18/02/2024 89comments  |  Jump to last

This article by Andy Hunter in The Guardian provides a pretty succinct overview of Everton's situation as the club enters what could be a pivotal week in its storied history.

"Barring the return of 10 points – which seems unlikely given Everton admitted to breaching PSR by £9.7m at October’s hearing – the risk of a first relegation in 73 years is real. Everton insisted the appeal was their primary focus when charged by the Premier League for a second time in January. 

"Everton’s case, while the result of years of mismanagement that prompted mass fan protests against owner Farhad Moshiri and the club’s former board, has exposed serious flaws in the Premier League’s regulatory framework. The argument for an independent regulator has been strengthened even further. The suspicion among Evertonians that the Premier League has used their club as a convenient scapegoat to show an independent regulator is not required has hardened since the appeal."

» Read the full article at The Guardian

Reader Comments (89)

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David Vaughan
1 Posted 18/02/2024 at 10:43:44
Nothing new, but a stark, elegant summary of how bleak our future truly appears.

And yet… there are sufficient gaps in the narrative to suggest we can (and should) retain hope for a brighter future, a resurrection, even before we have actually died and fufilled these prophecies of doom.

As I have said elsewhere on TW, reports of our (imminent) death have been much exaggerated.

Ian Edwards
2 Posted 18/02/2024 at 11:00:46
A journo called Vincenzo Grappa has tweeted that it will be announced on Monday we are getting 2 points back from the appeal.
David West
3 Posted 18/02/2024 at 11:08:02
This may be news to outsiders, but we know how grave the situation is.

The best thing for the club is to win matches and gain points. The team needs to pull some results from somewhere, we likely won't get all our points back, 4-5 maybe, so will still need to put points on the board.

It will be a massive week either way.

3 points from Palace, 6 from the Premier League would be a good week.

Brendan McLaughlin
4 Posted 18/02/2024 at 11:20:14
Ian #2

Only two points back I can believe.

To be announced on Monday... not so much.

Michael Kenrick
5 Posted 18/02/2024 at 12:10:52
After wading through the incessant barrage of utter crap from a host of despicable click-bait sites on NewsNow, it's almost refreshing to read a balanced and sensible journalistic presentation of our plight – especially without the faux angst and precipitous doom-mongering that seems an essential part of the exasperating formula all those sites now follow that requires some cretin to offer what passes for comment on the snippet of utter crap they have ferreted out.

Rant Over!

Bobby Mallon
6 Posted 18/02/2024 at 16:21:36
I’m sick of people going on about us not getting any points back and what’s the fucking headline "spark of defiance fading"? Not here it’s not.

We fucking got stitched up with a points deduction and, if we don’t get them all back, then the fans and playing staff should make sure no more of our games get finished. It’s time to really turn the heat up on those fuckers.

Bobby Mallon
7 Posted 18/02/2024 at 16:28:33
2 points is a joke and we should take the fuckers to court.
Derek Taylor
8 Posted 18/02/2024 at 20:42:21
More likely to be 5 points suspended but a further 5 imposed for the follow-up offence!

Meanwhile, City sign our young stars for pigeon shit and the show goes on..........

Jerome Shields
9 Posted 19/02/2024 at 08:16:17
No Appeal announcement Monday..

The summary is about right regarding Club mismanagement and the light touch regulatory Premier League ,forced to play catch up, is about right.

There will be many pivotal weeks ahead as Everton are giving enough to limp on with and avoid relegation..The ownership issue will drag on a lot longer that the current 5 months wait and Everton will not be taken over by 777 Partners ,even if they last that long, which is doubtful.

In view of being refered to a second commission imo the Premier League under pressure definitely has to make a point deduction on this appeal.Most likely to be 2 points on appeal, but I hope it is 4 points.But that would make 4 points the penalty result of the second Commission.It would take the August switch in rules to make that plausible. .It is going to take the Clubs of the Premier League to close ranks to get to that result.

