Everton's marketing… lazy or just incompetent?

There have been some extraordinary business decisions by the Everton management, not least the deal with Kitbag. I can't help thinking every decision they make regarding the business and marketing side is ultra-cautious and, on the flip side, they spend like there's no tomorrow on shit players. Go figure !

The answer to Stephen's question is both. This club is a bunch of marketing morons.

I'm with Bill and Mike above; it has to be both. The cronyism and nepotism at our club exact their price. Nobody is appointed who might present a danger by having the brains to think up new ideas and the energy to execute them.

Total re-set needed, not just on the playing side of things.

When Kenwright bemoaned LFC living a stone's throw away as one of Europe's biggest clubs without adding "but one day we'll show 'em" I knew we were finished at the top level.

No fight in this club just craven acquiescence.

Part of me takes pride in our roots. That will never change.

But our reach is way beyond L4. When I meet people, be that in London or the US, they are intrigued that I am a native of the city of Liverpool but more so that I follow Everton. And I've converted a few over the years.

In a marketing sense, we have failed to build the brand and don't even promote it in our own city let alone nationally and internationally.

As for the kit release. Why did we not wear the new one for the last game of the season?

Incompetence at board level and decision making.

Self-serving and full of ineptitude, I'm just praying Alan Myers is wrong for once, because Everton don't need investment, they need a full-scale reset, with new owners, having fresh ideas, especially in the boardroom.

Whilst it doesn't align directly for various reasons, some of those one-man-band outfits seem to be making a better fist of it when compared with a century-plus established business operating in a huge global brand.

Maybe we should ask Cleetus McFarland to carry Everton kits.

They can't do to me and all of us what they done to us last season.

Otherwise.

Okay, I confess. I'll be back for more regardless.

They must know this. They must know they own my irreversible loyalty. They know I'm hooked and have been since I can remember.

I've said it before, they're like the girlfriend who cheats on you, but you can't stop loving them.

I hate summer and pre-season.

And does it explain their willingness to accept poor deals that at least return some profit?

I remember writing a comment regarding the Kitbag deal, back when Elstone and Kenwright sold the rights of our merchandise (no change there), ١M a year for 10 years.

I said at the time, if it was a private company, both would have been sacked. Everything had to be bought on line, nothing has changed, I still can't buy an Everton jersey in any of the sports stores here in Ireland.

As you say, when you can't even buy an Everton jersey at John Lennon Airport, it sucks. We should have been using the likes of Tim Howard to advertise Everton kits in USA. We are a total marketing shambles. Thanks, Bill.

Back in 2014 I worked in San Jose for a few weeks. I stayed in a smallish town just outside the city called Los Gatos. Just off Main Street there was a small sports store, the first time I walked past I was astonished to see a Tim Howard EFC shirt in the window along with two blue EFC shirts. Of course I went in, the lad who owned it was from Birkenhead and had lived in California for quite a while.

He had telephoned the club to order 20 shirts. They referred him to Kitbag who wouldn't give him any discount and insisted that he paid full postage. He had sold all the Tim shirts bar the one in the window.

We actually don't deserve the Premier League as we've wasted every single opportunity passed our way due to the big fat parasite, Kenwright, who would have you all believe we're marvellous and full of endeavour.

There is no accountability at Everton because it's run by a club in a club. It's utterly despicable and I fucking hate them with every bone in my body.

We need a total reset and we needed it 25 years ago. All that said, my 7-year-old wants a kit – I might see how long it takes to get it and report back, however, I doubt they're available because …you know…. there's only a month or so until the season starts.

Everton that.

Can we have a poll and a serious debate on TW for getting rid of this board? Gauge the sentiment like and see how many brainwashed idiots are still out there. Cheers.

However, I spoke recently with a pal, Mike France (a Blue, and a seasoned businessman) whose company, Christopher Ward Watches, has just entered into a sponsorship deal with our club. I've no idea about the finances of the deal, nor would I ask him. But I can say he was very impressed with, and complimentary about, the people he dealt with in Everton's business team.

Just offering another angle on things.

Think about that for a second, because anything and everything else related to marketing a club, is secondary. Brand awareness is an utter disgrace, the marketing department has no presence anywhere, not even in our own city.

