Arsenal 4 - 1 Everton

Roberto Martinez stuck to a former pattern in naming Robles as the main change to an otherwise strong lineup that included Mirallas, Barkley, Pienaar and Lukaku as the attack-minded players, with Osman on the bench, and Baines named as captain in Jagielka's absence with a hamstring strain.

The game got off to a strange start, Everton hoofing the ball up-field and Barry clattering Arteta but getting an elbow in his face... before the Blues locked in to their possession passing game, and won a free-kick wide left. Baines swung in a great ball from it but Distin could not dig it out and Barkley tried to run the ball in but lost it. Arsenal worked their way forward, McCathy slipped, Carzola played in Ozil and the first goal was scored. Far, far too easily.

Everton were stunned and Arsenal went on to dominate the next few plays, getting good shots in on Robles. Everton then got forward with Barkley and Mirallas pulled back a great ball for Pienaar but he could not control it and Arsenal were attacking again, winning a string of corners. Barkley was getting well into it, winning the ball deep, then putting in a superb cross for Lukaku but he could not finish.

But when Arsenal got they ball, they looked threatening, surging forward through the Everton defence a little too easily for comfort. Flamini caught out Robles with a harmless ball that Robles needlessly pushed onto the angle and behind for a corner. His clearances were nervy too as Everton struggled to gain control of the game as Arsenal won another corner.

A good long run from Barkley, evading the yellow-carded Flamini, ended with an excellent ball to Mirallas at the far post but it hit his heel and spun nicely for Lukaku to juggle off his thigh and tap in from close range to put Everton on the scoreboard. But another surge by Arsenal saw them come close to scoring again, Oxlade-Chamberlains's fierce shot forcing a great save from Robles. A the other end, Mirallas should have done far better after getting a great through ball but his weak pass-back did not test Fabianski.

Arsenal pressed for the lead again leaving space for Everton to break into, Lukaku being the next to test them with a good run into the area but he could not dig out a shot or a pass under pressure from a trio of red shirts. Everton survived yet another corner (Arsenal's 10th!) at which Robles challenged his own defender, Distin to an aerial ball. Coleman then appeared to be fouled as he tried to pull the ball back on the Arsenal goalline but Clattenburg blew for half-time.

Everton needed to hold possession better but sloppy passing let them down badly at the start of the second half, ceding the initiative to the home side. Pienaar gave away a silly foul on Sanogo that eventually led to Arsenal's 11th corner. Mirallas was called a little unluckily for a handball and Carzola thankfully lashed well over in the next phase.

Lukaku was gifted the ball wide right from a hilarious Vermaelen miss-kick, he ran in and set up Barkley with a peach that the much-hyped young hope shockingly scooped over the bar when it looked easier to score with the goal gaping. At the other end, Robles had to fingertip a shot from Carzola that could have just shaved the post.

Wenger made the first change on the hour, Giroud replacing Sanogo as Arsenal put together a spell of pressure that won another corner. Everton regained possession but Mirallas was poorly offside. Everton attacked again but Lukaku seemed wasted out wide and the Blues were denied their first corner of the game. Oxlade-Chamberlain bamboozled Barry on the byeline and a penalty awarded, duly slammed in by Arteta but Giroud had encroached, so Arteta smacked the retake high into the other side.

McCarthy got a yellow for tackling Arteta from behind as Everton once again had to raise their game and get back into it. Baines whipped in an amazing cross that was too close to Fabianski, then Mirallas tried to beat the keeper with a decent shot. A spell of pretty good pressure from Everton saw them win their first corner, taken short, and Barkley again shooting off-target. Martinez decided it was time to replace Pienaar with Osman and Mirallas with McGeady.

It seemed that Martinez was waiting for Arsenal's third goal before he would bring on Deulofeu and that goal came when Sanyo pulled the ball back and Giroud could not miss. The young Spaniard came on for Barkley, tried a few stopovers then all too easily squandered possession in a forward position and watched as a rampant Arsenal danced through the stretched Everton defence and Giroud again made it a shocking 4-1 scoreline.

It was shooting practice for the red shirts in the final minutes as Everton's season collapsed miserably at the scene of perhaps their best display a few months earlier. Everton had played well at times but were clearly disturbed by the early setback and, despite having more shots than Arsenal in the first half, rarely played them off the park, as they had done in the league encounter.

Scorers: Ozil, (7') Arteta (pen:68'), Giroud (83', 85'); Lukaku (31')

Arsenal: Fabianski, Sagna, Mertesacker, Vermaelen, Gibbs (88' Jenkinson), Flamini Y:24', Arteta, Oxlade-Chamberlain (78' Rosicky), Ozil, Cazorla, Sanogo (61' Giroud Y:68').
Subs not Used: Podolski, Viviano, Miyaichi, Gnabry.

Everton: Robles; Coleman, Stones, Distin, Baines; McCarthy Y:69', Barry; Mirallas (76' McGeady), Barkley (84' Deulofeu), Pienaar (75' Osman), Lukaku.
Subs not Used: Howard, Hibbert, Browning, Naismith.

Referee: Mark Clattenburg

Attendance: 59,719

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Paul Taylor
292 Posted 08/03/2014 at 12:23:22
Not a bad line up but slightly concerned about Robles in goal. But must trust RM I suppose. We all need to be focused and if everything clicks into place then we might get a winnable replay. I am going for a 1-1 draw, but my heart wants a win... obviously COYB
Ralph Basnett
295 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:05:54
Same old same old when it comes to us against the so called big clubs or big games - panic!!!

I think so far this game has shown that MCarthy/Barry is not the holding, ball winning pair we all think and Roubles can’t catch a ball,which for a keeper is a bit of a worry.

Not passing it quick enough and the final ball being wanting makes for a Long afternoon.

Still, we can always blame Clattenberg!!!!!!!

Steven Telford
296 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:11:32
Big gamble to not play Howard......and watching Robles poor clearances, and decisions to punch when he should catch, and not really filling me with confidence.

We have been pretty blunt in all areas so far,

Shahul Hameed
297 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:19:01
Lukaku equalises.
Steven Telford
298 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:31:14
I think he should consider to replace McCarthy and Mirallas. The big difference between us and them is that the are capable of scaring from any half chance, were as (as usual) we need 5-10 good chances to convert 1.

Bring Deulofeu on!

Anto Byrne
299 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:38:43
Barkley playing well just need the pace of Gerard Del and play on the counter a bit more, possession doing nothing as too slow going forward and then they have everyone back defending. Yawn Hmmm who to take off. The keeper is a worry but hey how many games has he played? Bit of luck and we can win this.
John Moore
300 Posted 08/03/2014 at 13:44:52
Pienaar is shite, get him off please.
Ralph Basnett
301 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:08:19
13-0 on corners? Arsenal looking good on the break to be honest, think we need to look at Delboy, and now a stupid pen from Barry, stated in another thread he ain’t all that!!!!

Arteta of all people, and take it again, Giroud is a prize prat!!!!!!!

Steven Telford
302 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:11:25
Make a fucking CHANGE Martinez!!!!!!!! what’s he going to do what for 89 mins before to take one of the guys who did not turn up today off? FUCK THIS!
Ralph Basnett
304 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:25:18
McCarthy and Barry not at the party once again.

I really don’t know why people rave over them, I am an Ossie basher but would rather have him.

Once again we bottle it!!!!!!!!!!

Shahul Hameed
305 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:26:32
Hope for 7th now and it is the most for this season.
Phil Smith
306 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:26:39
Oh well. Concentrate on the league now, I guess.
Ralph Basnett
307 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:28:12
What a fuckin mess!!!!!

Shithouses the lot of them, fucking embarrassing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jermaine Jennings
308 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:29:14
Martinez and his tactics were fucking awful... how can you go through the season playing the same two central midfielders in Barry and McCarthy... fucking pants!

This fucking club just fucks me off sometimes its a fucking laughing stock.

James Kirrane
310 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:32:07
What a humiliation. Just not good enough when push comes to shove. Always the nearly men. Had our chances, but fluffed our lines yet again.
Tony J Williams
311 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:36:38
Wasn’t a 4-1 game but that Barkley miss was the game changer
Mike Powell
312 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:33:50
Just like watching Wigan! I’m sick off all this pass, pass, pass, pass, lose the ball they break and score its the same every week. If you are happy with that then that’s up to you. I am not; we need to change it now and again. Season over. What a load of crap.
Andrew Humphrey
313 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:35:16
Not that this is the biggest problem we face, but we always stop play when an opposing player fakes injury (badge kissing Arteta today). Can you imagine Suarez pausing when on an attack? We are too nice and honest by half to compete in this league of chancres and cheats. Do I want us to change? No, but maybe once or twice in the games against the real fuckers would be acceptable.
Shahul Hameed
315 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:34:31
Nearly men for twenty years.
Karl Parsons
316 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:34:32
Poor tactics, poor performance, poor substitutions. And the keeper is shit at best. Season over.
Alan Williams
317 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:38:23
Same old Everton, always let you down in the big games.

I’m pissed off. Arsenal were there for for the taking.

Steven Telford
318 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:39:32
Season over.... days were you feel you HATE Everton! We were let down by almost all 11 today.

Mirallas, gave a half-assed Sunday league performance.... For a "seasoned pro" like Barry to give away a penalty like that....
Barkley, hyped up as the next Gazza... errr yeah, after watching that miss; Gazza at age 40 after a few pints maybe. That could have been the winner for us.

Martinez failed to make the right changes at the right time. He played (by far) our second best keeper in one of our most important games of the season, a keeper who can’t catch.

James Carlisle
319 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:37:53
To be honest, that just looked like another dire performance in a big game to me. For some reason, the only times we looked to attack were after conceding the first and second goals. And I don’t know but if a team isn’t doing their all to win, especially in a quarter-final, every second of every minute then something is very wrong. Wish we’d look like we want to win one of these games one day.
Jermaine Jennings
320 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:41:34
"Crumble" is an understatement... and listen to Martinez "spectacular performance, really unlucky"!!!!

Lukaku didn’t break sweat in the second half because we always slowed the game down... fucking pathetic.

Noel Early
322 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:38:43
As usual a typical overreaction to a defeat, Barkley missed a sitter at 1 each, Barry gives a soft penalty away and they hit us on the break.

Pienaar criticism I agree with, too slow, not enough pace and no goals in him. I said it when we bought him: McGeady won’t do... EVER.

We will finish 7th so Martinez should just go with the youngsters from here until end of season.

ps: Kenwright needs to up the search to 25 hours a day.

Henrik Thomsen
323 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:42:43
Thank you Gareth Barry for ending our season in March. Braindead tackle in a harmless situation when we were in control.

Way to show your experience. Idiot.

Nick Armitage
324 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:43:54
Predictably we don’t turn up when it counts, makes all the hot air on the official site even more cringe-worthy. We got the usual flat-footed spineless big game performance.

I was shouted down after the derby for saying "season over". I was right.

Jim Bennings
325 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:36:38
The cracks are really starting to appear in a team that never got strengthened sufficiently in Jnauary.

Everton look a world away from the team of December that went to Arsenal.

The Gunners were crap today in all honesty yet typical Everton gift them the first two goals on a fucking plate as per usual.

It’s just another hard luck story and I can’t wait to see the usual "Oh but look at the chances we created, we were as good as Arsenal."

No, we had chances just like at Spurs and Chelsea but our finishing again was as feeble as ever. Do the Everton Ladies have harder shots of the ball than the men’s team, I wonder? None more so than the woeful Mirallas who, if it’s true that Spurs were interested in him this summer, I would drive him there... Over-rated flimsy. Baines was comfortably poor again and Pienaar needs putting out to grass..

