again this season, it has amazed me travelling up and down the country how many dedicated young fans we have. Total respect. Ultimate pride.

Back to this thread. I know this subject generates emotion and division. But what we cannot let it do is exactly that. Don't become a divided fan base regardless of opinion. It was unity between the fans and further unity between those unified fans and players that pushed us on last season.

That unity can take us onto far better things if we maintain it. Had we been at the other end of the table, I'm convinced we'd have won the league.

Do not let the men in grey suits divide and conquer so they can keep dining from the top table whilst we suffer. It's our club, not theirs. They are simply custodians who should be held accountable. Not get a free ride despite continuous failure or mediocracy dressed up as apparent success. Hopefully the supposed takeover will rid us of the anchor that held us back for decades.

I and many Evertonians know success. We've seen it with our very own eyes and lived it. We all will do so again. Together.

Dave Abrahams
51 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:37:43
Tony (45)

You seem to be one obsessed with defending Kenwright, you say all the things he is accused of may or not be true, he has never defended himself on any of these accusations, says nothing… maybe he is a saint.

You are judging Christine on the way she sees Kenwright; why don't you judge Kenwright on the way he has treated Moshiri, his friend, since he bought the club with all the debts accrued under Kenwright's tenure as owner. That made him a very rich man but let his money be spent and frittered away by different people including “the friend” who brought him into the club but never looked after him like a proper friend and genuine man would.

Kenwright described Mr Moshiri as the man who keeps giving and he certainly took advantage of that man and his friendship with at least one deal, Rooney coming back to the club. Kenwright's doing and possibly some more, that's the type of man you are defending.

Ken Kneale
52 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:47:27

"Paul Gregg, through a spokesman, said: "There are two sides to every story. However, it will serve no useful purpose to comment now and put my side of events after all these years."

To most fair-minded people, that is reasonable. Are you forgetting that?

On your point about Southall, add Mountfield, Ratcliffe, and several more who are ostracised from most club activities for daring to have an alternative view to Bill and, seemingly, you.

Tony Shelby
53 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:49:42
Dave (50) - So, let me get this right; you’re suggesting that a billionaire businessman whose friend/business partner is the sanctioned oligarch and closest ally of Vladimir Putin, Alisher Usmanov, has somehow been mistreated/hoodwinked by theatre impresario, ex-Corrie actor and all-round luvvie, Bill Kenwright?

Priceless mate, absolutely priceless. Do you write this material yourself?

Joe McMahon
54 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:50:44
Surely the fact that the many years of Bill being Chairman and just being at the club comprise the most success-starved years in the club's history… One poxy cup final in all that time.
Tony Shelby
55 Posted 24/06/2022 at 19:57:03
Ken (51) - Citation(s) please on what those opinions are.

Genuinely, if I see consistent criticism of Kenwright from former players then I’m prepared to listen. My point is that, frankly, none of what you guys say about him on a day-to-day basis makes any form of compelling argument for me. As I’ve said earlier, the comments generally appear naive, misinformed and poorly argued.

I appreciate that by saying I’m not swayed by any of what you guys say means you think I’m ‘Pro-Kenwright’. I’m not. I’m also not ‘Anti-Kenwright’.

Tommy Carter
56 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:02:28
@51 Ken

I get where you are coming from but none of these individuals have achieved anything in football beyond Everton football club. If they were to be listened to and followed etc then our most decorated captain may have achieved more in his post Everton career than a giant killing of Everton for Shrewsbury and a few seasons at the Deva stadium.

Big Nev is doing wonderful work with marginalised groups. I believe he either would’ve been an unbelievably good or bad manager at the top level. We will never know as he was never given the chance.

But in summary Ken. Bill has never had the stature of personality to challenge him. Ever. He’s very larger than life as you would imagine from his profession and is able to dominate most personalities.

This is not a bad thing as using his bullishness he brought about very positive change at everton. However there was and is a ceiling to what he can inspire. It was reached in 2009, 13 years ago. From which point we engaged on a steady decline.

Danny O’Neill
57 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:02:43
Robert, I meant to touch on your other point. The decline did set in before Kenwright. I always put it down to the late 80s and as we entered the Premier League era and our failure to capitalise on that.

But if you look deeper, aside from those glorious but all too brief Howard Kendal years, it was setting in before then.

This club needs top to bottom change to realise its true potential. And it has massive potential.

Dave Abrahams
58 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:02:54
Tony ( 52) well who else sanctioned all the deals that have gone through with Mr. Moshiri in Monaco and Kenwright the chairman doing all the negotiations on every transfer deal that is completed, including the three deals for players who were all No 10’s, he was left in charge to run the club and act as the co- ordinator.
Christine Foster
59 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:03:35
Tony. It doesn't make me wrong either. On the facts, facts, we do have, and there are bucket loads, from the bedfellows he took.. yes I am sick. Sick of people who cannot see the wood for trees.
I am therefore one of the last of the enablers as you put it, because under his stewardship we have had the worst period in our history. For all his faults I do not care about, it was the arrogance of treatment of shareholders, the fans, to the temerity of those asking honest questions. Obsessed? Not in the least, not on my Christmas card list but I couldn't care less about the man unless it concerns Everton. On that point I am a patient under group least I am not delusional.
Tony Shelby
60 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:18:45
Joe (53) - Or….

…it’s coincided with the advent of the Premier League, massive transfer fees, clubs being purchased by Russian oligarchs (before the introduction of FFP), totalitarian regimes sportswashing through football, and (allegedly) Leicester massively breaching FFP to achieve the only surprising success of the period (Google it). We’re actually one of only seven teams that were in the inaugural PL season and remain in the league.

We nearly got relegated this season. That was partly thanks to Moshiri appointing Benitez. Apparently Bill wanted Moyes, an uninspiring choice, I admit, but far preferable to the has-been RS Go Compare wannabe.

We were the Mersey Millionaires. Shorthand: we could buy success. The rules changed and we just about found a seat before the music stopped. Stop blaming Kenwright. It simplifies a far more complex problem.

Jerome Shields
61 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:19:50
I acknowledge that the Blue Union did have some impact. Members of which were banned from Goodison for a period, who later were involved in the #27 years protest.

Christine, you are right about Kenwright, but I don't think he will disappear after the next takeover.

Paul Jones
62 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:21:43
Tony @8

Your suspicion about Kenwright being an RS fan has certainly got some legs - and some evidence!

The awful 60s/70s sitcom The Liver Birds featured him in an episode in 1972.

Enitled 'Liverpool or Everton', it was loosely about football and the rivalry in the city time. Kenwright played a boyfriend and - surprise surprise - an avid RS one at that!

Now I may be naive but given the script, couldn't he have flipped the allegiance to his beloved blues instead? No. He spends the whole episode trashing us.

For all the Kenwright haters out there, you can see his shameful performance here. It was a pretty awful programme, so skip to 3:30 for the telling part.

I wouldn't trust this charlatan to tell me the time.

Tony Shelby
63 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:22:10
Christine - With respect, it sounds more like a cult, based loosely on some facts, a lot of conjecture, plus bucketloads of bullshit.

Sometimes people need a focus for their pain. If it helps then good for you.

Soren Moyer
64 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:38:24
And don't forget his "at least we had some good times" comment! Time to hire a hitman lol.

On a sidenote, Christophe Galtier has agreed to become the new manager of PSG. Remember him?

Tony Shelby
65 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:39:31
Paul (61) - OK, you've convinced me.

Also, I now realise that David Jason is a cockney barrow boy, Ronnie Barker, a stuttering Yorkshire shop owner, and John Cleese, a Torquay-dwelling, end-of-his-tether hotelier.

So, we're working on the basis that a 26-year-old actor was somehow able to rewrite the script of a prime-time BBC sitcom to suit his own ends but chose not to, rather than the more likely conclusion, that the producers chose a fairly well-known scouser to play a bit-part in their show?

What next: Did his Corrie character fail to run into The Rovers singing “Kopites are gobshites”, or did he choose not to open his production of Blood Brothers with the theme from Z-Cars followed by a walk-on performance by the Toffee Lady?

For fuck's sake!!!!

Barry Rathbone
66 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:40:31
Bill just didn't have the money to compete with the established big clubs - Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal and the new monied Chelsea. Virtually all similar clubs bar Spurs have been relegated and the Moshiri experience has shown that change is no guarantor of improvement.

Irrefutably he has made mistakes but I can see why – outside of febrile Everton forums – he isn't quite the panto villain of legend.

Brian Murray
67 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:51:18
Well it looks like fellow blues can and will force change which surprises me. Twenty thousand have signed an in line petition to remove our new sponsorship. Hold that thought if teary arse refuses to go and somehow convinces Kenyon or whoever he is Everton and knows what he’s doing.
Tony Abrahams
68 Posted 24/06/2022 at 20:54:44
Brendan@41, because it’s an absolute myth that we have got the most knowledgeable fans in the world mate. No set of fans can claim to be the most knowledgeable imo, and you only have to see the diversity on these pages to realize this.

One thing Bill Kenwright has done from very early on in his Everton tenure, is to split the fanbase, and anyone who didn’t marvel at our fans towards the end of last season, obviously doesn’t understand how powerful Evertonians can be when they unite.

Christine Foster
69 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:03:09
Ok Tony, rather than let you keep making personal remarks as to my mental state, rather than I regurgitating it all again, and believe me I would rather not, respectfully, I suggest you read Colin's article of so many years ago and just respond to that. (Or is that "just a bucket loads of bullshit" to?)
Tony Abrahams
70 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:08:53
Paul@61, my suspicion is based on the fact that no Liverpool fan could have done a better job, with the managed decline of Everton.

Giving Bill Kenwright his due though, when he told our supporters that we have had some good times under his regime, I’m actually not sure that even a genuine kopite, could have said this, whilst keeping a straight-face?

Ken Kneale
71 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:09:45
Tony 67 - the classic divide and rule

Tony S - Mountfield and Southall are on record saying they are unwelcome - they choose not to perpetuate a public argument which should b respected - did Kenwiright not use a similar line for why he did not pursue in 94?

Like you, I was not anti-Kenwright for a long period, staying neutral but the evidence now is compelling and irresistible - his tenure has seen an erosion of Everton's standing in the game and garnered a reputation as also-rans - sorry mate he should have gone in 2003 not 2009 as Tommy suggests

Tony Dunn
72 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:13:05
boris johnson = bill kenwright ? doesnt matter how much you fick up, youre unsackable
Paul Jones
73 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:14:25
Tony @64

Lighten up FFS!!! 😂

Michael Kenrick
Editorial Team
74 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:54:01
Sorry, I didn't have much time today, and with Don singularly dropping the ball on the challenge he was given, I rather rushed that piece together and then had to leave for other business, so I'm glad you've all had some fun.

I was remiss for not mentioning The Blue Union, thank you, Christine and Nick – they are indeed the only ones who have even attempted the very difficult task of public shaming and ousting – and we all have an indelible memory of how that ended, as Nick @43 recalled only too accurately in the big screen applause all around Goodison Park. How on earth do you deal with that?

The answer is you can't. The Blue Union just seemed to fade away after that… admitting defeat. But their coup de grace had been the taped interview exposeé (that they always denied) which revealed so much of the truth that was Bill Kenwright.

I saw the two great questions from Mike Gaynes and felt bound to give my answers:

1) I can't speak for other clubs but there was a story that Peter Johnson had effectively been forced into selling his Everton shares by vociferous fan protests that included messages (death threats?) daubed on his garage door... maybe I should check that one before we go too much further, but I think it's fair to say that he was finally driven out by a wave of public opinion against him.

2) Mike, as you so accurately observed, we have a handful of people who spend their lives it seems trying to do the man down – to the point of obsession. It has failed and I think an element is the minority size of this viewpoint, while the vast majority are what a former poster would call "Happy clappers" who will applaud his image because he is the face of corporate Everton FC.

Does that make one side right and the other wrong? I think it's much more complex with a great diversity of knowledge, interest, and concern mobilized to vastly different degrees across the fanbase.

Many other interesting angles and viewpoints on this thread that I'd like to explore... But still no real plan to get rid of the man!

And thank you, Mr Gaynes, for providing a unique link across 12 years on this topic!

John McFarlane Snr
75 Posted 24/06/2022 at 21:54:45
Hi all, I've read all of the posts up to and including Christine's [68] and it saddens me that fellow Evertonian's can resort to insulting each other, in order to make a point.
I view the running of a football cub in the same way I view the team, there has to be a unity to succeed, and the blame can't be regarded as the fault of any individual.
The term "We win as a team and lose as team" springs to mind, and if things are not going well off the pitch, it is the duty of the board of directors to rectify the situation. Therefore, what I'm suggesting is that if the Board allow one man to dominate proceedings then it becomes a major problem, and the blame is on the shoulders of more than one individual. I must stress that because I'm not familiar with the behind the scenes activities, I have no strong views on the behaviour of Bill Kenwright, but I use the, "We win as a team and we lose as a team" quote, again.
Michael Kenrick
76 Posted 24/06/2022 at 22:08:40
Christine @36,

"Put up or shut up" was more directed to Don Alexander. Mike Gaynes struck a chord when he described it as an obsession.

Don's posts have now become an asinine parody of their intended function, turning more people off in his blind obsession to hammer home the relentless message about Kenwright and hopefully change the minds of the unpersuaded. He's not alone but he's near the top of the list.

We provide the space for his bilious ranting but it's becoming tedious in the extreme, reading post after post after post that takes the current topic of any thread and twists it into yet another cringeworthy anti-Kenwright diatribe.

Sorry but I've had enough of all his talking. Let's see some action.

Tony Abrahams
77 Posted 24/06/2022 at 22:09:21
Do you think a real plan to get rid of the man, would develop if Everton are sold and Bill Kenwright is retained again Michael?

