Report: Everton face legal action if found guilty of breaching financial rules

14/06/2023 119comments  |  Jump to last

Everton could be sued for tens of millions of pounds by four recently relegated clubs if they are found guilty of breaking the Premier League's profitability and sustainability rules later this year.

According to The Guardian, the independent commission charged with assessing whether the club breached the regulations as accused by the League will hear the case on 25th October and Leicester City, Leeds United, Southampton and Burnley will be queueing up to file law suits in the event the commission rules against Everton.

The Blues were referred to the commission in March on charges relating to their spending and cumulative losses from the 2021-22 season. The three aforementioned rivals in this past season's battle to avoid relegation, plus Burnley, who went down last season, and Nottingham Forest who stayed up with Everton last month, wrote to the League to demand that the commission make their judgement before the end of 2022-23.

Having already referred the case, the Premier League, who told Leeds and Burnley a year ago that there was no case to answer before changing their minds once they had seen Everton's accounts for 201-22, were powerless to expedite the process but the Guardian report, written this time by David Hytner not Simon Goodley, suggests that legal action will be taken in the event the club is found guilty.

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The commission's remit allows for penalties ranging from heavy fines to a transfer embargo or even a points deduction which would be compounded heavily should Everton then lose in court to these rival clubs or be compelled by a tribunal to pay compensation.

The Premier League could also be sued if the clubs seek further damages.


Reader Comments (119)

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Paul Hewitt
1 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:34:54
What have we ever done against the Guardian?. That paper wants us to go bust. When will this ever end?
Jason Hewly
2 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:35:22
Football is a grubby business. Hire some forensic financial investigators and investigate those clubs as a counter.

Then watch them shut the fuck up.

Alec Gaston
3 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:36:06
Can someone shed any light on whether other clubs can sue us? There are conflicting stories
Bill Gienapp
4 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:39:58
It seems like the onus of regulating FFP compliance should fall squarely on the league (particularly after they initially claimed we were in the clear), but I'm no legal expert.
Matthew Johnson
5 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:41:55
don't panic, as long as we have hired Man City's lawyer we will be absolutely fine
Pete Gunby
6 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:42:23
It’s a can of worms that they don’t want to open. Every team will be looking to sue for position of anyone appears to have violated rules.
David McMullen
7 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:45:34
I thought the club was confident with their case? So it's all hot air and muckspreading. Usually the DM or the Guardian.
Danny O’Neill
8 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:46:11
I'm not getting excited about this. If we get fined, we can live with that.

Sue us for what? Because they got relegated?

It isn't as if they haven't invested millions in players and managers over the years.

And over the past 12-18 months, we have offloaded players and wages as well as generating income from sales (Richarlison & Gordon).

Are they going to look at Nottingham Forest who bought about 30 players? Chelsea, who despite Champions League income, which they have now lost, spent £600m last season on transfers?

I'll put this one in the out tray.

Tony Abrahams
9 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:56:19
If this article is true then hopefully Bill Kenwright, will stay on and fight our corner, because I doubt we will get anyone to do a better job. Ask the man himself?

I think this investigation has been brought about by the clubs mentioned, so it's only natural that they are going to file lawsuits for loss of earnings, if Everton are found guilty.

The man who kept on giving, and the man who kept on taking. Kenwright and Moshiri, remind me of Ridsdale and O'Leary, I just hope Everton don't end up in as much financial mess as Leeds United did.

Michael Lynch
10 Posted 14/06/2023 at 20:56:35
The Guardian is turning into the Daily Mail in the way it sensationalises everything to do with Everton.

Don't shoot the messenger and all that but what the fuck is their agenda against us? Does Klopp have shares in it or something?

Joe McMahon
11 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:00:51
Absolutely Danny, Chelsea, Forrest, Southampton, Spurs and Leeds, have all spent.
Ray Jacques
12 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:05:12
If other clubs are going to sue then I would guess they would have to produce their own evidence and bring about the case which is unlikely I believe, but wouldn't know. More likely we would be done by the governing body.

With our seedy board, I wouldn't take anything off the table sadly.

Ray Robinson
13 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:06:28
How can FOUR teams be interested in suing us? If we were guilty of any breach of compliance, we only would have sent ONE team down in each of the two seasons. What case have Southampton got? Or Leeds this season? They'd have gone down anyway!

If City were to lose their appeal, would Liverpool and Arsenal sue for loss of a title?

Unless Forest deliberately “make a loss” of £40 to £50M over the next few seasons, will they be sued? As for Chelsea!

And while we're talking level playing fields, how do you account for West Ham leasing their ground at a peppercorn annual rent?

Having said all this, doesn't this further highlight the Board's incompetence!?

Barry Hesketh
14 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:06:58
It wouldn't be in anybody at Everton's interests to have negative stories about the club, when they might be close to the exit, due to the possibility of new investment? Of course not, it wouldn't put would-be investors off, would it?

Who thought that putting a timescale on the future of the chairman was worthwhile, why didn't he go with the others, in other words – Moshiri, get a bleeding grip!

Barry Rathbone
15 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:11:09
I imagine sitting at home are three erstwhile directors and potentially one former CEO saying "yippee!! - personal absolution beckons".

