Favourites aren't always the best, Part 3

John McFarlane, Sr 11/12/2017  116 Comments  [Jump to last]

Jock Lindsay

Continuing my theme of who I regard as the best Everton players in their respective positions, I started in Part 1 with the inestimable Gordon West in goal.

Before I reveal the next player to feature, I have given some thought to the response to Part 2, featuring Alex Parker, a lot of people selected Tommy Wright as their favourite right back, and I'm convinced that I should have seven substitutes in my team, (with only three to be used if necessary as per today's system). I will disclose the identity of each substitute as we progress, so Tommy has the dubious honour of being the first substitute.

My choice for left back is a player that the more elderly will be familiar with, the younger readers may not have even heard of his name. This player made a big impression on me when he joined Everton from Rangers in 1951.

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John Smith Lindsay was born on 8 August 1924 in Auchinlech, Scotland. His time at Ibrox was a frustrating period because the full-backs in the Rangers first team were George Young and Sammy Cox, both of whom were Scottish internationals. George Young was actually captain of both Club and Country, so it's no surprise that "Jock" as we knew him, decided to try his luck south of the border.

Jock's first two games were what's known as a baptism of fire: his debut was Old Trafford against Manchester United on 17 March 1951, where he gave away a penalty. Luckily for him, Ted Sagar saved the spot kick, but Everton went down to a 3-0 defeat. His home debut was against Blackpool and here he had to face Stanley Matthews; I'm afraid that this too ended in another defeat, 2-0 this time. I watched this game from the 'Boys Pen'. I know that Bill Kenwright is ridiculed for saying that he started watching from the Boys Pen but, in those days, that was where we served our apprenticeship.

Jock was signed originally to cover for George Rankin, another name that the younger supporters will not be familiar with,. Jock didn't feature again until the last two games of the season, a 1-0 defeat to Stoke City at the Victoria Ground and the 6-0 defeat to Sheffield Wednesday, which resulted in both Everton and Wednesday being relegated to the Second Division. A draw would have seen Everton safe, but it wasn't to be. I'm from an Everton family on my mother's side; my dad wasn't interested in football, and he thought that a trip to the pictures would mend a broken heart – big mistake!

The following season, 1951-52, Jock started in 40 of the 42 league games, and 2 FA Cup games. I mean no disrespect to the full backs who preceded Jock but he showed me, [a near 13-year-old boy] a side to full back play that I'd never seen, he wasn't a "clear your lines" type of defender, as I remember him, he was more cultured. In season 1952-53 he started 39 league games sharing the left back position with Don Donovan, George Rankin, and Jimmy Tansey, Jock played in the 4-3 FA Cup semi-final defeat to Bolton Wanderers, another heartbreak day.

A day that sticks out in my mind, was when we played West Ham United at Goodison. Everton were defending the Gwladys Street goal and a lofted clearance was heading towards the Bullens Road side of the ground. Two West Ham players were so intent on getting the ball that they ran into each other, Jock had anticipated this and he just took a step back collected the ball and walked around the stricken pair. It wasn't a happy ending though because West Ham won the game 2-1, I can only remember that Eddie Wainwright scored for Everton and Harry Hooper got one of the goals for the visitors.

Jock scored only two goals for Everton – both were penalties, one against Derby County in a 6-2 win at the Baseball Ground; the other in an 8-4 win over Plymouth Argyle at Goodison Park.

Sadly, Jock's Everton career came to premature end ,when he suffered a broken leg in a game against Stoke City (on 10 April 1954] which ended in a 1-1 draw, Tommy Eglington on target for the Blues.

I wondered if my memory of Jock had been enhanced by the passage of time, until I stumbled on the tribute that follows:

"Cast in the studious mould Jock Lindsay was a thoughtful player who had great craft in his play. One of only two Scottish players on Everton's books in 1951 (the other was Jimmy McIntosh), he was signed from Glasgow Rangers for £7,000 by Cliff Britton who saw him as a solid and reliable full back with a flair for the unorthodox. He proved to be a useful acquisition, shoring up a defence which at the time was far from water-tight. He remained Everton's first choice until he fractured a leg in 1954.

Two years later, he stunned the Everton Board by demanding a transfer after making 115 senior appearances. In May 1956, he moved to Bury along with teammate John Parker but after only one season at Gigg Lane he left to join South Liverpool as a part time-time professional.

Jock had a brief spell at Worcester city before signing for Bury.

His Everton record was 110 league appearances, 2 goals, 10 FA Cup appearances. his Bury record: 7 league appearances.

Jock passed away in 1991 aged 66/67?

I can reveal now that Ray Wilson is the second substitute to be used, just one more to go.

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Reader Comments (116)

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Rick Tarleton
1 Posted 12/12/2017 at 06:20:48
Hi, John, I think I saw Lindsay only the once in the infamous Plymouth game and he didn't register on my seven year old brain. I suspected you might have gone for the elegant, but unreliable George Thomson who was signed alongside Alex Young from Hearts and who ended up in gaol and dying at a relatively young age.Love the way you keep surprising us and keep stimulating my old memory.
Laurie Hartley
2 Posted 12/12/2017 at 08:21:26
Thanks for your article John. I suspected you would come up with a surprise at left back; however, this chap is before my time.

If my memory serves me correctly I think Mick Meegan was our left back when I went to my first game at Goodison in 1961. I do have some vague memories of George Thomson however.

I was quite surprised when Harry Catterick replaced Mick, an Ireland international, him with Raymon Wilson.

I thought Mick might have been your choice of favourite. Mine would have been a toss-up between Leighton Baines and Raymon Wilson.

John Keating
3 Posted 12/12/2017 at 09:28:43
My mam's cousin was Jimmy Tansey, a local lad, true blue from a family, like ours, of mad Evertonians.

I don't really remember him playing or that period but my dad and uncles always told me he was a good solid hard defender who always gave 100%. Knowing the family, I can believe it!

However for me there is only one left back,

Ray Wilson. What a fantastic player both defending and attacking. Again like Parker, very rarely made a sliding tackle and did not come away with the ball.

We have had numerous left backs since Wilson and, in my opinion, not one could lace his boots, and I include Baines in that.

Simply one of a kind.

Ray Roche
4 Posted 12/12/2017 at 09:50:06
Rick, was that the George Thomson that joined Everton from Hearts in the deal that also included Alex Young? I was surprised to see that he made 20 appearances in our title winning side, I didn't think he'd made that many.
Rick Tarleton
5 Posted 12/12/2017 at 10:10:37
Yes, he was, Ray, and at times he was sublime, but the short step to the ridiculous was also possible with him. I believe from something Brian Labone said that he was the best ball juggler in the club and had at one time been involved as a ball juggler in a circus, but the story may be apocryphal.
Steven Jones
6 Posted 12/12/2017 at 10:18:33
Love your stuff, John – and very educational.

Only just saw Wilson and as a World Cup winner would feel hard done by being on the bench.

