09/09/2023 52comments  |  Jump to last

Vitalii Mykolenko was part of the Ukraine team that became the first to take points off Pickford's England side as they were held to a 1-1 draw in the Euro2025 Qualifiers.

Ukraine took the lead through Zinchenko but England equalized when Kyle Walker scored. England remain top of Group C by a big margin having played more games.


Reader Comments (52)

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Danny O’Neill
1 Posted 09/09/2023 at 19:51:21
Liked the look of the Ukranian right back. Although he did look more Scottish or Irish than Ukrainian!!

Sorry to be ginerist

Colin Glassar
2 Posted 09/09/2023 at 19:51:25
Five things I've learnt from todays game:

1) Southgate is shite.
2) Mudryk is shite, £80M for him?
3) Mykolenko isn't a very good left-back (in fact he's shite) but in a more central role he looks half-decent.
4) Foden should leave Man City for us or another club where he can play every minute. Pep and gormless Gareth are going to ruin him.
5) Southgate is so bad he'd probably play our former player aka Iwobi if he hadn't chosen Jamaica over England.

Southgate out!!

Alex Gray
3 Posted 09/09/2023 at 19:56:02
God, that was dross, wasn't it.

The fact that by the end of the game the likes of Henderson, Maguire and Gallagher were on the pitch says it all.

Southgate isn't shite but he's very much a play-it-safe coach. The irony is when he first got the job he culled the former big names and picked players on form and is now picking his favourites which will inevitably get him the sack.

Too many players getting picked that aren't playing for their club or, in Henderson's case, have retired.

Ed Prytherch
4 Posted 09/09/2023 at 20:02:18
Agree with Danny about the ginger right back.

Zinchenko was better than any of the England midfielders.

Barry Rathbone
5 Posted 09/09/2023 at 20:17:51
It was on in the background in our house so occasionally I looked up as though to confirm it really was the same film from years past and it was – absolute dross.

Why anyone expects anything from England is beyond me; the players are beyond parody, they just can't do basic things.

About the 70th minute, Rashford had the opportunity to cross the ball on the move from the left near the byline. A technique that shows if a player has "it" or is a lower league duffer. The gormless oaf sliced it into touch because he lacked the ability to wrap his foot round the ball.

Terrifyingly, Rashford is seen as one of our "star" players confirming the standard of footballer produced today is beyond a joke.

Rob Halligan
6 Posted 09/09/2023 at 20:47:42
Don't ask me why, but I'm watching this shite rugby World Cup, England v Argentina.

An English player is ordered off after about two minutes, while VAR, or whatever it is called, have ten minutes to decide if an accidental clash of heads is deemed a red card, or only a yellow. They decide it's worthy of a red card.

Meanwhile, an Argie is ordered off for flattening an English player, and given ten minutes to await his fate! VAR, or whatever it's called, decide it's only worthy of a yellow card.

Very strange game, with even stranger rules!

Anyway, England lead 4-1.

Mike Morgan
7 Posted 09/09/2023 at 20:54:40
So let's get this right. Southgate takes Bellingham off and leaves Henderson on… madness.

From kick-off, the middle 3 should have been Bellingham, Rice and Maddison with Foden or Rashford on the left.

Rob Halligan
8 Posted 09/09/2023 at 20:56:58
Mike, you mean Henderson was playing?? I never saw him!
Mike Morgan
9 Posted 09/09/2023 at 21:00:51
Rob, you must not have being concentrating. Henderson messed up lots of stuff. :-)
Rob Halligan
10 Posted 09/09/2023 at 21:14:21
Mike, I tend to switch off easily, as far as England are concerned, especially after a few pints in the blazing sun in the back garden!!
Mike Morgan
11 Posted 09/09/2023 at 21:23:36
Rob, Good call. Make the most of the sun whilst we have it. I live in Newcastle and winter starts next week.