Their testimony could be nuclear with Mosh, BMD and the club vanishing into one big fuck off mushroom cloud.

Steve Cotton
16 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:12:49
Can we counter sue the FA for bad VAR decisions?
Deborah Maria
17 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:19:27
So will these clubs be suing Man City as they have 115 charges to answer for and finished above them? Will Liverpool and Arsenal be suing for the lost titles and Man Utd for the FA Cup and Inter for the Champions League – not to mention the teams they eliminated en route to the tainted treble.

Bring it on – time to start throwing some mud!

Brendan McLaughlin
18 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:20:24
Just supply the court with a list of the players we have bought in the process of breaking P&S rules and claim not guilty by reason of insanity.
Larry O'Hara
19 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:22:14
Guardian = Scum.

Simple as….

Andrew McLawrence
20 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:22:56
Think I'll sue the club as well for stress-related issues over past few years.
Lev Vellene
21 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:23:14
Oh, well, if we get sued for spending money on players who'd actually hinder ourselves from achieving much better positions each year, how can we protest? :D

Maybe they should actually be happy that we looked so bad that they eventually seemed ill done by...

Lee Courtliff
22 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:23:25
I can't wait for this to be over. Fines, points deductions, whatever it may be... just get it done then we can move on!
Bobby Mallon
23 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:24:10
Well listening to Simon Jordan the other morning, and he said that the other clubs can't sue us as it is against Premier League rules.
Brent Stephens
24 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:25:24
Lyndon, given your journalistic experience, how do you rate the possible veracity of Guardian reports like this? I assume you wouldn't post this piece if you thought it were just being mischievous?
Tony Everan
25 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:25:25
Those four clubs need to be compensated.

Gomes to Leeds, Gbamin to Burnley, Alli to Southampton, Maupay to Leicester.

Take it or leave it.

Rob Halligan
26 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:28:59
What a crock of shit. While we're at it, Arsenal should sue Man City, Inter Milan should sue Man City, and Man Utd should sue Man City. Everyone should sue Chelsea for spending around £800M in six months. Maybe we should all sue Forest for buying 3000 players.

Also, why should all three of Leicester, Leeds and Southampton feel they should sue, when at least two of those three would have gone down with us? Maybe Coventry feel they should also sue us. Why? Well, fucked if I know… maybe because we finished fourth from bottom and they lost the playoff final. At the end of the day, we were better than all three relegated clubs – after all, the league table doesn't lie!

Have I just typed a pile of shite…z? Yes, just like the useless Guardian who have also published a bag of shite!!

Lynn Maher
27 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:30:56
Manchester City have been accused of breaching the Premier Leagues financial rules, 115 times during a 14-year period. This after a 4-year investigation. Because of the number of charges, it could take many more years to hear the case to completion.

The rate they are coming out of the woodwork to sue us, we may finally be compared to City!

Gary Brown
28 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:32:19
What an utter mess.

The stress of following this club is simply off the charts. If we come out of the next few years intact, it'll be a miracle. If we don't, maybe building back up from the very bottom (à la Rangers) is the real way forward.

Hopefully, the Covid force majeure argument stands up, but we have got to stay well within the rules for the foreseeable future, whatever the outcome. Sales, no investment and prayers. Fuck you, Kenwright.

Neil Copeland
29 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:33:49
Rob, you missed off Besiktas because we loaned them Dele Alli.
Chris Hockenhull
30 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:34:58
The opening defence in court has to be Billy Bullshit “It Was A Great Board” …. and take it from there.

Round these buggers up and let them take an oath and try to wriggle out of it like the snakes they are. Transfer the hearing to Nuremberg and bring Albert Pierre Point back off the bench!!

Bobby Mallon
31 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:38:55
Those teams should be suing the FA and Ivan Toney. He scored against all the relegated teams.
Ben King
32 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:40:55
It gets better and better doesn't it?

The sheer mismanagement, the gross incompetence to put us in this position

Who the hell was minding the cash register in this period?? Talk about a dereliction of duty. If we haven't broken the rules, well we've somehow got the best lawyers in the country.

I'm no accountant but even I can work out that a £300M loss over 3 years is about £200M more than permitted.

Yes, we can hide behind write-offs and Covid but if you're spending £50M on Gylfi Sigurdsson and £30M on Yannick Bolaise and £30M on Michael Keane and £22M on Davy Klaassen and £20M on Cenk Tosun and £12M on Ashley Williams and £20M on Theo Walcott and £30M on Morgan Schneiderlin and so on, and you don't increase your revenues, then guess what?

You're gonna fall foul of the P&S Rules!!!

It's so obvious.

They're absolute clowns, that stupid lot, and they've stymied the club for years to come.

Paul Jones
33 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:44:16
Rob @26.

Completely right and a nice summary of all this shite.

And I'll sue you if you don't agree with me.

Winston Williamson
34 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:47:47
Maybe we could sue clubs for misrepresentation for the shite players we bought and the players themselves for failing to honour their contracts by failure to resemble footballers.

In all seriousness, causation would have to be established surely? Did Everton's inability to manage their financial affairs cause the other clubs to be utter shite too? That's a tough one to prove, isn't it? No sensible court would entertain it.

