A spineless surrender to Ole's under-fire Reds

Bernard has got a lot of grief this season without hardly kicking a ball. Far better option than Iwobi.

I just hope that the rest of the team can make up for the inevitable pedestrian fouling stench that Sigurdsson will produce.

Need a change in performance after the last two poor ones.

COYB

If we are to be serious contenders for the Top Four we can't afford to lose any more ground. Okay we are sitting in a fairly good position, but as Southampton showed last week and last night a couple of good results and it elevates you to the Top.

Let's make sure we knock them off that perch tonight and claim it back again. There are a few sides who can spring surprises and are playing well so let's not let our own wagon get derailed.

Clearly Carlo isn't impressed by what he's seeing from Gordon in training, so we can't speculate really?

The emphasis will be on how we defend, that United attack is good let's be honest.

Can't keep conceding two goals every week.

Almost. 🙄 🇮🇸

I fancy us today though. 2 - 1.

Full support.
Onward Evertonians. 👍🏼💙

If Sigurdsson is in midfield today, we might as well give up now. If he is more advanced then he might have a chance of doing well as Utd will not sit back and defend, this will open up space. Unfortunately, if he is played more advanced there are likely to be limited options for him to make a pass.

We're either going to have a midfield that will be lightweight with Bernard in, or slow and ponderous with Sigurdsson in.

What do Gordon and Davies have to do to get a game?

I kind of see where you are coming from with regards to Gordon, especially with players in his position underperforming.

I do get the feeling though that Carlo may be holding him back slightly for his own benefits.

Sometimes when a player isn't in the team we can get a warped sense of their importance and then build a player up so much that when he does play, if he's not producing magical match winning moments the fans start getting on their backs then.

Gordon should be getting more game time I agree, but let's not pretend he's the saviour yet because he isn't, expect too much too soon and then it ruins the lad.

Next window I am sure will see some players gone and hopefully replaced with faster thinking and faster moving players.

Bernard in the last chance saloon today so hope he shows up as he does sometimes show how skillful he can be. Needs to put himself about, find the spaces and show for the ball throughout the game.

Tough one today no matter what anyone says as they have some terrific players on their day.

Next window I am sure will see some players gone and hopefully replaced with faster thinking and faster moving players.

Bernard in the last chance saloon today so hope he shows up as he does sometimes show how skillful he can be. Needs to put himself about, find the spaces and show for the ball throughout the game.

Tough one today no matter what anyone says as they have some terrific players on their day.

Fact is, without Richarlison, we are greatly disadvantaged. This dependance needs to be resolved in the next window.

But, in other positive news, the other 9 players (well, 8 as Siggy) are our first choice players. That right side of James and Coleman is key, and Digne too.

This is massive for us. We win and the team is showing a bouncebackability which will give the players plenty of encouragement going forward. if we lose we will start to tumble down the table.

Good Good players in that United line up, but they don't always put it together as a unit. Tough one to call, but I'm going for an Everton win - just

Crucial

The manager must be seeing promising signs from him in training for him to start, so maybe he can turn his form around.

Man Utd have been poor and fatigue will kick in too if we can play at a high tempo for 90 mins. I can see us posing a threat from corners and free kicks and this is where the match will be won in a tight and scrappy game. Prediction

Everton 1 Man Utd 0

I just hope Siggy is deployed centrally in an advanced role in a 4-2-3-1 formation. He's next to useless deeper or out wide.

Positive lineup anyway. That's half the battle.

UTFT!

Gylfi Sigurdsson is shite. He's been anonymous again. He trots about the pitch when the other team has the ball. He stands still when we have it. He doesn't tackle, he's not scoring or creating. How can you rate him when he is anonymous every week?!

lose the ball.. drop back into formation. Rather than closing down..

Have the ball.. look sideways and backwards as a first consideration. No thought of going forward..

Decent 15 minutes then reverted to the above..

Holgate and Keane marking no one for both their goals. Shambolic..

Bernard playing well...

Then we have midfield players with the "I'll get him in a minute" method of marking, the I've got the space why mark the man.

And up front, Calvert-Lewin has to move across their backline on the six yard box not in between defenders so that the ball can't reach him.

It's not that difficult and it could make a difference even if it just looks better!

There's no one following the runners.
Defender's not tight enough. Too much space in between defence and midfield not picking anyone up.

We can get back into this but I think Allan has been poor. He's on a yellow card, sub him off. Play Doucoure or Holgate there. A bit of Gordon pace for Siggy through the middle.

(sarc button firmly pressed)

We are being coached to play this defeatist shite. This is training ground stuff.

Poor... poor poor.

Lead balloon.

No defender at the club the can actually defend, defensive midfielder's that don't affect the game.

I'm starting to really worry with Ancelotti now that he's just another in the long list of Koeman's ect.

Certainly can't defend under him.

I know it might not seem the obvious thing to say after a day like this, but DCL is getting better and better.

We aren't even in the same league as Southampton or Leicester anymore.

We should be very worried because I don't see where we go from here; the lack of strength and quality in the team is appalling.

I've truly had enough.

Tony 57, I am with you mate, can't be arsed with it all, I've had enough too.

Our priority in January is an attacking midfielder then a winger with some pace to play back up to Richarlison.

It wasn't spineless. We lacked quality when it mattered.

Disappointing.

Baffling team selection, we need runners to make the most out of Rodriguez and, with Richarlison out, the only 2 we have left are Gordon and Iwobi (as much as I think Iwobi is not good enough).

It's no surprise that we looked better with someone stretching them out wide, this then creates space for overlaps or inside.

Sigurdsson didn't do a lot wrong today, but Sigurdsson didn't do a lot in general today - other than waste numerous set piece situations.
Bernard played better than I expected.
Calvert-Lewin needs some service.
Rodriguez had no outlet when he had the ball.
Doucoure should have done better with 2 chances.
Allan was ok.
Full backs were decent.
Holgate and Keane showed rustiness in the first half as a pairing, but got better.
Pickford had his usual once a game howler.

I still persist that I would be happy never seeing Sigurdsson or Delph in a blue shirt again.

How can someone like Carlo Ancelotti NOT get his midfield to play FORWARDS?!?!?

It's just staggering.

The midfield has no pace, there's no decent winger with pace.

Defence just the same as under Martinez, slipshod, weak mentally and switch off constantly.

Sickening when you at the way other teams around us play with a real shape and dynamic.

I thought Iwobi played well when he came on. I'd have played him instead of Sigurdsson centrally from the start. He's better at breaking up play, has better energy and can move with the ball. Then again, that can't be too difficult, I am talking about Sigurdsson here?! It's been a disappointment given we opened the scoring and then let them back into the game from silly defensive errors. Holgate is rusty and he probably needs the international break to get match fit. It's imperative that we get back to winning ways at Fulham. If we lose to them then this more than a bump in the road. But I wouldn't take too much attention to the result today. I'd hazard a guess that Ancelotti's overall win record since he's been here is still in the top 4.

Btw, a special mention to Fernandes. What a player but an absolute shit house who spent most of the game on the floor trying to get fouls.

Much to ponder. But our inability to deal with Fernandes on the edge of our box is really what cost us today. For me that was because of midfielders switching off; Sigurdsson for the first Fernandes goal, as on initial viewing it seemed like he got drawn all over the place rather than just staying with Fernandes.

Great to see Holgate back.

We need players that are able to run fast. Sigurdsson can not start any games. He is too slow, period.

Where is Gordon? The only midfield player with speed? Not even on the bench?

What is it with Doucoure? Yes, he is good defensively, but whats going on with his offensive involvment?

Holgate, where should I start. Is he the best choice? What about Godfrey? Is he not a better choice than Holgate as a central defender?

The right wing is too slow with Rodriguez and Coleman. Everything happened on the other side with Bernard and Digne.

A couple of players good today Bernard, Digne, Allan, DCL, Keane and Iwobi when he came in. Thats not good enough.

Tosun - seriously, we could have played with 10 men, would have been no difference.

Without Richarlison we are shit. Same problem as earlier. Next time we buy players we have to buy players that can run a lot and fast.

Keane (the experienced defender, cough cough) was marking space ie no one.

Bruno their best player was left unmarked all game. Our CDM should have taken responsibility but no one did.

You could see a counter attack coming all game. I just didn't expect so many of our players out of position. Poor defensively again.

After reading the lead we would have started in shadow and controlled the game. We did it well against spurs. Been terrible since.

Can't listen to these commentators, did McManaman really grow up in kirkdale? And as much as I think Pickford needs a rest, not one of these phoney bastards mentioned McGuire's hand push right into our keepers chest, just before he dropped the ball.

Feel sorry for Allan and Doucoure, because the midfield is not being set up right imo, but I saw enough fight and effort, but just not enough quality, and also a formation that is making the pitch too big, when we haven't got possession of the ball.

"Everton FC. has the honor to submit a formal request to the Premier League asking if MU and the referees will commits fraud against in the upcoming match between both clubs. In case the answer is affirmative, Everton FC. formally offers do not present its team for the next match and give the points freely to MU".

As I say, it's the midfield. I agree with Tony Abrahams about our set up (Ancelotti is an increasing concern) but Allan and Dacoure, especially the latter, aren't delivering when and where it matters.

The Bernard and Digne combination was good to see in the 1st half.
Digne should have crossed for DCL instead of going for glory.
Allan covered a lot of ground and came forward more with the ball.
Doucoure protected Coleman well today, but he should have scored from one of the 2 chances at the end.
I had given up on Iwobi, but to be fair to him, he always seems to play better from the bench. He was a real thorn in Man United's side and created a few opportunities.
Siggy played well although his set piece delivery was very disappointing. In general, we had more set piece opportunities than Man Utd but the delivery was very disappointing.

I thought Man United defended well, we just didn't have the guile on the day to break them down and conceded 2 soft goals.

With the space the ManU players have the quality to deliver an accurate cross, right between Keane and Holgate. I checked their position which looks correct. I heard the commentary saying the centre backs should have stand closer together. Mind you. The moment they stand closer together, the ball would be played towards the front post or towards the back post. Same result. They have the quality to cross. So we have to deal with that before allowing that to happen.

