Everton Left Counting the Cost of Someone Else's Battle

It's a difficult one. For people in Ireland, Wales,Scotland and other countries, the international games represent the only real opportunity for them to see their boys in the flesh.

But yes, the case for moving these games to the summer becomes more and more compelling.

Take time to heal and come back 100%, Seamus. True Blue. Living Legend. Proper Player.

"Take time to heal and come back 100% Seamus. True Blue. Living Legend. Proper Player."

With those two Irish clowns, he'll be playing as soon as he gets off his crutches.

Exactly how I feel.

I've felt absolutely gutted for Coleman all day, and can only hope that the break in his leg is a clean one and we see him back on the pitch as quickly as possible. My thoughts too to his wife and family, who must be equally devastated.

As for Neil Taylor... out of interest, I went to an Aston Villa fans forum to read some of their comments on Taylor, and for the most part they also quite rightly vilified their club's player for the, well, let's call it what it was... assault. What the hell went through Taylor's mind when he got a rush of blood to the head and decided to charge in, only he will know, but this will be something he'll have to live with for the rest of his life. And sadly for him, whatever may happen in his football career, he may well end up being best known for this one act.

I have no sympathy for him. I'm sure he immediately regretted what he did when he looked back to see the injury; the fact is, he did it – and if there was any justice, he would be banned from all football for a period of time (for arguments sake, let's say three months).

Anyway, I digress – the focus shouldn't be on him. Get well soon Seamus, everyone connected to Everton is behind you.

It's difficult to see how tackles like Taylor's on Seamus can be avoided given the physicality of the game, other than to impose penalties that deter such behaviour.

In comparison, it is not difficult to see how disputes like the one between O'Neill and Koeman can be avoided. It strikes me that there is a role for a third party to mediate, to rule on the medical fitness of a player, over and above the opinions of the warring parties and the player.

Such a ruling to take precedence over any rules from the likes of FIFA regarding international call-up. The third party would represent the protection of the player, for his health, safety and welfare. In this respect, there surely must be some regulation of safety in the UK, to protect players, because at the end of the day they are workers. Perhaps the Health and Safety Executive might be able to have some input here?

"Not that kind of player" talk is bollocks, he has done it so he is exactly that kind of player.

As it happens, the assailant, a thug masquerading as a footballer, will miss a few games (in essence a nice rest). The victim faces a threatened career.

Peter (#3),

I don't wish to be unduly pessimistic but, in my opinion, Oviedo never recovered the full form and confidence he was showing prior to his horrific injury.

Lyndon, a very sensible article, as usual, and I agree with you on International football; I'm just not interested in it, no matter what country is involved, but it will go on, so we just have to wait for these matches to occur and get them out of the way as quickly as possible.

Every Evertonian will be gutted for Seamus and hoping for a better future for him; he is a fighter so has a good chance of getting back in the game, God willing.

The Premier League pits twenty English teams littered with players with generally no affiliation to their teams together. It pays them ridiculous amounts of money before they move on to a club that will pay them more or give them a chance to win more trophies.

I have no problem with the Premier League but what I find strange is the animosity towards International football from the same people that get goosebumps when we have a local player playing for Everton. We also hear about how there are so many Scandanavians supporting Liverpool yet we want to reach out worldwide to attract fans. I don't get it.

I felt sick for Seamus watching last night. It was like someone I knew was down injured. That's really all the bothers me at the minute.

Even before this, I hated international football.

As for O'Neill & Keane, prize idiots. I hope Koeman has a pop.

Also sickened by Welsh, Villa, & Liverpool fans having a pop at Coleman on Twitter. Disgusting. Get well soon, Seamus.

And I agree, Lyndon, he has been a tremendous player for us. Of late, he was back to his best. What a player, what an attitude, what a nice guy.

We have had the nonsense of Allardyce, then the Republic of Ireland's Laurel and Hardy wilfully discarding Everton's concerns about the fitness of McCarthy whilst simultaneously attacking the manager and the club in public. Hope they are now satisfied.

Now we have Chris Coleman trying to convince us that Taylor is Mr Nice Guy. Suddenly Southgate is beginning to sound like a genius.

But it has to be said that I, like most people I know, have become less interested in the game as a whole, and more interested in what happens to Everton and Everton alone. I rarely watch any other teams these days, and have ditched Sky because of that. I can get all the Everton games on my computer and that's all I need.