Bill Watson
35 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:48:27
I would have thought any legal claim would need to be against the regulatory authority; in this case, the Premier League and/or the FA.
Barry Bragg
36 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:49:26
Maybe I'm missing something but surely we can't be sued by 4 relegated clubs. We could only be sued by the two clubs who finished in 18th place, ie, Leicester this season and Burnley last season, as they were the clubs that went down in our place (theoretically).

Also surely whoever sues us is going to have a really hard time convincing any judge that our overspending created an unfair advantage in our favour as it appears to have had the exact opposite effect and turned us into crap.

Gerry Morrison
37 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:49:45
Larry @ 19,

Guardian = Scum.

Seriously? Are we talking about the same paper?

David Currie
38 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:52:01
Rob 26,

Can we and all other English teams sue Liverpool for getting us banned from Europe for 5 years in 1985??

Danny O’Neill
39 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:54:22
Words of wisdom in your own style Rob.
Danny Baily
40 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:55:26
A nonsense article. The Guardian have been quick to put the boot in on us of late. I'm confident we will not be successfully sued for getting more points than Leicester.
David McMullen
41 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:56:04
Good point, Ray (13).

If Everton were guilty then either only one team can really claim against the club (Leicester who finished 18th) or, basically the whole league, the 19 other clubs. It's all a bit farcical… vultures they are.

Jerome Shields
42 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:58:51
The Mail; Sooner than later
The Guardian: Later rather than Sooner

By 25 October, most of it will be forgotten about. Everton will have done enough to placate the independent commission. Board changes, financial restructuring, the new stadium nearing completion, and a Premier League team.

There are too many vested interests to let Everton go down the swanie and the Premier League won't want clubs using in open court. There is an arbitration process which will be followed to limit upheavel.

Danny O’Neill
43 Posted 14/06/2023 at 21:59:57
David @38, don't start me. Remember the 39.

Steaua Bucharest banners.

No class. Wave that in our face and then protest when we shout at them.

Thanks David!!

Lyndon Lloyd
Editorial Team
44 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:07:01
"Lyndon, given your journalistic experience, how do you rate the possible veracity of Guardian reports like this? I assume you wouldn't post this piece if you thought it were just being mischievous?"

Brent, this one falls under the "general interest" category where it's worth posting as a headline piece because it's a) in a major daily newspaper (although, as we know, that doesn't count for very much these days) and b) everyone will be talking about it which means that our readers will want to discuss it as well.

If it's prefaced by "Report:.." I'm basically leaving it up to you, dear reader, to form your own opinion but not making any judgement as to its veracity.

The prevailing wisdom appears to be that this would open such a can of worms that it surely couldn't gain any traction, not least because of what rival clubs might do if Man City are found guilty on any of their 115 (!) counts of malfeasance.

Everton have been working with the Premier League for the best part of three years on their finances and have been under League-enforced austerity measures since the summer of 2021.

(I'm surprised, therefore, that the Premier League referred us to the independent commission in the first place.)

Additionally, I'm not sure how Southampton (who finished 13 points adrift of the next best-placed team above us) or Leeds (who would still have been relegated even if we'd gone down) have much of a leg to stand on here.

As I joked on Twitter, anyone looking at their respective situations could point out exactly why each of those clubs went down (Jesse Marsch, Javi Gracia, Nathan Jones... helloooo!) and it had nothing to do with Everton who were, arguably, only in the mire to begin with because they had no leeway to buy a proper striker due to Premier League restrictions.

Put simply, I don't expect this to go anywhere and if anyone gets sued, it would surely have to be the Premier League, not Everton.

Brent Stephens
45 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:09:51
Thanks, Lyndon. reassuring.
Joe Corgan
46 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:13:18
On the contrary to the prevailing viewpoint, I believe The Guardian employ some of the best sports journalists in the business.

This is a piece of somewhat investigative journalism and I don't detect any hint of bias here.

We are under investigation due to the incompetence of our owner, Chairman and previous board. If it were any other club, we would be applauding The Guardian for publicising this. If the board had done a better job, there would be no investigation, no case to answer, and no story for The Guardian to report upon.

What if we had been relegated while a club that finished a point above us had flouted Profitability and Sustainability rules?

As it stands, there is an investigation. Until we see the result of that investigation and the evidence presented, it is impossible to come to any conclusion as to our guilt. In the meantime, of course the media are going to report on the story.

Soren Moyer
47 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:17:56
Those clubs have to sue the Premier League as well as taking legal action against us, so any outcome in their favour is highly unlikely.
Philip Bunting
48 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:20:24
It's fine... Bill says 'other clubs look at us and think, what would Everton do'.
Dale Self
49 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:24:52
On The Guardian, my usual issue is the repeated presence of Goodley types and 20- to 30-year-old poll experts… erm, 'aficionados'. Overall, I still read often – which is saying something for them.

The turn after the Greenwald incident was alarming but they still get a pass. Sportswise I've never really kept a book so I will take your word, Joe.