You cannot outsource responsibility for incompetence and marketing remains insignificant for a club in a multibillion-pound revenue-generating industry. Revenue generation is a byproduct of brand awareness, exploiting the membership of a global Premier League brand and generating presence attracts success. It attracts money, sales, desire, association and pride.

We cannot even buy merchandise in our own shop. Not in the city, not in the country, not on a global platform. There is not a marketing focus, no brand awareness, a minimal revenue generation.

I would get professional marketing companies to present a marketing strategy to the club to address the failures and give options for the future. A uniformed marketing approach, from club branding, social media presence, merchandise, brand awareness and revenue generation targeted to different market segments by country, region, age and measure its success as a basic requirement.

This is a board requirement that has been utterly neglected for so many years it's an embarrassment to every single fan, father or supporter.

We have shown, as a fan base, just what the club means to its supporters, the fan base are there, the world of football globally sat up when it viewed the crowd scenes at the end of last season, it made news programs across the world, yet we cannot buy a football kit for our own kids in our own shop.

That's why we have no presence globally. That's why Everton FC should replace its marketing department with a motivated, focused, innovative, marketing professional group with global reach, guaranteeing brand association and awareness. It not just about the shirt, it's about who we are.

The only brand generation is done by us. The fans.

Genuinely. We generate intrigue and fascination once they realise they are talking to an Evertonian.

If only the club could build on that.

We are respected.

I read it on this site years ago so can't swear it's true but since doing nothing to take "them on" since Big Joe in the 90s I reckon it's extremely plausible.

Talking about Joe Royle, Barry, he was never my favourite Everton manager, but he was and always will be a genuine Evertonian, and he was also my favourite Everton manager, whenever we played Liverpool, simply because he had their measure, both on and off the pitch.

Stephen #15, I know Los Gatos and I think I know of the store you're talking about. I'm not the least bit surprised by their experience. My one regret from my initial trip to Goodison in 2017 was that Howard was already gone, and I couldn't go to the Everton 2 store and stuff my suitcase with Howard shirts to make the trip profitable!

The contrasting level of capability and actual interest staggered me. At Liverpool they presented us with a clear and coherent plan in return for our investment and I was met in one of their banqueting suites and had a very nice lunch with their senior marketing team. They presented a pitch-side sponsorship proposal official partner status and demonstrated their global reach etc. Contrast that with Everton and I was told “What we really need is some key rings”.

I would like to think that has changed today but it never left me, the gulf in functions. How we are run starts at the top and he who shall not be mentioned runs our club like a charity shop. It filters down. When Sheik Mansour took over Man City, they fired lots of partners and suppliers because they wanted the best. Our reality makes a mockery of our motto

I reckon Frank Lampard has got a touch of that in him, he doesn't have any fear of the grinning German.

I'm not into Kenwright bashing in the belief he's likely done some good among the "kirkby", "kings Dock" faragos. Maybe staying in the division could be so argued. But as you say proper Evertonians don't take a backward step especially to the monkey island crew.

His lack of determination beyond keeping control has always been his achilles and we as a club have deffo suffered from it.

During the 90s, I came home from the Army to watch us and my best mate warned me we were not great to watch. We'd been season ticket holders in the glory 80s years. He was right. Some revel in the dogs of war. I admired the commitment but thought the standard of football was poor. I guess you work with the tools you have and get the most out of them.

Even though he knew how to take on them and gave us us our last trophy until next year, I just didn't like the style.

We had that period where we looked good with Kanchelskis and Lampar as our wide attacking players.

But generally we were poor from the standards Joe the player and Danny the supporter had seen, experienced and witnessed.

What an Evertonian though. I think the only one that will break my heart more if and when he goes will be Colin Harvey. And I was never privileged enough to watch him play.

Blue 💙

The big launch in South America consisited of giving a few Clubs called Everton, Everton panents, you know the triangle cloth things. You rarely see them now a days.

I would say that a few in the know over the years got answering the phone jobs and progessed to bigger offices and bigger titles. I seen in some organisations that a Marketing budget is something to play about with no end product. I would say that Everton is that type of organisation.

I remember John Daly in one of his Shakespearean parodies devoting two verses to' Buckets of Blue Paint'. I really could visualise what he was getting at, Everton's Marketing efforts.

