Everton vs Southampton

A win would be good, more importantly a bad loss will have the knives out for out beleaguered manager.

Should Ross start as a striker?

Maybe Martinez cannot comprehend the situation, if he doesn't I believe he is digging his own grave regarding keeping his job.

Southampton on the other hand do have something to play for so it'll be interesting to see whether pride and possibly shop window effects will mean we put in a good performance or now the pressure is off we go back to slow sideways/backwards nonsense.

Unfortunately, and apologies for being a bit miserable, but I find it hard to get excited anymore as long as Martinez is still in charge.

Really not arsed with team selection or tactics; like some of the players, my mind is already on the summer hols.

Now we are pretty much safe from relegation, the pressure is off in a way and probably we'll start playing a bit better now there's so little to play for.

I hope he takes the opportunity to give some game time to the likes of Garbutt, Browning, Besic and Robles. Garbutt in particular as I will be livid if we lose one of the best young left backs in the country because we haven't given him enough game time in a season where so little has been achieved.

I hope he can prove us wrong but I see another dodgy performance from Howard coming up.

If Koeman can outsmart RM again, it might just get Ballbag Billy thinking about a managerial shake up with the Dutchman as his main target.

The manager and players should look to restore some pride back and give the fans something after the abject display in the reverse fixture.

Lee Mason in charge. Does that fucker ever give us any decisions?

It has become a very shaky area but Garbutt will never be up to the task if we don't play him. Going forward, he has us on the edge of our seats and the other sides of his game will only improve with minutes on the pitch.

We can't keep England's number 1 on the bench in order to make Garbutt happy. He isn't as good as Baines, he may never be as good as Baines, and Baines has a good few seasons left in him. I hope he signs a new contract because he is a great prospect and could turn into a future star, but he won't want to spend the next few seasons sitting on the bench.

Ultimately, a new contract means that we have the option to sell him for big bucks. Losing him for practically nothing is simply not acceptable. Guaranteeing him the first choice left back spot is not going to happen. I suspect that he will want this guarantee or he will be off.

He is gonna start tomorrow. Just think about it. Barry HAS to sit for 2 matches... we win both. As soon as he is eligible, we all just know he is back in. That is so depressing.

What is up with Jay Rodriguez these days? He was injured but I don't think he has played all season. If Koeman doesn't rate him, we should get in for him. He'd be perfect playing off Rom.

Garbutt and Oviedo may not be as good (at this time) but they are both decent. Money can then be used to finally bring in a class creative midfielder.

Baines is quality but he turns 31 next season so his value is going to dive over the next 12 to 24 months. He's also one of our top earners so would give us a decent wage to offer as decent midfielder.

No matter how good the player, we need to get better at rotating the squad and cashing in on players at the right time. Rather than holding onto them until they are in their mid 30s, still in high wages (Pienaar, Osman, Howard now... and the likes of Neville and Cahill not too long ago). We're like a pension fund these days.

He definitely misses Distin and, judging from one or two of his recent surging runs, could well end up in midfield. Much will depend on whether or not he loses his England place to Luke Shaw now that Hodgson is bringing the young lads through.

Have you ever heard of Luke Shaw?

If Rom plays, we could well win... but, if he fails to make the team, I just can't see us scoring. Therefore the question is: Can we keep a clean sheet?

Jags should be full of confidence after his good showing in Turin but, as for our hipster goalie, I don't fancy our chances.

However, the players can’t be allowed to think that way otherwise there could be another unwanted twist in this campaign, so it’s very important that the Blues continue to pick up points and hopefully show us some good football in the process.

I’ve just been on the Echo website and viewed Spurs versus Everton from this day in 1985 – oh for a time machine; how much the game and Everton FC has altered in those 30 years, no live TV coverage of a title-deciding match, not even a special highlights package, just a short news item on the Saturday Lunch-time programmes and snippets on the main news.

Sadly you just might be right.

So:

1. We do have the month of June to sell him and make a bit of cash correct?

I know clubs (and Garbutt) could just wait until 1 July. But, just turned 22 Garbutt would seem as good a prospect and 20-year-old 㿌 million Shaw, surely. Not that we'd get anything near that, but that some club would rather throw Everton some millions to get a jump on the others in for him. ("We didn't want to wait til July lad. See how much we wanted you? We paid!!") Not to mention Garbutt's basically a Moyes-developed defender, an area Davey's reputation was second to none. Gotta believe that would help.

2. If the "sell him in June" scenario works out, does Leeds still get a wedge of the sale price? That it doesn't matter Garbutt had signed a second contract, or however many, Leeds gets a cut?