Brent Stephens
50 Posted 14/06/2023 at 22:28:52
Yes, Joe, the only new part in this piece, as I see it, is the paper's understanding about the date for the hearing. I assume we'd all want to know about that.
Fran Mitchell
51 Posted 14/06/2023 at 23:17:49
Funny how people take it as 'The Guardian sticking the boot in' or 'The Guardian have an agenda'...

How so?

We are an absolute shit show. The management of this club from the ownership and board has been horrendous, and there is something dodgy about Moshiri's links with Usmanov.

Why should The Guardian ignore all that? Fans have been denouncing them for years, and complained that the board have been given a pass by mainstream media. (If you listen to TalkSport or Sky, they always repeat: "But the owner has put money in, what more do fans want?" And leave it at that.)

Fact of the matter is, the legacy of Moshiri and his board's utter incompetence is going to last long and deep.

David West
52 Posted 14/06/2023 at 23:35:05
Who's to say we would have been relegated if we stuck to P&S rules?

It's a transfer embargo, points deduction and or a fine. I get they are not happy.

Will they sue Man City when they are found guilty? Because Southampton definitely would've finished above them if City had stuck to the rules!!!

Nah, do one!

Paul Kossoff
53 Posted 14/06/2023 at 23:53:42
For fuck's sake… Every time I go on TW hoping for some good news, we get something else. It never rains but it pours on us poor buggers, doesn't it?

What's that religious song, When Will I Be Relieved? – seems appropriate to us.

Paul Kossoff
54 Posted 14/06/2023 at 23:57:47
Why are we to blame for these teams' relegations? We aren't that good at football and barely stayed in the Premier League ourselves.

Surely any money we spent didn't help put these teams down. What a bunch of twats they are. Them and fucking Ancelotti.

Lester Yip
55 Posted 15/06/2023 at 00:04:09
Perhaps a potential buyer's move to lower the club valuaiton further so they can buy on the cheap? As a white knight?
Dupont Koo
56 Posted 14/06/2023 at 00:13:22
As long as we drag the Premier League into the mud with us, the league's power brokers would keep the can of worms from opening.
Pete Clarke
57 Posted 15/06/2023 at 00:17:35
If MSP have done their due diligence, then I doubt they would have touched us with a bargepole should this or any other financial charges have a chance of happening.
Ian Pilkington
58 Posted 15/06/2023 at 00:18:25
Perhaps yet another spurious report in The Guardian could be connected to the impending removal as chairman of Everton Football Club of Champagne socialist and former Labour Party donor William Kenwright CBE, honour received in 2001, courtesy of Tony Blair's government.
Mark Taylor
59 Posted 15/06/2023 at 00:39:50
So we're likely to go halfway in the season or maybe longer before this is resolved. How very Everton. There will be a self-inflicted transfer embargo just in case. Any spend will be a fraction of what is sold, as has been the ritual recently.

MSP are fine. They have made us a loan and it's secured on the one sizeable viable asset we possess, a half-finished stadium.

Neil Tyrrell
60 Posted 15/06/2023 at 00:52:12
Disclaimer: I got pre-emptively drunk today on delicious DIPAs expecting to celebrate Bill's departure being announced. It's already tomorrow in the UK… so much for that then.

But fuck me, I thought the season was bad with misery and stress every Saturday (and occasionally Sunday or Monday… and the mid-week games). The off-season has started even worse!

Is everyone queueing up to kick us when we're down now? What's next? Dele suing us for not giving him a fair chance? Levy suing us for not playing Dele 20 times? Cenk Tosun have an axe to grind? Moise Kean, get yourself a lawyer, son. We must have screwed you over somehow.

Roll on August when I can just stress once a week again.

Kristian Boyce
61 Posted 15/06/2023 at 01:34:43
Would the clubs that are making the fuss also be the same teams who have either been in administration in the past or have been in trouble for some dodgy accounting over the years?

I can't remember any other team trying legal action against them when they were proven to be up to no good.

Greg Nelli
62 Posted 15/06/2023 at 01:52:23
This does not make a hell of a lot of sense for a few reasons:

1. Is there the possibility of clubs using the case to gain some form of competitve advantage? For example, weakening Everton further in order to have less competition long term for future places in the Premier League or financially cripple an opponent if the clubs return in future seasons? Could this possibility be why the rumour of Premier League clubs not be able to sue each other exists?

2. Where's the culpability of the Premier League after giving the club the okay last season? Didn't they need to approve any transfers?

3. If we are considering this season, how could Leicester, Leeds and Southampton claim any damage to their Premier League survival? We jettisoned £100M of players and did not replace them. Hence no damage could have impacted them from a competitive sense?

Kieran Kinsella
63 Posted 15/06/2023 at 02:09:49
No one has picked up on Bobby Mallon's accurate statement that Premier League rules prevent clubs suing each other as was reported months ago when this same story surfaced.
Pete Clarke
65 Posted 15/06/2023 at 02:13:11
Do the losses of Sigurdson for reasons out of our control and long-term injuries to the likes of Bolasie not count in our favour when it comes to P&S Rules? These players had to be replaced at inflated prices too.