From my era, Pat van den Hauwe two Championships Cup Winners etc was the best defender I ever saw and you would want his attitude in any winning side.

Baines was for me the best attacking left-back – his assists and chances made in the current era difficult to match anywhere across Europe and add to that his amazing free kicks and penalties and long service – history might put him higher.

Mine would be Wilson on the Team and Van den Hauwe on the bench

John McFarlane [Snr]
7 Posted 12/12/2017 at 11:01:38
Hi, all, I appear to have achieved what I'd hoped for, and that was to divert all the negativity that was around during the new management debate, and to bring a bit of light relief and revive some old memories.

I think that from the response that my articles have prompted, there is merit in reflecting on the past, and it's proof that though we all see the same players, we differ in our favourites. If my Uncle Tommy was around today, I have no doubt he would be extolling the virtues of Warney Cresswell.

You will appreciate that I will be unable to answer each comment, but if the 6 post rule has been relaxed I would be delighted to respond to as many as I can.

I will however answer one now: John [3] – as Jimmy Tansey was your Mother's cousin, you will no doubt be aware that his brother Gerry was also on Everton's books, but unfortunately he never made the grade.

It pleases me that my memories are bringing pleasure to others, even those who are too young to remember some of the players under discussion, and to sum up it's a case of, "One man's meat is another man's poison" – we all have our favourites and, as I have stated, "Favourites aren't always the best".

Steven Jones
8 Posted 12/12/2017 at 11:05:27
Forgot to do an honourable mention for Keith Newton – one cracking player.

He kept Ray Wilson and Tommy Wright out of England for a while and – even though he fell out with Catterick – was a really classy player and one of the best overlapping fullbacks I have seen.

Dennis Stevens
9 Posted 12/12/2017 at 11:14:24
Thanks, John, that's another fascinating read. Furthermore, as with the previous instalments, the responses of others who remember the era just add to the interest. Super stuff.

Nice to see my home town team, Worcester City, get a mention. Sadly, their feat of knocking Liverpool out of the FA Cup was somewhat before my time!

Stan Schofield
10 Posted 12/12/2017 at 11:20:17
John, another very interesting read. Jock Lindsay was before my time.

For me, it has to be Ray Wilson. As a young Evertonian, my impression of him was that he made everything look easy, that he was absolutely reliable both in the tackle and in using the ball. Also, I will always remember him carrying the Jules Rimet trophy around Goodison with Roger Hunt when we played Liverpool in the Charity Shield in 1966.

Another favourite of mine was Keith Newton, who didn't play many games for us, but made an impression, and was part of the great 1970 title-winning side. He was good with both feet, and a very elegant player.

Ray Roche
11 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:01:54
Rick @5,

Thanks for that insight into Thomson, it's always nice to get little nuggets of information, tales etc. from players from our youth. I don't think that there are players in the game today that have the personality that players in past eras had.

I cannot imagine players from the 1950-60s practising dance moves to celebrate a goal, choreographing them with their mates "Ere, Tony (Kay) what d'yer think of these moves?"

I doubt if Kay, Chopper Harris,Morrissey,Hunter etc. would be able to contain their laughter...

One of the last players who was a larger than life type was Gascoigne, now we have Carlton Pogba with his different hair colours and crap dancing... Lord help us.

John Snr, another good article; Lindsay was before my time really, so Wilson is my favourite, as well as the best I've seen.

Alex Bonnar
12 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:04:02
Here's one for you John. Do you remember, in the 8-4 game against Plymouth you mention, that their centre-half (a man-mountain with a huge black beard) was up against our very own battling, brave and bloodied centre forward, Dave Hickson.

I remember Hickson, who was always winding up the opposition, pulling his beard and upsetting the centre-half so much he lost his temper and chased after Hickson right back into our own half with Hickson protesting his innocence to the ref that he had no idea why their centre-half had completely lost his rag.

The ref then admonished their centre-half while Hickson was chuckling away behind his back. One reason we scored 8 that day methinks. Alex.

Brent Stephens
13 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:14:30
Ray (#4) – "was that the George Thomson that joined Everton from Hearts in the deal that also included Alex Young?"

Jeez, I'd forgotten all about Thomson. For some reason that brought back the excitement at the time of the twin signing.

And Ray (#11), re differences between players of today and then... I know I've said it before but I remember Young living by us on Aintree Lane (end of Aintree Lane or start of Bullbridge Lane). A Wimpey semi. One step up from our council house and we thought that was wealth. No comparison with today's semi's in Cheshire that they live in.

Stan Schofield
14 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:26:15
Brent, from what I can recall, a top footballer's pay in 1970 was around 10 to 20 times the national average. In today's terms that would be roughly £200k to £500k/year, as opposed to the many millions that the top ones now get.

Brent Stephens
15 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:42:45
Stan, I'd take the "£200k to £500k/year" today. A nice pension top-up. But think of the tax!

Ah, yes, tax havens; I almost forgot. To think, a couple of years ago the taxman visited me because, in error, I'd reported in my self-assessment a payment as received in the wrong tax year. It set the hares running for him and tied up an inordinate amount of his and my time trying to discover that error and to then convince him there was nothing else he needed to be concerned about.

Terry Underwood
16 Posted 12/12/2017 at 12:46:25
For me, Ray Wilson. He was one of those players that went unnoticed but was indispensable to the team, totally unflappable. In more modern times, I loved watching Pycho Pat clatter opponents, a hard-tackling, "take no prisoners" full-back.
Tony Heron
17 Posted 12/12/2017 at 13:11:56
Another great read, John, fantastic idea for a set of articles.

Like many others I'm not (quite) old enough to remember your choice and for me the best and my personal favourite was the great Ray Wilson, just pure class. The first left-back I can remember was Mick Meagan in the early 60s. I think though that we've had some good ones throughout the years. Andy Hinchcliffe, Mike Pejic, John Bailey all decent players.

I wonder if anyone remembers John McLaughlin, small but a tenacious tackler. I recall Alan Ball going into meltdown and raging at Keith Newton after making a mistake in a game and he was an England international at the time! Imagine him with Martina now!! How standards have changed.

Andrew Clare
18 Posted 12/12/2017 at 13:14:17
Without question – Ray Wilson. The best defender Everton have ever had. The finest exponent of the sliding tackle I have ever seen. Cool as a cucumber.
Don Alexander
19 Posted 12/12/2017 at 13:34:53
Had the pleasure of a natter with Joe Royle a few years back and he told me he considered Pat van den Hauwe to have been our best left back. Personally, I'd choose Ray Wilson.
Stan Schofield
20 Posted 12/12/2017 at 13:58:35
Tony @17: John McLaughlin was very good when he first joined us in the early 70s. As you say, a terrier when tackling.

Brent @15: It's amazing how HMRC target the likes of us, and most often seem to get it wrong.

