Everton vs Arsenal

The mere fact that Tosun is still be mentioned at this football club as a potential problem solver underlines how abysmal it's been run and how truly negligent we were in trying to replace the goals of Romelu Lukaku.

Can't see anything but another defeat tomorrow and same at Palace and Chelsea for that matter.

Sacking Benitez won't solve anything, that's pretty obvious.

Bring in a new manager he's still left with the same blunt attacking options, the same problem at right back, the same lack of creativity in the midfield and lack of a goalscorer in that number 10 role.

It will be interesting to see what the hapless board will do, let's see if any lessons have been learned, but I won't hold my breath.

I don't understand the fixation with having to play an out and out striker of a poor standard. We have 1 good one in DCL who is injured. Richarleson is more of a modern mobile attacking midfielder. Why not try a different formation.

The top 2 teams don't even play a recognised striker and haven't done for a couple of seasons knowing that winning midfield generally wins the game. I know we don't have the same quality as them but at least try and change something.

Stekelenburg; Coleman, Jagielka, Williams, Baines; Gueye, Valencia (Calvert-Lewin), McCarthy (Funes Mori), Barkley, Lennon (Mirallas), and Lukaku.

Seamus scored the equailiser just before half-time.

None of us could foresee then, that Everton would still be struggling for consistency five years later, and that the dreaded "R" word would be on many Everton fans minds.

Form table last ten

How welcome would a victory be tomorrow ?

His small club jibe has come back to bite him on the arse..

Our full backs will be severely tested by Saka, who will be attacking them and trying to find Aubameyang in the box. They will have to step it up a level to keep them out.

Then we have to try to find a team which can score a couple of goals. The time has come we're we have to get points on the board so only brave, fully committed players can be chosen.

433

Pickford
Coleman Keane Mina Godfrey
Allan Doucoure Delph Gomes
Gray Tosun Richarlison

From set pieces Mina,Keane,Doucoure and Richarlison can be dangerous, hoping they can poach us a goal tomorrow from this route.

Anything other than a win on Monday and I can't see Rafa staying in post.

Sorry, the edit timed out. Delete Gomes !

"Sacking Benitez won't solve anything, that's pretty obvious."

Seriously.

Who decided to play only two midfielders against a 3 man midfield unit, who are probably the best midfield unit in club football. Who decided to play a high back line against the quickest attacking unit in club football. Our manager decided to gift that game to Liverpool. I mean there's a shed load of bad decisions he made in that game, fucking loads, but seriously it was absolutely appalling game management.

Look at the Brentford, Wolves and Watford games and again you will see many mistakes that were all put in place by our manager. Shocking decisions if I'm being honest.

That man should of been sacked weeks ago.

Who do you think we will bring in as manager?

It's all well and good saying "anyone is better" but haven't we said that before sacking the last FIVE managers?

Wasn't Koeman meant to be better than Martinez?

Silva than Allardyce?

Ancelotti than Silva? Yet Silva finished higher than Carlo in one season?

Sacking managers isn't the answer when the squad is the worst it's been since 1997/98 when we nearly went down.

The club can't attract better managers with the plight it's in and the problems run far deeper than one man at the club.

Couldn't agree more. All people keep saying is he needs more time and that sacking him isn't the answer. There is no way we would of got beat against Brentford with Carlo in charge. Also the derby would of been more closely fought, certainly not a 4-1 thrashing.

I'm not even counting City and Liverpool. It's games like Watford where we were 2-1 ahead with 65 mins on the clock and we got beat 5-2. It's the tactics against Brentford. Even going back to games like Leeds away. It's not just about the results, it's the decisions, the formations and tactics and most frustrating it's the lack of subs.

I watched Guardiola bring on Mahrez and KDB last night at 70 mins. We seems to bring subs on within the final 10 mins when teams have already started to waste time against us. It's all around poor.

We don't scream about decisions like others do. We don't waste time like others do. We are quite simply tactically inept against these other teams. If it were me I would get rid of Rafa after we get stuffed by Arsenal tomorrow night and give it to big Dunc till the end of the season and go from there. Telling us what we would get from Dunc, is signing who want to play for the club and most importantly players who want to run. Would he raid Scotland for their best? Rather that then some of the signings we have made over the last few years.

Jim

I'd probably say anyone, absolutely anyone and for me there's to much RED in our existing manager. Way too much.