There's a lot of shit getting thrown around but, if any club sues another and wins, then the wheels will come off the Premier League and football in general in a free-for-all between lawyers.
Jonathan Oppenheimer
66 Posted 15/06/2023 at 03:23:17
This feels entirely like a report engineered by those relegated clubs to make us look bad and nothing more. It clearly has no legs, or if they tried to sue us, would not get very far.

But by continuing to plant negative stories about us, the hope is that we run more scared, players don't want to come to us (not like they do to begin with), and in a best-case scenario for these other shit clubs they've made us look worse in the eyes of this independent commission.

In other words, a legitimate report based on cry-baby sources, intended to kick us when we're down, which amounts to a lot of nothing.

Just think how good we'll all feel when there's actual good news. Like Kenwright slinking off into the darkness.

Steve Brown
67 Posted 15/06/2023 at 04:02:34
If clubs started to sue each other, every season would end up in the courts.

The Sky Sports final day finale would have included the Old Baily as one of the locations, as Leicester responded to Doucouré's goal by requesting an emergency injunction to stop us finishing the game.

Absolute nonsense, and the latest example of The Guardian trying to flog an old story to death. If their various claims have any validity, then other news outlets would have picked up the story and run with it.

Matt Traynor
68 Posted 15/06/2023 at 04:26:27
Absolute horseshit. The Premier League will shit themselves if this happens. It'll end the league, and the big six (or seven if Newcastle are included) will fuck off to the new European Super League.

I'm not averse to this outcome per se. Would be nice to have the game back to something like being competitive. A salary cap would be nice too.

Alan J Thompson
69 Posted 15/06/2023 at 05:55:23
I'm not sure about the argument that at least two of the sides said to be considering suing Everton for damages would have been relegated anyway as, and I've not looked into it, it could be argued that results of all individual matches could have been affected.

Secondly, I'm not sure that a Premier League rule against clubs suing each other has much standing as you cannot legislate yourself out of the legal system, unless of course you're a member of the Royal Family.

Whichever way you look at it, it is an awful mess and I wonder if any shareholders may have a case against the Board members at that time or the Premier League who were (are?) supposedly overseeing Everton's financial transactions.

Whatever, there certainly needs to be a review of the Premier League's P&S regulations – not least given the amount you can overspend over three seasons given the present cost of player transfer fees creating an unfair (pun intended) playing field.

Darryl Ritchie
70 Posted 15/06/2023 at 06:09:27
Will this nightmare of a season ever end?
Scott Robinson
71 Posted 15/06/2023 at 06:23:39
Sue exactly for what? That Everton's alleged breach of the profitability and sustainability rules caused them to experience a deterioration of their performance on the football field? Causation and remoteness has to be the test.

You can not also say that Everton's alleged breaches gave them a competitive advantage. If that were the case, then Everton would be comfortably in the top half of the Premier League.

There is no correlation between money spent and performance. It comes down to luck, managerial skill and performance on the field.

That said, I am not a sports lawyer but I don't think any judge could make that reasonable determination.

Alan J Thompson
72 Posted 15/06/2023 at 06:27:35
Oh, and just to add to the mischief, if Burnley prove their case, could Mr Dyche sue them for slurring his reputation and leaving him out of work for 10 months for reasons beyond his control?

If it wasn't serious, you couldn't help but laugh.

Bob Parrington
73 Posted 15/06/2023 at 06:34:52
The Grauniad is the worst of all the media. So, let's not not get too drawn in by this heap of reporting shit. They're just stirring the pot as they have nothing else to report.

Let's kick good old Everton in the proverbial – Editor's choice. Nothing to report today about Ukraine, no rapes, no murders. We can't provide good news as it isn't the done thing.

What a load of bollocks!

Colin Glassar
74 Posted 15/06/2023 at 06:52:07
The Manchester Guardian obviously has it in for us for some reason. We can do a Man City and drag this out for years (if a decision goes against us) using appeal after appeal until our enemies tire.

I'm more concerned about our current lack of leadership than this.

Paul Smith
75 Posted 15/06/2023 at 07:01:40
The Guardian playing to its readership – corrupt Russian money and the link to Tories. It's nothing personal.
Derek Thomas
76 Posted 15/06/2023 at 07:17:04
Paul @ 75; "Nothing personal" it might be - but you can still end up just as dead, if somebody decides...and City having an aura of 'a bit too big a bite to chew' invoke the dreaded 'Something must be Seen to be done 'Pour encourager les autres'
Rich Short
77 Posted 15/06/2023 at 07:21:42
I’ve not looked at it in any detail but as a lawyer I see some issues with these purported claims. Firstly, aside from a premier league agreement, we have no direct contract with these clubs and so there is no direct right to claim under individual contracts. As for the premier league agreement, I do not know it’s terms but assume that it provides for the premier league to govern its members and act accordingly but there is possibly a right of claim under this depending on its terms. Everton do not owe any general duty of care to these other Clubs. Secondly, and most importantly, even if there was some kind of breach, the other clubs will not be able to show that Everton’s breach caused them loss. This would require expert evidence but it wouldn’t take much of a football expert to say that we have spent badly and that the team is worse now than before we overspent. The pundits all say it and the league positions say it. Instead, these teams’ own relegation and league placings were caused by their own failings and not any overspending by Everton and their cases will fail for want of causation.
Danny O’Neill
78 Posted 15/06/2023 at 07:24:57
If they want to open this can of worms, a few clubs will be under scrutiny and open to being sued by competitors because they have sour grapes. I keep saying, a few will be looking over their shoulder.

