Precious point as Everton hold Fulham at bay

There seemed to be something different about our pressing from last week and whether that was because we weren't doing it so far up the pitch or with as many men or if Fulham are better at playing it out than Palace were. Our defence also seemed to sit a lot deeper and spent a lot of time on the edge of our penalty box.

Oh and that Antonee Robinson certainly has some legs on him, one that got away.

And I couldn't help comparing that the Mitrojvic(?) yellow with the VAR review that got Allan sent off last(?) season, there really does need to be some consistency.

Young blues in fine voice. I'm trying to hold it together

Fulham really should have been able to fashion a goal but they didn't really come close.

Brilliant Everton defence but absolutely useless in attack.

The difference between Willian and Gordon/Gray tells you everything about where we are struggling.

Good, if a bit lucky, point.

Big shout out to Mykolenko my MotM (apart from Willian!).

Some good defensive performances but I thought overall that we were disappointing, especially after the boost of last week.

Love Gana but how many times did he lose possession?

All-in-all a good credible point.

Well done to the 4 at the back.

We gave up too many chances today so thank fuck Mitrovic had an off day, - ten shots none on target he had.

People will say – avoided defeat, clean sheet and a point gained – true... but truly awful also.

Our defence is as solid as you can get, all we really need is some finesse up front and in the attack which hopefully can come as time goes by and the next transfer window.

We seemed to revert to everyone back, no high press or energy, and too many thinking they'd done their bit in the first half – particularly Gordon.

Is there something in some mythical coaching manual that says you must make substitutions around the 60th minute as those we made seemed to throw everything right off, substitutions for their own sake?

There was too much fiddling around at the back as Gordon was hiding, Gray had gone off, McNeil was not showing for anything and we'd even abandoned the long ball over the top.

Onana's yellow card seemed to be for an accidental coming together and was most unwarranted. My MotM, a quietly efficient performance from Mykolenko.

Disappointed we didn't come out in the second half to win.

We were really, really poor with the ball in the second half. Sloppy and imprecise with Gray and especially Gordon as the main culprits. If Thelwell could find a more consistent and threatening winger in January, that would be great.

Maybe Gana had to go off because he was doing the work of two men and might have been knackered while his partner in midfield Onano ambled along as usual and did next to nothing but stayed on, he might be one for the future but he's very poor at present.

As for some of the others, they are making mistakes 7-year-olds would be ashamed of. Garner should have been on long before Lampard made the call and yet Gordon lasted longer than he should have and Onana completed the game.

Another half with no shots on target; they are all mounting up, Frank.

We could have won, certainly should have scored – but the same goes for them.

Probably a point gained, even if it's disappointing not to leave with all 3.

I see the lad Yates scored the winner for Blackpool earlier on... I hope our Scouts were at the game, as we need goals badly and this lad might prove to be the answer!?

Need to get to Jan and hopefully Lampard can work his magic in the transfer window. Forward and wide areas need freshening up. We are totally bereft of any creativity. One or two cheap/loan options and then re-evaluate in the summer and focus on the bulk of our transfer spend in those areas.

Gray should be no more than a squad player.

That was about it; we all know what's needed, goals! But will we get them?

The second half was absolute torture, we gave the ball away at will, which is unforgivable, lacked any creativity and we were lucky to get the point.

Thankfully we look a different proposition at home so we should be okay for this season.

Yes, we're not great in attack, and being shut out in three of our last four isn't great, but it is what it is. You can see the platform we're building through the defense and midfield. Attacking reinforcements will come, we just need to pick up as many points as we can along the way.

The only reason there's cause to feel any stress is the table being so congested... and no obvious duds like Norwich City in the mix this season.

James Garner's looked consistently bright coming off the bench. I'd love to see what he could do with a full match, though I'm not sure who'd make way.

Great to see Patterson back in action, though it always feels a bit risky to bring in a defender cold in the second half. There were a few moments where he didn't look quite up to speed, but thankfully no damage done.

We really went into our shell, as MK described in the second half ,which was disappointing.

Onana, Pickford, Coady and Tarky were all very decent for the majority of the game, but Mykolenko was the stand-out performer for us.

I don't think the rest of the team will be all that pleased with their game today, but a point away from home is never the end of the world.

I hope back at Finch Farm next week they practise every day on cross conversion from Demarai.

It was Groundhog Day at Goodison last season, continuing this season at Goodison and away.

But Calvert-Lewin is inching his way back to full match fitness. Give him the benefit of the doubt, and watch Gert Muller, Bettega, Rossi and Leawandofski, amongst others for clinical in-the-box finishing.

Overall a good point against a decent team, but offensively today, bar the odd move in every 15 minutes of the game Everton, for me lacked belief and conviction.

The final ball, and shooting. I hope this stage fright at shooting disappears soon.

But great to see Patterson back and hopefully the balance of the team will improve with more scoring opportunities created in the next few games.

But if you don't take your chances, you don't win games. Everton must work on this, as for me there's a lack of ownership and belief in taking the clinical initiative just outside and inside the box.

But a well-earned point. This time last season, I'm sure this would have been a game lost.

UTFTs!

"It's difficult to believe, really. We did almost everything well. Everton played a direct game, we knew that, and they created some moments but we are always on the front foot.

"I am proud of my players, we didn't win the game but we played at a very good level. We have to put the ball in the net and on a normal evening we score more than one goal with these chances.

"Jordan Pickford and their defenders deserve credit, they block everything but we did everything to win. In football we have days like this. It's the first game at home we have not scored, our philosophy and desire is right.

"Mitro will score next time."

Ah... the philosophy. I miss that. We need a philosophy.

Negatives: the attack was terrible. Gordon was appalling. His possession giveaways put us under so much pressure and ruined the few attacks we had.

Calvert-Lewin: bad miss and injury from the post (real or imagined) seemed to impact his performance.

The midfield (aside from Iwobi) had zero creativity.

2nd half was so boring, so turgid: if we can go backwards or forwards we always select backwards.

How boring to watch but obviously a point away from home is valuable. Problem is that we could easily have lost that match whereas the game was there for the taking. We made great chances in the 1st half and then didn't bother in the 2nd.

So annoying.

Gordon doesn't track back. Gueye just loses possession. Gray is often anonymous.

I'd play Maupay and Calvert-Lewin in a 4-4-2. Garner or Davies for Gueye.

You must have a short memory, Silva totally lost the plot, we were in free fall, his last 2 games, lost 2-0 at home to bottom team Norwich, and 5-2 to our horrible neighbours.

Gordon was the worst player on the pitch, when he went down after losing the ball, and didn't bother his arse to get up, he should have been substituted then, and Gray wasn't far behind him.

Gladly take the point, and I don't know what more Frank could have done with his substitutions.

Mykolenko the stand out; Gordon couldn't do anything right; Iwobi good again and Calvert-Lewin missing with his timing.

Great defensively and nothing going forward 2nd half. Take the point and move on.

"Playing one up front is too negative for me."

Yes, don't ya just hate negativity?

Attacking we were poor, I think Gordon could do with a rest for a game to try and reset. I still think we need to replace Richarlison's threat, we desperately need that extra quality up front. It's the difference between winning matches like tonight and scraping draws.

Right now I'm having a drink while the queue goes down at Putney Bridge Station on my way home.

The poor lady next to me had to keep sitting down and covering her face as she couldn't bear to watch. I have to admit, I was close to joining her a few times as those barrages of corners came in.

I'll get home at a decent time unlike many of that magnificent travelling support as always. Start to finish. Excellent and still going in the 8 Bells.

Initial thoughts, we gave away too much in midfield and were not really a threat up front.

But the defenders were immense.

I don't know the name of coach who came over at the end and stood with the supporters, but I went and shook his hand and told him to pass on my regards to the defence and PIckford for tonight. For what that's worth. He gave me a smile and a back pat.

Good to see John albeit briefly due to M6 woes. Shame I didn't catch Rob.

Next time. We took a point home. Been to that ground so many times on the end of a 1 - 0. defeat.

I lost count of how many times we were looking to play out and we only had one of our midfield 3 looking for the ball. Onana and Gueye just became more obstacles for the defenders to pass around.

Something's not right with Gordon. He's been off colour lately but that was outright terrible. He couldn't even be bothered having a run with the ball.

The same problem persists. It was there in the run of defeats away from home and it was there in our wins too. We lack quality in the midfield. Gueye sits in that defensive role but he's negative with almost every pass.

Onana, well, I still can't really place what he's about – he's certainly not attempting to be an attacking force though he looks capable of it.

I really think it's time to see Garner in there. Take a bit of a chance and see if we can create anything.