Martinez got it badly wrong today... Robles was a poor decision for a game of this magnitude — why would you not play your first-choice keeper all season when you are away to Arsenal in the FA Cup Quarter-Final??

What is the point of keeping Deulofeu if he cannot replace Pienaar or Mirallas much earlier? What is the point of McGeady full stop when he is not staring any games? Why did Osman look knackered chasing back for Arsenal’s third goal?

What a sour end to such a promising season. I don’t want to sound too negative on Martinez’s first year but the honeymoon period of pre-Christmas is well and truly over now. Everton have looked tired and quite frankly since losing to Sunderland on Boxing day we have looked very poor.

The show is now over to Bill Kenwright and the Everton board to re-invest in this tired ageing squad now with some serious money... or as Martinez put it: A spending spree.

John Byrne
327 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:49:27
Can someone please tell me why our only centre forward Lukaku played almost the entire 2nd half on the right wing rather than being in the box trying to get on the end of any chances we might create??
Mark Tanton
328 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:51:33
I’m sure there will be people on here saying "oh, we were unlucky, it was never a penalty".. They are missing the point entirely.

This game followed an all too well-worn path — Everton play reasonably well, go toe to toe for a while but lack any killer instinct whatsoever, miss chances, waste the ball, don’t pass properly and give away stupid fouls.

We bottled it today, all too predictably. I for one and getting fucking sick of it.

Alan Khan
329 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:43:57
2-1 down and Roberto keeps Barry and McCarthy. 3-1 down and he keeps Barry and McCarthy. Am I wrong to want us to attack more going forward when we are down and chasing the game? Do we have to maintain two CDMs on the field for 90 mins?

Joel looked uncertain at most times today and I can’t understand why we have to slow the game down so often. We had some decent players on the park today but it’s just not good enough!

It’s quite sad how our season has backtracked following the Derby misery. I feel like the poor neighbour always watching the kid across the street opening his fancy Xmas presents... And now we also drop down a place on the league table to 7th following a win for Moyes.

Ray Roche
330 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:53:03
A spending spree.

In your dreams.

Brian Waring
331 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:53:51
Mark, it was a nailed on pen. Also, I don’t think we bottled it, it was more a case of, as you put it "missed chances".
Max Wilson
332 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:48:05
When the third goal went in, that was it: you saw several heads fall. Until the penalty, I thought we were playing quite well. Pienaar had missed a goal. Mirallas had made a weak shot when he should have passed.

Robles never looked safe. Would Howard have saved the second shot? We’ll never know. Robles punching of the ball instead of catching it was getting on my nerves (and no doubt those of his colleagues).

NOW DON’T ALL LETS GET DESPONDENT! There are still a lot of points to play for this season. The substitutes made no difference apart from Deulofeu. He looked hard to handle. So I’d give a sympathetic slap on the back for nearly all the lads if I were able.

Ian Glassey
334 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:44:00
Pissed off big style, will we ever win another trophy I don’t think I will ever see one. As an attacking force we just have no idea, a lot of players needed in the summer but you know it wont happen. One feed up Evertonian..
Brian Waring
335 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:57:14
Agree Alan, it’s a one of game, so I don’t understand why he keeps Barry and McCarthy both on.
Terry Maher
336 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:57:31
Same old season
John Moore
337 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:51:07
I’m sick of Everton and I’ve already been conned into renewing for next season, but then again this season’s over now so..... I’m tired.
Gareth Fieldstead
338 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:44:17
Barkley missed a sitter and Barry gives away a soft penalty, how games are decided. We were as good up to that point.

Complaints? Why didn’t Howard play? The fact we were already missing Jagielka from that defence was a strange choice indeed. The fact Deulofeu didn’t look interested when he came on suggests he genuinely does hope he is going back to Barcelona. I thought Barry and Pienaar were poor today. Hopefully a confidence-boosting performance against Cardiff.

Jim Bennings
339 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:53:45
Spot on Mark above.

Its not down to luck that we didnt score when Mirallas cut in during the first half or Lukaku ran clear through and should have passed or when Barkley should have at the very least hit the target.

It is down to POOR FINISHING AND POOR DECISION MAKING.

This is exactly why I said but got slated for saying it, we are not good enough to finish 4th.

We need too many chance to score even one goal.
When do you ever see us do what Newcastle did at Hull last week and win an away match 4-1??

Our goalscoring away from home is shockingly bad.

You just knew that when we kept missing chances just like previous away games that we would get punished and lets be fair, it was a penalty, Barry knew it and we knew it..Oxlade Chamberlain outstripped and Barry panicked and we were yet again made to pay.

Defeats now at Anfield, Spurs and Chelsea followed by this downer, all coming after a poor performance away at West Brom which set the ball rolling in January for the slump.

Do we even look like a team that has much left in the tank this season?

To me, we look like our race is well and truly run and we will do well to even see off Newcastle to finish 7th.

Alex Winstanley
340 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:56:34
The only thing Everton do consistently season in season out is break your heart! Different Manager, different playing style... Same old feeling!
Jamie Barlow
341 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:57:36
We’ll never win anything until Martinez and the team he takes charge of grow a pair of bollocks between them.

It’s a fucking joke when you drop your best goalkeeper for your second choice because it’s FAIR to give him a game. What about FAIR on the 5,000 Everton fans who paid a load of money to go and watch? Absolutely disgraceful decision from Martinez.

Also, why does it only seem like our soft, nice, lovable, everybody’s second favourite team put the ball out when another teams player (cheating Spanish twat) is on the floor obviously faking it. Far far too nice.

Al Reddish
342 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:54:25
I may be accused of knee-jerking here, but I have mentioned since Xmas Barry is not offering us much in terms of performance. If he is a defensive midfielder, how come the back four have little protection on counter attacks? He fell asleep for the Spurs goal. There was the penalty today and his stamina is about as great as Pienaar's and Osman's. Don't get me wrong, he started really well but if we are looking at paying someone £50k a week then I would rather it was someone more dynamic, or play Ross there. We don't always need two holding midfielders.

As for today, you start with your strongest team. Robles looks shit everytime I see him, and with Jags missing, we could have done with Howard's experience at the back. Del Boy, Mirallas, Barkley all seem too greedy and Pienaar should be jettisoned out of Goodison on one of those medieval catapults in the summer. McGeady looked decent when he came on and Baines is looking like getting back to his best.

The infuriating thing is when Martinez tells us we were fantastic today and unlucky. We were shit once we went a goal down and we are fucking clueless up front. These issues have been there all season and have not been addressed. The winter window was the usual shit out and once again we are suffering because of it. God knows what will happen when the loan players go back.... more fucking loans I suppose. Bunch of bastard bottlers.

Gary Mortimer
344 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:55:59
A few points:

Martinez obviously thought Robles would be a lucky FA Cup mascot after winning it with him in nets last year.

Gareth Barry at fault for their 2nd and 3rd goals. For some reason in the 3rd he takes a step to the right just when the balls goes to his left to the only unmarked man in the box!!!!

We cannot afford to miss important chances. We have done that in our last 3 away matches and ended up losing them all. I wonder if we actually do any shooting practice in training as we clearly need it.

If you look at the Live Forum you can see all the calls for substitutions, so when he makes them it all goes pear-shaped – Martinez can't win.

That doesn't explain the pathetic capitulation in the final 10 minutes. Deulofeu gave the ball away for the 4th and din't bother track back – disappointed in his lack of effort.

I hope Big Dunc gives them a proper seeing to in the dressing room, because after that, they bloody well need it!!!!

Graham Mockford
345 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:55:06
Roy Keane nailed it. If you play too open against the better sides they will find you out.

For the third time this season we've gone away and played too offensively and got turned over. City, RS and today.

I couldn't believe that when they were in possession Lukaku, Barkley and Mirallas never attempted to get goal side and close down. Add to that the two full backs pushed on and we are always liable to a counter attack.

It's all very well talking about attacking principles, sin miedo or whatever media friendly bollocks you want to wrap it up as but rigidly sticking to a philosophy to me shows a level of tactical naivety.

A classic is the decision to play Robles. Now the decision clearly didn't effect the outcome of the game. But it smacks of Roberto saying ' I play my reserve keeper in FA Cup ties, that's the way I do things'. But it was obvious too see he clearly is not as good a keeper as Tim. Why would you do that in the biggest game of the season?

I'm sure Roberto will be out accentuating the positive but I'm wondering what the fuck you could take away from that performance. Maybe the honeymoon isn't quite over but I think this might be the first major fucking argument.

Eddie Dunn
346 Posted 08/03/2014 at 14:56:50
Here we are again, no end product, and a centre forward starved of service, searching for the ball out on the wings.

Wenger worked us out. As Peter Reid said on ITV: "Everton rely on their attacking full backs for their goal threat". The Arsenal full backs pressed ours right back, and Coleman, in particular, could not cope.

Barkley needs too many touches, and the slow build-up does not suit him or Mirallas. Too many plodders: Barry, McCarthy, Pienaar....

4-4-2 with Naismith helping Lukaku would have been a better change, but Martinez never tries it.

Andy Merner
347 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:07:26
Utter lack of conviction in the final third. Sick to death of bottling the big games. Del Boy (can't spell it or be bothered to learn it) looked not interested.

Time to drink some Jack Daniels.

Jim Bennings
348 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:05:32
Al

I have been saying for God knows how long now that I don't know why on Earth we need two holding midfielders, especially in games at home to the likes of Cardiff but you can safely garauntee that it will be the same punchless goal shy formation next weekend at home to relegation fodder.

It has become a religious fantasy the 4-5-1 formation at Everton since they had that one successful season of 2004-05 but I have said for ages that there is no Cahill in this team.

We don't not have a reliable midfielder who can do what Cahill could do so well and that is arriving late. Our goal return from midfield is very poor nowadays and if you are playing 4-5-1 then you need at least one or two midfielders to chip in with 10 goals but nobody we have at present can do that.

Different manager but same old Everton with the same old steady but unspectacular I am afraid. Hard to beat (before recently but hopeless at scoring goals).

I hope eventually Martinez will be bold enough to try something a little bit different towards the end of the season now there is little other than the Europa League to play for, its hardly do or die is it?

Brian Harrison
349 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:03:26
I am afraid that we were second fiddle for most of the game, so we can have no complaints the better side won. Yes, the score did flatter them but they always looked as though they could create chances where we just don't carry the same threat. Lukaku was isolated for much of the game, as he is in most games, I think he and us would benefit from playing someone a lot closer to him.
Phil Walling
350 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:02:08
Today, with Rubles in goal, our tactics and profligate finishing made us look like Wigan. But, unfortunately, not the Wigan who battered us out of the Cup last season but the Wigan who got relegated after averaging over 60% possession in their Prem matches.

For all those who worship Martinez and his pretty, pretty, football, it is time to open your eyes and realise we are not a smidgeon better than we were halfway through the Moyes years.

Yet another dream turns into a nightmare. But hey! This is Everton.

Chris Butler
351 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:10:39
Yet another disappointing defeat in the capital, however it was predictable. Since January we've looked awful, the players just don't have any belief. We play good football, get near the opposition's goal and just piss about with it and lose the ball.

In my opinion, we miss Fellaini – somebody who unsettles defenders and scores from set pieces. He also played excellent at the Emirates last season completely controlled the midfielder by himself, which Barry and McCarthy failed to do.

My view is that the failure to bring in proper reinforcements in the January window has cost us; failing to bring in anybody has cost us.

Jim Bennings
353 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:17:34
I think the decision to go with Robles was even more crazy with John Stones being in the back four.

The lad needed experience behind him not a keeper who was lacking sharpness and just made things even more jittery on the whole.

Martinez got that call very wrong today just as he did at Anfield when picking Stones for right back ahead of Hibbert who would have handled the task there in that cauldron far better.