3. If his man tells him to wait until 1 July, he literally goes for free? He's an out-of-contract professional player at that point, so no tribunal and Everton get nothing?

Appreciate the answers.

He could re-sign, of course and I'm in the "Sign him up, Bill" group. No doubt about that. But, it just seems young Luke's man has positioned him perfectly for his next contract.

Getting Garbutt to sign another contract should be high on our summer transfer agenda and let's move Baines into midfield. He won't be any worse than Barry. An article from the 4-4-2 site (which is also on TW) thinks Baines & Besic would make a good pairing.

I’m not saying the manager should just dump Baines; he’s still amongst the best in the league and particularly after the way he conducted himself during all the contract speculation... but Roberto should’ve mixed it up a bit more and given Garbutt more incentive to sign a new contract.

Saying that, the manager should’ve mixed it up more throughout the whole team. Browning should’ve had much more game time along with Chris Long. I’m hoping these lads and others will get more games after we are mathematically safe but, with the amount of money each club gets the higher you finish in the league, I’m not expecting it.

I am not sure in what other industries an employee who is "unfit for purpose" would continue to be employed for such a period of time. Obviously Gibson is simply not physically equipped to perform regularly in the professional game and thus be able to fulfil his contractual obligations? Within the requirements of contractual law of course, surely Everton should be able to put an end to this saga which is now bordering on the farcical?

If this team is to be developed in the immediate and longer term, it would appear imperative that players such as Gibson, together with others who for a variety of reasons (age, injury, personal related issues) should be moved out.

With specific reference to Gibson it would appear from a number of posts on other related threads that his constant absence seems to induce perceptions of his qualities and performance levels that now border on the mythical. We even had one reference putting him in the same bracket as Alonso.....and even Pirlo!

So even his constant absences now seem to be playing havoc with perspectives! I wonder if it the same with the management?

Obviously Martinez will start with Barry/McCarthy as the holders, the back four picks itself as does Rom. It's the difficult three behind that's the problem...

How about Mirallas (if fit), Barkley & Lennon? Pace and power. Pity none of them know how to tackle back.

Baines isn’t a midfielder – and never will be, in my opinion – but is a better left back than Oviedo. Oviedo, obviously younger, can do a job in midfield but is not creative enough for the middle and not the standard we should be aiming for on the wing. I would see what offers come in for either two players and go from there.

As much as I like Oviedo, I would probably let him go and keep Baines so we basically have a higher level of left back for that position giving both Baines and Garbutt more equal playing time and focus on the next age group coming through for that position.

They're going to be dangerous on the break with Tadic, Mane and Elia, and solid at the back, difficult to break down. Basically, like last season's Everton.

A top half finish is the only thing that can salvage any positives from a disastrous league season.

Baines is first choice, with Shaw, Gibbs, Bertrand, Cresswell and Rose all well above Garbutt in the pecking order.

That's a bit of an indictment against Hodgson, that analysis.

England just don't give youth enough of a chance when it matters – always going back to their "tried and true" veterans.

He is no doubt a great prospect; instead of talking about Baines playing midfield, why not try Luke in Barry's place? Great going forward and he can improve his defensive game but only by being tried & given some game time. The same applies to the other young lads: give them a chance – they are the clubs future.

Howard has been very suspect on lots of occasions for two seasons now; Robles should be given the rest of the season to prove himself or he will just move on.

Harold, as an England fan, I hope Luke Shaw isn't 'brought through' yet. He's been fast-tracked ahead of where he should be, and is behind a host of other left backs in my opinion, possibly including Garbutt.

Yes it was rumoured at the start of this season that Liverpool were very interested in Garbutt, so there is the possible chance that he will go there.

I think Garbutt can go very far in the game, but at the moment it is still only potential that he shows; he has never played enough games to prove he is as good as some people are saying on here. I think, in the few games he has played, he has looked very good going forward and in dead-ball situations, but defensively he hasn't impressed all that much.

I hope we retain him for his potential, but to say he will be England's full back in the future is very premature to me.

2nd season syndrome my arse. This fool of a manager will buy shite in the summer and have us playing the same crap.

Thanks to the wisdom and insights to ToffeeWebers points of view, I have no confidence in the future of being a life long blue.

This Martinez blind spot is enough to cost him his job.

Gibson possible injury another case of making room for one of the BBS A.K.s.