I know Doucoure should have take his chances better. But when I look at how much ground he covered, I can understand. He's doing a lot of heavy-lifting for others. We need more players who can run. And can run fast.

I have given up on Iwobi. But today he's the bright spot. Also Bernard.

We would have big trouble facing Leeds.

No goal threat bar Bernard's effort.

Piss poor creativity from midfield.

Pickford got away with another error.

Massively miss Richarlison. Too many players that need shifting through the door.

The only two who really shined were two we didn't expect -- Bernard with a ceaseless effort and some really lovely passes to go with his goal, and Iwobi with a genuine spark off the bench and our only good crosses of the day.

Here's some news for the blues
We've found this new way to lose
When we're hot then we fail
And we all get right on the ale

So get your coat on and get moving
Come and see this new way of losing
So come on come on get smashed at goodison park
Wooooo

Everton, always take us lightly
Everton, you got us on the booze
Everton, always take us lightly
Everton, so many ways to lose

We're on the glue
From watching all the ways we lose
It's no surprise
That the whole thing's affected my eyes

So get your coat on and get moving
We've found a new way of losing
So come on come on get smashed at goodison park
Wooooo

Everton, always take us lightly
Everton, you got us on the booze
Everton, always take us lightly
Everton, so many ways to lose
etc

The officials were garbage through out, but theres no excuse. Sadly playing football with no belief, desire and tempo means we wont win too many games this season.

Thank God, Richarlison is back next week. The last x3 games and I doubt we've had x10 shots on goal.

Absolutely sick to the back teeth. United wanted it more, and we didn't stick one in on the dirty cowardly, diving crap house Fernandez.

Basic defending, was missing again, basic finishing and umpteen final balls, went missing.

Fulham will fancy their chances, next week and based on Evertons last x3 games, you can't blame them.

Surely, next week Anthony Gordon starts instead of Siggy?

For me the mojo of the team has vanished, over night, and whilst we are still in a decent position another performance like this, and the normal season, will be here again for Everton.

The frustration today, after decades, of mediocrity, is feeling worse.

Losing playing well and trying, you don't mind, but losing like this today against United, feels very bad.

No belief, no shape no inspiration...

What the hell, is going wrong as, this demise in form, is not all down to being without Richarlison..

A few beers will ease the pain, but not the inevitability,of night turning today and day to night, that Everton, will let us down again.

Sick to the back teeth and a life time book of inevitability in context of EFC, ambles on.

Next week hopefully the squad will focus on the basics, and desire and grind out a much needed win at Fulham.

Massive game for the club and the manager and coaches and the players have a lot to work on, to turn this bad form around.

The games against Southampton and Newcastle were warning signs, this one is a foghorn! I have to give Iwobi his due today; useless but willing.

I'm not giving up on Carlo. He still needs two more transfer windows but Jesus Christ it's harder each season to watch this shite.

Careful, you might have a best seller on your hands.

I thought it was great to see my first choice defence play today, though I don't know why Keane and Holgate didn't swap left/right. Keane's been having a good season, but was at fault for their first 2 goals.

James is brilliant, but I don't think we can carry him when we don't have Richarlison on the other side. When there's no Richarlison, James should be on the bench.

DCL is brilliant, but must be knackered battling on his own like that.

Doucoure's lost his shooting boots, but will be fantastic when he finds them again. It's just a pity he can't be rested for a couple of games to find his form.

Bernard and Iwobi tried, but they look like mid-table players at best. Bernard is a poor man's Brazilian Leon Osman.

Allan can't carry the midfield on his own.

Sigurdsson. Gylfi Sigurdsson. If he's the answer, then I'm really struggling to know what the question is. He's not good at pressing, he can pass, but he can't dribble. And he's allergic to going forwards. Frankly I wish we had a Barkley-style player there instead.

It's about taking responsibility, communication, partnerships and hard work.

Pickford OK, a few flaps but he was fouled by Maguire when dropping the ball. Much, much better kicking.

Holgate played well. 1st game back. He's helped our left side look good. Digne and Bernard linked well. Keane was Keane. Did OK but takes blame for their first goal.

The right side did very little in the first half. James just needs to find space and control the game. Seamus tried a few runs but there was very little effective link up.

Centrally I thought Allan, Doucoure and Siggy did little. No energy. Allan was our best attacking midfielder but our worst defensively, all very wrong.

A lack of cover, understanding, combinations and lack of forward options didn't help.

If Siggy isn't going to shoot from distance he offers no threat. Play Davies who at least will put a tackle in.

DCL good hold up play. Very few chances, needs quicker and more crosses into the box.

As for subs. Iwobi did OK. Put a few crosses in. Chased back, won the ball a few times.

Tosun, nothing.

Next game is now very important.

1. We are not as good as early results suggested
2. We are still suffering from the legacy of the past 4 managers player wise
3. Utd where hurting after midweek capitulation and they have a lot more quality than us, lets face it, their manager is not a a patch on Carlo but the quality they have pulled them through
4. It's what I've come to expect from Everton

We could and should have drawn the game. For me the pivotal moment was Digne not squaring to DCL. 2-1 then and a different story

However, we played into their hands. It was an almost perfect opening 20 minutes. Then we let Utd in, opened up and practically gifted them the lead.

The second half was a case of Utd sitting deep, cynical fouls breaking any play we made (and the referee allowing them to do so). If that had been us, the media would be spitting blood at our 'dirty' play. Yet for Utd, it's simply the players showing their passion and loyalty to their manager. Fernandes should have been sent off. Maguire should have been too for his cynical lunge on Digne. Fred also went two footed on Allan to zero punishment. They would pull our shirts, and the referee would fall.for it every time. If the fans were there, it may be different as we'd have been screaming at the woeful refereeing.

But still, that doesn't make up for our naivety after taking the lead. Then our lack of ability to break them down in the second half. We need Richarlison, that is clear. His pace and aggression going forward are greatly missed.

Our bench is just too weak, Tosun is poor, so poor.

But Allan was back to his best, which was good to see. Iwobi was ok when he came on. But we need another midfielder, and another attacker, it's plain to see.

The appointment of Koeman/Walsh has done us just as much damage as the Kings Dock fiasco, as the squad is awful. Carlo needs a squad of top-top players, Seedorf, Lampard, Petr Cech, Cafu, Pirlo, Nesta, Ramos, Drogba. You get my drift.

The Everton Job and squad is as challenging as it gets along with the ingrained losers mentality. The Peoples Club eh. It's shambolic.

Soggy didn't play to badly today he covered enormous amount of space but poor defending by Coleman and whoever was supposed to be picking Fernandez up.

If we keep giving up at least 2 goals a game we will lose far more than we win.

We are getting back to Marco style tippy tappy at the back, can't create chances and leak goals like a sieve.

Over to you Carlo.

Pickford
Coleman Holgate Keane Digne
Doucoure Allan
James Richarlison Bernard
DCL

Keep the hope up guys, it is still early days! We got to believe that Carlo will get it right.

There are occasional good runs and good signings, but on the whole there seems something fundamentally wrong inside the club. Until there is a big change at board level, with proper sports management people coming in, I can't see any significant change.

You can't really keep blaming the last four managers though.

Managers are meant to come in and stamp their authority and playing style on a team, it's not like Carlo only got here last month.

Look at the state Southampton were in when Hassenhutl took over, hasnt taken him long to get a team looking like a team.

Leicester were a disgrace under Puel but look like Man City lite under Rodgers in just over a year.

I can't sit here and seriously criticise a man with Carlo Ancelotti's CV but results and team selection like today's are purely on him, the tippy tappy nonsense is what he wants the defenders to do, are they good enough to do it? No.

We all slagged off Allardyce, the football was mundane of course it was but what he did when he came in for the first 10 matches was completely simplify the basic art of defending, he earned a point at Anfield with a defence of Kenny, Martina, Williams and Holgate for Christ sake!

I expect a man with Carlo's experience to be able to send a team out there more capable of keeping a tighter defensive structure but right now it's a throwback to this time last year again.

Carlo and chums have no one to blame but themselves they were either too incompetent to see the urgency of the situation or plain naive. The summer window did not accomplish the necessary and the ghouls of Silva, Koeman and Allardyce are tapping him on the shoulder saying "at least you get a good pay off"

Questions have to be asked as to why we get rid of 2 forwards and spend 30 million on a defender for the future. Who makes those decisions?

Allan and Doucoure together - is it working or are they simply struggling to cover the ground vacated by the other midfielders? I do think there's an argument for replacing one with a more creative and pacey midfielder - again from January if poss. Offload at least one of Siggy/Gomes/Bernard at the same time to balance the books - though it sounded like Bernard played pretty well today.

On the plus side we have a realistic possibility of six points coming up from the next two games - IF we can recover some of the old form.

However him returning won't resolve our defending as a team. We may still outscore teams but are likely to lose tight affairs, ultimately we don't have a No6. to sit and do the job to screen the back four and give the ball to better players. Is that person JP Gbamin? 👀

I don't think neither Allan (no positional discipline) or Doucoure (asked to do too much covering for both James and Allan) are the answer. For example Fernandes schooled Allan all day exploiting his lack of discipline.

We will probably beat Fulham and Leeds but I doubt Carlo will fix the problem we have without the ball as a unit.

Not without a huge turn around, we won't.

But we need more speed, speed and speed.

Everton, drives you to despair.

Midtable normality resumed.

The main reason for the poor performances in the last 3 games has been the lack of balance within the starting 11 which we had until we played the shite.

James needs runners to be effective which has been woefully lacking since Richi has been suspended and given our full backs bomb forward we need at least one of the three midfielders to hold position in defence to support the centre halves during quick transitions. Allan nor Doucoure are doing this and nearly always press the ball in front of them rather than hold their position when required.

I am confident we will beat Fulham (who are very poor) however I do have a concern that our current set up means our defensive unit is not solid enough to compete for top 6 and that is not solely down to Pickford.

Us? We've bought, for the first time since Martinez' first season with a plan but the damage has been done over a number of years. FFP resrictions mean we cannot replace half the squad overnight, even if this were desirable. It has to be accomplished in stages and this summer was Stage One. Hopefully January will be Stage Two, but that will depend on who is obtainable and outgoings. Clearly we need to add quality options in several positions still.