I am a fan of Martinez and give credit where and when its due but some big calls lately he has got badly wrong and they have backfired spectacularly.

Robert Elliott
354 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:12:15
Bottom line, we are just not good enough. Can blame the players all we want, with some justification in some cases, can blame the manager, with some justification in the case of preferring Robles over Howard, but we just don’t have the money to compete at the highest level.

Moyes tried, Martinez is trying, but unless you have the cash to be able to afford and then keep a squad containing some really top players, then you cannot win at places like the Emirates. Maybe you get lucky once in a blue moon, but when it really matters, when there’s something on the line, it just doesn’t happen.

Having said that, you should be able to at least expect players to make good decisions on the pitch. Barry’s decision to hang a leg out and give the opportunity for the Arsenal player to go down, therefore giving Clattenburg the chance to do what he’d wanted to do all afternoon, was ridiculous. And this is the bloke who apparently earns £120k a week! Lukaku trying to shoot when he could have played Barkley in was another poor decision which could have changed the game.

I didn’t expect to win today, I thought a draw and a replay under the lights at Goodison was the most we could expect, but to capitulate in the way we did was just not good enough.

Andrew Clare
355 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:16:59
We missed the boat twenty years ago and now we have a mountain to climb to catch up. It won't happen overnight; Roberto needs time. Better to lose 1-4 than play dire football and lose 0-1. The club really needs major investment to have any chance of challenging at the top.
Richard Reeves
356 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:06:48
I was expecting Robles to gift them some goals after the first half performance yet there was not much he could do to prevent them from going in. The only save that Howard might of been able to prevent was possibly the third as he is a good shot stopper at close range when there is little time to think and instinct takes over.

Pienaar and Mirallas need to pick out the right pass at the right time instead of holding onto the ball and playing it back into an area it came from. Pienaar does it in slow motion and Mirallas just the opposite looking like his feet are to fast for his mind.

I don't care who wins it now as long as it is not Arsenal; nothing against there supporters or that they beat us but more to do with their hypocritical, stubborn, bad loosing, whinging manager.

Tommy Coleman
357 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:27:44
Gutted. Individual mistakes costing us the game.

At least Phil Walling is happy.

Jim Bennings
358 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:22:30
You're right, Chris

It's about now when we are realising that Fellaini at times is a big miss in Everton's team. Forget how he is doing at United, he has been injured, he was made to fit at Everton.

We don't have any presence in the team; I cannot remember an Everton team scoring, or even actually winning so few header's all season.

We look absolutely no threat from corners, set pieces or high crosses and frankly it's now reduced the amount of goals we score because we do not score a variety of goals anymore do we? We don't score from a corner, a high cross, if its not along the ground or someone pulling out a world class free-kick then we just don't score full stop.

We miss Fellaini's 12 goals from last season despite the money we got for him because, in spite of having the money... 27 million pound cannot score you goals can it? It sits there in the bank and when we signed McCarthy we were getting a great defensive midfielder but we had lost the goals and unsettling nature that Fellaini brought to opponents.

The alarming thing again today was, despite the chances, how many times did we actually work Arsenal's keeper? They are all flimsy attempts or we take too long getting the ball away.

Very very frustrating and I think it's gone beyond knee jerk reactions now: we have to rectify this in summer otherwise we will be sitting here in 12 months having the same discussions.

Graham Mockford
359 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:28:50
Andrew #355

That's a bit if the Martinez mythology right there. I thought for the most part we were pretty dire today, and we lost 1-4.

I'm just failing to see this attacking expansive football that seems to be credited to Roberto's Everton. After all we had scored more goals at the same time last season.

Yair Kaye
360 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:26:04
Andrew ( #355) – You will never climb the boat with the current squad, nor with any other , as long as there is little or no investment by the club owners. Gone are the days when you could buy cheap and lead the pack.
Patrick Murphy
361 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:26:58
Andrew you are correct and now any Everton manager finds himself trying to push the boat up a mountain. I'd really like to know how Bill Kenwright feels after performances in big games like today.

Leadership starts at the top and we don't have any - happy to be mediocre, happy to put 35K bums on seats, happy to be the leader but without any leadership qualities. It will all catch up with the Club and perhaps sooner than we thought, our fans must be the most loyal in the country as at any other major club there would be no understanding of our financial plight there would have been a demand for change years ago and I can't see that changing in the near-future.

Everton have had far worse teams in its history but I can't remember a group of players who have failed to show up on so many big occasions - at times today it was like an old-fashioned end of season game with nothing at stake - I can't abide it when Everton's players don't show the same passion that the supporters do.

Amit Vithlani
362 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:05:38
Disastrous result and one to anger even the most die hard of fans. The last 20 minutes laid bare a complete lack of leadership and fight.

Chances were missed and goals conceded at crucial times. I can accept this as it is part and parcel. But to lack the fight and courage to overcome adversity is not acceptable.

We will continue to choke in big games unless this club develops a mentality of fight and courage. The last time we did, the dogs of war won us the cup.

Martinez also needs to drop the hyperbole. I admire the man's positive outlook but at some point you have to come out as a manager and say that the lack of guts in the last 20 minutes in particular were not acceptable in a big game.

Wayne Smyth
363 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:29:08
Why all the focus on Robles?

Did he contribute to any of the goals we conceded? Did he do something which prevented us from scoring?

He didn't play great, but he cost us nothing in terms of the result. Playing Howard would've made no difference.

The game was lost elsewhere on the pitch. Our entire defence was poor; going forward as well as defending. McCarthy and Barry, personally responsible for the 2 goals they scored which actually won them the game and their general play was poor.

Our forwards didn't take their chances either.

What I saw for a lot of the game was Arsenal players busting a gut to get the ball, break with the ball and help their teammates. Most of our players gave them too much room and spent the game strolling around.

To get a result at Arsenal you need to play your best. We didn't, so we get nothing.

Harold Matthews
364 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:11:39
We were matching them till the penalty. Robles was pretty awful, Stones was out of his depth, Mirallas was waste of space and Pienaar is beginning to look past it. Too many passes in the final third and too many missed chances. Forced to open up and chase the game against counter-attack specialists and paid the price.
Al Reddish
365 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:24:47
Jim, spot on re Hibbert and Robles. Seems we are on same wavelength.

The thing that annoyed me the most today was there was no closing down. Del Boy gives the ball away for the fourth and just puts his head down. For the third, Osman decides he can't be arsed to chase back after watching the opposition fly past him. These two had just come on and should have been busting a gut to get us back into the tie.

We were one game from Wembley for fucks sake. With so much at stake something can't be right behind the scenes somewhere to put in a performance like that in a quarter-final, and to let 4th place slip out of reach without so much as a whimper. Maybe it's because we have so many loan players with no real affection for the club. Maybe it's because they were expecting more of a productive transfer window?

I hate to say it but we need someone with the passion of that forehead challenged twat across the park. He wouldn't let his team mates heads drop as soon as they go a goal down with a semi-final place up for grabs. We allowed Arsenal all the time in the world when they had the ball, and for some reason our two fullbacks played on the edge of our 18 yard box, allowing Arsenal to cross at will. Also how many times did we have three-on-three on a break yet stop and let their defenders get back in position? Pathetic.

Paul Mackie
367 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:36:05
Trying my hardest not to knee jerk.

Once again we were just utterly toothless once we got the ball to the opposition penalty area.

Roger Helm
368 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:18:42
We played like we were on a par with Arsenal but – reality check –we're not. The only way to succeed at places like that is to get stuck in, work your bollocks off, and hope to get lucky. But we did hardly any pressing at all. For the first 30 minutes especially we were standing around admiring their passing.

When our defenders and CMs had the ball, on the other hand, they were under pressure immediately. And when we attacked, we just slowed right down and let them regroup. 13-0 the corner count was it?

We took none of our few chances apart from a tap-in. Do they even do any shooting practice? Today we got what we deserved – nowt. The season's over now, so we might as well let the youngsters have game time and see what they can do. The senior players look knackered.

David Pearl
369 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:33:11
I don't know where the anti-Barry and anti-McCarthy boys have come from. Barry left a lazy leg out and that was the turning point. We didn't move as a team today, especially the last ten minutes.

When Pienaar went off, it was crying out for Dela but RM's substitutions I thought were poor. Two changes meant we lost our shape... and McGeady isn't looking good enough.

We have to pick ourselves up and make sure we get European football next season. Interesting summer ahead... how much with Roberto be given to strengthen...

Paul Tran
370 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:31:13
Can we stop all this Wigan bollocks? A cheap gibe that detracts from the real issues.

In the final third we lack pace, guile, good decision-making and conviction. We look as though we don't really believe we are going to score.

Once again against a top side, we held our own without looking spectacular, we missed chances, we made mistakes, we got picked off.

We did the easy bit earlier in the season, creating a team shape and being hard to beat. I was expecting some improvement in the final third and it hasn't come.

As I've said previously, Martinez's success will depend on whether he can instil some pace, guile and conviction in the final third.

For me, I'd like to see him ditch one defensive central midfielder and put Naismith up with Lukaku. Fill the midfield with anyone who gets the ball and looks and moves forward with purpose. Nothing to lose now as I'm indifferent to the Europa League. I think it's all about trying things with an eye on next season.

Colin Malone
371 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:21:43
Once again, it's all about money: Arsenals midfield/attack, £100 million plus. Everton's midfield/attack, £20 million plus.

Very frustrating but lets not blame the last 20 years on the present management team.

Dave Williams
372 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:18:17
Can’t argue with hardly anyone posting here. Robles was shaky as we all feared though Tim would probably not have stopped any of those goals.

Jim B and the others are spot on — we do not need two defensive midfielders and Roberto needs to decide if McCarthy is a DM or the box to box player we were told he was when he signed. I really like him but pairing him with Barry is not right for the team. I’d prefer to see him as the only DM with Ross alongside leaving a space for a more natural attacker as Ross in my opinion is an attacking midfielder and not someone to play off a lone striker.

If you look at our squad we have too many players who are over 30 and our slow style of play will remain whilst the players are old. Barry should not be signed and I have said this for months – good player but too old and too expensive in terms of wages. Pienaar has taken unfair stick this season but he is certainly not the player of two seasons ago and he needs replacing. Stones is in place at CB so unless Duffy or Browning can step up we need a young CB who is good with the ball but who will also attack the ball when it comes in the box.

Alcaraz wasn’t even on the bench again today and it would not surprise me if he quit the game – something is clearly amiss there which is a great shame but at his age he is not all of a sudden going to recover. Mirallas scuffs his shots more than anyone I can recall and really does flatter to deceive.

Tactically we seemed to give them too much space in our half just as we did against the RS. We all know how dangerous they are when two or three of them run at you as a group and this is what undid us today. We may not have played badly but our current team is too old, set up in a way that denies us a second potential scorer and with two DMs lacks the creativity in the middle to give us an option when the full backs are squeezed.

Very disappointing but I guess it shows that Roberto is not a miracle man and whilst he has done well with what he has had available to him, he has to have a plan B... and to have that he has to change the personnel.

Wayne Smyth
373 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:41:19
David, I'm not anti-Barry or anti-McCarthy. I've given them plenty of praise this season. Still, they were at fault for both goals we conceded early on and I don't think either of them played well in general.

Mark Pierpoint
375 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:39:37
Agree with Rob Elliot on this (354); without money to buy the finished product you will always go into this sort of game an underdog. If you look around the team, we have some good potential, but players who can be out-thought by the opposition or themselves.

Coleman: Out of the game today. Pressed continuously by Arsenal players and currently does not have the answers.

Barkley — Shows some brilliance but is guilty still of making the wrong decisions. He should have put his foot through his chance and not tried a goal of the month contender. Still has to realise that in PL games you don't have the luxury of the extra touch that he may have got at Sheff Wed or in U21 games.