Everything Kenwright has done, is water now under the bridge imo, but surely most Evertonians must realize that it’s now time for real change, or is this just wishful thinking on my part?

You win and you lose as a team, is correct John Mc, but how many people would spend half a billion, and still accept that it was perfectly natural to lose to certain opponents?

Surely the owner or the chairman should be trying to change the mind, of the one who held such an opinion, or have I just got the thoughts of a madman.

Mike Gaynes
78 Posted 24/06/2022 at 22:14:06
Michael #73, thank Colin... he's the one who went to the trouble of writing a 5000-word history just for me! I wonder where he is now, and if he'll get wind of this thread. Would love to see him check in just for this one occasion.

And thank you for answering my questions. As to your second reply, I wonder if there's a great unwashed silent majority in between the Bill-haters and the happy clappers... folks who think he's done a poor job as owner but don't consider him the embodiment of Satan.

Michael Kenrick
79 Posted 24/06/2022 at 22:23:57
Tony @76, I don't think it will.

Between you and me, I didn't expect Don to rise to the challenge and he didn't fail to disappoint me. There will be no plan.

It would be nice to think the fans now have the power to affect decisions within the club hierarchy but I don't think they do. (FAB notwithstanding!) Things may just happen to align… and then cause and effect is claimed.

I believe we are now nearing the end of the Kenwright Era – but my powers of prediction are notoriously poor so you'd best ask someone like your dad for a more mature and considered prognosis.

Paul Birmingham
80 Posted 24/06/2022 at 22:43:06
My 10 bobs worth to this intriguing debate, is hand on heart the decline started with the Cat, and his authoritarianism.

Laurie @5, spot on, if only.

Great discipline, and created a couple of fantastic Everton teams.

Selling Ball, and not building on the 69/70, success, started the rot.

The 70s were the days of almost and not quite, 75,77, near misses.

The few golden years, in the 1983-1987, and demise since.

For me the club in my view didn’t capitalise at the key times, more recently,
1985, was MBORC, in terms of Everton, and Evertonians, and Old Nick, spawned and his legacy sadly since those great days.

But Kenwright took on and on the back of Parkfoods, etc, and the rest is history.

For me it’s a 52 year decline and steady erosion of Evertons stature, comprising internal mismanagement and an enhanced decline in the operating model across the last 30 years.

The governance of Everton, and a clear plan to run a professional football club and to compete effectively has become lost in time.

But the the last 30 odd years has been misery, 1995 aside. Any busy with an aspiration to succeed would have made structured changes. Perhaps one day in time future Everton boards will look back and reference the good, the bad and the ugly of managing Everton Football Club.

If the descisions are true about a take over, perhaps Moshiri, has been drowning with the stress but if true then any change must be done properly and what will take the club forward.

Descisions, descisions, and arguably Everton came from a magnificent feast of football, in the mid 80s, to a permanent famine in terms of football and success, since

Moyses flirted with success as did Martinez, for a season and a half. But generally it’s been poor, and this further compounds the amazing partisan support of Evertonians, home and away, which is arguably a religion, for Evertonians.

But the last season, literally Everton supporters carried and spirited the club to survival..

My concerns now are with the potential take over scheme.

No one knows enough, and respectfully has their views, on what they would like to see, in terms of the future of EFC.

My view is this is that the full facts and due diligence of this, and potentially other take over plans, needs visibility.

Risk, counter risk, and benefits, to Everton FC... on face value I would like to see a resilience plan, from any potential take over entity.

Emotional intelligence, care and respectful understanding of Everton’s greatest asset, which is the Everton supporters. Any new suitor must show this as statute. Will this be the case?

Let’s see, but the summer of discontent with inflation and pay in the UK economy, is massive but the future of EFC, is also massive.

John McFarlane Snr
81 Posted 24/06/2022 at 23:41:27
Hi Tony [76] I may not have made my point clear, I used the quote of, "We win as a team and lose as a team" to illustrate that it should be the same attitude in the Boardroom, if indeed one person is not doing the right thing, he should be brought to task by his fellow Directors. I trust that I have made a better job now, apologies if there was any failings on my behalf.
Christine Foster
82 Posted 24/06/2022 at 00:10:20
Michael, in years gone by there were times when I felt very angry, frustrated and upset at what was happening. But in truth, as I said in my post, I stopped writing about him and indeed, parked just about all my TW writings, when Moshiri bought the club. I this he, (Moshiri ) has been much maligned for in the beginning he really just handed over the chequebook and said go fo a kid in a sweet shop..
My own frustration though comes to the fore when the unknowing ask or when the facts are forgotten or distorted. There are few of the people left on TW who where about 10 to 15 years ago fewer still interested. I try, usually respectfully to answer or challenge, but unlike Don I actually try to leave it alone! So my apologies but waking up at 5am to insults does tend to get my back up! I remember you telling me all those years ago to toughen up kid if your going to post on here. My lines are drawn at personal abuse, will not do it or tolerate it..
Blue Union..KEIOC, 27 years.. I said long ago the many supporters don't give a hoot about the running of the club, just support the team, but the wheels finally came off that trolley last season as one bad decision after another almost killed the premiership dreams. Last season saw also a dramatic reversal of the media's view of the club management, all of a sudden Moshiri, not seen at Goodison for many months now and Kenwright, coping critiscm and it shook both of them.
As far as I am concerned, I have said my piece on Kenwright long ago, and I really try not to rise to the bait.. but sometimes..just need to sleep more!
Jerome Shields
83 Posted 24/06/2022 at 00:24:02

Whilst Don does have a obsession as Mike Gaynes rightfully describes it, I think the truth of what he says rings through in all our thoughts. But Evertonians are optimistic and want to see something constructive. There is a certain unhealthiness in not trying to accept the situation and move on. There is more unhealthiness in ignoring the situation and not attempting analysis. Of course this analyse will be incomplete such is the determination of the Club to get out their narrative across and further their interests.

I suppose we all yearn for the simpler times of Football run by owners and managers, but at Everton after the Johnson takeover we entered different realms and Financial gain and manipulation became the order of the day. Takeovers we hoped would be a return to those simpler days, but in reality it has kept growing and brings with it the scenarios we are now all too familiar with. Which is also happening to other Clubs in the Premiership. Not just Everton. Some people will be put off, others will wonder why they bother, but true Evertonians will always be optimist and eventually they will be rewarded, please God

Kevin Prytherch
84 Posted 25/06/2022 at 01:19:10
I get the accusations pre-Moshiri. But the crap about ‘Bill wasting Moshiri's money' is exactly that – crap. Moshiri appointed 2 directors of football and countless managers who frittered away his money – that wasn't on Kenwright.

Fair enough – blame him for his failings, but don't try to pin everything negative that's happened since Moshiri took over on him.

Would Everton Football Club thrive better as a business with someone else as chairman? More than likely. Would we, as fans, see anything different on the pitch by ousting him? Probably not for some time.

Paul Birmingham
85 Posted 25/06/2022 at 01:31:30
Good point Kevin, and well pitched.
Pete Clarke
86 Posted 25/06/2022 at 01:45:47
There are disgusting amounts of money involved in this sport at the top level with pure financial gain being the main driving force. Corruption is inevitably involved and what greater example for the world to see it than the ridiculous World Cup in Qatar this year.
I don’t think Bill Kenwright got involved in buying Everton other than his pure love of the club and a sense of duty to take care of something he loved so much. He actually had it well run and balanced for a short time whilst Moyes was manager but it as it became apparent that Moyes was never going to be good enough to bring success, Kenwright himself was also found wanting with his failure to run the club properly and he sold some of the clubs greatest assets. The EPL was moving fast and we became an also ran under his poor leadership. It became clear he did not have what it takes to move us forward and yet he clung to power.
That scenario where he is crying on the phone to Alex Ferguson after Rooney was sold really sums him up as a small time phoney. He got what he thought was big money when in fact we were being ripped off.

When Moshiri and Usmanov came in they did so knowing that there is more money to make with this cash cow called the EPL. Even with the insane losses the club have made there will still be profit for Moshiri after he sells. Bill will have also made a small fortune too of course and it has to be said that he becomes richer even though he failed in every aspect of his duty as chairman to make sure others did their jobs properly.
Moshiri entrusted Bill with his money to put this club back amongst the big boys but rather than appoint a professional well oiled team to look after the clubs affairs he carried on running us over the phone as a part time job as we’ve seen by the numerous crap players and managers to have walked through our doors. In any other industry he would have been shown the door long ago but somehow he’s still here today and probably trying to negotiate terms of the sale.
Moshiri himself has to take a lot of blame but there’s no denying the one constant name that comes up between Everton and failure.

Don Alexander
87 Posted 25/06/2022 at 02:44:33
Michael Kenrick, I've only seconds ago seen your piece above, thereby nullifying my invective towards you in my most recent post. My qualified apologies are accordingly offered. I respect your article, thank you,

You, me and any other clear-minded Toffee know full well that the only thing Kenwright delivers is mundanity at best, whilst he enjoys the vast profits of his exploitation of us.

Other TW'ers sometimes demand court-standard evidence from people like me and, of course, neither I nor anyone else has possession of it given that Kenwright has total control of it.

As "boring" as it may seem to newer TWers who may lap up "the world's greatest ever Evertonian's" mantra - much advocated as it is by the media at large I think it essential that TW continues to publicise the truth expounded by the likes of the Abrahams and me, and way more forensically by the 12-year-old piece you fulsomely allude to whilst in the same instance publicly admonishing me for again reprinting it.

After all, your welcome piece above makes heavy reference to it, as I always do too.

Don Alexander
88 Posted 25/06/2022 at 03:15:27
Michael, having just commended you for your post I then went on to read your later inputs, effectively criticising me.

Is your public disparagement of me way more significant to you for quoting, again, the 12-year-old piece, which you now cite and thereby endorse for the TW audience I was addressing, or do you have some sort of disdain for me, a bloke who pretty much agrees with everything you postulate in your piece above?

Confused - of Everton, for 60 years, Don.

Steve Brown
89 Posted 25/06/2022 at 06:58:47
Great post, Pete Clarke, whereas Tony Shelby has posted on here so much that I am beginning to wonder if he is Smithers to Kenwright's Mr Burns. When he started in on the personal abuse of other posters, he lost all credibility

I don't hate Bill Kenwright, but I don't respect him either.

1) He enriched himself through his ownership of the club without investing a penny of his own money.

2) He had opportunities to hand over the control of the club to others (Gregg, Mansour) where it would have allowed us to make the next leap forward. He refused to do so because he wanted to maintain a central role in running the club (pure hubris), which Moshiri mistakenly allowed him to do.

3) By any measure of success (winning a trophy / regularly qualifying for Europe), his involvement in Everton has been a complete failure on the pitch.

4) There is no benefit for Kenwright or the club in his continuing to be Chairman of the Board or having a seat on the board. He is simply too divisive a figure to the fanbase when we need to unify.

So, it is time for Kenwright to end his association with the club and sell his remaining shareholding.

Rick Tarleton
90 Posted 25/06/2022 at 07:09:13
I think I first posted on this site about the Thespian around the turn of the Century. Nothing has changed.

He loves acting as a football club owner and as an ex Boys Pen customer. In reality, he has taken our club down a double helix of debt off the pitch and failure on it.

I hope you're right, Michael, but I fear he'll remain like the bad smell.

Jerome Shields
92 Posted 25/06/2022 at 07:10:36

There always is – especially in the Premier League – an unwritten rule that money is a substitute for ability. Everton under Bill never prospered, because money never materialised to fund the status that Bill and the rest thought they were at. In reality, in ability they were well below that status.

This was proved when they actually got money under Moshiri. Moshiri also proved to be of similarly below status ability and he is now looking for sources of more money to continue.

Only when those that run Everton are held accountable for performance will Everton move forward. Everton are currently being held accountable by Premier League officials who are interpreting the Premier League's Profit and Sustainability rules. They are in effect running Everton.

Everton, if they had been relegated, would have been run by the Football League's Profit and Sustainability Rules. If they had qualified for Europe in the previous season, they would have been run by the FFP rules as well.

So the reason for the takeover of Everton is to get back control of actually running the Club. It is an admission of lack of ability, but not an admission of lack of proper status.

Danny O’Neill
94 Posted 25/06/2022 at 07:58:00
As I've said time and time again. I was never a Kenwright hater. I'm still not. A critic? Yes. I became frustrated as it became obvious his time was done, so he needed to go and let go. At the very least when Moshiri took over.

We need institutional change in the club. We need to change the culture. Not the fan culture; that will never change. I mean the culture of how the club is run. That needs a ruthless broom sweep. A spring clean on steroids.

Usually when something is failing, it's either an obvious mistake or there is a common denominator.

We have one. The Elephant in the room.

Change. Don't fear it. Embrace it. But change, because it hasn't worked for nearly 3 decades.

I keep using this so apologies for the repetition, but Goodison is a marker. Apart from the uninspiring Park End and an extended plastic roof over the Gwladys Street, it is still the same Goodison Park that I love and went to as a kid.

But we have effectively stood still. Standing still is walking backwards because everyone else walks past you. And they have, as we have looked on.


Brian Murray
95 Posted 25/06/2022 at 08:00:39
Steve post 88.

Tony Shelby is Smithers to a Mr Burns re. Kenwright... ha ha, classic. If he doesn't go of his own free will, release the hounds. I've had enough of this Crusty Clown.

Ian Bennett
96 Posted 25/06/2022 at 08:11:48
If Paul Esk is on the site, I'd like to understand his estimate for FFP up to 30 June 2022.

My assumption is that we need to sell Richarlison between now and 30 June, to book the profit and reduce our rolling FFP. Other clubs know that, and are squeezing us down on price.