For me the GK situations reeks of a BK money deal where I pay him more than any other player & I want my American Audience. Billy, I am from America; Howard is the worst keeper in the league 3 years running. Distin & Jags carried him the last 4 years.

Or maybe if he is unfit to carry out his contract, maybe the insurance company would pay Everton off without us paying him off.

"They haven't been overachieving at all. Their results are down to their performances. They are a very well-organised team and have tactical flexibility they use really well."

I was rather hoping that this would be how Everton under Roberto would be described by opposition managers, but, alas it was not to be!

Everton will stay up, no doubt, but have got to get it right next season. We need to be in Europe.

Everton are a big club; history speaks for itself.

The only position where Oviedo can play in midfield is possibly on either wing as Martinez usually goes for two holding in the middle which is covered by four players for that position and thatÂ’s not including Ledson who should be breaking into the first team now. Thats how good the lad is in my opinion, irrespective of age.

Oviedo can do a job on the wings if were hit hard with injuries but heÂ’s never a first choice for me and I donÂ’t think itÂ’s fair on him after what heÂ’s been through to only offer him a few minutes here and there. Mirallas will probably be sold and hopefully Lennon will go back to Spurs so that just leaves Pienaar to see out his final year and McGeady who I imagine will still be here after only one year.

What I would like to see is for the manager to sign Deulofeu permanently and Januzi as direct replacements for a first team start with Henen and Green being understudies to both.

"Gibson possible injury another case of making room for one of the BBS A.K.s." — Is it me or does that mean a whole hill of beans? BBS = Billy BullShit? A.K.s... err??? I got nothin'. I know it's another language on your side of the pond, but a little clarity might help.

While we're on, I can't believe anyone could make a case that Everton are playing Howard in goal for the sake of the American Audience. I just don't believe that enters the equation anywhere at all. Roberto believes he's the more senior more experienced keeper and therefore has to play if fit. Simples. [And it's clearly got nowt to do with form either.]

I will eat my hat if Barry does not start tomorrow, depressing but I will not be surprised when Martinez announces Gibson is not starting.

It's a really difficult one but I honestly think Garbutt could be a star if given the chance and it is definitely a new era at Goodison Park in which I think the senior players should be getting phased out and the new young british talent should be getting blooded.

This is what top managers get paid to do but for me I'd be thinking long term and building a young team like Pochettino is doing at Tottenham and saying goodbye to Baines, Howard, Barry, Hibbo, Ossie and eventually Jagielka who would be last to go.

Any ops needed can happen nice and early. Young players can be tried out. Decide if you're going to build the team around young Ross.

I've mentally checked out this season. Just about the only thing that can rile me against Soton is seeing Ross played on a wing.

We need to win tomorrow, we'll have to score at least two as The Beard will no doubt cause panic in our box and gift them at least one. The single biggest mistake Martinez has made.

Having said that, I'm going for 3-0. I expect Lukaku, Barkley, Lennon and McGeady to start, with Osman and McCarthy in the middle and the usual suspects at the back.

And this current situation reminds me of our season in 09-10, where our performance didn't live up to our expectations but the team delivered it in the last few months to finish 8th. COYB.

He brought his best players from Wigan and we know only one cuts the mustard, even that was heavily debated on another thread.

Everton 1 Southampton 3 – but a phenomenal performance.

The Toffees have made a habit of playing well when I don't think they're going to. May the trend continue.

Oviedo wouldn't last 5 minutes in central midfield, and I'd give Baines about 10 before he was either hauled off, or sent back towards the corner flag/touchline where he belongs.

Neither player has anywhere near the awareness or ability to be thrust into central midfield in the Premier League – no chance. There are very few examples of full backs suddenly making it in the middle – the only one I can cite is Phillip Lahm, but he's a very rare breed.

Baines is an up & down player who's brain works in straight lines, and Oviedo is exactly the same. Neither player has a right foot either which makes them both perfectly suited to left-sided play, and completely unsuitable for central roles.

I see no evidence, or even any justification or reasoning from any TW posters on why they think either player should be tried in midfield.

Answers on a postcard....

Since joining Man Utd he has suffered from a series of niggling injuries and has never reached full match fitness. This boy is a gem with the best to come. You'll see.

Martinez and his staff are useless and will relegate Everton. How much more evidence do you need?

MARTINEZ OUT.

To say he can't do it before he's actually been given a run of games there reminds me of my toddler saying she hates Brussels sprouts before ever trying one! To me Baines clearly has tenacity, stamina, accurate passing and crucially some good vision. I think he could do well there though to be honest we are not short with Barry, McCarthy, Besic and Gibson.