Deulofeu — Poor decisions constantly in his ten minutes. Lead to 4th goal. Will not get in the Barcelona team next year for me.

Lukaku — Had two opportunities to play teammates into goal scoring opportunities but took it himself.

McCarthy — I thought this was one of his most ineffective games.

All of the players are capable of brilliance, but when you are against the higher quality teams (don't think Arsenal can be described as a top team) away from home you will be found out.

Added to the naïvety probably has to be Martinez. Don't like the changing of the 'keeper, sends the wrong message. lacked a bit of bite. All-in-all, too nice.

Al Reddish
376 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:46:33
It's games like this where we really do miss Gibson controlling the midfield. He would have been at Arteta every time he touched the ball and his range of passing would have opened their defence up.

A lot of people are saying Howard wouldn't have stopped anymore than Robles did. Some truth in that, however, with his experience the opposition probably wouldn't have had some of the chances they had and, once Robles started flapping, you could sense the Arsenal attackers growing in confidence whereas our defenders were losing their shape, worrying about how to offer him more protection.

Kunal Desai
377 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:44:08
The season is now OVER. Likelihood is we'll get something around 14-15 points from the remainder of the season finishing 7th maybe even 8th. Focus will soon switch to the summer and the board, you've seen it over the last 15 years and you will see it again. A measly 10-12m in funds provided to RM and 1 or 2 players sold.

Expect 2 permanent signing and 2-3 loans... it will be the same next season until this board and Kenwright fuck off for good. EFC will always be the nearly men whether you like it or not. The honeymoon period is certainly over, the scrutiny really has to come back on BK.

Sean Patton
379 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:49:54
Everton – the most tedious club in the world. Same old result... same old season of failure, year-in and year-out; despite new players and a new manager nothing ever changes.

Why was Martinez waiting for the scoreline to change before bringing on Deulofeu? He was ready at 2-1 but he goes all Moyes and waits until it's 3-1 to bring him on. The only good thing that came from that was the fact that the odious little twerp Arteta didn't have the satisfaction of scoring the winner.

Andy Walker
381 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:53:31
I am totally sick of watching the same tactical errors week after week by our manager. Way too open yet again, the man must be deluded if he thinks he can take on the best teams at their own game. Three at the back away to Arsenal, fuck me, oh and wait that included a 20-year old with a few games under his belt at CB as one of them.

Arsenal looked like scoring every time they attacked thanks to our casino manager rolling the dice once more, maybe he thought his luck would be in after the RedShite, Chelsea and Spurs. Sorry, Roberto, it doesn't work like that lad. He ought to learn to 'cash out' when we still have something in the bank. 1-1 with half an hour to go should have been time to shut up shop and take them back to Goodison.

We need some smart thinking and dare I say it, pragmatism with a game plan that realistically gives a chance of getting a positive result against the top teams. Going out each game with the an attacking attitude may get the plaudits (just like Wigan used to) but it gets us fucking nowhere.

Roger Helm
382 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:54:47
It's all down to money. We may have a big history but our present income/turnover is medium-size. We are competing with Sunderland, Villa, Norwich, Newcastle and the like. The clubs above us have incomes and wages bills 2,3, or 4 times bigger than us. The opening goal today was scored by a £30 million player. Apart from the odd success like at OT, we can't compete with them over a season. This will never change with BK here.
Mike Price
384 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:02:49
I like Martinez but as many have said he's fucked up a few big decisions lately.

Our season fell apart after our 'warm weather training' which was a disaster and failed miserably.

We're too nice, players and management have to fight fire with fire or nothing will change and I think a lot of us are getting sick of it.

Steve Guy
385 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:07:51
I think we are just too "nice". I'm not suggesting we do a Stoke but I think a mixture of the football we play and aspire too plus a dose of "in you face" could have won this today.

The "injury" to Arteta was a classic example. We played on, but then gave in to crowd and peer pressure. The rules are clear, if its a head injury you quite rightly stop play but a player rolling around doesn't count. I'm not saying we would have scored but we might. More importantly it's team mentality.....we showed them far too much respect.

The team reflect the manager who is clearly a great bloke and also "nice". I'm not sure he has the killer touch frankly.

Colin Grierson
386 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:55:46
The tempo of our attacking play is depressingly slow and is too easy to defend against. We only ever look like scoring when the oppositions attack breaks down and we counter quickly. That's where our goal came from.

Earlier in the season we were breaking with some pace down the flanks and looked like the real deal. I don't know what changed around the Christmas period but we have looked like a different team.

I can't knock the selection today as we were in the game up until the pen, apart from Robles. How the fuck can he be getting paid any fucking money for keeping goal is beyond me. The Gooners were fucking laughing at him the clown that he is. Get him the fuck off the wage bill FFS.

Pienaar, for me, was poor today. Mirallas was wasteful in possession and showed no real threat. Lukaku on the wing is baffling. Stones looked lost at times. Distin was Distin, solid and dependable, McCarthy all heart. Barry, apart from the ridiculous challenge for the pen, was okay. Baines was hesitant going forward as was Coleman. Barkley looked better than his last few performances but still not what he was last time we played at the Emirates.

The substitutions were made too late, especially Delboy. The most embarrassing part of the day for me was RM questioning the pen. I've never seen a more blatant pen in me life Bobby lad. I'm a fan of RM and his style of football but he got it wrong in some ways today. Let's hope he learns from it and we end the season well at least.

Once a blue always a blue!

Mike Oates
388 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:00:28
We are at our best when we pressurise teams and get camped in their half. We then use the guile and combination of the Bainaar link and the speed of Coleman on the other side. We very rarely except today score from fast breakaways, our final ball is poor our final decision making poor and basically Lukaku, Mirallas, Deulofeu and Barkley all to greedy.

Our problem is that we aren't good enough to dominate the better teams and when we do they know exactly how to stop our wide threat.

We don't have that £25-30m forward who can score from nothing, the Suarez, Sturridge, Aquero, Negredo, Rooney, van Persie, Giroud, etc etc.

The thing which is irking me more now though is Martinez's completely over the top praise's even when we are turned over. If I hear that the likes of Barkley, Lukaku, Deulofeu, Stones, McGeady are phenomenal, world class etc from Martinez again, I'll go ballistic.

Ray Roche
390 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:06:36
Utterly depressing but at the same time expected. We cannot compete with the more wealthy clubs. They want a player, they buy that player while we go cap in hand to loan someone. Not good enough and we never will be while Boys Pen Billy keeps hold of his train set. And please don't anyone come on here pointing their grubby little fingers at Vincent Tan or Carson Yeung, gobshite Billy apparently had the chance when City's owners showed interest and also the KD fiasco but predictably cocked up.

As for the game, we were nowhere near the team that played Arsenal off their own park last year, but they have learned from that and we haven't. We are looking more like a Moyes set-up than ever in regards of late substitutions. Players need time to make a mark and 10 minutes is not long enough. Mirallas looks like a player who wants a move to a "bigger" or London club with us as the stepping stone to such a move. He should have been hooked long before he was if Martinez thought McGeady was going to make a difference, same with Delboy.

Poor team selection, OK, Robles may not have been directly at fault for the goals but the defence didn't appear to have much confidence in him and his distribution is woeful. Even worse than Howard's. Totally pissed off.

Jim Hillier
393 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:08:32
A lot of understandable over reaction here. I thought it was over when they scored on 7 mins, but the lads fought back and deserved to be level going in at half time. If Ross had taken that chance (big if) might have been different, but can't argue against Arsenal deserving it.

For me, Phase 1 of the Martinez restructuring is over. We were doing better than any of us thought would be possible up to Christmas, and since then the size of the squad, injuries, the age of the squad, and the simple lack of quality has led to us being found wanting.

New blood needed.

You can blame Robles for that, you can blame Martinez. You can blame Barry. You can blame Ross as well. I don't care, to be honest. I blame the lack of money.

Andy Walker
394 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:21:50
Ray, your comment regarding not pointing grubby fingers at actual real life examples of the consequences of allowing the wrong buyer to take control of our club is unbelievable. This is the number one risk our club currently faces. Get it wrong and we could be sunk forever. Thank fuck the owners of our club havent got the same casual attitude to the risk.
Andy Walker
396 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:30:03
Jim, how much does it cost to play 4 at the back? Can't we afford it?
Mike Gwyer
397 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:44:30

Dave Williams. Spot on mate and spoken like a blue.

Robles?? Sticking him between the sticks, what the fuck was that about? Both Distin and Stones were shitting themselves every time the Arse put the ball into our box - which is so unlike Distin. Do these players not have a say when RM decides to make a "luck wins the FA cup" decision and stick with his 2nd best keeper??

Barry will not be with the blues next season, his agenda was to get noticed and other top EPL teams have done just that, the Arse being one of them. Hopefully RM will realise that loan deals are short term answers - Barry, Del boy & Lukaku have all used this great club to advertise that they are available, yet it would seem that Everton are not in a position to offer any one of these players a full time contract. Del boy today was almost pleading for next plane back to Barcelona.

Lastly, lets hand it to the 5000 blues who matched the Arse fans for over 90 minutes with their singing and chanting - Everton are never let down by their supporters. Never.

Darryl Ritchie
398 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:24:31
Arsenal have figured it out. The RS have figured it out.

If you sit back and counterattack when the opportunity arises, you can beat us easily. RM's style of possession football is useless until he finds a solution to this strategy.

Dean Adams
401 Posted 08/03/2014 at 15:59:14
Seriously Kunal, 14 - 15 points from the remaining fixtures? I know it was a bad result but that is being ultra pessimistic surely. We can still finnish strongly, we have some very winnable games and the whole squad must be close to fitness for the remaining fixtures (Kone, Oviedo and Gibson not withstanding). I expect us to get 20 -25 points and push for 4th/5th.
Steve Guy
402 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:27:15
Jim, if you blame lack of money then that's the Dear Leader's fault. No doubt in my mind and a win today would have had his smug grin in front of the cameras quicker than you can say "Kings Dock". Am I right in suggesting we are the only premiership Club to not have changed hands in the last ten years ? Either way incredible he is still in charge given the money about and around the EPL.

However, we have shown this season that we can play ffotball and win against the "best" teams but our second half performance today was insipid and lacked the bite to impose on an Arsenal defence that lacks confidence. That's not lack of money, that's lack of cojones.

Linda Morrison
403 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:21:00
I was in 2 minds about going on the site today as I knew what the reaction would be.
I did not see the game but had the radio on Five Live.

I think it was a different game to the one discussed above by most posts..

Barry made a mistake to give the penalty away but the radio commentary stated he had spent a lot of the game acting like a defender. I didn't realise Stones was playing for the first half hour ditto for Baines as I never heard their names mentioned.

The team were too edgy by half. Roberto needs to stop being fair to players-Robies-and Howard should have played. He would have given Stones and Disitn more confidence.

It was a close game up until the third goal went in and then it was all over, heads dropped.

Ozil was the difference today, he is a class player and for once he put a shift in.

Supporters need to accept we can not compete with the big boys we do not have the finances.

We are all low but there is still much to play for and let us see what next season brings.Some feel the board will back the manager with dosh, others do not.This is our team ,we need to support them. I for one will cheer them on to the pitch next week. I know they get lots of dosh but they will be hurting as well. At least we are not QPR, Cardiff or all the other teams terrified of dropping out of the ELP.

As for the loan signings, with the exception of Barry, I think the sooner they go the better. There is no commitment at all to the club it shows in their play since Xmas.

