Lukaku into Euro2016 quarter-finals with Belgium

I'd love to see him doing well, but right now he seems frustrated and tired. 2 mins / 1st touch goal for his replacement says a lot. I'd like to see Rom getting a decent break from football.

In the 2nd half he was "Lazy Luka", there was little if any movement with him just hovering around the 6-yard line, this is why his team mates rarely passed to him, lack of movement giving options and the lack of willingness to move defenders around. He looked too heavy and purely relying on pace.

It will not break my heart if he leaves especially if someone is willing to pay an over-inflated price for him.

I thought Lukaku's first touch was okay, and in general through the tournament his touches have been better, but his movement was poor, and as per usual there was no pressing/harrying of the opposition defence. His gesturing and hand-waving to his teammates of where he wants the ball played is incredibly annoying to this viewer, so I can only imagine how frustrating it must be for his team! If Rom expended as much energy making runs/finding space as he does with his frantic hand movements, we might be getting somewhere.

Of course, just when we start to dig into Rom, he's likely to go and get a couple of goals in the quarter-final now – hence the frustration at his undoubted ability but complete lack of consistency of effort.

As I have said many times over, I still think he needs to shed a lot of kilos and get fit and sharp if he wants to play for Everton or even go on to what he reckons are "greener pastures"...... Get the Casius Clay catch-phrase out of his brain and work on making it happen for himself.

Belgium are playing like Barcelona and how Arsenal always wanted to play... millions of passes but no through balls. Lukaku is still very young and will improve a lot when he gains experience. I thought he worked really hard and did make runs especially in the first half but Belgium just play the ball to Hazard and he is the star of the show (let's everyone know too).

If Wales mark Hazard tightly, they have a good chance of beating Belgium unless the Belgian coach gives instructions to the team to get Lukaku involved with through balls. If Belgium do not score in the first 20 minutes and Hazard is man-marked, then I can see them running out of ideas. They struggled for a long time against Hungary even when one up as Hazard held on to the ball too long and the rest of his team were just watchers.

Wales can expose Hazard's weakness which is in defence, and they can attack Belgium down their left which is wide open. Hazard is a brilliant ball-player and I would love to see him in an EFC shirt but he needs strong defenders behind him to cover the gaps he leaves.

Lukaku would do much better in a more direct side. Mark my words, Rom will develop into a really top front man with the right ammunition. I would love to see him play with a strike partner. All the highest scorers in the English league played with strike partners. Players like Shearer, Lineker, Van Nistleroy, Suarez, Andy Cole, Henry and of late Vardy all played with partners who chipped in with goals. Lukaku and other Everton strikers since Lineker have been ploughing lone furrows.

Well spotted mate. Lukaku made run after run into the box looking for the early cross that didn't come. Hazard repeatedly checked back onto his right foot.

Within minutes of coming on, Batashuay made the same run and Hazard played his first cross off his left foot from the by-line. Lukaku may be playing a Billy big-bollox game in the camp.

These sorts of spoilers have denied us seeing the likes of Ade Akinbiyi, Danny Cadamarteri and Michael Branch score the goals that their one-dimensional talent warranted.

It really does make me laugh all this nonsense about not playing to his strengths. Basically for Lukaku to achieve his promise he needs to be managed by John Beck, à la Cambridge United....

I think until defenders decide to allow him a load of space, like we seen the RoI boys do, then we will see more pointing, waving and moaning from a player who called himself a "complete centre-forward".

If Lukaku leaves, then he will be the most difficult to replace. Barkley and Stones are far less valuable to our club and that is why Koeman is doing his best to keep him with us.

He is certainly NOT a complete centre-forward but he will develop into one. He is still very young and is still learning, but he is also contributing to our team by scoring far more goals than anyone else and that is what the game is really all about.

We have lots of drones in the team to do the donkey work but Lukaku needs goals to come from others to take some weight off his back. Deulofeu started last season quite well and provided some great assists for Lukaku, but he dried up and no-one else has stepped up to the plate.

So Rom is a good player as long as you don't expect him to have to control the ball and pass it accurately? He's good as long as the ball is played in front of him?

I mean it's a bit like buying a TV from a shop and the bloke selling it to you says "brilliant picture, one of the best you will see. What you need to do is allow it 5 minutes to switch on, smack the top of it and press the red and green button at the same time"

Maybe you need to look at the hilarious tweet from the semi-final showing Rom's touches from the game to understand the frustrations these attacking midfielders have to put up with. The players cannot commit forward with him up front as he loses it so often and teams hit us on the counter.

Trust me when I tell you that, after near 250 games of top flight football, it's not about potential any more. His touch is his touch, his attitude is his attitude. Stop living in hope that one morning he will wake up and become Didier Drogba – he just isn't and never will be that type of player.

He definitely has some great qualities, but needs every top class player needs a top class attitude ans mental strength to match the ability or they will struggle to be consistent. You obviously need to be a team player too to get the service you need. It will be interesting to see how the Euros affect Rom this time round – it took him ages to recover from Brazil 2014 and he's playing a good deal more this time.

Barkley has been better when brought on as an impact sub for the 2nd half of games and sometimes Osman was brought on for Barkley when the kid started games. This is why a 'proper' squad of virtually equal ability is required if a club has title ambitions.

The bench of seven players gives the so-called bigger clubs an advantage as they had the money to make their bench much stronger than most other clubs. The new wealth from media revenue will enable all clubs to have strong squads and hopefully ours will be good enough to compete effectively. Selling the best players at a club will be detrimental in the long haul.

I think he has massive potential and would love to see it realized in an Everton shirt. However, I don't share the obsession when you see the downside, where the team in general have to align with his style of play and not the other way round?

I also don't feel a sense of we have no option. I think our big mistake is seeing Rom as a lone target man. Rom needs a player along side him, and that is Ross, who in a creative / finishing role around and in the box is where his real value lies.