Danny Baily
10 Posted 19/02/2024 at 09:00:28
Today could be the day...
Jim Wilson
11 Posted 19/02/2024 at 10:39:42
I have to disagree with you Michael @ 5

Any article with the line 'Barring the return of 10 points – which seems unlikely given Everton admitted to breaching PSR by £9.7m at October’s hearing' is not creditable.

If the Commissions hearing was corrupted by Masters, relevant mitigating circumstances were thrown out incorrectly and the punishment did not fit the crime there is every reason for the 10 pts to be re-instated.

These type of articles can be there to justify a Premier League ruling and are just more propaganda - in my opinion.

John Keating
12 Posted 19/02/2024 at 11:08:40
The circumstances to get the 10 points re-instated would be fair enough if the “independent” panel was indeed independent
As these panels are made up from such a small group of so called experts, it defies belief that they can be independent
Similarly how can they go against the wishes of the hand that pays them?
Jim Wilson
13 Posted 19/02/2024 at 12:05:16
Agree John, and it was on our KC to make it impossible for the Appeal Board not to agree with the argument that a points deduction was totally disproportionate for such a small overspend. Backed up by the fact that the club will not rest until the unfair pts deduction is removed.
Paul Birmingham
14 Posted 19/02/2024 at 12:25:49
Days of destiny approach..

I hope the KC has exposed the lack of compliance and transparency of Masters and his cronies.

Man City have got away with flaunting the rules for 15 years. This must be a key issue to expose the double standards of the so-called FFP and interpretation of unfair sporting advantage.

Praying for a good outcome for Everton FC and a clearer picture of when and if Everton can be in calmer waters.

Peter Hodgson
15 Posted 19/02/2024 at 12:32:15
Lets be honest with ourselves for a minute here by answering (ourselves) a question or two.

Why has it taken so long for the results of the appeal to be made known? We still don't know do we?

The answer is that the Premier League needed time so that their chosen outcome would most likely be fulfilled, ie, see how everyone around us got on last weekend and how we do against Palace before deciding what they would give us back.

The outcome at the end of the season, they hope, will fit whatever they wish it to be. If it doesn't work out, they will continue next season on their preferred outcome.

Sounds reasonable (as far as Masters & Co are concerned). A short or a long game can achieve the desired result, and all without any obvious (provable) corruption coming to light.

We remain at their mercy. It is whatever they want in the long run.

Of course, my thoughts could be miles wide of the mark.

Jack Convery
16 Posted 19/02/2024 at 12:54:51
The bottom 6 should refuse to play until the decision is made public. They should also ask for Masters to be suspended pending an investigation by a Judge into his and the Premier League's conduct, concerning Everton's treatment. Dragging this process out has been very deliberate and needs challenging.

Expect it tomorrow !!

Alan J Thompson
17 Posted 19/02/2024 at 12:55:26
Everton should "leak" that they have engaged lawyers to prepare action seeking an injunction against the Premier League should they uphold this points penalty.

It doesn't have to be true but it might cause them to rethink the matter, not that we would believe they could influence an "independent" panel.

Andrew McLawrence
18 Posted 19/02/2024 at 13:14:35
I have neither a mind for financial or legal things, but can anyone explain just how close we might be to administration or what needs to happen for that to be reality?
Jim Wilson
19 Posted 19/02/2024 at 13:33:39
Peter @15,

I couldn't agree more. We win tonight and the Appeal Board add on 3 pts to the deduction amount they decided on.

It is where I am today with my thinking.

Eddie Dunn
20 Posted 19/02/2024 at 13:48:17
Jim -they have already made their decision and to do such a thing would be exposed putting the PL in a bad spot.

I think that they have decided on the outcome but have delayed the announcement simply to avoid adverse publicity at this game.

Lots of people are convincing themselves that the Premier League might give us a couple of points back but that would need a huge U-turn from them, and I just don't see them backing down. A couple of points might be deemed enough of a token gesture to placate most fans and show that the Premier League are not the bad guys.

They know we can be slapped with another deduction in a few months. I don't trust them an inch. They have us over a barrel, delaying the takeover, delaying the announcement and they still have another potential deduction to hit us with.

They have all the Aces.