That's my input on who I would want to replace our current manager, Moshiri and Brands can do the rest.

Agree getting rid of Benitez will not get rid of the problem. As you say after six Managers who would want the job.

The problem is the Club itself : how it is being Managed ; the personnel still being promoted in Oct and probably plans to employ and promote more in the pipe line: no accountability throughout the Club and having the Manager as the only scapegoat. Though we get 'not his own man' Brands this time.

These are the obvious observations from outside. But what would the professional ( people who earn their corn out of football) view of Everton. It would probably be worse. No money for transfers and their analysis of the squad, the team and the players, which we can see ourselves on the pitch. There advice would be stick with Benitez, thats if he wants to stay.

We are now a the point of no return where these problems need addressing, with the start of the first signs of Accountability, Benitez '5-10% Improvement in All Departments' and the shifting out of underperforming Managers in the Everton hierarchy.

This 'Who would you hire? Give us a Name' line doesn't cut it. Six Premier League clubs have replaced their manager this season and it didn't take consensus among the fans on the replacement's name for them to take action.

Nobody wants another managerial change, but the results are forcing it. I asked this question on another thread and I am asking it again. How many more defeats would be acceptable before the January window opens?

Equally; we all know the structural, operating norms and cultural issues at the club. Anyone who has been involved in business knows they can take several years to change. We don't have that long to act.

But the thing that sticks out for me is the line up that Barry #6 refers to. The last time we beat Arsenal we had a decent team (albeit weak at CB and in goal).

If we were to sack Benitez, what then?

What are the realistic expectations for a club coming off the back of 12th and 10th place finishes with a deteriorating squad and no money?

And which superior manager would come to Everton as Benitez' replacement?

Unfortunately it is damage limitation till January window / return of injured players.

If it's "a bit weak" then it's probably brought on by six years of bungling decisions made by the ineptitude at boardroom level.

If we sack Benitez next week and bring in another similar face, then where is the upturn?

If we bring in say Nuno what do we then get in January, same old "it's the start of a three year project".

That's all we are, a three year project that never gets past the first year or six months.

Any new manager will not be given time because the fans are too impatient now.

Duncan Ferguson is mooted all the time, but why at 50 has he not been out in the big bad managerial world and tried his hand somewhere?

Even Crease Head Gerrard cut his teeth at Rangers now he's got the Villa job yet Ferguson chooses to sit on our bench year in year out.

Any appointment from abroad would be filled with risk.

Someone tell me a solution?

At the start of the season he had the new managers bounce but what your seeing now is the real Benitez dull uninspiring football, pretty much how Necastle played under his stewardship. So I would ask those who are suggesting sacking Benitez isn't the answer are you sticking by that mantra even if we drop into the bottom 3 by Xmas, or do you suggest that we just have to stick with him no matter how bad it gets.
Look I agree sacking managers on a regular basis is not the way forward but to not sack a manager whose team is greatly underperforming borders on madness. This man will never ever unite the fanbase and without that unity its impossible for him to carry on. Even Spurs realized after 7 games Santos wasnt right for them at some point this board will come to the same conclusion over Benitz.

4141 could be played to pack the midfield and let him play his counter attacking style. Just what the idea of a 2 man midfield and high line against them lot was l can't get my head around.

Holgate is back for this game and perhaps time to give Coleman a rest. Or even Kenny, that's what he's there for. Isn't it?

The squad depth isn't his fault but the tactics, formations and subs have been. Is it Moshiri's plan to give him a transfer window, no matter what happens between now and January?

Will Arsenal loan us Maitland Niles in January or only sell him? They've done well off us.

We sold Lookman and got lwobi in for double the cost. Genius.

Personally can't see where the next three points are coming from unless we get rid. He said we ran more than the RS, did he seriously think we were ever in that game?

My advice would be to keep carrying the kit bag. He probably knows scapegoat is the other option at Everton and the loss of his salary.

The equivalent of being told to walk the plank.

Nuno, Potter, Ferguson, Lampard and even Rooney would be better than what we have.

Nuno was a victim of circumstance with Kane downing tools.

I have mentioned the rest on other threads.

The attitude of 'who would do better' will soon become 'get anyone in' If we are bottom 3 after Xmas.

Why would they be better?

What hard evidence do you have?

So Nuno was a victim at Spurs because Kane downed tools???

Seriously mate the whole Everton side downs tools for managers that's why we have gone through so many, so you think Nuno would get better treatment at Everton?