On footballer's houses, I remember the standard they had around 1970 was a detached 4- or 5-bedroom house that might fetch in the region of £500k nowadays, in a 'well sought after area close to all local amenities and schools'. I think I've found my vocation, I sound like an estate agent. A 'dream home' for most of us back then, but a far cry from the mansions they have now.

John McFarlane [Snr]
21 Posted 12/12/2017 at 14:24:07
Hi again, everyone. Because I'm that little bit older than some of you, and because I've seen one or two more players, I hope you will appreciate the difficulty I had in whittling my choice down to 11 players plus 7 substitutes.

At the time of adding the second part, there should be 20 parts in total, and already 6 names have been put forward as possibilities for the left back position,

Mick Meagan, George Thomson, Leighton Baines, Ray Wilson, Keith Newton, and Pat van den Hauwe. When you're in your 80th year, and it's your turn to reminisce, you may experience the difficulties I've had in deciding my eventual team and manager.

There are two positions causing me problems; it may come down to the toss of a coin, but I won't divulge which positions they are, just to add to the intrigue...

Stan Schofield
22 Posted 12/12/2017 at 14:32:21
John, well I reckon you'll have a problem with the midfield straight away. I can't imagine leaving any of Ball, Harvey and Kendall out, but that also applies to Peter Reid.

Centre-forward, how to choose between Royle, Latchford and Sharpe. Similarly, centre-half.

But you'll be aware of more players than most of us, so looking forward to what you come up with.

Stan Schofield
23 Posted 12/12/2017 at 14:34:40
John, and that's not even accounting for Young and Vernon.
Ray Roche
25 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:12:39
Brent (#13),

A year or two back, I played golf at Mere Golf Resort and Spa* near Knutsford. I don't know if you've been there but there is a large lake, the mere,along one side of the course. Across the lake there are some rather special Lottery Winner houses, with lawns rolling down to the lake. Beautiful.Some fabulous properties.

The starter told us, while we waited to tee off, that one of the Man Utd footballers had bought one and knocked it down and built a new one in it's place. They are £2.5m - £3m houses. He knocked it down. Don't anyone ever try to tell me that footballers earn there money. Spoilt idiots, many of them.

* Spa. This is not a little shop where we all thought we could get some crisps and pop for the game. Apparently it's a place popular with the ladeees where they get pampered by some oiled up gigolo with a sock down the front of his kecks and a bottle of Johnson Baby Oil. And "pampered" has nothing to do with nappies.

Brent Stephens
26 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:26:02
Ray (#25), I've not played there but know of it. You wouldn't be that oiled-up gigolo, by any chance? With sock down kecks and bottle of Johnson's Baby Oil (though not sure why you'd need a bottle down said kecks as well).

Stan, Roy Vernon was one of the most awkward looking players I've seen (but liked him - an edge about him). Others?

The most graceful (apart from Alex, of course) – Alan Gilzean? Others?

Dave Abrahams
27 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:33:26
Alex (#12), Davie had a few battles with that centre-half George Chisholm and he always came out on top. In another game at Goodison we won 4-1, not sure if that was against Plymouth or Coventry City.

John, I remember Jock Lyndsay very well, particularly the Stoke City game when he broke his leg, think it was on the Saturday after we had beat Lincoln City 3-1 on the Good Friday. As you say, a very good footballing full back but to be honest, John, he is way behind on my list of left-backs who have played for the Blues, after Ray Wilson, I'd have Pat van den Hauwe and the much under rated Mick Meagan among others, but as you say ''each to their own''. Keep them coming, John.

Alan J Thompson
28 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:36:31
Isn't John Bramwell in there somewhere?
Steven Jones
29 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:38:30
On best defender theme – before my time but my dad used to always say the best was T G Jones.

Anyone confirm, enlighten a youngster?

Dennis Stevens
30 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:47:49
John, I think you've made a wise choice in going for your favourites rather than trying to select the best. In many cases it may be one & the same, of course.

However, difficult though it may be, selecting the very best would be infinitely harder than selecting your favourites. Keep up the good work, John!

Jay Harris
31 Posted 12/12/2017 at 15:58:15
Steven,

TG jones was a centre-half but my dad also said he was the best player ever to wear an Everton shirt and he also had the privilege of watching Dixie and Tommy Lawton.

John McFarlane [Snr]
32 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:02:09
Hi Alan [28],

I tried to do a quick count of the left backs I've seen since 1948, from Gordon Dugdale and got fed up with it when I reached number 15, Keith Newton in 1969-70.

Yes, John Bramwell was available for selection, but I'm afraid he wasn't one of my favourites.

Steven [29],

I think you've misunderstand the theme, it's not the best players; the clue is in the title, "Favourites aren't always the best".

Terry White
33 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:02:58
As always there seems to be some confusion – this is not a series on the "best" players; John is naming his "favourite" players, and, as we can see, there is a big difference. Few of us old-timers would disagree that Ray (Ramon, Laurie #2, not RaYmon), was the "best" #3 we have seen but John is quite entitled to his selection of Jock Lindsay as his "favourite".

George Thomson did indeed come with Alex Young from Hearts. He made 73 first-team league appearances including 20 in the Championship-winning season around an injury mid-season having played in all the first 14 games.

Sadly I believe he committed suicide having fallen on hard times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Thomson_(footballer,_born_1936)

Jay Harris
34 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:04:35
John,

Jock Lindsay was before my time but my two favourites were Ray Wilson and Leighton Baines although I don't know which one I would have as sub.

I would also give honorable mention to Pat van den Hauwe – nobody would get past him even if he was having a bad game; Andy Hinchcliffe – The best corner taker going (I would love to know how many goals we scored off his corners); Paul Power – a very classy full-back; and John Bailey – a great character – I used to play in the same team as him as a kid.

Ray Roche
35 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:19:50
John McFarlane Snr (#32), you mention Gordon Dugdale. My wife-to-be rented a flat off Gordon in about 1971 before we got married. He had one of those lovely three-storey terraced houses in Arkles Lane, overlooking Stanley Park. When we got married, he moved into his top-floor apartment and we rented his old flat on the second floor.

I decorated it and put wardrobes etc in and he paid for the materials. He was an absolute gent, frightfully well spoken and forever smoking his pipe. We stayed there for a year before moving to Wales.

He was always modest but could be persuaded to chat about football, I think he played in the same side as Catterick. A really lovely old chap.

Dave Abrahams
36 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:26:17
Brent (26) ''The most graceful''?

How about John White, the ghost of White Hart Lane, brilliant inside right to the great Spurs team of the early sixties, sadly killed when lightening struck him down while on a golf course at a very young age.

Brian Denton
37 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:26:42
My dad used to tell me – in tones of awe – that Irishman Jackie Coulter was the dirtiest player he'd ever seen. Anybody on here old enough to confirm (or indeed deny) that?
Dave Abrahams
38 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:41:35
Ray (35), I think Gordon Dugdale had to retire early; something wrong with his heart if I'm not mistaken.
John Keating
39 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:48:02
Jay,

I knew the Baileys from the 4 Squares, though John was a bit younger than me, I'd often see him kicking a ball around when I "crossed the Brow" to see my mates.