Assuming we do lose Richarlison, what is our estimated spend vs that FFP constraint or headroom?

It's conceivable that, under FFP, we sell Richarlison and can't buy replacements given the Premier League have to sign-off on our short-term plans if over the limits.

£1.7M was spent last year… can we expect the same this year? Are we just waiting to sell players, and everyone knows that?

Tony Abrahams
97 Posted 25/06/2022 at 09:08:50
Michael @78, I don’t know if that’s what I would get from Dave. He doesn’t really like Richarlison, was never a real lover of the golden vision and he always thought Howard Kendall was a very lucky manager, although he did love him as a player to be fair!

Seriously though I think that more and more people, are now seeing through Bill Kenwright, but this new takeover is concerning me because I’m certain it’s our chairman who has let the cat out of the bag, and this man must have an ulterior motive, regarding Bramley Moore?

Maybe this is a good thing, because he definitely owes us “something good” but since he came on board, I can’t help feeling that it’s always been about what’s better for himself, rather than what is better for Everton Football Club, and this does seem to be a feeling shared by more and more Evertonians nowadays, so hopefully Bill has got the wisdom to go very soon?

John Mc, I knew exactly what you was saying mate, I was just pointing out that even our owner was saying he expected to lose to certain opponents, which is incredible really, and makes you wonder why he wanted to own a big football club in the first place?

Danny O’Neill
98 Posted 25/06/2022 at 09:28:35
"I can’t help feeling that it’s always been about what’s better for himself, rather than what is better for Everton Football Club"

That says it all Tony. If I'd have been as privileged as Kenwright to be on the board and control Everton Football Club, I would find it extremely difficult to let go.

But it wouldn't be about me. It would always be about Everton. Sorry if I sound like Donald Trump, but Everton first. Always. And if that means I have to walk and let go. Then that's what I would have done.

Hypothetical obviously as I'll never be in that position. It has to be about Everton. Nothing else.

Dave Abrahams
99 Posted 25/06/2022 at 09:41:36
Michael (73),

I also thought those two questions from Mike Gaynes were very pertinent to how do we get rid of Kenwright. I was basically answering Mike's questions in my post at (23), saying not enough fans are interested in what goes on behind the scenes in the boardroom but only what happens on the field, and I've stated that more than once on ToffeeWeb.

I still claim that Kenwright didn't do near enough to help Moshiri when he was allowed to run the club and he joined in with others in wasting his friend's money and not taking proper care of the club and its finances as he was trusted to do by Mr Moshiri. This was definitely the biggest mistake Moshiri made, a point I made to Tony Shelby despite Tony not debating but browbeating my post along with a few more Everton fans' posts.

Michael, well done in trying to bring the Kenwright scene to a conclusion. I don't think it will end until he leaves Everton one way or the other and I am one of the posters who regularly joined in and had my say on the man although there were numerous occasions, like Christine, I just bit my tongue and stayed out of the debate.

But I understand Don perfectly in raising the picture of Kenwright's very poor performances as Everton's owner and Chairman.

Michael Kenrick
100 Posted 25/06/2022 at 10:20:57
Dave @98,

Yes, I'd penned my reply to Mike before I saw your far better explanation. T'was ever thus, as another old TW voice would often say!

I can't agree with you about Kenwright helping or not helping Moshiri — because I simply do not know anything of the internal decision-making process. You and your kid have the advantage over me there with all your internal connections.

And the other Tony (Shelby) is right when he says "he's still where he is because the owner of the club wants him there, or at least has no strong urge to sack him." That has been the fundamental reality for the last 6 painful years.

Tony Shelby goes on to say "This hatred of Kenwright is, at times, irrational, and, occasionally, bordering on delusional" – reflecting Mike Gaynes's cryptic observation on Don's obsession problem. [Apologies that there are a few very early posts I haven't transferred across to this thread, which I will try to fix.]

It's a concern I share but I have a very low triggering threshold for repetition. And what we get from Don is repetition of the same theme, again and again, on thread after thread. No matter how right Don might be in his tirades, they just become tiresome and, yes, boring.

There are other posters we have who talk endlessly about themselves and try to get us to behave just like them. I find that intensely boring also, but creating a thread to harbour and isolate those contributions will be much more challenging for me. But I digress...

What I thought might be a good challenge for this thread was a little less conversation, a little more action please. (Who said that?) See if Don could do a little more than just rant and rave... and repost a 5000-word history tome! But, judging by his replies above, he's missing the point still...

Tony Shelby
101 Posted 25/06/2022 at 10:30:41
Steve Brown - I’m not sure why having an open mind about Bill Kenwright, and showing my frustration when the Kenwright Out mob can’t seem to muster a coherent argument for his removal, makes me his Smithers but keep chuckling to yourself at the analogy.

Given that it’s a minority of fans that feel this hatred towards Kenwright, they use a lot of TW oxygen. I’ve even seen posts referencing ‘bloated Bill’ at a time when he was clearly taking steroids for Christ knows what. On a human level that’s disgusting but it’s legitimised by the other cult members who are happy with anything fired in the man’s direction. It all feels a bit ‘People’s Front of Judea’ to me.

Tony Abrahams
102 Posted 25/06/2022 at 10:38:03
Hopefully with Kenwright smiling whilst asking “How should I fuck off?”
Alan McGuffog
104 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:21:59
Tony, is this coherent?

We have been treading water, as a club, for over 30 years. For much of that time, Kenwright has been Chair.

Would he have been allowed to get away with that appalling level of failure in any arena other than football?

Tony Shelby
105 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:31:43

See my post #60 which responds to Joe McMahon's similarly simplistic argument.

John Burns
106 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:35:24
The Colin Fitzpatrick analysis from all those years ago was amazing. Thank you, Don, for republishing it.

The poignant point for me in that letter was how the red supporters unleashed their fury in the press, when dropping into the relegation zone. It was unacceptable to them and they weren't going to accept it.

In comparison, we have barely murmured. Somehow, collectively we have been like that frog passively sitting in a slowly heating jar of water. Passivity kills.

I have no venom toward the chairman or any of the board, but the facts speak for themselves. In fact, more than speak – they shout failure upon failure. It's time for change.

My hope though is a ruthless but successful takeover that doesn't rip the soul from our special club.

Ian Bennett
107 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:42:01
Minority of fans that want Kenwright out? I am yet to meet anyone that has anything positive to say about Kenwright.

Put it on a poll, and he'd be lucky to get 20% of a vote. The man is calamity, and so is Moshiri.

Steve Brown
108 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:43:14
Don't worry, Tony S, old Bill will be fine.

Someone down there likes him.

Christy Ring
109 Posted 25/06/2022 at 11:57:25
Kenwright bought the club with other people's money, and his legacy since then hasn't changed.

Moyes, to be honest, turned the club around, with no money from Bill and his rich friends. If he had been able to spend big on a striker, I think he would have brought us to the next level.

Instead, Bill had sold off anything that didn't move, and sold Rooney to Man Utd by spoofing that Newcastle had offered £20M for him, that's what Kenwright's reign as Everton owner gave us.

Dave Abrahams
110 Posted 25/06/2022 at 12:20:03
Ian (107),

There has been a poll on Grand Old Team running for the last few weeks, it asks “Is it time for Bill Kenwright to stand down?”

Not a massive vote with just 750 voters: over 89% saying Yes it's time for him to go, and slightly over 10% saying No, he should stay. So 9 out of 10 asking for him to go.

Colin Glassar
112 Posted 25/06/2022 at 12:32:28
Dave, I presume that 10% are family, friends and Stockholm syndrome sufferers?
Kim Vivian
114 Posted 25/06/2022 at 16:36:44
This joke I saw yesterday was directed at Boris Johnson...I think it is equally relevant for Bill Kenwright:

"The shark's bitten off both my legs but I'm going to keep going"

Paul Kossoff
115 Posted 25/06/2022 at 17:23:10
In my humble opinion as a long-standing blue boy, if we would have been relegated last season, then Kenwright would have been directly responsible for that.

Why? He was the man who turned down our one chance in a million to become the biggest wealthiest club on the planet. Kenwright – being an arrogant self-centered him first, his bank account first, power hungry control freak – stopped us being what Manchester City are today!

Thanks, Bill, time to go, and I truly hope the rose-tinted glasses wearers on this site don't say, "Good luck, Bill, we wish you all the best!" I'll be glad to see the back of him.

Jay Harris
117 Posted 25/06/2022 at 17:49:53
Just like Christine, myself and many others rallied against Kenwright's determination to take us to Kirkby and pocket a few million for him and his friends. We argued night and day with acolytes like Doddy (could he be reincarnated as Tony Shelby?) and but for the efforts of KEIOC and Blue Union he might have succeeded.

Like quite a few others I have no wish to enter into another debate about someone whose catalog of disasters and deceit as Chairman of Everton is there to see. I just want to see him gone with all his ill-gotten gains.

Jeff Armstrong
118 Posted 25/06/2022 at 18:30:36
Sorry, John (#106) but you're wrong, when we fell into the bottom 3 recently we weren't having it either. We the fans did something about it: we went to the training ground before away games, we went to the ground early on match days and turned the sky blue.

We let those players know we weren't having it and we lifted those players to win key points to keep us up. Fair play to the players for responding, but do not suggest the RS fans are more passionate than us. What we saw for the last few games was Evertonians “not having it”.

Greg Anderson
119 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:10:27
I am certainly not a "Kenwright supporter", and I doubt that too many are. Like most, I would like to see the club run by people better equipped for the job in today's shabby football world.

But I also don't think that Kenwright deserves the vitriol that the loud minority pour on him every day here. I completely agree with the brave Tony Selby that blaming him almost exclusively for the "decline" of EFC is naive and simplistic.

The "case" against Kenwright, which I have read on here too many times over the past 15 years or so, is stitched together by far too much decontextualized black-and-white thinking, unverifiable supposition, hearsay, and flat, ungracious refusal to give him the benefit of the doubt about anything at all.

To me, this whole case is based on a syllogism. "Everton have been in decline for 30 years; Kenwright has been on the board for 30 years; therefore Kenwright is directly responsible for the decline."

As I think everyone knows, Kenwright did not become majority shareholder till December 1999, and only became Chairman in 2004. In case it isn't obvious, our "decline" was already well and truly advanced by 1998, with two desperate last-minute relegation struggles in 1994 and 1998.

Blaming individuals for this abject decline after the '80s glory days is not straightforward. But at least two candidates have more obvious responsibility for the demise than Kenwright.

First, the saintly Sir Philip Carter, Chairman till 1994, who helped orchestrate the Premier League, while apparently doing nothing at all to prepare us for the systemic change that would follow. Why are his obvious failings always ignored?

Arguably our decline was already sealed by the time the shifty Liverpool supporter, Peter Johnson, took over as owner and chairman in 1994. But, FA Cup aside, things only got much worse under his tenure, especially with the chaos of the 1997-99 period.

This included having a manager with (by all accounts) a serious drinking problem, the car boot sale of icons like Duncan Ferguson and Gary Speed, attempts to buy our way out of trouble with money that we did not really have under Walter Smith, with the ill-fated short-term purchases of, eg, Materazzi, Dacourt, Collins, Hutchison, et al.

This was the complete mess, or shambolic "decline" that was inherited when Kenwright's True Blue Holdings took over in late 1999. By this point, we were already way behind "super-clubs" Man Utd, Arsenal, and Liverpool, and struggling to compete with the likes of Chelsea, Newcastle, Spurs, Aston Villa, Leeds, etc. And soon the context would shift yet again with the staggering monetization of Chelsea and Man City.

Yet as we all know, Moyes was appointed manager, and during his 11 full seasons at the helm, the ship was well and truly steadied, with an average league position in that time of 7.6.

Given our still rather precarious financial situation, the continued dominance of the 3 super-clubs, and the mind-boggling monetization of Chelsea and Man City, this was about the best we could realistically hope for, almost all of it coming after Kenwright finally became chairman in 2004.

And of course this was then followed by that relatively thrilling 5th place finish under Martinez. Are we then going to blame Kenwright for the two 11th place finishes after that? Or perhaps this had something to do with Martinez's complete sacrifice of a really good team on the altar of his stubborn, vainglorious "philosophy"?

Whatever the case, by this point, the only way we could realistically compete with the "big clubs" was either by having some vast cash injection like Man City or Chelsea had, or somehow by building our "brand" through regular Champions League competition, leading to higher income levels and greater commercial opportunities. But there is no example of the latter ever happening without the former already happening (except possibly Spurs?).

Which means that Kenwright's biggest "failing" was not selling us to the only kinds of owners who could afford to bankroll us into the "big club" stratosphere, namely Russian oligarchs, Arab oil interests, or US hedge fund-type vulture capitalists.

Instead, he got us someone with oligarch money once-removed, still not rich enough to buy our way to the top. For the first three years under Moshiri, we ended up 7th, 8th, and 8th, which is exactly commensurate with our relative wealth at the time.

After that, a 12th place, due mainly to the fact that Zouma and Gana were lost and not replaced, then a competitive year under Carlo where we were in the top 6 for most of the season, before fading badly at the very end, mainly due to injuries.

Only in this last, most recent debacle of a season have we returned to 90s-type "decline" form, even then with serious extenuating circumstances, like the effective loss of the team's spine and creative players for a variety of circumstances, none of them obviously Kenwright's "fault".

Of course, Kenwright has had his failings, and of course at times he might have embellished the truth. No doubt, he has at times conflated the best interests of EFC with his own personal interests. He is a showman, a theatre impresario, and it is long past the time that people like that should be running Premier League football clubs.

But he did not "cause" EFC's decline. If anything, he (with Moyes's help) did more than anyone to arrest that decline when he took over after the lost decade of the 90s, restoring us to some kind of stability. For that alone, he deserves some credit, not vitriol.