A front four of Rom and Ross, with Kevin and Geri (if in / on form) supported by a traditional midfield general alongside a get-stuck-in, box-to-box midfielder is the solution for me. If Rom goes, then I wish him well and would look forward to seeing a replacement doing a similar job but without the ego / emotional baggage he carries.

Anyway, that's why we pay the manager to sort it out. NSNO / COYB

I would. Thus I don't want us to sell him...

We relied on corners and free kicks to score and we were awful to watch. I hated those days and hope we never return to them.

My point is, I agree that Rom needs a strike partner alongside him. If Barkley really wants to arrive at his full potential, then he should be pushing for this spot otherwise he is just another midfield drone.

Perhaps Mr Koeman can get more out of him and others. It would enable us to spend money on a top schemer who can pass accurately FORWARDS!! Maybe he can see something in a couple of the kids too!!!

This is not the first match that I have noticed this with De Bruyne. Maybe the repeated pouting and gesturing of where they should play it actually does work in pissing him, Maertens and Hazard right off ...

See Pelle's performance before??? Outstanding.

That aside, Pelle is a far better all round player who will enable the team to score more goals.

Not spin, simple season total. How much more of an apple-to-apple comparison can you get than comparing both players from the prior season, in the same league?

He's a blue, and he's the only blue still in the competition.

Funes Mori made it to the Copa America final, it would be good for us as a club if Rom could do something similar.

Rom has let us and himself down with recent comments, but he is still a blue as it stands, and the better he does, the better for us.

He will come back to us full of confidence, ready to tear the Premier League up, or will look to get his move. If Mane is worth 㿎m rising to 㿐m then what fee would Rom fetch if we were to sell him as the top scorer at the Euros.

Rom doing well at the Euros is a win win situation, and IMO he's not doing too badly.

Lastly, even though Rom could have a few more goals to his name, he's still out-doing a lot of good players; a tournament like the Euros can't really destroy a players valuation, but it can certainly boost it.

Zlatan will still command the same wagers even after a poor Euros, Spurs would still demand ridiculous money for Kane, Man Utd wouldn't consider selling Marcel or Rashford even though they've done nothing.

Here's to hoping Rom rips up the Euros and the blues end up smelling of roses.

Lukaku played in 46 games scoring 25. He was rarely subbed or rotated.

I'm not disputing Lukaku's goal stats. I'm merely supporting the fact that, in terms of goals per minutes and the type of role he plays, Pelle is a very good option indeed.

He would cost around ٥m apparently whereas we can supposedly get 㿞m+ for Lukaku.

And yes, Lukaku would do well to watch how Pelle played yesterday. For all you Lukaku fans who obsess about goal stats, watch and see how a forward can massively impact his team by being able to control and look after the thing.

Pelle being 30 would give us 3 years quality. There is no guarantee that Rom will get better. I've seen very little to convince me that he has what it takes to get to where some of you dream he can.

You can either whinge about his first touch and work rate or you can back him for the goals he scores despite the lack of early ball into the channels that brings the best out of him.

You don't need to have a coaching badge to know he will never be a back-to-goal centre-forward.

There's some bollocks posted about this guy. He has averages around 14 league goals in the three years he has been with us and by missing glaring sitters in the latter rounds, he as rendered the cup goals he has scored (mainly against lower opposition) worthless.

This is not a guy who is improving, we all saw how much he has been weighed and measured by opposing centre-halves in the latter stages of last season.

Lukaku is nowhere near the much maligned England strikers. They both pissed all over him last season and will do so again next time around.

20-plus league goals? Not as long as he has a hole in his arse.

Only hard-working consistent strikers get 20 plus goals. Players who don't need four chances in order to convert one.

He scored 18 last season. Not beyond the realms of possibility that he could grab a couple more next season is it?

Nope, it's impossible for him to score another two goals to get to 20. Despite playing in a system that doesn't play to his strengths last season and knocking off for the last 10 games, he scored 18.

He admittedly ran around like a fat wagon driver for the latter part of the season; hopefully he has got his passion back. With Koeman's playing style, I am fully confident he will get to 20. And that's with the hole in the arse.

I wish I had a crystal ball for next season and would hope that Ronald puts a size nine up his arse to make him work harder. If not, get rid and spend the money on Shane Long – at least he puts in a shift.

I don't mind who gets the goals, as long as we score plenty.

He's not World Class yet but then nobody who plays for us is. He's a highly effective striker and possibly our best and most important player.

I hope he stays, gets focussed on Everton and scores the goals that gets us into the Champions League. Don't see many out there I'd be confident to do that job better than him.

However if his mind is set on going then let him. So long as someone offers 㿨m+, I'd rather have players who want to play for the club.

Agreed. He's probably been playing at a decent level since he was a kid in primary school and, with all the coaching he must have had over the years, still can't control a ball consistently.

1. Martinez threw everything he could at getting Rom to justify his biggest outlay. He had players all set up to do his donkey work (Kone, Naismith) as lone striker. He gave him penalty duty, he rarely if ever dropped or subbed him, even when he played shocking. Martinez indulged the sulky lazy sod and he got rewarded by the petulant idiot downing tools and spouting off to the press.

2. Koeman likes his forwards to offer more than just being 'Johnny on the spot'.... see Pelle and his style of play. Koeman does not indulge prima donnas – see Tadic and Co. Lukaku will either need to get his head down and put in a shift or get lost.

But we can dream I suppose...

Don't knock Pelle, mate. He scored 11 league goals last season.

I mean just think... ٥m may buy a player who can actually trap a ball, score a decent return of goals per minutes played, hold up play, offer an aerial threat – there has got to be a catch hasn't there?

Is it just me but does anyone else think that Ross Barkley has all of the tools to be a really awesome centre-forward? Or, to put it another way, what skill does Ross not have that would prevent him from becoming a world class No 9?