Good to see Patterson back. He'll improve us immediately.

Good point, when not fully firing is an incremental progression which will result in a more consistent points accumulation in the long term. Pickford once again ensuring a result.

We would have lost this game last season!

Frank as an attacking goal-scoring midfield player must be able to see our problems. No fluidity, no interplay between the front 3, no midfield players getting beyond the striker, and barely any quality for Calvert-Lewin to feed off.

Is it time for 4-1-4-1? 4-4-2? We can't expect the defence to play as well as they have tonight, week-in & week-out, with no respite.

The changes had no real impact. Could we give McNeil a start and hope Gray or Gordon have more impact coming on?

The games we have lost are not what will determine our league position; it's these games against Fulham & Palace etc. We are so much more solid, that it's so frustrating we can't create more.

Look at Willian, ran that game for them, he's what we are missing – a true creative player.

Roll on January!!

I think Anthony Gordon, can be a very good footballer, but some humble pie, and back to basics, is needed.

Tonight for me he tried but was off it, in timing, passing shooting, and not doing his defensive duties.

But I also think the midfield is out of balance, and it's now a good chance to start Garner, in place of Onana, or Idrissa. A tough decision for Frank, and his staff.

For the talent they have, there's too many basic mistakes, and much of Everton's offensive moves tonight, stoped with their poor decision making, passing but also Anthony Gordon, was equally as guilty of the same mistakes.

But this is Everton in transition, and hopefully soon, the consistency and balance can be found for a full 95 minute performance every week.

But great respect to Evertons Goal Keeper and defence, whom were immense, and self less, in playing for the shirt.

I'll take that, but soon for the whole Team, to make that level of focus and commitment.

It is extraordinary how this type of performance away from home has dogged us now for years. A strange torpor falls upon us.

But until we become braver, a lot more positive, and also better with the football, then we have got to be happy with a point.

Another must win next Saturday at Goodison Park.

Now the attack, that will come as the season progresses. Calvert-Lewin is finding match fitness as each game comes. Gray is the finished article, good moments, infuriating moments, that's why he's here ٟ.75million? Still good business for me atm.

Gordon… if an offer comes in January from Skunks or Chelsea, I would definitely sell him, I don't think he's going to be a top player.

Maupay.. his record speaks for itself, but still early days. We need at least one other striker in January, which is what? 4 games away?

We'll will be fine this season.

We were okay in an even first half, poor in the second. I'm surprised at those criticising Frank's substitutions, it looked to me like he was going for the win.

When we were kicking the ball out of play in the last few minutes instead of moving it towards Calvert-Lewin and Maupay, it felt like watching kids' football.

It's hard to reconcile that we have certain players performing like infants. But, speaking relatively to the likes of Man City, that's what we are. And that's what the manager has to work with, and improve.

Take the point. Move on.

It's very hard to expect to win a game when four or five players were either having an off day, not concentrating or even worse not fully commmitted and the team going on the back foot, again, for most of the second half didn't help.

Anyway I bet you were thrilled with young Adam Mayor today, coming on and getting the equaliser for Morecambe.

Come on, you know we weren't talking about Fulham, of course they were in the Championship. But equivalent games like Villa, Palace, Wolves, Brentford and Burnley that we lost, pathetically, last season.

We are improving. Gradually. It's very hard to draw a game when, as you correctly point out, we have four or five players who, for whatever reason, are performing under-par. But we did. That's good. Not great. Just good.

Another step along the road. All the best, Dave.

Being honest and trying not to sound biased, I don't think his team deserved anything today, but Adam's contribution was very impressive, just like the players you mentioned for Everton's was, in your earliest post on this thread.

I even agreed with your MotM, Dave, because I thought Mykolenko defended brilliantly today.

We now have a squad good enough to keep us in the top flight, which couldn't be said last season with any confidence.

As for those whingeing about the performance, it's not like we've just lost to the two bottom clubs on the bounce is it?

Anyway, we are still on course to go into the break with 20 points and in the top half of the table. And above the whining pumpkin headed Halloween ghouls next door with any luck.

Competent first half and web could have gone in two-up (Calvert-Lewin and Tarkowski), equally we could have gone in two down, but thanks to Jordan we didn't. Second half was massively disappointing, we didn't compete in midfield & lacked composure on the ball.

We were also toothless upfront, especially out wide were the lack of quality and delivery was very evident. How Anthony Gordon stayed on the pitch as long as he did was baffling. I think Frank's subs were correct however I'd have withdrawn Gordon before Gray.

Anthony imo is vastly overrated by many, he lacks presence, is to easily knocked off the ball & his delivery is very, very poor. I do not believe he is a wide player, however I'm not sure what his best position is either, possibly a 10 in a 4-4-2?

Big credit to the two centre-halves and goalkeeper who were immense and the left-back, who I thought just shaded MotM, especially for his second-half performance, securing a point. On to Leicester Saturday for yet another must win home game.

I really don't think Gordon is vastly overrated on here, if you read the thread and indeed the Live Forum, I think you will find Anthony is rated about right… below average.

In fact I can only think of 3 people that actually rate Gordon:

Lampard;
Anthony himself (this week's twitter interview was embarrassing);
And some unknown scout at Chelsea who's never heard of Ryan Brewster, Jack Rodwell, Ross Barkley, Ryan Kent, Harry Wilson, etc etc etc.

Anyway, for the time being, we are a mid-table team and will be for a while. Onwards and upwards. Mykolenko my MotM.

Fulham are no mugs. Not many teams will keep clean sheets there. In a great performance by the lads at the back Mykolenko was Man of the Match for us. He dealt with De Cordova-Reid's pace and trickery very well.

As for our attacking play, after a bright start we lacked quality and consistency today. Certainly in away games the deployment of two wide players, one of them well out of sorts, feels like a luxury we cannot afford at present.

McNeil would be a better option than Gordon based on recent form while Garner must be very close to earning his first start.

“Action packed”??

I must've been at another game. A good day out spoiled by a game of footy is how I'd describe that. We need to grow some bollocks - Fulham are shite!

Still, my son woke me on the train with the score from Greyskull - it cheered me up no end! UTFT

I suggested the formation which has resulted in 11 goals all season is too negative and you feel it's more important than the team's failings to have a snide little dig at me as you quite often do. Rent-free Brent.

It's so lame and weasley,…..

I think he's got promise, but he is way off from being worth big bucks, playing Champions League or dominating a match. There were at least two Fulham players way ahead of him.

Solid effort, but we definitely need more fire power.

But there will come a point where Gordon & Gray need to justify being selected, week-in & week-out.

Is Gray doing anything McNeil couldn't?

Gordon has some grace as he's scored goals, but their general play and link-up is not really giving us what's needed.

A formation tweak maybe what's needed.

I think a 4-1-4-1 could work well, give Gana a rest, bring in McNeil.

The media are at it again with Sky saying Fulham had 24 shots while failing to mention only 6 were on target to our 4. They also claim Fulham should have had 2 penalties.

I thought we played well first half but then reverted to type second half and dropped deep inviting then onto us.

Frank has to sort this mentality out out go 4-4-2 away from home and drop the 2 wingers.

My highlight of the day was Klopp face when Leeds scored the winner late on.

How petty Marco Silva was at dropping two points when he thought he would put one over on us for firing him.

Well done Pickford and Co. Defense really coming good again.

Needs a better choice in January if none of the kids can step up yet.

Fulham are in our peer group these are the clubs we need to wrest points from to survive it's as simple as that.

The limitations are obvious with inconsistent to very limited players throughout the squad Frank hasn't the luxury of a Plan B bench to call upon so it's a case of scraping along as best we can.

He's doing that very competently.

Seriously! Take another look at it in slow motion, even a static shot. The ball is not moving when the Fulham player makes a direct aim for Gueye's shin. By the time the ball has gone, Mitrovic's boot is on Gueye's leg.

We don't get anything given as Frank said. When blues are defending dirty play, no wonder. How do you know it wasn't intentional?

And to think the club could have had 㿔M+ for him just 2 months ago...

Certainly no complaints with our defence. Felt it would be unfair for Fulham to lose, and likewise with us, so a draw I feel was a good result.

If the other teams in the Premier League heard a strange sound, it is the growl of the Everton Tiger, awakening from its slumber! We are coming!! My prophesy is that in 2 years we will be a regular in the Top 6.

"In Frank I Trust" (Didn't hear you Scream, Christine!)

We only have one game against a top 6 side between now and the start of February, so hopefully we can make steady progress up the table.

And look on the bright side, ‘creashead' has been sacked and Klopp looks like he has swallowed a turd every weekend.

