Championship Playoff Final

I like Forest, they're a proper club with excellent fans. Cooper has been superb and I had him as one who might have done a fine job for us. I hope they win today.

Uh-Oh... looks like that commentary stuff is fake news. The Beeb are doing Monaco and Indian cricket – What The Fuck?!?!?

Colwill playing #26 for Huddersfield.

Johnson #20 for Forest.

Operation Live Forum is go.

O'Brien for Huddersfield at 8. Was on my list of potential summer targets. Very hard working midfielder who can pass and tackle.

Half-Time: 1-0 to Forest.

O'Brian has looked good for Town, Brennan Johnson who has been linked with us has been quiet.

Has to be a penalty.

VAR is not being used as it should be.

It's being used to agree with the incompetent officials incompetent decisions.

Looked a nailed on penalty for Huddersfield , the Forest defender caught him ? The forward didn't help himself with his dramatics. A big 170m mistake if VAR missed that.

Cannot stand Jon Moss but I think he got that one correct Danny, I don't think there was contact looking at the replays, and he didn't have the benefit of the replays.

Now that was a pen

Jeff, it looked to me as if there was contact, the way the attacker's boot was clearly, severely deflected by the contact. Maybe they can see a better angle?

OMFG - stonewall penalty. With VAR, and John Moss. And despite CLEAR contact, not given. Unbelievable. Un-fkin-believable.

Its ok tho, cos hey, its not an important game is it. Nothing riding on this. Absolutely stunned.

And that idiot then gave the attacker a yellow for diving. Astonishing.

So its not just Everton then.

Two very strong penalty shouts. That last one on O'Brien wasn't even checked. The VAR is ludicrously poor.

Sam, it's got to the stage where I truly believe that they are, as far as they can, getting the results they want. It's becoming endemic.

VAR has become an establishment tool and in its current form is not fit for purpose. Mind-blowing incompetence week after week, or corruption, take your pick.

It really is utterly disgusting. If I was an Udders fan...

I'm sitting in the house and am genuinely not putting on this game because I'm sick of football these days. The officials are simply not good enough, and their lack of accountability is papering over a thousand cracks imo, especially when the favoured teams get away with absolutely horrible and ludicrous decisions, and their friends in the media, tell a lot of lies and help to talk them out of it.

The VAR isn't the problem, Sam. It's the morons who operate the system that are the problem. The VAR obviously covering for the on-field officials. Procedures aren't adhered to.

Moss has completely bottled his final career game, and he'll always be remembered for this appalling performance. Especially at Huddersfield.

According to the radio commentary, this is Jon Moss's last ever game. And for that, I'm pleased because I think he is probably the worst of a very poor bunch.

However, the thing that really bothers me is someone was sat in front of a slow-motion, frame-by-frame video recorder of both of those clear penalties, and didn't see them. Christ.

I wish someone had told me ahead of the game that the Premier League wanted Forest and not Town. Then I would not have watched in hope of seeing a fair fight. Utterly shameful nonsense.

That's all we need – another team in red & white.

I get what you are saying, Mike.

But until these people have to answer questions about their accountability, which then might even lead to people genuinely questioning their integrity, then the VAR has now becoming a major problem.

It hasn't taken away any inconsistencies, and because of all the technology now available, this should rarely be happening anymore.

All the ESPN commentators are talking about is the blown penalty calls. It has overwhelmed the game itself.

I don't like VAR because it adds yet another level for corruption to occur.

I think that the playoffs are an amazing idea.

Mike, Exactly. Drama over substance.

Sold as improvement, used for engineering talking points*. Hard not to get cynical.

* I should add; when not being used for corruption.

What is the point of VAR if it cannot rectify a clear and obvious error by the referee? Surely that is its purpose.

Then again Forest are the more attractive team – history, fan base – to be in the Premier League, so maybe that's the reason Huddersfield have been disgracefully shafted!

They are a bit slow on Sky to show us these game changing VAR decisions. Still waiting to have another look to see if I have misjudged. Maybe they want the Huddersfield fans well dispersed first before they show it.

Tony #28,

After a couple of comments above about the first penalty shout, I rewound to the 73rd minute and watched it on the slo-mo replay 3 more times and I'm still convinced Colback, the Forest defender does not touch the Huddersfield forward; it looked like a dive to me.