Today? Well, I liked the lineup but it didn't work out. I think bringing back 3 players from injury backfired. Coleman was not ready and struggled; JJK would have been preferable. Holgate was lacking match sharpness (unsurprisingly), though he improved second half. In retrospect would've been better coming off the bench for a couple matches. James is clearly not right yet, hasn't been since the VVD foul. The other change, Bernard, played well and took his goal smartly. Pleased for the lad, who obviously wants to play and is focused and looks to make things happen. Our best player first half.

We struggled to get any quality balls into the box, or to support DCL with midfield runners. Our line was too deep, leaving gaps in midfield for Fernandes to exploit. We need to play a high(-er) line to allow Allan and Dacoure to win their battles; today they were chasing shadows. Iwobi was impressive when he came on, but atm I don't trust him to start. Saying that, I'd have preferred him playing instead of Sigurdsson, who looks finished now as a starter and should be moved out in January, if there's any takers.

This run of games has been a disaster, in terms of suspensions and injuries. Hopefully the international break will allow a couple of players to get fit, we refocus as we then have 3 games to come where we should be aiming at maximum points.

I think top 6 is still a reality but feel we need to add a couple of quality players in January; a forward option (maybe Milik) and a wide attacker, preferably on the right, or someone like Lozano who can play both wings.

On a related note, it was also depressing today watching DCL break forward and having no one in support and having to win a corner as the best outcome he could achieve - no one near him.

Other option is to try 4-2-3-1 with maybe Iwobi in front of Allan/Dacoure, but unsure how this would work.

Hopefully the club, will show some character and bounce back, this week.

Let's hope Richarlisons, return, sees a return to winning ways, at Fulham.

Rodriguez and Bernard, with no real penetration of their own, have no pace / movement elsewhere in the team to find with their good quality. Sigurdsson / Gomes continue to be passengers.

Despite having never been a fan of Walcott or Bolasie, they would at least provide us with something to complement Rodriguez instead of more of the same. It would have the opposition running back towards their goal instead of watching everything unfold at a snail's pace in front of them.

Quite what Gordon has to do to get a game I do not know. He was the best of a bad bunch after the restart - and has done well against admittedly poor opposition in the cups.

To me, I think it's got to the point where we just can't get a performance out of Sigurdsson or Gomes. We need to go with the more Gordon and Iwobi, accept they are erratic, but do so in the knowledge that they do at least move about a bit and create passing opportunities for Rodriguez.

We looked OK at times today but never caused thier goalkeeper any problems. No wingers with pace, no goal threat, no chances for DLC it all equals only one thing no fcking points.

Fernandez was the difference today. He ghosted into space without anyone picking him up for the entire game.

UTD have goal threats up top and in midfield. We had 1 player who is scoring whilst we are almost surprised if any of our other players score.

Bernard had his best game under Ancelotti linking up well with Digne just a shame that our half chances fell to players that just don't know how to find the back of the net. Dacoure 2 chances near the end looked like he had never kicked a ball before in his life. Goals win games and we just don't score enough outside of Richarleson or DCL.

Our formation or game plan was far too open. It would have been a decent game for the neutral.

What has happened to Sigurdssons delivery from set pieces. Another anonymous game for the 45m man.

3 losses on the trot have taken place because we cannot move up the pitch fast enough.

It'll get better obviously when Richarlison is back. But it beggars belief that we can still be so reliant on him.

And it's just so sad that we're behaving like a little club again that doesn't have the balls to take a game to the opposition.

Deep fucking breath again. We must stay calm. This is a true test of Ancelotti's credentials both as a tactician and man-manager because he must start thinking radically on both fronts. He must show craft and nerve and get the players to do the same. Our heads have gone for the moment.

Of course, we lost three straight games in our title winning season of 86-87, one of them against Charlton if memory serves. Obviously, a good omen.

If only Everton could have done what Marine just did at Colchester.

If a manager like Ancelotti can not get a shift out of these boys Moshiri is totally fucked !

He needs to bring in 1 or 2 option upfront in Jan, even if its on loan and then in the sumer another 4 or 5 players. Goalkeeper, RB and RW has to be priority. Address some much needed pace in the forward areas.

Carlo needs the next two windows to sort this out and bring his own players in.

I'm not so sure, many home games over decades and certainly against Liverpool the Everton players just shove lube up their arses and bend over.

"We had this bad moment and we have to be focused"

Marco Silva rides again.

This is a marathon and Carlo sees getting rid of two big salaries (Siggi and Bernard and Iwobi) is how this will be done.

The only way to do it is to put them in the shop window (play them) and hope this is not to the detriment of the team, at the moment it is.

We need a settled defence and now that Holgate is back we may see this.

We need pace in the middle and dropping Siggi for Richarlison will bring this but I would also swap Davies for Bernard.

All teams in the prem have pace except us!!!!!

What little we have we need to use.

Unfortunately, I am one of those naive Evertonians who let their hopes get raised. I should know better at my age, I'm taken in every time, which is utterly daft because at the back of my mind there is always this nagging anticipation of eventual disappointment.

Where to start?
Allan obviously comes with good pedigree and a great reputation. If I am correct he's been signed as our midfield stopper. In other words his specialism is the defensive side of the midfield game and we should t expect anything from him going forward.

In that event, he should be in the ideal position to cover the advances of Bruno Fernandes. Today, he wasn't. Just prior to his first goal Bruno had two opportunities presented to him in acres of space to pull the trigger. Allan was nowhere near on either occasion. Just as he was nowhere near the bursting run the Portuguese man made for his first goal.

My point is, if Allan isn't giving us defensive dominance then what is he giving us?

Doucoure I'm afraid is full of energy but low on quality. He looked to me at Watford as a bog standard athletic premier league midfield player. He's very much been that in an Everton shirt.

I think the Holgate start obviously says as much about Yerry as it does about Holgate. The Englishman started today and I felt that he should've at least been anticipating the Bruno header and challenging for it. And for the second goal his positioning was wrong again.

Godfrey deserves a chance to put his best foot forward and make a start at centre back.

Pickford: simple. Olsen should start the next game game.

Sigurdsson. No more game time for the icelander.

Iwobi. Don't rate him but took his chance today. Enough to stay in contention.

So deflated.

At this rate, we will be in the bottom 3 in January. Did someone say Carlos is the man, needs a long hard look in the mirror I think. Another weekend ruined but aye this is being an Evertonian. 2 weeks off now to pick up more injuries. Onwards and downwards, me thinks.

Anyone interested in any of our cast-offs will be well aware of what they're about.

In the case of Sigurdsson anyway, we'll get less the more is seen of him.

Sigurdsson tries but his legs have gone. He hasn't the mobility, pace, ability to rapidly close down or tackle. He must then be on the pitch for his contribution to the attack ? In the last 43 Premier League games he has scored two goals (one a penalty), his assists stand at 4, one in every ten or eleven games. Even his dead ball ability is becoming suspect. James Rodriguez or Digne are probably better at it.

Why are we starting with him week after week ? No wonder we have problems when he is contributing next to nothing. A Premier League team cannot carry passengers and get away with it.

Gomes and Delph didn't feature today, but Gomes hasn't been much better, Delph maybe needs more games, but he is in this category too.

Carlo Ancelotti has to wake up and smell the coffee with regards players who are weakening the team for their inclusion.

Carlo can't polish a turd but he's not even looking for the shovel to fuck them out. We have entitled players at this club that have consistently drained the life out of any decent players we bring in. It's a fucking cancer, folks. Cut it out or suffer the consequences.

Delph is in your category, and is apparently now injured, again.

Picking the more experienced 'better footballers' in a system that doesn't suit and not using the younger players with more energy, pace and aggression.

Perhaps if he must pick these players maybe a change of system to a 3-5-2 would be best? The attacking threat we have is Coleman and Digne anyway and we can then play 2 up top, Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison. James in behind them with Allan and Doucouré in midfield?

It is, however, worrying that the same system appears to be used time and time again with mostly the same players and that's 3 losses and 1 draw out of the last 4.

The international break coming at a good time this time.

Who'd be an Evertonian!

I'm not suprised we lost, just the manner of it.

I agree, the selection and formations being wrong in this past three games. But most of all, the advances in basic individual coaching by Ancelotti have been lost as a result. Certain players and their poor performances are being allowed to influence the team tempo, tactics and formation.

The resulting weaknesses have been exposed in the last three games. Everton are currently playing as they did under Silva, which was always player-dictated.

If you think Carlo is the problem then you really and genuinely have absolutely no clue about football.

I'm absolutely aghast at anybody questioning Ancelotti.

It's laughable. You just be deranged.

Get rid of Ancelotti, one of the most decorated coaches in the history of the game. One of only 10 managers to have won a Premier League title.

Sack him. Who comes on and does better??????

Klopp or Simeone and that's about it. And even then we're talking some of the best managers in the history of the game.

The guy has inherited a squad full of dross.

The teams now target our weakness, namely our right hand side where initially Godfrey was left isolated, then Kenny, and today Coleman - all because James repeatedly and Gomes last week don't give our full backs any cover at all. Unfortunately James is a luxury you can't afford, as a winger, as today they need to track the opposition full backs.

We're not utilising our purchases well at the moment, Allan was a Hunter gatherer at Napoli, all over the place pressing, now used as a No 6 deep lying covering our brittle defence. Doucoure was box to box, occasional goal scorer at Watford, now caught between covering James, doing the work of Siggy or Gomes and never supporting DCL. Neither Doucoure or Allan did a job on Fernandez today, he jinked between the lines and both left him in acres of space and he destroyed us.

We desperately need a fit, Gbamin, a true No 6, one who would then allow Allan and Doucoure to get on with their own specialist games. Until then we can only hope after today, Holgate is pushed into it with Mina/ Keane/Godfrey as our centre half's.

If we can get a No6 working well, Doucoure and Allan further up and then allow James the freedom as a No 10, feeding Richarlison, DCL and hopefully Gordon as replacement provided Ancelotti gives him a chance. Gordon must be wondering how he's been left behind especially when Tosun gets on the bench ahead of him. Ancelotti can't be allowed to state that's it not his job to develop young talent - Brands needs to step in here and question Ancelotti on Gordon's complete lack of game time.