Like Popeye used to say "Who does this guy think he is?"

We are a couple of creative scoring players short, so hopefully January may see a couple of arrivals. I see we have been linked with Daniel Podence of Wolves who will be in his last year of contract and has asked for a move, he has certainly impressed with what I have seen of him for a smallish guy. Still think we made two massive blunders, when talking of smallish players, in not going for Leandro Trossard and Jarrod Bowen who we could both have had for ٥M each a couple of seasons back.

Let's go out with a bang against Leicester City before the World Cup break.

Yes, previously we would have lost this game. Our fan expectations are starting to grow, which is a good sign. However, we shouldn't get ahead of ourselves.

Away game against a team that is playing really well with a former Blues manager at the helm. And we could have won it.

Look at Leeds vs the RS. Under the pump for most of the game but had the run of the ball at the right time.

MotM for me was clearly Mykolenko, who is continuously improving, with the help from Coady and Tarkowski. Pickford was again excellent. Gordon had a poor game - possibly our worst player on the day. But, y'know, shit happens.

IMO, 0-0 was a decent result for us.

The day then we finish above them and actually win something (like they do regularly) is the time to be cocky.

Bright start and a solid defensive performance against an in-form team who I didn't realise have scored more than anyone in the league other than Man City, Arsenal & Tottenham after reading the BBC match report.

Hard to pick a stand out player, but I'll go with Mykolenko. As is often, the first player over to the supporters at the end to make some young supporter's night by handing out his shirt. No nonsense defending when his team was under pressure.

Once again, you can see the influence of Coady and Tarkowski straight from the warm-up. Lead by example. Seamus looked like he was back to being the age of his squad number and Jordan was excellent.

One thing not commented on here or elsewhere was the "goal". We put the ball in the back of the net right? Or had I been transported to another world momentarily and imagined it? I suppose it must have been nailed on offside as not many complained.

I didn't really get a good view of the tackle on Gueye but thought he was seriously hurt at the time as he didn't move much. Frank seems incensed and angry about it.

I'm not going to batter Anthony Gordon. After last week's seeming comeback performance, he was off sorts again. Maybe he needs a rest. For a young player, he's played a lot of football these past 18 months or so. Onana will come good. I just wish he'd stay on his feet more often, as sooner or later, he'll mistime one of those and it will cost us and him.

I have to say that the new stand Fulham has built looks really smart even though hardly anyone was in it. But Craven Cottage still retains that certain charm. The cottage in the corner kind of reminds me of us having St Luke's at Goodison. I noticed they don't have the mixed neutral section any more, and seating wise, it's now segregated. Although both sets of supporters can still mingle and chat on the open concourse, which I like.

I still don't know the name of that coach who's hand I shook at the end. I hope he passed on my words of praise to the defence. They got us the point.

Amber shirt and socks with blue shorts for me.

We looked like Chelsea in the 2009 Cup Final.

Even Souness felt, and stated, it should have been red.

The VAR has the facility to slow down the action and review these incidents so it just goes to show how shit the VAR can be.

I promised not to pick any teams after the Palace result but I think there is an argument for playing both Garner and Vinagre (in tandem with Mykolenko) in the next game.

On the Mitrovic tackle - same sort of lunge that Van Dijk inflicted on Onana in the derby. It was a red card all day long – it had leg-breaking potential.

After the initial disappointment of watching such a weak second-half, I'm content with the point and with the recognition, noted by Frank post-match, that this is just the beginning.

As someone else has noted, though, it's horribly close in the lower section of the table. We don't want to be slipping up against an improving Leicester and an awkward Bournemouth.

If it's not broke don't try and fix it, is what some people will say, especially because Vinagre is also unproven at this level, but we just aren't getting enough out of our wide players imo. We will see…

Gana can interrupt the passage play of the opposition but he does not really turn defence into attack with forward runs and accurate passing. And Onana looks lost by himself in midfield.

Both lads have bags of talent and are quick. Their decision-making, final pass, awareness etc… is often poor. Now that Calvert-Lewin is back and McNeil is getting up to speed, these two lads will have the chance to start forming a better understanding.

Talking of forwards, we need better options than Rondon and Maupay in January. Both are sub-standard to what we require in this cutthroat league.

As for Onana, great young player who also needs to be protected and nurtured. Garner should start the next game with Onana benched. Same goes for Patterson and Seamus.

Sorry not willing to wait another decade to take the piss out of them! We take our pleasures where we can.

Whatever Frank and his team have done to bring Iwobi back to life, please start doing the same with Gordon.

Pickford
Patterson Coady Tarkowski Mykolenko
Garner Gana Onana
Iwobi Calvert-Lewin Gray

Iwobi is a key player… give him a free role, to come inside, shoot or pass through the defence, to attack wider and cross, to feed Patterson to attack the line, to feed Garner to supply his wicked delivery in from deeper. Without the ball, he is still encouraged to press relentlessly.

It's possible we can get some more control of a game without forfeiting our current level of threat. Especially so away from home.

Gordon needs to remember why he is in the team and what his job is. Robinson beat him up all day and showed what many of us said on here years ago to be true! What a player he is!

Decent point though.

It's hard to sit, support and wait – once again – but that's what we must do. I was particularly pleased with Lampard's interview after the game. He has no illusions at all.

Two fine stoppers, for sure, but there is far more to defending in top flight football than putting backs to the wall in your own box and repeatedly throwing your body in to block shots. There is a responsibility to the rest of the team.

Their unwillingness to push the team up the pitch (and it is their job) means we have players who are far better in the opposition half, being forced to play virtually all the match in their own.

These two will continue to take the p!audits. That's mainly down to Evertonians becoming accustomed to collapses, but there has to be a happy medium. This is a team game and, unless our centre-halves start to concentrate on the team instead of their own performances, you will not see the best of 5-6 of the other players. Forwards and creative players need to play in the opposition half.

I'll take this point but, if Frank wants us to continue to play the game in our own half, we can't possibly get to where we want to be.

Interesting that mate, and maybe another reason why our system doesn't look quite right, although some might argue it's because the very talented Onana keeps drifting in and out of the game?

It might be an option, Tony, but none of the midfielders you mentioned will really want to go and play out wide.

Our squad is pretty thin so Lampard doesn't have too much room for manoeuvre but a couple of changes here and there in midfield and down the flanks would've freshened things up and given us a much better chance of a victory. This should be all part of a good manager's blueprint and Frank has to realise that.

I'm just commenting on what I saw yesterday.

I don't think we have the centre-backs to do that, which is why I was crying out for one about 2 years ago.

I would credit Fulham yesterday. They had us on the ropes at times by doing exactly what you say. They played on the front foot.

Your points are taken on board. Yes, I realise we are at the start of our long journey back to being a big team again and you have to have the proper luggage to be really prepared.

It's patently obvious we are at least two or three cases short at the moment and maybe I will have to be more patient but, if three or four players are off-key in one game, it becomes very hard for me to accept that.

Anyway, Peter, best wishes, I hope your grandchildren kept up their form from last week and won their games.

Frank improved the timings of his subs but was still a little slow in making them.
Onana is trying to avoid injury and showed little ambition (perhaps playing to instruction).

Gordon failed to cover the runs and, when Seamus was sacrificed, Patterson was exposed to an even greater degree due to Gordon's dereliction of duty. Gray does the same thing every week. Starts well and fades.

Mykolenko had a tremendous game, as did Tarkowski and of course Pickford.

However, let's not pretend. Fulham outplayed and out-thought us and should have won handsomely. We still fail to create enough and lack clinical finishing.
Surely it is time to start McNeil and Maupay up with Calvert-Lewin.

And finally, Garner makes the midfield tick over better than Gana or Onana. I know we are a work in progress but we are leaning too heavily on what is becoming an impressive back line.

Frank has had one window and already we are more difficult to beat. Another couple of windows and we will be a very different team again. It's a process we will have to bear with after years of mismanagement and poor signings.

Unlike "Trigger-Happy FC" (aka Chelsea) we do not have the resources to blow on players who may or may not perform in the Premier League. Patience is the key.

I agree with a lot of that. I completely disagree that Fulham should have won handsomely, however.

We created and should have scored a couple of goals. I think a draw was a fair result. But 2-2 would have been a fairer reflection.

Also, Mitrovic should absolutely have seen red. That was a very late tread on the ankle and players normally get sent off for that (or at least ours do).

Otherwise, I think we should continue to applaud our deep, robust defenders as they help get us up the table and make us hard to beat. At the same time, we can acknowledge that they prevent us from playing an expansive game higher up the pitch. Frank has the balance absolutely correct right now.