I get this is under investigation and goes back a couple of years.


We have been compliant with the Premier League.

Last year we spent about £80M on players coming in. But sold to the tune of about £100M. Not to mention those we offloaded on free transfers and loans.

Pathetic attempt to blame not achieving enough points to stay up.

Arsenal should sue Manchester City for winning the league.

Liverpool should sue everyone. Just for not liking or being Liverpool.

Stand your ground Everton and throw the stones back at them.

If it happens.

Michael Lynch
79 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:04:51
Rich, I'm no lawyer, but I'm not sure about your second point. Yes, we can say we have failed to gain as much as one would expect from our over-spend, but the counter-argument would be that, had we not over-spent we would have been even worse, and that we have gained enough advantage - despite our incompetent board blowing most of the money on shite - to keep us out of the bottom three.

Tony Abrahams
80 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:07:20
I know you will be a bit biased because you’re a proper Evertonian, Lyndon, but because you always speak a lot of sense, imo, then reading your reply to Brent, was both reassuring and also made a lot of sense, especially when you read what Rich says@77.
Phil (Kelsall) Roberts
81 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:34:10
Michael - not sure (apart from Rooney's wages) the board blew any of the money on the useless players. I thought that was down to the managers and the DoFs.
But hey, they could have done a Johnson and said you are not buying that person and when he did that Joe Royle walked. Perhaps they should have done and then we could have got rid of Koeman, Allardyce without compensation (sorry by FSW never had any money to spend - oh sorry Rondon's wages = he did).
Michael Lynch
83 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:43:07
Phil, the whole point of Bill was supposedly his "negotiating skills" so I assume he was involved. The board are responsible for spending and appointments - they appointed and subsequently fired an ever-changing cast of managers and DoFs and gave them the money to spend. Too much money, it turns out, and that is why we are being sued and may be docked points.

The buck stops with the board and the owner.

Scott Robinson
84 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:44:20
@Michael 79, this is pure speculation and opinion. This would not stand up in a court of law. You need evidence that would suggest that Everton's overspending caused the other teams to drop out of the premier league. This cannot be proven nor justified.
Rob Halligan
85 Posted 15/06/2023 at 08:55:22
Scott, you beat me to it mate. There’s not a cat in hells chance of what Michael is saying @ # 79 standing up in court. It would, in fact, as the saying goes, “be laughed out of court”.
Ian Horan
86 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:03:26
Surely the teams trying to sue Everton have an issue here!! Saints beat us at Goodson, Leicester beat us at Goodison, Leeds we’re unbelievably shite hence 3 or 4 managers in one season, Burnley shot themselves in the foot sacking Dyche. So obviously they believe he contributed to their relegation. Easy this defence of our position !! Oh and finally the league had us on special measures signing off our transfer or lack of transfer activity. Just need BPB gone and the skys will be cloud free and full steam ahead
Michael Lynch
87 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:14:31
That's good then - so the Guardian is just making it up, because if the clubs in question asked a lawyer, the lawyer would say "you've got no case, save your money".

John Chambers
88 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:14:43
An article in The Times today says the commission will meet on 25th October and the issue is to do with tax treatment of loans for the stadium. To me that is not a “direct” footballing offence so would surely make it harder for other clubs to sue. Also would have thought it would lead to a financial penalty rather than a footballing penalty, I.e. points reduction. Or I could be looking through rose tinted glasses!
Brian Harrison
89 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:23:38
I think this is just nonsense of clubs prepared to sue Everton for their inefficiencies, wouldn't hold water in any court. But Football here and in Europe has a major problem, most clubs are losing money year on year, mainly caused by most of their income going straight to players wages. So UEFA brought in FFP rules and the premier league brought in their own financial constraints, but the truth is neither are working. Man City were found guilty by UEFA for breaking their rules and were subsequently charged with a 2 year suspension from Europe, but they took their case to court and UEFA backed down. City also broke 100 Premier league financial rules and with their vast wealth they are again challenging those rules through the courts. And because they are a nation owned club non of the other Premier league clubs who could have been impacted by their rule breaking cant afford to challenge them in court.

As we have seen with Newcastle another nation state club owner, when it looked like the government might step in and challenge their take over they warned the British government that if they did step in then Saudi Arabia would withdraw its defence contracts with the government worth billions, hence the government didnt challenge the take over. So if a nation owned football club can make the government of the 5th biggest economy back down what chance do UEFA or the premier league have of imposing rules that these nation state owned clubs don't agree with.

Pete Neilson
90 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:24:44
John (88) that would tally with some initial reports that stated the breach was concerning the accounting on BMD. If proven I’d have thought it more a case for HMRC than the PL.

I think we can file the Guardian piece under sensationalist bilge. To think they still use “where the facts are sacred”.

Daniel A Johnson
91 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:27:36
Legal action what a pile of shite.