Tony Abrahams
21 Posted 19/02/2024 at 13:51:37
If 777 Partners are not going to be accepted, then this points deduction, as it stands, is obviously pushing Everton a lot closer to administration.

This alone is making a complete contradiction, out of the very reason why the profitability & sustainable laws were brought in, in the first place imo.

It's not corruption, but it's definitely a case of the weak getting crushed whilst the strong grow stronger.

Eddie Dunn
22 Posted 19/02/2024 at 14:07:19
Yes, Tony, the whole point of these rules is to make clubs sustainable in the long term.

The very fact that they changed the rules so that stadium costs were no longer included undermines a business from attempting to make the steps needed to increase revenue and ensure future profitability.

It's self-contradictory.

Brendan McLaughlin
23 Posted 19/02/2024 at 14:22:47
In reality, only 10 working days have passed since the Appeal hearing ended so it's not that surprising there has been no announcement yet.

The fact we have a televised game tonight probably has also impacted the timing.

Brian Williams
24 Posted 19/02/2024 at 14:26:22
With regard to the second charge, once again, I'll point out that the "financial expert" Paul Quinn has stated that there's nothing to worry about and that we'll be in the clear for that one.

With regard to 777 Partners, let's hope they don't get the go ahead!

Moshiri will then have to continue to fund the club until a better buyer comes along. It wouldn't make sense for Moshiri to seek administration.

Jim Wilson
25 Posted 19/02/2024 at 14:33:08
Eddie @ 20 - thanks for the assurance that decision won't be influenced by tonight.

But as regards them giving us a couple of pts back I will be furious if that happens.
Our KC should be able to drive a coach and horses through the IC's initial conclusions as they were so badly flawed.

I am of the thought all pts back or legal action.

Bill Gall
26 Posted 19/02/2024 at 14:51:36
My opinion on the points deduction is the same as most supporters, that it is unfair and seems motivated by someone who would like to see Everton at least relegated.

My own complaint is this deduction has distracted the actual poor performances from the team. We have played about 12 games since, that gives a chance of 36 points and we have got 15.

Yes, that would have put us up around 12th but that gives a false impression of the poor squad we have.

Tonight's game should not have been a must-win game – it should have been just another game where we expected a win.

Rant over. Time for my medication and go walk in the river till my hat floats, only problem: the river is frozen… maybe I will just go ice skating.

James Marshall
27 Posted 19/02/2024 at 15:22:25
To those saying the Premier League won't back down and give us any points back – it wasn't the Premier League who gave us a 10 point deduction, it was a so-called 'independent' commission. Correct me if I'm wrong on this point?

Also, and I know it was a slightly different kettle of eggs, but the 12-deduction for Spurs was halved to 6 points on appeal, so something similar is not entirely out of the question in my view.

Rennie Smith
28 Posted 19/02/2024 at 15:31:33
Seeing as they said the appeal decision would be published "middle of February", I know we're all guessing but could it be the decision is being challenged by the club (which I'm assuming that means it's bad news) which has resulted in a delay in publishing?

Just want the whole shambles of ownership and point deductions sorted so we can, somewhat, move on.

Rob Halligan
29 Posted 19/02/2024 at 15:32:52
Brian # 24… You don't mean “The Mighty Quinn”?


Brendan McLaughlin
30 Posted 19/02/2024 at 15:50:02
Rennie #28,

The mid-February date was newspaper talk. It didn't come from the Premier League nor the club as far as I'm aware.

Raymond Fox
31 Posted 19/02/2024 at 15:56:25
James @27,

I'm in the same boat as you as to who actually decided how many points were deducted. Will someone better read on this, clear this point up.

We will survive this season, regardless of what they do. A bigger question is do we really wont to play in this league? We are on survival mode each season as it's a competition in name only.

As things stand, we are tied into it because of the money but, unless they do away with this affordability lark, we will in a headlock for a long time.

Rennie Smith
32 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:19:19
I think you're right, Brendan @30, that was probably speculation.