Peter#17

They are perfectly nice to deal when taking your money, but I would ask your friend at the end of the season how they have delivered.

Christine#

I would get they have had Management Consultants in hence the titles, but they just took their money and ran when they realised the Muppets they where dealing with.

I may be wrong but I'd be surprised if you couldn't get Everton gear at these stalls.

Maybe someone at the top will soon be able to discover and evict the one common denominator throughout our decades-long mediocrity.

I ain't holding my breath though.

I think though that it is a licensing issue no market trader will ever get permission to sell official EFC products. So everything he sells is not official blue merchandise.

2 words: unimaginative & lazy.

Our owner/board for the last thirty years, half of my cognisant life btw, have studiously avoided any of the top-tier merchandising opportunities that have enabled every other one of Premier League founder clubs to prosper way ahead of us.

But ,,,,,,,

The owner/board have sought to progress from our "Peoples' Club" mantra however, exciting no-one not already fully involved as a committed supporter admittedly.

Fine pop-voc perhaps, for just a week or two to a successful club, but bringing the square sum of fuck-all into our coffers (which I'm told now occupy the miniscule space previously used to store the Arteta-money).

Still, let's be positive eh?

I wonder if it was the nice middle aged Lady I dealt with. She would have been close to retirement 20 years ago. .

I think the reality of Evertons Marketing is a shop, with a Internet connection. The advertising budget, which nobody at Everton believes has any endproduct, is spent by the Chief Executive on Bramley Dock information, self promotion and one James Rodriguez display in Time Square. As for the shirts they are farmed out to preferred producers and more pirate shirts are sold than real ones. As for a Marketing plan no staff at Everton have a clue about it.

The whole thing has a 70s feel about it. Even Goodison has the look of layers of blue paint.

On the marketing front, we'll never be the tourist attraction and day out at the shop that is our cousins or the global machine that is Manchester United. I know people who have all the gear but have never been to Old Trafford or Anfield. I embarrassingly had to explain to a supposed Liverpool supporter what Heysels was a couple of weeks ago. He genuinely didn't know. Different story.

Success has to come on the pitch first, but whilst I don't expect us to become the corporate machines that are those I've mentioned, we can do better. On my travels and in my experience, football people know Everton. They are intrigued by Evertonians. They like Everton. They will never be blind faith idiots like me, but they will certainly follow if we get the brand out there.

The Bee Hive. One of my favourite City Centre Pubs Stephen. I also like the Post Office.

The new stadium will help. Unfortunately we look embarrassingly old fashioned at present.

Barry@25, in his final paragraph says it all imo, and this is why our chairman absolutely sickens me, because whilst he fought tooth and nail, whilst begging, stealing and borrowing to keep Everton, our institution has been reduced to an afterthought, by anyone who doesn't support Everton FC.

In Gelsenkirchen on the road leading up to the Veltins Arena, its called the Schalke Mile.

Shops and apartments decked in Royal Blue as well as supporters pubs en-route. Winslow-esque type places. It breaks up the walk if the trams are rammed!! On match day they also deck the city centre out with flags and banners. And the central Christmas Tree is decorated blue and white.

I can envision something similar along the Dock Road leading up to Bramley Moore.

Let's take centre stage.

It is undoubtedly the case that the club does not have the global reach of the Top 20 clubs worldwide, but things change in football – the likes of Chelsea and Man City had been similarly low profile to Everton for most of my adult life, that was until they had their respective injections of dubious monies from foreign investors. It might help if the team across the park might fall off their horse for a while, but that seems unlikely.

The advent of the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock offers a huge incentive for a complete re-set of the marketing of the club. Personally, I would like to see a big enhancement to the walk along the Dock Road to encourage fans to walk the route up to the ground from the city centre.

You only have to visit the likes of Disney or Universal Studios in the USA to see how the boardwalk experience in the approaches to the parks can build anticipation, and marketing the club should not be restricted to the immediate environs of the new stadium in my view.

The Beehive is not bad for a quick pint or two, the other Beehive in Mount Pleasant is livelier and full of “ characters”!!

My other watering hole in town is The Globe opposite Central Station, you can have a laugh listening to the idiots on the all-day karaoke at The Coopers next door (or not).

