Live by the sword, die by the sword but change brings opportunity for a much better future

Relegation to the Championship for all six is a fair and proportionate sanction.

Also the need for a truly independent regulator to oversee fairness and stop anticompetitive actions is immediately needed.

Why do I feel that the ‘Greedy Six' size 10 Jackboot is still squashing my face?

I fear that nothing meaningful will be done, there will be subservience and almost puppy licking gratitude by some clubs that they have come back into the fold.

It literally and physically makes my stomach turn that it is almost inevitable all they will get is a slap on the wrist and a ‘don't do it again'.

They need to understand that these greedy six are hungry vultures and they are still circling their prey. ACTION IS NEEDED or they will get what they want in the short to medium term.

It's a golden opportunity for the sport to create a “Fair Football Charter “ to protect clubs from any future self-serving greed and Cartel like anticompetitive practice. As it stands I'm unconvinced that the current powers have the wherewithal to the kick the ball into the empty net.

That could be by way of points awarded to the 14 Premier League clubs at the start of the next campaign, or indeed added to their totals at the end of this campaign - 23 points should suffice as that was the number of years the contract the Super League was scheduled for.

If not palatable to mess around with points how about the TV monies allocated to the rebels is shared out amongst the 'good' clubs? Better still allow all the other clubs to have a five-year FFP holiday whilst the 'rebels' are restricted by whatever FFP rules are in place at the time of the decision.

In fact, all three scenarios should be employed as this would be a suitable albeit indirect punishment for the transgressors.

Of course, none of the above will happen and things will be back to normal before the first trophy is won on Sunday, but it was nice to dream for a moment.

The commentary on governance inevitably makes me think of the German 50 + 1 model to ensure a club retains the majority of its voting rights to reduce the dominance an external investor can have.

They have said sorry and will not expect or accept any kind of justice. For the 14

And Paul, l must add. Loads of effort into your thoughts and posts always interesring.

The Regulation piece is interesting to me. You're right that the clubs have shown that they can't be trusted to regulate themselves. Independent regulation seems an obvious solution.

The only problem is that the clubs would need to vote for it wouldn't they? Across English professional clubs it would be supported, but at PL level I doubt it would get up. We'd need fan revolt and a Government squeeze.

My sense is that things have simply gone too far now. We localised power in the top division, then a top 6 formed that held enough power to veto anything domestically and influence on the continent to maintain their status. We're just waiting for professional football to collapse and re-form.

Unless we can get a couple of the big 6 to break ranks. But that will take a massive coordinated effort...

Then, if they don't do it already, hold a complete audit of these clubs finances to be widely published to show what debt these 6 clubs would have if they were to be wound up tomorrow. Then a submission to UEFA to drop any rating system of clubs in order to give any priority/seeding in competitions.

May be the best way to punish the breakaways clubs, is to put a transfer embargo on them and restrict their financial clout for two years. That may lead to a more level playing field and allow, others to compete with the so called ‘big six'.

In the fifties, sixties and seventies, the leagues were more volatile and subject to constant changing competition, and players more settled in their locality, but in the modern game the attraction of playing in the Champions league definitely has a bearing on where a quality available player wants to ply his trade.

The Premier league will have to consider innovative ways of producing a different brand and it appears that can only be achieved by financial regulation or by a type of handicapping system in order to give other less powerful clubs a chance.

I've just rechecked the EPL rules. Each club has one vote each, so in any situation, 14 clubs need to vote for a change in the rules, or in a change in commercial arrangements.

Under existing rules, members can be fined, or lose points, for breaking the rules, and in extreme circumstances can be expelled. Any of this would require the involvement of an independent 3 man tribunal, seemingly.

So if I'm reading it properly, under the existing rules, quite severe penalties would be open if the 14 teams vote unanimously for it, if these 6 clubs are deemed to have broken the rules.

Expect the lawyers to get involved in the interpretation of the nature of the ESL ‘agreement'

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/56741406

How convenient it would be if we all just forget this ever happened... But it did happen.

No Pep, hopefully this is only the start of a well-earned chastening of those involved and a level playing field for all.

I won't hold my breath..

The Premier League must demand that the greedy 6 with all other clubs sign some sort of loyalty agreement now or they are thrown out the Premier League.