Lyndon's piece really says it all. But you still feel the need to express sadness and sympathy. As you would for any player but especially for such a decent person as Seamus.

You hope it's a clean break and heals well. And then you hope his confidence in tackles is not diminished when he returns (cf Ross?). In the meantime, and I know it's less important in a sense, Everton might be just as well served by the likes of Holgate at right-back.

Best wishes Seamus.

I cannot believe some of the disgusting comments I am reading on Facebook and Twitter from the Kopites and the Welsh. I fucking despise Liverpool FC, we back them in everything and this is what we get back in return.

On the incident itself – not so different from Alli's sending off against Gent. That was grams away from a break but luckily for the Gent lad it was higher up the leg and the knee joint absorbed the shock.

I have wanted to see more of Callum Connolly and JonJoe Kenny for a while, though, so perhaps this is the opportunity to allow one of those two to lay down a marker and say to Koeman and Walsh, "You don't need to go into the transfer market – you have me!!"

It's probably best that I just do not post my true feelings. I'm utterly revolted by this.

If no Everton player EVER plays another game for their country, then I won't be the slightest bit disappointed.

Fans, including us, expect players to get stuck in and give their all on the pitch and we are the first to complain about them if we think they are not trying hard enough. Sometimes, in the heat of the moment, tackles are mistimed and players get hurt. It's unfortunate but football is a contact sport and injuries both minor and major are likely.

We can only hope that Coleman recovers as quickly as he can but I would not expect to see him in a blue shirt for the best part of a year.

Now, as bad as it is for Coleman, it has created an opportunity for someone else at the club to stake a claim for a first-team place. Names have been mentioned in the OP. Holgate, Connolly, Kenny etc. So hopefully, unwanted as it is, this cloud will have a silver lining for someone else. Let's hope whoever gets it is up to the job.

I am Welsh, but I would have preferred to have seen Wales thrashed and eliminated from the tournament than to witness this. I wish Seamus a speedy recovery and want to see him back to his best in the future.

Seems like everyone's mood is downcast. Not even beating the RS & Mancs would make it up.

I think the answer would almost universally be "Yes".

For those who want to play International football, they should be supported and managed responsibly; for those who don't they should be allowed to sit out, supported in that decision and allowed to get on with their club careers.

I'm not mad for International football, and have little interest in the qualifying stages and friendlies, though, if you are going to have global tournaments – which millions of football fans around the world are interested in – then these are a necessary evil.

I have a hunch many of those who "hate" international football will gush over the top team of the time, whether it be Brazil, Argentina, Italy or Germany and perhaps take a lot of enjoyment out of seeing a Costa Rica or Iceland, for example, show up against the big boys and turning the tables.

International football, if managed correctly, adds to the global football experience, it doesn't detract from it in the greater scheme of things. We as supporters have pulled the short straw over the past 24 hours but this is down to a pair of irresponsible coaches and a hugely irresponsible tackle.

Ask Seamus Coleman this morning if he'd prefer to have never played for Ireland – and I imagine he'd answer very clearly he'd do it all again tomorrow,

My thoughts are with him. I wish Seamus a speedy recovery after a horror tackle which we all wish, including Taylor I'm certain, had never happened. It's one that could have happened just as easily in a blue shirt as it had a green though, both of which I'm sure Seamus is equally proud of wearing.

Get well soon.

I would give anything to see young Mason smash in a "That one's for Seamus" winner to sicken the fuckers next week.

Best wishes to Seamus.

Good article on the Arseblog if you are interested:

Seamus Coleman's injury was sadly inevitable and Neil Taylor is that kind of player

The FA should revoke players' licenses or this kind of violence.

I would look into legal proceedings, but I imagine that the PFA have that angle covered.

Dogs are put down for less.

Best wishes to Seamus and I hope he makes a full recovery in whatever time he needs to do that.

Now I know he didn't mean to damage him, but it was vicious, and the authorities need to come down strongly on this, as each player has a duty of care to fellow players. God help him if we get Aston Villa in the cup next season.

As for McCarthy, I've always been a big fan, but if he prefers risking his career thanks to Moron O'Neill, then he doesn't deserve to wear the Everton shirt... FFS, he isn't even Irish!