This is a huge loss of income and exposure for the club, it really did look like there was only one club in the city.

There are huge complaints on here about coaches hanging around and going through the motions and picking up their pay… I may upset a few but I see that throughout the club.

But it's interesting that the lightning rod for the criticism is Bill. Personally, if a CEO is doing the job the Chief Executive Officer should be doing then, it is DBB that is responsible for sorting it out – holding her next level of staff responsible. She must be so happy that Bill is still Chairman as he draws all the fire.

And fire is something she does not seem to have – or maybe fire and responsibility. How many people would she like to replace? Any or is she happy with their performance or just unable to do so?

From the outside, there appears to be no coherent marketing plan.

A lot of club stuff bought would be black market, not Official Club stuff. The fact that Everton are behind the curve means they would face a lot of competition from the black market stuff which outsells the Offical merchandise.

Anything I ever got was bought on offer on the Internet or from sellers outside the ground. What occurred to me is there is a theatre marketing mentality.

Everton. The originals.

When I used to travel to my granddad's on the bus from town to Arkles Lane, as you went alongside Everton Park and Everton Valley, you could look down on the Mersey. I don't know if true, but my Grandad always told me it was the highest spot in Liverpool. So as a kid, I always thought of Everton being the highest point of the city.

That district defined our history, from the origins of St Domingos. Now we are moving to be located on the river that defined our City.

The city is ours.

I got my son a birthday card from Moonpig… there were many RS cards so I clicked on the list of football clubs. Not far to scroll down to E… but no nothing. This club is still being run in mid-20th century mode.

That's probably all chinese to our current marketing team… if we have one. I want us to dominate at least that part of the city. The Hudson River is dyed green on St Paddy's Day. Imagine the Mersey dyed blue, eh.

Heated arguments and it wasn't uncommon for fists to fly, yet they seemed to be the best of mates who would sit down afterwards and share a drink! Fascinating and educational place!!

I have to say, not a place I was too aware of in my earlier years, but Doctor Duncan's at the back of St George's Hall is also a good spot.

We are diabolical with our marketing and merchandising for sure and I usually put it down to small club syndrome - which we aren't but seem unable to promote ourselves above and beyond from where we are now which is what the objective should be. Trouble is, it has been so many years since we have attracted fans simply because of who we are. All of us Blues are dyed in the wool and all my sons are rabid Evertonians, basically because I am one.

I am acquainted with one person who lives in Devon who started supporting Everton because we were achieving in the mid 80s but we really have nothing much to offer since then bar an FA cup. Given the lack of on-field success which always brings marketing benefits, our marketing people should be busting a gut to promote us, as I say, above and beyond.

Maybe they just don't see us like that and just look misty eyed and nostalgically at our history in the hope that will be enough.

To be fair, Frank and his staff plus these awesome fans may find a way of keeping all that in the background giving them oxygen with every storming under-the-lights night match they live to fight and breathe another day.

Disgusting bastards… I hate them.

I'm not sure when Moorfields closed wouldn't argue too much with your date of the 1980's but it was well missed in that area.

Christine I remember buying Aussie whites in your Dad's pub, he used to keep a stock of it to stop some of his customers making the short trip to Moorfields and keep them in his pub which was a very lively pub to be in, again with some funny characters keeping us well entertained, very happy days indeed.

ManU and the RS seem to be the masters of this to me. Common denominator? American owners.

We know that the Yanks are the peers in this game (marketing) so I was quite encouraged by the recent takeover gossip notwithstanding the adverse chat around the consortium. ManC by simply pouring money into the club have bought the success both on and off the pitch and sure as eggs is eggs when they falter, so will the fanbase and associated revenue unlike ManU.

It's really hard to be objective from within as Everton, definitely in a football context, is the biggest thing in our lives. I find it maddening that we are such small beer outside our own 4 walls whatever part of the country we live in and know that we can do better. My own business was marketing driven from the start and we established a high end reputation and quality product off the back of a well structured marketing strategy.

Surely it is not the beyond the bounds to expect a top drawer effort by our club. With common sense when one considers the amount of wasted wages that could have been invested in a high level marketing consultancy to get things going (we clearly don't have the human resources in house) we could be streets ahead of where we are by now.