Rooney, give me a break, the fella can't even manage his own marriage let alone a Premier League football club with a volatile surrounding.

I'm not advocating keeping Benitez out of favouritism, but I've seen young up and coming managers sacked at this club, I've seen elite managers like Carlo Ancelotti walk out because he knew what was coming and even he had fans starting to turn in the latter months.

So throwing a few names on a list and saying "they'd be better than what we have" is that typical myopic view many have.

It's like players that haven't played for ages all of a sudden being the answer to all our prayers.

In recent times I've heard people saying build a team around Gbamin, Gordon, one time not long ago it was Holgate and Davies, just because they hadn't played when a few bad results occured.

Bigger picture and not myopic nonsense is required, that's why this club is the way it is.

I agree with every word this morning.

If we are to get rid of him then there are plenty of options out there. Now whether our board is capable of finding someone better - that's a different question! Their lack of capability to get someone in who can inspire and change things is probably the major issue.

For me, I wanted Graham Potter in before we got Rafa and I haven't changed my mind. He's a young progressive coach who gets the best out of his players. He would change our style, create an identity and get the fans back on side.

Lose Mon, Sun, a few results don't go our way we are in dire straights, if not there now.

I ll get slaughtered for saying it.

But the only manager I know of who has the methods, skill set and "Balls big enough to sort out the mess on the pitch is Sam Alladyce.Hes done it before for us.
He got his fee, but Martinez Koeman, Silva, Carlo, now Rafa have taken probably £60million out in pay offs, £250 million in wasted signings.

60 years watching, believing, enjoying, suffering.
Never suffered like this,Watford et al.

So get hold of Big Sam now.

I ll suffere mid table, not in bottom 3,then Championship.

Who thinks Pickford, Ritchy, other will go to the Championship with us.

It wont be pretty for a couple of months.But the players we can put out at the mo.Not the 3/4 quality lads, but the others6/7alongside them.
We got 11, 16 who can play the way Sam would want for a bit.

Who in their right mind things we can play the attacking, slick way, flanks, into the box we want a Goodison.
When we are bottom, or bottom 5, few points off the drop.

We need a manager who can deal with that pressure, deliver, set up right, with the squad we got.

4/5 injuries to our top players again and ????Jan, Feb,March.??

I don't want to go to.the championship and don't want to waste games, training time, transfers with Rafa, or another manager who will have NO IDEA of whats needed, the pressure of facing relegation.

Lets face the facts, reality.5 months to save ourselves from the drop.
Moshiri needs to act and it shoukdnt be a fancy pants, expansive, brilliant manager of world class players.We don't have that.

So Sam has to be seriously considered.
Would he come, of course he would.

He wasn't even considered for a part in the 'Brooke Bond' Adverts, though he definitely had the looks. :-)

He's also now been relegated with West Brom so his “special touch” has now gone.

Benitez is divisive for our fan base, but Big Sam is worse. I remember the last game of that season, Everton 1-1 with Southampton with nearly every person in the crowd chanting “F### off Sam Allardyce”. Never experienced anything like that before at Goodison.

I not hearing any serious solutions to a dire situation that could see us in the Championship.
Or leaving the opportunity to save ourselves to late.

Need coaching, tactics for players we have, (injury prone squad)

Manager, leader to steer the club to safety pronto.

Love it if we secure 12 points, even 10 from next 15.

Waste 5 games?? Waste Jan, give Norwich,Newcastle,Burnley,Leeds,Brentford a head start.??
They all winning points we winning none.

Cant wait longer than ????

18 games from Jan, 16 mid Jan??

Ancellotti followed the Big Sam Manuel last season to some extent. He declared that the players hadn't got the tactical and technical ability to play any other way and then had to publically declare a lack of work and effort, as destroying chances of getting into Europe.

The problem with this team is a tendency to play deep, with the proverbial error. Both are lethal in the Premiership.

Rafa on Sunday played s more offensive formation and with Rondon maintained a shape. But again the proverbial errors raised their head. I think he will go with the same formation again and hope that the players have learn't from that game. Against Arsenal especially these are the right tactics.

Everton need the crowd behind them and any walk out is a stupid idea.

15th and dropping! PULL UP! PULL UP!

We pay a price either way with the quality we lack. Make your choices take your chances.