And finally Ancelotti - to me and many others you seem to be lost at the moment with poor team selections, poor team tactics, poor use of substitutes - please show us how you have developed teams to regularly parade around the European scene. One loss, ok, two losses raises questions, 3 losses leads to questioning his ability.

Yes, we miss Richarlison, but Bernard done what he was asked to do: helped Digne and scored a goal. James today was a luxury who looked as he was unfit.

Doucoure was expected to be on the team sheet today; what wasn't expected was he missed 2 chances to score with 1 he should never have missed. We only had Mina missing from previous 2 games who received a lot of criticism for his performances and likewise Gomes.

There are no easy games in this league and you have to have a full squad to compete, and the difference was shown when we bring on Tosun they bring on Pogba.

Man Utd were not there for the taking, they were there to compete, and the reality was they competed better than Everton, and that's what makes this result so scary.

It's not all doom and gloom but tactically we got done again. We tried to sit deep but got caught on the crosses. It ruined our gameplan and, just like at Southampton and Newcastle, we hadn't the nous to turn it around.

Richarlison will be on his merry way next summer so we need to find another way to win.

No team should be dependent on one player, but this Everton squad is.

Hopefully as some people have had said on the threads today, may be this international break will do Everton a favour.

Football, Its in the mind, some times a team needs the guile to go route one, as well as play slick inter passing football, when on form.

To do this you need a boss on the park.

And to have a good boss's on the park, you need good verbal communication on the park.

Today I hope this is a harsh lesson the players and Carlo will learn from. The whole team must start taking more responsibility, as at times today aside to standing off, no one was barking orders.

Two soft avoidable goals, and getting mugged for the third goal.

Down to confidence, but today we played into a poor United team hands.

Down to the Cottage, hopefully we can erase this and our last performance down there. At the time we were on a three ga e run of wins, I recall.

Everton, it's, time, to get rejuvenated, please.

We all see games differently. I thought Coleman, Digne, Calvert-Lewin, Bernard, Doucoure and Iwobi all showed a lot of effort. Agreed that Doucouré should have scored. We just don't seem to have any sharp shooters. I also would like to see Olsen given a run. We lost due to really poor marking and, despite an early lead, we did not try to push on with that advantage.

We have to maintain faith with Ancelotti. As poor as three defeats in a row feels, hopefully it will give stimulus for improvement. We have just spent a lot of money on another centre-back. Play him please. Of all the new players, Allan has been the most disappointing from my perspective. But I am still prepared to give him time.

As a long time Evertonian now living 20 minutes from the US border, my disappointment was somewhat tempered by Biden winning the Election. Small consolation but at least it may have more long time positive consequences than Everton losing to Man Utd.

On the other hand, Everton winning is always appreciated far more than anything else. COYB get back to winning and keep me and all true Blues happy. We have been patient far too long.

Question: Does Pickford wear boxing gloves during game practices?

Having said that, nobody will succeed at Everton under the current curse of Kenwright.

How's the new ground coming along? Covid-19 allows for a very convenient Get Out of Jail Free card.

James can't play on the wing... he leaves the full back exposed continually – play him as a Number 10.

Doucouré was an odd signing... average.

Sigurdsson... take his locker from him.

Yet, instead, acquired another centre-half at £23 million, money that would have been better spent on attacking players, because Calvert-Lewin must be fed up with not receiving any service 3 games in a row.

I don't have many redeeming qualities but I am objective in analysis and this club is run like an amateur dramatics society compared to others exhibiting the hard edge professionalism of Broadway shows.

Be great if they would prove me wrong but, year-in & year-out, they fail to do the necessary... and here we are, 7 games into a season doing the usual of leaning on a handful of good players amidst a sea of dross.

It is a recipe for mediocrity but understandably the heart rules the head in such matters. After all, we all desperately want the club to succeed.

It's interesting. Allan and James appear to be very much Carlo signings. Doucouré and Godfrey however don't.

The Doucouré one for me is very much like when we got Iwobi. I thought maybe there was something I hadn't seen and maybe I was wrong.

Saw a tweet tonight about the combined cost of Iwobi, Cenk and Sigurdsson. Feel a bit sick about it all to be honest as I don't mind us wasting the money trying to get it right as long as it's sustainable but I get the really horrible and real feeling that it isn't

The last x3 games, have confirmed the limitations of the squad, and had confirmed more or less bar miracles, that there's an ensemble of dead wood to move on.

No easy task. Carlo for me, the last x3 games must take accountability, but also this confirms that some players aren't up for it.

We all have our views, on the players, respectfully right, but todays game was, lost as we gave them too much respect, and became too timid, and didn't have the belief or confidence, to get the shots off, when we could! And wasted every dead ball today.

No genuine out let for fast interplay passing up the park, today by Everton, so we helped United, supported by a referee and lines men, and combined to give the game to United on a plate.

No excuses for not competing and not believing.

Today United, eclipsed the RS, in the diving and feigning antics. The referee today and his officials, should be reported for bringing the game into disrepute for not sending off Fernandez for multiple diving and late tackles and also Maguire, for a straight red, on Diane. And being honest Pickford, could have seen red as well, but he was also impeded in the challenge, by Maguire.

We have a good manager, a proven manager, and until we get squad strength in depth and off load our dead wood and sick notes, this is the way it will be.

But there should be more substance and fight.

Pioneering the route map for EFC, at any level is not easy, and for Carlo, it's the Jacques Cousteau, period, in terms of sussing the players and the squad limitations.

I can't wait to get United back before Christmas in the Carabou, and beat them, and beat them well.

But between now and then, the squad needs to dig deep, and learn how to fight out of a corner.

The curse of the RS, or not, more grit and fight in every position must be shown, and by every player starting at Fulham.

Without him it is so much easier to defend against our slow players. Right sided Centre half doesn't get dragged across to protect the full back's inside shoulder for when he steps inside. Means DCL invariably has 2 centre halves to try and break free from.

Siggy offers absolutely nothing unless it is from a dead ball. He doesn't effect the game in any way unless he scores or creates a goal. Bit like Alli for Tottenham but less effective.

Bernard played well in large parts of the game and that surprised me. We really need some pace and options off the bench with pace. Moshiri's spends can't be over otherwise we will need to be really lucky with injury and suspensions.

We started fairly well in what was a scrappy affair from both sides, but once we got the goal, I thought 'here we go', but no! I said on the Live Forum like in many matches before, " we are giving these too much room " and lo and behold they score. Their tails go hope and our heads went down.

An all too familiar pattern, reading the posts before there were calls for, play so and so etc, I don't think it would have mattered who we played today, apart from Richie, they don't have the nous to win a game.

I sometimes despair of some of the guys on here. It's kind of childlike. When things go wrong most of them hit out at all and sundry finding fault and failure in pretty well everything Everton.

JT (the new Don) @ 207 pretty well sums it all up. The fault lies with Carlo, Kenwright and of course Bramley Moore will never happen.

Jesus, I'm so glad to self isolate from some of you guys.

One of the best Football Managers in the history of this game will get it right under the stewardship of the Everton Board. It will take a bit of time.

If changing a problematic business were that easy, most of you guys would be a helluva lot more successful than you are. A bit of advice. Think before you drink/type.

Being an Evertonian has built my character for many years. It has made me a glass half empty, miserable, cynical curmudgeon. Thanks to the lads for another shite Saturday. We can always rely on you.

I would love to know how many of them are as gutted as we are. You know what, I really doubt they are too bothered. I don't want to hear from Carlo or Seamus or any of them. I want them to shut the fuck up and earn their money.

The goalie Olsen was picked and played well at Newcastle, doing things we have been crying out for, like coming out and commanding his area and not dropping innocuous crosses or parrying the ball out to the onrushing forwards.

All we got from Carlo was a slight shrug of shoulders and a vague comment about Pickford needing a rest. Try and be ruthless, mate, or your CV will be dragged down to our level.

The disappointment today, is massive, x3 games, it's how this squad can bounce back.

Next time, out and victory at Fulham.

It baffles me that supposedly world class managers cannot see the obvious.

Siggy should never wear blue shirt again brings absolutely nothing to team just a passenger though out the game like playing with man short every time he plays same could be said about Rodriguez both woeful but at least Rodriguez might not have been fit.

1 shot on goal in 95 minutes ain't going to win you games massive mistake not signing striker during loan transfer window..

At times Tom Davies took stick, but at least that guy will put a tackle in and try and go past players.

I know Rodriguez is not known for sprinting, but he can play a through ball a 50 yard pass and put players on the front foot, this is something that Siggerson is not offering.

Plenty other areas need working on, but for now, playing Siggerson is killing us, surely Tom Davies or Anthony Gordon have to be given a starting place, after the International break.

I think the plan was to keep Kean, but his agent must have arranged a loan with PSG and he was determined to go. I doubt he will be back. As for Tosun he won't be any use, unless final third play improves way beyond current levels.

I find it hard to get my head around it as well. I was hoping for better.

People who can't/won't attribute massive responsibility to Kenwright, period, makes me think if fan bases had a "Masochist of the Quarter Century" award it'd be in our permanent possession, period.

Floundering around sequentially blaming managers and players, whilst understandable on a day like today, completely fails to address the poison that's been consuming our club from boardroom to Finch Farm ever since the year when the British record transfer fee was a mere £7mill.

Pathetic performance from our overpaid overated so-called footballers. What a bloody discrace we are. Top 4? Be closer to bottom 4 if we carry on with this calibre of performance much longer.

So disheartening following Everton. But we live in hope. Like we have for well over two decades. How much longer do we have to wait for some joy???

Coleman - Better than Kenny in general. Thats it. Right back needed.

Keane - Poor today. Slow and not good enough.

Holgate - Clearly not fit to have started this game.

Digne - Our best defender today. Yet did nothing spectacular.

Allan - Not a defensive midfielder.

Doucoure - Just a passenger on the pitch today.

Sigurdsson - Never want to see this man in an Everton shirt again. What a waste of money he is. 45 Million pound "creative" midfielder, yet did not play a single pass into DCL. Might as well start the game with ten men instead of starting him the fucking ghost. Get rid.

James - Clearly was not 100%. The fact that he is our creative player on the pitch and he is asking the bench to be substituted with 20 minutes to go when 2-1 down.

