Will James Rodriguez & Co Be Successes At Everton?

They have worked with 2 of these players before, and each are superstars in their own Countries, Italy and Spain. I do think Covid-19 has influenced the prices paid; in the case of Doucouré he has proved he can cut it at this level.

Add to all this that they all were desperate to come to us, such are the expectations and the obvious pull of Carlo himself. All ingredients which can greatly make a significant difference.

Another factor that may be worth considering, is that the age these players are at, they will want to enter the twilight years of their career with a spectacular flourish, on what is considered the biggest stage of all.

Hopefully our luck materialises this year. It is about 30 years overdue

Ancelotti being meticulous in targeting areas that will strengthen the first team from the off. Players will know their role in the system and they will be used playing their strengths in that role.

The new players will give us a better structure and formation from the off, with far more quality too.

Other current players will benefit from it and we will be dramatically improved from last season.

This can give a rather different (and surprising). If we consider goalkeepers' clean sheets figure is as a ratio to games played we get the following (which may be a bit inaccurate as "number of appearances" is the number for the club rather than in the Premier League.

Nigel Martyn 30/137 = 0.219
Neville Southall 62/269 = 0.2305
Jordan Pickford 33/114 = 0.2895
Tim Howard 116/329 = 0.3526

I would agree with the general assessment that 'Big Nev' was our best goalkeeper of the Premier League era, but in fact, the figures don't support this. I was never very happy with Tim Howard who always struck me as too likely to make a horrible error but who appear to have been the most effective by a very significant margin.

Of course, it can be argued that Tim Howard benefitted from Moyes's excellent defensive approach and was thus less exposed than the others, in other words, that in some sense the number of clean sheets is at least in part a function of the setup of the team as well as the excellence of the goalkeeper.

I am also delighted to see that the much-maligned Pickford is easily the second-best (and apparently was the best England player in the team last night, it seems that unlike everyone else, he actually did something very good).

You can't use clean sheets to judge goalkeepers. So much more is down to a clean sheet than simply the keeper. Conversely the keeper can be man of the match in a 3-2 win.

How many times did Nev save us from defeat or a draw? There won't be stats for that but I can tell you he was widely considered the best goalkeeper of his generation.

Martyn was incredibly consistent and very rarely made any mistakes let alone ones that led to goals.

Where there are stats to help is goalkeeping errors leading to goals.

In Tim Howard's last 3 years (heading towards retirement) he made 10 errors leading to goals. Only beaten in that time period by Joe Hart (England number 1, is it any surprise Pep wanted rid).

In the last 3 years, Pickford has made 10 errors leading to goals. More than any other keeper in the Premier league. England's 'number 1'. A goalkeeper is supposed to inspire trust and give defenders confidence. Speak to anyone who played in front of Nev or Nigel and the all speak highly of the pair of them.

I trust Pickford to make world class saves in matches but do not trust him not to lose us a game or snatch a draw from the Jaws of victory.

I don't buy into this idea that Ancelotti has some mythical "pulling power". If he did, he would be signing players the top clubs covet, not the ones they are prepared to let go. He has identified these players because he knows his "pulling power" has no effect on players the top clubs want.

We have signed three players who are all at a crossroads in their careers. James and Allan have been allowed to leave because they are considered as surplus to requirement. James is a brilliant talent, but I'm struggling to recall many players who have seen their star resurrected after it has been falling for so long. I expect him to be brilliant at times, but not often enough for us to muscle in to dine at Footballs top table.

Allan is a different type and though he isn't quite as talented, but I expect him to be more consistent. Doucoure interests me. I have heard all the criticism of his inconsistency, but he has impressed me every time I have seen him. Unlike the other two. He will be playing on a bigger stage... Could be the making of him.

Allan and James are both coming from an environment where one poor match can see a player out in the cold. Here, they will be given time to rediscover their game. They will only have had to leave their cars for a brief second to have felt what is already, overwhelming love from fans desperate for them to do well.

Success ? Depends on what you mean by success. My personal bar is quite low. I believe that, even if all three signings had great seasons, we have too many sub-standard players in goal or in defence to challenge the top boys.