1. Taylor should be banned for at least 8 games from International football + a sizeable penalty. There needs to be punitive action to discourage rash tackles not just platitudes.

2. O'Neill and Keane (and/or the Irish FA) need to be hit with some sort of action over the McCarthy situation. There's been previous when he's been taken unfit and effectively had problems exacerbated and the club medics and management made this point but were ridiculed and insulted. Yet again they've demanded an unfit player features against club advice and the result is an injury – this is flat-out negligence. If it was in any other profession there'd be some sort of criminal or civil case, that won't happen here, but there needs to be something done to deter this nonsense.

When the Irish FA start paying for players and their salaries over the season, they can call the shots on these things. Until then, the club's view should come first.

Such phrases as "It's turning into a non-contact sport" or "You can't put a tackle in early like you used to" or even from fans themselves wanting that "Big Grock, nasty fucker of a centre half"... well, you can see why the game has changed over the last few years when Seamus suffers an injury like that.

Let's not forget, Oviedo was never again the player he was before his break. I hope for our sake (and, in a strange way, Taylor's) that one day we can watch Seamus sprinting down the right wing, cutting inside, and slotting one in the far corner. If not, we will be denied a consistent and top class pro in the mould of Baines at his peak and Taylor will have to live with that disgusting tackle for the rest of his life. God help him if he ever plays at Goodison Park or the new dockside.

The standard is the professional football player standard, so in essence would the normal professional in his situation have taken the risk knowing that, if it goes wrong, there was a strong likelihood of a dangerous injury. If all yes to the above, then it is negligence, pure and simple, by definition.

Were there any other defences, such as it's difficult to judge things in real time, ie, in fast moving sport, ie, International football at World Cup level, the player or his football club would normally be liable for Everton's loss. The losses are subject to actual losses which are not covered under contract and or covered under contract but not where covered under tort (ie ,personal injury law).

Was the negligence so bad that it satisfied the jump from civil liability (tort) to criminal liability, ie sufficiently serious, is another question all together.

All that needs to be said is "Wishing Seamus a speedy and successful recovery."

Although we have not heard anything of any disciplinary action,I would have to agree with the writer from Arsenal that the punishment will not fit the crime, and it is about time the world governing body reviewed this.

These incidents should include punishment in the players domestic league, as – even if he is banned for three international games – there was no guarantee that the offending player was going to be picked again.

If a pro footballer didn't want to play International football, he would just retire from International football.

What the hell does that millionaire PFA chairman, Taylor, get paid for? What other union would say nothing and do nothing when such violence is perpetrated by one of it's membership against a fellow member?

From the current squad, if I had to pick someone to be on my side if it ever kicked off at a 'Scouse Wedding', that pick would be Seamus. Because, as Chumbawamba's Tubthumping song goes, Seamus may "get knocked down, but I get up again. You're never gonna keep me down."

His background, his progression in professional football, at both club and international level, demonstrates – as others have referenced – a battler. Someone not easily deflected from his course. He is going to need to draw on all his strength on the long road to recovery.

As Lyndon also mentions, whilst not always at his best this season, he is out on his own within the current squad for his position. He is going to be missed for what he offers the team at both ends of the pitch.

But, one man's misfortune is another's good fortune. We will now see how imaginatively Koeman covers for Seamus's absence and who will claim his shirt and whether they have the mettle to be a regular pick for the first team.

Finally, as no jingoistic nationalist who is not so enthused about international football as I might have been in the past, nor am I totally opposed to it. Calls to only contract players who will not play international football only prejudices the club's interests. Like it or not, the more international players you can field, the likelihood is you have better quality footballers than having a team of non-internationals.

I would also suggest this particular TW aversion to international football is very much a minority view among global football fans. Whilst I would agree too many games at the World Cup or Euros are borefests, in my experience most players selected for their national teams and certainly the supporters DO give greater value to international football than is often expressed on here.

Don't forget also, even allowing for the corruption of officials like Blatter at Fifa, the World Cup is a cash cow that helps finance football (and related social programs) at grass roots level in every football-playing nation on the planet.

And the new head of Fifa is pushing to expand participating teams at the World Cup finals, so those opposed, don't hold your breath just yet that international is destined for the scrap heap.

Once again, get well soon Seamus. We're gonna miss ya, big time.

