Dan Meis on his return to the stadium project

I happened to hear Dan speaking about the project in the tail end of a radio program on the BBC World Service (yes, they still have one). He spoke with great pride and passion especially at how well the project had been received by the people of Liverpool. Even the other lot!

He is a great ambassador for both the club and the stadium.

He probably would be quicker at getting us them players!

He just stopped short of saying "What a chairman!"

Now that safe standing is getting a trial run, 62,000 for the derby is lip-smacking, with that huge home end.

It will be a sad day leaving Goodison, but we have to move forward and I reckon the new ground will be a game-changer for us.

We've had 5 years of failings under a period of big spending and we are a team that looks no more equipped than for just scraping 40 points every season.

Couple of injuries to one or two key players and we are stumped, such is the ineptitude of our recruitment policies.

Injuries and lack of funds have not helped his cause, especially when he has had games where Pickford, Godfrey, Doucouré, Richarlison, Calvert-Lewin, Digne, Coleman, among others, have all missed games through injury.

Rondon was a case of "he is free, we will take him", but Townsend and Gray have been decent players brought in.

Only lack of funds probably forced our hands to let Olsen leave and have a freebie brought in, instead.

We need to stick by Rafa for now, give the guy some money to spend, and get some better luck on the injury front.

Tough games ahead but, if the support is like the Spurs game, and the players react, we can get through these tough games.

We are only going to get stronger, when we get players back in, and a few additions in January, so for now we need to roll our sleeves up and try and dig out a few results.

You don't tend to hear the role of "Guardianship" in a major new build too often.

I've said it before and I'll keep on saying it: The away fans should be up in the gods, à la Newcastle or Old Trafford. Behind Perspex screens with obviously proper ventilation. That's optional on derby days... 😀.

The screens would dull the noise because we need this to another blue bear pit. No more nice old Everton.

A quality play delivered by a top cast at a premium theatre plays to packed houses. Substitute has-beens and second-raters and the place morphs into a half-empty graveyard.

Shakespeare warned in his Caesar play when talking about an Iranian fella building on the river... "Beware the tides and Mosh" !!!

Nice to see a Shakespearean reference on the thread (and not one related to Big Sam's mate Craig Shakespeare). Raises the overall tone, I think.

I was wondering if TW's resident thespian (Sam Hoare) has ever delivered this line on stage – or if he's still waiting for the opportunity?

Another crap month of football so what do you do? Wheel out another BMD story!!

Has our esteemed manager spent any time in California?

How do you work out 62,000 capacity?

I thought the announced figure was 52,000 with safe standing up to 60,000.

How you can increase 10% capacity, I just don't know.

Welcome back Dan, just like a new signing ! Now, what size boots do you take ?

Good of him to be earning his crust on shit show Sky and his fashion shoot. He's a big girl's blouse.

The Premier League club will unveil more details about the proposed stadium during the second stage of public consultation, which begins on July 26.

Everton has already revealed that it is targeting a capacity of 52,000 for its proposed new stadium, with the potential for it to rise to 62,000 in the future, with safe standing.

May be 60,000 but, from what I remembered, if we had safe standing, it could be be raised to 62,000; apologies if I am wrong.

We could have Dan back onboard as well, with no World Heritage Site hurdles, and that he could ensure if we need to build higher in the future, he can future-proof the stadium to ensure that.

Inspired by Rodin's 'Thinker', we will be getting The Stinker by Rondon.

"Did I tell you, by the way, me uncle Cyril put me on his crossbar and put me in the Boys Pen."

Two more sniffles, a 10-second pause, then a sigh, followed by a band playing The Leaving of Liverpool (Goodison), then more shite from Bill about a new chapter in Bramley-Moore Dock, complete in his Bob the Builder outfit, hard hat, and scissors.

I can even see a West End play coming out of this....

That's right, folks – the seats will be facing the other way!

You at the derby? Is your brother going?

Leaked rumours from the corridors in Goodison in the lead up to the stadium opening that it will be named the BK Bramley-Moore Stadium. Bill all excited as he is asked to cut the ribbon and the look on his face when the curtain is pulled back to reveal:

"Burger King Bramley-Moore Stadium"!!!

I recon we could sell 52,000 tickets to see that bit of theatre alone.

And welcome back, Dan – I was disappointed to see you go when you did.

I bet he even has a clause that gives him 10% of any sale fee for the new stadium.

I think maybe the editors should carry the report in the Echo that Brands has drawn up a list of possible targets for Benitez in the January window. The report goes on to say that we will only be able to afford one player and maybe some loan deals, also suggests that Simms may go back on loan to Blackpool and Branthwaite will also be loaned out. But no worries, we have got Meis back on board.