They must be punished too. We must not be soft.

The greedy 6 were plotting for at least 3 years and will be still plotting while getting the benefits of being in the Premier League.

They are treacherous and an utter disgrace.

I rather suspect rule changes and monetary fines rather than any points/relegation penalties in the hope it may quickly blow over and back to business as usual but with precautions. It may not seem fair but may be acceptable to all clubs.

I think it's a 2/3 majority needed which basically means 14 teams in a 20 team league. I think they tried to reduce the size of the league as part of their last attempt as well. So they have the numbers to vote for sanctions like fines and points deductions if unanimous.

Yes, the tribunal applies to expulsions as far as I can see, and it must be independent. So that rules me out! It may be they use a tribunal in any case because of the legal implications

I'm not sure what powers the FA still have, but they are effectively the games regulator so they might have a part to play.

Obviously there has to be some retribution but I feel Sky's viewing needs will be part of the ongoing consideration, which is why they have started their own underlying campaign to rule out any such thoughts of relegating the top 6.

Once this has all settled down, the best we can hope for is a new governance that will attempt to re-set the Premier League into some form of equal playing field, although it will be more equal for some than others, I suspect!

The new Champions League format is too complicated, so we could do with starting a re-think on that competition for starters.

Also West Ham had points deducted for breaches of player registration which nearly demoted them so the PL also has it's own precedent for applying this type of punishment.

Another added benefit is that if Arsenal are demoted Everton become the longest continued top flight team.

Seriously, a battle may have been won but the war to create a meritocracy has only just begun. UEFA's own proposed Champions League format includes discretionary places for teams with good "coefficients" (however that is intrepreted), which means that the likes of the RS and Utd will never have to qualify again.

How can anyone be totally happy with the current backdown if such a back door system exists? It's like saying Brazil and Germany can play in every future World Cup without the need to play any qualification matches.

Let's show our disapproval of the "VIP pass" with as much passion as we did in the case of the proposed Super League. Otherwise, we have gained nothing.

Similarly, the Champions League won't expel them as they generate too much money for the corrupt Uefa leeches.

The best we may hope for is that there would be a 10-point deduction for those involved, thus minimising the impact to the Premier League and Uefa coffers to only 1 year.

But I think we also need to address the real reason these clubs wanted to join the money cartel: it's because most of the so-called richest clubs are in massive debt. The reason they are in debt is because they have created their own demise by paying agents and players money they couldn't afford to pay.

Most of these clubs enjoy raking in Champions League money but it's still not enough to balance the books. Barcelona are a billion pounds in debt... how have their regulatory authorities both in Spain and under Uefa FFP allowed them to do this? The wage bills of both Barca and Real are just not sustainable.

Yes, Messi is probably the best player in the world but who can afford to pay him £680,000 per week and his team mates are also on extortionate wages. Real are still paying most of Bales £600,000 per week, plus the other top earners there are on again unsustainable money that no club in the world can afford.

So, instead of looking at ways of joining elitist teams to forge a cartel to make more money, which will no doubt not reduce the debt; this allow them to spend even more on players. Surely if there was a time for a maximum wage in football, it is now, never mind what Barca and Real spend — 85% of Everton's profit goes directly into players' bank accounts.

I would love to see that kind of punishment meted out but the chances of relegation or European bans being imposed are zero, I would say.

I would welcome Everton getting more fan representation at boardroom level and to use this to get our own house in order. I'm sceptical that Moshiri, although seemingly of a higher moral standard than some of his peers, is still as businessman who will want massive control of the club.

Already, the events of the past few days seem like this had all been a dream. The narrative has been changed: Jordan Henderson spoke up and that John Henry deserves credit for apologising. The 6 clubs want to return to normal as though nothing happened – like unfaithful husbands returning to their wives and families and asking for forgiveness.

This morning, Sky Sports News were continuing their agenda that they invented football in 1992 – Man City and Spurs both won last night and that was where their focus should be this morning. I sat there listening to whether Phil Foden is Man City's player of the year. Was Mourinho's sacking where their focus should have been directed towards on Monday?