Like me, he went the Friary but not sure if he went to St Gregs or another school after the Friary.

I still occasionally see him around Shaw Street Park area. I think he lives with his sister somewhere around Everton Road way.

Ray Roche
40 Posted 12/12/2017 at 16:52:29
Dave (#38),

I don't ever remember him mentioning that, I just remember him as a very decent sort of chap.

Dave Abrahams
41 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:20:30
Ray (40),

It's a long time ago but I remember that it was recorded in the Liverpool Echo at the time.

Rick Tarleton
42 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:31:11
Gordon Dugdale owned my local off-license on Kensington, always immaculately dressed. However, a local Tory councillor, some things are unforgivable.

Stan Schofield (#14), I remember in 1962-63, Jimmy Gabriel's family, I think his brother really, had a building business and my mate's dad worked at Long & Browning on Queen's Drive. Jimmy was driving for him and said his biggest pay cheque in the season we won the League was £75, that included win bonuses and attendance bonus (£1) for every thousand on the gate over 45,000.

In those days, Brian Labone, an England international, imagine that now, whom I mentioned earlier played cricket in the summer with his mates from his primary school; Flo Melly, not organised cricket just a game with mates in the park, in Walton Hall Park and I was mates with a brother of one of his mates. Later, I played crown green bowls with Brian at The Hermitage.

Stan (#22), I agree about the Holy Trinity, but to be honest, only Colin Harvey gets in my immortals Everton, while Bobby Collins and Tony Kay are certainties.

Brent Stephens
43 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:33:45
Dave #36 - ah, yes, John White!

John #32 "Steven [29] I think you've misunderstand the theme, it's not the best players, the clue is in the title".

Sorry, John, you rightly pull us back on to the original theme!

Bill Gall
44 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:43:50
I like the comment on the Boys Pen being part of your apprenticeship in supporting Everton. I started supporting Everton from 1952 after playing on the ground for the school in a final, getting changed in the home dressing room and winning were the bonus.

After that I started my pre-apprenticeship support by waiting for the gates to open I think it was 20 mins from the end and getting into the Boys Pen on the end of Gwladys Street, after getting a paper boys job I was able to pay to get in. I started work in 1956 and was then able to continue as a paying customer first in Gwladys Street end then on to the paddock and finally finished my apprenticeship as a season ticket holder and part time steward.

I am now 77 years old and my memory is not as good as it used to be but I would go with Ray Wilson who said he never missed a penalty in practice but would be terrified to take one in a game. Great article.

Ian Burns
45 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:44:15
Hi John, another great article and this one has caught me by surprise as I thought Ray Wilson was a shoo-in.

Can't wait for Part 4 because now you have me guessing.

Don't let Christmas get in the way, John – keep it coming!!

John McFarlane [Snr]
46 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:48:28
Hi Ray [35],

Gordon Dugdale was a teammate of Harry Catterick, my fondest memory of him was after he retired as Dave [38] correctly stated.

Gordon was a Conservative Councillor for the Low Hill ward, and I can only surmise that the Headmaster of the school I attended [All Saints RC] was a friend of Gordon's, because he came along to supervise a training session which was held on Breck Park.

I was lucky enough to be team captain at the time, and during a six-a-side kick-about, I managed to clear the ball off the line, Gordon said, "Well done, full-back" and I recall saying in reply, "I'm not the full-back, I'm the right-half!"

Unlike today, the footballers were ordinary people going about their daily life relatively unrecognised, and to have a player of the club I supported complimenting me was something I cherished.

A few years later, I played for Anfield Boys club, and the leader of the club (Albert Cheetham) arranged for Billy Liddell to give a talk on behaviour, another gentleman.

The standard of comments posted so far [40] is excellent, not a swearword in sight. I have to confess that although I don't consider myself a prude, I do find foul language in the public domain (where ladies and youngsters have access) is not necessary. Please don't let me down.

Rick Tarleton
47 Posted 12/12/2017 at 17:48:39
Can I thank John for this marvellous series of posts which has got all us old boys talking and reminiscing about the wonderful players we saw in the fifties, sixties and seventies. It's a great thread and I've loved it, especially for the twists – it's not the best players, it's the players who impinged on our minds back then when we were impressionable and young.

I've no real doubt that modern players are quicker, fitter and more skilful, but these are the players I watched and adored when I was a kid and when I was a teenager. Thanks, John.

Alex Bonnar
48 Posted 12/12/2017 at 18:03:20
Left Back. I'm going for Leighton Baines.

Yes, Ray Wilson was a brilliant defender and would be my choice of substitute but Baines was/is an excellent defender and also brilliant when attacking, which Wilson was not noted for, and don't forget to throw in Baines's superb penalties record.

So Baines for me – both very sporting gentlemen by the way.

Brent Stephens
49 Posted 12/12/2017 at 18:13:50
John, as others have said, a great thread. Thanks.

And you can be sure it's always "Best Wishes" from me.

Peter Mills
50 Posted 12/12/2017 at 18:30:22
John, I have to confess that Jock was not on my radar, even the name was not familiar, so thanks for putting him forward; it was interesting to read about him.

For me, Ramon Wilson is the indisputable left back in my all-time Everton team of those I have watched, so Jock must have had something about him to work his way into your affectionate all-star 11!

Looking forward to the next one.

Billy Dunne
51 Posted 12/12/2017 at 18:54:26
The mention of Keith Newton, although a very fine player comfortable at either full back position, is contentious.

After retiring from football he ran a news agents in Sudell Cross Blackburn. Above the door it read:

Keith Newton – Blackburn Rovers, Burnley & England.

The fallout with Catterick must have cabbaged his memory.

Peter Mills
52 Posted 12/12/2017 at 19:12:06
Billy #51, I know Sudell Cross pretty well, Keith was probably just a shrewd local newsagent!
Ron Marr
53 Posted 12/12/2017 at 19:15:02
Anybody remember Keith Newton scoring from maybe 30 yards around 70-72?

Ray Wilson for me. I like Leighton Baines too over his Everton career.

Andy Crooks
54 Posted 12/12/2017 at 19:17:43
To mention Pat van den Hauwe with Ray Wilson is like comparing Duncan Ferguson with Dixie Dean. Two modern era "hard men" compared with two truly great footballers. The "hard men" are not fit to lace their boots.

John McFarlane [Snr]
55 Posted 12/12/2017 at 19:49:11
Hi again, everyone.

If the 6-post rule is still in effect, then I will only have one more to go. I'm hoping that the person I erroneously called the 'Webmaster', may well come on to this thread to clarify the position.

I feel that I could contribute a little to many of your comments, and I would love to do so, but for now I'm faced with a bit of a predicament, should I chance my arm or should I play safe?