The team will evolve – and maybe Branthwaite and Godfrey and even Welch will help us next season.

I absolutely agree that, while both Coady and Tarkowski are no-nonsense defenders, because of their lack of pace, they prevent us playing 10 yards further up the pitch.

Also just worth noting that, despite the dogged defending by Coady and Tarkowski when we played Spurs, Harry Kane had 31 touches in the opposition half – way more than he has had before or since – and yesterday Mitrovic had 10 attempts on goal.

I thought last week was a new beginning and, after 10 minutes, I thought they are carrying on where they left off last week. But in the 2nd half, we reverted to how we have played since Frank arrived with maybe a couple of exceptions.

Our lack of attacking intent was quite evident in the 2nd half, and this is against a newly promoted side who were basically the same group who got promotion from the Championship.

I know some posters are taking comfort in the fact that we may have lost this game if it had been last season, but let's be perfectly honest: if Fulham had taken their chances, we would have lost, so more to do with Fulham's failings than our improvement which resulted in a draw.

I can't really believe that we as a fanbase are accepting that watching Everton away is a pleasurable experience where we always seem to be hanging on for grim death for most of the second period in games.

Also, I am embarrassed that Onana wants the fans to erupt because he wins a throw-in deep in our half. Maybe if he had more impact on games instead of strolling round the pitch, the fans would be on their feet more.

I thinks it's time maybe to give him a rest and play Doucouré in that role – at least he would get forward more than Onana does which will help our shot-shy forwards.

For me the defence was solid but plays too deep; apart from Iwobi, the midfield plays too deep when in possession, and the front 3 aren't good enough individually or collectively.

Most repeated comment: "We would have lost that game last season." Lampard has identified our biggest problem from last season – flakiness, that has definitely improved.

The forward players are pretty ineffective as our midfielders will not push on and, although not creating too much, we are not conceding many; I'll take that all day long at the moment.

The next transfer window, we'll see more attack-minded midfield and forward players, I hope. Slowly slowly catchy monkey. He has a big mess to clean up!

What is it with the VAR and challenges either by us or against us? The Allan yellow card against Newcastle last season, upgraded to a red card by the VAR despite the referee not going for a second look at the pitch side monitor. It was a cynical challenge, yes, but not dangerous and definitely did not prevent a clear run on goal.

Then we had the crude challenge by Shelvey on Anthony Gordon up at Newcastle. Clear red but only given a yellow, did the VAR even look at it?

Jordan Ayew again on Anthony Gordon in that Palace game. Another clear red, minutes before he scored their second goal. Could have been one fatal decision that one.

This season, we've had the challenge by Van Dicjk, stamping on Onana with a clear over-the-top challenge. Another definite red but apparently a yellow was sufficient.

Finally yesterday, with the challenge by Mitrovic on Gueye. Yet another dangerous over-the-top challenge, deemed by the referee and the VAR to only warrant a yellow card. Malicious or not, intent or not, mistimed or not, these have all been challenges on our players which could have easily put them out for months.

Overall though, quite happy with the point and probably a fair result. Jordan Pickford again showing why he will start as England's Number One in about 3 weeks time. A mate of mine yesterday said Pope is a far better goalie than Pickford. I just laughed at him.

As many have said, Mykolenko was outstanding in a very solid looking back four. I think it will be harsh on Seamus to leave him out, but there is no such thing as sentiment in football and Patterson will soon return as he was also outstanding prior to his injury.

Anthony Gordon needs a few games on the bench. He stunk the place out yesterday. Same mate of mine said there was never any talk of Chelsea wanting him in any way shape or form in the summer. Again, I just laughed.

I wonder if Potter has the same thinking as Tuchel did regards Gordon, or has that ship finally said into the distance? Whatever, but Anthony is not playing like someone deserving of 㾶k per week, let alone 𧴜k.

Was a tiring day yesterday, not helped by the fact it took us over 6.5 hours to get to Fulham, mainly due to a major accident on the M6, which added an extra 90 minutes to our journey.

We arrived at Craven Cottage about 5 pm and managed to down three pints in the time allowed before the bars inside the ground shut… that's how you get served, Danny, who unfortunately I failed to meet up with again… One day, mate!!

One more home game before two arduous journeys down to Bournemouth in the space of four days. At least the club have decided to reimburse all travelling fans for the cup game the price of the match ticket.

Spot on with Mykolenko, the guy just loves to defend and stop the opponents from scoring. Along with Tarkowki, Coady and Coleman or Patterson we have one of the best defensive back fours in the Premier League.

Spot on with Gordon, their left-back was able to overlap at will.

Fulham were the better team and should have won, they are no mugs and sit in 7th spot this morning.

We are improving, but are nowhere near the finished article. The kid from Belgium, like all kids, will lack consistency but hopefully with the passage of time that will come.

McNeil should start next Saturday, he provides better delivery than either Gordon or Gray.

We won't be looking over our shoulder next April!

Having said that, two or three players had very poor games. Especially Gordon, who should have made way much earlier in the game.

Still not sure about Onana, is he better than Doucouré or Davies, the jury is still out.

All afternoon, the danger kept coming via Robinson and Willian on that wing and
I think Frank should have been more positive in stopping those attacks.

We need results to keep us safe in the Premier League, then we can build from there. Let's face it, we are not going to win trophies with the current squad of players.

You have to walk before you can run.

We had our chances in the first half and could have been ahead on a couple of occasions. I remember that one when the 2 players missed the double sitter. Calvert-Lewin should absolutely do better and Gordon should be braver as the second player following up. He's got to take one on the goal post to get to that.

That league is tight and closer than I can remember at this stage of the season. We're 2 points off Liverpool and 3 points off the Bottom 3. But let's not get carried away with the league table just now. We're only 5 off last night's opponents, who rightly and proudly sit in 7th at the moment. A lot of the season to go, a lot to play for.

Keep picking up the points. Last season, my son rightfully pointed out that we didn't turn enough losses into draws. If we had done, we'd never have been in the situation we found ourselves in.

Now, we've become hard to beat, we need to convert some of these draws into wins. We seem to have stopped the rot, now for the next step. But it's going to take time. Let's get to this annoying World Cup break and the next window and move to the next phase.

Red all day for me, by the way, having now seen it. Someone from the referee's union explain this claim that it wasn't a deliberate stamp so that's why it was yellow. It was late and dangerous and could have seriously injured the player. I really don't get it.

I still don't like that strip.

As it happens, this deep 4-3-3 / 4-2-3-1 is a good compact defensive shape. Personally it's a relief even if it makes the attack very disjointed and general play a bit boring. Perhaps with Garner in for Onana, we will have a more consistent, reliable central trio which allows the front 3 to stay higher up the pitch.

Adding just one very high-quality attacking talent to this team could make a big difference. Probably not something for January – but next summer. We don't need another 8 new players, just a couple.

And what is the news about RS - I think their manager has taken his family back to Germany in disgust as someone told me the Klopps went back last night.

I'll get my coat …

I can't make up my mind what's wrong with the lad. He doesn't seem able to get up and down the pitch – is it lack of stamina or desire? Either way, he leaves other players exposed.

I wish he had Iwobi's engine and attitude. I think he would benefit from starting the next couple of games on the bench to get his head right.

On the plus side, I'd give Garner a start and maybe leave Gana on the bench for a few games.

Just saying like.

Playing a high defensive line is not an end in itself, as it depends on the tactical set-up of the team. Conte plays a deep defensive line and counter-attacks, as does Ancelotti. We can play a deeper line and still press high with an energetic midfield, as we did against Palace. Where we failed yesterday was the poor quality of our offensive play.

The wide players are one-dimensional, loose in possession and inconsisent. That is what needs fixing in January.

Was that an improvement on last season? I don't think so and would be prepared to have an argument with anyone who said so.

Inconsistency, it's our middle name so we should be used to it by now, but it is still so difficult to accept and understand.

Good job that they were rubbish too because, looking at the stats, we should have got a hiding. I was amazed that Willian wasn't "looked after" properly because he was the only Fulham player who looked capable of hurting us.

We got away with one yesterday – let it be a lesson.

And can I ask if Gordon is still asking for a whopping pay rise? I hope not after that.

Definitely an improvement on last season. We're not conceding many, and it's helped us pick up points at Leeds, Brentford and Fulham where we'd have been comfortably beaten last season.

A few draws would have made all the difference last season. 7 wins to go. Leicester at home is one we should be targeting for 3 points.

Fulham had scored 22 goals up to the game, so I think, all-in-all, I'd regard it as a point gained rather than points lost.