Like all fellow Toffees, we haven't had much to shout about on the pitch but we should be rightly proud of how our club reacted to this coup attempt, how it treated its staff during the pandemic and the brilliant work it does for the local community. I've read countless contributions from Evertonians which are well-balanced, brilliantly argued and completely fair. I think Everton are one of the winners from this debacle.

To hear of pundits and ex-players saying that punishment affects the players and the fans is infuriating to us long-suffering Evertonians who were deprived of seeing arguably our greatest ever team compete amongst the European elite for 5 years. Our club did nothing wrong then, and in truth, Everton have never looked like reaching the summit of English football in the decades since. That European ban affected a whole host of clubs including Oxford United, Wimbledon, Coventry City, Nottingham Forest and Sheffield Wednesday. As others have said, there are numerous cases where points deductions were enforced against clubs and it unfairly affected the blameless fans and players – my home town club of Wigan Athletic spring to mind. I didn't hear much outcry when Bury were forced out of business. Fairness in punishments has never been directed towards the fans so why should that change because this time it affects the media darlings?

I've had people say to me "Yes, but Everton were in the Big 5 that started the Premier League." Well, that is true but we never advocated an additional midweek league lasting 23 years from which we could never be relegated, effectively pulling up the ladder, using an obscene amount of riches to ensure that no other clubs could ever compete in English football again. Everton were the second most decorated club in the land at the time and most affected by the harshest of punishments.

If there is no action taken against these 6 clubs, then I hope, at the very least, that Sky Sports, BT and all of the print media ban the use of the term "the Big 6". With their ex-players all over the media, I think even this is asking for too much.

My prediction is that next season will start. These 6 will still be in the Premier League, and not much will have changed. Hope I'm wrong.

Of course, when we were one of "The Big Five", that was understandable!!

There should be a full investigation into who knew about this whole sorry affair but that would probably take ten years by which time the ESL may be up and running anyway.

Ray @22, I agree totally how wrong this latest Uefa cartel is but surely so do every club in Europe outside the top clubs, with a genuine hope of gatecrashing the party. Why don't our great club get signatures from the owners to say they won't stand for it. Surely this is a great time for us to stand up to the bullying Uefa corruption.

As most have said, an apology and a fine (If we are lucky) with Uefa sneaking the new restricted Champions League club rules in via the back door.

If they can play dirty, can't the rest of us? The squeals from the other 5 will be wonderful!

But yes, much as I would love it, just love it, for the 6 to be severely punished, I do not see it happening. Too much influence. What is frustrating is now is perhaps the time to strike back. There is so much anger and resentment that their threat of "Give us this or we will set up a ESL" to Uefa is at the moment a paper tiger. It is a non-threat.

Therefore now is the time for Uefa to knock them down because they are on the floor and can't fight back. Now is the time to get rid of the cartel. To show the stranglehold of these clubs, since 1992 there have been 86 titles in Spain, Italy and England and only 7 times was it not one of these clubs. Competition and uncertainty is just so much more fun.

A plague on all their houses.

Had this super league gone ahead, each club would have received £350M just for the privilege of joining. So the answer is simple, each club give Everton £100M, that's £600M to build our new stadium.

Unfair on the other thirteen clubs, maybe, but don't forget, their share of the pot of gold at the end of the premier league rainbow would have been affected dramatically had the super league gone ahead. Each club could have lost anything between £200M - £300M over the next few years because of reduced tv money. I'm only guessing at these figures, because even the bottom club gets around £100M, so let's say the TV money could easily have been cut by 50%. So over the next 4 - 6 years that amounts to £200 - £300M.

So £100M fine for the septic six, payable to Everton Football Club. Jobs a goodun, septic six are punished and the rest of the premier league clubs are not out of pocket. Sounds good to me anyway!

I have a problem with the idea of relegation of the Psychotic 6, in that; it seems to me, that would provoke them to join a completely separate, permanent League of 12, which I suspect, is their ultimate objective. How about applying an immediate deduction of 5 points? Enough to have them scrabbling around for European qualification, but not enough to make them want to break away.

As for the Rob Halligan 'pay for our stadium' idea; I think it's a good one, but I would suggest that the Horrid Half-Dozen be made to provide Everton with an interest-free loan of £600m repayable over 25 years, the likely period we would have borrowed over, anyway.

As to the bosses of these clubs; in a different age, men of honour would have picked up a pistol, walked into the forest and done the decent thing!!

