Everton collapse in a gut-wrenching catastrophe

Frank is making me sick with his player selection and formations.

Why start Dom if there's no one to cross into him. I would have started Brainthwaite. Keane and Holgate in a back 4..

I have no confidence in them to do anything. They had at least better work hard for the team!

Otherwise we'll be overrun.

A winnable game if we play our best.

There's always an excuse for his mistakes. He was wrong footed last week. This week it was a difficult ball to defend.

But when does he turn a difficult situation into a successful one? As opposed to some thing difficult becoming a goal.

Sorry, but he's done.

Seamus and Kenny have not been good enough for last 2 years, to think they are suddenly now is naive at best, idiocy at worst. Both goals started down the flanks.

Whilst Frank keeps playing this defence, we are going to keep losing, and losing badly.

At least he's consistent.

Gary Jones (8) Exactly right. WE just completely wasted one more window.

Very naive tactics from Lampard. And DCL shouldn't be playing, he's off the pace.

But the big problem is Coleman's awful lack of pace he's finished, simple as. Keane and Holgate are the worst defensive partnership, they never know where the other is, they leave space open, they're easily beaten, they are both liable to own goals, and neither is a leader. And Kenny is what he is, an average right footed back up somehow playing at left back when we have a 20 million pound left back on the bench.

Keane and Holgate, I have to pretend we only have nine players as I can no longer stomach supporting Keane and Holgate any more than I can support Boris Johnson just because he is theoretically on our side (e.g. Britain)

Gomes, Davies, Iwobi, Tosun need to immediately retire and go into witness protection before anyone nails them for fraud. Godfrey, Kenny, Rondon maybe division one at best.

Coleman, Alli and Mina retire now. BK and Mosh do one.

Donny Van De Beek is hiding every time the defenders are looking for a midfielder to pass to.

Depressing.

What can you say that hasn't been said many thousands of times?

"Looking like" at what point do we realize he hasn't bothered to get him match fit after months and accept it's not "looking like he doesn't care," it's that he does not care. And even if he did care, he is Division one at best.

I was utterly wrong…..it was my comments that were embarrassing, nearly as embarrassing as this team.

It's hard to blame Frank for the shambolic recruitment, but he's added two expensive parts that are adding NOTHING themselves. He's not striking me as a brave manager who gives youth a chance, but a naive one who thinks character in training is the same as character at the match.

We really are in shit. Unless Frank grows some balls and plays the kids ahead of the Coleman's, Kenny's and Keanes, we are going down……the next Leeds.

Full backs way too high, that ones on Lampard.

Coleman is getting roasted every time.

Holgate is nearly as bad as them two.

Richarlison and DCL look like they can't be arsed.

Van De Beek is showing why he couldn't get a run for Utd.

Only Gordon. Allan and Doucoure look interested.

Mykolenko for Coleman, Branthwaite for Keane and Ali for either Van De Beek or DCL.

Make 3 subs to embarrass them into doing something.

The disaster of Kenwright and the foolishness of Moshiri allied to the worst level of recruitment and retention of players and coaches in Everton history are seeing to that.

I still support Lampard and his backroom team despite tonight's foolish tactics, but my word this has been a shameful capitulation even by our now established standards.

If we do manage to stay up we need to offload Richie and DCL for a £120m+ so we can do a rebuild and offload garbage like Keane, Holgate, Kenny and Gomes, besides from the crap that's put of contract.

It's madness that we spent the best part of £35m on 2 fullbacks who aren't yet good enough to play. It's no good thinking they might do it next season when we're in the Championship.

I wasn't expecting points this evening but I certainly wasn't expecting it to be so damaging, in terms of goal difference and morale.

Rondon a holding forward should have been on from the start. Calvert Lewin is a walk past for the Spurs defence. Doucoure and Allan bombing forward is suicidal. As for the defence Keane in wrong position. , Holgate in wrong position and Colman with absolutely no cover.

The second half looks as bad.

Everton set up to play at home and placing right into play for Conte tactics. Conte has not even implemented his full tactics I bet. He could go home now and watch TV. Braihwaite on for Keane means Frank is blaming him. , needed to change alot more than just Keane position.

Frank must see now that he is faced with both incompetence and worse still in my view, gutless.

I wonder what Kenwright thinks about these 'good times'

But if we are relegated, there can be no complaints whatsoever about ill fortune or any other excuse; it will be because we are institutionally shit.

We're too scared to give new kids a run, we've relegated Dobbin and Onyango back to kids, sent Simms away to Scotland and won't give Jarrod more than a game at a time. We've hired a manager and entire back room team, but did so at the end of a window with no time to assess.

We are an utterly shambolic football club from end to end. SACK THE BOARD!

Just hope we can spawn a few wins between now and May

The players are poor and the Club is a shambles, but Frank tonight got the tactics wrong. I don't like saying that but I knew from the team selected and the first 5 minutes of play. He has changed nothing of value and the only saving grace is Tottenham will take it easy.

I am not saying Frank "Got it right," I am simply saying there is no "right" aside from the occasional fluke with these complete scum bags

We needed to sign fighters who hate losing. We have no spirit whatsoever and haven't had for years. I'll accept poor players if they roll up their sleeves and compete.