It would certainly nullify his shortcomings as a midfielder which his understandable reluctance to put in a fill-throated tackle. Lukaku and Barkley, dual strikers, best in the league .

Pelle was often playing with the likes of Mane in the lineup, while Lukaku was isolated up top on his own.

Also you assume a player will do better if 'indulged' as he was by Martinez. Think a lot of top managers would disagree with you.

Better to put that same ٥M towards a 23-, 24- or 25-year-old, someone with plenty of successful seasons with us ahead.

Now I treat all Lukaku rumours with a pinch of salt.

In the left hand: Lukaku
In the right hand: Pelle

Put the hands together, lads!

Why would I be agitated by you harping on about a player that nobody else is interested in? For what it's worth, I think he will be another Kone because, as you said "Players that start young (as Pelle did) are finished by 28."
Are you his agent by any chance? Ha ha.

And if you take a look at Kone's last 2 years before he joined Everton, he scored 2 more goals in the same amount of games as your top striker did.

And that was playing for the mighty Wigan Athletic.

Lukaku spent the second half of last season thinking like a sun reader in denial.

Those mathematicians who think he only needs another two need to think again. half of his eighteen goals were scuffs and miskicks, no way will he be that lucky again. What did he get the year before? 10 wasn't it?

He may get double figures, but I expect Koeman will sit him down when he realises he cant play, then we will find out his true worth. Then we will find out why gormless Bobby is the only manager to make a concrete bid for him since he came to the Premier League.

We've already seen the best of this fella. Those foolish enough to claim he will get twenty league goals next season need to get themselves down the bookies... there'll be a very warm welcome for you there.

20 league goals? – Hole, arse. not, while.

I actually thought all Everton fans were 'knowledgeable'.... it seems many have forgotten what a proper centre-forward looks like after watching our cash-stripped club languish with bargain-basement buys for years. When I read many of these posts, it's as though the person has left their PC on and some rugby fan who doesn't really get football has looked at Rom's wiki page for stats and decided to argue for the lad.

Pelle is just one example as to why Rom is over-rated – he is a journeyman striker who could arguably offer us what Rom can't at a fraction of his cost. So the lads get very specific on the number of goals Rom scores (making sure the ones against League One opposition in the Cups are counted). It's very important to back this lad of 250+ senior games because despite the fact that he has had the average amount of games as 26-year-old he still needs that time to learn how to do things the average 26-year-old could do when they were 20.

Tomorrow, Rom will find his usual spot in Ashley Williams's pocket. His best hope is that De Bruyne or Hazard beat their men sufficiently well to pull Williams away from Lukaku to take up his position pointing to a spot in front of him.

Goal stats support Rom in the way that passing stats would have you believe that Joe Allen is the midfielder Paul Scholes could only dream of being.... only the wisdom of the watching person knows the difference.

It seams these experts on Fifa don't know the meaning of NSNO. Not old enough to have seen some of the Goodison greats. And have the audacity to call themselves 'knowledgeable'. FFS, aim a bit higher, girls... aim a bit higher.

I don't want to be signing bargain-basement cloggers for my club. We can now afford the best but, if they see you signing second-rate players who nobody is interested in, they won't come.

"Only the best is good enough" Do you understand the meaning???

Desperate is a good word. It could be used to describe some fans of a proud historic club who want an over rated, over indulged, over paid footballer to still play for us despite him disrespecting us and saying he wanted to leave way before a crucial season was over. These desperate fans are trying to convince others that he is worth holding onto and we should be thankful we have him.

Nil satis indeed.

I think some on here spend to much time watching non league football.
I will be happy if we can sign a replacement for Lukaku so long as it is not someone that is going to chip in with 7 or 8 goals a season. We have Kone for that.

PS Keep dreaming.

"Half of his eighteen goals were scuffs and mis-kicks"
Can you back this statement up? Or is it just the usual drivel that you and Roberts come up with. If you can bare to watch here is all of the 25 goals from last season:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpozhwUUfqU

And I would like you to tell me which where the mis-hits and the scuffs?

And when you have watched this I bet you are not man enough to admit you where wrong. Some of the goals were not bad for someone that can't head a ball.

I genuinely thought 18 + 2 = 20.

I also thought that half of 18 = 9. So you are saying that 9 of his goals last season were scuffs or mis-kicks?

Watch the footage mate. I can honestly say that not one of his 18 league goals last season was mis-hit. Not one. I could list them for you if you like?

But why let the facts get in the way of your obnoxious way of letting people know how clever and right about things that you are, hey?

ps: I currently find Lukaku pretty obnoxious too, but that doesn't suddenly make him bad at football.

I don't think they will respond. Or, if they do, it will be some cryptic messages about nothing to do with the evidence.

There's no doubt he scuffed and mis-hit some that didn't go in, and I guess that is what the Mr Hinds of this world would like to focus on.

But surely that would suggest that there is room for improvement, not that he is a spent force who we've "already seen the best of".

I'm not for one minute denying that he is somewhat over-rated (by himself) and that his attitude often stinks the place out. But could he be the great goal-scorer we need to help us challenge for honours next season? You bet he could be!

Dont start complaining about other people being obnoxious, your opening line was to call somebody elses opinion Nonsense . . ditch the hypocrisy and faux outrage.

As for your maths, Lukaku will not have 18 goals to his record when the season starts, he will be starting from scratch... He does not just have to get two more he has to get twenty... get it? T-W-E-N-T-Y. Think he'll do it? Then get down to the bookies, it'll be an open arms job. They can spot a mug punter a mile away.

Eric,

I have watched Everton for over half a century, so don't give me idiotic nonsense about not being old enough to watch the Goodison greats. The difference between me and you is I recognise a great.
You bang on about NSNO then gush about Lukaku's "control, speed and sublime skill"? ... I suspect the irony of that is totally lost on you? ... SUBLIME SKILL???

