Full Circle

I think more fans are arriving at a Paul The Esk type view that it's the clubs processes and structure that is the ultimate cause of our mediocrity.
In such a scenario, we could have cloned a younger version of Alex Ferguson and still ended up exactly where we are today - up to our necks in it.
I'm increasingly of the view that this morass the club is in is much deeper and larger than one or two personnel changes can fix.

Unfortunately the game, and especially football finance, has moved on. We're miles adrift of success and while we just wait for it to happen, other clubs are figuring out ways to make it happen.

I could go on and make it about David Moyes, but let's face it, he would have been sacked after leaving us with our lowest points tally, and yet twelve months later, he had taken Everton to its highest finish in the newly reformed EPL?

Stability is what's needed, otherwise the anger and the desperation is only going to take us one way imo, but please let's not make Marcel Brands the only casualty, or is that contradicting what I've just written!

I think it's also strange that both Ryantsov and Usmanmov's nephew have left the Board recently, but who knows what that was for?

Moshiri appears to have been guilty of interferring in the selection of players, rather than either the DoF or the Manager, and has contributed to the mess the club is in.

Someone mentioned the need for stability, but I would like to see one final parting of the ways first, and that is BILL KENWRIGHT! Sorry about the capital letters but this feller has wriggled and wormed his way around the club and the saddest day was when Greggs missus, lent or gave him the cash to buy his share of the takeover centuries ago. At least it feels like centuries with him in charge and we've been sinking sdown into the mire ever since.

We do need stability and my own view is that Benitez, given anything like the money that the rest of our manager's have had, will bring in players who will improve on the ones we need to get shut of. Some will respond about "what about Rondon" well, my guess he cost us nothing buty his wages and was there as a make weight until January, when qwe hope we have some funds to buy a goalscorer, or a right back, or a left back, or a midfielder or...the list is large.

I think Moshiri also, should look at himself and stop interfering in the selection of players. We might get somewhere better, if one person selects the players, and one person gets the push if the team don't produce the goods. Up to now, Benitez has brought in two players who are at least as good, and in my opinion, better than most of the attacking midfielder/wingers in the club.

Get with the program or get going down the road.

Trouble is, Moshiri is part of the problem, it remains to be seen if he can be part of the solution.

Not holding my breath.

It's a shame about Brands, it doesn't sound like he had two hands free in order to perform his role. And if this means that Rafa is just going to sign journeymen, rather than young saleable assets, then we've learned absolutely nothing.

https://www.lfchistory.net/Transfers/ByManager/20/1

Can only hope there's more to it than his choice alone.

Moshiri has a job to do, a big one, lets hope he doesn't shirk it.

Make no mistakes about this, though: Bill Kenwright has become very very rich during all of this malarkey and he will probably be eyeing the top prize of ownership again. He's a wise old bastard and is taking Moshiri for a ride.

Where the hell is Usmanov in all of this? Surely he can't be daft too?

Great post, and not one about Moyes. Why Lyndon introduced him into his article puzzles me; he is the past and – whether he was good, bad or indifferent – he no longer has anything to do with Everton's present affairs.

A new board needs sorting out very quickly and by the owners with no interference from the shareholder with 1.72% of the shares, with a couple of shrewd businessmen with a sound football knowledge being an essential part of it.

Let's see how Benitez performs with his own team around him; he'll know who fits in and those who are surplus to requirements in all parts of the football areas.

He starts off with, I'd say, the majority of the fans not on his side but that will not bother him unduly. All he wants is time to prove he can do a good job for Everton; I hope he gets that time. Nobody can repair the damage that has been done to this club in a few months; that damage, which runs very deep, has taken a long slow painful number of years to get us to where Everton FC is now.

But for how long? Who made the original decision to bring in the DoF model? Who made the decision to now ditch that? What happens when Rafa goes? Back to the DoF model? Where is the long-term, strategic thinking?

Have we ditched the DoF model for short-term convenience? Possibly justifiably? Justifiable in that we are so close to relegation, despite the number of games left, that the immediate priority need is to get this team playing and win points, bolstered by January signings which serve that short-term goal.

So, have we had Rafa saying that in January he'll want to recruit players to keep us up, whereas Brands's thinking has remained as more long-term, developmental? And ne'er the twain shall meet...

But what damage does that short-term (necessary?) expediency (to avoid relegation) do to any longer-term stability of strategy? Whenever Rafa goes, and assuming we're safe again, are we back to the DoF model?