Howard
Coleman Stones Jagielka Baines
McCarthy Barry
Lennon Barkley Osman
Lukaku

Subs: Robles Alcaraz Garbutt Gibson Mirallas Naismith Kone

If Lukaku fails his fitness test, Kone will start. Gibson has been good in the last couple of games but there is no way I can see him being picked ahead of Barry. Even if Mirallas is fit, he won't start... but, if he is, and makes the bench, expect to see him around the hour mark.

Many players have been converted from full-back to central midfield and vice-versa. You're right about about it being a step up, you've effectively got 360 degrees to worry about when you've been used to 90, but the need to both attack and defend, judge when to do so, and use the ball effectively from deeper positions is the same.

Soton want to beat us very badly, they will see this as a softer 3 points to get them Champions League footie. They will surge forward from the off. The Ref is another problem...

Lukaku will not play. Hamstrings take longer. Martinez won't be daring or imaginative up front, so expect that wonderful striker Naismith to figure.

Our defense has Jags in form and McCarthy is in midfield, so expect a fight. Lawro (shit shirts) can't bring himself to say we might win, he says a draw. We will be very lucky to draw. A win to-day would be amazing.

I don't expect a classic today – we ll find it hard to break down a well-organised Saints side... so I'm going for a 0-0 or 1-1 draw.

"This season, the Blues have suffered a curious spate of the same injury – it seems they have a hamstring curse. Lukaku became the 13th first-team player to be hit by the injury and, since Martinez arrived 18th months ago, those 13 players have had an incredible 22 hamstring injuries between them. The worst player affected was midfielder James McCarthy who up to getting injured had been extremely influential for Everton."

I can't see him being fit for today's match and I certainly don't think we should risk him anyway, but The Thin Spanish Waiter, if he's still here next season, should get his Spanish arse in gear and get shut of HIS backroom staff and get some professional people in. We have a small enough squad as it is without having it further reduced by avoidable injuries.

I would like to see Baines playing in front of Garbutt or vice versa. If Pienaar is on the bench then he could be brought on if that ploy does not work. Perhaps Robles may get a game, but it is unlikely IMO.

Is Atsu still with us, by the way? He is another alternative wide player and I was pleased with his last showing for us. His assist for the goal on his last appearance showed lots of awareness and the lad was voted player of the tournament in the African Cup. He has fine passing ability and is a better distributor than any other wide player we have, IMO.

I just don't see Baines or Oviedo every being anything other than full backs, or at best, wide players.

Look at all the various posts on here, we are all confused and don't know what to expect anymore. If the manager is portraying this to the fans then the players must be completely lost.

I've lost all interest in the season and with RM. I can no longer listen to him anymore. He even said in the Daily Mail yesterday that he is considering giving Alcaraz a new deal... OMG!!!

I will still go the games because I love EFC with a passion.

You may be right but I think to dismiss a possibility before it has been amply tested is somewhat churlish. Personally I think he has a lot of the necessary qualities; crucially he is good on the ball and able to spot intricate, forward passes and then run into space for a return pass. Something we rarely see from our central midfield.

I certainly think it would be worth trying with so little to play for now and such an exciting replacement in Garbutt.

Southampton will be very tough to break down and will be dangerous on the counter. I can almost certainly guarantee that Gareth Barry will go straight back into the team which means he is going to be a liability as usual.

Martinez's compliment about Southampton being tactically flexible and all their players knowing what they're doing etc on Thursday actually can be used as an indictment against him because this season we have been the complete opposite to Southampton on every level.

Martinez is one of the most stubborn managers in the league, he plays players out of position and we have no structure or organisation to our play at all. We were lucky at QPR, we won't be so fortunate today.

BBS = Bobby brown shoes. AK = ass kisser.

The whole Rom episode and his agent shows how unambitious we have become as a club. A player like Rom should not have to play in the same team as a damaging donkey like McGeady (or even the likes of Osman). Martinez had a chance to make things exceptional after last season but fluffed it, and fluffed it badly. Even if we thrash So'ton today (which we won't), there is something ineradicably rotten at our club, and it starts with the chairman and manager.

Both must do the decent thing and go.

They will look to go for us from the start today. We will really need to be up for today's game.

Garbutt's comments earlier in the season clearly haven't helped his cause either, even though I think we all know (again) he was right.

In other news, I hope everyone's enjoying the early kick off :)

Can't see us winning.

All should be shown the door asap. Too old, not good enough, too injury prone, not worth it - take your pick.

That's half our squad!