However the second one was a clumsy challenge and the Forest defender got no part of the ball, nailed on penalty. VAR looked but didn't see it, ridiculous.

Just watched the replays and it is clear as day to me there is contact, a clear penalty, can't believe it was not spotted if the VAR had that angle.

Who needs angles, Tony? It was only two weeks ago that Carragher was on Sky Sports saying Richarlison's shirt pull wasn't a penalty because it was only shown in slow motion!

Tony, I didn't know Carragher said that, is he now so revered by Sky that he is making the rules up himself? They should have a contract clause, “three complete bullshit statements and your out “. But there again he's already got away with worse behaviour.

That ignored shirt pulling half off Richie's back decision came very close to relegating us. If Everton were in Huddersfield's position today I'd have steam coming out of every orifice because of those VAR decisions. I feel sorry for their fans, they've been badly let down.

VAR was introduced in 2019 and we are still arguing about the incompetency of it
If anything it seems to be getting more controversial

I hate the thing, some are blaming not the concept of it but the halfwits who are interpreting it

I would like to see it completely dropped or at least suspended until someone works out how to interpret it consistently and fairly

The decision not to give Huddersfield a penalty should not be pushed to one side as just one of those things. The Club, players and supporters have been severely short changed by incompetence

John #33, VAR is not going to be dropped or suspended. No way. Video review systems have been deployed in various sports for decades (football is one of the last), and none has ever been pulled back, no matter how controversial. They get adjusted, tweaked, systemically altered so eventually they work better. But never simply halted.

Jeff #29, you might want to get either your TV or your glasses checked, because Colback's contact on that foul was clear and obvious, foot on foot, well off the ground. And he knew it. That's why he crossed himself when the decision wasn't overturned.

Why bring the VAR in for the playoff, when all season, the Championship has been played without the VAR?

All to do with getting maximum exposure for the TV showing the game, yet again the VAR was absolutely useless.

Expect more of the same next season.

How can we expect anything close to perfection with the VAR when our experts on TW cannot agree on the decision? The VAR is subjective because it involves a human to make the decision. It will always be controversial.

Tony Abrahams

Biased reffing apart aren't you pleased to see your old team promoted? I was quite excited thinking we have a resident former Forest player in the ToffeeWeb ranks to give us some insight next season.

I'm glad Forest came up as I'm a shameless nostalgic. I grew up in the years post Forest winning the European cup as Everton rose to the top. So from a young age I viewed Forest in the way I guess kids now see Chelsea.

That said, I don't remember us having a good record versus them lot but all I know is that from personal experience Everton are good when Forest are good. I'm banking on history repeating itself.

I'm happy for Forest, Kieran, but I've never really had that much of a soft spot for them, although I will always be grateful for the years I spent in Nottingham, because it left me with loads of great memories, and I also met loads of great people along the way.

I think I got more excitement watching the highlights of Forest's youth team playing at Old Trafford in the final of the FA Youth cup, (we got beat in the semi's) but it does please me that Forest, are playing a lot of decent football, because that was definitely how they operated when I was lucky enough to be there, even if it was a lifetime ago.

It's funny and I know I'm stereotyping a fanbase again, but I've never really liked Forest. Or the East Midlands teams in general.

Maybe it's their supporters. Always found them an odd bunch. Even more odd than their West Midlands cousins (I hope she's not reading).

Maybe it's a few disappointing trips there in the 80s stood and climbing on the floodlight in the corner of the uncovered end that used to be the away section influenced me.

I don't know. Fantastic achievement for them but I won't be wishing them too well. At least Nottingham is easier for me to get to than Huddersfield.

Danny, its funny how we all see things differently. I've known people from Leicester, Coventry, Derby and Nottingham. All football fans and genuinely nice people. (I've worked for a large company based in Nottingham). Even though I did want Huddersfield to win I'm also pleased to see Forrest back.

Me too Joe. Having served in the Army for many years, I know people - good friends - from all over the country and the world.

That's why I'm always keen to emphasise the "collective" when I talk about fan bases.

Individually, I know some great Forest, Derby and Leicester supporters who are friends for life. It's the collective. I guess some would say it about us. My wife does!! Apparently we are idiots. I'll take that.

Mike (34), Mike I know you watch football in different countries all over the world through TV screens, is VAR used better for football in some of these counties than it is in England?