As you say Aussie white was an acquired taste, I never acquired that taste, an auld fella I knew told me if I didn't like it why drink it, he put me on to Barsak, not sure of the spelling, and that did me easier to go with pints of bitter later in the night!!

I have good memories of Yate's Wine Lodge and Aussie White. I suspect that it is the same as the white port wine that Guy Clarke sings about in "Let Him Roll".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVpqrnDonto

I'm sure the club could do some kind of marketing about Frank being manager. The highest-scoring midfielder in the Premier League era? But nope.

The way it's going for Everton at the moment, I can see Frank walking away and Bill's wish coming true as Rooney becomes manager.

Regarding the red wine that was sold I think it was referred to as lead in' but never drank it myself.

A website giving us profiles of the management and players. A bit of a shop, some drinks and sweets or ice cream, poor ladies facilities. Staff that have been there years and look it, with younger relatives.

The show extends to the new Stadium, tours and videos. Everton on tour with pop-up stalls based on one-off shows. Trying to build smaller shows by satellite clubs. A website in one language, no overseas content, an extension of the program.

Self promotion of management and no interest in promotion beyond the theatre or modern merchandise marketing.

I remember too before microwave ovens were invented, Dad bought an infra-red sandwich maker, you had to buy special plastic bags to make a toastie, it was really popular!

I remember being sent over to Yates in Moorfields to "get" my granddad who had been there all day... it was a loud scary place to a kid! Parked in the corner was my grandad in his wheelchair... dead to the world on Aussie whites.

I stand by every word of my previous post @18: "It's not just about the shirt, it's about who we are."

Outside the UK, we are hardly known, an untapped generation in a global market. To be fair, I actually do give credit where it was due when James was at the club, see link below:

James Rodriguez Helps Everton Build On Americas Profile

We marketed him very well in the Americas and it raised our profile massively. I wonder if anyone could buy a shirt there?

We have got such potential as a brand, Christine. Like you say, when we had Rodriguez, there was that period where I think Spirit of the Blues rocketed to number one on certain online music charts.

With all the clips of the supporters from last season and over the years, if marketed the right way, we have massive potential to get that brand out there if marketed correctly. Especially with being able to plug the stadium images.

People know who we are. They just don't know enough about us. Get it out there. Loud and proud.

I was about to say don't be a submissive 1860 Munich in the shadow of Bayern, be more of a noisy neighbour Manchester City who challenged and surpassed Manchester United.

But no, we are not going to be noisy neighbours. We are the landlord. It's our city and they are the Tennants in OUR city.

The fact that we have just entered back into a deal with a betting company, when we've already admitted that it was not the right thing to do in the past, just shows that this isn't considered at most levels and departments aren't talking to each other.

Yesterday, I saw pictures on Twitter of fans who had received new Everton shirts with the club crest printed on wonky and the outlines of the printing stamps clearly showing. That doesn't scream “pride” to me.

I completely agree with this thread and posts that the lack of shirts for sale is shocking. However, even if the marketing department aren't up to it, I wouldn't want their job as the rest of the club is making it really hard for them to send any of the right messages. Maybe the club and departments within need to show a bit of pride in their own work before marketing can even really come into it.

Always remember the sign they had on the wall in there. "Wine is a good servant but a poor master". I understood that after my Psychedelic yawn in Moorfields.

I think it illustrated that Liverpool had more Yates's Wine Lodges than anywhere else in the country!!

For younger readers, that 10d and 8d was old money, it would have been around 4p and 3p today, so see how cheap it was to get bladdered those days.

I mentioned to a friend and teammate who came from somewhere off Scottie Road that at one part of the film Michael Caine as the don/tutor asked if anyone knew anything about Yeats and the Julie Walters character replied that she'd been in his wine lodge.

I said that I was the only person in the cinema who laughed and he said that the same had happened to him. As they say, they can take you out of Liverpool....

He was right, Everton is the highest point of the City and the birthplace of our club and our history, as we all know. Does the club fanfare it? No Chance! This was the home of one of the oldest and, until around 30 years ago, one of the greatest clubs in England.