If we were to approach this season playing brave, fast attacking football, I would overlook defeats. If we were to get the old lady bouncing with passionate die-for-the-shirt performances. It wouldn't break my heart if we didn't win anything – that bits a lie. If we can get the neutral rubbing his hands when he sees Everton are on the box rather than flick through the channels to see what else is on...

This season, I want to see the foundations laid for future assaults on all major competitions. I want pride restored... That, for me, will represent success.

Only 3 world class players in that lot - Southall, Rooney and Kanchelkis - tells you all you need to know about our EPL story so far.

"I don't buy into this idea That Ancelotii has some mythical "pulling power" If he did he would be signing players the top clubs covet, not the ones they are prepared to let go."

Wow, I can't believe you won't simply sit down, eat your serving of crow and get past it.

You were flat-out wrong a month ago when you wrote:

"The foolish claim that the name of Ancelotti will attract top players is already beginning to unravel.
The only way we will get players who have attracted interest of the top boys, is to pay them considerably more."

James and Allan have come to Everton expressly to play for the manager they know and love, Carlo. At career crossroads? Yes. Needed to find new clubs? Definitely. Would that club have been Everton if not for Carlo? Absolutely, positively not. No way in the world.

And did we overpay? Not at all. As somebody pointed out, we paid less for these three signings combined than we paid for Siggy and Klaassen together.

And why were we able to do that? Because they wanted to come to Everton. And not for the Guinness at the Winslow or the thrill of Z-cars or the BMD project. They wanted to come for one reason, and one reason only. Carlo Ancelotti.

C'mon. Eat that Crow a la Carlo and move on, man.

In particular, it must be said that for some of us, Ferguson is anything but a "legend". I recognize his significant transition and applaud his commitment and contribution to the club's coaching at this point in his life, but during his playing career I considered him an embarrassment to the shirt because of his conduct. I recognize that may not be the majority opinion here, but I know I wasn't alone in my feelings at that time. And for all his physical presence, I really didn't think he was that good a player, particularly in his second spell with us.

For me, Barry has to be in the side as he's only in competition with Lee Carsley and Joe Parkinson. No-one else has ever nailed that ‘holding' role and our best seasons have tended to be when someone did it well.

Southall; Coleman, Jagielka, Distin, Baines; Kanchelskis, Arteta, Barry, Pienaar; Rooney, Lukaku.

Subs: Martyn, Gough, Materazzi, Dacourt, Collins, Speed, Barmby, Richarlison, Ferguson

Eat crow? Because you and I have very different opinions as to what constitutes a top player?

To me a top player is somebody the top teams around Europe are pursuing. Players at the peak of their powers. Not players the top boys are happy to offload.

Of course, these players have come to play for Carlo... That's because he is the one who has tempted them with the chance to resurrect their careers. I didn't see any offers from Pep, Jose Klopp, or Solskjaer did you? How can you talk about pulling power when there was only one person making the offers?

I really hope Ancelotti can resurrect the careers of these two as it would be fantastic for the club. But Pulling power?
We got a very good look at the strength of this mythical pulling power when the journeyman from Bournemouth got an alternative offer from Spurs.

I hope sincerely hope Carlo, Allan, James and Brands all prove to be very good for each other and can resurrect each others careers. It would be fantastic for the club I have supported all my life. But, as Paul Tran rightly points out, they are all rolling the dice.

If the day ever dawns when a players leaves a top club where he is regularly getting a game, or turns down an offer to join a top club in order to sign for Carlo. I may give some credence to this "pulling power" claim.

When Wayne Rooney came back to Everton he came because, like these two, he was being offered exactly the same opportunity to resurrect his career. He came because Kenwright was the one who offered him the chance. He did not come back due to Kenwright's pulling power.

There is no doubt other clubs were in for Allan and Doucoure certainly. Rodriguez was unlucky with injury last year so of course top clubs are going to be reticent which is why we are taking a gamble. There is no way James would be here if it wasn't for his former success under Carlo.

So I don't really see how you can say that there is no pulling power.