I think that it has been a big mistake to talk of Top 4, Europe etc, it puts too much pressure on the players and they always lose games when that happens. The same thing happened under Moyes

Ray Roche
406 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:30:26
No, Andy, I think you are missing my point. Whenever there is any criticism of Kenwright and his failure to find a buyer we get the usual and puerile comments regarding the two people I mentioned as well as the "Be careful what you wish for" mantra. Of course I wouldn't want us under the control of Tan or Yeung but Kenwright has yet to do anything but look for investment. Or claims to be looking for investment.

No-one will invest in Everton, even the Grantchester family are reported, on this very website in previous threads, to be refusing to invest while Kenwright and his friends are in charge. The same Grantchester family who said that we will "never be allowed" to get into the relegation battle that we endured in the 1990's in an interview I heard myself on Radio Merseyside but clearly aren't going to get involved till Kenwright has left. And I don't think City fans are worrying about their "casual attitude to risk", do you? .

If you are happy with Kenwright and his running of the club, fine, you carry on enjoying our club scratching about in the loan market and being royally stuffed when we meet a big club at their ground. Days like today must really do it for you. I would rather see your mate Kenwright bugger off back to London and his luvvie mates.

Everton are not for sale.

Wayne Smyth
411 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:42:14
Darryl, you may as well have posted:

"Arsenal have figured it out. The RS have figured it out.

If you spend hundreds of millions of pounds more than another team, then counter attack when the opportunity arises, you can beat them easily."

On another day, McCarthy may not have given the ball away in midfield so easily, and Barry may not have conceded a soft pen and we could've come away with a result. As it was they did and we lost because of it.

Asking a manager to come up with a strategy to beat a team with 1 hand tied behind his back(i.e. with a fraction of their resources) is kinda harsh. Teams with our financial clout generally don't go to anfield or the emirates and come away with a result.

I for one am glad we are aiming to go to these places and play football and look for a win. Doesn't happen often, but will happen more often than if we go there and circle the wagons and talk about knives and gunfights.

This season we got a point at the Emirates and 3 at OT, because we went there and gave it a go.

Eugene Ruane
413 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:25:59
Arsenal - better control, better movement, better finishing, more brains.

Why?

More money.

You can vent all you want (nb: and if it works for you, go for it) or you can accept that while occasionally we'll get a result against a 'big' side, we simply don't have the money to buy the quality of players that would allow us to CONSISTENTLY compete with those who do.

All you need to do is ask yourself, would the sides with big money spend it if there wasn't a fantastically increased chance of success.

No.

Of course I'm gutted, but while the bums who 'run' Everton remain in place (and the gullible continue to applaud their uselessness) nothing (that's FUCKING NOTHING!) will change anytime soon.

Tip, get used to it.

James Royston
414 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:31:54
Saw my first game in 1947 in that time I have never seem a goalkeeper who seemed unable to catch a crossed ball. He may not have been to blame for the goals though he rode his luck on other occasions and certainly did not give defenders any confidence. I agree with lots of the comments re:

1) Too many loan players.
2) Forward play far too slow, never using what little pace is in the team.
3) Too many older players who are past their best and tire and seem to give up far to easy.
4) We do not appear to have a leader on the pitch to give the rest a kick up the backside when things go wrong. Who would it be ???????

I have deliberately not gone into names as we all have our critical opinions many of them very obvious. We may have a decent squad but not a trophy winning squad, at best just above mid-table which I believe is our finishing point this season. We are certainly NOT anywhere near good enough for any European competition.

My theory now play any youngsters (in particular strikers) who may be on the fringes and at the end of this season have a clear out of the older players. With the "transition over lets try something different.....

Mike Oates
415 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:44:45
Martinez said before the game that he would attack, it would be an open game. That's fine if you are 100% on your game, fine unless you lose the ball constantly as Mirallas, Lukaku and Deulofeu did, and when they did inevitably Baines, Coleman are to far forward and hey presto Roberto has got his open game - namely our defence.

Arsenal's 1st, 2nd, and 4th all came about as our full backs where way upfield and we lost the ball in Arsenal's half and 10 second's later 2 goals and a penalty. We had 2 similar chances and our greed buggars it up. Its all about quality players vs average players. We have the average players.

The only optimistic note is that Rodgers had same problem last year, great possession stats but losing games, but he turned them round this year to the best counter attacking team in league. Can Roberto do it, will he want to do it, have we got a Suarez, Sterling, Sturridge - NO , enough said back to possession as a way forward.

Karan Oza
416 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:45:59
Two very bad mistakes today ensured that Everton go another year without a trophy. I’m not a fan that changes my opinion of any player or the team when things start to go sour. As I said before, I didn’t trust Martinez at first, but he won me over in the beginning of the season, and I am not about to change my opinion of him now,

McCarthy, whom I have never really supported (a bit expensive for my taste for a player of that caliber) looked like total crap. His slip gave away the first goal and he barely looked like he was in the game throughout.

Osman is a little shit who can go die in a hole somewhere. Every time he steps on the pitch, the whole team looks like shit, because he smears his shit on the rest of the team. I don’t know why in the world we extended his contract last season, but that’s in the past.

The Robles choice was a bit confusing and he didn’t look all that good in goal to me. If he’s supposed to be Howard’s long term replacement, I’m worried.

Overall a very poor performance for a team that I think could and should have won this game. I know Everton will bounce back though, and we’ll string some wins together. At this point I’m hoping for either 4th or 6th place. I hate the Europa League. The fact that games are played on Thursday really messes with the fatigue levels of a team and I’d rather avoid that competition all together.

Either way, we won’t be better or worse of this year than last year and I’m seriously hoping we spend some money to build the kind of team RM wants and hopefully really push or either Champions League or FA Ccup next year.

Dan Brierley
417 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:30:56
Ray, what a load of rubbish. Why the need to make up things to suit your argument? Mansour rejected by Kenwright? What nonsense.

Today we were beaten mainly because a lack of enthusiasm or desire, the players didn't look interest for the first half hour. After we scored, we got back into the game a bit more but it was clear that we were too slow in getting the ball forward. This is not about money, its about motivation and playing to the teams strengths. We need to mix up the play, sometimes try and pass through but at other times go more direct. RM needs to be more brave on his decision making, 2-1 down and we still keep 2 defensive midfielders. He has to learn from this, instead of maintaining this arrogant 'my system is perfect' attitude.

Next season is going to be much more tough, United will be back in the mix and I expect Spurs and Liverpool will spend again. RM would have been better finding the next Arteta than forking out over 20 million for McCarthy and Kone.

Andy Walker
418 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:42:07
Bear in mind to compete on a money basis will mean we'd need as much a City and Chelsea, so a billionaire rather than a multi millionaire would be needed.
Not many exist on the planet let alone ones that want to invest in a football club that will ultimately loose them money, unless it's part of a bigger strategic vision.
Sheikh Mansour invested in City because of the association with the known brand of Manchester United, it instantly gave the high profile to the name of the club ie 'Manchester' City and instantly generated massive publicity because of the impact it would have on United. It was done as part of an investment portfolio that is designed to market a country ie Abu Dhabi, to the world, so it's a much bigger strategic vision by Mansour who's also the deputy PM of Abu Dhabi. So this money is clean and to all intense and purpose limitless.
Exactly what does the profile of the future buyer of Everton need to look like ie

Value of liquid assets
Amount they are prepared to invest in the club
How have assets been accumulated ie are they legit?
What's the motive of the person?
Do they understand and will they respect the traditions of our club?
Have they any history of acquiring and investing in other sports clubs/franchises ie they have a track record of commitment in sport.

Roger Helm
420 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:51:47
Well said Linda, whatever the here-today, gone-tomorrow managers and players do or don't do, we the supporters are the club, the heart and soul of Everton, and have been since 1878, and whether we are in the Champions League or the Championship (God forbid) we will go on cheering for the lads in Royal Blue.
Brian Denton
422 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:57:36
Good post Eugene. Either the structure of the Premier League changes or our billionaire comes. That's it, no other chance. The League will never again be won by a provincial club with a talented manager and a good crop of youngsters coming to maturity. Bosman has seen to that, and the Premier League's Law of Capital Accumulation. Even something like allowing so many fucking subs - all has contributed to the position we are in now, where there is a cartel, and we ain't in it.
Ray Roche
425 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:59:53
Dan Brierley, I didn't say or mean that Kenwright rejected Mansour, I am saying that Everton are not for sale. Kenwright wants someone to "invest", not purchase. He has said so himself. He ALWAYS talks about investment and has never given a valuation of Everton when asked for one to my knowledge.
And I'M not in the habit of making things up to suit my argument. Are you?

The rest of your post is pretty much bang on the money though, especially the Kone part. McCarthy will eventually be a good buy, though, I think.

Kunal Desai
426 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:57:55
Dean Adam - Seriously mate, please take off those blue tinted specs, there is absolutely no way we'll be breaking our points total (65) this season. The start to 2014 has been nothing short of mediocre in terms of our league form and we have mustered 4 away wins from home all season, the last coming at Swansea in December. We will NOT attain anywhere near to 25 points from the remaining games. Please a bit perspective needed here.
Jim Bennings
430 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:02:57
Today had nothing to do with money.

Arsenal were missing Ramsey, Wilshere, Walcott and had no Podolski or Giroud starting.

We had the much lauded next 40 million pound player Ross Barkley (yeah right!) and the so-called best left back in England that everyone wants to sign plus big hitters like Lukaku and various other experienced players.

To say today was about money is foolish..

Today was the same as West Brom away, Spurs away and so on and so on... Inability to have supposedly big athletic men hit the ball with any pace or power or accuracy when the chances came along.

Andrew Clare
432 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:01:12
Everton are a big big club with fantastic support. I just wonder how much longer we can keep it that way with season after season of disappointment.

We can’t blame Roberto. As everyone knows it is the board that have let us down. It is time for them to go!

I cannot believe that there isn’t anyone out there who can’t see the massive potential in Everton FC. The 4th most successful club in English football, great support and an illustrious history please someone save us from BK and his cronies please!.

Dan Brierley
433 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:05:33
What is funny, is that there were people saying last season that its Moyes tactics and negative attitude that was holding us back. Many countered that Moyes couldn’t do more due to a lack of finances, but this was dismissed at the time.

Fast forward 12 months with the most positive manager in human history, and the exact same people are waving the financial card to defend the manager.

Andy Walker
434 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:00:25
Ray you must be deluded if you think there is a queue of billionaires wanting to buy our club but being prevented from doing so by BK.

Not only a queue, but a very patient one that isn’t interested in buying say Man U, Spurs, Liverpool all of which could be bought if the right bid was put on the table to their owners who are only in it for the money.

Let’s face it if a billionaire wants to buy us they will and they will pay what it takes, but the very obvious reality is their isn’t any one who wants to. Why would you now that Mansour and Abramovich will be your competitors, no matter how much money you invest you still wouldn’t be able to guarantee success.

Sadly the reality is that unless a lifelong Everton fan who happens to be a billionaire rides over the hill, it ain’t going to happen and spouting the same drivel week after week that it’s BK blocking the path is just showing how naive you must be.

Andrew Clare
435 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:14:13
Dan at 433. Are you suggesting that we should get rid of the manager?
Mike Oates
440 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:07:14
We are not a good prospect to buy at all, not even by a billionaire. We have zero brand pull, (City had some just by having the name Manchester in their title - immediate comparison with Utd) , most of the world doesn’t know who we are, where were from. We have no presence in the Premiership or Champions League, never even won them, and never ever got in CL group stages.

Liverpool football club has massive pull, successful in Europe over the years, massive world wide fan base, is from that famous City (half the world haven’t got a clue Everton are from Liverpool - believe me I’ve worked in N & S America, Europe, Asia Pacific, Australia etc in last 20 years).

Anyone buying us will need £200m for a new ground, £100m for first batch of new players etc etc.