As for two Sunday rags saying Moshiri will go for Mourinho, such a replacement would be deserving of a new padded office in the Liver Building and a DCL designer jacket with extra long sleeves and plenty of straps.

Roma will sack Mourinho in a few weeks anyway based on recent results and his tactic of publicly picking on individual players has backfired spectacularly at his recent clubs (even though he would have plenty to choose from here).

I'd give a caretaker job to Big Dunc while a permanent replacement is sought, but the most pressing need is to remove Kenwright from having any further influence at the club and for Moshiri to leave footballing decisions to those equipped to make them.

Ferguson didn't do badly last time he was called upon and transformed the atmosphere at Goodison, which is exactly what's needed now. Yes, he's been here under half a dozen managers, but hopefully he will have learned from them exactly how not to go about it! The big mistake was bringing in Allardyce and wasting another £50 million on Tosun and Wallcott.

Whatever the team is, everyone needs to get behind them and make Goodison a proper bear pit. Any venom should be saved for the opposition, officials and for a fully deserving of it Board at the end. COYB.

For me changing the manager does very little. Personally I want to see a shake up at board level and that HAS to be done now, otherwise it's the same circle of shite in decision making. Brands, Kenshite and DBB. Get them out. That has to be the priority for Moshiri.

Are we overlooking the fact his fireman's hose ran dry last season?

Heaven only knows how that was - ehrm - 'calculated'.

A totally faudulent claim I fancy.

The Echo is reporting the Mirror's allegation, adding they are 'checking it' to see if it is true.

How come their own well-connected local journalists haven't got the inside track to get this exclusive first, or be so well-informed to be able to deny it immediately?

What a hopeless rag.

I totally disbelieve the stat. From both games.

It didn't happen.

https://mobile.twitter.com/EvertonNewsFeed/status/1467509907041796097?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Blue Bill still there?

I'd still like to hear a general analysis of why this was necessary from the one who made the decision. Maybe I should be more specific, Moshiri Bill may be scripting it all.

Reporting the Mirror story and at the end saying they are 'checking it out'.

I thought the same Barry. A sister paper checking out the veracity of their big brother's paper.

Now I'm usually the foolish optimist, but I'm also superstitious.

I'm currently in the US (yeah thanks UK Government for changing the rules!!).

When I watch Everton stateside, it rarely ends well. In fact, it's usually a disaster.

Early season in Florida, 2009 prior to deploying to Afghanistan. 6 - 1 thumping by Arsenal. Thanks Everton. Great send off.

November 2016, Texas, 2 months into my first civilian job. That 5 - 0 humiliation by Chelsea.

Two weeks ago, Texas. The City embarrassment. Last Wednesday, Florida, the obvious.

I don't fly back until Tuesday, so tomorrow concerns me. It's my fault. I apologise.

We'll be selling. The only question is how aggressive ? Ok a second question, how young do we buy?

I've linked it to the data for the Brentford-Everton game.

Brentford v Everton Data

If you scroll down to the graphic of the footy field showing the players, click on any player and it will open a window showing the individual data and a complete metric of every play they made.

For example, in Seamus' case that day he completed 59 passes with a passing success rate of 79% and had a total of 109 touches all game.

On the ranking they apply he was the second highest rated player for the Blues on the day.

For me personally, as I called it on the day, Seamus was our best player v Brentford.

He had a more torrid time of it v them, but methinks someone is being a maverick on Football Insider and distorting the numbers to make Seamus look bad.

Just think Kenshite couldn't muster 30 million for Kings Dock and we've basically paid that out to fired managers on his watch.

But if this is true, in all likelihood there will be a NDA - a non-disclosure agreement so the dirty laundry doesn't get aired.

More's the pity.

It's what Russ Abbott said all those years ago! Must be true, it would explain all the screwed-up faces in our Directors Box for the last few year's!!

You know what they say: 'a change is as good as a rest' and there's plenty who need "resting" at Everton.

I agree. The match tomorrow will see commitment and effort. I believe that some of these players where part of the resistance to Benitez as the comfortable life came under threat and their backroom pals and theur higher up mates feared the confidence and authority that Benitez seemed to have in his ' implementation of his Improvement in all department ' plans. There worse fears have been realised and accountability and appraisal of performance will continue as Benitez pushes on with his review.

Arsenal have alway been a barometer of Evertons season and it a good place to start a fightback, Benitez will be thinking.