When the news first broke last night, I was not happy and, having seen some footage, I am feckin' livid. Seamus, or any other player, does not deserve that sort of tackle. To break an opponent's leg is not easy and not an accident, it is gross negligence and basically assault. So best wishes, Seamus, and here's to a full recovery both physically and mentally.

The powers that be need to start clamping down on this again. A few years ago, any studs-up challenge was a straight red (remember Rodwell v the shite) but this seems to have lapsed. This sort of tackle now seems to be acceptable again so has crept back into the game. Time to review the rule / regulation.

Get well soon Seamus lad.

As for Seamus, Everton should sue the Welsh FA for damages because of the reckless and career-ending tackle. At his age, and the time it recovers from such tackles, will cost Everton £20 million to replace Seamus.

We, as Everton, will lose one of our better players for at least six months and possibly a lot longer. Injuries in Internationals are not able to be avoided, and when it happens to one of our players, it is even worse.

The incident last night could have been avoided if the ref did his job and sent off Bale for his horrendous challenge on O'Shea. It was just as high and just as bad, the only difference was that it didn't connect fully.

Bit of balance please. We are Everton.

Big strong lad, but would he EVER do that to a fellow pro?

Can't remember feeling so gutted since we sold "The Red Haired Dynamo".

Couldn't "give a blow of a Ragman's bugle" about the bloody derby at the minute.

Just get well, Shay. Just get well, son. If anyone has the bollocks, then it's you.

I say Ronald should make him Captain for the derby match.

The headline is unfair. Seamus was not fighting someone else's battle. He is an Irishman playing for Ireland. It was not "damned unnecessary" – it was an injury.

I can understand your frustration and I am as upset as you but we will get better and Seamus, my favourite Evertonian, will get better.

Sèamus is a belting player, strong and skillful. Not once in his entire career has he "two footed" an opponent.

Problem with us Evertonians these days is that we've confused our nobility with saying "thank you" for being shafted. It's NOT the same!

We really do have to learn. Being battered isn't a reason to say thank you. Sèamus was assaulted. And I'm pissed off. So are others, and we are fully within our rights.

We can tell gobshites to "Fuck Off!", because standing your ground is not a crime.

I'll stan my groun,
Stan ma groun,
I'll nay be afraid!
(Sgt McKenzie)

That's used in one of my favourite films:

"We Were Soldiers Once and Young".

I cannot hear it without thinking of Big Dunc.

Link

Okay, they are right. I am sad today for Seamus, one of the very few players I have truly liked and admired over the past 50 years. I hope he recovers to lift a trophy for us.

I'm utterly dumbfounded at your comment. "Playing for your country means more". Has Everton become SO meaningless?

But, thank you for illuminating me that my club really have become so third rate.

How many of us have failed to protest and express our expectations during these barren decades? I have. And I'm so very deeply sorry. Genuinely, I am. Genuine apology.

He is Irish! He wants to play for Ireland. What exactly is wrong with that?

As far as McCarthy is concerned, what have Everton being doing about his hamstring problems?

Johnny Sexton has been suffering similar and probably more serious hamstring problems for Leinster and Ireland. He was sent by his club to a Specialist Sports Clinic in Dublin and this specialist treatment appears to have worked.

So...why blame the FAI? What have EFC been doing?

Some of the stuff they put on about Seamus was just horrific. And not just a few of them. I hate the club as a whole.

Safe recovery, Seamus. I'll bring you back some Lourdes water for that leg. God bless.

Our perennially dismal performances in tournaments from all british isles has taken our interest to new lows and our intolerance to new highs.

Well lots of blame to shovel around one might think but in the case of McCarthy and others similarly placed, then they need to own the responsibility of it.

If the lad isn't fit he should say so, so what of ROI pull a hissy fit? He will in all probability get picked again.

James has persistently risked his own career longevity by being meek. He is likely to lose his place at Everton based on his inability to look after himself.

Sure you may get called up but then it should be made plain you cannot play. Hours after a fully fit player gets seriously injured McCarthy should think long and hard about what he wants.

Nothing more need more be said about the cowardly opponent whose name I will not use. You guys said it all.