Are Man Utd going to sue Man City for losing the FA cup.

Are Inter Milan going to sue Man City for losing the champions league?

Are Man Utd, Liverpool and Arsenal going to sue Man City for finishing 2nd behind City in the premier League?


So why should it suddenly apply at the other end of the table to us. You are relegated after your own performance over a 38 game season. Not because we bought a few too many crap players.

Bernard Dooley
92 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:33:30
#88 Ian.
"the league had us on special measures signing off our transfer or lack of transfer activity."
Could it be that the league are accusing us of breaching those special measures in respect of one transaction, resulting in one charge against us?
Andrew Clare
93 Posted 15/06/2023 at 09:50:06
Football no longer belongs to the fans. It's all about money. A few years ago, it was dodgy billionaires buying football clubs; now it's nation states with awful human rights records.
I bet the older Man City fans still think back to the days of Johnny Crossan, Neil Young, Franny Lee etc as the real great times rather than the unreal times of now.
Stephen Davies
94 Posted 15/06/2023 at 10:16:52
Our FFP charge is related to a tax issue on stadium loans
Eric Myles
95 Posted 15/06/2023 at 11:28:09
So theoretically Arsenal could sue us for beating them and preventing them winning the league this season 'cos we should have been relegated last season?
Mark Wilson
96 Posted 15/06/2023 at 13:39:49
Lyndon 44# you should be selling stress busting medicine after a piece like this !! But joining apart, is todays news from that strange beast ‘a reliable journalist who writes about football…’ aka Paul Joyce totally change the landscape ref the charges laid by the PL ? If not actually related to yearly losses then it’s little surprise the club seem so bullish about defending the charge ? If this is a tax issue then it’s a very different defence ? Honestly hadn’t spotted this tax reference re BMD build……serious in HMRC terms but they don’t dock points do they…..

Totally be used by the whole PL commission thing. The PL in general have basically run the clubs balance sheet entries for nearly three years. How can they do this and arnt they charging themselves ? But somehow the whole thing feels a bit less threatening points wise if it’s a tax issue though I suspect we’ve somehow linked the supposed-to-be-seperate- BMD finances to our PL issues as way of reducing ‘losses’ and the PL saw that as naughty and it’s that which sits at the heart of the current commission…..if any of this tosh is right then I really think it’s going to get very rough and can see at least 6 points and a transfer ban in January 24 on the way in the current season.

As for those other clubs suing us, basically if that is even allowed to go to court then as many here are pointing out, that’s a recipe for disaster in the league as any breach of any rules will lead to legal action, cue the breakaway six being sued and those poor hard up types at Man City being wide open to lots of trips to the Old Bailey…..

Paul Tran
97 Posted 15/06/2023 at 13:53:14
A classic piece of 'if then' journalism.

If we are found guilty and sanctioned, of course a relegated team has the option of suing us, and presumably the PL, to compensate for their commercial/competitive losses as a result of us staying up after breaking the rules at their expense.

We'd rightly do the same if the boot was on the other foot, wouldn't we?

That word 'if' is carrying a huge weight in the headline, though, because we may not be found guilty. We got 'assurances' didn't we?

Those alleged 'assurances' concern me far more than a close season newspaper headline.

Ray Smith
98 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:00:09
Without going into the minutiae, which I far from conversant with.
If we follow the Man City avoidance model, this situation will (hopefully) not be resolved for some considerable time, unless the movers and shakers try to make an example of us!
Any half decent lawyer need only cite the Man City saga, then sit back and wait for any sanctions to be imposed, then appeal, and follow that decision up with further appeals up through the pyramid of higher judicial processes.
In short, follow what Man City are doing, albeit they are where they are through ability and financial resources, the analogy/principal is the same.
Isn’t it?
Dave Lynch
99 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:23:02
Yank investors will tie this up in litigation for years.
They aren't stoopid, they wouldn't of invested if this had legs.
Ray Smith
100 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:27:42
Dave 99

Good point 👍

Rob Halligan
101 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:37:53
Seeing as we’re in suing mode, we should be suing the RS for loss of income and prize money for the five years we were banned from Europe. Also, we should go and nick one or two of their European / CL trophies as a kind of compensation for what we could have won in those five years. Seems pretty fair to me.
Jay Harris
102 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:40:10
It really irks me that Man City are being serenaded and LAuded for their treble winning year and plucky little Everon are headlines for being investigated for a single breach of P&S policy.

I detest this modern vogue of trial by media.

Lets hope we get this over and done with quickly and get back to the football.

Mark Ryan
103 Posted 15/06/2023 at 14:57:58
How do we get an October hearing and Man City get nowt
Mal van Schaick
104 Posted 15/06/2023 at 15:11:38
What next? Let’s revisit all the wrong VAR decisions and re-jig the league points table.
Ed Prytherch
105 Posted 15/06/2023 at 15:16:38
The shit houses at the Grauniad are chuckling after winding us up yet again.
Jack Convery
106 Posted 15/06/2023 at 15:50:27
Perhaps the 10 teams who finished 7th to 16th will send us a monetary gift for letting them finish as high as they did. Afterall we have been so crap for so long and no longer finishing 7th. The teams who got relegated did so because they were inept.