Pickford is showing his worth and has made some brilliant saves since the season began.

We need to start scoring more goals though and I think we will if we can keep our first-choice players fit.

It's tight towards the bottom of the Premier League table but I believe we will be safe enough... but it's not a given.

In my experience of playing a back 3, you have one player who attacks the ball, the other centre backs are marking or sweeping. Very fluid. That's in open play. Set pieces, you mark men or space.

And you need very hard-working wingbacks to make a 3 at the back to work and give the defenders options to play out. And a good number 6 who wants to come and receive the ball short and make space behind. As well as cover either on the flanks or for the centre-backs if they have to go there when defending.

Okay, I didn't play at the highest standard, but a good standard. That was my experience and we were successful. Six league titles in eight seasons. Concurrently, 5 cups in a row.

To your point, I too can see Mykolenko being part of a back 3. But in my opinion, it has to be 3-5-2, not this 3-4-3 thing, which frightens me.

I understand that we're finding our way back to being competitive but these are things which ought to come naturally to professionals. We've been like this for a long time and you can count in single figures the number of confident away games over years under different managers. Why is that?

Silva saying they should have won just because they had most shots and corners. Most of the corners were not from goal attempts apart from a couple of saves that the outstanding Pickford dealt with, and most of Mitrovic's attempts (when he wasn't stamping on Gana's ankle that deserved a red) were either yards wide or way too high to cause a problem.

The penalty claim replay showed that Gana touched the ball before Willian fell over from the tackle.

Fulham are a good side and, as the home team, had most of the possession that was at times conceded by some Everton players too easily, especially in the midfield area, but they failed to take advantage of it.

It wasn't that Fulham failed to take advantage of their possession stats – it was Everton as a team that earned a valuable away point.

This leads me to thinking that Lampard is not only being asked to manage the team – he is also under orders to preserve Gordon's price in the market, by giving him playing time and hoping that he shows promise that others will see and come back with that 㿨M offer.

Watching Lampard's comments after the match, I now firmly believe that he knows that Gordon is not one for the Everton he envisages.

So I think we shall continue to see Frank struggling with Gordon until the New Year and then cash in his chips.

I'm usually more of a studious fan when in the ground. I don't really join in with the singing and try to watch the football. I don't really watch who is on the ball. I'm more focussed on where it might be going next.

But to your point, in that second half last night, I was screaming at us to keep the ball. Look after the football. We were very wasteful in midfield.

Bill @141. Bang on mate. Should have, could have. So could we have. If you don't score, you don't win. Fulham didn't. We didn't. So it was a draw. I don't buy this if they had took their chances we'd have lost. If we'd have taken ours, we could have won. An away point against an in form team with a clean sheet. Not the worst of results.

Onto Leicester and 3 points. Goodbye Brenda.

As Danny says, games aren't won just because you have more shots and corners. Maybe Fulham aren't as good as Silva thinks they are in that case.

For me, Southgate cannot do much better than picking Coady and Tarkowski as his central-defender pairing. Both are playing so much better than Dier, Maguire and Mings. In addition, they know how to play with Pickford and with his ball distribution, it is like having a team of 12 outfield players.

For me, the midfield pairing of Gana and Onana play too deep leaving Calvert-Lewin pretty much isolated. If you watched Fulham yesterday, Mitrovic always had players close by to lay it back to, creating the triangles. We don't have that yet and, until the midfield can join attack quickly, that won't happen.

Still, Rome wasn't built in a day and we have to be a little patient. In reality, getting a point a Craven Cottage was awesome. I don't think many clubs will do that this season.

Anyway, we made it (just) in time and could well have been two up by half-time. Equally we could easily have been two down. It was that sort of game.

Once again, our final pass was poor, as were most dead ball situations. The solution may well be James Garner. He's looked decent when he's come on and can see, and make, a pass, can tackle, and is very mobile.

I'd like to see him start v Leicester.

We are where we are, in that we are (hopefully) a mid-table team, until we bring in some quality up top.

On another point; I thought Willian was MotM by a country mile, in fact I'd go as far to say it's the best individual performance I've seen in any of our games.

It would be beneficial for Lampard to sit Gray and Gordon down and play a tape of the game on a loop highlighting Willian's decision-making when he's in possession, and his running and movement out of possession, and how he finds space in a congested area of the field.

Come January, if we get a player (or better still, players) anywhere near the quality of Willian, I will be ecstatic.

Whether this is how we want to see Everton play is another matter. No-one can fault the efforts of the players, but the School of Science it certainly is not. It does hark back to the Dogs of War and is certainly a lot better than last season's meagre gruel and it may be the best we can do with the current squad and in the current circumstances, but continuing the food metaphor, it isn't even good pub grub and certainly not Michelin-starred fare.

Regarding the official coaches for away games, I, like you, was also on them (coach 2) and we were saying after clearing the accident on the M6 that the coaches should leave a lot earlier than the scheduled time. Who actually decides the departure time, the club or Eavesway?

My mate thinks it's the club, but how can someone there decide on the departure time, given they probably don't know how long these trips actually are? Also do they not think that what happened yesterday could easily happen again?

It also happened going to Spurs last season, when we were stuck on the M6 and we didn't move for about 90 minutes.

I'm on the coach for both Bournemouth games, but for the league game it leaves at 8:30 am, a mere 6.5 hours before kick-off. If what happened yesterday, happens for Bournemouth, then we would probably not get there until half-time. An awful long way to go for only half a match.

These scheduled departure times really need to be looked at.

Give us a break! "School of Science"..."Dogs of War"?

They where different eras and arguably it's a totally different game. The School of Science would be thrashed in today's game, much fitter players who are athletes. Dogs of War would end up with no-one on the fucking pitch.

Embrace what we have, a young manager who knows the modern game and is building for the future.

I was in the neutral Putney end next to our fans and there were plenty of blues around me.

Love the pubs in Fulham before and after the game.

One question to Lampard: Why did you not take him off sooner? A top coach would have dragged him off at half-time. So why did Lampard leave him on?

How long before Andros Townsend is fit?

The obsession with the past needs to be somehow turned to looking to the future in a stadium for fit for progress (hopefully).

Pickford does what he does. Great shot stopper, best in the league and probably one of the world's best. Not so good at bossing his 6-yard box and when will people spot the fact that, despite the reputation to the contrary, his distribution is outright amateurish. But only he and Mykolenko would get a 7 out of 10.

Not much more than mediocre for the rest of them.

Gordon can't seem to string decent games together so he can go whistle for his 𧴜k a week.

Gray as usual starts well and fades. Maybe just take him off at half-time?

I think Gana is still trying to get used to the higher pace of the Premier League versus Ligue.

Calvert-Lewin is still clearly some way off match-sharp.

Even Iwobi was below par but still the only midfielder actually trying to create.

Like others, my jury is out on Onana. Reminds me of Pogba, often not in a good way but, unlike seemingly everyone else here, I actually saw more of what he might be capable of in constructive play. Not much but slightly more than previously.

I guess we are where are, it's not as though we have much in the way of options. Maybe Garner but not seen enough of him yet to be sure and I'm aware there is a tendency to overrate players when they first come in.

At least it was an away point and we didn't get too many of those last season...

Watching Everton go from one end of the pitch to the other is slower than an 11 o'clock mass and more boring, with hardly any end product – never mind a goal. The way Frank is building for the future, I doubt I will see any productive endings!!

Good summary and observations.

Dave and Joe, football is essentially trivial, but your attitude is terrifying.

My problem is not with Gana but the lack of movement around him looking for the ball. Only Iwobi ever shows for the ball. Gray and Gordon are static and Calvert-Lewin only looks for a ball over the top to run onto.

I'm still of the opinion we should go 4-4-2 and 4-2-2-2 away from home and do away with the wingers who neither create nor score goals and are not much help defensively.

You pretty much nail it, Dave Abrahams.

Joe, I'm 51 so we're similar. I love reflection but agree on moving on.

We're marching to BMD and those young supporters last night believe. So I will too.

Defence get a combined MotM for that one, including Pickford. Mykolenko had a very good match and put a few cracking balls into the box.

Still pretty pleased with a point though, we had an off-day and didn't get beat.

The final third of the pitch is of particular concern, hopefully Gray and Gordon can improve as the season progresses – and McNeil too!

Willian was exceptional and there are lessons for our players in his performance. Credit also to Fulham for their much-ridiculed signing of him. At 34, his career was over, done, toast.

His move from Chelsea to Arsenal had flopped, and his return to Brazilian football had been a catastrophe. Yet he scored a game-winner last week and was scintillating yesterday.