Regarding Macca, so much of the rage seems to be directed at O'Neill, but I say the player has the greater responsibility, and James was just plain irresponsible to accept this invitation, no matter how tempting. I won't shed a tear if he's shipped out this summer.

ps: Adding my thanks to Jack for the Arseblog link. That's one outstanding blog post. Superb.

(At the same time, I make no judgements about or seek to lessen the pride that others – Shane Corcoran for example – take from following their country's national team.)

In that context, seeing as Everton is not Ireland and that the club have lost a highly influential player through no fault of their own, this was someone else's battle.

And seeing as it could have been avoided by the referee, it did feel – again, to the eyes of someone without a "dog" in the Irish-Welsh fight and who finds the long-winded, season-disrupting qualification process an annoyance and a risk – "damned unnecessary".

Seamus, quite rightly, won't see if that way but the collective we as Evertonians would be within our rights if we did. That was my point.

As far as a replacement is concerned, I suspect Lennon will have a part to play – particularly in those games in which Koeman adopts an attacking approach.

Everton will move on, Ireland will move on but very sadly one of our greatest players may not. It is all about Seamus and surely nothing else.

By heavens, Mike, your opening paragraph entirely sums up my thoughts. Sick to the very pit of my stomach.

I cannot wait for the day that Seamus pulls on his Royal Blue Jersey again.

I would love Ross Barkley to get a World Cup winners medal because, as an Evertonian, I see him as a local lad and I want the best for him.

It's not about flags or jingoism and as Shane said on another thread.

If only players could bottle that for this club, they would truly appreciate what a great club this is!! Rom, read this please.

Keep up the excellent writing on this website

I completely understand those that regard the international game as an interruption and potential irrelevance to the greater interest of a club's fortunes. I know these feelings are shared by a lot of fans irrespective of nationality.

However, as an Irish fan, I am more conflicted as I know that the deeper meaning of representing one's country, particularly a small and young nation. I do not condone the Irish manager and assistant's attitude to the club. For me, that has all the hallmarks of a dispute that could and should have been avoided with better diplomacy.

I am a proud Evertonian and a proud Irishman and the only thing I would ask of those of who utterly disengaged from the international game is that, in Ireland, at least, the national team is a source of great pride for football fans.

Seamus Coleman embodies the sort of honest and ingrained endeavor of those raised in Gaelic Games (and highly parochial) tradition where representing your own place has a significance that is hard to explain to everyone who is understandably pissed off with Everton players returning from Irish matches on crutches.

I do understand the different viewpoints and that international success or failure (particularly of a country to which you have no affinity) may seem like an abstract and downright aggravating intervention into the regular flow of the club game. I'd also point to the fact that international football is an enormous sense of pride for many nations and the spine on which the global game is built.

I am gutted for Seamus as a fan and I wish him the best in his recovery. I will continue to proudly support both Everton and Ireland. COYB

If then you have a team like England where most players couldn't be arsed, are overplayed and overpaid – and not very successful in the past number of years (in terms of expectations at least), then I can understand those people losing interest in Internationals.

However, many Irish, Scots and Welsh think differently about their Nation, don't have the luxury of Premier League footie each week, and pride themselves on their national team through thick and thin. Seamus has blue veins and a green heart and is decision to play for Ireland should be respected. He is rightly captain and should not be criticised for playing for his country – nor should anyone.

Yes, Keane especially should shut-up for once and also O'Neill must be strongly criticised for their handling of McCarthy. But don't wipe Internationals off the cards for everyone just because team USA or England are crap (supposedly).

Seamus is a legend and my heart breaks for him and for the absence of his spirit, motivation and boldness in a blue shirt in the coming months. Get well soon, Seamus – we'll need you back when you are ready to go.

So as fans who generally are more dedicated to our clubs than the international team we just have to accept that players go on international duty. Plus the better your team then the more likely you will have more international players.

For Seamus, this was very much his battle and not someone else's and unfortunately he has paid a heavy price for being in that battle. I would hasten a bet that, even though he obviously does not want the injury, he would not duck the battle.

We should celebrate our players who are selected for international duty.

As for any 'national pride', I have none... at all.

Basically, I heard George Carlin for the first time in the late 1970s and the effect was immediate and lasting (it's why I'm not proud to be 5' 8")

Link

A lot of us follow two sports in the main, soccer and GAA. In soccer, due to a relatively poor but improving league, we look to our nearest neighbours for entertainment and a team to follow.