I'm nipping down to the car bootie now, see what bargains I can get; but I'll just say this until I get back:

Bill Kenwright has done more to cripple our teams, our club, and our history, than any other factor in our history. The fact that there are so many people who know about Everton FC is down to the many Evertonians who are and have been, great ambassadors.

Everton, its roots, its history and great supporters, are not because of Kenwright – but in spite of him.

Our club.

The city is ours. Everton is ours.

The people in our Club need to stop thinking small-time and start maximising opportunities. Not just to make money, but to make us fans feel more valued. Fans in Merseyside, and further afield. It's been said many times how we've missed out in Ireland, America and Australia in recent times. This is just one of the many reasons why the Board should be held to account. Investment and a forward looking, professional new broom is needed.

The Echo have no designated Everton FC news link button, today. they have relegated us to the "More" button, not important to regular visiting Evertonians but another example of the way the Echo's owners view the club.

I really like the idea, put forward by a few, for a Blue Walk along Regent Road from the tunnel exit right down to the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock. Could be spectacular.

This is part of the great Dan Meis drawings, the water feature, so to speak, in front of the South Stand, am I right? That will be a nightmare if that is filled in as it was a part of the beautiful aesthetics of the overall design.

Watch the club stand by and do nothing, it'll likely end up an Aldi or another RS superstore.

Firstly, apologies, I used the word 'rumour', I could've sworn Baz on ToffeeTV said it IS up for sale by Peel Holdings but I can't find the link video now??

Re "kicking the club", I'm surprised you'd find my comment overly critical given some of the posts in the thread. The club are extremely poor at marketing and as mentioned earlier, the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock is a marketing opportunity and a chance to make a big impression if done right.

The club have done fantastically well getting where we are now with the stadium, I'm genuinely thrilled about it. But the stadium is just part of that project. I feel if Nelson Dock were bought and filled in, it would ruin a large part of what is going to make the new stadium project unique. Look back at the photos and tell me I'm wrong.

Also, ask yourself, do you have faith in the club to get the whole project right – bearing in mind it's more than just a stadium?

I believe the lack of kits outside the official stores (ie in Sports Direct, John Lennon Airport etc), is down to the Kitbag deal. I'm happy to stand corrected on that.

For you will pass a number of direction signs as you walk along. None point to Goodison Park, however. They indicate the whereabouts only of 'Anfield Stadium'. Trivial perhaps, but telling.

I don't know to what extent better marketing would improve sales. Our lack of success on the field, the absence of any sort of European profile in recent years and the failure to reach Wembley in the domestic cup competitions must make our stuff harder to sell even for a company specialising in sportswear retail.

Typical Everton that... our board must go before the season begins... useless greedy pricks!

And that means not selling things short... in fact maybe charging a little extra – if fans are willing to pay?

After all said and done, you do want us to be in a position to compete with the richer clubs, don't you?

Or maybe you don't because that makes them, in your eyes, "useless greedy pricks". Even if the money goes toward better players, better facilities, a better Everton FC?

But there's always EitC right next door. It seems the club and the charity have become irrevocably conflated.

I truly believe that unless our boardroom leaves very soon, we'll just plod on and continue to make up the numbers in the Premier League. The club needs a new broom, a total reset in order to rise from the ashes of the Moshiri reign and Kenwright's total neglect.

It was okay but you wouldn't want to get it on your clothes…

The club appointed Dixon Baxi on the strength of its AC Milan rebrand, which Dixon says was “very successful at reaching fans globally”. Everton FC detailed a similar ambition in the initial brief – to reach fans outside of Merseyside from across the world.

“Another thing they liked about the AC Milan rebrand was that we'd gone beyond just sports branding and focussed on the heartbeat and ethos of the club” adds Dixon. Using this same strategy for the Everton FC project, the studio says that it spoke to fan groups and carried out workshops, during which the idea for the tower motif emerged.

Dixon says, “We knew that St Rupert's Tower as a piece of iconography was important to the fans because that's what they told us.” He describes the tower as an “anchor for the design system” which is also a subtle but knowing nod to the club's history.

Everton FC rebrand

I would argue it is the small things which annoy many fans, not being able to buy tickets on the first day of sale due to some computer glitch, not being able to see as many of the underling teams in action - when it is permitted, far smaller clubs than Everton FC don't seem to have a problem making things work properly, so there are no excuses.