The only chance we have of being great again is by getting 4th place, getting into the Champions League Group stage and doing reasonably well - AND do it again the year after. It needs a miracle.

As Terry Leahy said last week, we need a new ground and what we cant do anything about at moment is that our brand is swamped by Liverpool FC. So lay off Kenwright or you might get a dodby new owner like the bunch out there at the minute - would you want Everton to play in RED !!!!

Drew O'Neall
441 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:13:40
Some serious phsychological frailties exposed away from home again today.

Coleman was inconspicuous, Pienaar appears distracted and Mirallas too regularly diffused counter attacking promise by passing balls out of the opponent’s penalty area to a fullback.

The best form of defence is attack, show a bit of bollocks please lads.

Dan Brierley
442 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:23:47
Of course not Andrew, just highlighting how fickle we can be at times.
Christopher Kelly
447 Posted 08/03/2014 at 16:50:41
10 years on and the same posts about the same dead-ass owner. 5 years ago we had poorly stitched together protests but those quickly petered out. Kenwright has remained... Why has the pressure stopped on Kenwright? I for one feel robbed of 12+ years of exciting football. We haven’t had a god damn sniff! Not one trophy not one substantial title chase. Again, until there is a salary cap and/or a tournament/playoff for the Premiership, Everton will never ever win the Premiership again under these circumstances. I bet my house on it.

Of course Everton aren’t for sale. Never really have been. I’m just shocked that the wire goes cold barring games like today. People will moan and all but In three weeks time we’ll go quiet again and Kenwright will be just fine again. Why would he sell? He loves the fact that he owns a club ( who wouldn’t?) and no one is buying this club for £150m.. It’s the fact that we’ve bought this charlatans horseshit for so long that really amuses me about this lot of fans! How dumb can we all be? How much can we endure before things change? Aren’t you all bored? I am. bored to death of it all tbh.

When we are being outspent by clubs half our size, the real focus shouldn’t be on how bad Pienaar was today (just shocking really!!) but on putting together a successful campaign to get the Board out. If we can’t get them out, I guarantee we’ll all be here in 10 more years having the same conversation. Now how about THAT for depressing?

Lyndon Lloyd
448 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:27:42
Of course today had to do with money. Wenger was able to bring on a player in Giroud who has now scored 18 goals this season and a top class, experienced midfielder in the form of Rosicky off the bench to kill the game.

We brought on a 19-year-old kid from Barcelona who is still learning who and when to take on with the ball, a free transfer acquisition from Russia with limited Premier League experience, and a 32-year-old who has no pace to chase it.

Eugene Ruane
450 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:29:04
Dan Brierley - "This is not about money, its about motivation and playing to the teams strengths"

That’s..it?

Really!?

You need to tell this to Man City and Chelsea (Spurs.. Liverpool.. Man Utd..) right away!

They’re all stupidly spending millions on top players when all they have to do is motivate the team and play to the teams strengths.

(Maybe they’ll give you a cut!)

Andy Walker
451 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:32:22
Money is the excuse to deflect from the real problems over the past few weeks and that is the bad tactics of a gambler.
Andy Walker
456 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:39:12
Quite ironic that the fans that are using the excuse of lack of money to try to cover up the inadequacies of our manager. I have a very different opinion to this manager who joined our club knowing he wasn’t going to have lots of money to spend but still believed we should be able to compete.
Dick Brady
457 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:41:14
Roberto’s big mistakes have been in the transfer market.

Kone –Rubbish,

Alcaraz – Rubbish,

Robles – Rubbish,

McGeady – Rubbish,

Traore – Rubbish.

He’s done well with a few loans (Lukaku, Barry, Deulofeu) but really McCarthy is the only permanent transfer who I can honestly say has improved the squad.

Andy Walker
460 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:46:10
Aye Dick, and he bought so well at Wigan, oh wait a mo......
Dan Brierley
461 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:39:13
Make all the excuses you want Eugene, but today we looked disinterested and disorganised for large parts of the game. You can have a billion pound squad, if you don’t play the right balance from the start and substitute the right players at the right times you won’t be successful. The last time we went to the Emirates we easily matched Arsenal, and the main difference between the two games was attitude and enthusiasm.
Colin Grierson
462 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:19:11
Eugene – spot on!

It’s not going to change in the foreseeable so we have to get on with being pissed off with it and being disappointed.

UNLESS... A billionaire with knowledge of football and respect for the heritage of a club and the views of its fans will come along and all will be rosy

Or... Boys Pen Bill will keep smiling at the media and pleading poverty and shrugging his shoulders and things will remain the same.

Or... some dodgy businessman will try to impress his mates in their shiny suits while pissing everyone off. We will become the Everton (add trade name here) playing at the (Tesco?) stadium and changing manager every 4-6 months while getting buzzed off by all and sundry especially those cunts across the park.

I’ve enjoyed this season for the most part and believe we are heading in the right direction. The thing is RM is not a miracle worker. I think he is a good manager and he positively spins everything for his own reasons. That’s fine by me but when we are shite we are still shite regardless what RM says but I’m glad he tries to look on the bright side. It’s better than the dour one’s after match bollocks.

Realistically at the beginning of the season I hoped for a cup run. They were better than us today in the end but not by that much... just £80m or so.

Dick Brady
467 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:52:55
Last season we went out of the League Cup early, had great possession but struggled to score goals to beat teams, went out of the FA Cup at the quarter final stage and finished 6th in the Premier League.

This season we went out of the League Cup early, have had great possession but struggled to score goals to beat teams, have gone out of the FA Cup at the quarter final stage and look likely to finish 6th at best.

As far as I can tell there’s not been a great deal of difference between David Moyes and Roberto Martinez. The facts seem to suggest that an FA Cup quarter final and finishing 6th is the best these players are capable of doing.

Certainly two top managers have tried and they both have produced the same results.

Mark Dunford
468 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:23:40
I’m sorry but today had everything to do with money (Jim #430). Ozil cost more than the entire Everton squad and the depth of quality on their bench showed that – even with an injury list – there was scope to leave out Rosicky. We replaced Jags with a promising rookie.

There is no escaping the truth that we are still the best of the rest, so in this respect we haven’t really moved on this season, yet this is a positive too after the change in manager. In many ways, we have progressed.

The football is different - McCarthy is a great player, preferable in my view to Fellaini and a future captain (assuming we hold on to him), Coleman has come on tremendously and the loan signings have all contributed well. Stones looks like he could be a great player. Joel is a better prospect than Mucha but he has to build on his strengths as as a shot stopper if he is going to make it – and I would say he has improved since I first saw his nervy debut at Fulham.

On the downside, Kone has added nothing due to injury so he has a lot to prove when he returns and the loan signings may (or may not) be here next year.

The postings at the start of this thread which just about blame the players for everything from the extinction of the dinosaurs through the black death to the holocaust are clearly (hopefully) written as emotional responses to a harshly unfair defeat. Watching from the stands, it seemed that some heads dropped after the third goal really badly but then rallied again when the fourth went in – there seemed to be a determination not to let in a humiliating fifth goal.

It is worth noting that we conceded similar second-half goals at Chelski and Spurs. In each case, we seemed to run out of steam as the opposition threw on multi million pound players. We put on Osman who played well with some thoughtful contributions but McGeady and the Boy Wonder didn’t offer too much today. No defensive midfielder on the bench and I thought Oviedo would have been useful today to play in front of Baines but he was obviously missing. Arsenal were dangerous down the right for the entire game – no surprise that the penalty came from that direction. We still have a small squad.

I think it is also worth acknowledging the way Distin went to recognise the support at the end. Also, Barkley had his best game since the injury.

Now we need to beat some of the struggling teams we play in the next few weeks. We lost this one. It was crap. Get over it and move on to the next game.

Andy Walker
469 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:51:19
Quite clearly if we go on the pitch against a side with more money than us then we should loose, is that right? Sorry I don’t accept this defeatist attitude, the one thing I agree with Martinez is that we should be challenging for top 4, but it means being smarter in how we acquire players (ie, loans) and having our game plan spot on; the latter has been very much lacking in recent weeks.

Money is a lazy excuse being used in denial of reality, which is bad tactics which cost nothing to put right.

Andy Walker
473 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:59:48
So Mark, why wasn’t it about money when we played Arsenal in the league?
Ray Roche
476 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:01:54
Andy Walker @ 434

I am neither deluded nor naïve. Of course I don’t imagine a queue of billionaires banging on Kenwright’s door, but I refuse to believe that there have been no opportunities for Kenwright to relinquish control in the 15 years he has had hold of the reins, a period which has seen the Fortress Sports Fund, the Kings Dock and Destination Kirkby fiascoes. You carry on waving Bill’s flag for him, you carry on applauding every time his grid comes on the big screen, you carry on in your deluded little world viewed through your blue Bill-tinted specs. I’ll carry on seeing him for the charlatan that he is.

Realising that having more money can make you a better team is reality. Bad tactics are one thing, but Eugene makes the point well enough, as do other posts, that when you can bring on better players you can indeed change the game. Martinez does get things wrong, they all do, but it’s money that ultimately makes the difference as much as good tactics. Next year Utd, under Moyes, will be a more fearsome side than they are now. Because he’ll have millions to spend on better players. Even Moyes can do it.

Eugene Ruane
477 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:09:43
Dan Brierley - "Make all the excuses you want Eugene, but today we looked disinterested and disorganised for large parts of the game. You can have a billion pound squad, if you don’t play the right balance from the start and substitute the right players at the right times you won’t be successful"

You (almost certainly deliberately) miss the point and/or the big picture.

First of all to say we looked disinterested is complete bollocks and one of those criticisms that is purely subjective depending on what you’re trying to ’sell’.

There was plenty of effort out there but I repeat, Arsenal - better control, better movement, better finishing, more brains. Why? More money.

(or maybe Barkley’s run for practically the full length of the pitch for our goal look disinterested).

Coleman got the run-around today because he’s a 60 grand trier and was up against class players who cost millions, but... not interested!?

Nonsense.

As for disorganized, we were playing a quality side on their ground and they made us look that way at times because they’re better (and they’re better because they cost millions more and Arsenal pay them millions more)

But if this is just ’excuses’, fine - BUT let’s hear your reasons for why City, Chelsea etc spend millions more than us on players when (according to you) they don’t need to as it’s all about ’organisation.’

Andy Walker, your "So Mark, why wasn’t it about money when we played Arsenal in the league?" is beyond childish.

Money doesn’t or won’t guarantee the team with loads money will ALWAYS beat the team with little or no money.

But most of the time... they fucking well will.

Raymond Fox
478 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:10:44
Andy, if money doesn’t count why do the richest teams finish at the top of the PL each year!

I’ll answer my own question, its because they can go out & buy the best players + keep hold of their own class youngsters that come through their own youth system.
Unlike us!

Ken Williams
479 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:18:47
We need to stop playing such a high defence line, that is why we are being beaten on the break, we spend to long passing the ball along the line, that as soon as we lose it our defence is out of position.
Paul Thompson
482 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:53:17
Of course money is a major factor, but as DanB points out above, this argument was often dismissed under OFM (sometimes by the same people making it now).

Plus, we didn’t have money in the first half of the season and something has clearly gone wrong since then. If you compare our (excellent) display at the Emirates earlier this season, we pressed them more aggressively and moved the ball more purposefully. We still didn’t have much firepower. We’ve haven’t played with such intensity for a while now and in fact have looked lethargic. I do not pretend to know why.

Today, Arsenal played with much more purpose and aggressively. Look at the corner count. There are lots of other problems that could be identified, but like the team, I don’t have the energy. Though the scoreline did flatter Arsenal, only Barkley, Distin and Lukaku came out of the match with any real credit.

Paul Smith
483 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:05:53
Nightmare: too many loan players waiting to play for their parent clubs.