Were the media concerned about the remnants of clubs and fans left in the ruins of the Premier League? No, all the focus was on the poor dears who support the not-big six and the effects of leaving on them. (Has anyone ever got a new seasons fixture list by the way and looked up when we play Man City, Spurs or Chelsea? Thought not.)

Football has become nothing more than a tool to be used and abused by television and gambling concerns. Parasites like 'giants of football', Kris Kamara and Robbie Savage, talking shite while earning millions, studios rammed with pundits from the usual suspects, fixtures at every minute of the night and day so that every redshite fan from Cockermouth to Staines can get behind "the shirt".

For me, football needs to go back to basics, get rid of TV contracts, and play all games at 3pm on Saturday afternoon.

I don't care about tv money or foreign players, I enjoyed football more when you had to go the match to see it, when the grounds weren't full of trendy nobheads but people who played and knew the game.

The blanket coverage nowdays bores the arse off me. Unless the game goes back to basics, and it won't because the greed is too powerful, then the charade of normality will continue until the next attempt to break away comes from the self-appointed big clubs.

How Spurs are considered "Big Six" is beyond me, have they won anything since 1963?

It can only be based on money, so now Greedy Six is more appropriate.

Since then Uefa Cup twice, FA Cup and League Cup 4 times, but most importantly League Titles... Zero. And that includes 1977-78 when they only finished 3rd in the Second Division, to be promoted back on Goal Difference!

Finish the well know phrase by Jim Royle - Big 6? Big 6 my arse!

It's a nice idea – and one I trust you'll be recommending Denis Barrett-Baxendale puts on the agenda for the next meeting of the Legacy 14. I still think the most likely outcome is modest fines and modest points deductions.

If I were a gambling man, I'd guess that the Premier League will wait until the end of the season to see where teams finish. They will then impose points penalties cunningly calculated to cause minimal damage. Assuming Man City and Man Utd finish 1st and 2nd, the points deductions will be such that they'll still have enough to qualify for next season's Champions League – so Uefa will be kept onside.

The other 4 may have to suffer the consequences of dropping a few places, but 2 of them would miss out on the Champions League in any event.

In this way:

1) The Premier League can claim to have “taken tough action”;

2) Sky will be kept onside, as all 6 remain in the Premier League next season;

3) The Legacy 14 will be happy – they know they need the Super 6 in the Premier League to retain the value of the Sky deal;

4) Uefa will be happy – though they seem happy enough that the ESL concept has died away;

5) And of course, Mr FLorez, FSG, the Glazers & Co can resume their clandestine meetings to plan resurrecting the idea – in a different guise – sometime in the next 2 years;

6) Most supporters of most clubs won't be happy – so no change there!

We all know the Septic Six are going to escape any meaningful punishment, so my idea would never be considered in a million years!

Apparently Masters of PL warned them not to go ahead but they ignored him. Told them the rules didn't allow it, but they ignored him. Told them the wider football community wouldn't accept it, but they ignored him.

'Ignore' is the root of ignorance, I'm guessing.

Just seen it on Sky Sports News.

Maybe the odd sacrificial lamb.

"More faces than the town hall clock" is one the milder ones.

It should happen but it won't, mate.

I'm guessing they reckon the force is with them.

"Okay, Joe Bloggs, you have been a very naughty Chairman. You're sacked. Jack Bloggs will take your seat with immediate effect."

Once complete and agreed by the 14, and I suppose the lawyers, then the penalties will be announced, seemingly. If any.

This is a separate action.

Mark, give us a clue.

There are calls for an Advisory Board with at least an element, if not entirely, made up from Fans. We already have at our head, I'm told, the Greatest Evertonian Ever and look where that got us.
No, not the British Virgin Islands!

Of your two articles you wrote in the wake of the news and its rapid collapse Paul, I couldn't agree with the doom-laden content of the first portraying it as disastrous for Everton, whilst this second article, athough sound in its rationale and appealing to many, is extremely unlikely to be implemented.

Personally, I'm encouraged that both the PL (in the case of the soiled six) and UEFA are taking their time in preparing the case that all the involved clubs have to answer for.
I was never as despondent as you appeared in your first post on the subject and the possible financial exposure to greatly reduced monies from media deals.