It does highlight part of the problem which is the lack of transparency of the whole murky mess that is the Premier League. When they don't allow any associated documentation to be published with these "trials", we and the papers just make up our own stories.

That's why they don't want an independent regulator (and will probably succeed in that).

James Marshall
33 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:21:16
Raymond @31

Here you go, Ray, this should clear it up: Link

TL;DR It was an independent commission, not the Premier League

Eric Myles
34 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:23:02
Brian #24, if we get all 10 points back Moshiri may decide to go for administration with it being only 9 points deduction and we'll still survive!
Eric Myles
35 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:25:54
Eddie #22 "The very fact that they changed the rules so that stadium cost were no longer included"

When did they do that?

Les Callan
36 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:26:53
I don’t think it was the press that made up the middle of February. I’m pretty sure that the PL itself issued a timetable a few weeks ago which included, not only a schedule for the appeal date, and subsequent decision, but also for the second charge and a possible appeal, which ended a week after the season ends.
Ray Roche
37 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:36:20

I feel sure that I read that there were no hard and fast rules for punishing clubs at the time Everton were charged so they either ‘invented’ some or imported them from the EFL and also suggested to the independent commission that 12 points would be their preferred punishment. The whole thing appears to have been made up on the hoof and rushed in for reasons that have been widely discussed on here. Yes, the Government Regulator.

John Keating
38 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:39:22
Raymond 31
Raymond I think you will find the “independent” commission gave the 10 point deduction
However, it has to be said that rather than say absolutely nothing the PL issued a statement what they expected the outcome to be prior to the commissions decision
The commission told the PL they would not be swayed by their guidance and come to their own decision
But, lo and behold, guess what, the “independent” commission miraculously came to the conclusion the PL stated prior to the farce
Coincidence? Maybe? But equally maybe Putin is a nice guy and misunderstood by everyone
Tony Abrahams
39 Posted 19/02/2024 at 16:49:32
Ten working days, or seventeen days, is way too long imo, Brendan. They must surely have all the answers by now, and if they have I don’t know why we are still waiting?
Will Mabon
40 Posted 19/02/2024 at 17:18:32

we're still waiting mostly due to the oily PR bullshit that dominates above all else.

Now that we've passed the looks too close to the match/possible influence deadline, the next step will be to disguise that decision by leaving it a few more days. Expect Thursday.

An alternative is a "leak" from late tonight onwards. Unprovable, but mysteriously turns out to be accurate later.

Paul Tran
41 Posted 19/02/2024 at 17:22:38
Like I said on another thread, I think the Premier League are searching for a face-saving solution that is acceptable enough for all parties.
Raymond Fox
42 Posted 19/02/2024 at 18:05:48
Thanks James and John for replying.

There were exceptional events that we could not have been expected to forsee.
Their answer was 'tough thats business for you' and didnt allow us anything!
Its no wonder we appealed, whether it will do us any good remains to be seen.

Rob Hooton
43 Posted 19/02/2024 at 18:06:38
I predict we will be given 5 points back and then docked another 5 when the time comes, leaving us exactly where we are. Forest will then also be docked 5 points, dragging them into the mix. You read it here first!
Brendan McLaughlin
44 Posted 19/02/2024 at 18:42:48
Tony #39

I appreciate that but these things generally have timetables with fairly generous leeway built into them.

I'd have thought the Appeals panel will have had 7/14 days to reach a conclusion, draft a report and present it to both parties. No doubt Everton and the PL will also have been given an opportunity to ask for changes to the report if, for example, they felt the wording didn't accurately reflect their arguements.

Not satisfactory I accept but that tends to be the nature of the beast.

Let's hope tonight's result gives us more reason to be cheerful!


Dave Abrahams
45 Posted 19/02/2024 at 19:07:51
Paul (41),

I also think that the Premier League are looking for a face-saving solution that gets them off the hook along with Man City and Chelsea and every club starting afresh when they announce the new rules later in the year.

Some of this might be wishful thinking by me but it is also feasible to believe.

Tony Abrahams
46 Posted 19/02/2024 at 19:13:38
Thanks for explaining things a little bit better Brendan, and yes tonight’s game is absolutely massive for Everton tonight.