I can't see getting rid of Brands changing much; if anything, it'll make it worse. It's a backwards step for me.

Glancing at his signings, most have been hits for me. He's been unlucky, I thought, with Gbamin and Gomes.

The problem for me is Moshiri. I'm not saying I want him gone, but I do want him out of being involved in player choices and managerial picks. Isn't that was Brands was brought in for?

Until he takes a step back, we're going to be a dysfunctional club, chopping and changing between managers and having totally different types of players goes with that.

Mike de Asha's Twitter post fills me with dread...

If he had returned, however, the vocal members of the fan base would have been protesting about the appointment of another dinosaur.

Who is conducting the strategic review of the football structure at the club? Is there anyone there with the clout and the football knowledge other than the manager?

I agree with that except for some semantics. I think Moyes gave us a team we were no longer ashamed of, rather than a team we were proud of.

Unfortunately we're back in the position we were in pre-Moyes, of being genuinely ashamed of the team (and club as a whole) on a regular basis.

As for Benitez, he might be a dinosaur in some respects because he doesn't do gegenpressing or tika-taka – but, in fairness, he does do fitness, hard work and team spirit which we've certainly been lacking. That's also basically what Moyes does because it's an effective way to turn a squad of limited players into more than the sum of its parts.

You just cannot run a football club the way Kenwright is trying to do. All lovey-dovey, touchy-feely, back-slapping, the “Everton family”. It's a cut-throat business that has replaced the rag trade as the most ruthless.

We have had over 20 years of Kenwright's ideology. It has not worked. It is not working. As long as Kenwright is Chairman, our decline will continue.

David Harrison is to work with Mr Benitez for the time being. He's been Everton's secretary for the last few years, recruited from Man Utd and involved with all transfer deals since he came – just the paperwork and introducing the new players to the media and fans. Nothing else about him, maybe he will be part of the team that organises the new members of the board.

I ask because Brands, or whoever bought him, keeps getting slated for bringing him back to the club.

For me he should have been given another season, as he could score goals, more than 10 in that season, and he was a total leader that, for a long time, we have been missing.

It will be Kia Joorabchian.

Maybe they chose to get rid, once he insinuated that it was more than the players who were to blame? But I'm also sure he will be very relieved, once he realizes his money for old rope - job, has just got even easier.

But, we were also very depressing at times and, even with his organisation, we still got battered a few times and couldn't even muster a shot on target in a game or two. Moyes has done well at West Ham so far but do any of us actually believe that he'll start winning trophies for the first time when he's well into his 50s now? I certainly don't.

In theory Brands was perfect for us. I've always believed in young players/managers who are fresh. Much prefer that to old fashioned coaches. It didn't work out but it does seem our problems are deep set and nothing to do with Marcel himself.

I never wanted Benitez but with his experience and ego, maybe it's for the best that we stick with him and let him improve standards around the club bit by bit. Ruffling feathers is what is desperately needed at a club that has drifted for over 20 years.

Just play 3 in midfield tonight, that'll be a start.

It wouldn't be a surprise for him to recommend an agent led approach to recruitment (as per Wolves) - instead of a DoF led approach. Which might also see us get Coutinho on loan.

Whilst I sort of hate that model it has worked very well for Wolves - and also allowed them to freshen things up with a new manager while maintaining the same broad direction as a club.

Whatever we do, the key is to commit to a strategy with all major stakeholders pulling in the same direction - rather than continually to undermine the strategy.

What on earth were four doing making that decision, Kenwrong, Moshiri, Silva and Brands? I think the idea was Moshiri's to bring in a "big name" when he got Koeman; to become the next Big Manager along with United's, City's and Liverpool's successful managers. He might have had a big name as a player but as a manager he was nowhere near their standing! Perhaps if he'd had gone for Pottechino, before he went to spurs, we'd have done better.

But I don't think which manager they brought in; with the set up in the Boardroom all putting their oar in and no guidance from the Chairman. I think he just curried favour with the original board members, to get is way while in the background, If you look at him, and the current Spurs Chairman, (trusted by Lewis to make the major decisions) He takes responsibility. Ours just loves the limelight and hides when hard times happen.