In fact the only players safe in my eyes with RB in charge are Coleman, Godfrey, Digne, Branthwaite, Grey, Townsend, Rondon, Lonnergan, Begovic, Allan, Doucoure, Dobbin, Simms,Gordon and Delph ( RB seems to like Delph). Frightening isn't it !!!

Maybe RB should name this team to play Arsenal.

Begovic, Coleman, Branthwaite, Godfrey, Digne, Allan, Doucoure, Delph, Grey, Townsend and Simms. Come January it may be all he has left.

Pickford
Coleman Godfrey Keane Digne
Doucoure Allan Gomes
Grey Simms Richie

Pickford
Godfrey Keane Branthwaite
Coleman Allan Doucoure Digne
Grey Gordon
Richie

What we'll likely see is Rafa's toothless 4-4-2 again, with at least 2 of Tosun/Iwobi/Townsend in the starting 11 again, and then the master stroke of bringing on Delph for an attacker once we are chasing the game.

They know the position we're in league wise, they've had a bit of grief after both Brentford and the RS games.
They will have heard of possible protests and the demise of Brands.

Rather than get upset on the possibility of getting a bit of stick from the supporters they should realise their incompetence has contributed to the present situation.
They need to get their fingers out and get it sorted on the pitch !!!

Looking to the future the most disappointing aspect of being an Everton supporter is I cant see things getting better, we look like being a nearly club for a long time.

They were a tad unlucky to lose to Manure too,sadly there'll prove too smart for us tonight,as our confidence is at rock bottom and the Atmosphere will be toxic amongst the let down faithful.

0-2...and the misery sadly continues further methinks!.

Tired of the chaotic behind-the-scenes activities they believe to be to blame for the current on-field shambles, those behind #27minutesfor27years want Moshiri to keep spending money but instigate a boardroom cull, stop communicating club business through favoured Scottish talk radio presenters and give them some face time so they can voice their concerns in the hope all concerned can get more bang for their emotional and financial buck. Fan reaction to the planned protest has been predictably mixed and if the current squabbling on various social media websites is anything to go by, those behind the #27minutesfor27years show of dissent may discover their fans are no better at singing from the same hymn sheet than the very people they are railing against.

Otherwise, Partey, Elneny and Odegaard will completely dominate the game (with Rowe-Smith dropping back in too).

Gray, Richarlison and Gordon can play on the break.

As an observation, Arsenal are now probably going to reap the rewards of sticking with Arteta (must have been close to the sack) and of investing (heavily) in player development. They now have a strong, improving side and a quality bench.

Tough ask tonight but if we compete in midfield we stand a chance.

Almost Murdoch quality. One to avoid, thanks for the heads up.

And I can find no fault with Glendenning's commentary.

Glendenning is a frustrated Mackem fan. With that context, the snide subtext of the piece makes a lot more sense. We got Moshiri the clueless billionaire; they got Short the clueless tightfisted billionaire.

"If that was us we'd be building statues of w'or Moshiri"

He's a hack with a cob on Mike, but if you want to read disingenuous crap you're in luck. T'internet is literally full of it.

As to the Guardian, I find its reporting on the US to be vastly superior to the odious Murdock sludge here, particularly Fox News and the New York Post.

Simms and Branthwaite may therefore be on the bench at Goodison.

You could have just stated your opposition to the campaign Mike, and I'd have been happy to accept that.

Quoting a snidey Mackem writing tripe didn't really add any weight to your opinion though. In fact, if anything it rather did the opposite.
I respect your opinion Mike, because I've read enough of your stuff to know it's thought out and has the clubs best interests at heart. Even when I don't agree with it.

Some hack from the Grauniad with an ax to grind doesn't even qualify. We'll have to agree to disagree on the campaign, and I suppose agree to disagree in our respective choice of broadsheet as well. Hope we both enjoy the match.

PS - Not as far as I'm aware Dave, the younger Glendennings wikipedia gave me a laugh though.

DM #112, I'm aware we have differing views on a lot of things, but it doesn't bother me a bit.

Dave #111, I assume not, since Barry is Irish.

Bobby #113, sorry, but I think it's a silly idea, and I stand by my opinion.

Agree midfield will be critical.

That stat on the BBC is unwelcome. We cod become the first team to lose 400 Premier League games.

Oh well, if not tonight, it's going to happen this season!!

"We cod become the first team to lose 400 Premier League games."

sounds a bit fishy.