Ron (#53), I would certainly have been at the match you refer to, it was versus West Bromwich Albion on 27 February 1971 – a 3-3 draw, the scorers were Keith Newton, Jimmy Husband, and Joe Royle; however, I have no recollection of either the match or the goal.

I had to go to what I call my research department to establish the facts; it was actually the only goal that Keith Newton scored for the Blues, so my advice to you is cherish the memory, because other things will come and go, and (like me), you'll find they'll pass you by. Oh and by the way, you were one of 35,940.

Peter Mills
56 Posted 12/12/2017 at 20:07:49
Memory is a strange thing. I had no recollection of Keith Newton ever scoring, now I’m beginning to have flashbacks of a belter, high into the Park End goal.

Can anyone confirm, or otherwise, please?

Len Hawkins
57 Posted 12/12/2017 at 20:28:22
In 1987, I bought my first and last brand new car from Perry's in Blackpool Rd, Preston. Whilst sat with the sales man while he was filling in the paperwork a bloke walked across the showroom went outside got in a new car and drove off.

I said to the salesman, "Wasn't that Keith Newton?"

"Yes, he works here," was his reply, "do you know him?"

"Only through watching him play for and against Everton," I replied.

"Oh, I'll tell him when he gets back."

My favourite left back was Ray Wilson – a gifted player and as cool as a frozen cucumber. And one of the few English men who will ever be the recipient of a World Cup Winners' medal.

Stan Schofield
58 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:08:07
Peter @56: Yes, it was soon after he joined us. I was in the Paddock near the half-way line, Newton was taking it forward on the left out of defence, cut in a few yards, about 30 yards from goal, and hit a shot with his right foot into the corner of the net that's nearest to Goodison Road.

It was a belter, looked great from where I was, but I can't remember who we were playing.

Andy Crooks
59 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:15:22
John (#55), I think you will be allowed to post all night. This thread proves that Michael and Lyndon know when to do the right thing. Wonderful series of articles, John, truly top stuff.

However, I hope you don't mind me saying that left back is Ray Wilson's spot.

I look forward to the rest of the team and hope that I will concur with one of your favourites. Here's a hint, John: imagine Dean and Lineker together.

Peter Mills
60 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:22:44
That's the one, Stan (#58), thank you. I'll be able to sleep tonight now.
Dave Abrahams
61 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:25:42
Andy (#54), it's all a matter of opinion mate.

According to Don Alexander (#19), Joe Royle thought Pat van den Hauwe was the best left back we have ever had. I thought Pat was very good myself but would agree that Wilson was the best left back we have ever had. I don't think there is anything wrong with mentioning the two of them in the same sentence.

I never saw Dixie, so although everyone knows he was the very best of goal scorers I don't know if he was a great footballer, do you?

Peter Mills
62 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:39:04
Dave (#61), I spoke with a few people who watched W R Dean and Tommy Lawton; they all agreed that Lawton was the better footballer.
John McFarlane [Snr]
63 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:44:05
Hi Andy, [59] I will probably overstep the 6 point rule, and if there's any penalty, I hope you and your fellow posters will protest on my behalf.

I can't object to you preferring Ray Wilson, because you are doing exactly what I have done, choosing your favourite left back.

We don't have to justify our decisions, everyone sees different qualities in players, and in my case (then not a teenager) Jock Lindsay showed me something I hadn't seen from a full back.

Now, approaching 80, and still attending games, I will readily admit that there have been many better left backs for Everton, but the magic that I witnessed in my youth has stood the test of time.

In the (close on) 70 years since, I still have that affection for Jock Lindsay, and I believe that you, at an advanced age, will likewise extol the virtues of Ray Wilson, and rightly so.

As for imaging Dean and Lineker together, I can... but not in the tight shorts of the eighties.

Dave Abrahams
64 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:50:24
Peter (62), yes, again It is different opinions, with Dixie there is very little footage of him to see what sort of a footballer he was so I just don't know.

I certainly revere him as the tops in goalscoring, and although I saw Tommy Lawton he was past his best and in the second division with Notts County...

Mind you, his partner that day, Jackson was more than a handful, scoring four in County's 5-1 win.

Mike Goodwin
65 Posted 12/12/2017 at 21:56:12
Peter (#62),

My father watched both and told me Dixie was better than Tommy Lawton. Personal preference as ever, but I also got the impression he thought Dean was more of an Evertonian than Lawton and perhaps he was right about that.

John McFarlane [Snr]
66 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:00:13
Hi Dave [64] – well it's in for a penny etc, so here goes...

Dave, I can remember that game very well. As you say, Jimmy Jackson scored 4 goals in a 5-1 defeat for Everton. I believe that Jackson later emigrated to either Canada or America, I think most likely Canada.

I think that Lawton may also have appeared at Goodison Park with Brentford, but I wouldn't put money on it.

Dave Abrahams
67 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:07:20
John (#66), yes, I was going to say I'd seen Lawton playing for Brentford but wasn't absolutely sure.

John, keep replying; I know you relish your good manners but I think Michael and Lyndon will turn a blind eye in your case... mind you, I will have to start counting my own.

Stan Schofield
68 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:09:07
Since Tommy Lawton is being discussed, I remember Everton holding a testimonial game for him around 1971, after he'd fallen on hard times. I think about 30,000 attended.

Most of my mates are actually reds, and two of them went to Lawson's testimonial, as well as Brian Labone's around the same time. I went to Roger Hunt's and Bill Shankly's, standing on the Kop with my mates.

I know times have changed, but there was always a mutual respect between the two halves. I also recall a derby at Anfield, about 1972 I think, where we lost 1-0 but played really great football, true to our reputation. Again, I was on the Kop, and I remember one Everton move in particular, it was brilliant, nearly scoring after a move involving what seemed like every one of our players. There were Kopites extolling that.

Chris Thornton
69 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:12:27
I'm surprised nobody's mentioned Sandy Brown on this thread. Not the classiest left-back we've ever had, but a wholehearted player who filled a variety of positions and who was a real crowd favourite – despite that infamous own goal.
Dennis Stevens
70 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:22:04
There you are Chris – it's a colour I use online all the time: "Sandy brown is a pale shade of brown." Sandy brown is one of the web colors. As its name suggests, it is a shade of brown which is similar to the color of some sands.

The color name 'sandy brown' first came into use in 1987, when this color was formulated as one of the X11 colors, which in the early 1990s became known as "the X11 web colors."

Martin Nicholls
71 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:23:30
Mike Goodwin (#65) – any relation to Billy?
Brent Stephens
72 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:40:13
Chris, I've mentioned Sandy before now. And played in many positions for us, even in goal. Mr Reliability.
Stan Schofield
73 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:41:46
Chris @69: Sandy Brown was very versatile, he played well in very different positions. But that goal in the 3-0 defeat at Goodison, spectacular or what. At least we won 2-0 at Anfield.
John McFarlane [Snr]
74 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:51:02
Hi Stan [68], yet again I had to go to my research department to shed some light on your "derby" memory, and although I haven't been to Anfield in more than 20 years, I had seen every derby game home and away from the 1955 FA Cup game (when Liverpool, who were in the second division and hadn't won an away game, came to Goodison and won 4-0; I didn't have to research that one, January 29th 1955 is etched on my mind) until 1994, a 0-0 draw. The game you referred to would be a 1-0 defeat on 7 October 1972.