Where is our Chairman now; when the Club who we all love, is in crisis? I think that Moshiri has been given by Ryantsov and Ismail, the pen picture of every board member and, at last!!!) has decided to take action.
I think Benitez has been taken on to bring the footballing side including the "Old Boy's rest home, the Academy" into a more focussed and a slimmed down organisation (I thought Sheedy was doing a good job but was forced out). If Duncan and Rhino had any ideas of becoming a managers, why haven't they done like Gerrard has done? proved themselves as Managers, istead of hanging about in the hope that the Limelight Lover, suggests one of "The Boys" for the post.
It' s very long overdue, and a frighteningly tense time; but maybe the clear out has begun at last.
My final thought is that a heap of blame is thrown on to Benitez for what has been coming for years. Someone posted about the bad player's he's signed over the years...Never mentioned the great players he brought in. I hope that he will be supported this season, not so much as any loyalty for him (though I think he was the best available for the situation the club's in.) The consequences of bringing yet another manager in or getting Big Dunc and Rhino in, would be disatrous.

When he gets sacked, and he will at some point. Does that leave a super agent calling the shots or does Bill go looking for Moyes MK2.

John 19.
Do you mean 'lucky' as in the Monty python sketch lucky.

Lucky..We had David Moyes, every season he lowered expectations whilst giving himself a pay rise.

Lucky.. we scored the lowest amount of goals in a season ever under Moyes.

Lucky..Moyes won nothing, not even a sniff against the big boys.

You have a strange understanding of the word lucky. Now if you would have said unlucky I would have 100% agreed.

How are the supports in any way shape or form responsible for a billionaires play thing. We are just the people that pay to watch. I don't recall a fans group having a seat on the board or having any say in any matters whatsoever.

I think we as fans have been ridiculously patient, expectations lowered to an all time low.

Suffering Kenwright for decades!

Moyes for 11 years without laying a glove on any of our traditional rivals, watching the club get mismanaged.

How are we responsible?

1)Get the current lads motivated, brave, focussed.
2)Get two or three ‘first team' signings in, first week of January.

We should know our place, laugh in the face of the Kopites who have much more ammunition to attack us than at any other time in our history, be thankful that we actually scored last week, and stop worrying that things might get worse and even quite possibly with such an owner and a set of idiots in the boardroom eventually go out of business.

Of course, the fans have called for changes in the past, because things weren't panning out on the pitch, the board/owner listened to those voices and somehow managed to compound each of their errors by making greater more expensive ones every time they made a decision.

So yes, perhaps, if the fans had sat on their hands and kept their mouths firmly shut the board could have watched on and done nothing at all and we might actually be in a better situation today.

Two down against our neighbours who were on another level, I think the reason that Everton stayed in the game was because of the brilliant backing they received from the stands, and but for Coleman's mistake, who knows?

Not one person in the media has praised this side of Everton's support, though, because it just doesn't fit the present narrative.

If and it is an if Benitez, the club is unfortunate enough to lose all six games, even four, draw one win one, we will see.
Moshiri, (Kenwright by his side if they are joined at the hip)could nose dive us into the championship.
New legislation, a regulator going to happen, tougher regulations surrounding fit to own a club.

Serious implications.
Will Moshiri cash in, sell the top players,all the squad,raise £300 million.
Taje the drop payment.

Suspend, stop work on the stadium.

He might take £200million for the club as a Championship outfit with a 20,000 fan base.
Sounds like half of what we got going now wont go anymore.

The stark reality is, we might be on the road to the Championship, without Moshiri 's deep pockets.

The senario is there for all to see.

Mr Moshiri will be in Monte Carlo, well out of it he might think.

Just a thought.

The issue of Moshiri communicating via Jim White also came up, and Kirkbride did make the point how grossly unsatisfactory the support base found this.

The 27 minutes for 27 years came up. Kirkbride noted that the club is well aware of the high levels of anger within the fans also.

To my mind, the campaign has been a huge success so far. We are now drawing media attention tothe serial mismanagement of the club, we're getting acknowledgements of legitimate grievances, we are hearing the club is aware of the issues and wants to fix them.
I'm not sure sitting there stupidly cheering the winless in the league in eight games would have accomplished the same thing.

Here's hoping this is is the very start of the long road back.

Old Kirkbride so "in the know" he was the last journalist in England to report the Brands departure. On the Jim White front, if White has forged a relationship with the man then as a good journo he's bound to use it. If The Echo don't have that kind of access maybe they should get better journos instead of whining about it.

As for sell to buy, I suspect that's what Brand's meant by vision. Rafa has said publicly we should sell good players so I suspect Brands disagreed on this point. As do I to be honest because selling an unfit DCL, and out of form Rich, or Indeed Pickford is unlikely to raise enough money to bring in the kind of quality replacements we need. I fear we will lose our better players and end up with more depth but the depth is purely numerical (e.g. bodies of journeymen) not quality. Rafa, Kenwright, Baxter, DBB, Unsie, toffee lady, kit man, stewards out!