Ha Danny, I've just remembered when I took a friend (from down south) to Goodison about 25-30 years ago. I remember cringing when (some) of our more "choice language" fans around us started with their shouting, anger and verbals. I remember saying to her after the match, of course most Everton fans aren't like this.

I suppose every club has em, just that some clubs (we know the ones) have more.

They should allocate Var to ani ndependent body, perhaps with an ex player or a foreign referee. Or maybe a panel of 3 with unanimous decision standing..
Anything but existing referees who may/maynot have agendas.

Feel free to debate who should be in the VAR room, who oversees it, who the referees are...

It all misses the point. The VAR is not there to ensure the right decisions are reached. That is definitively, 100%, undisputably not what the VAR is.

We heard this season "we wouldn't give it, but we wouldn't have overruled it if it was given". No consideration of reaching the just and correct answer.

The current VAR implementation is ready for the bin. I just can't believe they're continuing with something so flawed.

It's actually made refereeing worse. They don't always make a decision because they have the VAR in the background. But the VAR isn't there to overrule referees' decisions if they've seen the incident.

The refereeing fraternity took an opportunity to get key decisions right for the good of the game, and turned it into a system that protects referees from being solely responsible for big decisions (or non-decisions).

The solutions are simple. But they're not happening. If they could have happened, they would have happened. So they won't.

Nothing is ever going to be 100%. But the VAR was supposed to make it more conclusive. The game has stopped, so if in doubt look at it and mostly make the correct decision because you have the benefit of a second look.

Repeat warning. Rugby Union does it well because they have competent officials and are open. We hear them going through the thought and decision process.

Football has implemented it in a manner that gives incompetent officials supported by another tier of incompetence another level to hide behind.

And then silence. Managers are fined for overly emotive comments in interviews they a obliged to conduct several minutes after a match when the adrenalin is still pumping.

Rugby officials talk throughout the match, especially on key decisions. For everyone to hear. Football officials are afforded the privilege of not having to explain themselves to anyone.

Noone is held to account. Like Kopites, let them keep getting away with it and they'll keep doing it.

Danny @46,

Best post I've read for a while, I agree with every word.

Why can't football follow Rugby Union with the refs having microphones – or have they a hidden agenda??

The first penalty shout was similar to Gordon's first penalty shout in the derby. There might have been contact, but the theatrical way in which he flung himself to the floor went against him.

In rugby, I've heard decisions not given because “he made a meal of it”. If you have genuinely been caught and lose your balance then fair enough, but if you feel contact and fling yourself in the air, or roll around holding your shin after being caught on the foot, then it puts that element of doubt into the refs, and the VAR's mind.

That being said, the second shout in both games was nailed on and the VAR was absolutely incompetent with both.

Ah well, Fatty Jon Moss's last ever game. He'll be sadly missed by the Asian spot betting syndicates (allegedly). Tha VAR is only there to ensure the fix is right.

The private sector company supplying unfit second-rate match officials and the VAR is accountable to no-one and rotten to the core. Anyone who dares to speak out gets slapped with a fine.

No doubt Huddersfield will be totally grateful for the verbal apology they might get in a couple of weeks time once all the pay outs have been made.

John #49, at least over here in Ireland the authorities investigate the match-fixers.

Seems in the UK match-fixing is a bit like football dope testing. Nothing to see here guys, move along please.

The possibility of Nottingham Forest repeating their feat of winning the title, the season following promotion, as they did in 1978, is minuscule.

It's chastening to think that the last 30 years has produced 19 titles for the City of Manchester, 8 for London and just 3 for clubs outside of those two cities – one for a club that you would expect, or at least in the eyes of the media, should be amongst the winners, and two for unfashionable ones: Blackburn Rovers and Leicester City.

I agree that the second penalty claim by Huddersfield had far more merit and still can't understand why the VAR didn't overrule the onfield decision.

I wouldn't rule out a trip to the City Ground as the opening fixture for Everton next season.

Also in Rugby they get pushed back 10 yards if they don't retreat quick enough. I just watched the cricket and they have the same system of review.

Everyone sees the same replay as the reviewer umpire and hear him asking for the different camera angles or technology.

The on-pitch Rugby and Cricket Refs never get asked to review on a screen.

It would probably speed up the process, if they had the same rules.

Do you think if enough teams ask for the same transparency it would happen?