DCL - Third game on the bounce I feel for him. Feeding off scraps again. Would not surprise nor would I blame them, if him and Richarlison left in the summer.

Bernard - Got the goal, look lively first half an hour then proved he is too weak for this league.

As for that bench today. If any Everton fan thinks we can get into European football with a bench of Iwobi, Davies, Tosun and Gomes. Then they're deluded.

Club needs to get a grip ASAP. Just gonna wait and see in the papers on Monday morning either Coleman or Keane giving the old "it was not good enough" or the old "we'll come back next game" Do the fucking talking on the pitch lads!!!! Fans or no fans at the ground. The supporters at Everton still demand "Nil Satis Nisi Optimum" not "let's have a go and see what happens"

Big talk saying we want to compete with the big boys in the Echo or Sky. DO THE TALKING ON THE PITCH FFS!!!!

We will crack top 8 if we're lucky! We spent just enough to stand still. 4 of the back 5 are not top 6 material. Only digne gets a look in. New keeper has a good game, dominates his box and spreads calm and gets dropped, holgate straight back in the team against a very mobile front line, Coleman torn to pieces over and over again.

It's not the midfield, it's the defence. They genuinely are not good enough. Bottom line.

And the world is spinning, DT, lost the USA, election..

But the weather on TW, keeps us on our toes.

Here's to a good week, for all TWrs, but don't ever consider BBC, MOTD, as proper and fair reviewer, of teams, nor BT or Sky

The officials today at GP, based on clean descision making, were blight.

But so was Everton, in trying to play to win this game.

No, more to say.

2. We conceded to a cross which went straight in without anyone touching it.

3. They brought on Paul Pogba and Edinson Cavani: we brought on Cenk Tosun and Alex Iwobi.

4. Our goalkeeper could easily have been sent off. He also complained about the sunshine but did nothing about it.

5. Backwards and sideways passes outnumbered forward passes by about 3 to 1.

6. We need a boss who can arouse the sleeping giant, restore pride to battered egos and take on take on loudmouthed rich opponents: Welcome, Joe Biden!

7. A guy called Moise Kean has been seen in Paris, rolling around the floor, laughing his socks off.

Big big problem at the moment is Siggerson,he has to be taken out of the team.

We have tried and lost. So try something else. In the favored 4-3-3, Allan and Diacoure as box 2 box midfielders, supported behind by Holgate as a holding midfielder. Anthony Gordon would have been a better bet than Bernard. Bernard while technically good get brushed of the ball too easily.

The lack of a tracking back by James means we need another pacy ball playing defensive player to balance the team. We more directness up front to support Dom, that is Anthony or go out and buy Zaha.

Leave the defence alone with Keane and Mina as they are okay as a defensive pair and also add height threat to set pieces. Sadly time to get in a new right back with pace and attacking ability, as Coleman's deputy and let's get behind and support Pickford. He is not being helped by the lack of proper cover in front of him, and this possibly leads to a rush of blood to the head at times!

Lastly, also don't understand why nobody shoots and keeps passing the ball around the box. No shots, no goals. What's the point of shooting practice if no one is shooting?

I felt that pen was Ademola putting himself above the team. If he was invested in Fulham he'd play it safe. Being an arrogant prick, he risked Fulham's point in pursuit of an individual moment of glory. He failed. Good riddance to him

Everton; mostly fucking me over since those 4 days in 1971 when we lost to the rs and the greeks.

They looked as pissed off as we obviously all are, and with gestures like what the fuck are they doing, we didn't tell them to act like this in preparation at Finch Farm? I do agree there are some passengers in the team but I thought Bernard really tried today and can be exempted from criticism.

I also agree we do need more players, but preferably grafters and no more luxury players, who expect all the others to do their running, tracking back, etc. I was a bit disappointed, and have been for a few games in both Allan and Doucoure, who could and should have done a lot better.

I think Allan is realising what the Prem is all about and I think will up his game to suit. Doucoure does know what the game is about at this level so must improve. His couple of goal attempts, if you could call them that, were right out of the 'schoolboy error manual' which he has obviously studied and memorised.

I also thought Maguire should have gone for the tackle on Digne, but it was a similar incident to Pickford's, in that the flag had gone up for offside before, but nevertheless could have been a career ending one, which luckily it wasn't.

Richie is back next game, so I expect we will see a better showing, but I don't think he will stay around for much longer, although I hope I am wrong. Holgate didn't have the impact we had all hoped for, so maybe was rushed back, and retrospectively maybe should have been on the bench.

I know it's always easy to look back and say we should have done this or that differently, but by the same token, we are allegedly a professional outfit, and should neither keep making stupid mistakes, but also learn from the one's that we do make, never to be repeated.

It's a shit run. The manager is in part to blame because he picks the team and sets the tactics. But the players are responsible too. Holgate shouldn't have started, but he's a country mile away from the first goal and no challenge on Rashford for the second either.

It shows how important Richarlison is, for me particularly in how he stretches the pitch.

We have already seen the rotating foul process used against him, and once some knuckle dragger like Fernandez, Maguire, or Henderson mistimes a tackle intended to injure that's Richi's career over.

And given the New York Times level of naked hatred and lies coverage from the media, the refs won't see a thing.

Keiran 248 Lookman came here with much promise but was overlooked and criticised by numerous managers, has gone to Leipzig and has been overlooked and loaned out. His penalty yesterday illuminates what we have all wondered - behind the babyfaced "nice kid from London" is an arrogant twit who thinks he is better than he is and his ego transcends what is best for the team - a Brands masterstroke to get £22M back from him, a rare moment for Marcel!

As for the game yesterday there is not much for me to add from what has already been said above. I will say there is some over-reaction on here, I thought there were times were we pushed the ball around quite nicely, we had more possession than them (yes I know, some infuriating backward/sideways passing) and I thought up until their third we looked most likely to score. James, Coleman and Holgate all played unfit and will improve after the International break. Calls for Carlo's sacking are utterly bizarre! Richy is coming back. We need to find that confidence from earlier in the season, James switching play with Richy. It may feel like we are back to last season again but we have Fulham next (we must win this game) and hopefully we will look sharper.

We need to ship players desperately, Mina, Tosun, Siggi and Kenny should all be sold in Jan. We will be lucky to get £30M for them but a subsequent injection of new players will freshen them up and create greater competition (DCL is hardly shitting himself about his place with Tosun warming the bench - Coleman likewise with Kenny). I'd like to see a wide man brought in (Boga - yes please! Lozano unlikely, maybe Buendia) a striker who knows where the net is (Edouard - really like this lad, Morelos a slower cheaper option but boy can he finish) and an RB to push Seamus (Emerson likely to cost too much but good options out there). Agree with some comments above that we are shipping too many goals and this is mostly down to the defence, things need to be freshened up, I'd like to see James playing no 10 by the end of the season with a hardworking RM alongside him to protect the RB more.

Couldn't agree more, 2 goals in the last 43 PL games, one of those was a penalty. One assist every ten or eleven games in that period. His corners and free kicks have regressed to the point where someone else is better taking them. Defensively he can't tackle and doesn't have the required pace or mobility to close down. You and other posters are right, starting with Sigurdsson is starting with 10 men and it always follows we concede possession in midfield and look slow, weak and disjointed.

The fact that Carlo cannot see this glaringly obvious weak link that's what's scaring me more than anything, as he's the man we have invested all our hope and trust in.

Some thoughts:
a) Ancelotti made mistakes for the third match in a row; picking Sigurdsson to link up with DCL was a complete failure and left our lone striker isolated.
b) Coleman and Holgate lacked match sharpness and it showed in the first half - they improved as the game went on but weren't ready for the first team.
c) Who in our midfield is tasked with trigging runners into the box? I haven't got a clue and it appears the team doesn't either - get it sorted quick.
d If Gomes is unfit/out of form, I would prefer James, Bernard or Doucoure to take that role.
e Bernard and Iwobi get stick, but they were decent.
f) We will not get anywhere while we commit individual errors every game.

However, he disappoints with his team selections and tactics which have lost almost as many games as his 'mega signings' have won. In the maelstrom that is the Premier 20/21, what he achieved elsewhere is of little or no consequence. All that matters is what he can do with Everton FC with our surfeit of dubious quality, grossly overpaid playing staff.

Most of us had hoped that, unlike all managers since Moyes, he would be able to effect immediate improvement on what was available to him -even if this was merely in respect of attitude and application. Sadly, his preference for the 'tried but not trusted' old brigade over the energy and enthusiasm of home developed talent, has left us looking as moribund as we did last season - in other words fucked !

Now we are back to praying for miracles. Nothing changes, does it ?

However, worth considering that maybe, just maybe, he can come in and do the job he was brought for. How would this affect things? It would allow us to push Doucouré and Allan further forward.

I suspect that at times, James & Allan have not been fit enough to play and/or playing in this league has suddenly hit them. Very few, if any breather games in this league. They'll get over that.

We are heavily dependent on Richarlison & Dignes pace, purpose and creativity. That gives James space to do his magic. Defensively, James is a passenger who leaves gaps the opposition will exploit. That requires the team to press strongly without the ball and cover the right. Carlo hasn't got them to do that consistently enough yet, that's down to him.

The likes of Bernard, Iwobi and Gomes won't change. Talented, peripheral players who play 1 good game in 3 or 4 and rarely score. I don't know what Siggy does, except run about with little purpose. All four have a limited future at the club.

The backlash on here was inevitable too. Back in August, I'd have seen 6th in November as a solid enough start to build on. But this is Everton and we have to play hubris or despair. I've always said, take a look after 13 games, then at Christmas to see what we really have. The reality is we were very good for 4 games, OK against Liverpool and poor for the last three.

Here's what I'd do. Put Olsen in goal. Give him at least six games. Decide on my centre back partnership and give them time to gel. Drill the midfield to press till they do it in their sleep. Tell Richarlison and Digne to keep their discipline and publically tell referees to protect Richarlison. I'd play Gordon, unless there's something behind the scenes I don't know about.

Carlo won't make the peripheral players better. He could make firmer decisions about his best team and stick with it. And he has to get them playing with purpose again, otherwise we'll be in for a long hard winter.

Four wins were on him, four without are on him. Lets see what he does next. Time for us all to respond.