Dave #156,

Frank has been building for 9 months, and much of that time was a salvage operation and trash removal. We are starting to see exactly what you want to see -- the quick moves from back to front happened several times yesterday, and I noted them on the Forum.

But we will need to be patient. It took Arteta 3 years to get the Arsenal club he wanted, and he was starting with more talent than Frank. Give it time.

Mark #155,

The only comparison between Onana and Pogba is height. They are completely different players. But you're right, Onana showed some quick progressive passing yesterday that he has not displayed previously.

The defense definitely needed strengthening and unfortunately for some regulars through injuries, and fortunate for Everton, we have now got two tough experienced central-defenders with two young full-backs.

The midfield was strengthened with a new young midfielder and an older more experienced defensive midfielder plus a couple of forwards, all from the money from the Richarlison sale and not exceeding the FFP rules.

Yesterday showed Everton's strengths and weaknesses, improvements in some areas and areas that need improving that mostly can be improved if finances are available. Yesterday's result, keeping a clean sheet with the additional point earned, we were the only team with 0 goals against that didn't lose.

It is difficult after picking a team you believe will get you a positive result during practice during the week, and when you play and one or two are not playing well, you change the players hoping that the replacements play better. Changes that are made have to improve the team – not the individual.

Pickford is now proving to his detractors that he is one of the World's best and the back four is hard to create clear chances against.

Keep up the good work, guys.

I think Mr Thelwell is doing a lot of the building-up of new players and getting rid of most of the very poor buys of the recent past. Yes, I can see some improvement, mostly in defending.

Yesterday, the first half was okay, we could have had a couple of goals. Fulham could have had more. We never had an effort on target in the second half and defended desperately to hold on to a point – the game lasts for 90 minutes not 45.

Like I said in a previous post, it's hard in my case to be patient when four players are playing very poorly, with two of them passengers and the other two doing their best but their best is not good enough. Then biting your cuticles down to the bone while waiting for the final whistle.

The ten-pass sequence last week from Pickford's hand to the back of the net never would have happened six or seven months ago.

There was another one yesterday, a nine-pass, end-to-end daisy chain of passes featuring all three midfielders, ending with a poor low cross from Gordon on the right. Forgotten immediately, of course, because the move produced nothing, but just that burst of cohesiveness was good to see.

I don't see any passengers, BTW... I know you don't like Onana much, but he's our leading tackler.

And great point about Thelwell, with obviously his acquisitions of Tarkowski and Coady topping his resume right now. Insane statistic for you: Tarkowski has blocked 30 shots this season. Nobody else in the entire league has more than 15. What a committed defender that guy is.

I'm on Coach 1 because I can't afford Eddie's numerous lottery tickets and Andy makes a brilliant cuppa!

I don't really have an issue with the leaving times as I've never actually been late for a game on the coach.

Previously my late wife and I booked self-drive mini breaks for the Bournemouth games so this will be my first trip by coach.

Yes, I see some progress, the defenders brought in, good job we've got them; the way we are set up to play, especially in away games.

If you can see some of the team's good points, you surely can see the passengers. They were not hard to spot yesterday, one has been consistent for quite a while.

You are correct about Onana. I love what he does a few times in the game, then he goes missing for minutes on end. He goes to ground far too much with his tackling, especially when he tackles from behind. He got booked for one last week.

He was a passenger for me yesterday. While Gana got stick off some, he was constantly probing and looking for movement from other players so he could pass to them while his fellow midfielder was mostly static.

Yes, he's young and new to the English game so will take time to adjust. While he's adjusting, I'd give Garner as much time as him – he played most of last season with Nottm Forest in a very tough league.

As for stats, Mike I don't take an awful lot of notice of them, but my eyes tell me a lot about players. If Onana is our leading tackler as you say, imagine how many he would make if he played for the full 90 minutes instead of ambling about the field for a lot of the time.

There will be some high points, some low points and quite a few games like yesterday's.

This has needed doing for 20-odd years; if Frank can sustain this over a couple more seasons, then we will all be laughing.

Boring? Possibly, but absolutely the right plan to put Everton back on the map. Once teams fear playing us, then the flowing football will come. We are already a pain in the arse to play against, just continuity, bit more belief and a couple of scorers to get.

I don't want Coady or Tarkowski going to Qatar, they will be ruined for the season when they come back. Southgate is a loser and won't use them. Better off training at Everton.

It'll come good.

Little bit off-topic, but despite Bournemouth only having a capacity of around 11500, it's a nightmare of a place to get away from if you travel by coach.

I agree. Lack of movement / effort from players puts pressure on other players, ie, Gana holding on to the ball too long.

Lampard's Chelsea formation does not suit Gana or Onana unless we get a Robben and a Pedro in the side. Until such time, it needs a formation change.

To the naysayers I urge you to just hold last season in mind, we would have all taken signs of progress, a tight ship and a mid-table finish at the beginning of the season.

I don't get the Onana bashing, he was a 7/10 yesterday, nothing spectacular and yes he drifted in and out. Short memories are forgetting his MotM performance last week. He needs this season to adapt, let's get behind him.

Of far greater concern for me are our wide options. Gray and Gordon, for all their endeavour, the end product is sparse. A pacy trickster is needed.

Hoping we can shift Yerry Mina and maybe Andros Townsend (as much as I like the guy) in January to free up some funds.

If that had been most teams, their players would have been going fucking mad and in the ref's face, that would undoubtedly have made a difference to both the ref and the VAR team.

If that had been the other way about with Gana on Mitrovic, I would bet he would have been off.

I have read that we are interested in signing Daniel Podence in January. I think he would be a good acquisition.

I do not, however, want us to sell Townsend (unlikely anyway until his knee is proven healed) because, if healthy, he's the short-term solution to the Gray/Gordon problem.

He hasn't their pace or skills, but if there's one thing Townsend can produce, it's end product. He has the best shot in the club and had scored our three best goals last season until those final frantic weeks.

The Burnley blast was breathtaking -- Premier League Goal of the Month, if I recall -- and the counterattack equalizer at Old Trafford was simply gorgeous. He's also superb defensively. Definitely keep him until summer.

But I did notice Gray tried to put crosses in. I've seen Gray did put in a few of those teasing crosses in that just require someone for a touch. But somehow we just don't have that someone to convert them.

For McNeil, he has been putting those crosses in early for Chris Wood at Burnley. Now with Calvert-Lewin playing again, I'd like to see more of that.

Some of our offensive movement and interchanges in the Palace game were the best I'd seen in a long-time. But they were completely absent in the second half and we defaulted to stubborn defence.

If Frank had a bit more confidence in the offensive tactics, we could have converted two away draws into wins. I think he is being over-pragmatic, but I guess he would point to the inconsistency and how vulnerable we still are in the transitions.

Podence is skilful but inconsistent and too small, mate.

Avoid. He would be Bernard Mk II.

I also wonder if McNeil playing on the right wing could turn inside (like Rodriguez used to) and play a cross-field ball to the left side of the pitch?

Having said that, I don't think our manager is likely to experiment any time soon – I think he has his starting 11 and will stick with it.

I agree but we did that last week in the Palace game and look where that got us! Yellow cards and a club fine. I hope the players haven't been told to tone it down but I'm guessing they have.

Yeah, I know all about his stats, but I also watch the games and know how misleading they are. For example: the stats will tell you he started at Leicester last season and we won, but he very nearly got us relegated that night, luckily he sprained a socd the stout defending of the much maligned, but massively improved Keane (again) and whimped out (again).

It was the goals, the assists anne and Holgate which pulled us back from the brink last season. While they both struggled on through pain and injury, Mina offered nothing to the fight.

Mina is a player who refuses to play through pain. A player who, in the eyes of some, seems to improve with every game he doesn't play. A player who let us down on the rare occasions when he deemed to make himself available during that traumatic run-in.

Mina will have cost this club around 㿨M in transfer fees and wages. Come the day of reckoning when all things are considered, he will have few rivals when the decision is taken as to who was the worst signing in the club's history.

It's not normally my way to hammer individuals like this but, on a thread where people are coming on 2-3-4 times, not to comment on the game, but to hammer our youngest player, I find it difficult reading posters are sorry to see the balsa wood man go.

Gordon had a poor game on Saturday. That happens to young players all the time. But It's worth pointing out that, while Mina sits in the stands earning over ٤M a year for smiling a lot. Our youngest player took and often symbolised the fight against the drop all over the country last season.

While our lowest-paid first-team regular is our leading scorer, our highest-paid player hangs around, squeezing every last pound out of the ridiculous contract he was given.