How many teams above us are relying on loan players to make them better?

With all the will in the world & RM’s philosophy to boot. Without our OWN players, and a dressing room who can see a future together, I can’t see anything changing.

Mark Dunford
484 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:13:53
Each game is different. We played well enough for 70 minutes before the penalty and then lost to a very good counter attacking team when we were trying to chase the game. Each game is different. We were chasing a draw in December and we drew there last year in the league too under Moyes. Today’s scoreline is really down to their strength and speed on the counter attack.

My point is that well spent money buys squad depth which we just don’t have it to the same degree as the teams above us. When we are one or two players down , it shows. When we have more than this out, cracks can appear like they did in the Anfield derby. The squad is larger than it was under Moyes, but it has lost a certain versatility with more specialist players and what seems like a lot of wingers. None of them are bad players but we have needed a bit more in the past month. As it stands, we’ll almost certainly finish sixth or seventh and have a similar cup record to last year.

There is an aphorism about not all change being progress but progress being impossible without change (can’t recall where it is from). I think we’ve changed and progressed this year. We’re still in the same position and money to buy the necessary depth of squad is the root cause. Martinez is doing a very good job which needs to recognised and supported in the coming months.

Jim Bennings
485 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:24:48
But money does not score goals.

Money cannot make a simple decision which even your average lad in the street could make when faced in a three on two situation and all you need to do is pass to a un-marked team mate or shoot.

Money cannot be the reason why a grown man who is meant to be physically trained brilliantly to shoot like a flimsy girl.

We are piss weak in front of goal and people like Mirallas who cost 6 million, Lukaku who we are led to believe will cost 20 million and Baines and Barkley who are meant to be worth million and the much experienced Pienaar who has played for Ajax, cannot finish chances then I ask the question why?

We have spent more money than West Brom but couldnt beat them home or away..We couldnt beat or score at Palace..We couldnt score at Cardiff? We were dumped out of the League Cup at the abysmal Fulham.

The fact we did not punish these teams who are meant to be weaker cannot be down to money alone.

Pat Whitmore
487 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:26:57
Martinez messed up picking Rubles with Jags out. Sticking with Pienaar is also frustrating when he is so out of touch; at present, he offers nothing. Mirallas with his inability to pass is costing us games now. Not only can he not pass but his shooting is piss poor for an international player. Lukaku has lost all interest and too many other players are out of form.

Big problem is lack of replacements so we can all moan and gripe but, until Kenwright gets investment or sells up as he promises he’s been trying to do forever, nothing will change. We will get flashes of brilliance and utter shite like we got today.

We need money, plain and simple. Look at Man City now!! 10 years ago, they couldn’t have dreamt they’d be where they are now and in 10 years time Kenwright will still be looking for that magical buyer!

Andy Walker
488 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:24:23
Amazing, the mantra last year was if the manager gets credit when we win he is open to criticism when we lose. Fair enough. That message was repeated week after week by many of the same fans who now blame lack of money rather than the performance of our manager. Maybe he’s got you all under his spell!

And Ray I will wave a flag in defence of our clubs future thank you. Perhaps you would care to set out the profile of the type of person you would like to buy our club. Wait you’ve probably never got at far in the thought process....

Phil Walling
489 Posted 08/03/2014 at 17:51:57
Dick @457. None of the five players you describe as ’rubbish’ have contributed ANYTHING to the Everton cause this season.

My point from day one has been that a club running on a shoe-sting as we are cannot possibly afford to be paying out for players who provide no return.

Even the fee for Martinez’s one success – McCarthy – was grossly inflated and his reliance on loanees has merely papered over the cracks.

I have suffered dog’s abuse on here for pointing out the man’s shortcomings but, just as Tony Marsh was proved right about Moyes, so shall I be vindicated.

Unfortunately.

Richard O'Shea
490 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:36:42
Complete overreaction to today’s result. Last year under Moyes we finished 6th and reached the quarterfinals in the FA Cup. Will be in top 8 in the league this year and reach the quarterfinals in the FA Cup again.

Different managers with different approaches to football reach similar results. Does this not tell you something you can only go so far with limited funds? You can blame Moyes’s or Martinez’s tactics all you want but the bottom line is: to reach the next level, you need at least two top class forwards. Liverpool have them, Man Utd have them... we have none. Our best is a loanee from Chelsea.

Mark Tanton
492 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:43:30
Everton in a microcosm was the moment where Arteta went to ground, no head injury, no horrific break - the referee waved us on the pitch. What did we do? We played the fucking ball out. Absolutely mindnumbingly pathetic.

How wet can you get? Still we could have marched on forward as Arsenal stood and watched and still contrived to play eight one-twos before rolling the ball back the halfway line.

Mark Dunford
493 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:34:59
I’m sorry Andy (488) but I defended Moyes from silly criticism and will defend Martinez from the same. Both have worked hard to get the best from a small squad. They have gone about it in different ways which is also fine. Moyes laid the defensive foundations for the team which Martinez has improved in midfield and up front.
Ray Roche
495 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:40:45
Andy Walker, no mate, you don’t wave a flag in defence of anything but your mate Kenwright. Carry on believing that he’s the man.

Martinez will get criticism when he deserves it, just like Moyes did, but, for all his faults, he’s been as positive as Moyes was defeatist . And, after almost 60 years following Everton, it’s something I appreciate: a positive outlook.

"Far in the thought process"? What a supercilious twat you are.

Phil Walling
497 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:47:58
Mark: How can you possibly see our inevitable fall from sixth to a likely seventh as improvement?
Mark Dunford
500 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:46:40
I also agree with Mark T (492) - this was an issue last year against Arsenal when the players fell about laughably in the first half and Everton kicked the ball out when they were in the ascendancy. Arteta had lost his boot and could simply have put it back on like any capable child. It was really pathetic and should have been ignored. No reason to stop the game. Worth noting that when this happened last year, Everton who had clearly been instructed by Moyes ignored the prone player immediately after half time and that was the end of it apart from Wenger’s post match moan. This doesn’t happen with other teams and is easily the most off putting thing about Arsenal
Graham Mockford
502 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:40:27
Of course money is a key requisite to consistent success in today’s football. City don’t win a trophy for 38 years, win the lottery with a billionaire owner and have three in four years and counting. Go figure.

But on any given day any team can be beaten which means our only chance of a trophy is a Cup. We have about as much chance of winning the League as me forcing my way into the first team squad.

That’s why the manager and team should be getting some deserved criticism today. Some would have you believe Martinez is some sort of tactical genius replacing the imbecile who held us back for years. But for all the positive thinking, media friendliness and nice suits I’m seeing someone just as mired in his orthodoxy as our previous manager.

Playing a second string keeper was bad enough for me but it’s his post match comment that is most telling. He wanted an ’open’ game. Why play open against sides with better players, because that’s your philosophy? Did he not learn at City or the RS. Good counterattacking sides will pick you off.

Unless he starts displaying some tactical flexibility it may be the Emporer has no new clothes.

Andy Walker
504 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:47:37
Mark, I also often defended Moyes from such criticism, (most of which centred on the colour of his hair, his Scottish demeanour and his apparent love of BK). I did criticise him on occasion such as the capitulation against Wigan ironically, but it was based on what happened on the pitch rather than a pre determined prejudice.

The same suspects who used to use no factual or thought out football argument but instead repeated their entrenched views on Moyes week after week, are now some of the fans exhibiting exactly the same behaviour but based on a pro Martinez agenda, ie, he is beyond criticism regardless of events on the pitch.

Mark Dunford
505 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:53:40
Phil - the season isn’t over yet and I don’t share your undue pessimism. We have a new manager and it would have been reasonable to anticipate Everton finishing lower this season - perhaps down to say 10th. We’re now playing better football and there is a welcome freshness about the team. I worry that the loan signings mean there is a fragility about the squad but Martinez also seems capable of dealing with this
Raymond Fox
506 Posted 08/03/2014 at 18:45:13
Andy, all I am saying is money buys success, I don’t think you can dispute it.

The rich clubs finish top each year, its no coincidence.

Unfortunately we are not a rich club, we pull trees up each year to finish where we do, we should be proud of what we achieve given the handicap.

I know we all want to win things of course we do, we drew a short straw today having to play Arsenal away, maybe with an easier draw things might have been different, who knows.

Mark Dunford
507 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:01:16
Andy, we can agree that neither manager is beyond reasonable criticism and that much of what passes for comment on ToffeeWeb is really just prejudice.
Andy Walker
511 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:04:25
Raymond, I don’t dispute what you say, money will almost always decide which club wins the league, but it’s not true to say the the club with the most money will always win the league. We do have money just not as much as some other clubs. I agree with Martinez when he says we should be able to get into the top 4. He said it, he needs to deliver, which will take time. But he is accountable for the teams performance, good and bad and when it’s bad defaulting to the ’lack of money’ excuse made by some supporters (not RM) is ignoring so many other factors.
Andy Walker
512 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:11:38
Mark, yes so true and on that note I’m off down the pub.
Michael Kenrick
514 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:10:40
Mark, I think the vast majority of comments are from passionate Evertonians gutted with a loss that could have been different. Of course they show ’prejudice’ — regarding the team they support and love. Surely that is right? You make it sound like something that is wrong, clearly in a pretty shameful attempt to elevate your own comments.

Mark Dunford
524 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:25:47
Michael, if you read my comment, you’ll see that I’m agreeing with Andy (504) who has now gone to the Pub. No attempt to elevate my own views. I still think there is a lot of prejudice or ill thought out comment on ToffeeWeb in exactly the way Andy says.
Phil Walling
525 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:05:14
Ray, you are 100% correct. Only money buys success - although some who have it fail to spend it wisely. Just ask the guy at QPR about that !

I expect no more of BK’s Everton than they finish ’best of the rest’. But the mere smell of a top four place sees the manager - be he Martinez or Moyes - raised to the level of genius and then denigrated as normality kicks in.

Perhaps if we all tempered our enthusiasm we could enjoy the good days and suffer the bad whilst we pray for that billionaire.

Tahir Abdullah
529 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:33:47
269 vs Chelsea, 65 vs West Ham, 150 (to date) vs Arsenal. Mark @524 you may have a point....
Dick Brady
531 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:35:11
Phil Walling, you need more than money to get success. You need to spend that money wisely.

For example Everton spent £12 million on Jelavic & Kone.

Liverpool spent £12 million on Daniel Sturridge.

Its alright having £12 million to spend but you have to spend it wisely.

Paul Ferry
532 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:20:41
Mr Walling (489): I served with Tony Marsh. I knew Tony Marsh. Tony Marsh was a friend of mine. You sir are no Tony Marsh.

RIP Jimmy Ellis, Z-Cars legend, the old tune will be a little limp next week for one week only.

John Daley
533 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:37:43
Quite a few posters having a pop at the younger players like Barkley, Lukaku and Mcarthey but they are easy targets in my opinion. They are the one’s you can maybe excuse for being overawed by the occasion when there’s something more riding on the game than a mere 3 points.

It should, instead, be the more experienced players setting the example in ’big’ games but, as shown numerous times in the past, the ’old timers’ at Everton flinch whenever faced with the prospect of actually having to piss or bust.

Baines, for all his qualities going forward, was continually caught out of position and laboured getting back. His much vaunted delivery was, once again, about as reliable as fucking Yodel. As captain he shouldn’t have been chummily laughing and joking with Oxlade-Chamberlain and ruffling the whinging Arteta’s hair, he should instead have been having a word with Robles and telling him to fucking cut out his woeful ’Wonder Woman deflecting bullets with her bracelets’ impression.