I think this is also why Richie is so influential on the left. Because other teams throw men over to our right, it leaves space on the counter. His pace and eye for goals let's us exploit it.

Not really sure how we can stop it, but I think in next transfer Windows the right hand side is an absolute must. We need a ‘right footed digne' to come and be a 1st choice rb, and we need to find another Richarlison / Salah (spit) to play in front of them.

Until then maybe pack the midfield a bit more. Maybe try a 3-5-2 with

Olsen
Holgate Keane Godfrey
Coleman Doucouré James Allan Digne
DCL Richie

That worries me a bit though that it could leave even more space for teams to get crosses in. The 3 at the back would have to be *very* dominant in the box.

A 4-4-2 option would also be nice, but whilst I'd like to see Nkounkou tried in a “LM” slot, we simply do not have a proper RM option, and are limited full stop here.

Alternative is a solid, defensive 3 in front of the back 4. I'd try Tom Davies on the right (and tell him to stay there and protect Seamus). Allan and Doucoure would provide the other two, maybe allowing one to get forward on a rotating basis.

Think that would work well with the first choice front 3 as they have enough about them to craft some goals. As soon as we lose one of them though we become completely blunt. Not sure there is any answer to that outside of the transfer window.

Squad still hugely unbalanced. Desperately need more goals and threat.

433 Line up.
Defence
GK - TBC or ( Could be Olsen ), RB - TBC, RCD - Keane, LCD - Holgate, LB - Digne.
Midfield
Allan, Doucoure, TBC or ( Could be Gbamin )
Attack
James, Richarlson, DCL.

By dropping Pickford last week, Carlo alerted every agent he wants a goalkeeper come next summer. He's also alerted Pickford and his agent, that he's not happy, not happy at all. Rotation was a smokescreen and in my opinion not even a firing shot across the bows. Pickford will be going. Who comes in is anybody's guess but I'm sure Carlo has his eye on someone already. His bigging up of Coleman was to get a last great effort from his Captain for 20/21 as he does not trust JJK to come in and take the place from Seamus. So I expect a new right back and I would love us to get Lamptey from Brighton. Keane and Holgate have recently signed new contracts I believe and Digne is here for as long as he wants to be. Allan and Doucoure have only just come in. Gbamin is the big question mark. If he can be the player we bought and get over the terrible injuries he endured since coming here, he could save us a fortune, which could be spent elsewhere. If not then someone will have to be brought in. I would love Ward Prowse but the boat may have sailed on that one. The front 3 pick themselves, though whether Richarlson is prepared to stick around is the real issue. If not then Zaha maybe the player to go for plus we need cover for DCL and Milik from Napoli maybe the bargain buy of the Winter window.

Brands needs to move on Bolasie, Besic, JJK, Tosun, Siggy, Delph, and Lossl. Bernard and Mina possibly.

Being an Evertonian its all ifs, buts and maybes, as ever !!!!

I'm hoping the prelude at the beginning of this season is a sign of whats to come, once Carlo has got the 16 players he really wants under his command.

I think Carlo got it wrong he should not have dropped either Olsen or Mina. Fernandez wouldn't have got a free header and if he did Olsen would have reached it.

I have been a fan of Gomes but going on that performance when Richarlison comes back Bernard should take that spot.

My view is the strongest team Carlo can put out from the current crop is:

Olsen
Coleman, Keane, Mina, Digne
Doucoure, Allan, Bernard
Rodrigues, DCL, Richarlison.

But he has inherited 2 CBs in Keane and Mina who are both slow to turn and because of that cause us problems defensively. Last week a simple ball over the top caught out Mina which led to a Newcastle goal, and yesterday Rashford should have scored when a simple ball over the top left Keane floundering and left Rashford with a one on one with Pickford who made a good save. Keane was involved in both of Utds goals although others contributed. Seamus needed to be closer to stop the cross coming in also for reasons best known to himself Sigurdsson allowed Fernandes to run off him and the gap between Keane and Holgate allowed Fernandes to step in and score. The second goal again Keane was at fault, he was marking Rashford both were about 10 yards outside the box, but when Rashford came short for the pass Keane didnt close him down instead stood about 15 yards away. This allowed Rashford to turn and play the ball to Fernandes and then again got in between Keane and Holgate, its not clear whether he got a touch or not but again poor defending from us again.

I thought after the first 5 minutes we started to get into the game and when Bernard scored I began to wonder maybe we could win without Richarlison. But that hope was killed off very quickly, Bernard linked well with Digne but sadly as the game goes on Bernard seems not to last the pace.

I would hope to see Carlo play James in a more number 10 role, as when Sigurdsson went off and James moved into that position he looked a lot more effective. These days any flaw that a side has will be exposed and most teams now know James doesnt track back so our fullback is often faced with a 2 v 1 situation. I am sure Carlo is aware of this and needs to fix it quickly otherwise this will become a recurring problem.

I though DCL yet again did very well and made the half chance for Bernards goal. Without Richarlison nobody else seems to get close to DCL and its asking to much to expect him to do anymore that he is doing already.
Finally I can only assume that Carlo must think Anthony Gordon isn't doing enough on the training ground to warrant a place in the team. But maybe when Gordon went to see him over not playing as much as he thinks he should, maybe something was said that Ancelotti didnt like. Obviously the only 2 people who know what was said are Carlo and Anthony, I remember seeing Klopp in an interview and said he would be very disappointed if any player knocked on his door to ask why they werent playing. He suggested he would rather they ask what more do I need to do to improve my game.

The nucleus is definitely there now, so I expect to see steady improvement, and I'm sure with our best eleven, we will get some very good results this season, ever the opmitist (can't spell!) that I am.

Holgate came back from a three month lay off and is getting plenty of blame for United's first two goals, while Keane hasn't missed a game all season, and was just as responsible as Holgate for those goals,Keane is as big a liability as Mina and not just for his slowness in pace, just as slow in reading the game, I thought United were well kidded when they bought McGuire, and still think that, but what a massive difference between him and Keane yesterday, he isn't the answer to Everton's centre back problems, let's hope Holgate and Godfrey forge a real understanding there.

Olsen
Coleman Digne
Holgate Keane
Allan
Doucoure
Iwobi/Gordon Richarlison
James
DCL

Edit as per personal choice.

Having watched the game again (yes I'm in to extreme S&M), I'd say the difference between the teams was Frenandes(not just the goals) and Mata, plus, more disturbingly, they appeared to be fitter.

I cannot overstate the difference between those 2 and Siggi; when they were in possession they looked to move the ball forward and then follow the ball to support the front 2, whereas Siggi would turn sideways or backwards slowing the move down.

Even though one man doesn't make a team, swap Siggi for Fenandes and we would've got something out of the game; there's a damming statistic that Siggi didn't give a single forward pass to DCL in the game.

Normally, I don't like to pick on a player, but it's hard on the evidence of this year not to come to the conclusion that Siggi should never start a game ever again; too slow, and it isn't a coincidence that he's looked good when coming on for the last 20 minutes with everyone blowing for tugs.

Iwobi did more in his cameo than Siggi's whole game, just by doing what was asked of him; support the front players. Desperately disappointing, but we all knew this was going to take 2-3 windows to ship some of the deadwood on; and don't forget easier said than done, and get some of CA's players in.

In the meantime, like Laurie I'd draft Bernard in to the starting 11, only maybe switch him and James.

People moaning about injuries are simply making excuses for him. He has better players than the Southampton and Newcastle managers have and both beat him hollow. Every time he comes up against a young coach his game looks stale and dated. He just doesnt win like he used to.

There no point in pointing to his log list of achievements when they were all years ago and when he had world class players to choose from.

Sportsman. Even managers, have a shelf life

I wonder if he has enough pulling power to get a taxi driver to come around to GP

Like all great players and managers, they have a sell-by date. And maybe Carlo has reached that point. His selection of Pickford and Sigurdsson are examples of his ludicrous decision-making. I for one believe Olsen would have come for at least one of those crosses that led to their goals. Pickford is allergic to high balls, and we all saw his latest farcical attempt to deal with a high ball that almost led to a penalty. I concede the centre backs were not entirely blameless for their goals.

Sigurdsson is now a passenger. He cannot even take decent free-kicks or corners, but Ancelotti persists with him. Why? I have no idea. I would even give Tom Davies a run out, because at least you know you're going to get 100% from him. And of course there are other young players he ignores, like Gordon, Nkounkou, etc.

So what's happened to our 3 amazing signings? Let's be honest, if Allan, Rodriguez and Doucouré were world class, the other top European clubs would have snapped them up before Everton. Everton do not get bargains. The 3 of them look very mediocre now, after the first 3 games – burnt out already?

The same goes for Ancelloti. Why didn't other top clubs come for him? Maybe they knew he had reached his sell-by date.

Let us remember, the idiot got himself sent off for a reckless, and unnecessary challenge, which quite possibly has cost us half a dozen points or more, and maybe would have helped to maintain the start of season momentum. I get the feeling, he'll come back sulking, and probably get injured, then he'll be off in the next transfer window.

I think he can attract a better quality player than we have been used to for any years such as James, however the squad containing many below standard players on huge salaries who can't even run or pass forward would stifle even Klopp.

This may well be the first group's he players he has coached who have an inbuilt acceptance of near adequacy. I don't think that James, Gordon and Davis have been afflicted yet. They will be.

Like it or not, the last 3 games was a chance to show us he is different than the last 4 very limited managers by being brave and supporting Calvert-Lewin with Simms or Gordon and keeping Pickford well away from the first team and stick to a commanding reliable keeper. Failed miserably.

The hope is what kills us Blues, never mind a virus!

Darren said earlier in the thread "He has better players than the Soton and Newcastle manager." Personally I don't think he has.

The midfield, certainly of Soton were buzzing around playing the ball and moving quickly. Our midfield is too slow and lacks dynamism. They don't create because they don't move the opposition players around and out of position to create space.

Looking at Leicester's midfield today. Young quick players who want to create and beat people and run round like fuck to do it. We're just not gonna get that with most of the midfield players we have, unfortunately.

Gordon isn't a Rooney, Owen etc he is a very fit direct athlete who will work, if he isn't getting picked he must be short in an attribute or two at the moment.