Hi Chris [69] ,Sandy Brown was on my short list, not least because he played in so many positions for Everton, I found it difficult not to give him a place on the bench, but I considered Ray Wilson deserved it more.

If you ever undertake a similar venture when you have time to spare, you may find it's not as easy as at first imagined.

Ray Roche
75 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:54:46
It was sad that Lawton's memory was somewhat besmirched when Dickie Attenborough decided to sell some memorabilia and included letters Lawton had sent to him asking to borrow some money. Very sad; the article is in the link below.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-35360384

Brent Stephens
76 Posted 12/12/2017 at 22:59:15
John, I don't think Chris's observation in #69 was having a go at you – he refers to what has happened in "this thread" not your original piece.

John McFarlane [Snr]
77 Posted 12/12/2017 at 23:03:12
Hi Chris and Stan, I was behind the Park End goal and I can tell you that if Sandy hadn't attempted to clear the ball, Bobby Graham would most certainly have scored.

It's a shame that a man who gave such sterling service to Everton, should have had to bear the stick he got, for that one mishap for the rest of his life.

John McFarlane [Snr]
78 Posted 12/12/2017 at 23:12:57
Hi Brent [76] I think there's been a misinterpretation, I wasn't making a retaliatory comment, I didn't take any offence from Chris' observation. I was merely trying to explain the difficulty of undertaking such a challenge. I apologise if I caused any offence.
Stan Schofield
79 Posted 12/12/2017 at 23:19:46
John, I remember reading Howard Kendall's book 'Playing for Everton' in about 1970, and in it he highlights the versatility of Sandy Brown and his natural athleticism that helped it. Kendall doesn't mention too many players in that book, I seem to recall, so he must of thought very highly of Brown.
John McFarlane [Snr]
80 Posted 12/12/2017 at 23:48:11
Hi Stan [79] I'm about to retire for the night but I'm almost certain that Sandy wore every shirt from 2 to11, I'll check it out tomorrow.

I have a busy schedule as I'm the resident Santa at our local school, but I'll make an effort in memory of Sandy.

I thought a lot of him and as I said, it's a shame he had to bear that one mistake for the rest of his life. RIP Sandy.

John Keating
81 Posted 13/12/2017 at 00:26:26
My dad and uncles always spoke of Dixie being the best forward they ever saw – not only his goal scoring but also his overall contribution to the team. My dad was a regular from around 1926 until 1980 so he'd seen quite a few come and go.

Mike at 65 mentions Dixie as being more an Evertonian than Lawton. Based on what my dad and uncles told me, I would second that. He seemed just an ordinary guy with a gift.

Alan J Thompson
82 Posted 13/12/2017 at 01:29:28
As John (Snr) has pointed out it is about favourites but it does get the mind moving. Another full-back I met a couple of times who was quite a good player although I didn't take to him off field (and took a while to remember his name) was John Gidman. The last I heard in the mid '70s he was running a sports shop in Woolton.
Don Alexander
83 Posted 13/12/2017 at 02:09:58
Dave Abrahams (#61), I was at a dinner where Joe was the main speaker and as such was asked to put forward his best-ever Everton XI. He included Pat and afterwards told me that the man's athleticism and phenomenal attitude had been the things he respected.

Stan Schofield (#68), I went to the Tommy Lawton testimonial in '71 and will always remember the rapturous look on his face when he took to the pitch pre kick-off. None of us at the time knew of the penury that'd engulfed him, a total 24 carat legend according to my Dad, but he was crying with what I now assume was relief. Sad, but I hope the night made his last years more bearable.

I've noticed on this and other recent threads that a preference is emerging for describing our unloved neighbours in something other than the odious "Red-Shite" term, or worse. If I'm reading it right I commend it.

Liverpool families contain avid Blue and Reds so, whilst I'd rather barbecue my own balls than start singing "You'll Always Walk Forlorn" or what-ever it's called, their fans are but a dramatically different gene away from us, so let's dispense some compassion on them 'eh?

Pete Clarke
84 Posted 13/12/2017 at 02:56:10
John Bailey did in fact go to St Greg's. A few years ahead of me but in my brothers year. He was a very good footballer but fitness let him down. He was knocking on my mamma's pub door after hours on a Friday night for a drink but still had s decent game the next day. Good laugh for sure ,John.

I thought Mike Pejic was solid too. Did he not buy the house Kevin Keegan owned in Colamendy, North Wales?

Ray Wilson was brilliant but I have loved Leighton Baines since he came to us. Always gave his all and never complained. Like somebody said earlier, his goals and assists cannot be beaten by any left back we have had.

Laurie Hartley
85 Posted 13/12/2017 at 04:13:44
I find that John's "Favourites" articles set me off down memory lane - mind you it doesn't take much.

Anyway I decided to see if Mick Meagan (got the spelling right this time Terry) was as good as I thought he was as a 12- or 13-year-old boy. As a result I came up with this quote from a potential "midfield favourite" Bobby Collins who said Meagan was:-

"The finest exponent of the one-two pass' he had ever played with."

Stan Schofield
86 Posted 13/12/2017 at 09:34:25
John@80: I think you might be right about Brown wearing every shirt from 2 to 11. It wouldn't surprise me if he'd also worn number 1, in the days when there were no substitute goalies!

To be honest, I don't think it matters having a joke about that own goal. The reason I say that is, Brown is definitely remembered for the versatile and reliable player he was. Steven Gerrard made a major blunder that halted Liverpool's title ambitions in 2013-14, but it doesn't stop folks remembering his playing attributes. (It does make me smile though!).

I recall that when a player was injured, Brown would often play in their place, and every time we just knew he'd put in a strong performance. As you say, one of the favourites, and a player that (like Paul Madeley of Leeds) any top team would gladly have because of his versatility.

Stan Schofield
87 Posted 13/12/2017 at 09:45:40
Don@83: I agree about the label 'RedShite'. I preferred it like the 60s when we were both top sides, Derbies were balanced (but seldom good games), and there was a general buzz. Most Liverpool supporters are just supporters.

I think a minority have perhaps become arrogant with past success, which ironically seems to blind them to their current status. I don't like that arrogance, and I'm afraid Klopp seems an exponent of it, unfortunately, with constant attempted 'cheating' by getting into the faces of match officials. For this reason, I was quite chuffed with his media meltdown on Sunday, it gave the same kind of pleasure I get when Liverpool lose.

Ray Robinson
88 Posted 13/12/2017 at 09:50:22
Re Sandy Brown, Stan, I know it's from Wiki but it's true - I remember it.