Larry O'Hara
120 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:17:13
Greg (119), there are two simple reasons why Kenwright is unacceptable

1) Destination Kirkby

2) Turning down Sheikh Mansour

I rest my case.

Tony Abrahams
121 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:38:17
There is no doubt that he’s conflated the best interests of Everton FC, with his own personal interests.

Greg Anderson
122 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:44:46
Larry, 120, we all agree, I think, that it is long past time for seriously qualified people to be running EFC. My post was about the vitriolic blame thrown Kenwright's his way for our "decline" over the past 30 years, which strikes me as patently unhistorical and unfair.

As for Kirkby, again, I think we can all agree that the whole idea was horrible, and presumably born of an extreme desperation in straitened financial circumstances. Either way, it had no impact on our "decline" because it didn't end up happening.

As for Abu Dhabi, neither you nor I nor anyone here knows the real truth of that situation. But there is zero evidence that Kenwright "turned down" Sheikh Mansour. To my knowledge, all that has been said on the record about this is by Kenwright himself, who observed years later that Man City were bought because they already had the stadium in place, and that EFC could have been the beneficiaries, had we had a new stadium at the time. There is no evidence that an offer to EFC was ever made.

And frankly, even if an offer had been made, I and many others might have been just a bit uncomfortable if it had been accepted. Abu Dhabi is not exactly a place one would want to be associated with. Here is the Amnesty International report for 2021:

The government continued to commit serious human rights violations, including arbitrary detention, cruel and inhuman treatment of detainees, suppression of freedom of expression, and violation of the right to privacy. The right to health was partially fulfilled. The United Arab Emirates (UAE) continued to deprive stateless individuals of the right to nationality, impacting their access to a range of services. Courts passed death sentences and executions were reported.

Perhaps this helps put the "sins" of Kenwright in perspective.

Bernie Quinn
123 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:52:09
I have been away for a while and not been able to make any comment until now. I am not going to make adverse comments about Luvvie Bill, but having read the early posts I feel annoyed with Tony Shelby's post in reply to Christine. He said "With Respect" then is abusive to her.

Christine is always polite and is entitled to her opinion. so why the vitriol? Christine, I know you can fight your own battles, but this went byond the pale.

Tony Abrahams
124 Posted 25/06/2022 at 19:52:13
That Amnesty International report definitely helps to put Bill Kenwright's absolutely disastrous reign into perspective, Greg.
Jeff Armstrong
125 Posted 25/06/2022 at 20:52:00
Kenwright is the Boris Johnson of EFC, he doesn’t know the difference between hate and utter Herculean despise by Evertonians, he is a bubble boy who still thinks he has respect.

Nobody respects Bill Kenwright …nobody.

Christine Foster
126 Posted 25/06/2022 at 22:00:20
Greg Anderson, good response – even if I disagree with the thrust of your post that Kenwright was merely picking up the pieces of a decline that pre-dated his tenure. But it did make me think that the current board's strategic review, which none of us have seen, would have been a better initiative if carried out then and not now. Hindsight, wonderful thing...

At the back of my mind was an itch... you know, a memory you can't quite put your finger on? When the club announced its Fans' Forum, there was that itch again... Anyway, this morning lying in bed contemplating a cold shower, it came to me…

An article I wrote here on TW some 11 years ago. And before anyone thinks it's another pointed attack on the board, it's far from it and frankly I could be forgiven for thinking what I laid out became the basis for supporter involvement in the club.

Please, forget the fact I wrote it and put it into context of the current strategic review... it's uncannily similar! Oh and Greg, I noticed a response in there from you as well..

For once, allow me an indulgence.

An Alternative Strategy Required

Greg Anderson
127 Posted 25/06/2022 at 23:00:25
Christine @126,

Your vision of 2011 sounds just as beautiful today as it did back then. And yes, hopefully, it is now at least a little closer to be being realized in actual practice!

Robert Williams
128 Posted 25/06/2022 at 23:32:03
Paul B 80.

Here is my six penneth: Johnson sold out to Bill and we've been 'hampered' ever since.

Don Alexander
129 Posted 26/06/2022 at 00:47:51
The fact is that, for decades before Moshiri entrusted his investment to the hands of Kenwright, the latter had squandered very many years of our potential progression in favour of seeking out a moderately wealthy billionaire with even less football know-how than him.

He got rich and lucky when he found Moshiri. We fans got fucked as a consequence, just like Moshiri.

Right now we're on a par with Espanyol in Barcelona in terms of world-wide appeal. (Espanyol are European football nonentities to anyone interested, albeit they too have a maniacal local fan-base also endlessly devoting themselves to on-line argument on the next bog-standard at best player acquisition their provenly inept board seek to impose on them).

Bernie Quinn
130 Posted 26/06/2022 at 00:49:01
By Heaven, Christine, I'm glad to be back and reading your posts! So well written and I agree with you completely. Looking forward to hearing your screams in the new season!
Sean Kelly
131 Posted 26/06/2022 at 00:49:38
On a lighter note, I was reading an article here about Bono. I started singing the song “I still haven't found what I'm looking for”. Very apt for us.

Bono says he has a half-brother. He must be tiny. I get me coat.

Brian Murray
132 Posted 26/06/2022 at 01:19:44
Robert post 128. It’s certainly been no picnic since.
Paul Birmingham
134 Posted 26/06/2022 at 01:23:59
Rob @128, spot on, mate.

Danny O’Neill
135 Posted 26/06/2022 at 08:38:06
Sunday Morning. This is going to be a long one. Apologies in advance.

Good shout, Bernie. We are all entitled to have a view and opinion. That's what we come here to do. But there is no need to get personal. Lock horns on occasion, agree and disagree. But we're all in this for the same love and reason. Keep it civil. Well said, sir.

Great post, Greg. I'll be consistent and offer some balance. I'm neither a Kenwright fan nor a Kenwright hater. Initially, I actually appreciated Kenwright stepping in when he did to rid us of Peter Johnson when no-one else would touch us with a bargepole.

I don't blame Kenwright for our stagnation, but he has overseen and contributed to it significantly for too long.

The stagnation started in the 1970s. Arguably the sale of Alan Ball was a defining moment and starting point for that. That's according to my late father, not me. We've rested on our laurels for too long and nearly been found out on at least 3 occasions now as well as sailing close to the wind on several others.

My issue with Kenwright is that he has held on for longer than he should have. There's an argument that he was waiting for the right owner with Everton's best interests at heart. But just like now, was the "right" owner the one who would keep him in place and allow him to run his train set?

That's what I'm reading; he still wants to remain as Chairman. So he's thinking of himself, not the club. That kid who storms off the park and takes his ball back to his nan's in a sulk because it's his and he can. The rest of us stand there watching and have to go home because we have no ball.

Just let go, as he should have done so years ago. It's failed. Premier League survival and finishing 7th isn't where I want my Everton to be. So it's failed. Go. Hand it over.

I won't recite them again, but remember the words of Sir John Moores: Everton expects success. Okay, I got part of it in there!

Kirkby was a bad plan and a bad idea. But a bad plan. Most know my views. The whole "Kirkby isn't Liverpool or Scouse" thing doesn't come into it for me. That wasn't the reason we shouldn't have gone to Kirkby.

I said at the time that, if we were considering an outskirt location, it should have been Speke. Plenty of land, airport, motorway links, South Parkway Station nearby in Allerton.

And, for those it mattered to, within the city of Liverpool boundary. But that's water under the bridge now. The new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock is going to be great and fitting. I'm looking to the future, not the past. We're going to make history on the banks of the Mersey.

Bootle, Kirkby, Huyton, Halewood. All Liverpool and Scouse regardless of some invisible political / council boundary in my opinion. Think big. We are a Liverpool city region, not an insular, inward-looking city based on the colour of your wheely bin or your council tax bill. We made our name being outward-looking.

When we move to the new stadium. it's going to be fantastic. Nearly 40 years too late, but fantastic. Yes… 40 years. We should have been thinking of relocating or redeveloping Goodison in the 1980s because even then, it was becoming outdated. And that's when we were one of England's leading clubs.

As alluded to, despite promoting the introduction of the Premier League, we failed to capitalise. We rested on our laurels, failed to invest strategically and assumed we'd be okay.

Think big. Act big. And that doesn't mean aimlessly throwing money at the problem. Implement a strategy that may take a few years to see the rewards.

We are a huge club. A sleeping bear waiting to be poked with a stick to wake up and realise it took its eye off the ball and is going to reclaim the mountain.

Dave Abrahams
136 Posted 26/06/2022 at 08:58:13
Christine (126), I’m off to church now, I will read your post from a few years ago when I get back.
Bernie Quinn
137 Posted 26/06/2022 at 09:02:22
Good Morning, Danny,

I missed the last 10 days of ToffeeWeb, due to overseas family being here for our Diamond Wedding.

Thanks for your comments – that Tony Shelby quite annoyed me with his anti-Christine remarks. I just had to throw my cloak in the puddle for her!

It's good to read your post this morning. I must be honest here – I am not a fan of Luvvie Bill and I wish he would retire but I won't make comments about him, good or bad… though I think I just did!

Danny O’Neill
138 Posted 26/06/2022 at 09:25:38
Cloaks over puddles Bernie. Chivalry of the highest order!!

Off topic, but something that may mean something to an ex Irish Guardsman. It was Armed Forces Day here in the UK yesterday. I posted this elsewhere:

To our forefathers total respect.

To us modern day veterans, be proud of what we achieved, often, in hostile environments far away from our families for long periods.

To those serving, keep doing what we do. Get the job done without fuss or need for recognition. It's what we said we would do if we were needed. No regrets, no complaints. Come home safely and get ready for the next one.

For those who never came home. You made the sacrifice. I'll raise a glass tonight and think of you.

Most important. For those who still struggle, don't be alone. We were in it together and we always will be.

God speed and god bless Bernie. In it together. Just like Evertonians.

Kunal Desai
139 Posted 26/06/2022 at 09:25:55
Yes, the decline and rot started at the start of the 90s but Kenwright has presided over 30 years of that and being the 'blue' he is has made no real attempts at trying to reverse that decline, even when opportunities have presented themselves to at least returning back to those competitive levels off the field (on-field Moyes stability).

He failed to deliver us the Kings Dock in 2004; we wouldn't be discussing Bramley-Moore Dock. Turned away Sheikh Mansour in 2008; wouldn't be discussing Moshiri.

We would not only have had the stadium but owners who would have brought a decade of success. But instead, one man's decisions have been only made for himself concerned and no-one else.

Tony Abrahams
140 Posted 26/06/2022 at 10:23:21
A nice tribute to your comrades, Danny.

Don is on the money, because Bill Kenwright keeping hold of Everton for as long as he did is probably the worst thing that's ever been allowed to happen to Everton in its once very illustrious history.

We are all complicit in this though, because to slag him for what he never did (sell Everton and move on because he's never been good enough for our great club) is very galling to a lot of genuine Evertonians, even for the ones who can see he's conflated Everton's best interests and his own personal interests... (Wow!)

This might have been acceptable if Everton had been really competitive, instead of the claim that we were punching above our weight (Kenwright and Moyes must have absolutely loved this) and something that was actually celebrated, was when plucky little Everton eventually became the best of the rest... (Another wow!)

Evertonians must have changed… I can still remember the cushions being thrown onto the pitch when I was a very small child, because people weren't happy with a team that lost one final, and got robbed in the other semifinal, with my thoughts being that I don't think Bill Kenwright could have kidded these people for so long.

If I was advising Kenwright, I'd be telling him to leave, because I don't think this younger generation of Evertonians have got any time for the man, and these are the people who deserve the most credit for helping Everton stay in the top division. I'm certain these people would really turn on the man if he stays and things don't change.

Danny O’Neill
141 Posted 26/06/2022 at 10:51:38
Absolutely, Tony.

He should have gone many years ago if he had Everton's best interests at heart, as he claims to have had. But his personal interests have overtaken that, in my opinion.

Although I understand how a generation admire and pine for the Moyes years, those two were the worst combination for our club as they convinced many that mediocre was acceptable.

It was a perfect storm. Beating Liverpool once every now and then and embarrassingly releasing a DVD to celebrate the occasion. Something my red cousins rib me about continuously.

Well, I watched Everton get beat 3-1 at Anfield in the Kevin Sheedy two-finger salute match. They celebrated and I walked away gutted. But we won the league a month or so later.

Advising him? If I was in negotiations, I would just be clear that he has no future at Everton Football Club.

Other than being a supporter like me. He's welcome to that and can sit next to me any time he wants. If he's as big a supporter as he claims, he can go through what we all do.

Christine Foster
142 Posted 26/06/2022 at 11:00:01
Bernie, courtesy compels me to bow to the cloak and the puddle, for which I can only curtsey and say thank you kind sir... However, the Scottie Road in me is rolling up her sleeves ready to go toe to toe, just give me a bottle of Guinness first! I am usually not so courteous after two bottles of stout or a black and tan.

For my troubles, I used to work at Chester Garrison for the MoD, doing lots of stuff with the now-defunct Gordon Highlanders and green berets, based locally, spent a lot of my early working years in North Wales and travelled daily to sites, from Catterick to Lossiemouth, Portsmouth. I think over 7 years I went to most bases and the more sensitive places too... trained in electronics and coms with them in Chalfont... but then life got in the way and I was missing too many home games!

The linked bit I wrote 11 years ago is, I must confess, something I had forgotten but, in honesty, it really is worth the read as I feel someone at the club must have cut and pasted it for themselves, but I do think it was probably one of the better articles I wrote here.

Anyways... thanks again for the cloak!