For three seasons now, I have watched Lukaku miscontrol, scuff, mishit, glorious chances. Most people in the crowd would have converted at least one of those chances he contrived to miss at Wembley. Even the goal against Chelsea (the one he's been dining out on ever since) was scuffed. You would not recognise a clean strike if Sugar Ray Robinson caught you flush on the jaw with one.

If I could find a bookie who would offer me semi-decent odds that Lukaku will not get 20 goals next season I would snatch his hand off ...unfortunately they are not that daft, they leave the pipe dreams and the nonsense to the gullible and easily pleased.

I'm more than happy to accept that Lukaku is hugely effective when he puts his mind to it and throws his weight around, knocking people out of the way ... but "sublime skills"?

Put your glasses on and take your own advice. Aim higher. Your aspirations are depressingly low.

I suppose the ideal is for the romantic goal, the pure strike that can make the fans come over all dizzy.

Half of the goals where scuffed or mis-hit? So you were making that nonsense up then. I bet you couldn't even force yourself to even watch them. Usual drivel, as I said – not man enough to admit you were wrong.

"If I could find a bookie who would offer me semi decent odds that Lukaku will not get 20 goals next season I would snatch his hand off ... unfortunately they are not that daft."

Just read what you said!!! And you are calling them daft.

Any centre-forward with enough heart would find his way onto them. Ironically it's not the ones Rom scored I'm looking at... it's the numerous ones that ended up going out for a throw-in on the far side because "super striker" was standing on the penno spot expecting a cut back. You don't have to be a finisher to score goals from Geri.... you just need to 'want it'.

Geri and Rom seemingly fell out. Unsurprisingly. One particular game, I seen Geri gesture angrily as another one of his crosses went unchallenged. Jags for that matter made his thoughts known to Lukaku.

Lukaku didn't score goals that required the genius and inspiration of many of the ones Suarez did for that lot when almost winning them the league. He scored many that were on a plate and the odd good goal.

How many moves did it take for people to realise Adebayor was a lazy, egotistical, athlete?

Wet dreams wake you up again, Peter?

Deulofeu + a hungry striker equals goals. That's the whole point – Rom hasn't single handedly done a Suarez and made all his goals – dropping off, linking play, doing give-and-goes.... he's a one dimensional player who is vastly over rated and over priced.

Eric.....

Have a look back at your posts, quite a few following the same theme. It's 2016 mate, sexuality isn't taboo any more. You feel free to be who you want to be mate.

Now Bellendino has gone, we might have a coaching staff and training regime who can get him sufficiently fit to last 90 minutes. We should see the best of him then.

Well, you agreed with that ("Bang on the money, Eddie Dunn"). So, you accepted that Del plus Rom equals goals.

And you say "Deulofeu + a hungry striker equals goals." You said it – so Rom must be a hungry striker.

Lukaku, despite clearly knowing this, didn't always make the run into the realm of the brave forward.... Why? Because he's only bothered when he's bothered.

Maybe I'm being a bit of an old romantic but it kinda meant something to Evertonians watching Andy Gray do a diving header at the feet of a goalkeeper in his 6-yard box. I'm not asking the 6ft-4in marshmallow to get himself decapitated but to at least look like he wants to get in the mix and finish a cross that deserves finishing.

Deulofeu, as I have said, will be a big stand-out player under Koeman. He will get him fit and he will demand his striker "takes a chance".

What I said was that, by your own admission (via support for what Eddie said), Rom's scoring suffered once the support Del provided was withdrawn. You said it. Let's discuss that, by all means. But don't try to divert attention by arguing about something I didn't say. So, he scored all those goals last season even though, as you say, he suffered from the loss of Del.

Young players are particularly susceptible to bad habits and that is why they need to be constantly corrected whilst they are still learning their trade (aka "coaching", for the benefit of Messrs Martinez, Jones and Lawrence).

Ross in particular suffered in my opinion, as most of the criticism he got was based on faults in his game that were easily addressed if we had had decent coaches.

People are swayed by Lukaku's price tag and forget he is still a young player too. I don't see why he would not benefit from coaching from someone who actually knows what they are talking about, and I think it is pretty ridiculous to give up on anyone until they have at least had the opportunity to improve when they are given said opportunity. Which clearly there was no possibility of under the last regime for whom "discipline" was obviously a dirty word.

I think the point is Andy Gray was hungry and brave whereas Lukaku isn't.

Two in the same game v Sunderland. One v Notts County

Trade mark buffoonery. Once again you dive in arguing about something you clearly don't understand.Get back to me when you have worked out the difference between odds for and odds against.

Eric.

I think you exposed the limitations of your judgement when you spoke about Lukaku's control and "sublime skill" ... and to answer your question: No, I couldn't be arsed to watch the goals – I have already seen them.

Not really any point in discussing them with people who think he didn't scuff the shot against Chelsea. I had enough of arguing with people who were prepared to deny the evidence of their own eyes throughout Martinez's ... err, leadership.

Why don't you be man enough to admit you made up your allegations about Peter being "deperate" to sign Pelle and the snide little "wet dream" remark? Go on, we all knew you did and we know you did it, simply because he put up an alternative to your "Great"

"Sublime skill" ... still chuckling...

Still, what do Lineker and Shearer know about goalscoring?

Now you're saying the "shot" was scuffed. Important difference between "goal" and "shot"! Nice try but...

(What was that about trade mark buffoonery! as you would say, get back to me when you know the difference!)

Do you realise how pathetic you sound? You embarrassed yourself again by steaming in full of ignorance – absolutely trade mark. Now you're trying to deflect the argument by babbling about a shot or a goal.

Try to get your head around this ... The shot WAS the goal. Get it??? And unless you are completely deaf, dumb or blind, you will know it was scuffed.

By your reckoning, there never could have been a scuffed goal because his goals and his shots have nothing to do with each other.