We spent £1.7m for 21/22 and had to sell Richarlson before 22/23 and Gordon in Jan 23 and did not replace either. ( Maupay does not count ). We play a 37 year old right back. We sold Digne and replaced him with Mykolenko, who is not as good, when it comes to scoring goals and assists. We let James go who scored goals and created goals. We have Keane, Holgate and Godfrey who are not top defenders. Mina our best defender who was always injured and a defender on loan from Wolves. DCL who is our best forward but is always injured. 2 goalkeepers as subs most of the time, Rondon was on the pitch, ( I daren't say played for us ). Benitez and Lampard as managers for 18 months. Lets not forget, an incompetent board and an interfering owner. We wasted £750m. If you cannot compete against that then you deserve everything you get.

Kieran Kinsella
107 Posted 15/06/2023 at 15:57:16
Jay @102,

It is absurd. The media narrative is Man City are the greatest team ever and any questions are just unfounded sour grapes.

Just for perspective, Man City could be found innocent on 99 of the charges they are facing and still have twice as many cases remaining as Everton have. Or put another way, if we are found guilty of 100% of the charges facing us, that's the equivalent of City being found guilty of 0.99% of the charges facing them.

Additionally, while the media expect nothing to happen to them, we are being braced for a 10 points deduction, a transfer ban, and being sued my multiple parties. It's kind of like if you let Frederick West walk free, then hang draw, quarter and burn at the stake a man who let his dog poop on the street outside Frederick West's house.

And therefore it is utter nonsense – just papers trying to create drama where there is none. Let's not forget, a year ago Chelsea, were going to lose their license, be wound up by the government, etc etc. What happened? Nothing but a lot of naive people enjoyed reading salacious headlines for a few months.

Joe McMahon
108 Posted 15/06/2023 at 16:25:32
Kieran, absolutely correct. The unfortunate passing of Gordon McQueen today got me thinking of that great Leeds team in the mid-70s. Peter Lorimer, how good was he? All those goals from midfield.
Michael Barrett
109 Posted 15/06/2023 at 16:49:40
Know one us getting sued relax ffs...and ground will be brilliant some of you lot need a bloody hobby.
Danny O’Neill
110 Posted 15/06/2023 at 17:04:43
We do have Michael @109.

It's Everton!

Relax? I try, for about 30 seconds!!

Sad to hear of the passing of Gordon McQueen.

Roger Helm
111 Posted 15/06/2023 at 17:26:14
Well, our defence will be straightforward. 1. We spent loads of money but it obviously had no effect, as we are shit. 2. If you weren’t so shit yourself you would have stayed up, so it’s your own fault.
Michael Barrett
112 Posted 15/06/2023 at 21:16:06
Danny, you need another one, fella – get yourself a big arse train set! 😂
Mike Hayes
113 Posted 15/06/2023 at 21:45:39
Can we sue Moyes for leaving us and going on to win the Europa Conference League cos that could have been us if he was still with us?
Steve Guy
114 Posted 15/06/2023 at 22:11:36
If anyone is getting sued, it's the Premier League.

We have been under special measures where they scrutinised all our financials for the last few seasons. With this in mind, it's difficult to see how we get sued for an irregularity they are culpable in.

Jay Harris
115 Posted 15/06/2023 at 22:11:38

It used to be journalists just reported the facts after verifying them but these days it's just constant bullshit and lies with an agenda against anyone who is in their sights.

We should have an independent review of the media with a governor to control these imbeciles.

I'm guessing most of them are rednoses or "Landanners" with a chip on their shoulder.

Si Cooper
116 Posted 16/06/2023 at 13:39:31
“We have been under special measures where they scrutinised all our financials for the last few seasons. With this in mind, it's difficult to see how we get sued for an irregularity they are culpable in.”

Wouldn't that depend on how open and honest ‘we' had been? If it wasn't hidden, then it's on them if they signed off on it; if deception was involved, then it would end up laid at our feet.

Howard Don
117 Posted 17/06/2023 at 13:39:44
So the hearing is on 25th October, but when will their decision be handed down? Are they studying the evidence now with decision delivered on 25th or will they go away after the hearing and deliberate for weeks?
Ian Bennett
118 Posted 17/06/2023 at 14:08:59
Any update on what decade city are going to get sanctioned?

Alan J Thompson
119 Posted 19/06/2023 at 06:24:55
25 October:

"And how do you plead, Mr Kenwright?"

Kenwright: "A funny thing happened with the handlebars on the way to the theatre, no, not of dreams but watersides, supermarkets and sewerage works, I met a man who offered me three beans for my cash kow..."

Tony Abrahams
121 Posted 22/06/2023 at 21:13:47
Expect more, Arild, especially if the man who has kept those horrible wolves from the media away from our club, is finally forced out the club because of mob rule.
Kevin Molloy
122 Posted 22/06/2023 at 21:23:56
It's a miracle we stayed up this season just gone. When you think of the absolute clowns in charge, and that year of Lampard, and with not a goal to spare.

Maybe at this point we should just reflect on the massive bullet we just dodged. I think we were a whisker away from going out of business.

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