Dave Abrahams
143 Posted 26/06/2022 at 11:16:02
Christine (126),

I read your piece going back to 2011, a truly excellent article, but I never expect anything less than excellence from you – even when we occasionally disagree with each other's opinions. The pen is definitely mightier than the sword when it is in your hands, I imagine a “Dear John” wouldn't read so bad written by yourself!!

That's enough of the flattery, back to your piece of 2011. It is truer today as it was then and reading through the posts in response to your article then there is a general agreement how much it was appreciated as a great idea with replies from fans still on ToffeeWeb like Greg Anderson who thanked you for the post and was in full agreement with it, also one from Ged Alexander – any relation to Don?

The only general dissent against it was that Bill Kenwright would never let go of his train set and agree to Everton being run properly.

Belated thanks, Christine, for a great plan and proof you have remained consistent in your views on how Kenwright has run the club which also goes for a few more names on that 2011 article still posting the same views in 2022. Eventually, we might see the end of Kenwright having anything to do with our club.

Bernie Quinn
144 Posted 26/06/2022 at 22:50:01
To Danny and Christine - Danny, I am definately more emotional than you. I shed tears at both your replies! I wouldn't be able to write that tribute about the Army - it made me well up reading it. And you Christine saying you were employed by the MoD back in the day. So was my wife Sheila, base at Barton Stacey and Andover, until we came to NZ. All I can say, is Thanks again and I am so glad I am on the same wavelength as you both - though not so articulate.
Don Alexander
145 Posted 27/06/2022 at 02:58:18
Dave (#143) I'm no relation to my namesake Ged.

Michael Kenrick (various), you constantly seek what you call "a plan" from me to topple Kenwright, and then personally deride me for, in your opinion, failing to put one forward.

For the record, I'm not conceited enough to contend I have the answer to the question this very piece by you demands an answer to. Your "plan" is absent too by the way. It's a tirade, echoing me and other perceptive fans – end of, and that's all a website reflecting "opinion" can ever do.

This site was allegedly incepted to carry opinion on Everton Football Club from devoted fans, not to denigrate fans who criticise those in charge of it.

This post of yours may as well have been written by me or any other of the many of us who despair of Kenwright and the blight he's inflicted on our club. Neither you, me, nor anyone else has ever posted a credible plan to oust him, entirely because he's rock-solid in his position on account of his permitted, by disclosure law and Moshiri, malfeasance.

Just to repeat, my "boring" attacks are against the very same, decades-long, ever-present, now fabulously wealthy man you now also credibly deride. He's the reason we'll remain in the doldrums next season and beyond.

So, you and I should with many other perceptive fans continue to rail against him, and refrain from personal attacks against fans of the very same mindset as our own.

Call that a plan, if you like!

Derek Taylor
146 Posted 27/06/2022 at 10:54:39
I suspect Chairman Bill will already have been in touch with Kenyon to offer his on-going services to any new owners. Perhaps even to remain in the chair as a show of continuity !

If this were to be the case, I think that will be sign for all ToffeeWebers to 'militarise'. Enough is surely enough.

Michael Kenrick
147 Posted 27/06/2022 at 14:15:47
You're right, Don, it was a naughty ploy of mine. I thought you might not have a plan.

I'm sorry, I understand how you feel… but it's the need to express it on an almost daily basis in almost every post – that's the obsession bit that gets a bit much, to be continually bombarded with – especially when you have no plan to change it yourself, in effect guaranteeing that your obsession will continue unabated.

But of course there could be no plan because it is not possible for mere fans to oust him. Yet, despite this obvious truth, you persist in your perennial campaign that impregnates itself into almost every post to the point of boring repetition.

Yes, we provide a place for fans to air their views on Everton Football Club... within reason. And we would hope that people would keep it fresh, provide some new perspectives… rather than resorting to posting in its entirety some lengthy tome from 12 years ago – and not once but twice!

But more than that, it's the relentless tirades, the manic diatribes... while a few may nod in agreement, it's an old and very broken record, sad to say. But maybe there's hope that the latest takeover news will finally provide a welcome release.

Tony Abrahams
148 Posted 27/06/2022 at 14:37:12
I’ve laughed and shook my head at Don, taking many threads on a different direction, by going on about Kenwright, but then I think about what Everton have become over time, and when I stop laughing, I continue to shake my head.

Sometimes I feel it would be better to stop posting on ToffeeWeb, because it mostly goes around in circles, and I am as guilty as most people, when it comes to a certain man.

The Anti-Kenwright or pro-Kenwright posts, can be very tedious, but watching Everton has also been mostly tedious for a very long time now, which makes the amazing support, that Everton received towards the end of last season, even more incredible, and is hopefully what is drawing in the investors now?

Probably not, but imagine if it was? Imagine one day, having really great times watching Everton again🤞

Mike Hayes
149 Posted 27/06/2022 at 15:22:37
Tony Shelby or Richard Dodd FFS wake up and smell the coffee you are as delusional as Kenwright. (Are you him as well?)

The facts have been spelled out - what more proof other than a signed confession of Kenwright do you need? 🤷

Don Alexander
150 Posted 27/06/2022 at 16:50:35
Michael, Thank you for the courtesy of your latest reply.

You and I, and many others, share the same view of our club and the prime cause of its diminishing mediocrity.

I think it'd be wrong to waiver in our opposition to his ongoing influence over things but I will try to refrain from exasperating fellow Toffees unless I feel the need in 12 years time, if he's still in post, to regurgitate twice on this site your excellent diatribe at the top!

Michael Kenrick
151 Posted 27/06/2022 at 16:58:38
That sounds like a good deal.

Thanks, Don!

Brian Harrison
152 Posted 27/06/2022 at 17:08:41
As we are now thankfully nearing the end of Moshiri, I was trying to think of any player signing under his tenure that made me go "Wow!"

To be honest, I can't think of one, but maybe that's just me being picky. Would be interested if any player signings under Moshiri got anyone thinking "Wow, what a player!"

Tony Shelby
153 Posted 27/06/2022 at 18:31:16
Brian (152) - James Rodriguez.
Tony Shelby
154 Posted 27/06/2022 at 18:58:51
Mike (149) - Love it. Suggesting that someone who is on the fence about Kenwright’s legacy therefore must be Kenwright. You’re not the first either but take a bow anyway.

I realise that to many of you, merely choosing not to condemn the man means you’re pro-Kenwright (or maybe even Kenwright himself, boom-boom). That’s your choice but goes some way to legitimising my comments at the weekend about some of you acting like cult members. The reaction when I dared address Christine in terms you all happily address others, including me, was further proof. Well I refuse to submit to Stockholm Syndrome and will say it as I see it.

Re: the club’s current state, I will say this:

Farhad Moshiri couldn’t run a piss-up in a brewery. His ownership of the club has been disastrous, associating us with, and making us financially dependent on, Vladimir Putin’s closest ally, and culminating in a relegation near miss.

Provided we get the ‘right’ new owners, then I will welcome them with open arms. If they know what they’re doing, unlike Moshiri, then they can structure the club and its board as they see fit, with or without your friend and mine, Bill [insert your favourite insult] Kenwright.

Dip that in your coffee, Mike.

Christine Foster
155 Posted 27/06/2022 at 19:02:06
Tony 152# Totally agree...the player we never saw..orchestrated out to the tune of FFP, by a manager who should never have been appointed who replaced one who left us at the altar of fame and fortune.

Tony Shelby
156 Posted 27/06/2022 at 19:07:05
Christine - Fantastic pass at Anfield, wasn’t it? Made the pain of lockdown and everything that went with it disappear momentarily.
Christine Foster
158 Posted 27/06/2022 at 19:31:21
Tony, I get the point you are trying to make but the only cult I have ever been involved in is the support of our football club, the love of that club is as ingrained in me as my very being. But that alone does not justify my position on Kenwright which has been borne out of experience of working with millionaires at senior levels who taught me how they ruthlessly deal with ownership, critiscm, risk and money. My opinions have in the main been borne out by the actions of Kenwright who, despite his own love for Everton, has his own wellbeing as his motivator. He is the only person who has profited by our demise, one as an owner and person responsible for the actions of the club, has overseen that demise. It has been his responsibility as owner, as chairman both before and to a more limited state,, post Moshiri, to be held accountable for where we are.
Like it or not, it's how the business world works, when the club is a success they take the plaudits, when it's a failure you take responsibility. I will continue to tell it as I see it, my views borne from personal and professional experience, not indoctrination!
Christine Foster
159 Posted 27/06/2022 at 19:35:33
Tony, yes that pass, I had a smile that's still etched in a memory I will never forget..don't get me started on James, despite all his shortcomings I would have him back tomorrow and play to his strengths not try to work on eliminating his weaknesses.
Christine Foster
160 Posted 27/06/2022 at 19:50:39
When Benitez had his interview he must have raised the matter of James and getting rid. I still feel it was a sacrificial lamb to get Benitez on board.

Given that it was probably the desire of Moshiri to employ him over and despite Kenwright's protests, or at least his disquiet, who had the job of selling it to the fans? Certainly not Moshiri, it was a nice press snow job to get rid of him that the press bought and whipped up..

James was at the end of his career as a top player, one no longer wanted by the elite, but we failed to extend his impact trying to make him do things he had never been good at rather than play to those, yes, fading, strengths.

Tony Abrahams
161 Posted 27/06/2022 at 20:14:49
I personally think you was looking through rose tinted glasses, when you wrote that last paragraph Christine. My own view is that Carlo, gave him carte-Blanche, and Rodriguez only ever played for Ancellotti, in the EPL.

I heard it was definitely Usmanov who appointed Benitez, and this makes sense, (to me) because I’m sure Moshiri, would have wanted to spend a little bit more of his time on Everton, if he was only using his own money?

Tony Shelby
162 Posted 27/06/2022 at 20:25:03
Christine - Let's see what happens next. If the club is sold, Kenwright is retained, and we go onto greater things, it could be argued that he wasn't culpable. I'm sure you and many others might still suggest otherwise, but it would go some way to justifying his continued legacy.

If he isn't retained and we massively improve, you could argue that his removal was a key element. I'd still say that it proves nothing but, there you go.

Obviously, if we're sold, they let Kenwright go and we get relegated, then I'm coming after you all with a pitchfork-wielding mob on the basis that the acquirers must have been reading TW and thought they'd got the fans' pulse.

As for James, he might have been at the end of his career and a flawed diamond but he was our flawed diamond, producing glimpses of brilliance that served as a stark counterpoint to the turgid football we endured for most of 2021-22.

I agree, Benitez probably used the suggestion as his USP when interviewed and Moshiri et al swallowed it, in the knowledge that the footballing genius revolutionary plan would help towards our FFP plight.

As a footnote to the goal at Anfield: A friend of mine had given me a bottle of wine called Everton many years ago. I'd decided that I would save it until we ‘won something'. It got opened that evening and was greatly enjoyed. You could argue that that's a barometer of how little success we've had in recent years.

Christine Foster
163 Posted 27/06/2022 at 20:46:03
Rose-tinted glasses? Okay, yep that's true, but I love class acts and on his day James was a class act. I prefer to remember those bits as they make me smile and keep me warm in winter!

Tony S, that's the problem with hindsight, everyone claims vindication! But you're right of course, pitchforks at dawn it is!

I guess the bottom line is we have failed as a club, on and off the pitch, for the past 30+ years with few good times in-between, if you believe the man. But ultimately it was the way he led that alienated many. Once you lose trust, you lose faith.

Tony Abrahams
164 Posted 27/06/2022 at 21:18:50
You could argue that the night you opened your bottle of wine, because you couldn't save it no longer, is definitely a barometer of the Kenwright years, Tony?

Who brought one of Putin's best friends to Everton? I could go on, but I honestly prefer Usmanov to people like Phillip Green, and definitely don't hold it against Bill Kenwright for bringing one of the richest men in the world into Everton, even if it's ended in failure, because I honestly don't think the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock would be getting built otherwise?

How cold does Christchurch get in the middle of winter, Christine?

Andy Crooks
165 Posted 27/06/2022 at 22:21:17
Don, Michael set you an unenviable, indeed impossible task. Bill Kenwright has lived and continues to live his dream: he won the lottery without buying a ticket and he will never let go.

I would suggest that very few people have ever got as much joy from a toy as Bill has from his club. He loves to be loved and one might assume that a clear demonstration that many Evertonians actually despise him would have some impact.

However, Don, even if you had the power to organize a mass anti-Kenwright rally on the scale and with the passion and intensity of the fervour that saved us from relegation, it would fail. Bill just wouldn't see it. That is his super power; the uncanny, magnificent ability to, actually literally, see only what it pleases him to see.

So, Don, you really must learn to love him, be as one with him and enjoy him while we have him. You know it makes sense.

Christine Foster
166 Posted 27/06/2022 at 22:30:20

The South Island has been getting dumpings of snow, the North Island just dumpings of rain... but temperatures are falling and locally overnights are around freezing. Out of my window, I can see Mount Taranaki full of snow and that's about 20 miles away!

Bernie Quinn
167 Posted 27/06/2022 at 22:36:32
Christine, I don't have a pitchfork, but I do have a sword to go with my cloak. May I be in your team against Mr Shelby?
Christine Foster
168 Posted 27/06/2022 at 22:55:44
Hi Bernie, afraid this is a one-on-one match! But I'll give a good account in dispatches!

Keep hold of your cloak and sword, in the terminology of Game of Thrones, winter is coming, seems worse down were you are than here with the snow! Stay warm!

Bernie Quinn
169 Posted 27/06/2022 at 23:39:52
Thanks, Christine. To Mr Shelby – Are you really serious in your comments about Kenwright, or are you just playing 'The Black Knight' with tongue-in-cheek, hoping to get a rise from everybody?

It certainly does with me – and I don't like it, Sir! I am normally a very mild chap, so let's all be friends, eh?