This is why I won't watch the compilation. Every scuffed shot pointed out will be met with half-witted denial.

"By your reckoning there never could have been a scuffed goal because his goals and his shots have nothing to do with each other." Never said that. The shot is the culmination of the goal. Simple.

"This is why I wont watch the compilation." Says it all.

I never said that's all it was. The guy out-muscled 3-4 players to get into that position. His power startled everyone in football, but he still scuffed the fucking shot. No matter how many times you try to deny it.

I hope Rom scuffs another 18 league goals next season (at least) like last season. I reckon he will scuff 20 minimum.

"...but he still scuffed the fucking shot. No matter how many times you try to deny it." I don't think I ever said it was or it wasn't a scuffed shot.

"And nobody would describe it as scuffed" ... 'cept those who value honesty .

I haven't laughed so much since you triumphantly presented your evidence that Pardew was sacked because of fan pressure ... only to be informed that he was actually sacked.

And he isn't the best at reading crosses into the box either. But he still scores the goals – when he's fired up.

Whilst I'm prepared to cover the entire goal – giving Lukaku the credit for the incredible power he demonstrated. You cant even bring yourself to admit that the shot (the bit where the goal came about) was a scuff.

I don't expect you to admit it, but then I don't need you to ... we all saw it .

If you get round to watching the goals, I would like you to tell me the other goals that where scuffed or miss hit.

But that wont happen because you know if you do that your pathetic little argument wont stand up. Everyone can see this except you.

Keep chuckling to yourself.

I was offering an olive branch by saying that mine was simply an opinion as to whether he scuffed it. But you rejected that olive branch, which speaks volumes about you.

Can you not see that yours is simply an opinion as well? You don't have (nor do I) the exclusive rights on truth. No, I don't "know he scuffed it" and you can't read my mind, can you?! Absurd.

In fact, I would invite all ToffeeWebbers to say whether they think Rom's FA Cup goal against Chelsea was scuffed.

I blame the Belgian team.... they didn't have the ability bend the ball 90 degrees around the man who Rom allowed to get in front of him time after time....

I've seen good stuff posted by each of you on matters other than Lukaku – why not just agree to differ and move back onto those other topics?

I'm with Joe Clitherow, I need to see these players under Koeman before I write anyone off.

How can you give a credible argument about what is scuffed and what isn't when you don't even have the moral courage to admit you were wrong about the mis-hit against Chelsea? You are either denying the evidence of your own eyes or you don't understand clean contact.

I'm beginning to suspect it's the latter – given your ridiculous attempt to convince people that you spent last season witnessing "sublime skill" from Lukaku.

You can keep ducking the question if you like but you are only kidding yourself. Other mis-hits and scuffs PLEASE. You won't because you cant find any can you?

I bet you have been watching him curling them in and stamping your feet. "NOOOOO – there must be some scuffs... I know, I will just pretend I didn't see the question."

Did you say credible? Nice to see you have advanced from scuff to mis-hit. Keep chuckling.

Got loads, Eric, but no point in going through them with somebody who either denies the evidence of his own eyes... or doesn't know what a clean strike is.

Man up and admit the Chelsea goal was a scuff and I will give you other examples. Otherwise, what's the point? You will continue to put you fingers in your ears and go "Lalalalala..."?

In this thread Darren, having boldly stated @ 50, "half of his eighteen goals were scuffs and miskicks, no way will he be that lucky again", is in one of his manic denial modes.

Darren @ 63: "Even the goal against Chelsea (the one he's been dining out on ever since) was scuffed."

Offered a link to view all 25 Lukaku goals this season to identify the claimed scuffed goals, Darren replied @ 85: " No I couldnt be arsed to watch the goals I have already seen them. Not really any point in discussing them with people who think he didn't scuff the shot against Chelsea."

Further challenges are met by Darren @ 89 with: "This is why I won't watch the compilation. Every scuffed shot pointed out will be met with half witted denial."

Because of course Darren is the sole possessor of the truth, as @ 94: "post #64 "And nobody would describe it as scuffed." 'cept those who value honesty ."

And numerous ad nauseam posts mocking the opinions of others challenging Darren's own opinion on the ratio of 'scuffed goals' Lukaku scored this season and whether the finish against Chelsea was scuffed or not.

Well I did take the trouble to view all 25 goals. The breakdown is as follows:

Right foot finish = 8
Left foot = 10
Header = 6
Penalty = 1 (also left foot)

Delboy provided 11 of those goals before Martinez in his wisdom dropped him shortly into the New Year. Next best provider was Ross with 3. There's another discussion in that data...

Only one of the 25 goals - NB Darren ... IMO ... can be called 'scuffed' or not cleanly finished, if you like. That was the goal away to Villa when Romelu bundled Funes-Mori's cross in off his thigh.

The goal against Chelsea - you know, the one that won the FA Cup goal of the season - was a very clean finish hit deliberately across the Chelsea keeper into the far corner with his left instep.

With respect Darren, you are in no position to question the honesty, judgement or opinion of others when your own claims can demonstrably and easily be proven false.

Time for another whiff of the laughing gas, Darren?

You're making yourself look very, very silly.

I'm in the Rom camp but feel that maybe he could do with being brought down to earth in similar fashion? Something like "you're quite good Rom but there's a way to go before you're one of the best". You never know, it might hit home.

Remember guys, we're all Evertonians. COYB

Self-righteous individuals who are so intolerant of the opinions of others make debating tedious.

COYB

I stopped bothering about eight Lukaku threads ago!

Catnip I tell you.

Reminds me of my mate after being dumped by his fit bird – "She's an ugly dog anyway, and her fanny stinks"

It seems to have escaped your one eyed view that even before I posted on this thread it was Eric who began trying to put down other peoples opinion by calling them "numpties" "girls" "desperate". accusing people of having wet dreams about a player simply because he rates him higher than Lukaku. acting the superior blue, saying others did not undestand the meaning of NSNO, calling the "FIFA experts"

He then has the temerity to say . . Get this "self righteous individuals who are so intolerant of the opinions of others make debating tedious" . . You could not make it up.