In GAA we follow the county you're brought up in. There is no alternative. That's the way it is. All the players are from that county and, with one or two noticeable exceptions that I won't get into, that's the way it is.

The contrast is huge. Playing for ridiculous money, for a club that you have no affiliation with versus playing for nothing with a group of players that couldn't have been brought up more than two hours from you.

The closest thing in soccer to this is the national team, albeit diluted by the Granny rule. Now supporters from other countries will tell me I'm talking shite as they don't have a GAA equivalent and can be just as passionate but I still feel it plays a big part for me.

Friday night was a big game for both nations as Wales had to win to get themselves back in with a chance of qualifying. Roy Keane certainly stoked the fire before hand with talk of tough but fair tackling and so it panned out.

As we all know, Seamus is a fully committed player which is one of the main reasons we love him so much and he really went flying into that tackle but Taylor was reckless with his lunge. It could have happened in any Premier League game but I can understand the frustration of many who are not Irish (or Welsh) who think it's a terrible injury for a stupid international game that doesn't matter. I see FIFA will be paying Coleman's wages for the time he's out.

Re McCarthy, it's hard to get accurate information but from what I read he felt a small twinge during the warm up and decided not to risk it himself. Maybe he was going to do that the whole time but wanted to look keen to play.

Seamus could have suffered a bad injury from a terrible tackle in a Premier League or Cup fixture, as Aaron Ramsey or indeed Oviedo did.

International football meanwhile provides a platform for many a talent and try telling Ronaldo that Portugal's exploits in Euro 2016 were not worth writing home about, which may not have been possible without an extended format necessitating more qualifiers.

Taylor was undoubtedly reckless but career threatening injuries are the black swan events of top level football, to borrow a phrase from the financial markets: not very common but when they do occur the consequences can be dire.

I am optimistic for Seamus and believe he can still have a long career with the blues. He may need to adapt his game but he has more than enough ability to change his game and still prove to be an effective right back.

I also think Holgate has the talent to stand in as an able deputy. We may lose the cut and thrust down the right that Seamus gave us, but having depended on the Bainaar axis for years down the left, the side will need to find a new way of breaking down the opposition.

Who knows, perhaps Koeman can look to Lookman and Calvert-Lewin to provide speed down the flanks, with our full backs returning to more conventional defensive roles, freeing the youngsters to attack with freedom.

So much for my long-time admiration of Martin O'Neill!

From the last shenanigans involving McCarthy, Koeman has basically refused to speak to O'Neill (who has contacted him or tried to) on a number of occasions, and proper order to.

I don't think O'Neill has any chance of speaking to Koeman directly unless he and Keane acknowledge and take back / apologise in the press or whatever that they indeed messed up last time round with McCarthy and looking at what happened this time round that looks like it isn't going to happen.

McCarthy I was told today was under big pressure to try and get himself fit for the Wales game. That doesn't excuse him being an idiot in my opinion. The player should have been telling O'Neill / Keane he wasn't properly fit; by not doing so, he has treated Everton FC with zero respect.

It will be a long battle, Seamus, but I am sure you have the grit and determination to come back stronger than ever.

Good luck on behalf of all Evertonians!

Seamus, a wonderful person in so many ways is going through quite an ordeal. He has probably pondered whether his career is over or at least is negatively impacted by the injury. I hope not. I really admire the man. He has the character to fight through this, and that is half of the battle.

If you are reading this, Seamus (probably not), I cannot wait to see you out there again fighting with all your heart for OUR team and giving that quality, that in my opinion, has made you the stand out right back in this league for the last several years.

How many full backs provide assists and score goals for fun like you. You are invaluable!

As someone who practised Criminal Law for 20 years, I remember that 'intention' is not a requirement of assault; 'recklessness' will do. There is absolutely no doubt that what happened was reckless.

'Ah, but it's different if it happens of the pitch'. Really? I think Duncan Ferguson would beg to differ!

Ronnie – stop bleating on about Martin O'Neill, who actually has a better track record than you as a top flight manager .

Focus instead on Chris Coleman, who sent out his players in the second half v Ireland to do damage.

Once Bale got away with his assault on O'Shea, it was open season – resulting in Taylor attacking our Seamus Coleman, thinking he could get away with it.

Who is the real culprit?