Mike. G

Darren's time will come and when it does, I will serve him his crow and you can pour the cheap plonk for him to was it down. He may have a point about pulling power, but these players were available. Every top manager had the chance to sign try them but no other had the vision or the audacity to do it.

I'm sure there will be lots of fun to be had throughout next season, reminding him of that little fact.

"When you share a city with a club that can attract the best players on the planet". Well are you talking about Winaldum they got from Newcastle or Robertson from relegated Hull or maybe Mane from struggling Southampton hardly world class players from top clubs were they. Klopp admitted he thinks Werner was a top striker and despite the rumours that he preferred Liverpool they didnt have the cash to spend so he went to Chelsea.

Darren23 if you are going to suggest that Ancelotti didnt have the pulling power to get Hojbjerg from Spurs grasp at least get the facts right he was a Southampton player not a Bournemouth player as you suggest.

Subs
Nev, Barry, Dunc, Distin, Hinchcliffe, Pienaar, Saha

For the first time since Moshiri came I see some professionalism at the club.

He came, he saw the problems in MF, and by God he conquered with three of the best.

They're certainly of a pedigree we have never attracted before.

Now if your standard for "top" is World's Best 11 or Champions League starters, or even just players who turned down offers from Pep or Klopp to come to us... then yes, Carlo has failed.

But the defection of that Saints mechanic notwithstanding, Carlo's "pulling power" is obvious and self-evident. We have electric talent, a new midfield, new excitement and a worldwide profile that we didn't have ten days ago, and the only reason for that... the ONLY reason... is Carlo's pulling power.

You're welcome to hang on as long as you can to your pessimistic predictions of Carlo's inevitable failure at Everton, but I'd say your avian dinner is already waiting in the warmer.

Not sure what your point is. I'm not here to big up RS. I just started the obvious.
Making good shrewd purchases didnt blunt their pulling power. The interest for their center half and goalkeeper was worldwide. They had the pulling power to land them. That pulling power has only been enhanced by the results securing those signatures.

It's not a fact we ike but itd still true
At this moment in time there is only one club with genuine world class pulling power in this city. Hopefully Carlo can bring us the success to change all that

I am praying we get some success soon as I really do feel we could be staring at the abyss if this doesn't work. What is for certain is these signings certainly show progress and a plan for the first time.

As far as I'm concerned they can have the six points for the coming season and every season if you could guarantee me that Everton would finish, above them (top four) but, not because they've had a mare.

You two have repeatedly complained about me judging Ancelotti, after six months, but here you are, both triumphantly proclaiming his signings before a ball has been kicked.

So come on then. You are both convinced the good times are here. If you really believe Carlo has "came, saw and conquered" why not nail your colours properly?

I've answered the question the OP posed by saying what will constitute success to me. but for some reason you still dug me out. So let's hear what success looks like in triumphant fantasy land.

Given that these signings have been so incredible and Carlo has proved to be the man. Why not tell us what you think we can expect? Ist? ... 2nd? ... Champions League qualification?

Everton where mugged by Rooney. For over three years before that he had turned into a carthorse and unprofessional compared to his peers. Everton foolishly allowed him in and made him the highest paid player, keeping him in the style He was accustomed to. He was still a carthorse at Everton. , who couldn't behave professionally, with no rhyme or reason why he was in the team.

There is no comparison. with the transfer in of the three amigos and Rooney.

By the way under Ancelotti top six finish guaranteed.

6th or 7th for me unless Kean finds form or we sign a goal scorer of the Lukaku ilk.

Roll on Sunday, I can't wait.

Noted for possible later piss-taking.

"James Rodriguez will be lucky to play 11 games with his injury record..."

Noted for possible later piss-taking.,"By the way under Ancelotti top six finish guaranteed."

Noted for possible later piss-taking.

"James Rodriguez will be lucky to play 11 games with his injury record..."

Noted for possible later piss-taking.,,,1,21:52:39,,80.3.202.204,ok,19747,09/09/2020 21:52:39,Overdrive,reader,,,no 1092016,39874,toffeeweb,09/09/2020,Mike Gaynes,,"I like this idea! We need a Salford supporter next week!

I'd like to see the site do this for every game this season, although obviously it would be impossible to find a Leeds fan who communicates in anything beyond grunts and gestures.