This is a footy forum. I'm happy to debate all day but when somebody takes the gloves off, then he has no business screaming the house down if he gets a taste of his own. Neither do you. You Jay are as big a hypocrite as he is . . You tell me that I'm in no position to question other people honesty, opinion or judgement when mine can be proven to be false . . How ? . . .by yours

I don't need laughing gas Jay I will be laughing at you hypocrisy for days.

I don't give a flying fuck how many where scuffed mis hit, I don't care if his headers went in off his ear, his shoulder, or in the opposite corner to where he meant to put it, I welcome any Everton goal, but don't expect me to listen to people who try to dress it up as sublime skill.

you said;"It seems to have escaped your one eyed view that even before I posted on this thread it was Eric who began trying to put down other peoples opinion"

Wrong!!! you started at post#30 calling peoples opinions "bollocks"
My first post was sometime after that!!
Or did you not bother to even check your facts again?

My first post was not directed at an individual like yours, it was a generalisation.

You on the other hand repeatedly attacked somebody because he rate Pelle... see the difference? People can get as harsh as they want with my posts. Unlike you, I won't scream the house down. It's a man's game.

Not like you to be having a row!

Such a man that you are.

All four say he hit it with the inside of his left heel,

Why would I admit I was wrong? I did see incredibe raw power to get himself into the position, but saw a very definite scuff... not "sublime skill".

These are all neutral reports from the BBC, ITV, SKY, all the papers.
Be prepared to cringe when the words you don't want to here are being used like world class, sublime, brilliant.

Now these quotes where not from my Brother, Son, Mother etc; these were from football journalists who do this thing called reporting for a career.

Not even by those who have seen the greats.

Just feel the pride gushing through your body when you read about one of our players getting all the plaudits, even from some of those greats you talk about. It makes you proud to be a blue.
COYB

Think we can give this a rest now, Darren, I'm getting bored now. Shall we just agree to disagree with no hard feelings as fellow Blues?
Eric xx

Southampton away; tries to head in one corner, connects badly and it ends up in the other.

West Brom away; "header" comes off ear and left shoulder.

West Brom away; bungled first attempt fall kindly for easy tap-in.

Norwich away; see Southampton away header meant for near post mis directed ends up in far.

Pen against Butler; bobbler down the middle.

Villa away; goes with his foot, puts it in with his knee.

Saw these, won't be watching video to confirm what I saw.

Soon the season will be away and we will have better things to talk about.

I hope Lukaku get 30 goals next season scuffed or otherwise . .unless he moves on,

Wink wink.

Darren,

You've just reminded me of one of my favourite Everton goals. Phil Neville's first for the club (I think) in a 3-0 victory over Newcastle. A twenty yard 'thunderbolt' that he twatted right-footed into his own left foot before it looped over the keeper.

Gets fast tracked..... but they forgot to teach him the basics.

Why would his physical attributes not be considered attributes? He's not going to progress much physically now but he'll continue to develop as a player.

I couldn't care less whether he "bungles" his efforts as long as they keep going in. We've had plenty of strikers who couldn't do what he's done.

Your posts are curiously hypnotic. A runaway train of disparate thoughts threatening to jump the rails, leaving a passenger-reader giddy and nauseous with the roller coaster ride of high octane emotion, totally unsure of your final destination or the likelihood of even arriving there.

I see in post 134 - 3 days after claiming @ 50, "half of his eighteen goals were scuffs and miskicks, no way will he be that lucky again" - you finally offer a list of six goals you claim support your earlier view.

The list you offer as evidence of scuffs and miskicks can legitimately be challenged by others as being nothing of the sort.

Even stretching the truth to breaking point and allowing you the six goals you list as evidence of said scuffs and miskicks, my maths makes that considerably less than the 50% you claimed earlier.

It's also curious that you won't lower yourself to view the offered link showing a compilation of all Lukaku's goals, preferring instead to trust your memory (which evidently isn't the best...).

But in an attempt to support your claim about his cup goal against Chelsea, in post 130 you go to the trouble of:

"Just froze Lukaku's shot against Chelsea at the point of impact, I got four different people to look at it and say where they thought he had made contact. All four say he hit it with the inside of his left heel."

Putting aside how sad that reads, how desperate you are to be 'right,' my reaction is ... Really? I can only conclude you and they don't work in healthcare or missed the biology class on anatomy.

Carry on ranting Darren. It is obviously very therapeutic for you.

I think he'll stay, but he'll need to work on his PR and improving that 'scuffing'. 25 scuffs in all competitions is no where near good enough.

N.S.N.O. Rom, N.S.N.'kin O.

Where's the 'Scuffing Coach Money' Mr Moshiri?

On the other hand the likes of Hazard actually seemed to stop passing it to Lukaku. I think 'pinball feet' did his team mates nut in.

Did you watch him against Wales the other night Eric? It was almost poetic how he followed my script. "Other than the Belgian wingers taking the welsh full backs on and making the centre halves leave lukaku he will fit snuggly in Williams back pocket" ..... by jove didn't that just happen eh! It really comes to something when Robbie Savage is being critical of a strikers anticipation (I call that hunger really). He runs in straight lines as demonstrated by his inability to get in front of his marker for byline crosses (does he actually think the defender should just let the ball go through his legs?).

In short he's a million miles away from the player you are so steadfastly supporting despite the fact he doesn't want to be here next season.

I await more interesting soundbites from the buffoon. He must be cacking it... just imagine thinking you are going to get a move to somewhere like chelsea and they buy your international understudy..... it seems conte knows his stuff. He seems to rate pelle too.