I’m getting ready to go the match, and hope that with the team having had nine days rest since the City game, then we might play with a bit more energy tonight, because the only thing that really concerns me (other than 777) is that our players have been looking tired.

Alan J Thompson
47 Posted 20/02/2024 at 04:09:30
An interesting point as to who actually applies the points penalty and at what stage it is applied. I'd have thought that the "Independent" Commission reach a verdict and then recommend a penalty which the Premier League then implements and is subject to appeal.

The whole mess will be looked at and changes made but we can be sure that it will be too late for us but just right for some others and that should also open a truly legal case for Everton to pursue, if the laws are that poor they need change then should they have been implemented at all, have we been allowed "natural justice"?

Eric Myles
48 Posted 20/02/2024 at 05:29:33
Ray #37, my point in questioning Eddie is that there was no change in the rules so that stadium costs were no longer included.

Stadium costs have always not been included.

Mark Ryan
49 Posted 20/02/2024 at 10:38:10
Who is currently running the club. Who is in charge? Do we even know? Why are they not demanding an answer to the Appeal? Come out and demand a resolution.

Typical of Everton to go so quiet. Get on the front foot, get the answer, take the medicine and get on with it ffs

Ray Roche
50 Posted 20/02/2024 at 16:24:10
Eric, again, are you sure that Spurs weren't allowed to include stadium costs in their calculations? I heard that they were.🤔

I was initially referring to the ‘formula' for deciding how many points we would get docked, the number of points docked per million pounds over, which was (I think) borrowed from the EFL because the Premier League didn't have a formula of their own.

Ergo, made on the hoof as they went along.

Stephen Davies
51 Posted 20/02/2024 at 18:28:15
Takeover further delayed.

Unlikely to hear anything this month

Mark Ryan
52 Posted 20/02/2024 at 18:29:08
Still no news about our Appeal.

How long does it take to type "The Appeal was not successful"?

Wish they'd put me out of my misery and just get on with it.

Stephen Davies
53 Posted 20/02/2024 at 18:34:56

Richard Jolly of The Independent confirms further delay in the takeover.

Rob Halligan
54 Posted 20/02/2024 at 18:58:43
If Forest are found guilty of their charge and get a points deduction, then they are going to appeal on the basis that, had Brennan Johnson been sold prior to 30 June last year, then they would have been under the threshold.

So basically what they may be asking for is the sale of Brennan Johnson to be “backdated” to before 30 June. How funny is that? They didn't sell him because they wanted more money for him, so asking for the sale to be backdated is just a joke.

We might as well have said that Richarlison was worth £80M, but we only got £60M, so can we include the extra £20M in our accounts?

Kieran Kinsella
55 Posted 20/02/2024 at 19:11:07
Mark Ryan,

The club probably communicate via fax and, since Bill died, no one has thought to add paper to it so they're all there sitting around wondering why it keeps ringing but no communications are forthcoming.

Tony Abrahams
56 Posted 20/02/2024 at 21:46:06
I’m struggling with every Tom, Dick and Harry speculating about Everton, and can’t believe that we still don’t know the outcome of our appeal!
Brendan McLaughlin
57 Posted 20/02/2024 at 21:51:29
Tony #56

Won't be announced tomorrow either.

Possibly Thursday but my money would be on Friday.

Tony Abrahams
58 Posted 20/02/2024 at 21:59:35
No Rob, I think Forest are going to say that they got more money for Brennan Johnson in the summer than they would have got if they had sold him in the previous transfer window, even though they knew by waiting, that this might have got them in trouble with P&S laws?