All will be okay if we beat Arsenal. Hope we have Beto with Calvert-Lewin fit to come off the bench. Would give Goodison something to cheer for at last !!

Kevin Molloy
12 Posted 09/09/2023 at 22:56:13
Watching England, with that preaching bearded knobhead at the helm, soft arse with his rainbow laces taking the knee on a million pound a week from Saudi. Doesn't get much better than this
Geoff Trenner
13 Posted 09/09/2023 at 23:06:18
Braai in the garden then rugby rather than the football. Looks like I made the right choice.
England (rugby) were in magnificent, not pretty but played the game they had to after the early red card.

Kieran Kinsella
14 Posted 09/09/2023 at 23:42:48
Southgate has lost the plot. Sterling (played at right-wingback) didn't have a great time last season but has started this one brilliantly. He's also been a key man for Southgate.

He's dropped from the squad altogether. Is Southgate bitter he popped home from the World Cup after his family were robbed at gunpoint?

Henderson has a crap season, is told by Klopp his days are numbered, and drops his principles to go to Saudi Arabia as it's best for his family.

Do they speak Arabic? Does he wife like wearing a hijab? Are their fair northern skins suited to radiant heat in the desert? Or is he a greedy bastard?

But he starts of course, as does Maguire who's assumed Phil Jones's spot on the Man Utd bench for the last 2 years.

The preppy Maddison, after one good game at Spurs, of course starts ahead of the scruffy Manc treble winner.

And then how do we approach this mediocre opponent? We bore them to death with sideways passing.

Southgate should have walked after the Euros. If you can't beat a lackluster Italy at Wembley you're never going to win a trophy.

Billy Shears
15 Posted 10/09/2023 at 02:38:15
It's games like this one that does my fucking head in...so negative and boring!

The Premier League should only stop for the FA Cup rounds or an act of God... ONLY.

Alan J Thompson
16 Posted 10/09/2023 at 06:03:22
Kieran(14); Is that meant to be in jest?

Most of the world speaks English, she wouldn't have to wear a hijab as a head scarf should suffice and I'm sure they have air conditioning even where you live.

Somebody in NW Australia was hated for calling it life in the refrigerator as you went from the air-conditioned house to the similarly equipped car, shopping mall and work place. And who doesn't want a pay rise with a lower rate of taxation?

Or I'm getting thin skinned in my dotage? And while your posting isn't about it, I do wonder at those who seem to think that Everton going out backwards both financially and on the pitch is just some sort of glitch. It is possible that the last memory of Everton FC won't be as Liverpool's original football club or one of the founders of the Football League but as the builders of a white elephant on the banks of the Mersey or even worse, history repeats itself and some other club moves in.

Apologies to the thin-skinned, it's Sunday morning and England v Ukraine in Poland really isn't of great interest to me, aside from a left-back and a goalkeeper.

Jim Bennings
17 Posted 10/09/2023 at 06:38:14
Not picking Ward-Prowse is just stupid when he's playing better than some of them that walk into the squad on name.

I never have understood why we lose a week of the domestic season so early on for these games and then have to cram in about 10 matches in December, it's mental.

Alan J Thompson
18 Posted 10/09/2023 at 07:54:48
Jim (#17);

We can't have it interfering with the winter break, with or without underground heating. Surely this was brought up during Brexit, not to mention that most players might come from the "Sky Six" and we can't have them playing three games in a week.

Danny O’Neill
19 Posted 10/09/2023 at 08:56:52
I only watched as it was on. I have no connection with the England football team.

My observations? Southgate picks his favourites. I suppose you could say that about a lot of coaches and managers. They will tend to go with who they believe that they trust.

Harry Maguire. The expensive version of Michael Keane.

I thought Kyle Walker done well and not just because of his goal. No spring chicken but fit and competitive. Only a year younger than our Seamus.

Tony Waring
20 Posted 10/09/2023 at 09:27:21
I didn't watch the game – preferred "early doors" at my local – but I am much encouraged by previous postings. The disenchantment with England is surely encouraging for the Blues.