Why? Because here in England at least there is a HUGE appetite for live match attendance. And not just in the PL. For a number of seasons now the Championship has had the third highest aggregate crowds against all other major European leagues. That number is only bettered by the PL itself and the Bundesliga, surpassing the likes of Spain, Italy and France.

When unrestricted numbers of spectators can return to the stadiums they will be hotbeds of raucous, unbridled passion. We've seen it in the pockets of protest from even the supporters of the soiled six. All that adds to the TV spectacle. And to the uptake of TV subscriptions.

I think in predicting the doomsday scenario of much-reduced revenues from TV broadcast rights Paul you overlooked a vital component in the arrangement: just how essential – key, in fact – live sport is to the broadcasters' business model.

Who remembers the early days of satellite TV? It was CRAP! Filling airtime with awful re-runs of 1960s American sit-coms like The Flying Freaking Nun! Sky had their backs against the wall and were close to going under.

Then they found the magic ingredient. Live sport to which you had to pay a subscription to access. Their advertising revenues soared to help fund and perpetuate their dominance in the field.

All such broadcasters worldwide follow the same template and have multiple channels as a result. Those channels constantly need fresh content to fill the airtime. On a global scale, nothing has greater appeal to the TV than football. And English PL football in particular.

I mention this because in the last 24 hours you have the following story doing the rounds:

No Fall Off in New TV Broadcasting Rights

As you can read, Sky simply cannot afford to lose the near monopoly they hold on PL broadcasting rights in the UK and – even with the turmoil of the last two weeks yet to fully play out – they are already willing to pay the same inflated monies of recent seasons to retain the contract for the next 3 years.

Personally, I never feared that the leaving of the soiled six could impact as negatively on Everton and others as you originally wrote Paul. English football at both the PL and Championship level is a great ‘product'. The possible absence of the soiled six could actually have been a great opportunity to enhance it further.

Finally, as this has played out so far, I also think Everton could be very well positioned to take advantage of events. Consider the following:

* From the start of the pandemic the club moved quickly to reassure all its staff that they would be retained on full salary, which contrasted starkly to the likes of three of the soiled six – them, Arsenal and Spurs – who couldn't move quickly enough to dismiss and furlough staff, claiming the UK government furlough handout in doing so
* DB-B took the lead and eloquently opposing the soiled six's ‘Big Project Reset' for the PL and the English Game in October
* Last week she delivered the club's scything comments in response to the ESL
* Moshiri, speaking on TalkSport, was equally condemning of the soiled six, saying Everton would ‘never' join such a league
* Our continued outstanding work in the community through EiTC.

If you are looking for a club with ethics and a social conscience – and it does matter to many – you would be hard pressed to find a club that surpasses Everton.

I would also suggest, given how quickly the soiled six withdrew their support for the ESL, they also know they need the PL just as much – maybe even more so – than the other 14 clubs.

Another very, VERY good reason we and Everton in particular should not fear seeing the soiled six sail away over the horizon is the following.

Some statto has done some serious number crunching of how every PL season would have played out without the presence of the soiled six.

Who would take seeing Everton crowned as PL champions in EIGHT of the last 15 seasons as a result? That's my hand up!

Everton Dominate PL

All harmless fun.

I suspect very little will happen now the 'not fair to punish the fans and players' card has been well and truly played by all parties including the media.

Serie A to Ban Breakaway Clubs

This is no small thing. It's very categoric and they have a deadline - June 21. Any Italian club signing up to a competition before then not sanctioned by UEFA or FIFA will simply be banned from Serie A and all Italian domestic competitions.

That's much further than any other federation has declared to date. Nor is that to say 'that's it', that there will be no further sanctions against the rebel clubs.

Plenty of time and scope for that yet.

There is nothing to fear without them and they, along with the global audience would soon tire of the mundane nature of the closed club. That's why they bottled it quickly; they know they need the Premier / national leagues too. They want both, not a breakaway.

Interesting stance from the Italians, but then, albeit for very different reasons, they have proven willingness to act against big names in the past. Whereas we make scapegoats of Wigan and kick Leeds when already down, they took Juventus to the cleaners a few years back.

I wonder if our football authorities have the balls.