My gut feeling is that Romalu's fate has been decided and that the club is forcing him to put in a transfer request.

The irony of your post will of course be completely lost on you. You of all people speak about the "desperation to be right". You even trying to reignite an old argument because you feel you missed your chance,

I love your posts Jay, they are every bit as funny as Eugene's and John Daley's . . so what if those two intend to be funny, your's is a different kind of funny, your attempts at trying to present yourself as insightful and intelligent make me howl . .You're ToffeeWeb's Very own David Miliband.

I will not look at the footage because by doing so, I would be accepting the possibility that you may be right. Your not. Lukaku has a head like a fifty pence piece. If you think those headers against Southampton, West Brom and Norwich all ended up where he intended them to, you need your eyes testing, if you think that bobbler penalty against Buttler was intended you are a fool. I'm sure if I watched the footage I would come up with more than six. but I will stick with what I saw .

Before you question my memory, you may want to visit specsaver's (They're doing two for one) and having come to the conclusion that Lukaku only miscued one goal last season (even though you have just watched the footage) You may want to get your judgement looked at too.

We had lots of visitors yesterday and I have the Chelsea game recorded, it took about 30 secs to show them Lukakus goal and although they all loved the goal, to a man they thought he had miscued the shot. If that sounds sad to you, you maybe should consider mixing in football circles, footy lovers do it all the time. Its far healthier than returning to a football forum repeatedly because you find somebody else's posts "curiously Hypnotic"

Get out more, form a few opinions of your own. . .and ditch the hypocrisy

Nor am I fussed, fazed or intimidated by the windbaggery, harranguing, hectoring, snide, sneering, mocking personal abuse commonly found in your posts whenever anyone has the termerity to offer an alternative view to your own.

You are not the sole possessor of 'the truth' Darren. Nor am I.

You chose not to see in my post @ 116: "Only one of the 25 goals - NB Darren ... IMO ... can be called 'scuffed' or not cleanly finished, if you like." (The bold type might have helped, but evidently not).

And you advise me to visit Specsavers..?

Nothing wrong with my recall, my vision, my judgement, but thanks for your concern Darren.

Lukaku's goal against Chelsea was, for me, the single most electrifying moment of a largely mundane season. The live reaction in the stadium and here on TW (and post match) reflected a similar euphoria to my own.

You feel a need to denigrate it as a means to further devalue Lukaku's worth to maintain your absolute (negative) position on the player.

In the face of challenges to your bigotted position, you repeat again how you got a panel of visitors to view and agree with your interpretation of the finish.

Darren... Seriously, so what? That is not proof positive that you are right and anybody and everybody else with a contrarian opinion is wrong.

Having made your ProZone freeze-frame analysis of Lukaku's strike, I can imagine you prompting your audience: "There, there! See that fuzzy blur? He scuffs it with his heel!"

"Yeah right, whatever grandad... can I get back to me texting now?"

Or...

"Aye? Aye? What's our Darren on about now?"
"Ahh, you know how he is ... just agree with him before the tea cups start flying ... we're running out of crockery."

(Other scenarios available).

Given your forensic attention of the Chelsea goal, this latest comment says it all about you:

"I will not look at the footage [of the 25 goals] because by doing so, I would be accepting the possibility that you may be right."

And that, dear Darren, is evidently too much for your fragile ego to take, isn't it?

I went to the trouble to view again all 25 of Lukaku's goal and gave an honest appraisal of them. You continue to refuse to do so, trusting instead your evidently prejudiced memory. Yet you have the gall to accuse me of hypocrisy.

Phttt!

Carry on chuckling, Chuckle Brother.

In fact, till Rom had a go at the full back and got his momentum, I don't think he was in the game at all. After that, it was like fish in a barrell – he was in the box and they either took him out with a risky tackle or tried to play him on his weak side. It looked good but in reality wasn't exactly a great great goal. Just dynamic and yes, half his studs took up the turf when he hit it. Personally? The second goal was better.

Waiting for Rom to have a good game is like sitting in your back garden in July with a bottle of factor 8, an ice cold beer and the Beach Boys playing in the background. When the sun comes out, it's great and the day lives in the memory... but the majority of days are overcast, windy and miserable. People on here try and forget the 28 miserable days and focus on the 3 good ones.

I mean, ffs, people are saying he's got 2 goals in the Euros.... yes, he has, but he has been garbage, absolute garbage. His performance against Italy was cringe-worthy. It was like watching the fa cup semi final all over again. The Wales game??? Awful again.

Please someone bid the daft money touted. Get rid.

Here is the link.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Wk7wrcdcag

Watch Azpilicueta. Listen to the commentary. The words "brute strength" and "shrugs off challenges" are used by the commentator. Not "defenders backing off".

Why denigrate a great goal? He maybe a gob shite for the things he said this summer, but he scored a cracking goal and if he produces this again in the coming season I am sure we will all leap for joy.

Tell you what, Rom, your arrogance and clear lack of effort towards the end of last season (I think that you thought your job was done with the Chelsea goal), truly shows you for what you are. I've commented on various threads recently and I stand by my hope that I never see you in an Everton shirt again.

Take your "I'm the dog's bollocks" attitude somewhere else. Oh, that's right... no-one else is interested – hence the reported U-turn. Get lost.

Might make some interesting reading!!

"it was a moment of individual brilliance that won it for us"

Not my words!!

I wonder who said that?

Let our new coach work with the players and judge them. I admire Lukaku and believe that Koeman can make him much better.Same goes for John Stones. I believe that there should be a total amnesty for any player who had his career damaged by the worst coach who ever earned a living at it.

If RK looks at Lukaku and thinks that we need him gone, fair enough. However, I hope that a new start will see the best in all of our squad.

A goal, incidentally, which you too deemed worth of praise on the night it was scored, as Eric Holland points out.

The Lukaku "marmite/love him/hate him" debate I have left out of my post.