Sell cheap and stay out of trouble, or wait until the deadline has passed and make a lot more money on the transfer, even if getting more profit is somehow going to impede on your sustainability levels🤦‍♂️

Henrik Lyngsie
59 Posted 20/02/2024 at 22:32:54
I can’t see Forest get away with that explanation regarding Brennan Johnson. I think Forest will be in big trouble and they have overspent far more than we did according to P&S.
If they have overspent for 40 million and the logic is 6 points for overspending and 1 point for each 5 million. In that case they would be stripped 14 points!!
I read one place that they claimed they could have been fine if they had sold Johnson for 30 million in June but they opted for the higher fee in August.
30 million in breach would be 12 points.
I just don’t see Forest be stripped 12-14 points and therefore I am very optimistic that our 10 points will be significantly reduced.
Otherwise the season could very well end with appeals and lawsuits etc.
Rob Halligan
60 Posted 20/02/2024 at 23:09:35
This is where I saw the point in question about Forest wanting the Brennan Johnson fee received after 30 June 2023, to be backdated prior to 30 June. Appreciate it's probably not the most reliable source going, but still. Can't see them being successful with it myself……….


Ernie Baywood
61 Posted 21/02/2024 at 01:21:14
It's actually not a bad argument. They've been proven right... they developed a player and knew that selling him for less than he was worth would be a bad financial decision.

This is where the rules get iffy. The intent is to have clubs manage there finances within sustainable limits, but the application of those rules can cost money and prevent that.

They'll lose, but it's a decent mitigation. We had a similar mitigation with Richarlison but we instead went with Gylfi's mental health.

Does anyone know if we have now changed our accounting treatment of loans so that we can now retrospectively capitalise them against the stadium? If so, you'd expect some points coming back.

Pete Clarke
62 Posted 21/02/2024 at 02:21:30
Moshiri has done very little right since he took us over, especially trying to front up to the Premier League over these charges, but at least he realized that mistake and hired the super silk.

All our hopes are pinned on the job he has done. We are guilty to a degree but it's their job to pick holes in the prosecution as such and try to minimize the damage.

The waiting game is almost as painful as watching our players try to play football.
John Flood
63 Posted 21/02/2024 at 14:20:18
Ernie (61).

Nottingham Forest would have an argument if they had reigned in their spending between the PSR deadline date of 30 June 2023 and selling Brennan Johnson on transfer deadline day 1 September 2023. But they didn't.

In between those dates, they signed 9 more players including Ibrahim Sangaré, Anthony Erlanga, Chris Wood, Andrew Omobamidele and Murillo for a total of £103.87M. As well as selling Johnson they also brought in £13.36M in that time, so they have still increased their net transfer spend even including the sale of Johnson (which they want to count to the previous season's PSR figure as they are already way over on that).

What is more, even after getting charged, they spent the cash again in the January window, albeit on a much smaller scale this time.

As such, I would be stunned if their argument was accepted when looked against their continued transfer activity since the PSR deadline date, and I really cannot see what their defence could possibly be.

Jamie Crowley
64 Posted 21/02/2024 at 18:46:43
Are we ever going to hear word about the appeal?

God above, man, take your time!

This is taking so long, they need to pitch a tent and sell tickets! Circus!

Michael Bennet
65 Posted 21/02/2024 at 21:01:30
Liverpool's C team are doing us a favour tonight... it will be a straight shout out between us and Luton I think...

Even if we get some points back we will get more deducted next season and probably the season afterwards, we are in a right fucking mess.

Paul Hewitt
66 Posted 21/02/2024 at 21:03:21

I would say Forest are in more trouble than us.

John Raftery
67 Posted 21/02/2024 at 21:04:35

If our appeal fails, Forest face a 15 points deduction if their hearing uses the same formula applied to us.

Steve Oshaugh
68 Posted 21/02/2024 at 21:44:31
Clearly our season mostly hinges on what happens with the points deduction. In my mind, I have assumed that we don't get points back this week and, if that is the case, then you can only imagine we will get some more taken away.

It seems to me wishful thinking that the punishment for the second breach would change if the appeal fails.

I think, once that situation is clarified, Dyche will respond appropriately, ie, if we lose more points, he will loosen the shackles out of necessity as seemed to be the case last time.

If it remains somewhere around 10 points, then I think it will be more of the same on the basis that the teams with the worst defence, generally speaking, are the ones that are more likely to go down.