We have to pay against them – except Jordan Pickford of course – over the next few months so our chances appear to be much improved!

Having got that off my chest I must say that Alan (16) speaks sense; I just hope his thoughts do not become reality!

John Brooks
21 Posted 10/09/2023 at 10:51:22
IMHO, England could have easy won it but they just decided not to play and beat the Ukraine.
Tony Abrahams
22 Posted 10/09/2023 at 11:01:02
When did Evertonians become so paranoid? Fuck Liverpool and just concentrate on ourselves.

If the stadium is a white elephant then let's demand that the people who started building it get out of our football club, and let's start fighting for better owners before these bastards really stitch us up in a similar way David Moores stitched up Liverpudlians, when he sold their club to Hicks and Gillette.

Take no notice of me, it's not as if we can we do anything anyway! Of course we could, but it seems to have gone very quiet, with most people just accepting that Bill Kenwright will never really be seen again at Goodison (I'm paranoid – I don't believe this for one minute).

But what is being done behind the scenes to make us a better football club? Because the silence from the board and the whole club is totally embarrassing.

Les Callan
23 Posted 10/09/2023 at 11:44:22
Geoff @13. Try watching rugby league. Proper rugby.

That game on Friday between Saints and Leigh was brutal. True effort.

Rugby Union: 3 points for a drop goal. Says it all.

Danny O’Neill
24 Posted 10/09/2023 at 11:58:45
It's going to be our stadium.

It will be our 4th playing pitch in the city before we become the first team to win league titles in three centuries (there you go, Tony!!). And settle my even number OCD by making it a 10th.

But, always a but. He can't come back. He never can. It would be rightfully poisonous. I think the song was Silence is Golden. No. This is deafening and is a total lack of leadership from the top. If this was WW1, this is Lions led by Donkeys, although that is disrespect to Donkeys. Communication. Just tell us what is going on.

Don't get paranoid, Blues. Bramley-Moore Dock and the Liver Building are ours. They are going to hate it.

Those images of the blue and white cranes at Bramley-Moore Dock pointing towards Goodison in respect to the funeral of Michael Jones was very poignant.

Meanwhile, the manager and coaching staff will be focussed on next Sunday, which is the closest crocodile. Are we all meeting up?

Colin Malone
25 Posted 10/09/2023 at 11:59:17
Declan Rice : A centre-half in midfield.
Danny O’Neill
26 Posted 10/09/2023 at 12:37:53
I'm not an expert on Rugby, Les.

I'm not an expert on American "Football".

But having spent a lot of time out in the US, I see a lot of similarities and parallels between the two.

Likewise with Australian rules and Gaelic Football. Those two confuse the hell out of me as you just seem to be able to do what you want!!

Ray Smith
27 Posted 10/09/2023 at 12:39:47
Billy @15, I totally agree.

Utterly boring, and any half-decent side will pull us to pieces.
No chance of winning the Euros at this rate.

Blood some youngsters against Scotland, the current fringe players are the future. Clear out the old brigade!

Geoff Trenner
28 Posted 10/09/2023 at 13:03:32
Les @23.

I have tried watching Rugby League but, having watched the 15-man game for over 50 years and played it for over 30 years, I just can't get into it.

Tony Abrahams
29 Posted 10/09/2023 at 13:15:01
I agree with Geoff, and can't believe how much I enjoy watching a proper Rugby Union game, and it is now my second favourite sport, but only when I'm watching the big teams play.

I used to love watching the Aussie league, when I lived in New Zealand, especially the state of origin, which must surely be one of the best sporting events in the world.

But when I watched a rugby league game live, I was bored to tears, and wonder how many modern-day football fans would be equally bored if they had the same experience, rather than just watching on TV?

Robert Tressell
30 Posted 10/09/2023 at 13:21:50
I thought our approach to the Ukraine game was cowardly and thick. We were obviously going to be the team with the ball, challenged to break down defensive opposition. Southgate set us up as though we were playing France or Spain or Argentina - and very cautiously at that.