Our early season form was scratchy at best. We won at Spurs after Pickford made 3 or 4 outstanding saves, we best Palace on a dubious penalty and WBA threatened us everytime they broke on us until they were reduced to 10 men finally against the RS being honest Hendersons goal was onside.

I am a blue of 55 years but I aint deluded we are a work in progress, top 8 at best and possibly a cup final or cup win is progress.

My own belief is that whoever gets the manager's nod, the Everton squad is well short of making any sort of challenge 'for honours,' as outside the 'first XI' the cupboard is bare. That Tosun gets a shout more than verifies this statement as so many of our fringe players should be plying their trade at a lower level.

Be that as it may, we'll beat enough of the teams below us to finish top half -so just be content !

Bernard and Digne, both did it in the first half yesterday, one scored, one hit the post. Coleman tries to at times, but nobody else does, and it's a big problem, because it's easy for your opponents, when you keep playing in front of them.

I'd hate to be Allan and Doucouré at the minute though, because the system is massively exposing them, along with whoever plays right back, and Carlo Ancelotti has got move Rodríguez inside, instead of getting players to cover him, which is just leaving to many little gaps for teams to exploit at the minute, is how I'm seeing it.

Trying to shift it around to squeeze Sigurdsson into it is just madness, he doesn't offer any relief to the pressure or expand the play.

I think Gomes or Delph is a better fit into the midfield rather than Sigurdsson, at least them two are midfielders. Even though they are not doing anywhere near enough.

I think the lessons learned of the last three games are

1 If Richarlison is out we have to replace him with Gordon who can offer an outlet for he midfielders with a bit of width, creativity and pace. Shoehorning Sigurdsson into the team is a non starter.

( If Carlo thinks Gordon is not ready then but someone who can give us that outlet when Richie out, who can supplement the attack, Imsaila Starr, Diatta )

And / Or

2 We desperately need a mobile midfielder in the mold of Bruno Fernandes, Ward-Prowse. Someone with energy and buzz who can pass and play at a high tempo, close down fast and drive forward.

We will look like a different team when Richarlison returns, and here's hoping he has a trouble free run now for the rest of the season.

The issues we are currently having are a stark forewarning for Brands and Ancelotti of what life will be like without Richarlison next season. ‘ IF ‘ we don't make the right signings to compensate.

Now we know that Carlo has the same problem, only ours are all purchases at a cheaper store. Many of us often pick virtually the same line-up as the manager only to see what appears to make sense confound expectations.

It is simply that Carlo is trying to make the best of what he has. Apart from Doucoure, Allan and James the others have all let successive managers down.

I think we have to be patient and see who he brings in. The early table-topping has inflated hopes but we must remember that we finished 12th last season and if we end up 7th, it's progress.

When Doucoure Allan and James arrived here. The fanfare from people marveling at Ancelotti was deafening. This was "the better caliber of player he can attract" Go back and look at the threads.

Now you are telling us they cant compete the midfield's of Southampton and The mighty Newcastle and a Man united side who have been getting spanked by all and sundry

No wonder Carlo likes it here. 60m contract and an excuse factory manned by people who don't think he is responsible for anything.

I`ll tell you who I would have played Brian. The fella who cant stop scoring for PSG. It makes me laugh that people will defend Carlo by saying he doesnt have anyone to partner DCL in Richarlison`s absence

Who`s fault is that ?

Where are the precision, the concentration, the fitness, the appetite and determination? Nowhere to be seen, evaporated like the mist after 3 or 4 games. He needs to manage us out of it all, very quickly. Let's find a hard core. We've not had one for 33 years.

Carlo and Brands are sophisticated, self-possessed and well-dressed. Everything the team is not.

Whilst I criticized his team selection and tactics against Southampton and Newcastle, I could not fault the setup yesterday and we were well in the game apart from really bad defensive mistakes.

We have by far the most lightweight squad in the top half of the table devoid of pace determination and goalscoring ability. Carlo might be magnifico but he is not a magician.

However, there is no question this squad should do better but none of us can put out finger on what is going wrong. Some blame the manager, many blame individuals like Siggy, some blame Kenwright, some blame Finch farm and some blame Brands.

The question I ask myself is which of our squad would get in a top 10 side let alone top 4, my answer is very short: Calvert-Lewin, Richarlison, Digne and maybe James. 6 managers can't all be bad so I conclude like a few others that we have to be patient and have a few more windows before we can hope for better things.

If the rumours were true, he tried to offload Sigurdson, for a reason, but that's not an excuse for the way we are setting up, and any midfielder worth his salt, would be rubbing his hands before playing against Everton at the minute, because there is loads of space in the middle of the pitch, because one “midfielder” is trying to protect the space being vacated by one luxury player, which is leaving Allan exposed, whilst Sigurdson unfortunately, is “just everywhere” that the ball has just been.

I loved your description of Rodríguez the other week Darren, “he's got soul, but he's not a soldier” was brilliant I thought, so it's the man who knows him better than anyone who has got to acknowledge this. Play the man with soul, in a position where he doesn't need to be protected, and let everyone else just get on with their job?

Unlike those before him he keeps picking up points and hasn't gone on bad runs. This is the first back to back league defeats in his tenure.

He's comfortably better than what we've had, but is that good enough? At the moment, for me, yes it is.

Richarlison will restore the balance, and he needs to atone for a truly poor decision, that's not on Carlo. The root of the problem for me is our midfield and the lack of No6. I think a proper disciplined player could release both Doucoure and Allan, screen/support the back four.

Carlo is a bit of Curate's egg, but at this moment going in the right direction.

God forbid if you do accidentally foul, that's an instant card, yellow at least, while waiting with bated breath in case it's red... would it be disheartening?

That's fundamental to what our lads have to put up with. How come, as soon as they leave Everton, most players turn into the stars they're meant to be?

I wouldn't be surprised if Tosun went to Palace, he'd be prolific within 10 games, at least he'd probably be called 'Toe-son' rather than 'Toss-un". It's so insulting how we as a club get spoken to/about. I would just be happy if someone fought back once.

When other teams have played the same games as us we will probably be 8th -10th.
Even the media joined in the hype when things went our way early in the season, but I doubt if any of us were convinced that those results would become the norm.
This is Everton, we except the wheels to come off at some point don't we.

Do some people really want to write Ancelotti off already? I couldn't give a fuck that he's on crazy money – that's the way it is these days... his profile, knowledge and status in world football is worth every penny.

Carlo bought in 3 midfielders this summer, 2 of who he's worked with before. He's also shipped out a fair few and had a big squad to choose from.

There's definitely room to go but Carlo is not operating with someone else's team still. And even if he was he has to take responsibility for how we setup and execute with what we have. To my eyes we have looked unorganised, unbalanced and unfit at times over the last 3 games. Of course a big part of this is Richarlison, whose dynamism and output both offensively and defensively are a huge part of Carlo's preferred system. But we cannot rely on him.

I like Carlo. Nice guy with an incredible CV. But I was concerned at our form post lockdown, which was really quite dire. This season we obviously started well, the Spurs game especially was excellent, but it would seem teams have quickly adjusted and target our right hand side where Rodriguez leaves gaps.

After the international break we should, barring usual international disasters, have as clean a bill of health as we've had in a very long time, with Holgate, Branthwaite, Tosun and even Gbamin back. There will be no excuse with that squad and a handful of talents in the U23s if Carlo can not get us in or very near the top 6/7.

Another soft penalty as well. Mane's just been tackled on the halfway line much more robustly than the "penalty" incident and surprise surprise he stayed on his feet and kept going.

Mane is ruining football, it is becoming non-contact, unless you are Harry Maguire.

Let's see when JP G, return, and if he can play as a CDM, as he did at Mainz.

And Richarlison, on his return will hopefully, boost moral in the squad and on TW.

The next x3 games, Fulham, Leeds and Burnley are winnable but the formation and shape issues seen and exposed the last month, will need to be fixed.

Unfortunately, I think Everton have made a habit of not winning these winnable games and losing the games that most observers believed that they would lose before a ball is kicked.

The most important fixture is Fulham away and yes Everton should be more than capable of winning it, but will they? If they fail at the Cottage, then the following match becomes psychologically more difficult.

Pickford, Sigurdsson, Coleman, Iwobi my God what' is Carlo thinking?? Letting Kean go out on loan with just DCL as the clubs only striker is mind boggling. I don't count Tosun he is Sunday League level.

The appointment of Ancelloti was another box ticking excersise by the club. Bring in a big name to appease the fans trouble is the big name is nearer70 years old than he is 50. We've taken Carlo on the way down and its nothing new

I am sick to death of this club being a pension fund for washed up players and managers.

I wanted Brenda Rodgers when he was going to leave Celtic exactly what we needed. Look at the Saints manager Ralph Hutenshuil absolute gem. Saints also found Pochetino. Why do we always get stuck with useless duds.?? Let's face it Ancelloti is an exact replica of Marco Silva and making the same mistakes with the same players that got Silva the sack.

In all honesty we should of lost the recent Derby game and that should now be 4 losses on the spin. Relegation form if ever there was such a thing.

So big deal we beat Palace, West Brom, Salford, Fleetwood etc I never believed the hype. We conceded 2 in every game now and only thing Carlo can think of doing to stop the rot. is playi Sigurdsson in diffrent positions every week. I fucking give up.

Thank God there is no game next week and there is a lot of time for Carlo to ponder what has been going wrong.

It's all too easy to blame injuries and suspensions but I think the bottom line is that the squad just isn't good enough yet.

It was nice to get some early wins but there were still concerns that we were hoping would disappear but after the RS game it all went pear shaped. We lost Richie and almost the game at the death and it had a big effect we didn't expect.

No game is easy and Fulham are starting to play a little better since they got Robinson and Lookman but once again we will expect to win it but they have to show a much better mental attitude and get the defensive side of things sorted out.

I honestly stopped watching the Liverpool game after the ref gave that penalty, because as much as I hate Liverpool, I love football more, even if the bastard lawmakers are doing their best to spoil the once beautiful game.

Handball?

If he does come back and proves his worth, we then have a potential midfield of Allan, Doucoure, Gbamin and ??? Who does everyone reckon would be the best 4th man in that line-up?