In my opinion we'd have gone down without Gordon last season. That would have cost the club tens of millions. A figure we may have not recovered from. Those calling him a greedy bastard (without hearing a single comment from him) would do well to remind themselves of the figures posted on TW recently. 㾶k a week is a fortune to the man in the street, but it still makes Gordon one of the lowest paid players in the Premier League.

"Make him earn it"???

I think it's time to start using Stanley Mills as an option. I thought him on for Gordon on Saturday on the right would have been useful if we had him on the bench. The lad is scoring every week at the moment for U21s; he looks ready.

I'm still frustrated by Gana. I've mentioned before I don't personally see the player others do. He always seems to take an extra touch, holds on to it too long. gets caught, chooses the wrong pass, or is never there to pick it up off the defenders. I think he can be much much better for us.

Also, every corner against seems to be a perfect delivery, whilst ours are slow, high and easily cleared.

Spot on comments about Anthony Gordon, Dave. He's a young, developing player who is a bit off form right now compared to the high standards and progression he achieved last season. It's form; he's shown the talent and he's going to get better. Same as Onana; 21 years old and learning his trade. Be patient and let them learn.

Mina has been really disappointing. A very good defender and a character in the dressing room. I haven't even checked (again) but for a centre-back, not even that old.

It reminds me a bit of Louis Saha. Now there was a talent if he'd have wanted it more. But wasn't it once reported that, if he didn't feel 100% fit, he wouldn't play? He wouldn't play?? So his call??? Not if the management, coaching and medical staff who may have thought he could?

I obviously don't know but I wonder how much of that there is with Mina. And I like him as a player and character. Sorry to revert to my Army background, but we used to call that malingering or refusing to soldier and it was a chargeable offence.

Sorry, went a bit extreme there.

So, it's been a real letdown with Mina. Anthony Gordon will come good. Just get him focussed on his football again, maybe give him a rest and get his head away from the alleged Chelsea rumours and supposed 𧴜k a week wages, speculations that none of us really know if they are true. He's our player for now at the very least.

But most teams don't have players with that technical ability, and watching a lot of the games at the weekend practically every team tried to pass the ball out from the back and most got into trouble doing it.

The Man Utd game highlighted this problem Utd were passing around their own box and West Ham closed them down and Martinez inside his 6-yard box passed it straight to Bowen on the penalty spot and luckily for Utd he failed to score.

I understand the theory of keeping possession but, other than Man City, most sides adopt the Chuckle Brothers routine between the centre-backs: me to you you to me, then they either pass it back to the keeper who launches it upfield or, after 5 or 6 passes between the centre-backs, one of them launches it upfield, so completely destroys the argument of wanting to keep possession and not give the ball away.

I am not saying we should launch it from goal kicks, or the first defender to get the ball should hit it long, but surely to make it so obvious that you are going to pass to one of your centre-backs inside the 6-yard box every time is asking for trouble.

We also have in Calvert-Lewin a forward who is excellent in the air yet, whenever we do try and hit him from a goal kick, neither the wide players nor our most forward midfield player ever runs past him gambling that, if he wins the header and flicks it on they will be in on goal with just the keeper to beat.

Can we just mix it up how we play out from goal kicks?

However, it can't be easy to be those two in a 4-3-3 formation. They're picked predominantly as attackers with, I presume, the instructions to get out wide and put crosses in for Dom. However, they also seem to be expected to get tight to Dom and support him up front.

At the same time, they're needed to track back to help the central midfielders out whilst also supporting the full-backs. Coleman and then Patterson were left exposed in two-on-ones many a time at the Cottage; less so Mykolenko on the left.

Gordon and Gray (and McNeil) will always struggle to be all things to all people at all times. Perhaps the issues lie as much in the coaching and team set-up as in individual performances?

In a nutshell, Mina makes me sick just thinking how he uses Everton FC. I know and knew plenty of genuine characters, Mina isn't like any of them. I also know and knew plenty of con-men; I'd put Mina in that bracket.

Anthony Gordon is having a hard time over the last couple of months. He honestly looks and acts like he is exhausted. He didn't look like he wasn't trying, to me, on Saturday and in the previous few games. It seemed to me he was genuinely knackered after every run he did and it was an effort for him to get into the action.

Now the club should know better than me if there is something wrong physically with him but he just doesn't look right to me. I said the other week that I thought he had played too much football since last January for Everton and the England U21s without enough rest. He most definitely isn't doing himself justice with his performances and needs taking out of the team for his own good, physically and mentally.

That isn't meant in any way as having a go at Anthony but he is better than his recent performances, and that includes the Crystal Palace game. He is still only a potentially very good player, but at the moment he doesn't look able to give of his best.

We have improved and are more solid with Onana and Gana but there is too much emphasis on Gray and Gordon producing the goods. The balance isn't right.

If we dropped Iwobi for Garner, our midfield 3 could cover the wide players more but why would we drop our most productive player?

Lampard has to try and get more attacking threat from the side whilst remaining solid.

In the space of one transfer window, our midfield has gone from being the slowest and worst in the league to being solid with players competing for places.

Maybe going more narrow in the middle with playing Garner or Doucoure instead of a winger may help?

We have Maupay, McNeil, Mills and Rondon as our attacking options off the bench. It's pretty obvious where we need to strengthen, isn't it?

The object is to win games, trying to mimic the same type of play that superior players can manage is just playing into the Top 6 sides' hands.

Obviously we all want to play like Man City, but you're kidding yourself if you think you can do it as well with players that are inferior.

I'm not advocating humping it up the field all the time but just mix it in there sometimes.

I watched some of the Forest v Liverpool and Liverpool v Leeds games and saw two bottom-of-the-table sides defend with relish and contest the midfield areas as well as attacking, not constantly, with real intent in both halves of the games. The managers and the teams both let Liverpool know they were in a game and they could have lost the games but tried to win and did so by attacking.

No need for anyone to tell me that we tried in both halves to win the game v Liverpool at Goodison Park and we could have done so. We could have lost as well but we were at least, at times, trying to win.

Attack is the best form of defence, not all the time but some of the time; there is no way a team can win if they don't attack.

Great post and think most fans will agree with you.

You would think the team would want to play in the normal blue strip.

You said a lot of things that need saying about Mina, and which I and few others have mentioned in the past but perhaps not as eloquently as you.

I just don't see why people are still enamoured of this guy. He disrupted our last season much more by being in and out of the team than if he had never been available all through the season. He is a good defender when fit, but that is a bit like saying Van Dijk would have been a good defender for Everton – all hypothetical and useless.

When you think of all the terrible luck that Everton have had with injuries – Delph, Gbamin, Mina, and the strange situation last season with our most expensive signing ever (Sigurdsson), we really must consider ourselves very, very lucky that we survived the drop.

We are now seeing a team that more closely resembles all the good qualities of a Moyes team – assembled for relatively low outlay: players who want to play for the manager, fans and each other, resilient and hard to break down, and flashes of upcoming young talent.

I believe that Lampard needs to rotate the midfield and the front players a bit more. I would like to see Davies, Garner and Doucouré given more playing time, and Gordon and Gray rested occasionally.

We actually have a decent squad now, and one or two key additions especially in the creative attacking area in the January transfer window would make us more competitive.

I hope we can ship him out in January on a free. I am hoping that Rondon will follow... Perhaps also Townsend, not because I have anything against him, in fact I like him, but because he is unlikely to get many minutes and we might actually get a small fee for him.

Hopefully these savings could allow us to buy an attacker to push the others.

I actually think Townsend is worth more to this team than Gordon or Gray; his set ball play is better, his goal threat is greater, and he crosses a ball – something Gordon or Gray struggle to do.

He doesn't go missing either!

As regards James Garner, I'm not sure as I haven't seen enough of him. The little I have seen leaves me unimpressed but this might be unfair. Risk giving him a start, Frank, to see what he can do!

Personally, I would give McNeill a run of games instead of Gordon or Gray as I feel he can interact and combine more with his team mates than either of the other two who can't seem to do so.

McNeil in place of either Gordon or Gray would add a bit of a different element to our attack and I don't think he is any worse defensively than both of them. He also has a wicked long-range shot (remember the one he got against us a couple of seasons ago?) and he and Iwobi seem to have a good understanding.

A front 4 of Calvert-Lewin, Iwobi, Gray or Gordon and McNeill can be a decent unit.

I don't believe most Everton fans feel that way about Mina.

It is easy to see why Yerry Mina is put in the same category. None of us knows the true state of his fitness but his record is suspicious.

Do we ever see players on low salaries with this kind of track record?

Yes, low earners get persistent injuries too. See Besic for example.