Clive, I think you are right on the capacity. Though a lot thought it should be 60, 000.

Moshiri is committed to keeping Benitez and the budget available was discussed extensively during the Summer, which does not amount to much. Brands's involvement is mimiual in transfers, probably just contract-based, and this could explain his involvement in loaning out players also.

Usworth gives the impression that he decides who is loaned out and where they go, but I think it has more to do with keeping wages under control and the manager goes along with this pre-existing plan.

The Stadium is just wheeled out just like the players. But it is good to get an update.

As I recall, the Bramley-Moore design includes the option to introduce rail seating in certain parts of the stadium which offers the opportunity to raise the capacity to up to 60,000-ish.

As this will go on trial at several grounds shortly, it will be interesting to see if and how Everton adopt it.

You never know, it's just that them shower would rather die than have an off-day vs us. Always remember Spit the Dog Carragher says they had ya beaten before a ball was kicked, nice guys like Baines Jagielka Seamus greeting him, saying "Alright, Carra." He just wanted to go to war on the day. Different mentality still rings true.

I bet Bill Kenwright has asked for that in case he doesn't make the unveiling.

Away for a couple of weeks from Sunday, but back for Brentford away and the derby. See you there!! I would love to meet your brother, the ball boy and buy both of you a drink. As well as the others of course.

Passed it on many occasions but as Steve and myself had 20 mins for our trains, we called in and was surprised how big it was both downstairs and upstairs. Reasonable prices as well for both drinks and food.

Much as I like the crown, I was impressed with my quick visit and for any future meet ups for those catching a train, it is well worth a visit.

I missed that option in the plan. But this type of rail seating has been talked about as being a real possibility. So maybe we will get the 60, 000 capacity stadium, as you said.

I prefer proper pubs, like The Crown and Ma Egerton's when I'm in Lime Street vicinity.

Welcome back, Dan Meis (he's like a new signing).

Having seen his latest get up, dressed as a school girl with matching pink handbag, pictured on the front of a men's (men's???) magazine, with the words, 'Arm candy' next to him. I'm more than certain that our big butch 6-feet plus striker would be putting on a glittering gown, high heels and tiara before you could say Rue Paul's Drag Race!

Dominic Calvert-Lewin ribbed for ‘schoolgirl' look as England and Everton star poses for daring Homme+ magazine cover

Dom, what do you look like?!

(There's an exclusive clothes label in that tag, lads).

If the club have done the design and planning and state that they can increase capacity through safe standing, on what basis have you come to the understanding that informs you they are wrong?

Sadly the bar is set too low but you never know I believe Tottenham inceased seating capacity from their first plan. If it ends up with 55-56000 seats it might get there with SS. While we're trying to get over the 60k mark potentially with SS other clubs will be well over it! Planning for 60,000 plus from the off.

I think that is regulation as it stands at the moment due to safe standing making a return and is based on a 1:1 ratio to see how it goes.

In general, safe standing in Europe (mainly Germany) can increase an area by as much as 80%. If certain sections of the new stadium at Bramley-Moore Dock have been future-proofed, then this ratio may be being used to calculate the 60k or thereabouts.

It's got nothing to do with Dom's and Tom's fashion sense at all. Do you really think Dom walked into a fashion shoot and said, "Hi guys, could you sort me out with a schoolgirl's uniform, oh, and pink handbag to match."

If he did request that, then we are well and truly fucked!!!!

Ehrm... what has anything of that got to do with the price of a tub of lard?

Calvert-Lewin has been got at, he's had his head turned, he's believing all he hype that he's better than he is.

I don't care what he wears or what he does (besides the point that his last get-up is embarrassing). His mind won't be on his game. He should be at Finch Farm getting fit, not galavanting around fashion magazines.

I think he'll be off soon, if not January, then before the new season starts. I'm waiting for him to be the new Marcus Rashford and give his opinions on the climate, or critical race theory. The worry is that, when he goes, we will be left with Tom and Jerry to score the goals, that's why we will be fucked.

Rashford is using his free time to get free lunches for impoverished school girls and boys. Calvert-Lewinis using his to get dosh for dressing up as a school girl.

Not sure why Twitter is abuzz with people praising Calvert-Lewin for his money-making vanity project.

Rashford is signed to Roc Nation, and they make a big thing of maximising their clients' earning potential by encouraging them to put their names to big political and social causes. Rashford becomes more than just another footballer, and his sponsorship and advertising deals are enhanced.

Not sure who Calvert-Lewin is signed to, but if it was Roc Nation, you can be sure he'd be fronting some kind of campaign rather than just modelling for fashion magazines.