"He was most effective as an overlapping full-back but also played as an emergency attacker and scored against Real Zaragoza in a European game during the 1966-67 season. In fact he played in every position during his Everton career, including goalkeeper. This came after Gordon West was sent off in a game against Newcastle United."

Chris Thornton
89 Posted 13/12/2017 at 09:56:47
Hi John. I certainly didn't take offence. I really enjoy reading about your favourites and I appreciate how hard it must be to whittle down a list of 18 from hundreds. I'm glad you're making the effort though.

As Brent said, I was surprised Sandy Brown's name didn't come up, but in the comments, not your original post. You're entitled to mention whoever you like – they're your favourites!

And didn't Sandy once score against Liverpool in a 3-1 win after coming on as a substitute?

Peter Mills
90 Posted 13/12/2017 at 10:46:47
I was at the ‘Faith of our Fathers' book launch with a few family members a couple of weeks ago. We were having a beer and sat down at a table with a couple we didn't know, who turned out to be Mr and Mrs Frank D'Arcy, they were very pleasant company.

Frank told us he was at Everton for 10 years, and we recalled him being in the 1965 FA Youth Cup winning team, and also substitute in the 1970 Title winning game v West Brom. He told us of his frustration at not being able to command a regular first-team place and how he would go in to see Harry Catterick once a year to ask for a transfer. Harry would answer “No, we need you in the squad", then turn away and look out of the window of his Bellefield office. Frank would stay seated, Catterick would shout down the corridor “Harry”. Harry (we assumed Harry Cooke, chief scout and sidekick) would appear, and Catterick would say “How much is Frank on these days? Make sure he gets another £8”.

Frank later signed for Ron Yeats at Tranmere. Having struggled with a knee injury, Ron promised to pay him £X if he played 12 games – his knee went in the 11th.

It was good to meet Mr and Mrs D'Arcy.

Jay Wood
91 Posted 13/12/2017 at 11:11:57
Ray @ 88 beat me to it.

Sandy Brown did wear the Number 1 shirt, going in goal after Gordon West got sent off against Newcastle.

Poor ole Sandy immediately conceded the penalty the barcodes were awarded following Gordon's sending off.

Sandy was the perennial butt of Gordon's dressing room humour – the story goes tha,t when the team traipsed in having lost the game to that single penalty, Gordon laid into Sandy for not saving it!!!

Michael Murphy
92 Posted 13/12/2017 at 11:44:26
This is my first post. Having enjoyed reading the many excellent fans contributions over the years on ToffeeWeb, the comments about Sandy Brown brought back many a memory, particularly John Mac Snr's and Stan Schofield's comments on him. Much remembered by the opposition for an own goal sadly, instead of a truly versatile player which he was. So I felt the need to pay a tribute.

I started watching the Blues in 1967 and saw Sandy play many a time and even score at the Gwladys Street end (I can't remember the game) but he cut in from the wing past a couple of defenders and buried it.

He always gave 100% even when often he was the sub. He always got the biggest cheer when he came on because the first thing he would ever do would be to roll his sleeves up, indicating he would get stuck in. The fans loved him. Happy memories indeed.

John McFarlane [Snr]
93 Posted 13/12/2017 at 12:06:16
Hi everyone, just back from Santa duty at the local school nursery, and have to do it all over again this afternoon, but I'm not complaining it's a labour of love.

I'll try to reply to a couple of posts, Chris [89] I'm pleased that you didn't take offence, and yes Sandy did come as a substitute to score against Liverpool, Alan Ball scored the other two.

One Sunday newspaper read, "Liverpool resorted to Scotland Road thuggery".

Hi Stan, [86] I was 99% sure that Sandy played in every position for the Blues, but I'm going to, what I call my research department to check it out, I'm a stickler for accuracy.

Hi Jay [91] You're correct in stating that Sandy donned the keepers jersey against Newcastle United, when Gordon West flattened [if memory serves me right] Ollie Burton, and it was reported that Westy berated Sandy not saving the penalty kick. I'm off HO, HO,HO'ING now.

Dave Abrahams
94 Posted 13/12/2017 at 13:30:43
I think when Sandy scored that goal versus Liverpool the shirt he wore was either blank on the back or maybe a Number 12, I'd say it was blank.

Sandy was also the butt of many stories by other Everton players, one of them told Sandy was ordering a round of drinks, one of the drinks was scotch on the rocks and Sandy asked for ''Scotch on the rocks with no ice''.

I spoke to him a few times when he lived in Maghull. Safe to say he was a real character, funny even if he didn't mean to be.

Alasdair Mackay
95 Posted 13/12/2017 at 13:31:22
I love these articles. Keep them coming, John.

I confess to have never having heard of Jock Lindsay and to being surprised that Ray Wilson didn't make it. I never saw him play myself, but he is the stand-out player for many Evertonians of a certain vintage.

But then, that is the point of the article. Favourites aren't always the best, so it would be impossible and pointless to argue with you, even if I had seen both Lindsay and Wilson play.

I consider myself fortunate to have seen Pat van den Hawe, Andy Hinchcliffe, Michael Ball and Leighton Baines don the blue Number 3 jersey in the last 30 years or so. Baines takes it for me, but it is close between the four of them.

Ray Roche
96 Posted 13/12/2017 at 13:45:33
Dave (#94),

Dave, it was actually the Number 3 shirt. Have a look, if you can stomach it, at the link below.

Terry White
97 Posted 13/12/2017 at 15:59:06
Laurie (#85), pleased to see that you have your spelling boots on! I'd better spellcheck all my contributions going forward.

Mick Meagan was a very neat and versatile player. He started out as a wing half, a typical Everton player of that time in that position, undersized! Kenny Rae was another example of this.

Mick certainly fitted in well in both full back positions during the Championship year. I can well understand Bobby Collins's tribute to Mick, he was largely underappreciated by the faithful as we were signing so many "stars" at that time.

John G Davies
98 Posted 13/12/2017 at 16:25:36
Peter 90.

I'm 99% certain I played against Frank in the Sunday league. It was definitely an ex-Blue. I think he played for a side that played on Lower Breck.

John McFarlane [Snr]
99 Posted 13/12/2017 at 16:47:19
Hi Dave [94] and Ray [96], Just back from Santa duty. I remember that game very well, it was a fortnight after they beat us 1-0 in the Charity Shield, and Liverpool roughed us up a bit, hence the Newspaper coverage.

I can't remember who made way for Sandy, but he is listed as number 12, and although I appreciate that he may not have actually worn that shirt number, I suspect that he did.

Hi Terry, [97] You're right in describing Mick Meagan and Ken Rea as being somewhat undersized, I wonder what you made of Jackie Grant, and later down the line Graham Williams.

I remember reading of Mick Meagan in a programme before he made the first team, and in it he was referred to as Chick Meagan.

I suspect that Laurie [85] will be chuckling now, and that he's feeling that the spelling boot, is on the other foot, I write that as a bit of banter, and trust you are not offended.