Now, unless you are telling me that the TV cameras in this youtube link I pasted for you doctored Azpilicuta's hand on Lukaku's shoulder, clearly trying to pull him back, then you sir have a faulty memory of the goal, or possibly optical issues which may extend to a blinkered view of what was a superb goal.

I will say however that I think Lukaku is a gob-shite, although that does not change the brilliance of the goal.

"Keen student of your posts " ? Hate to break this to you fella, but I never read them. They're too long. I see your name, see the length of your post and invariably move over it. I don't remember commenting on, or responding to your post . . ever. Sorry.

You seem to have gotten yourself a little confused. its not my style to go straight for the jugular when I post. I try to attack a point not the person. I'm not going to come on here and say I'm whiter than white, if somebody aims a low blow at me personally, I am more than guilty of responding in kind, but I don't bleat about what others say. Its a mans world and football supporters play rough. Hands up, I'm guilty of putting down the other guys argument in a debate. but that is a million miles away from being abusive. You on the other hand . . .

You entered the fray with a frenzied personal attack. Nine times you mentioned my name (eighteen in three posts) Then you have the brass neck to say you are not "intimidated" by ME ??? Do you realise how ridiculous that sounds ?
You sound like a bully who has taken several cheap unprovoked shots, only run away crying "stop picking on me . . .I'm not scared of you".
I know you believed you were dismantling my posts, but you have neither the guile or the wit, you couldnt dismantle a game of Ludo. You have furiously backtracked on your boast that my claims could be "demonstrably and easily proven false" but only after several failed attempts to do just that . .Once you hypocrisy was pointed out, you decide we all have an opinion.

I believe those who said there where no scuffs from Lukaku, not only missed the obvious ones, but also failed to take into account the headers and bobbling penalty down the middle of Buttlers goal.

So I will pose the question again. Does anybody believe Lukaku made clean contact with everyone of those headers and that penalty . .or the one he put in at WBA with his knee/shin ?
If one single person comes back and tells me that they were all clean contacts and that you are not in a minority of one, I will accept that it really is the Honest considered opinion of some.

BTW; Eighteen times ? I know you find me "curiously hypnotic", but, you need to know I'm very happy with the missus

"Brilliant brace, the finishes were the best part – arrowed." Peter what can I say? I agree with you as well.

Lukaku does not get the number of chances he could as he is, in my humble opinion, a lazy bugger. If he worked harder he could be worth what he thinks he is.

See post 91. No contradiction from me, I havent wavered from my view. I have not seen anything like that, he played skittles with three/four men . . but he still scuffed the final shot.

Nice try, but trawling back months desperately trying to be right didnt quite come off

But he is still dining out on it, and he still scuffed it. You deny that, so we don't agree

I'm not upset, just disappointed that you havent supported jay in my challenge.

Why don't you come back and tell me the headers I spoke about were not mis-cues

He's completely overrated. Loved by his fan boys, criticised by us grumpy lot.

I've never known a player to be so highly hyped who is so lazy and can't control a football.... quite remarkable really.... kenwyne lukaku.

It must be out there somewhere! I would imagine every time Lukaku scored a goal last season you will both have slagged him of and said what a fluke the goals where.
Be back soon just off to do some trollin.

You and others repeatedly challenged me to name goals that were miscue's. You clearly believed that because I wouldnt, I couldnt . . .so I did.

Cue Silence.

There is evidence of an Orwellian Ministry of Truth rewriting of history by some.

And - no! - I'm not even referring to the 'How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?' debate in relation to which and how many of Rom's goals last season were scuffed or not.

I refer to the revisionism, misrepresentation, contradiction and outright hypocrisy of posts within this very thread.

Entertaining and revealing on a kind of voyeuristic 'reality TV' kind of way on one level, trite and tedious on another.

Nowt stranger than folk, as they say.

I-Zingari.

I must be missing something here, but is there a slightly sneering view of the I Zingari going on here? See, as a young apprentice, one of the old French Polishers I worked with, who would be over a hundred if he were still alive, always said that the I Zingari was a top league in his youth and I admit that when I played in it in the 60's there were some damn good players and some of the best pitches in Liverpool.OK, they weren't up to Ford's or maybe Crawford's standard but they were pretty good just the same. I left Liverpool in the early 1970's so, has the Zingari plummeted in quality or what? Just interested that's all.

You are missing something. Some weeks ago, I mentioned that I had played in the I-Zingari and one of the above contributors (no prizes for guessing who) berated me for playing at such a poor level and added something about laughing while his girlfriend pissed on his dog. Now, on this thread, he claims not to have made personal attacks, only arguing the point.

I too played in that league in the '60s, later in the Liverpool League, Ellesmere Port, and in Perth and Sydney after leaving Liverpool in 1972, and it was a decent standard.

No sneering from me, Ray, or at whatever level anyone has played, but I did feel the need to correct his claim and I apologise if I have given the impression of sneering.

Girlfriends pissing on dogs? Is this a local phenomenon, passing craze or what? Don't the dogs object? Sets rather a bad impression to pups don't you think?

Sydney? Fabulous place.

First of all, I did not say "never ever" – you made that up, didn't you? What I said is still there In post #165. I actually said "if someone aims a low blow at me, I'm more than guilty of responding in kind." ... See the difference?

In the article you decided to rake back up again, when I laughed at your claim that you learned to control a ball with your shin, it was in response to your personal attack, which was "or are you just being a cant because of previous posts". Changing a letter does not make your response any less abusive.

As for claiming I spoke about "someone's girlfriend pissing on a dog" – How warped is that? Is that really what you read? You have to read what is actually said rather than what you would have liked to have been said.

I could imagine the crowd (somebody's bird and a dog) would be pissing themselves as Alan "controlled" it down the wing with his shin...

Let's be a little less OTT please!

Know who said that? Yeah, Benny Hill.