I'm like Mike, I don't really get the animosity to Mina (and Calvert-Lewin) over their injuries. I've heard no off-the-field issues like drugs, drink, gambling etc and no concerns about training either.

I just suspect (don't know) that, as soon as Mina feels anything, that's him done. In comparison, and I am not suggesting he was on the same level, I remember watching Besic continuing to chase a ball when his hamstring had clearly gone big time. Credit for the commitment, but he probably made his injury worse and prolonged his time out by doing that.

As always, it's a balance. In this case, between playing through the pain barrier if you can, but also knowing and being honest so you're not a liability. Only the players and medical staff really know.

I think there's a lot of frustration in that we are never likely to see the best out of Mina and he does seem popular in the dressing room from the footage I've seen. There's a great shot of him in the tunnel with Tony Bellew and what I assume is his son after that Palace match.

Bilic is another interesting reference, Ed. Another very good centre-back who we didn't see enough of. I think I remember reading an article not long after that quoted it being Everton's last throw of the dice at being a big club. That article, if I could find it, is where I remember it not being the transfer fee that kills you, it's the wages. Another disappointment as I really liked Bilic too.

Anyway, the article was wrong. We remain a big club, we are a big club and we're going to be bigger in the near future.

We've been managed badly and slipped into mediocrity. Somehow we didn't suffer the fate of Manchester City, Chelsea, Newcastle, Aston Villa or Leeds over the years. Somehow, I hope we "suffer" the more recent fate of the former two in the not-too-distant future.

Danny, what I saw from Mina going off this last time was complete anguish. To me, it looked like he was desperate to continue and was almost literally pulled off.

I've never seen anything from him on the pitch except total commitment and passion, and I think both his apparent popularity in the club and his managers' eagerness to pick him at every opportunity speak to his character.

The last time Mina went off was against Chelsea in the first game of the season. If I'm correct, the ball had gone out of play, Mina was standing up, he hadn't been tackled, he never went down.

Then, all of a sudden, he went down, the trainer came on, had a look at him for a couple of minutes, then the substitute got stripped and ready to come on.

Mina then started indicating and moving about that he was ready to get back on the field after it was obvious to most fans on The Bullens Road side of the pitch that the substitution was completed. He then walked round the pitch along Park End and into the player's entrance.

He hasn't been since – unless you go into the dressing rooms and see what a marvellous character he is.

You meant "sheer glass"... didn't you?

I think we all would agree that he is a decent player but, after missing so many games, he frustrates the hell out of all of us.

Hopefully we can get a half-decent offer in January and can get his wages off the books. History tells us he is not suddenly going to become someone we can rely on to remain fit.

I remember reading when Townsend signed that he had scored just two goals in his previous two seasons at Palace (in over 60 games). He did get three for us last season, but Gordon has already got that many.

I like Townsend as a player, I'm not knocking him, but he faced the same difficulties as Iwobi. McNeil, Gordon and Gray… what chance has a wide man got of supplying an end product? They have nobody to cross to. No team in the league gets fewer bodies in the opponent's area from open play than we do.

Until we start playing in the opponent's half and getting more than one player into the box, there will not be a consistent "End product". Not from anybody.

No "End product" is not the problem. It is merely a symptom. Give them players (plural) in the box to aim for. Defenders must love playing against us...

Sometimes, when it comes off, it's fantastic. Gray's goals, Anthony's brilliant touches and early finishes this season. Townsend's screamer against Burnley last season.

But they are all few and far between. They are not natural wide players. I'll have to revert to the older community; they are more inside-forwards. Or am I off the mark there? I don't mind being called wrong.

There's very good reason why those players are forced to go it alone. Next time you are at the game, take a look at the opponent's box when any of them get the ball. Count the number of Everton players in there, or trying to get in there. It won't take you long.

These players generally have three choices when they receive the ball. Turn around and play it back; go it alone; or try to get round the back and cross to the invisible man.

I said on another thread that Dave Thomas would struggle to create in this team.

As far as I'm concerned we either address this problem of we spend the rest of this season bleating about the symptom

Yes, and you are welcome to whatever you saw on DVR, whatever that is. My recollections lasted a lot longer than a moment and I followed the whole incident from my seat in The Upper Bullens Road stand from the moment the ball went out of play to the actor going through his phoney and pretentious act of wanting to stay on. Same as when he packed it in at Newcastle last season.

You like him and think he is a very good player and a tremendous character. I think he is slightly better than Michael Keane and a con-man who we will be well rid of, financially and otherwise, the second we get shut of him.

If the midfield or defence look up and don't see options or runners, what are they supposed to do?

We've fixed the defence, the midfield is in progress.

Give them something to aim for.

Townsend scored more goals in fewer minutes in all competitions than Gray or Gordon last season, and remember he played many fewer games. Overall, he scored a goal every 259 minutes on the pitch, versus 450 for Gray and 673 for Gordon, so no contest there.

But what I was actually talking about was shooting ability. Townsend scored three goals that were absolute screamers, goals that nobody else in the club was capable of. So yes, from any perspective, I considered him a greater goal threat. Obviously, we have no idea if that's still true until his injury fully heals.

On another topic, you and Danny are absolutely right about the lack of forward runs into the box ahead of the ball. I'm hoping a fully fit Calvert-Lewin solves part of that problem, but the lack of opposite-wing runs into the box for crosses from one side or the other is concerning and frustrating. We'll continue to see stranded forwards on the ball as long as a guy like Onana is more likely to get on the end of a far-post cross than Gray.

Dave #216, apologies, DVR stands for Digital Video Recorder. I save some games on there off my satellite feed. I just watched the Mina injury incident again today and I believe he was injured in minute 67, leaping for a cross in front of Havertz. When he came down, he grabbed immediately for his right calf. The incident at the touchline, where he turned and pulled up, happened 2 minutes later. The tight camera angle clearly caught him refusing to come off. Frank overruled him.

Goals are different than almost anything else. Quantity trumps quality all day long. As the old adage goes: Being a scorer of great goals does not make you a great scorer of goals.

Being generous to Townsend, he has averaged about 3 goals a season in a career that stretches back more than a decade. I expect Gray, Gordon and McNeil to spend the rest of their careers topping that.

I like Townsend and want to see him make a full recovery, He still has stuff to offer, but I don't think Erling Haaland will see him as a challenger for the Golden Boot award.

The trainer only came onto the field when he was standing on the touchline, standing up straight, nobody touched him. He made moves to stay on after the sub had stripped and was ready to come onto the field, and he looked okay when he started his act of wanting to stay on the pitch. He seemed to be walking alright as well when he made that long walk back to the players' entrance.

What was the injury (?) classed as? It was nearly 3 months ago, about ٟM in wages, and still no sign of him coming back. I think that's a blessing in disguise!!

I hadn't heard that adage before. I always learn something new on this site.

Townsend is 31 and just had major knee surgery, so I have no doubt you're right that Gray, Gordon and possibly McNeil will outstrip him (although McNeil's career so far of 9 goals in 147 Premier League appearances shows no indication of that).

However, come April, when we're tied against Spurs in the 87th minute and somebody is stepping into a potential game-winner from 25 yards, I know which of those four I will want it to be.

To infer anything else into the situation is frankly silly.

I learnt long ago that there are two distinct elements to the club I and so many of us love. The business, commercial and running of the club, and secondly, the playing staff, management and recruitment. Then as now, I supported the latter, not the former.

Sadly they stuffed up the running of the club so badly, it eventually saw us almost relegated and struggled to compete.

Many on here want to lay the blame at manager's feet, recruitment or tactics. Truth is, they are a result of who recruited the players, the multitude of managers, and the waste of a once-in-a-generation investment.

We are left with a disinterested owner looking for a way to clawback his investment and secure funding for the stadium, a chairman who should no longer be involved with the running of the club, a manager trying to build a team, and fans who desperately support the team, but not the way the club is run.

So Don, I hear you, I understand exactly where you are coming from, but I will always try to support those in blue on the pitch without considering why they are there. That's another discussion, one you and I and anyone else have a right to raise or object to.

No-one here loves Moshiri or Kenwright. Moshiri gets a get out of jail card because he is funding the stadium, Kenwright, however, does not.

Well, I'll bow down to your guess, that must be the answer to Mina's continual problems. He's had umpteen since he was fostered on us for 㿈M and ٤M a year in wages.

I've heard he will definitely be back shortly before Christmas, Kenwright is hiring him for the Christmas pantomime “Jack and the Beanstalk”

Yogi, sorry Yerri, is playing the part of the Beanstalk. My guess, for what it's worth, is he will pull out after a week or so with Dry Rot or Dutch Elm Disease!!