I think Kirkbride was the last to break the Brands departure because he was busy collecting dirt for the article he ended up writing.

I see the Echo keep pushing this narrative but I think it's them that are unhappy about White more than the fans. His source is obviously Kenwright -- the fellow whose guest at the derby was David Prentice himself. The same Kenwright who has the Athletic on speed dial and has been sharing stories that make everyone other than him look back ever since Koeman and Walsh arrived.

I'm not defending Moshiri by any means. Clearly he is a fool. But I just don't like the transparent Kenwright propaganda machine trying to manipulate fans through the Red Echo.

We are not going to pick up many points between now and January, at which time we could - and probably will - be in the bottom 3. DCL to Arsenal and Pickford to Spurs is very much on the cards. Richie will not be a happy bunny.

A walk out at 27 minutes is not going to help the inevitability of the above, nor will it make Moshiri/Kenwright any more aware of the mess they have created - the league position, recent crowd reaction and social media tells them all they need to know.

I am dreading this walk out, in fact it makes me feel sick to the stomach at a time when the club and players need the full throttle support of every single Everton fan, otherwise the inevitable really will be realised.

Moyes never was and never will be the answer and unless we get behind Benitez and he himself gets to realise Rondon and Iwobi could well be his undoing, then I might just start looking to see who we will be playing next season. Ironically it won't be Rooney's Derby County, that's for sure!

We need to bring cash in to spend it, not because Moshiri is skint, but because of the rules. And our delinquency in breaking them.

They want to recreate the great success of cashing in on Lescott and replacing him with Heitinga and Bilyaletdinov. We can have a nice core of journeymen with that cash through Begovic -Tarkowski - Longstaff - Rondon. If there's a little extra we can pay Aaron Ramsey to take up residence in the medical center. Seems like the way to go.

Both moves totally changed the football structure of Everton and actually decreased accountability and enhanced conflicting agendas that had already existed in leadership at Everton. The old structure was miles better in comparison, as Lyndon says, though Moyes was never of the calibre for competition success. He may do okay stabilising things and suit an unambitious Board.

Benitez has now got the power to have the same control as Moyes, but there are structures and personnel in these enhanced unaccountable roles and the residue problems of the unambitious old structure pre-Brands.

Lyndon did not have the hindsight of the performance against Arsenal which showed the commitment and effort, but also the capability within Everton, that never made them a relegation candidate. .

The good news from this whole sorry saga is that Everton are back to square one with the original football structure being raised from the dead, and with the hope that something may be done about the unambitious, unproductive part of Everton that it was hoped that Moshiri with his money would have sorted out when he did take over the club.

Also that Brands will get a DoF job, in a suitable structure with a professional board, and prosper. Good Luck, Marcel. Everton just needs good management rather than luck.

Everton are a traditional English football club. A simple direct structure, both on and off the pitch, with the addition of people who can do the job and quality, guided by a tough, aware management, they can beat anyone.

I don't always like to have the Moyes discussion as he is Everton history and isn't coming back. Nor do I want him to. I know an entire generation grew up on it and still pine for it, which worries me for their expectation of the club. But I understand that at times like this, it can appear attractive.

I think Lyndon captures it accurately. You have to put it in the context of time. At the time, with our hope (that word) and expectation, why would we have gone for Moyes when we had the opportunity to get Ancelotti?

A serial European level winner who had managed the biggest clubs on the planet backed by a Billionaire. Or someone who hit a glass ceiling at Everton. Has never won a trophy. Flopped big time at United, despite many calls previous to that to "imagine what he could do at a big club with money". Embarrassed in Spain (that cringeworthy interview being on a par with the YouTube Tony Adams' training session clip). Relegated Sunderland and then initially had an uncomfortable and unpopular spell at West Ham. At the time, he was a failure. Damaged goods.

Credit to what Moyes is doing now and good luck to him. Our Grandfathers were brothers, so there's a family connection as well as an Everton one.

He had the fortune of inheriting a good squad. My boss is a huge West Ham fan and I was telling him pre-Moyes mark 2 they had a good team. That's the only reason I pay any interest in West Ham and, by default, Moyes as it generally takes up half of our weekly chats (he's an Essex ex pat living in Texas).

It will be interesting to see how Moyes copes with increased expectation. Has he learned or will he choke as he did on many occasions?

Nice to see him doing well again.