And Christine and Tony Abrahams: The temperature here in Christchurch at 10:30 am is 5 C (feels like 4 C) with steady cold rain. I am not a winter person!!!

Bernie Quinn
170 Posted 27/06/2022 at 23:57:04
I have to disagree with both Christine and Tony Shelby over James Rodriguez. Whilst agreeing he is a skilful player, I wouldn't rave over him.

There have been many at Everton I would prefer – ranging back from Kevin Sheedy to Wally (Nobby) Fielding – but that is my opinion. Nice to see though that you two agree on something.

Bernie Quinn
171 Posted 27/06/2022 at 00:06:23
ps: In our Supermarket, we have several bottles of Everton wine. We drink it quite often, even though my wife supports the other team. and she agrees with me it is a delicious taste.
Mike Gaynes
172 Posted 28/06/2022 at 00:21:07
Bernie, pour an extra glass of that wine and watch the video of James's highlights from the Carlo season. He could bring you out of your seat as few others could.

Nobby Fielding? Isn't that what happens when you play baseball on a bumpy pitch?

Bernie Quinn
173 Posted 28/06/2022 at 01:07:40
Mike @172,

i feel sorry for you as you obviously never saw Wally Fielding play inside right to Dave Hickson and John Willie Parker. He could make the ball talk – he was that skilful. Ah those were the days.

Baseball? Dunno much about that game – isn't it the male version of Rounders?

Dupont Koo
174 Posted 28/06/2022 at 02:06:13
Well written piece, Michael. It cannot be more spot on with your very last paragraph.

I am still with the belief that the Ownership Group of Man City actually first reached out to Bill the Liar: Our brand and heritage, notwithstanding of our stadium issue, represented a better acquisition than Man City at the time.

Of course Bill's "Up Yours" to the group sent them up the M62 afterwards.

The rest was history.

Brian Murray
175 Posted 28/06/2022 at 07:11:09
Dupont @174.

Never mind all his litany of inept balls-ups. That scenario alone is totally unforgivable and changed the course of history to where we are now.

Even now, I bet a written or unwritten clause is in place that any new owner has to keep him on. Hopefully Kenyon or whoever won't put up with this.

Same as getting a proper CEO who actually understands that role and knows how to make the club money.

Daniel A Johnson
176 Posted 28/06/2022 at 08:01:04
Even the Grim Reaper can't touch Bill Kenwright so we've all got no chance.
Bernie Quinn
177 Posted 28/06/2022 at 08:44:10
Tony @164 – in case you were really interested, here in Christchurch, the temperature never rose above 8 C all day and now, at 7:40 pm, it is 5 C, dropping down tonight to –1 C. But, if you are thinking of emigrating to this city, we do have decent earthquakes!
Dave Abrahams
178 Posted 28/06/2022 at 09:20:12
Bernie (173), Wally Fielding a very good scheming inside forward with a lot of devil in him, I remember him well providing the long passes for Eggo (Tommy Eglington to run onto and centre for John Willie or Davie to head home.

You might not have liked his vocabulary though Bernie he told me to get off the effing coach at Leeds after a 3-1 defeat in our promotion year, his manager Cliff Britton offered me and a couple of mates a £1 note to go and get some fish and chips on the same occasion, we thanked but told him we had already had something to eat.

Michael Kenrick
179 Posted 28/06/2022 at 09:24:17
Bernie, enough of the weather reports from New Zealand, please. Football only – and contemporary rather than ancient, if you don't mind.

We are not a museum you know!

Brian Harrison
180 Posted 28/06/2022 at 09:27:53

I think Wally Fielding and Dave Hickson were my first Everton heroes, always remember Wally always had hold of the end of his shirt when he played, don't quite know how he did that. Cyril Lello was also in that team along with Don Donavon, and as you say Tommy Eglington on the wing happy days.

Dave Abrahams
181 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:03:42
Brian (180) yes Wally always had his two two shirt sleeves balled in his hands, he played for England once in a game I think was charity match for the dependants of the Bolton disaster when a lot of fans were killed.

He was signed after the Second World War in a dispute with Charlton Ath. who had also signed him and he played with many notable players when I first saw him, Jock Dodds, Alex Stevenson, TG Jones, Peter Farrell, Ted Sagar and the players you mentioned along with Harry Potts and Eddie Wainwright.

Michael (179)Ah hey Michael what’s wrong with ancients we’re all part of Everton’s history and you’ll miss us when we’re gone- - - - - - I think!!

Dale Rose
182 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:07:01
Cat amongst the pigeons there Michael. Well done. If we sell to a professional outfit that know how to run a club and to make money, I think Kenwright would go. The last few years have been a disaster. That's down to the board and an owner who should have bought a Subbuteo Set. Name the new stadium after Bill and make him life president. It would then be adios.
Tony Shelby
183 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:18:32
Bernie (169) - Yes, my comments are genuine.

From your own, it appears that you are falling into the trap of thinking that by not condemning Kenwright, I am therefore pro-Kenwright. That’s not the case. I just don’t see him as the sole (or even primary) cause of our current predicament.

I know this is TW but opinions contrary to your own, Christine’s etc do exist.

Anyway, back to that wine (rather than an anti-Bill whine): Yes, it’s an Ozzie red so presumably far easier to obtain in New Zealand. If it’s readily available where you are then you’re very lucky. I’d suggest that you go into business, buying bottles in bulk and exporting it back to the motherland. Put me down for a few if you do.

Dave Abrahams
184 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:20:07
Dale (182)Dale you’ve just threw another cat amongst the pigeons. “ Name the new stadium after him and make him life president”. Just making a large banner “ Kenwright Out” !!
Dale Rose
185 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:40:42
Dave 184. Symbolic mate. No power.
Ian Hollingworth
186 Posted 28/06/2022 at 10:53:49
Apparently Bill was having his tea with Levy last night in Scotts in London so get ready for the deal of the century

Spurs get Richie and Gordon, we get Ali and Winks with no money exchanged!!!

The man has been at the helm for the worst period of our history and is Chairman so he has to accept some responsibility for the clubs failings.

Now is the time to go BIll and it is long overdue.

Dave Abrahams
187 Posted 28/06/2022 at 11:30:03
Dale ((185), Dale symbolic or not too much for me although you got half of it right, bolic. How about all the Gents toilets in the new stadium having brass plaques with “ Bills Gaff” on them.
Stephen Vincent
188 Posted 28/06/2022 at 12:23:06
Dave, rather than brass plaques perhaps we could have his picture at the bottom of the urinals, then we could piss on him like he has pissed on us for the last 27 years.
Tony Abrahams
189 Posted 28/06/2022 at 14:53:03
Thanks for those weather reports Bernie, and take no notice of Michael, just because he’s only interested in recent match reports, mate! I could have quite easily lost my life on Mount Taranaki, Christine, and was very lucky to get away with only dislocating my elbow.

New Zealand wasn’t kind to me Bernie, and even though it’s a fantastic place, I wouldn’t want to return, especially now I can drive the long way home, just so I can go past Bramley Moore, and dream….hopefully about the start of a much better era for our football team🤞

Will you be lucky enough to get back inside Goodison before it closes Bernie? I’ll give you my seat for any game, just as long as it’s not for the last one, (even though I’m sure you have said you are an ex-copper!) because this is something I’m sure will eclipse the Crystal Palace game by a million miles.

Dave Abrahams
190 Posted 28/06/2022 at 15:04:15
Stephen (188),

Yes, sod the brass plaques – yours is a much better idea! I'll make sure I have a good few pints before I use the toilet in the new ground!!

James Hughes
191 Posted 28/06/2022 at 15:08:02
Michael, I would have to disagree on the last sentence

We are not a museum you know!

Some of the arguments on here have been going years and some grudges for longer. Not quite museum but maybe getting into vintage. :-)

Richard Jones
192 Posted 28/06/2022 at 16:56:15

I see that you believe Moshiri to be more to blame for all our ills.

Wasn't Kenwright looking for the right type of investment and knocked back the likes of Mansour because, to him, they were deemed unsuitable?

So, bearing this in mind, surely it's Kenwright's fault he's here...

Tony Shelby
193 Posted 28/06/2022 at 17:50:16
Richard (192),

That's like saying that if you started a 6-year relationship with someone who was a dream at first but turned out over time to be an absolute nightmare, it was your fault for choosing them.

What's interesting is that there are so-called ‘facts' about Kenwright that many of you regurgitate ad infinitum without ever considering their validity. They're rarely questioned by other posters which has created this whole narrative that's constantly peddled on TW. When someone appears and says they're not convinced, it's like the sky has fallen in. How dare they suggest that the world might not be quite as you see it.

Moshiri owns 92% of the club; for some reason pursued Ronald Koeman and Marco Silva; told Sky TV presenter Jim White that we didn't buy a central midfielder ‘out of loyalty to James McCarthy'; allowed £500M to be spent on (predominantly) utter shite; brought Rafa fucking Benitez to the club, culminating in us nearly getting relegated and generally becoming a laughing stock. All of these are actual facts, not conjecture or ‘ToffeeWeb Urban Legend' ©, and happened over a period of 6 years. But, obviously, it was Kenwright wot dunnit.

Danny O’Neill
194 Posted 28/06/2022 at 18:04:36
Nothing wrong with having a different view, Tony, even when swimming against the tide or running against the wind. I genuinely respect that.

Bill was here long before Moshiri. And the stagnation set in before that time.

I don't often do the "someone told me" thing unless I have it on good account. It was interesting talking to a very well informed person after a match last season who did have knowledge at the time that Mansour's first and preferred option was Everton.

Our regime at the time apparently showed him the door and sent him down the East Lancs Road by all accounts. That wasn't Moshiri's decision as he wasn't here. Talk about judgement. Talk about making the best decision for the club over self-interest.

Hindsight may be a great thing but, even now, I'm hearing (just hearing – I don't know) that Kenwright is angling for a deal that keeps him in the Chair.

Sorry, but whichever way you look at it, he is consistent factor, the common denominator over the last near 30 years.

And Tony, I do honestly respect your counter view. It's welcome.

Tony Abrahams
195 Posted 28/06/2022 at 18:05:27
In a nutshell, Tony, and just so he could stay involved.
Chris Leyland
196 Posted 28/06/2022 at 18:29:45
Tony Shelby - here is an indisputable fact: Kenwright’s has been on the board of directors for the entire period of the club’s longest trophyless run in our history. He was the owner for a large portion of that time and he has been chairman and a member of the board of directors who are responsible for the day to day running of the club since he made himself a multi-millionaire by selling to Moshiri.

All of the facts you entirely blame Moshiri for happened whilst Kenwright was on the board of directors and whilst he was chairman of said board. Did he resign in protest? Indisputable fact - no he did not. As such, he is complicit and accountable along with Moshiri.

He has gone from being responsible for allowing the club to drift further into mediocrity whilst he was the owner to being front and centre and therefore complicit in the shit show that has happened since his 24/7/365 search for investment was finally concluded. He’s made himself very rich in the process but we should all be thankful for the “world’s greatest Evertonian” for what we’ve become.

Tony Shelby
197 Posted 28/06/2022 at 18:59:27
Danny (194) - If that were a pretty-much 100% nailed-on fact then I could understand why some Evertonians would be pissed off. I'm no fan of sportswashing and had already drawn a line in the sand for myself if Usmanov had taken over, but I know I'm in the minority.

The problem is, within the last 24 hours, another TW poster has said that they had been told we didn't get the deal because City had a stadium and we didn't, and I've seen numerous interpretations of the same scenario over the years on TW. So, with all of these inconsistent accounts, how do I decide which one is true? Easy, I don't.

And before anyone suggests that I'm being awkward, it's worth considering my own position. My best mate has a friend who works at the club and has done for years. He frequently gives my mate the ‘heads-up' on what's happening at the club or what is going to occur next. But guess what? He's hardly ever right, and for one simple reason: unless you're on the board at Everton, you don't really have much of a clue as to what's going on.

Many of us have worked for companies where there's gossip about the senior managers and what's going to happen next. How often is it right? Your mate might work for Vauxhall and have lots of info, but that doesn't make him any the wiser about what decisions are being taken in the boardroom.

Chris (196) - I've addressed that point several times and we're clearly not going to agree. All I would add is that the points I made about Moshiri are facts and have happened over a short period of time, whereas almost everything I see spouted about Kenwright on a minute-by-minute basis is hearsay, conjecture and (possibly) bollocks.

And what's wrong with him being a millionaire? I'd be embarrassed if the Chairman of our club wasn't. What are we saying, that we're okay with Vladimir Putin's closest ally (allegedly) laundering money through our club (£30M for first dibs on stadium naming rights) but Bill Kenwright isn't allowed to make a profit on legitimate share sales?

Brian Murray
198 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:00:53
I think Mr Shelby needs to open his eyes or at least have a peaky at what's happening at the club he says he supports.
Christine Foster
199 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:05:33
Michael, #179 half a mo, I think you're being harsh on Bernie, this website is for all things Everton, past and present, but more than that, much more, it's a social network that is worldwide of Evertonians, young and old. It forms bonds with people and cultures you never get to see or hear about in L4.

Trying to stay contemporary and not look at our past is impossible and would end up being a very sterile site. Sharing memories connects people, Evertonians are a family because of it. The weather in New Zealand may be totally irrelevant but the social side of being an Evertonian is just as important as the daily news because it fills the void when news is slow or breaks up contentious arguments with humor.

It's a great site Michael, full of diverse views and opinion, but most of all it's full of Evertonians who support the club and find friendships on these pages even if it's not relevant to Lampard's breakfast or conjecture on a player of no relevance. It may be a by-product of the intent of the site, but it's a great one that increases the site's richness to all of us.