How we are playing is directly attributed to the injuries in the squad and feeling the need to not throw it away with this many games to go. Holding the line, while not pretty, is a justifiable tactic at this stage.

Jerome Shields
69 Posted 21/02/2024 at 21:49:20

We will find out soon enough – and the second commission does have a bearing on the appeal and will be less of a punishment, because of the period it covers, which crosses with the previous period.

Don Alexander
70 Posted 21/02/2024 at 00:15:38
Viewing the Premier League Table for the past five games, only Fulham, in 12th position, have "excelled" our own four-point aggregate. And people still say the Premier League is the most competitive in the world? As if!

Even if we get all 10 points back ("as if" again!) we're still rats in a bag amongst the hopeless.

I just wish there was a credible club out there who "always get it right" that others, like us, could contact in a bid to obtain assistance to rectify the catastrophe inflicted on us for decades.

But there isn't – and never was. The notion is patent nonsense, obviously, except to Kenwright fans.

Tony Abrahams
71 Posted 22/02/2024 at 08:27:32
A club that has avoided relegation on the second last and then last game of the season, these last two years, are under massive pressure because of the points deduction, and are not being helped (once again) by the Premier League now dragging out the verdict for the appeal.

Yes, we won four on the bounce after they took away 10 of the points the team had already won, but it came in the month of December, when the games come thick and fast.

An absolutely disgusting decision was conjoined up by Oliver and Atwell to stop us in our tracks at Spurs, then a linesman's decision turned the game in Man City's favour, and then suddenly the wind in our sails was gone.

We then had injuries that a very small squad found hard to cope with, and I don't believe we have regained our energy levels, and once again this is not being helped by the Premier League dragging out their decision, which is obviously affecting a squad that look mentally tired.

Monday was very poor, way too conservative, and we looked like a team with no real method, but anyone who thinks that waiting for this decision, isn't affecting the squad, is being very unfair imo.

James Marshall
72 Posted 22/02/2024 at 09:05:29
As someone said on the Live Forum, Monday night: if you circle the drain long enough, eventually you'll go down the plughole.

We really, truly are a club on the precipice of dropping out of the Premier League.

Now where's the bloody decision on these damned points?!

Jerome Shields
73 Posted 22/02/2024 at 09:06:28
Just hope we end up with a manageable point deduction.

Any speculation I have made on the appeal or future is based on what I hope will be a manageable outcome and Everton will survive in the Premier League. I am betting on Everton with its tradition, wide support, new stadium, and pressure on the Premier League being too big to fail. Something I would not do in my normallife.

Liam Heffernan
74 Posted 22/02/2024 at 09:52:46
How is the appeal taking so long? It shows that the Premier League and the appeals board they appointed have nothing but contempt for us as a club. The so-called "bigger" clubs would be treated very differently.

Didn't Liverpool get away with overspending a few years back and the Premier League said it was okay because of extenuating circumstances (money spent on their stadium)? COYB.

Paul Hewitt
75 Posted 22/02/2024 at 10:16:15
Weirdly enough, I'm taking the time the appeal is taking as a good sign.

If the appeals panel had found in favour of the Premier League and said the 10-point deduction stays, I doubt the Premier League would wait so long to tell us.

We probably have all 10 points back and the Premier League are just trying to come up with some excuse to save face. Plus keep the relegation battle a bit more interesting for a bit longer…

Alan McGuffog
76 Posted 22/02/2024 at 10:20:56
Ha ha, Paul...

I always used that "logic" when I was waiting for a reply to a job application. No news was good news. Then the slim brown envelope would drop on the mat.

Brian Harrison
77 Posted 22/02/2024 at 10:25:47
Paul @314,

Let's hope you are right and the majority of the panel want a bigger reduction in points than Masters wants, so they are still negotiating a final figure.

Whatever the outcome, the more worrying aspect is seeing we face a second charge along with Forest, by the time they make their decisions known and then undoubtedly an appeal it could be at the season's end before this is resolved.

But maybe, Paul, they are making it look like they have deliberated long and hard and it's taken the best part of 3 weeks or more to come to a decision that they actually made within days of the hearing finishing.