"Roc Nation Sports elevates athletes' careers on and off the field, including endorsement deals, philanthropic endeavors, media relations and brand strategy."

Spit it out, Dale. Don't skirt around the subject.

Too bad the “world leaders” in Glasgow seem similarly reticent about talking about or addressing the climate.

You? Trenchant?!

On a related (ish) note, report today released pertaining to petrol prices, has Everton Away fans as having the second biggest petrol bill for the season based on remaining games. You may want to kip at Danny O'Neill's for a month and save on going back and forth for London games.

And Brent, I'll take misunderstood if you'll give me that. It's a big ask I know.

Fair credit to him, he likes to go out at half 6, so he's just waking me up early to watch the news and have my coffee!!

I'm in Speke tonight for a family 40th wedding anniversary in the Metal Box.

Pre-match drink and they only went and put Elton John on the juke box (if we still call it that). Talk about nostalgia. I'm at Wembley 1984 all over again.

My cousin, whose anniversary it is tonight, is blue and her dad, my dear uncle Jim (God bless and RIP) had a dog called Blue who used to roam the streets of Speke unattended, as many dogs did back in the day. "Kids and dogs" as one observer once described the place to me.

But most of that side of the family are Red, Istanbul attendees and all. Wish me luck. I'll be getting it from all angles tonight!!

Well said. I remember the '70s, flared trousers and fly-away shirt collars with big-heeled shoes to add to the comedy. I bet there was millions of torn-up photo's after that era came to an end and people took a look at the state of themselves in that period... fuckin' whoppers – and I was one of them!!

As I've got older and the realisation of what they done to us as a force in '85 hits home every passing year, I can't be in their company more than 5 minutes so hats off to you. You have more diplomacy and are a bigger man than me for that.

No black sheep (Reds) in any of our family or sons or nephews etc. Your mixed bag of a family has helped your therapy of being a Blue, as in biting your tongue with them. Anyway, catch up soon!

So my thought on this is, how about showing the final home game on a big screen at the new stadium? Those that are unlucky getting a ticket at Goodison could at least get a taste for the new stadium.

I doubt this has ever been done before. Have some kind of concert around 7pm; those coming away from Goodison can then attend the Bramley-Moore concert, by showing their season ticket or match ticket stub.

Well, if Phil Collins can attend both Live Aid concerts at Wembley and Philadelphia, then why not the Evertonians at Goodison Park, then Bramley-Moore Dock, via train instead of Concorde?

Okay, it is a crazy idea, but if the stadium is up and running, and needs proof testing, then why not show the final game on a big screen, at Bramley-Moore Dock?

I guess it depends if the new stadium is ready. Remember Spurs with all the jobsworth safety inspections? We may have to play half a season at Prenton Park until we get our safety certificate.

But if it goes to plan, it should be quite an occasion. I know a few Hammers who were at the Boleyn / Upton Park for the last game. I should imagine a fair few will be going home with plastic seats or clumps of turf.

Why not have the big screen at our original stadium? I'm sure our cousins from across the park would be happy to accommodate real football fans.

"I should imagine a fair few will be going home with plastic seats or clumps of turf."

Surely that would reduce the Demolition Bill considerably. :-)

Community effort. The old World War 2 spirit, we all chip in and save the club a fortune! Oh wait, Kenwright will probably autograph every square inch of iron and concrete and auction it off on eBay to bankroll Tommy Steele at the London Palladium.

Brian Wilkinson, I think that would be a fantastic idea. Maybe also a big outdoor screen and event on Stanley Park, a place that has also featured in our history?

Spurs tested their "operation" with a run out for the U23s about a week (possibly 2) before the first real fixture. I got a tour of the stadium prior to that and an explanation of their plans. They had about 20,000 turn up to watch the kids, which was a sell out based on available tickets.

Dave, I always bemoan being a '70s kid. Bad haircuts and everything from clothes to carpets and wallpaper seemingly being orange, brown or beige in colour. But I'll raise you the '80s shell suits as being worse. And yes, guilty your honour! And I too have photographic evidence to charge me so.

On the train heading back to London and recently passed Finch Farm. I sprinkled some "holy" water in the direction, which got a few bemused looks. And really I should be using it for rehydration.

For those season ticket holders that have had the same seat for years, surely Everton as a good will gesture, will allow those to have the seat, although have a feeling some will be leaving Goodison, with a seat in their arms, either way.

Many fans believe that safe-standing will meet any shortfall in capacity and future-proof the stadium. This belief might be quite misplaced.

Firstly, there are two sets of rules or legislation dictating increases in safe-standing ratios beyond 1:1. It is not just a case of the government changing its views following any trials. The green guide will dictate that ratio and is based on minimum spacial allowance figures, which are not that flexible.