As a midfield anchor (the modern version of a Sweeper), Rice is a CB in midfield of sorts. This should mean we can release the full backs (and use the likes of Alexander-Arnold on the right) and dispense with a limited runner like Henderson in midfield. It was a game for Foden in midfield and runners / dribblers in attack to provide movement and feed off Kane.

Danny, I agree that Konoplya looked good at RB (he looks like a 1970s British footballer) and his Shahktar teamate Sudakov looked quitely effective orchestrating quick counter attacks from their midfield.

I did think Mykolenko looked very comfortable against Saka also - and hope that by the end of the season, we'll be more encouraged with our full-backs under Dyche's organisation than we are now.

Dave Abrahams
31 Posted 10/09/2023 at 14:22:00
I think Rugby League used to a lot better to watch than it is now, the scrums they play now are pathetic making the game far too open, I loved watching Wigan in the days of Billy Boston, still watch it but watching Rugby Union is much superior, absorbing and interesting, more interesting than a lot of football games I see, in fact if it wasn’t for Everton I wouldn’t really bother to get out and watch the game and there are lots of reasons for that, number one being the cheating illustrated perfectly by McGuire when he pretended to be injured after going in illegally at the Ukrainian goalkeeper, quickly jumping up to protest at getting the yellow card.
Ed Prytherch
32 Posted 10/09/2023 at 14:46:13

You're right about Rugby League not being what it used to be. I grew up in Ormskirk, attended secondary school in Wigan, and followed Saints. I took a lot of stick at school but it was friendly.

I bought my cup final ticket in Wigan and I was with my Wigan friends for the '66 cup final when Saints thrashed them, Billy Boston and all. 1966 was a very good year.

Paul Washington
33 Posted 10/09/2023 at 16:35:12
Rugby League is an excellent game to watch, especially live. I used to go and watch Widnes but haven't been in a good while.

I've always thought Widnes and Everton are similar clubs in their respective sports. Widnes aren't the best run club either!!

Jay Harris
34 Posted 10/09/2023 at 17:17:29
I thought Mykolenko had a decent game apart from the lapse that led to the equalizer.

It bodes well for the Arsenal game that Saka was mostly frustrated.

Agree with Robert that Sudakov looked a good player with some really good passing and link-up play.

Phil Smith
35 Posted 10/09/2023 at 18:28:56
I thought our left-back had a good game, actually. Bellingham was the worst player on the field and should have been hooked at half-time. Played one decent ball to Maddison, whose first touch was awful (all game, in fact).

England are way too slow moving the ball. Less tiki-taka and more like tippy-tapper. We seriously bore the opposition into switching off. Can't play Henderson and Rice all game. Rashford was also awful when he came on though. Saka didn't do too much either. I think Bowen, Eze or someone else should have been involved. Sterling? Grealish?

Tony Everan
36 Posted 10/09/2023 at 19:14:49
I dislike the international breaks, and it's hard to even be motivated to comment. I'm not bothered too much about rugby but I enjoyed it more than this match.

Mykolenko did relatively well considering he's still short of game time. These two internationals should get him back to full match sharpness. He'll come back in for Young against Arsenal.

England were clueless for the most part, the only piece of magic was Kane's pass to Walker then his control and finish. Mykolenko maybe could have cut it out but the bullet pass and finish were of top quality.

Southgate has got to be brave and stop picking Henderson, especially now he's in semi retirement, it's time to move on. Also, there's got to be better options than Maguire at the top level. It's all looking very stale.