Besides all of the above, as long as Frank and Co don't walk, we are onto something... haha.!!! Failing that, get pros in or cock a continuous deafen on your yacht, Moshiri.

Unbelievable. Only Everton.

I did bring this up with the red ECHO some time ago. I put forward the simple idea that it should be done in alphabetical order - EFC then LFC.

I was told it was based upon how many views and comments each club got however for example when news about the new EFC stadium broke which generated hundreds of thousands of views and comments far outweighing that of the RS news threads - needless to say, nothing changed.

Its a red rag and full of nonsense. I simply choose not to read it anymore.

If memory serves - it came in a glass like the ones you got water in at school dinner.

Today this liquid would need to be kept in a COSHH cupboard.

We are a Premier League team in many ways but continue to be run by a short-sighted, half-arsed or uninterested board.

We appear to be run by people who believe in luck and good fortune rather than good work or best-in-class people.

These things take time but, after decades of being a Premier League team, we haven't acted upon it.

To rebrand Everton FC DixonBaxi overcomes the responsibility of doing the fans justice

How important is branding? Barry suggests it's all the little things the club keeps getting wrong at fan level that are really important. You read this stuff and you have to wonder if this "branding" business isn't just a wankfest for the career professionals to gloat over...

When Ancelotti was on board, his name and presence were marketed, the awareness levels globally raised by a significant amount, how we were thought of by players, by other teams, by media, by fans, was raised by the new profile. It was a flash in the pan as he left before we could build on his profile.

In short, the "Brand Everton" was increased in popularity, respect and awareness. As a PR exercise alone, it was up there. Our "Brand" is who we are and how we are seen.

Small stuff? No merchandise in shops, no brand awareness, no income. Economics of supply and demand. No one cares if they don't stock Everton shirts because no-one outside Liverpool knows about us except the fans.

We need to use and expand it. Build on it. We have a brand. We are known but we don't use it enough. We don't put it out there.

I know we have the crest and many got agitated when we changed the crest on the kit in that Nike / Martinez season, but I don't care too much for what is on the kit.

In my lifetime, we didn't even have the badge on the strip until the 80s if I recall; just "EFC".

The crest will always be there but I like the idea of modernising and I actually like that simplified Prince Rupert's Tower. I'd have it on the strip somewhere. Very subtle, very Everton.

Even the stall holders in the city don't bother stocking any Everton or maybe a token gesture in a small corner. I always stop and ask them have they any Ancelotti tee-shirts. Ha ha, small victories to see the gobs on them.

I'd love to know is it really lazy or just plain incompetence and no vision at all by the club. This is why it's crucial before we move to the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock that we have new people in and don't waste another big opportunity to really push our name.

Even non-football fans are nudging each other as they pass the new stadium on the train as it's all taking shape and getting bigger.

That's winning matches and trophies on the pitch in the game of football.

All else is secondary and of zero impact to anyone who matters or cares without that absolutely vital "performance indicator".

What I'm less sure about is whether "the brand" (and, through that, merchandising) can be significantly developed without success on the pitch. (Hardcore) fans might buy the merchandising (if available), regardless of success on the pitch, and for them 'brand' might not be an issue.

Merchandising is unlikley to attract new fans. Have all the overseas fans of "the other lot" latched on to them because of merchandise? Or have they latched onto that club through its success on the pitch; and only then bought the gear?

To a large extent, success strengthens brand; and a strong brand strengthens merchandising.

The fact that there is no advertising in the City Centre for the new Everton kit means that undecided kids or tourists (and there are over 2 million to Liverpool each year) can't choose an Everton shirt. The 5 million travellers who go through John Lennon Airport can't make an impulse buy when they are going abroad, the knock-on is that there are fewer Everton shirts on European beaches.

We have had opportunities over the years which have been completely ignored by the club, presumably because they cannot increase income. Fanatics are completely unaware that the opportunity exists.

The 2014 World Cup has already been mentioned (Tim Howard and Tim Cahill), I remember Justin Bieber being photographed in an Everton shirt, Amanda Holden for God's sake.

The club's attitude (If I'm correct) is so blinkered it is untrue. Surely the way to get a better deal from Fanatics is to sell more shirts.