As for the other left-sided ’superhero’ Pienaar, the last time I saw someone spend so much time puffing air, running in circles, slowing down, turning back on himself, shaping to pass then changing his mind, I was watching the man-boobed Adam West version of Batman trying in vain to find a safe place to dispose of a big fat arsed bomb. At least the shark-repellent sporting, sixties sex pest, had a guest villain tying him up in knots every week instead of fucking doing it himself.

Barry, bearing in mind his experience and the fact he’s got a league winners medal under his belt, looked baffled by some of the quick Arsenal interchanges. His moment of recklessness for the penalty might have been understandable from a rash youngster ruffled under pressure but, coming from a senior pro, it was sheer stupidity. I actually think he’s looked off the boil for a while now. Whether that is down to tiredness at having started so many games, or just a levelling out in form after his great start at the club, I don’t know but, on current form, I would be seriously considering whether he’s worth the wages it would take to entice him here permanently.

Distin was his usual self. Quick, strong, but looking increasingly shaky under sustained pressure.

Jamie Barlow
537 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:31:23
Wayne, how can you say playing Robles instead of Howard made no difference? The lad was absolutely shocking in the first half and if that didn’t put our defence under more pressure than needed, I don’t know what. A goalkeeper that can’t catch or kick a ball. Waste of fucking time.

A terrible decision from Martinez. One that no doubt he will keep making in the cup games.

Andy Crooks
544 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:50:55
Phil Walling # 525, I like things to be black and white so when you post sensible comments that I agree with you only cause confusion. Get back to being a pantomime villiain and stop making sense.
Raymond Fox
548 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:40:27
So now everything’s crap now, we’ve just been relegated to 7th in the league by the richest club in the world, we have a game in hand, mind.

We’ve been knocked out of the cup by Arsenal on their ground, & now everything & everyone’s rubbish.

Martinez will & does make mistakes, fair enough, sack him!

I’ll tell you what, the best manager in the world, whoever that may be, couldn’t make us a trophy winning club, were operating on a fecking shoe string!

That’s our problem, end of, sorry to beat you over head with it, but its the stark reality!

Ste Traverse
555 Posted 08/03/2014 at 19:09:35
Not trying to be a ’told you so’ merchant’. But I did say on here yesterday and pre-match today that Howard’s experience was vital if Jags didn’t make it so no way should should Robles play. Ok, he wasn’t directly responsible for any goals, but he was shaky and surely this made the defence nervous.

Laughable for RM to suggest it wasn’t a penalty. It was clear as day. And Clattenburg couldn’t have given it much quicker.

Oh, it seems some of the Kenwright-defenders are out in force in this thread. If you STILL don’t see this tosser for what he is yet you never fucking will. He continues to ’live the dream’ on the cheap while our finances get worse and worse with no fucking plan to get them better except flogging our best talent.

And in the days of players respecting former clubs after scoring against them, we get Arteta, who was loved and respected by the Everton crowd, despite spends large chunks of his his career here on the treatment table, pointing at his badge after scoring to go with his theatrics during the game.

He always get a good reception when he returns to Goodison (which he ignorantly ignores). I hope he gets loads of shit when he comes back next month. Fucking prick.

Brent Stephens
564 Posted 08/03/2014 at 20:01:32
Two further thoughts.

First, did we once try to hit a long ball quickly out of defence just to see if we could get Lukaku behind their defence that way?

Second, it’s often said that it’s tiring to chase a team who has possession. However, I wonder if the reason we seem to get tired so easily this season (as others have pointed out) is that we’re chasing around so much trying to give short-passing options. And that first point, which is all about mixing it up, might also give some of our players a breather as well as testing the opposition on the ball over the top.

Or maybe I’m just too tactically unaware.

Richard Harris
565 Posted 08/03/2014 at 20:15:25
Why oh why did Martinez choose a second choice goalkeeper when we were missing a first choice defender? Tactically naïve doesn’t begin the describe it........

The ineptitude of the board, managers (and to a lesser extent) the players over far too many years just doesn’t deserve the level, commitment and passion of the supporters that we have....

Callum McNab
571 Posted 08/03/2014 at 20:01:25
Ray spot on, but the man who keeps doing god knows what with the millions that comes in to the club keeps walking away scot free. We need quality and that takes money. We need players who are owned by the club and we can build a team with. No point that we keep having loaners who couldn’t give a crap what happens.

I have supported them through thick and thin for many, many a year. But I have had enough. I won’t be renewing my ticket and have sent Sky back. I won’t cross that beloved threshold till Kenwright and his cronies have gone.

I never thought the day would come when my love of football would go, but I can honestly say now I couldn’t give a crap, nothing is going to change. The same teams are going to sweep up the silverware, we are going to be lied to by that gobshite, and the season will be over in January or February.

Michael Evans
578 Posted 08/03/2014 at 20:38:24
Good old Everton - you get older, hopefully wiser and more philosophical about life.

You try to tell yourself a series of mantras ’it doesn’t matter in the great scheme of things’, ’It’s only a game’, ’We’re in a period of transition’, ’ Give .... (insert player/players name’ 12 months THEN we’ll be a team’ etc etc etc.

Trouble is that’s all shit, isn’t it ?

Still hurts like hell.

I’m with Richard @565 ... Why do we do this to ourselves ?

What’s that definition of an idiot ... keep doing the same things expecting a different result ?

Guess that makes me a Grade A idiot !

Christopher Kelly
589 Posted 08/03/2014 at 20:49:55
Jon Daly, I’m a big fan but not your best on this one (still a fan tho, mate!) And in your defense, you do make valid points per usual.

OK, we can talk about money forever and I love to have a go at the Board as most of us do. (To me they’ve wasted the better part of 12 years for us so I think we all have a very valid excuse to be pissed at them and want them out.)

What I HATE, what I LOATHE is the fact that RM I feel, needs to be loved by everyone. He is very inspiring, he is probably a great guy at home and in training, but the BEST managers, the ones we will remember, just do not give a fuck. About anything, excepting winning. They certainly don’t give a fuck about what other people think. Any sport, you name it, the greats just don’t sugar coat shit and don’t feel the need to appease everyone and be everyone’s best friend. So....

... Stop buying your old players who are washed up (Kone, Alcaraz). Don’t play it "safe" – even though it backfired. Go find some young fresh talent in Eastern Europe, South America or Africa. Build for the future by buying players that can really make a difference. By players that could really be something... I’m sorry, muscle fatigue?? I’m not a doctor but if a professional athlete has muscle fatigue, after being hurt for 6 months??? Then you should probably be considering another profession. It’s like a blind dentist or a violinist with no fingers? I’ve never heard of something so stupid in sports...ever

Christopher Kelly
592 Posted 08/03/2014 at 21:11:49
Good post, Richard. We deserve a lot better as fans. But that passion is also our downfall. We’re too easy on the board, manager and team.
Rick Tarleton
599 Posted 08/03/2014 at 21:25:17
Good teams counter-attack, Liverpool did it to us, Arsenal did, why are we quite so vulnerable to this style? A team attacks us with pace and we’re wide open, it needs looking at on the training ground.
Graham Mockford
607 Posted 08/03/2014 at 21:40:42
Rick

It doesn’t take the training ground to work it out. We get too many people ahead of the ball away from home against good sides.

But hey it’s good to play open right.

Darren Hind
616 Posted 08/03/2014 at 21:13:24
Phil #489

Not sure what you are talking about . . " Vindicated"?

Nobody advocates the right to criticise, or challenge the manager more than I do, but for the 19th year running. Evertonian dreams have been crushed. You may take some solace out of telling people "I told you so" but you merely come across as somebody who feels "being right" is more important than winning.

I’ve been watching football long enough to know how fleeting "being right" can be – I thought I was "vindicated " in 83 when I told everyone Kendall would never make it as a manager. How wonderful it was to be proved a mug.

Criticise the manager or the players all you want, they have made mistakes, but please, this is not a day for scoring cheap points, everyone is raw enough.

We were well beaten by a good team today, but if Barkley had kept his composure and fired 18" lower you’ d have been singing a different tune tonight.

Fine margins...

David Flanagan
618 Posted 08/03/2014 at 21:55:21
What worries me is what does Martinez tell the players? He constantly says we played well, deserved more, unlucky as he did after every defeat with Wigan... blah blah blah.

I hope the squad are told it’s not good enough — because it isn’t. It’s about winning not about looking pretty out there. We can’t expect to go to the better teams and over commit but we do. Tactically he’s one-dimensional and everyone knows exactly how we are going to play no matter what the scoreline.

Ron Sear
621 Posted 08/03/2014 at 22:11:59
After getting up at four this morning, traveling down, and finally watching this disaster, I’m trying to think of a silver lining...

I know: it was good practice for watching England play in the World Cup in Brazil — I’m now immune.

Seriously though, we do need an injection of ruthlessness and leadership on the field, Jags and Baines are far too nice for the job.

Mark Frere
625 Posted 08/03/2014 at 22:33:11
RS pundits on MotD again! Robbie Fowler is one tiresome twat!
Bob Parrington
714 Posted 09/03/2014 at 07:49:05
Ist Arsenal goal Robles was badly positioned. The rest of the time he was pretty awful. if Howard was fit, this was a lousy decision by RM.

Defensively, down the left particularly in the first half we were pretty awful.

We got the result we deserved. Shit, that hurts.

Amit Vithlani
716 Posted 09/03/2014 at 07:44:47
Katan Oza #416 "Osman is a little shit who can go die in a hole somewhere".

WTF is wrong with you? Ridiculous.

Andy Walker
757 Posted 09/03/2014 at 10:19:08
Ray 495, well done mate, did that make you feel better. See you ignored the question though, what is the profile of the person you would like to see take over our club?

It requires some thought doesn’t it?

Andy Merner
766 Posted 09/03/2014 at 10:36:02
A defeat is hard to stomach, especially with a Semi-Final up for grabs, but sometimes positives can be taken depending on the manner of defeat.

This is why I’m so dejected today though. If we are to continue with this more open, passing style of play, it’s imperative that we trouble teams, create clear chances, score goals!

Had we peppered the Arsenal goal, forced their keeper into World Class saves, hit the woodwork numerous times, we’d still be sorely disappointed with a loss, but the manner of our play would give us genuine room for optimism.

Today, at least, our toothless possession football leaves me wondering (and worrying) if we are able to bridge that gap.

Goals win games.

Ray Roche
810 Posted 09/03/2014 at 13:33:41
Yes, Andy, I felt better getting it off my chest. Supercilious twat? Bit over the top so I apologise for that, lets settle for just supercilious......but only because I've had a decent knock at golf.

Owner profile. Let's just start with honest. No-one has a right to be rich, but the fans deserve honesty if we can't have a rich owner. Integrity. And let's also accept that money IS the overwhelming factor in a Premier League club's chance of a trophy. Sure, there are the odd exceptions in the FA Cup, but all things being equal, money's the Daddy.

Frank McGregor
863 Posted 09/03/2014 at 16:44:13
Michael, I would like to see someone from this site make a representation to Everton Football Club to have a system in place to monitor our supporters at away games and have the culprits of bad behavior banned from particularly away games.

Yes the game was disappointing and changes need to be made and the team obviously needs strengthening.

Simon Smith
975 Posted 09/03/2014 at 19:58:50
I sent a post in last night to the mailbag but its not been added yet so will go over a couple of points on here.

Like many I watched the game on the TV, my mate who was lucky enough to get a ticket for the game usually calls me with a match report when he gets home had some disturbing news about what went on at the game.

He was most upset by some fans who were sat behind him and throughout the game racially abused some of our players as well as some of the Arsenal team.

If that was not bad enough he also added that smoke bombs were again used by our traveling support which just goes to prove why our ticket allocation was nowhere near the 15% we should have got.

All I hope is those so called fans are shopped by true fans who don’t want our club dragged down to their level

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