Dale Self
37 Posted 10/09/2023 at 19:38:46
Tony, fair enough but occasionally you get to see something like Moriyasu’s Japan upend the football order even though in a friendly. Flick is gone and Moriyasu is a serious fellow.
Bill Gall
38 Posted 10/09/2023 at 20:31:52
Sounds like I am not missing anything, not being able to watch any England games on regular TV in Canada…
Martin Reppion
39 Posted 10/09/2023 at 22:17:34
As we have American based guys on here, I would love to see the stat on Henderson's passing on Saturday. Quarterbacks are rated on number of yards gained per pass.
I reckon Henderson must have been well into the minus hundreds. Every time he got the ball he stopped and played it back.

Before the game, I asked on my Whatsapp group how an England side can start without Foden and Rashford (Henderson and Maddison, are you kidding?).

Surely the Red-nosed retiree has done enough for a one way ticket back to the land of money and repression. Maddison can go back to his hairdresser.

Ian Bennett
40 Posted 11/09/2023 at 07:08:40
The standard of journalism, is utterly shite.

Starts well. I am going to get some informed opinion?

"Former Daily Star journalist Paul Brown told GiveMeSport (8 September) that Dyche even prefers the likes of Ashley Young and Nathan Patterson to play at left-back over the Ukrainian despite them starting the season off poorly",

Then oh dear. How to write an article with never seeing him.

"Mykolenko, in a similar way to Patterson, is probably better going forward than he is on the other side of the game. I don't really feel like his Everton career has ever got off the ground."

Mate, he doesn't cross the half-way line. He's not bad as a defender, but offers fuck-all going forward. A bit like your journalism Paul Brown.

It's been a slow weekend...

Andrew Ellams
41 Posted 11/09/2023 at 09:13:27
Martin, absolutely spot on. Every move that went through Henderson came to a crashing halt.

How on earth can you pick him vs Foden in a game that you know will need something special to break the opposition down.

Ian Jones
42 Posted 11/09/2023 at 09:16:13
To be fair to England and Southgate, both haven't done too badly in recent years. Reached the quarters of the last World Cup, semi-final the one before and reached the last Euros final.

Agree with people who feel if Southgate could be a little less cautious, the team might be a bit more successful.

On their day, I feel England could be capable of beating most teams.

Regarding the weekend match against Ukraine, a few points to be made...

It's still early in the season

Players are feeling their way back in

Quite a few players injured - Stones, Shaw, James, Mount, Alexander-Arnold, Grealish

Many players likely to be involved in Champions League matches so may have been holding back

With qualification likely to be reasonably guaranteed, perhaps players not as motivated as might be if playing a major team. Not saying that's the right way to play

Ukraine are a decent team

Lastly, Colin, all the way back to post at 2, assume you meant Demarai Gray :)

Jack Convery
43 Posted 11/09/2023 at 09:27:28
Can I ask our USA-based Blues if there any promising players in the MLS that could be a viable option for the blues in January? I notice quite a few players are out of contract in December 2023.

As for Mykolenko I thought he did okay against Saka. I reckon his best position is a left side in a back 3. How the kid has played football over the past months beats me, what with his parents and relatives back in Ukraine, wondering on a daily basis is a Russian missile coming our way. He deserves a medal: Long Live Ukraine.

Mick O'Malley
44 Posted 11/09/2023 at 13:35:35
Rugby League is an excellent game, absolutely love it, physical, non-stop action. I'd watch a Rugby League game before any football match bar Everton.

Regarding the England game, that was absolutely excruciating to watch: pass, pass, pass, pass, sideways, backwards… absolutely boring as hell.

I thought Mykolenko done well against Saka, gave him a few kicks and was physical against him. Jordan Henderson was hopeless and Why play Maddison on the left? Surely Foden is better there in his natural position.

How Foden isn't one of the first names on the team sheet is beyond me.

Charles Brewer
45 Posted 11/09/2023 at 19:57:24
One of the problems with sending people to Mars is that it takes 15 minutes for a message from Earth to Mars (actually, it's between about 4 and 24 minutes depending on the relative locations). So a "What is happening?" message from Houston will learn the answer after about 30 minutes.