To the extent that some existing stands with very tight rows could even see a reduction in capacity in safe-standing mode due to potential for spilling into aisles because of insufficient space and clearways within those rows.

Unfortunately, Everton have opted for a 750-mm tread depth for those areas earmarked for safe standing (so far). This is the minimum that will allow an intermediate step in each row and allow enough space to increase the ratio above unity (2 x 350-mm steps plus 50 mm for rail seat depth).

However, when calculating using minimum space, this only equates to approx 1.3:1 ratio for new builds (possibly upto 1.5:1 for older stands). At that rate, the areas envisaged for safe standing would only yield 2-3k increased capacity.

Yes, they could increase that by converting more seats, but you soon end up with less seats than at Goodison Park at such a low ratio. (And that of course is only if that legislation even changes.) Increased treads in those areas would be prudent to at least increase potential of those areas.

Those are very interesting stats as, like many fans, I was led to believe by the club that if the government allowed safe standing than we could increase our capacity to just over 62,000. But according to your figures under the new rules regarding safe standing, we will only increase our capacity by a few thousand.

I really do question the ambition of our club sometimes, when the club carried out its first consultation with fans over ground capacity, the overwhelming view was that we should have around a 62,000 capacity. I think without other clubs increasing their capacity by the time BMD is built we will still have only the 7th biggest capacity in the Premier League. Most clubs are looking to increase their capacity so we might not even have the 7th biggest capacity when BMD is built.

Given your stats and seeing Dan Meis is back in the fold, it might be worth one of our local journalists asking him, given the rules of the safe standing: Does he still believe we can increase our capacity to 62,000?

From OTB Sports:
"A recent trial showed that safe standing areas are effective. Teams will not be able to increase capacity at their grounds but fans who want to stand during games will be able to do so safely. The standing areas will have rails in behind and rails in front where seats would typically be.
22 September 2021

Yes, I think a lot of people thought similar. I think there was also quite a bit of slightly mixed-messaging in the initial stages of the project. As we now know, there were actually 2 designs. One East-West (probably 60k+) for if we won the Commonwealth games bid, and the smaller traditional North-South for if not.

I asked the question about safe-standing uplift at one of the consultations and was told similar. I think the speaker was under the impression that 750mm automatically meant similar ratios to what we see in many German stadia, due to simply allowing two 350mm steps per row. However, most German stadia have treads in excess of 800mm and for a green guide spacial allowance of only 0.2 - 0.25m² per person, this can equate to ratios < 1.8:1 for the larger treads.

It is possible that the green guide may be changed in the future to allow a smaller allowance of 0.2m² for new builds too. This may then increase the ratio to the more favourable 1.5:1. If that was the case, to increase the overall capacity to 60k would require a minimum of over 12k seats to be safestanding rail seats. However, at just 1.3:1 approximately one third of the stadium would need to be safestanding to breach 60k overall capacity.

I think the proposals are for approx 6k at the south stand and 1-1.5k for the visitors section. I could be wrong. It's true that at present there are no formal plans to increase ratios, but the whole safe-standing movement has been built on that assumption to enable increased capacities and thus cheaper tickets etc.

But then I looked up Schalke's Veltins again, having done so previously on a similar discussion. I haven't seen it, as I always sit in one of the upper tiers when I go. If you want something on a similar scale to Bramley Moore, it says the capacity (seating & standing) is just over 62,000. But seated only, for international matches, is just shy of 55,000.

I'm know architect, so have no idea how that works out, but the 52,000 to 60 or 62,000 could be feasible. However looking at some of the discussion above, it will depend on regulation I guess. This isn't Germany after all.

David, it can be quiet. I've found for years, probably since the advent of all seater stadium thinking about it, that home fans in general are quiet and it's the away support that makes the noise most of the time. It's not really different when we travel to a lot of grounds. Possibly linked, possibly the more family nature of the game, whereas the away support tend to be a hard core. Possibly the football we've had to endure for years!

We all learned our own Godfrey survival techniques...

As with during any Brother McGovern maths lesson, or any lesson with Brother O'Brien, I learned to engage my not-so-daft-half as much and as quickly as possible. As a result, my ability to absorb some shoite knows no bounds.

I think the away supporters are going to be located at the bottom right-hand corner of the north stand behind the goal, the opposite end to the main home supporters in the south stand goal, supposedly the new Gwladys Street

Everton are not showing any willingness to let the Union Officials have a say in who goes on the site, safety work, rates of pay etc and their go-to man, Joe Anderson, has been sidelined. So they have a meeting with his successor, Joanne Anderson, to see if she can get things moving regards to Union Officials having a say in how work is carried on and organised in the future.