A central 3 with that energy and dynamism hopefully gives more license to the front three to stay up top and be in position to quickly take advantage of the turnovers.

In the current form, Everton, would struggle to beat a Sunday morning pub, let alone beat Fulham.

You win games by shooting and creating chances, and Id like to see, the stats for the chances made and shots on goal, the last x3 games. Probably very few chances and shots too.

You could say why are they - the players bothering, are they really serious, about trying to win games for Everton?

Its the hope that kills you and supporting Everton has an acknowledged public health warning.

Next Saturday, early morning, I'll be fishing in the Mersey, so the weekend won't be totally spoiled, I might catch SFA, but I get as much enjoyment from the fishing these days, as I do from the match.

Carlo must get the shape and formation, right, and this means putting Hames, if he's fit in a free central role behind DCL. Alan and Dacoure are good players but are being over exposed, and the last x4 games, have proved this.

I hope when JP G, returns, he's fully fit, and could play like he did for Mainz.

Crap happens in life, let's see the backbone and guts in this squad starting at Fulham.

We are still waiting for Gomes to show us his Valencia form so don't hold your breath on that. Having said that Man City and the shite playing into our hands drawing today. We have them exactly where we want them! Bit of Street End black humour.

We need to be quicker on the break which worked at times with Digne and Bernard but not happening on the other side. Matters only improved when the much-maligned Iwobi made an appearance.

Go and get Barkley back and give Grealish whatever he wants, let's start to rebuild with youth and vitality, I'm sick of the overpaid mercenaries.

The number of times whilst the defenders played amongst themselves the odd pass forward was returned or given straight to the opposition. How the hell those tactics used by 4 managers on the bounce is going to make us successful I haven't a clue.

We have been hammered mercilessly by the press since the derby, had injuries to key players, unfair yellow cards, a joke of a penalty against Newcastle, and a joke of a red card for Digne. I tipped this after the derby and it won't end there.

I am not a Pickford fan either but remarkably the only damn person that acknowledged he had been pushed in the chest before he dropped that ball was the man who pushed him – Maguire.

Why don't we try something different – like getting behind Ancelloti?

Bearing in mind that he inherited what was basically a mis-match of players courtesy of Koeman, Walsh, Allardyce and Silva. So he has had to work with whatever tools were in his box.

I think he thought that some were 'salvageable' but that doesn't appear to be the case on evidence of the last 4 matches.

Absolutely abysmal stuff and it's hard to imagine that any other team would give him so much space. It was as if he was being completely ignored. What's wrong with our lot?

If it is just about playing those who will put in more effort then I would prefer some of our youngsters who do actually play in those positions being given a few full games at least and certainly if they have a natural attacking game.

To put any kind of expectations of Gbamin would be frankly insane, the lad hasn't kicked a ball for 15 months, had never played in the Premier League before and we don't know if he's even good enough yet.

Sometimes we have this vision about a certain player that isn't in the team during a bad run that he's the saviour and the answer to all problems but the actual fact is it's usually about players we don't possess at the club.

Gbamin may be great but he's not the answer to our lack of pace in wide area's, he's not going to help our lack of support for Calvert-Lewin, no more than currently Allan is doing or Doucoure or Gomes or Davies before him when he played last season.

For me there's still about three or four really good players we need to sign before we can move higher than 9th or 10th that's my view on it.

We have seen the limitations of the squad laid bare with one or two injuries, it's as bad as it was at the end of last season.

Trouble is we keep signing central midfielder's that don't offer any creativity or goal threat, not saying they are bad players, they are not, but with our future signings we need to be more attack-minded.

In the meantime a switch to Number 10 for either Bernard or James Rodriguez might just be the way forward.

Olsen

Digne
Coleman
Mina (until the others fully fit)
Keane

Allan
Doucouré
Rodriguez (number 10)
Iwobi (right)
Richarlison

Calvert-Lewin

I think we could get more from Iwobi on the right than we do left, I also think James isn't working with Coleman on the right because not tracking back is burdening Seamus at 31.

James for me at number 10 would be massively productive, let him play where he can hurt teams.

Bernard if he's to feature he should now do so only behind Calvert-Lewin and let him again get in where his intelligence can cause problems.

Gordon should be coming in for more game time when Richarlison is out.

The thing with Carlo is he needs to stop flogging a dead horse, he's got options available and different area's he can use players but he's shown a rather annoying reluctance to be flexible, falling into similar past Everton manager's bad habits.

We're still in a transition where we need to offload the deadwood and get in better players. I agree that letting two forwards go and not replacing them was only going to result in what we're seeing now.

I do think that sometimes we think we are better than we actually are. There were a lot of people on TW saying that Josh King isn't good enough for us and neither was Fraser or Wilson. I think all three of those would have improved our team. Bad management has wasted a glorious opportunity for our club to progress and we are still dealing with that.

We need to strengthen in January and carry on with the clear-out.

Richarlison is the twice the player of any of his replacements, when you look at what he offers defensively and offensively; It's like playing with 10.5 men when he is not in the side.

We are a team lacking in energy and forward thinking. The continuing mistreatment of Gordon by Carlo preferring players who aren't fit, can't pass, cross the ball, speed up to walking pace or even provide a half chance for DCL over 90 minutes is beyond mystifying. I'm half expecting several clubs will offer Gordon playing time on a permanent basis come January. We are wasting his talent. Sadly, I hope the lad goes for the sake of his career.

The season is basically over now as far as Europe is concerned and we will be in our usual place by Christmas looking nervously down the table. Thank God we didn't get the RS for the opening fixture.

However what some ToffeeWebbers must also consider is that there are supporters who doubt Carlo is the man to take us forward and he must offer evidence that we are misguided. You will actually find that those of us who are often the most critical when things are going well are also not the first to put the boot in when the shit hits the fan because we are probably better prepared for it.

Carlo can certainly make the case
1-over the last few games we have lost key players while James has definitely been constricted by his injury.
2-we need our first eleven to compete as our subs have let other managers down and results so far back this up.
3-I still can't believe it was his decision to loan out Kean and Theo and bring in Godfrey and so he should get backing in January and a little understanding that he has been constrained.
4-we are pointswise not far off where we should be and the season is very much alive with key players now available.

But likewise there seems part of our fan base that just don't want any criticism of Carlo, whether constructive or not, and are often proffering bullshit as fact in attempting to justify some poor decisions.

1-Carlo's midfield signings have improved the team. This I believe has little merit. Of course being new signings they are hungrier and of better quality and character currently than your Delph,Siggy and Schneids but they have solved nothing.
We are weak defensively as they offer no protection, the intensity and dynamism they were allegedly to bring is below average at a push.

2- Carlo has not bought what was required. We needed a holding midfielder, a right back, right winger and more youth and energy in the middle of the park. As Brilliant as James is we have a catalogue of number tens and he has added another two midfielders who can't defend or assist to add to about five already there. Even some on this thread who mistakenly believed Allan to be a world class defensive midfielder have astutely abandoned ship and proposed playing him further forward.

3-the latest Carlo assertion to do the rounds is that Gordon must be shit or have a bad attitude in training to justify exclusion. This doesn't take into consideration that he's been sub in some games which contradicts this account. In reality Carlo throughout his career has sided with experience over youth. Indeed Keans desire to seek a loan can be traced to post Lockdown when Dominic needed a rest, Ricky could have dropped wide or if Theo had no future he could have been jettisoned but none of the above happened. Gordon's form and skill set when Richarlison was out was badly needed. No excuses.

4-Carlo's reign so far has been one of tactical master classes or abject failures with only the Tottenham game a shining beacon. We encounter the same issues of fitness, motivation, energy and lack of identity time and again.

5- It's damning that the ONLY 2 players I believe he has improved is definitely Dominic and possibly Keane. Some I think may also have regressed under his stewardship.

The international break has come at a good time for both Carlo and the squad alike.

To me, Ancelotti is a decent manager who will see us safely into Bramley-Moore Dock in top half. Expect more and you will be disappointed so accept that 'Europe' is a generation away – and enjoy!

Always wondered how we can make so many 'good signings' or have 'good teams' yet win nothing and not look like winning anything either in decades. Mystifying.

We are a mid-table club that is aspiring to get into the top 6 and it won't ever happen if we keep changing management. It's the players that need changing as they are the ones who kick the ball, week-in & week-out.

Well, he won those at clubs that always have the best players, and would win anyway, I hear you say.

Well, let him pull in the best players to our club, and repeat the feat, I would say.

But, I can't wait longer than one transfer window, I hear you say.

And therein lies the problem of the stereotypical impatient football fan, I would say.

There is no doubt in my mind that Carlo has improved the team both by acquisition and by the fact our pass success rate has improved tremendously.
Cast your minds back to how many times our MF misplaced or mistimed a pass to give it to the opposition in the past few seasons.

What we are up against is a number of other teams have progressed too.
Southampton and Villa are light years ahead of the teams they were last season.

I remeber most posters saying that we needed to be patient it would take a few transfer windows to improve the team sufficiently but because we got off to a flying start we all raised our expectations and feel deflated at some shocking results.

But we need to realise the league is a marathon not a sprint and with virtually no preseason every team will struggle with injuries or poor form throughout the season.

For me Carlo is the manager we should have had much earlier because certain forces have been established at Finch Farm and in the club that will take a while to eradicate.

Once the culture, comradery and unified force is restored then we can think of titles and trophies. In the meantime enjoy the ride but it will be bumpy along the way and it may need a government health warning.

We've missed Richarlison badly as he makes other teams defend so differently. We have spent an awful lot of money on dross, there is no denying that and our strength in depth is woeful.

I think last season in particular took its toll on a lot of the players and sometimes you just need a fresh start. Even Walcott looks half decent now and he was flipping hopeless.

Kean had clearly decided Everton wasn't for him. Good news is that no option to buy agreed for PSG so that the more he bangs them in the more his price goes up. At worst he comes back and shows us what he can do.

There is more talk of Isco joining which could be cheap and quality. I feel we really, really need to add some pace though. Without Richarlison we are too easy to defend against, as evidenced by the Utd game. We didn't stretch them at all and they are woeful at the back.

Next 3 games are winnable before the tough Christmas run. We could do with 9 points so hopefully everyone comes back fit and well from international duty.