Success builds brand. Brand is built on success.

You can only dine off your historical success for so long before you become the next Woolworths (to use a High Street analogy). Okay, that's dramatic and not happening to us.

We still have a marketable brand. A huge fan base. And I am convinced with even the slightest of success, we would attract a new and broader support base to complement the magnificent one that has single-handedly kept this club in the spotlight. People outside the city of Liverpool are fascinated by us. It wouldn't take much to build on our heritage and existing brand.

Yes, people do a lot of their shopping online now and that is effectively the new virtual High Street so it is important to have the online presence.

But to my High Street or Retail Park analogy, Sainsbury's, whoever – it's still equally important to have a physical presence. Put the brand out there so people see it. Be visible in prominent places such as high streets, city centres, airports etc.

A new flagship store in the city centre. The road to Bramley-Moore Dock decked in blue. Paint the town blue. Take back the city. Then global expansion.

He told me he would never say it to the Evertonians in his family, but everywhere he traveled, people used to praise Everton because of their unbelievable away support.

He told me, people used to tell him it was understandable Man Utd and Liverpool constantly selling out their away allocations, because they compete for honours (this was about 10 years ago) but Everton haven't won a sausage for 27 years now, and getting a ticket for most away games is still virtually impossible.

Phillip (125) Agreed. This is especially true for the younger supporters, who ought to be the priority target for future growth. And most grandparents are now comfortable using online purchasing.

Your belief is that basically we are doing all we can off the pitch and it's no use trying to increase our footprint in the city and globally until we are successful on it. Well, to me, that's a no-no and another no.

This board adores and would embrace that attitude because it gets them totally off the hook to be creative professionals with a vision.

I've said on another post that as the new stadium gets bigger and bigger, especially people looking at it on the train network (I see and hear them all the time). We just can't have people out of their depth to take us there – otherwise, it's the Everton Way again. Play it down, it's just little old us.

[Just my opinion.]

Brian, that's not at all what John has said. I don't think anybody is saying we're doing all we can off the pitch, nor that there's no use trying to increase our footprint until we're successful on the pitch. It's a question of not expecting great returns from merchandising until success kicks in – but still squeeze out as much as you can in the meantime.

To cut a long story short, I decided to walk with them rather than try and explain the way to go, as it was obvious they couldn't understand me. Anyway, turns out they were Portuguese, from Lisbon.

I was wearing an Everton tee-shirt which one of them recognised and tried to tell me we were lucky to avoid relegation last season, but he did watch the Crystal Palace game on TV, which he said was very exciting, and the crowd were amazing.

So you never know, we may now have three new fans in Portugal?

As the song goes, Tony. We are respected wherever we may go.

To repeat myself, people and football fans in general; they are genuinely curious and intrigued by our madness. God help them when we're successful again.

I'm actually having a tough time trying to educate the young barman in my local on Liverpool as he claims to support them. But doesn't know much about them.

I have followed the Christopher Ward Watches (and Mike France's) tie-up with Everton very closely. Their watches are superb and as good value and quality as you can buy. The two main men and founders of the brand were Mike (staunch Blue) and Chris Ward (staunch Red) both from the Liverpool area.

12 months or so before Covid hit, Chris cashed his chips in with the company and started Tribus watches. He signed a sponsorship with LFC to the tune of around ٥M! The logic ran that they were in their pomp, had a huge global fanbase and the deal couldn't fail.

Tribus then brought out a series of watches including LFC branded watches (EPL Champions models) and a tie-up with Jamie Carragher amongst others. Unfortunately for Chris Ward, Covid destroyed the thrust of the launch and the company went into administration. The watches became available at up to 80% discounts in the associated fire sale. (I bought a few!)

Now I'm not being unfair here, but some of us watch geeks who are Blues couldn't help but smile when, as soon as Tribus struggled and failed, that wily old fox, Mike France, announced a tie-up between Christopher Ward Watches and Everton FC. Was he wisely seizing the moment as Everton fans got the club some welcome attention while simultaneously thumbing his nose at Chris himself who will be less than thrilled, as a rabid Red, with having his name plastered all over Goodison Park and the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock?

Both great guys incidentally, send my regards to Mike.