Last season was the first time Ancelotti managed a team who finished out of the top six in any of the top flight leagues he has managed in. He only managed Everton for part of the season. Take a note of that as well.

I'll go for 7th and we can meet again next summer.

Same old same old and yet another thread ruined.

I haven't said one goddamned word about Carlo having "conquered" or "proved to be the man" -- all I said was he signed two top players we never would have gotten otherwise, and brought new quality and excitement to the club. And I'm right.

But in answer to your sarcastic question, at this point -- without any further signings -- I would consider 6th and Europa League to be spectacular success, and could certainly forgive lower if the performances were more enjoyable.

Why such a low bar, just like yours? Because I think Carlo has dramatically improved three positions... in a side that required improvement in at least 8 positions, maybe 9, to contend for the Champions League. Like you I believe the rest of our talent simply does not measure up.

At this point I see us improving from mid-table to top half, and perhaps a nice Cup run. Add some more pace and creativity in the form of a right back and another quality attacker and I'll be ready to dream higher. But Carlo has made a GREAT start.

To me it's always laughable, extending to hysterically funny when they absurdly attack each other, forever.

The weird thing is that they persistently, ad nausam, assume their own opinion to be factual, and therefore dominant, against any other fan/supporter's "opinion".

Weird!

One of the duo (who remind me of the old fellows from the muppets) only came to my attention when he ironically stated he was ignoring me based on some past disagreement we'd had that I hadn't even noticed. I didn't even notice he existed until he stated he was ignoring me.

But I guess like Trump he will be right eventually when Carlo goes away (retires, quits, expires) and isn't in charge of glorious success in perpetuity, just like Trump will smile looking up from that place below one day when Covid-19 goes away.

In the meantime, I'm excited to see the new signings in action that Carlo was able to attract.

As it happens in ToffeeWeb, Hinds and Wood are amongst the small handful who have actual writing ability. Take a lesson.

Both protagonists alienate posters rather than bring others over to their way of thinking, even when they have something worthwhile to say.

Writing style? If berating and belittling others to point of ruining the thread counts as such then sure they have style.

Darren who has been conspicuous by his absence, posts for the first time in weeks and poor old Jay Wood hasn't opened his mouth. Yet people are shaking their heads bemoaning the fact that they have ruined another thread.

Mike

You accuse Darren of bring snotty and exaggerating by quoting rhetoric you hadn't used. You may not have used those words but Jay H did and he addressed his response to both of you.

You are on another thread calling Darren out, and when he does finally post, you are on it like a shot demanding he eats crow. You dig up comments he made weeks ago but, as far as I can see, they are consistent with what he is saying now.

I thought his post was positive. He expects one of the signings to be consistent. He calls another a brilliant talent and he says the third has impressed him every time he's seen him, but that doesn't seem enough for you. He has to agree with everything you say or "eat crow". It doesn't work like that, Mike.

Darren is not the aggressor here and quite why Jay has been dragged into it is anybody's guess. Neither man has made the thread about themselves. Other people have done that.

For what it's worth: the "pulling power" argument is the only one I agree with him on.

Football management is a precarious profession and no player in his right mind would risk his future and drag his family off to a foreign land on the basis of a manager's "pulling power". Not when he knows a few adverse results can and usually do see that manager out of the club.

Stay safe guys and play nice.

Anyway, I'm with Terence @51.

Football teams are a sum of their parts, not a FM collection of superstars.

The pulling power argument is pretty nuanced. Like all experienced managers, Carlo will form strong bonds with some players. He's worked with better players, so he's bound to bring us a higher standard.

This season is all about the project going in the right direction. I'm expecting some better football, more wins, the usual bits of disappointment and 6th place as the base camp for future, proper, progress.

They have us finishing 9th on apprx 53 points just behind Leicester on apprx 55.

It's all relative and we all want better, and 8th is unacceptable for all of us.

But as far as cold hard index goes 8th is better than they expect. So for a neutral person who doesn't give a flying shite about Everton 8th is an relative success compared to the expectations of a neutral.

If you think we are top 6 certainties you can get 5/1 on betfair.