Dave Abrahams
100 Posted 13/12/2017 at 17:15:17
Ray (96), I haven't looked at the link to be honest. If you are referring to the own goal, it would be Number 3. I was referring to his header when he came on as a substitute and scored the goal for us, I can see how you thought I was talking about the own goal from my post saying "that" goal. Sorry about the confusion.
Alan McGuffog
101 Posted 13/12/2017 at 17:17:24
This little tirade is not directed at any of my brethren on this site but it pisses me off, regally, that Sandy is remembered for that own goal. He played a vital role for us in the run-in for the title in 1970. If my memory is correct, he covered for the injured Keith Newton for the last month or so and didn't put a foot wrong. An unsung hero if ever there was.
Ray Roche
102 Posted 13/12/2017 at 18:06:17
Dave (#100),

No worries Dave, as long as you don't watch the link I sent... it'll put you off your tea.

Alan, true, Sandy deserves a better epitaph than that goal. He was a fine all rounder who never gave less than 100%, something today's precious little mites should try once in a while.

John McFarlane [Snr]
103 Posted 13/12/2017 at 18:38:16
Hi Stan [86], I've checked and double checked, and can find no evidence of Sandy wearing the Number 8 shirt, I'll try again but I think we'll have to settle for 10 positions including goalkeeper, not a bad record eh?

Hi Dave [94], when looking up Sandy's record, I discovered that it was Fred Pickering who was substituted in the 3-1 game; we can't be expected to remember every thing, can we?

Terry White
104 Posted 13/12/2017 at 18:51:34
John (#99), in my family Graham Williams was known as "Tom Thumb". Where did we get these "smaller" players?

Jackie Grant, as you mentioned, was cut from the same cloth. Ken Birch, while taller, had no weight on him either. Peter Farrell, on reflection, was a bit of an anomaly.

Tony Heron
105 Posted 13/12/2017 at 18:56:55
Interesting to read the comments about Sandy Brown. If memory serves, he was sent off after just 3 minutes in the infamous 60s home game against "dirty" Leeds. Then the Ref eventually took all the players off before half-time to get them to calm down, after Derrick Temple had been clattered.
Alan McGuffog
106 Posted 13/12/2017 at 19:17:11
Remember that so well. Didn't he just plant Giles and walk off? Legend!!!
John McFarlane [Snr]
107 Posted 13/12/2017 at 19:49:12
Hi Tony [105] and Alan [106], I was behind the goal at the Park end for that game, and it was Johnny Giles who started the bother, fouling Sandy and unfortunately, Sandy was the one who suffered.

Regarding the incident that led to the referee [Ken Stokes] taking both teams off the pitch, was a savage assault on Derek Temple, I said to my mates, "Temple won't come out again" obviously I was mistaken.

To add insult to injury, the man who launched that attack on Derek Temple [Willie Bell] scored the winner. As good as Leeds were at that time, they were also masters of the dark arts.

Laurie Hartley
108 Posted 14/12/2017 at 08:00:52
John (#99) – no offence taken with you or Terry – spelling is not my strong suit but I have been trying (sometimes unsuccessfully) to get the players' names right.
John McFarlane [Snr]
109 Posted 14/12/2017 at 10:19:24
Hi Laurie [108] I know how you feel, if I didn't have my 'dicshunry' I would be lost.
Terry White
110 Posted 14/12/2017 at 18:33:24
Laurie (#108) and John (#109),

No offence intended on my part or taken from anything that has been said. With my simplistic sense of humour I smile when I see so many of the names of our players, past and present, being misspelled.

At least it humours me! It's the little things...

John McFarlane
111 Posted 14/12/2017 at 18:50:21
Hi Terry [110] I'm glad you feel as you do, because I know that the recipient of some comments, can't see the twinkle in the senders eye.

I have just sent a post to Michael Kenrick [on the thread announcing the signings of the three youngsters] requesting clarification of the 6 posts rule.

I have noticed on other threads that there appears to have been a relaxation over the last few days, I too have violated this rule, but being a bit 'Old School' I don't seek special consideration.

Dave Abrahams
112 Posted 14/12/2017 at 21:45:21
Mike (#65), of course Dixie was more of an Evertonian than Tommy Lawton, Dixie was born in Birkenhead and had an affinity to the Blues while Tommy came from Bolton and had a few teams to support around there, including the two Manchester teams.
Jeff Armstrong
113 Posted 15/12/2017 at 21:31:01
Pete Clarke (#84), following Johns theme I think Pejic was probably my favourite left back, above Baines, Psycho etc. Yes, he did buy Keegan's North Wales home when the perm left for Hamburg.

The mid seventies where an era where there was a leftover from the Corinthian spirit of the 50s and 60s and the superstar was starting to emerge: Cruyff, Keegan, even blurts like Malcolm McDonald where starting to make big money from TV adverts etc.

Looking back, we had some top players around that time: Dobson, Todd, Pejic, Thomas, Latchford etc – some of them really intelligent footballers who were brought up on the game when the likes of Young, Wilson, Moore etc where their icons..

Derek Thomas
114 Posted 17/12/2017 at 00:51:04
John McF Snr: As I know you check back here I'll answer you Re The 62-63 side being labeled 'rough' – rather than in the hurly-burly of the Allardyce thread where it might get lost.

I didn't notice anything at the time either. But on reflection we wouldn't, as the papers print different stuff in different editions 'oop north' than down south, where they were no doubt preaching to the choir.

It only came to my notice 2 years ago when somebody posted a page, probably from Charles Buchan's footy magazine, with Roy Vernon vigorously refuting the accusation; short version - we were hard but fair... I'll try and dig it out.

Don Alexander
115 Posted 17/12/2017 at 01:45:27
Whilst he wasn't a contender as "best ever" when it comes to our left backs, Andy Hinchcliffe is surely worth a mention. His delivery of a corner or cross was top-notch, low-flying, accurate and very fast, leaving minimum "wriggle-room" for panicking defenders to get in the way of our scorer, usually Ferguson. I was sorry when he left, especially when he was replaced by the waste-of-spaces Pistone and Valente.
David Currie
116 Posted 27/12/2017 at 01:23:10
Agree with Joe Royle, Pat Van Den Hauwe was the best all round left back. Great athlete, tough defender with a great winning mentality. Howard Kendall said that after big Nev Pat was his best signing.
John Steele
117 Posted 20/02/2018 at 06:43:22
I worked with Jock when I was an apprentice on the Dock Road in Liverpool. We used to play footy in the lunchtime and it was obvious that, although a little overweight and balding, this guy had been able to play in his day.

I got talking to him a few times and he was reluctant to tell me that he had played for Everton. I have to say he was a really nice man with no side to him at all. Sad to see that he passed away a long time ago but I still have fond memories of Jock Lindsay, the Scottish fitter who was also and ex-Everton player. RIP, Jock.

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