Assuming a remedy for a problem is sent instantly, the remedy is applied instantly on Mars and the result sent back, it will take about an hour for an issue to be resolved.

This, I think, is similar to the problem of Southgate (and Dyche). It's as if the shite play on the pitch in the first half doesn't register until half-way through the second half.

At that point, something resembling thought takes place, and substitutions are made in the 87th minute, just in time to send on a bunch of extremely inexperienced players who won't have any time to overcome the initial adrenalin rush or to get enough running around to warm up.

Furthermore, if, like the Italian manager in the 2020 Euros (as played in 2021, of course), you react to problems and restructure the play at half-time, Southgate completely failed to react and, instead of countering the changed formation and players, kept his team playing against the Italian first-half team – which was no longer on the pitch.

Moyes used to wait too long, Southgate waits too long, Lampard waited too long, Dyche waits far too long. All have second-rate (at best) results, even with decent players as the England squad seems to be.

The trouble is that, when you get up against a Guardiola, Mancini, Ancelotti, or Scaloni, their ability to change stuff around in adversity will very, very often overcome the slow thinkers.

Paul Tran
46 Posted 11/09/2023 at 20:05:48
Cracking stuff, Charles. I'd argue in this instance, Southgate's thinking was even slower — playing Henderson & Maguire. I'd have neither of them in the squad.

I've always thought that, if Bellingham was 2 years older, England would have beaten Italy in that final — if Southgate would have picked him!

Tony Abrahams
47 Posted 11/09/2023 at 20:18:47
Maybe, Paul, but I go back even further to when Croatia came from behind in the World Cup semi-final in Russia. I think that Charles makes a very valid point about slow thinkers. It might not even be that Southgate is a slow thinker, but more that he sometimes lacks a little bit of bravery.

Hopefully Dyche starts making a few more substitutions a lot quicker, especially if or when we play 4-4-2, because it's very hard work playing in a midfield four, especially because most teams play with an extra body in the midfield nowadays.

Paul Tran
48 Posted 11/09/2023 at 20:29:23
Tony, I think England lost that Croatia game mentally.

Southgate knows that it's the pragmatic teams that tend to win tournaments.

I often read that overdone strengths become weaknesses. You're right – Southgate's pragmatism becomes a lack of bravery.

If he picked any centre half other than Maguire, the team would be at least 10 yards further up the pitch. The pressing would be better and the likes of Bellingham and Foden would have more chance to shine.

Barry Hesketh
49 Posted 12/09/2023 at 21:48:39
All the players missing proves that England are serious contenders, Stones, Trent, et al all mentioned by C4 panel, but not Pickford, who didn't play tonight against Scotland, maybe that's the Arsenal keeper as England's new number one?

As for this tweet, from Robin Bairner Sep 11, 2023

Jordan Pickford hasn't saved a single shot for England in Euro 2024 qualifying, despite playing every minute.

He's only faced 2 shots on target and conceded from them both.

His last save came when England were still 1-1 in the World Cup quarter-final vs France.

well Phil McNulty answered him by saying and should he have saved those two shots? No!

Barry Hesketh
50 Posted 13/09/2023 at 11:47:40
Just read that the only Everton player who will be involved in the Africa Cup of Nations in January, will be Gana Gueye - is that correct?
Pete Neilson
51 Posted 13/09/2023 at 12:12:39
Barry didn’t Doucoure switch to Mali? There was something in the summer about a falling out with his national team so maybe he’s no longer in their plans.
Tony Everan
52 Posted 13/09/2023 at 12:28:35
Sounds like Doucoure was not happy with the set up there, don’t think there’s anything official though, but hoping he he stays here and helps us.

“After a magnificent end to the Premier League season with the Toffees, Doucoure seems to have turned the page on the Malian national team.

A bad experience with the Eagles
According to Sport New Africa, Abdoulaye Doucoure is no longer in contact with the technical staff. "He is not responding to calls and messages", we learn. The reasons for this refusal are not yet known. “

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