For me;

6th [or better], and a cup would represent success.

7th, euro qualification and a cup final would be acceptable progress towards it.

8th and below is flat lining.

I know, but Everton as you have hinted have let us down before. But I think that Ancelotti is a different animal than what has gone before. When you think of Everton trying to source the next Manager with the highest potential, it was like the plot of one of Kenwright's productions. Having said that his productions always ended with coming back down to earth anyway.

Quite a few clubs have strengthened their squads but may still struggle to be consistent.

I expect the likes of Chelski and Arsenal to be bigger challengers than last season to City and RS but I don't rate Manure.

Why don't you give Don Carlo Ancellotti a chance? He's now got in three of his own players (I'm not sure if Dacoure was his tbh) for the first time. He tried to get Gabriel in who's going to be a world class player. He might even get 1-2 more players in.

So let's not judge him until a few months have passed, at least. You never know, he might surprise even you.

Even Tony Marsh isn't complaining about Carlo.

Re: My Everton Team of the EPL era

I pre-qualified my final selection by saying "the players I'm proudest to say were blues, not only based on their time at Goodison, but also where players have gone on to have great success having impressed or started with the Toffees." What I should have also said (and what some of you have deduced) is that I favoured players who I perceived to have had been at their best at Everton.

Lukaku's performances at Everton earned him his big move and he has continued that level at subsequent clubs. He makes my team and Richarlison could join him with a couple of big goalscoring years benefiting from extra quality behind him.

Kanchelskis was as fantastic for us that first year – every bit as good as for Utd. Similarly, Tim Howard, who may have won more with United, but I believe was better for the Blues. Lescott just missed out on my team after Everton were rewarded for taking a chance on him (where others had passed). He went to City off the back of those performances but the move didn't make him a better player. Similarly, John Stones hasn't kicked on from his City move, but there's still a quality player there if he, like a number of Everton favourites, were to return to Goodison. I'm sure he'd rediscover his old form and even progress again in a settled back four.

Rooney at his best gets in ahead of Ferguson, no question - but his best was for United (as big an impact as he made for a couple of teenage years with us) - hence the honourable mention only. Similarly, Beardsley was great for us (albeit his best season was pre-EPL). He was arguably better at Liverpool and definitely better at Newcastle. I don't think we saw the best of Barmby or Barry either.

Materazzi was a top defender for many years and is therefore an honourable mention, but he didn't get a chance to evolve into the finished article in his one season at Goodison. And whilst I'd love to have included Joe Parkinson and Everton certainly did benefit from his best years - his few progressive seasons in the top flight don't (in my opinion) really put him in contention against 15-20-year top performers.

Speed was pure class and perhaps I overly favoured Graveson in my selection in wanting to make sure that there was that balance in midfield that often gets overlooked in best elevens. I was also keen to have some representation for our excellent academy, so Osman and Unsworth got marginal calls over the likes of Pienaar, Jagielka, Yobo and Distin (where I couldn't justify Rooney, Barkley or Hibbert for example).

Dave #17 you are of course absolutely right that it was 10 (long) years ago, not 20, since we last won an EPL derby. Thanks

Am I missing something, or are those who have spent the last six months telling us how lucky we are to have Carlo trying to pull off the greatest act of expectation management since Kenwright and Moyes invented the glass ceiling? Is that really the general consensus? Are none of those who have been making all those noises about what Carlo is going to show us the courage of their convictions?

I'm genuinely stunned. All this outpouring of watch-us-go. All this bravado and it seems the limit of our expectation is to turn the tables on the likes of Burnley, Leicester City, Sheffield United and Wolves? Do those who think we are lucky to have Carlo actually believe what they are spouting?

When Davey Moyes used to tell us how difficult it was to crack top four we called him a negative dream crusher. He didn't have the benefit of a brand new midfield unit of his choice for his second season. They sold his best player. Roberto finished higher than 6th in his first season.

Seems the luckier we get with managers, the lower our expectation becomes. The more money we spend the less our ambition.

I sincerely hope Carlo has a greater expectation and ambition than those who tell us we are lucky to have him.

Sixth? Sean Dyche'll be up all night.