Tony Shelby
200 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:12:08
Brian (198) - Ah, the classic “you’re not a ‘proper’ supporter” reposte.

I just need you to suggest that I’m actually Kenwright himself (or one of his lackeys) and you win today’s ToffeeWeb Cliché Bingo.

First prize is a map telling you where the Arteta money is buried.

Brian Murray
201 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:22:18
Tony, ha ha, okay but all anyone on here is asking you to do is not heresay, just look at the facts over two decades. long before Moshiri was here.
Tony Shelby
202 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:25:09
Brian - ‘Facts’.
Brian Murray
204 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:32:38
Tony, Jeez, I'd be here all night. Look you don't like to scratch the surface of the ineptitude that's rife so the tangerine trees and marmalade skies suits you obviously.
Chris Leyland
205 Posted 28/06/2022 at 19:41:26
Tony - absolutely nothing wrong with him being a millionaire but the fact (your favourite word) is that he made the vast majority of his money by selling his shares in Everton to Moshiri.

He must also be the luckiest man... yet, at the same time, the unluckiest man in the world. Lucky that he managed to make a fortune from the club through selling to the new bloke after searching so hard and tirelessly 24/7/365 for so many years. Incredibly unlucky that the new bloke turned out to be so clueless after all those years of such diligent searching.

He's also incredibly unlucky to be apportioned any blame for the decline in the club despite being involved in running it for over 30 years. He must just have been in the wrong place at the wrong time for people to think he might have had anything to do with the decline during that time.

Tony Abrahams
206 Posted 28/06/2022 at 20:05:22
If I ever had the chance to own Liverpool, I’d love to get away with doing a similar job, is the only conclusion I ever come to, whenever I think about Bill Kenwright’s absolutely awful reign.
Eugene Ruane
207 Posted 28/06/2022 at 20:11:20
We open at a table in Scott's (fish restaurant) Mayfair, London.

A waiter clears plates from the table.

Bill Kenwright and Daniel Levy sit back in their seats appearing fully sated.

BK: "My fish fingers, chips and peas was boss. How was your lobster therm..os...flas.."

DL: "Thermidor, it was decent enough. So, to business Bill. You have a player we want, what will it take to.."

BK: "Hey did I ever tell you about Dave Hicks..."

DL: "Bill!"

BK: " yeah Coleman, well he won't be cheap, he's very popu..."

DL: "For fuc...the Brazilian lad Bill - Richarlison."

BK: "Oh yeah Ritchie we call him, he's boss, we won't be giving him away cheap that's for su...are you 'avin a pudding like?"

Levy snaps his fingers and a waiter delivers two menus. Both men look intently.

DL: (to waiter) "The Creme Brulee"

BK: "Oh that sounds nice...what is it like?"

DL: (sigh) "TWO creme brulee"

Waiter: "We only have one I'm afraid sir."

DL: "He can have it."

BK: "Are you sure? That's very nice of you."

DL: (thinks) "Well how about this, you have the creme brulee, we get Richarlison?"


We cut to Bill shoving the expensive egg custard into his grid as DL shoves a contract in front of Mr Everton.

Bill signs..there..there..and..there and goes back to his pudding.

DL: "Well as usual Bill you drive a hard bargain. I've got to head off but don't rush your dinner. We'll speak soon."

Levy heads off into the night.

BK's just finishing his pudding as his mobile rings. He listens then says..

BK: "Just 'avin me puddin' like"

He continues listening.

BK: "Yeah I signed a contract but don't worry I don't think it's..."

He sharply pulls his head away from the phone as someone is obviously screaming abuse at him.

He turns the phone off and now looks concerned.

The Waiter appears and says "Your bill sir"

Bill now looks confused and concerned.

Then he looks at the bill and his eyes open VERY wide.

Then he shits himself.

We see a smiling Daniel Levy sitting in the back of a chauffeur-driven Bentley as it speeds into the night.

The music from The Long Good Friday begins..


Danny O’Neill
208 Posted 28/06/2022 at 20:17:05
That made me smile, Eugene.

Although nervously, as even in its creativeness, that may not be far off that hypothetical transfer discussion between the two!!

Tony Abrahams
209 Posted 28/06/2022 at 20:21:20
Kenwright would probably just sit back in his chair, smile and think, "What a fucking tune, I've come a long way from Coronation Street!"
Christine Foster
210 Posted 28/06/2022 at 20:34:00
Eugene, that's just too uncomfortable to be funny! I don't know what rock I have been hiding under for so many years, but that's the first time I have heard that theme..
Christine Foster
211 Posted 28/06/2022 at 21:07:25
Act 2.. the scene shifts to A small office in Monaco overlooking the bay. Farhad Moshiri slams the phone down and stares at it, purple with anger still in utter disbelief. Muttering in a strange dialect that's almost sounds like scouse..
FM: "Fuckwot"
Secretary: "it's fuckwit sir"
FM: "No, it's that awful man, Kenwhite"
Secretary: That's Wright sir"
FM: "I know it's right!"
Secretary: "I'll get Mr White for you.."
FM: " What? wait, "
Secretary: " Putting you through now sir"
Jim White of Talksport fame..
JW: "Farhad my friend, it's just hit the fan here, Gordon and Richarlison to Spurs? Done deal, just had David on the show saying how wonderful it was doing business with such a great club!"

Moshiri tries hard to steady his shaking hand, Richarlison and Gordon?

"Jim, I think your mistaken, Bill was only discussing it with David, nothing more"
JW: " No, I have the signed agreement in front of me, didn't you know?
FM: Look Jim, there has been a misunderstanding, Bill is a total fuckwot"
JW: "Wit, Farhad"
FM: "What wit?"
JW: " Thanks for being so candid Farhad, our switchboard is lighting up! "
FM: "Wait, what, am I on air?"
JW: "Of course Farhad! Always the first with breaking news..hang on, I got Frank Lampard on line one.."

Bernie Quinn
212 Posted 28/06/2022 at 21:10:43
Michael Kenrick - Sorry - Because I'm so old, I live more in the past than most of you. It seems that others remember the old days with affection as well, but I take your point - I am just a nuisance. I will remain quiet.
Bernie Quinn
213 Posted 28/06/2022 at 21:35:07
Christine @ 199 - I should have read further on after Michael but I was upset. Thanks Love for your support, but it seems I keep saying the wrong thing, so perhaps if I shut up then Michael will be happy - after all it is his website.
Sean Kelly
214 Posted 28/06/2022 at 21:47:17
Michael #179 regarding your comments to Bernie have a bit of respect please. This site is supposed to embrace all Evertonians no matter their opinion or age profile. Luckily Bernie has experienced some highs in the past with this club and rightly reminisce.
Is this site to become one for only the opinions that agree with yours.
As you know our successes are long gone over the horizon and maybe the under 30s here might welcome comments from the older Evertonians.
Christine as usual you said it better than I can.
Just for the record Bernie it’s rain here. Suits the mood at our beloved club.
Sean Kelly
215 Posted 28/06/2022 at 21:48:56
Bernie keep hitting the keyboard your views are most welcome here lad.
Tony Hill
216 Posted 28/06/2022 at 22:00:45
Bernie, ignore the gerontophobe. He's weird.
Michael Kenrick
217 Posted 28/06/2022 at 22:19:24
Bernie, sorry to have admonished you as you've asked some good questions about football stuff that have made us explain things with greater clarity. That's fine. That's what young people call posting "on topic".

Then you've blathered on about the weather in Christchurch. That's not "on topic" and unfortunately what the young people would say is that it triggers a bad reaction for some sensitive people reading the thread who then suffer all sorts of distress and anguish. I'm sure you wouldn't want that on your conscience, would you?

So be a good chap and keep it "on topic", okay. Thanks!

Sean Kelly
218 Posted 28/06/2022 at 22:35:03
Bernie Quinn
219 Posted 28/06/2022 at 22:48:29
Michael@ 217 - I don't think I was 'blathering' about the weather. Tony Abrahams had asked Christine about CHCH weather and I was merely giving him an update. I don't think the younger readers were upset with my writing - (it seems that it was only you) so I don't have it on my conscience. I also fail to understand why you didn't like me talking about Wally Fielding and the 'old days' Other posters didn't seem to object. I AM upset with your ruling but I don;t want to rock the boat so I will just shut up
Christine Foster
220 Posted 28/06/2022 at 23:10:00
Michael, was that an attempt at sarcasm? If so it fell on its face..
Young people indeed
Tom Bowers
221 Posted 28/06/2022 at 23:12:40
Some people just love a platform to run off at the mouth and I suppose this column is as good as any to do it given all the downers we fans have had to suffer for many years since the last trophy.

Quite a few of us are ''old farts'' who have experienced so many ups and downs since the year dot and so, as we all get crankier with age it is expected that we like to rant on about everyone connected to the club to the extent that even the tea lady is not without blame for what has happened to this once great club.

Sometimes going off topic happens when there is not much else to comment about and I believe we should all be a little more tolerant when it happens but there are limits I suppose.

Bernie Quinn
222 Posted 28/06/2022 at 23:18:02
Sean Kelly @ 215- Thanks Sean and to others who posted. As for keep on hitting the keyboard - whats the point? I'm getting too old and tired to keep my end up and lets face it - Michael is in the box seat - my posts can be (and have been) deleted any time he wants. I might as well be a good lad and do as I'm told. Makes for a quiet life for everyone
Sean Kelly
223 Posted 28/06/2022 at 23:21:53
Michael your attempt at either an apology or sarcasm have failed miserably. Maybe now we are the young “people’s club” thankfully this club that stretchers beyond the recent miserable season.
What’s the cut off point for having a valuable and respected opinion on this site. Everyone’s opinions and contributions should be respected. I have seen some inane comments on here but yours @ 217 goes top of the pile. Congratulations.
Stephen Vincent
225 Posted 28/06/2022 at 00:28:35
Tony # 197 et al.

Pretty sure that the guy Danny refers to is me and the conversation was in the Crown on Lime St.

Danny did get one thing wrong Newcastle were the Sheikh's first choice, Everton were second. The group wanted a club that owned their own ground and had an under developed airport close by.
Mike Ashley had only been in charge at Newcastle for just over a year and wouldn't sell. We were second choice (even though Goodison had been mortgaged to the hilt by BK), but the Arab group wanted a clean break and offered BK a life presidency he chose not to accept this honorary position and consequently the Sheikh went up the East Lancs, where he did get a clean break from Thaksin Shinawatra and who did accept the honorary role (although he was subsequently stripped of this following his conviction in his own country for misuse of public funds).

The consequence of this was that East Manchester rather than L4 had £2bn invested in its rejuvenation and Manchester Airport became a European hub for Etihad Airways rather than John Lennon. Not to mention the consequences for EFC as a club.

Incidentally, City do not own their own ground, it always has been owned by Manchester City Council, although these days the club has a virtual freehold as deals have been done, especially when City wanted to increase capacity to 60k.

I worked as an accountant for Shinawatra at the time of the take over and subsequently for the new City.

Brian Murray
226 Posted 29/06/2022 at 00:48:05
Never really rated man city as a fan base although quite loyal and got 30 thousand plus in the dark times their is just not enough of them. Especially in manchester itself. Fair play to them thanks to our chairman they are living the dream. This window and especially the takeover will decide Franks fate and define what division we end up in. Or failing that we trundle on to bmd in mid table not really troubling anybody. That’s the clubs dream no doubt.
Mike Gaynes
227 Posted 29/06/2022 at 03:12:59
Stephen #225, brilliant information, thank you.

Bernie, you keep posting whatever you damn well please. I love your little items.

Eugene and Christine, thanks for those flights of literary fancy.

Just the mention of Scott's Seafood is painful for me. I was once a regular at the original Scott's in San Francisco. Took a lot of first dates there. Spent a lot of money.

And the answer to the obvious question is...

No. Never. Not once.

Bernie Quinn
228 Posted 29/06/2022 at 05:37:14
Mike at 227, Thank you very much Mike for your post. I just don't know what I have done for Mr Kenrick to dislike me, I mean there are plenty of other post that do not have a football content that he has just ignored, I can understand now what Frank Lampard must have felt like with all the Referees - VAR - Premier League, etc having a go at him. Very upsetting. But I will take your advice and that of earlier posts, and continue writing if something comes to mind - and just hope that Mr K, leaves me alone. I'm not trying to hurt anyone. Thanks again.
Danny O’Neill
229 Posted 29/06/2022 at 06:01:19
Thanks Stephen and for correcting my error!!

I didn't want to call you out in name. I wasn't being clandestine, I just would never disclose given it was a conversation between a few of us, not public.

Your account speaks to the subject. Just let go Bill. As you should have done years ago.

Danny O’Neill
230 Posted 29/06/2022 at 06:10:40
Keep going Bernie. North end upbringing if I recall? Ex Irish Guards. If you come on here, just bring your welcome opinion, thick skin and an ability to retaliate respectfully (as you do). A tin hat often helps too!

Keep posting. Keep believing. Not that you need me to tell you the latter.

Bernie Quinn
231 Posted 29/06/2022 at 07:35:16
Danny at 230 - So pleased to hear from you Danny and thanks for your comments. A bit embarrassing having so many posters supporting me. I just hope now that Mr K will stop picking on me, but I suppose that is asking too much!
Tony Abrahams
232 Posted 29/06/2022 at 07:49:00
I always thought City, were on a par with Everton regarding their fanbase Brian, and sometimes think that they take a lot of unfair stick, from both our neighbours, and also their own?

They were getting a lot of stick for not selling out for some champions league group games, but aren’t they still getting around 50.000 most weeks?

This is why I also think Everton have got it right regarding the capacity of Bramley Moore, especially because it can go up a few thousand, once they put the safe standing in?