Let's hope we hear before this weekend's games so everybody affected knows where they stand in relation to our appeal, as this decision doesn't only affect Everton.

Les Callan
78 Posted 22/02/2024 at 11:01:55
Now then, Alan, never knew you were trying to leave Sin Tellins!
Brian Harrison
79 Posted 22/02/2024 at 11:13:51
Where is our owner? He chooses to stay in Monaco rather than come out and tell Evertonians why he has run this club so shambolically since he arrived. No word why, as a qualified accountant, he allowed the club to fall foul of the P&S rules.

He has also accepted an offer from 777 Partners to buy the club yet, as the days go by, they seem less and less likely to get the go-ahead from the Premier League. So what happens if they don't get approval?

What is Moshiri's plan? Will he still put in funds to finish the stadium and support the day-to-day running of the club if 777 Partners pull out?

The fans deserve better and I feel sorry for Colin Chong, who has been thrown in the deep end being made CEO. Yet our owner hides away from telling the fans what's the likelihood of us going into administration if the deal with 777 Partners falls through.

Alan McGuffog
80 Posted 22/02/2024 at 11:26:12
Les... many fond memories of the place but not been back in years. All the best mate
Bill Gall
81 Posted 22/02/2024 at 12:09:50
I didn't think the Premier League were taking their time with our appeal, until I realized I had read War and Peace twice while waiting.

Makes you laugh when they consider themselves Premier league officials… 'Premier' in the dictionary: First in rank or position. More like first in cowardice and backstabbing.

Pete Neilson
82 Posted 22/02/2024 at 12:30:43
I see Forest will be asking the Premier League to backdate the accounting oJof the transfer of hnson to Spurs to help their financial case. Their argument being they held out for a higher offer.

A sensible argument but surely it won't hold water with the Premier League as they refused to acknowledge we sold Richarlison for £20M less as we panicked to balance the books. At least Forest managed to hold out and negotiate a higher price!

Nigel Munford
83 Posted 22/02/2024 at 13:28:00
I see we’re still awaiting the appeal outcome. The suspense is killing me.
Tom Bowers
84 Posted 22/02/2024 at 14:10:08

Yes, the long delay in the Premier League's decision is totally unacceptable and lends credence to the thought that they will give us back shit as far as points are concerned. I won't hold my breath given the way they run the Premier League.

My beef (one of many) is why no change in the stupid offside rule that allows the game to continue knowing full well it will all be brought back??

Another is that at corner kicks etc defenders can continually clutch and grab offensive players and very rarely is a penalty called. Instead, a gutless referee merely holds the kick being taken whilst he has a quiet word with the players involved but they carry on with it anyway. Why bother talking to the defender (who is generally the culprit) and then do nothing?

Justice was served when Onana score against Palace because Branthwaite was being held mercilessly by a Palace defender but, if Onana hadn't scored, would the inept referee have given a penalty? No chance!!

Les Callan
85 Posted 22/02/2024 at 15:16:14
Have I heard this correctly. Sean Dyche has just said that appeal decision not expected till the end of the month?
Mark Murphy
86 Posted 22/02/2024 at 15:59:29
Possibly Les, I didn't hear it myself, but it's February and today's the 22nd so we're pretty much in the end of the month?
Alan McGuffog
87 Posted 22/02/2024 at 16:02:25
If it were one of the Sky Six, d'you think they'd have the nerve to drag it out ad infinitum? Then again I've answered my question.

It'd never involve the media darlings, would it?

Pat Kelly
88 Posted 22/02/2024 at 19:13:57
We have two great prospects of entering the Guinness Book of World records this season. Calvert-Lewin's scoreless run and the points deduction appeal delay. Another Everton first beckons.
Ray Jacques
89 Posted 22/02/2024 at 19:28:32
This sounds stupid and I know it is but, if we are relegated because of a points deduction, then I wouldn't class it as such as I would be full of a sense of injustice.

I am sick of the Premier League circus and would probably enjoy the Championship more. At least we would win more often. It's been turgid watching Everton the past 3 seasons.

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