Where will we end up? Who knows. But we should be competing for that 6th / 7th spot this time around. Who knows, even a touch higher if something clicks and we get some luck. And hopefully we'll see a shape / style emerge too.

Ok, it's not going to be our title year but it should be much more enjoyable than it has been. Looking forward to it, big time.

James Rodriguez: "I said yes to Toffees because of Ancelotti."

Err... slam-dunk. Case closed.

Not even if you had quoted the player - As opposed to the reporter. I am still waiting for the player who said he had just signed for a manager he regards as a complete Cheshire cat.

Contracts are the real pulling power. In every walk of life.James was not signing for the Dog and Duck, he was not making a choice between two Sunday league managers both offering him an Ayrton Senna a game to come and play for them.

This is a multi-million pound contract and seeing as Bayern Munich and Real Madrid were not prepared to gamble on the guy's future fitness, it was the only real one on the table. Those who know this and still want to believe that it was the manager's pulling power that got him here are perfectly at liberty to do so. I don't.

I won't condemn Ancelotti for taking this gamble. In many ways, he had to, but let's be very clear here. He was the only one prepared to offer such a lucrative contract.

We all know what James said about coming to play for Ancelotti, but they all say stuff along those lines.

The world and his dog knew Sam Allardyce was only ever here for a short term, but it didn't stop Walcott saying he was swayed by signing for Sam. What else are you going to say about a guy who has just offered you a contract when your injuries were making you doubt if you will ever be offered another one?

Be a man, Dazza, and admit that you got this one horribly wrong.

Spewing out words ad nauseam, in voice or print, is hardly a guarantee of credibility.

Just look at BoJo for instance. Never stops tub-thumping and talking shite to the extent he's long since become risible in all but the most skewed minds.

Read the quote Mike dragged up from over a month ago

"When we get the players who have attracted the interest of the top boys".
Get back to me when that happens and I'll be the first to hold my hands up.

Gambles nobody else was prepared to take don't count. For "pulling power" to be in evidence, the player has to have an alternative something to pull the player from - Think Ian Snodin

Gabriel and Holjbjerg had other options and are among a growing list of players who have knocked this "pulling power" nonsense out of the park.
I'm not sure why you and Mike are so determined to TRY to make this point (actually I am), but you are beginning to sound like you are re-enacting an excerpt from the life of Brian.

It would be fantastic if James was to rekindle something like his performances from his pre-injury, younger days. If he does, I will be the first to applaud the gamble. That is a guarantee, but I'll still always know it was a gamble.

"Pulling power"? When I look at all those good players who have gone to China. I can only assume there is some world class charismatic coaches over there luring them over to enhance their game... I mean. Why else would they go?

Pulling power: James Rodriguez is only at Everton because Carlo Ancelotti is the manager.

You might need to read that a few times before it sinks in...

Carlo is not the only reason James is here. There are several more compelling reasons I can think of. The first two are obvious. If he was still wanted in Munich or Madrid, we would not be having this conversation. We probably wouldn't be having it if he had offers from Manchester or West London either.

What is interesting is reading Mr Brightside "guarentee " he will will applaud Carlo's vision and audacity for bringing this superstar to play for us.

Looks at his watch and taps his foot

Unlike all our previous managers (who wouldn't have dreamed of even attempting this move). Ancelotti has thought big time.

Now can we get on with the season ?

James on signing - "I am really happy to be at a great club. A club with so much history and with a manager who knows me really well. I'm looking forward to achieving great things here and winning things which is what everones aim is"

The transfer suited all parties.
James signed a 6 year contract for Madrid in 2014. By signing for us he will earn 12.5m he probably wouldn't have got elsewhere.
Madrid did not want the player to leave for nothing so were happy to take the offer we made.
Moshiri got a really marketable commodity on the cheap and Carlo got a man with the ability to turn his fortunes
Smiles all round

As you quite rightly point out. If this guy rediscoveres his form. Nobody will give a damn how, why or when he got here

I'd also suggest that whilst he is otherwise Everton's greatest ever goalkeeper, Neville Southall's overall Premier League performance was not as impressive as Nigel Martyn's.