Danny O’Neill
233 Posted 29/06/2022 at 08:16:47
I'd agree on the capacity thing Tony. I think the club has done it's analysis and been realistic.

Sorry to bang the Schalke drum again, but using them as an example, and a point I've made several times.

For international matches, when only seated, it has a capacity of just over 54,000. For league matches when safe standing and seating is implemented, the capacity is just over 62,000. Hopefully Everton are planning something similar as it gets introduced.

I've been in the Stadio Olimpico to watch Roma. The crowd was decent; 40,000. But in a stadium that can accommodate 70,000, it was half empty. Which creates a half empty atmosphere.

Give me a full to the rafters stadium an day.

Brian Murray
234 Posted 29/06/2022 at 09:32:42
Tony @232,

Maybe they bump it up with non-City fans as corporate. Bit like all of a sudden West Ham get over 50,000.

Anyway, as a truck driver and in Manchester a lot, City fans are totally outnumbered at least 4 to 1.

I could say that about us but as Covid found out, we have at least 26,000 from the city while they had 6,000 with Merseyside postcodes.

As you know, our away fans second to none. Especially in numbers... They have been through a lot but a tragedy is not us, just for one man's ego.

Danny O’Neill
235 Posted 29/06/2022 at 10:18:34
Now you open a debate Brian.

West Ham? Those white seats always expose the number of empty ones. I saw it in person. Just like at The Etihad. Just like at The Emirates.

What they declare as the attendance seems to be tickets sold, not actual attendance. Be that match day, season tickets or corporate hospitality. But the figure doesn't always reflect what is actually in the stadium on the day.

We will fill the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock and create the spirit of Goodison on the banks of the Mersey.

Christine Foster
236 Posted 29/06/2022 at 13:24:06
When you consider the horrendous season we have just had, despite it, every home game – even against Boreham Wood – was at ground capacity. I tried getting a ticket for my son's birthday a while back... not a hope..

I think 52,000 is more than achievable, think of the extra season ticket sales and the opportunist turnstile sales, it's going to be full – no problem!

In keeping the capacity at that level, it will create atmosphere, which, if the motivation is there, will create a bear pit, an imposing pressure cooker. If they had gone for more, then it would be at the cost of that atmosphere. Bring it on.

Brian Murray
237 Posted 29/06/2022 at 13:32:03
I'm sure even EFC know, by the time the stadium is ready, there will be government legislation right across the board for safe standing, so I'm sure we won't have to settle on this 52,800.

The scale of the site is apparently a lot bigger than it looks through a drone etc,

Brian Wilkinson
239 Posted 03/07/2022 at 00:47:34
Tony Shelby, I mean this politely, but after reading some of your comments, it reminds me of the Monty Python sketch, "What did the Romans do for us?"

Every time a poster has come up with a suitable explanation, you still somehow manage to defend our Chairman.

Even this season, after three occasions of fans unrest, Bill still managed to put the blame elsewhere. First it was Brands, then Rafa, then there was the #27 campaign which was sadly lost before it even started, due to fans not wishing to leave their seats – and rightly so, but had it been organised better, and had it happened, outside the 90 mins, it could have worked.

After that, we were in a relegation fight, so we got behind the team. We the fans saved Everton from relegation, absolutely no way we could make our feelings known in a protest.

But something has to be done, before the start of the new season, we simply cannot move forward with Bill still Chairman.

I will gladly join any marches organised, but a while back I put a post up about Keioc campaign, it mentions a lot about what Mike has listed above.

Even Peter Johnson who a lot have mentioned we were glad to get rid of, at least left Everton in the black, landed us a trophy, and had a new stand built.

Since then, we have gradually become stagnant, having to rent our own training ground, having to sell our best players, year after year.

So yes, Tony, I am fuming over our Chairman. I will at every opportunity vent my grievances because that guy has turned the football club I love into a complete shambles.

He knows we will never turn our back on the club we love. I just do not have the answers of what we as fans can do to make our feelings known.

I know a lot of posters on here are far from keyboard warriors, a lot never miss a game. I take my hat off to them, such loyalty.

When a large percentage of fans are saying the same things, then there really is a problem that needs addressing.

I just cannot for the life of me see how people can still support Bill.

Brendan McLaughlin
240 Posted 03/07/2022 at 01:08:48
Brian #239,

"But something has to be done, before the start of the new season, we simply cannot move forward with Bill still Chairman."

I mean this politely but I'm guessing Blue Bill's staying... what's your plan?

Brian Wilkinson
241 Posted 03/07/2022 at 15:46:46
Well, we could start the bandwagon rolling, with the pre-season friendly at Blackpool.

A little March down the Golden Mile, voicing our feelings at the game.

For the 27-minute campaign, there was a simple solution, I suggested at the time, but the leave your seats remained and the plan of action that failed. For me, on the 27th minute, for one minute, all it took was for people to stand in their seats and turn their backs for the minute, a simple but effective message, in front of the cameras, and the board.

If things are not going to plan, the next guy to take the rap will be Frank, and so on, while Bill still remains.

On a final note, we have heard Moshiri, through an open letter, admitting he got things wrong etc, possibly done by PR, but over the last few years and way beyond, has anyone ever heard Bill once say, “I'm sorry, this or that was my fault”?

We have heard him throw everyone else under the bus, from Philip Green, Brands, Rafa, even the owner, even turned round to a fan to say we've had good times rather than say he was wrong.

Moshiri has to take the blame as well, but at least we got a sort of apology letter. In 20-odd years, I have never once seen Bill hold his hands up and apologise. Instead, he throws someone else under the bus and trust me, if things start off bad next season, he will throw Frank under the bus.

Brian Wilkinson
242 Posted 03/07/2022 at 15:56:15
Marching down the Golden Mile, all the windows open wide.

When you hear the Toffees shout, "Hey, get Bill Kenwright out! We are the Goodison gang."

John Keating
243 Posted 07/07/2022 at 14:07:17
Well one lying bastard has just resigned
What a day it would be if our one went as well
Steve Brown
244 Posted 07/07/2022 at 14:32:46
John @ 243, Bill has tried to rally his supporters like Boris did to avoid eviction. Think his bank manager turned up.
Steavey Buckley
245 Posted 07/07/2022 at 14:51:29
My biggest regret about Bill Kenwright was being a chairman without any of his own money to give to any manager. During a period when Abramovich bankrolled Chelsea for over a billion pounds.

That is the basic reason why Chelsea went from strength to strength and why Everton had to be kept miraculously alive by the management skills of David Moyes, who had a pitiful transfer budget compared to the massive transfer budgets given to managers at Chelsea.

Nick Page
246 Posted 07/07/2022 at 15:03:16
Ah, my favourite ever TW article from the great Colin Fitzpatrick. Not sure what he's up to now - the Esk might know?

Anyway we need sustained fan action to shake off the parasite. And that means all the ambivalent and quite frankly blind as fuck Evertonians getting involved. I blame them as much as Bill for the past 20 years to be honest. Absolutely shameful bunch.

Kenwright Out.

John Keating
247 Posted 07/07/2022 at 15:26:54
Colin was brilliant. Regardless of the many pro-Bill and move to Kirkby brigade, Colin absolutely nailed them on facts, figures and the politics of the planned move.

Supporters against the move and, like myself, Blue Union supporters took so much stick from the Kenwright acolytes. Thank God common sense prevailed and the continuous lies fully exposed.

How Kenwright never walked after that is as mysterious as Johnson staying so long.

Danny O’Neill
248 Posted 07/07/2022 at 15:46:28
Brian, you sum it up well.

I am no raving rebel. I will always give someone a chance. But I am not submissive either. It became apparent to me years ago that change was and is needed and Bill should have moved on. Some predicted it earlier. That's my bad for clinging onto hope.

Many done it with Moyes at the managerial level. They were made for each other in hindsight.

I don't want credit, but I expended a lot of money, emotion, time, effort and, on occasion, risk to my relationship with my good lady last season following us around the country. And a home game is as much effort as an away trip as an away game to me. Often more. No complaints, only fond memories that will continue.

But it backs up your points. We, the supporters, pulled them back from the cliff edge. And like you say, when most are saying the same thing, including the moderates, we can't all be wrong.

We want change. Change the culture. Even if we don't change the ownership, change the board, especially the Chairman.

Change it now.

Kevin Molloy
249 Posted 07/07/2022 at 16:01:36
I used to laugh at Villa fans when they loathed Doug Ellis like they did, but it seems we've got our own Mr Ellis now. Of course he was from another generation.

I remember him being interviewed and trying to downplay his testy relationship with John Gregory: "When I told John we'd signed Ginola, he jumped for joy'.

Just as economical as Bill with the actualité.

Danny O’Neill
250 Posted 07/07/2022 at 16:08:49
With the wife being a Villa supporter along with many of her West Midlands fans Kevin, I get your point about Ellis.

I was always suspicious of someone who named a stand after himself whilst still alive though?

Kevin Molloy
251 Posted 07/07/2022 at 16:20:26
Imagine that, Danny.

“Two tickets for the next home game please.”

“We've only got obstructed views in the Bill Kenwright Stand, I'm afraid.”

“That's okay, I'll take them.”

Brian Wilkinson
252 Posted 08/07/2022 at 17:20:47
Quick update about posters saying why do you not come up with something then.

Action is being organised, a group of Evertonians have ordered a banner, more will be known next week, but up to now a group has been set up, enough is enough, they are organising a March at Goodison, before the season starts, and does not have an impact during a game.

Up to now it is pencilled in for Saturday 30th July, no time yet.

So if any other posters have had enough of our Chairman, lend your support to fellow Evertonians.

Once everything has been agreed, I will come back to this post, and give you an excact date and time of the fans gathering at Goodison.

Michael Kenrick
253 Posted 08/07/2022 at 18:04:29
Brian, that's excellent news, thanks for keeping us updated.

If I could ask a favour of you, when you do have more, could you submit it as an article as this thread is already somewhat long in the tooth.


Brian Wilkinson
254 Posted 08/07/2022 at 18:19:12
No probs Micheal, will submit all details when finalised on a new thread.
Tricia Wood
255 Posted 11/07/2022 at 12:06:54
I am absolutely horrified that Everton have partnered with I would like to know exactly who signed off on this deal. Online betting addiction causing havoc to people's lives. The People's Club! I don't think so.

The deal shows me what a mess our club is in and most Evertonians will feel shame at being associated with this sponsor. Even those that don't care – the £10 million pound deal just isn't worth the bad and tacky publicity.

Brian Wilkinson
256 Posted 11/07/2022 at 20:43:54
I have more information now and a set date for the Enough is Enough campaign. I will submit everything on a new thread.

Look out for Enough is Enough.

Dennis Stevens
257 Posted 11/07/2022 at 21:10:28
I'm not sure about this Enough Is Enough campaign, Brian. I just can't see an old Status Quo B-side from '81 supplanting Z-Cars.
Kunal Desai
258 Posted 11/07/2022 at 21:16:16
Thanks Brian. Look forward to the submission.

In the meantime, banners – or should I say bedsheets – have gone up around Goodison to the effect of Kenwright and Moshiri to go.

Enough really is enough. Get these people out of our club, however uncomfortable it gets for them.

Brian Wilkinson
259 Posted 11/07/2022 at 21:25:44
Once Mike has put the post up, you will have all the information, it will be Friday 5th Aug 7:30pm, a banner, a statement and media will be there, so hoping some fellow ToffeeWebbers will be able to attend a peaceful gathering.
Tony Abrahams
260 Posted 11/07/2022 at 21:51:48
This is something that has got to be really pushed now, otherwise things will never get better.
Jim Lloyd
261 Posted 11/07/2022 at 23:04:13
The people who make the point that there is no direct evidence that Everton directed Sheik Mansoor up the East Lancs Road to Man City, are wrong. There is a lot more than heresay and, as has Danny, I've been told by a very reputable source, that he was interested in Everton FC.

The thing is, there are people to protect, by not blabbing where the information came from. So those who decry that information... well, it's their choice. I believe implicitly, that what I've been told and repeated, is the case.

Whatever, look at where we are! Our football reputation has been going from bad to worse, to a massive joke, under the Chairmanship of Bill Kenwright.

There is no disputing the fact that Kenwright was helped in his takeover by Mr Gregg and his Missus. If I remember right, it was Mrs Gregg who funded Our Beloved Leader's share purchase.

We can go on and on with examples of Shifty Kecks's gob on the big screen, to his great big picture looking down on the masses from his speck on the wall in Goodison Road, and all the rest of the total playacting from this charlatan.

I wasn't going to mention the episode where he introduced (from some bloody country in the back of beyond) a True Blue Evertonian who heroically fought off Mr Gregg's bid to take over the club. As I remember, that money is still in the bank... (I think it was the Royal Bank of Toytown!)

Never mind the whole horrible years before Moshiri came. What about all the money that Mr Moshiri has poured into this club? What about the split in the crowd's loyalty when we got Rafa as our manager? What about the last bloody season, for the gods' sake?

Where was the guiding hand unifying the Board and the supporters at a time when a new, young manager was thrown into a maelstrom of angst during the last few months of the last awful season? Where were the words of wisdom from our beloved Chairman? Exhorting us all – supporters, players, with himself at the head – that we will fight every minute of every game to protect our history?

I must admit, I was brought to tears with his stirring words when we faced oblivion. Those words should be engraved proudly lit up in Blue on our new stadium, Churchillian in their call to arms... I'll never forget them, Ahh!

"Well, we've had some Good Times!"

[Apologies to Michael for the slip of the finger there.]

Stephen Vincent
262 Posted 12/07/2022 at 01:31:14
Jim, see post #235.
Brian Murray
263 Posted 12/07/2022 at 04:20:56
Just say when and where – I'll be there, as Wacko Jacko once sang. Hope it makes the Red Echo etc.

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