Coleman, Keane and Holgate are atrocious. 1 good performance in 10, on average, doesn't make them good. Donny van de Beek is a decent player but absolutely not what we need. He can pick a pass but not with statuesque forwards. We accept mediocrity: Kenny had a couple of good games and now we think he deserves a contract. Top clubs would get shut and look to improve.

If Rondon played like Calvert Lewin tonight he would be crucified on TW. Only Gordon gets any credit, whatsoever.

We were saying for weeks “we need DCL back”, “ we need Doucoure back”. Who is the miracle player now? Mina? Godfrey?

Even Carra has said our defence is Championship. Michael Keane is Titus Bramble but slower.

A series of managers who've not been able to turn this ship round.

I can't imagine where that will leave us, with our sugar daddy in hock to the Kremlin, a ground that won't get built, a whole new team to buy as they'll all have relegation clauses (fuck them, they can all fuck off anyway), and yet another new manager to find.

This is desperate stuff. I could fucking cry.

I can't imagine where that will leave us, with our sugar daddy in hock to the Kremlin, a ground that won't get built, a whole new team to buy as they'll all have relegation clauses (fuck them, they can all fuck off anyway), and yet another new manager to find.

This is desperate stuff. I could fucking cry.

A series of managers who've not been able to turn this ship round.

The damage was done with the appointment of Benitez and that kind of poison can take a long while to get rid of.

Ancelotti got this squad of players to a very respectable position last year and was still, and remains derided by many who visit this forum.

Not me.

We are going to be relegated and Frank will take us down. But at least he has experience at that level to try and get us out.

That's why we are where we are.

An absolute pathetic refereeing performance and he gave us nothing instead playing advantage when our player had just been taken out.

It was so wrong by Frank to play a narrow high line as I said before the game and before his appointment. He's going to struggle to keep us up because he continues to play the same open football no matter what.

It's as bad as when Silva managed us. No crosses, very little link up play, a wide open central midfield and defence with a few slow plodders that are not good enough.

Calvin-Lewin one of the best leaps and headers of the ball with absolutely no service all game.

Every opportunity we get we should be firing crosses into the box. instead we jog around, come inside and are forced backwards if we haven't already lost the ball.

Relegated with no financial backer, no Championship standard players willing to fight, no plans, no ambition and players that we will be forced to sell for peanuts because we are clueless.

Let's be Frank. We are abysmal.

Some stats:

98 team ended on 40 points, Holgte and co trending to 33 points

They conceded 1.47 goals a game, Holgate and co avg 1.84

Bad, Bad formation. Give us a shout, Frank, I'm better than Clement.

The whole team is brittle and every player is looking around for someone else to fix this. It ain't going to happen. Everton haven't a clue from top to bottom and I think relegation isn't the only danger to this club.

Like the rest of you, I'll be there on Sunday - after a five hour drive in my case - and we'll shout and shout until they kill the spirit, but it's dawning now that we are definitely one of the worst three teams in the Division. We've taken 8 points from 18 games. Why would that change now?

I repeat what I said weeks ago, our fate is in the lap of the gods. This lot may squeak through to safety but equally they may not get another point for the rest of the season.

Talentless and gutless is a combination deserving of relegation.

I've been one of Keane's supporters but the lad is an accident waiting to happen and has to be dropped. It sounds as if we were playing the ball around at the back, well Frank you better change that mate, because that's not how we got points away from home last season, call Carlo and ask him.

I'm not blaming Frank for the current mess, but it looks as if he's too adventurous away from home and we just don't have the players to do that, they may train well and say all of the right things but the bottom line is they are incapable of handling pressure and Frank will probably be another short-lived manager as he watches his 'star' players desert a sunken ship in the summer.

I'm getting to the point where I'm not even arsed if we stay up or not, that's not good is it?

It's true that right from the start Benitez set us up to be too defensive and we were constantly needing to come from behind. The mindset was ingrained then and by him. Now we're too far gone to change in the short space of time we have left.

Michael Keane is having a mare and should be taken out of the spotlight. How he had the nerve to ring Southgate to complain about being left out of the Euros squad is beyond me.

If the unthinkable happens and we go down then we're fucked and will do a Leeds and disappear for generations. Scary times but, injuries apart, I can't complain because we've been shite and deserve to be where we're are now or even lower if I'm honest.

The next 2 games at home are massive so let's get behind the team and drag them along because they've shown they can't do it without the fans.

Allan, Doucoure, Van de Beek far too slow in midfield. Back four even slower. The home games are our only chance of survival plus bad runs for our rivals.

It's imperative the Goodison Park crowd get behind them at home or else.

Meanwhile, a genocidal maniac engages in slaughter and world powers wring their hands and look away.

The nurse has just arrived with my medication.

Understandable points re Keane but the terrible truth is he's the best fit centre-back we've got.

Holgate tonight was unreal - continually playing 'clever' balls into teammates' feet that put them under huge pressure and no doubt he thought he'd done well. He should never play for us again. I'd far rather see us play Doucouré there.

Old Everton are dying, with the words during the second verse of that classic ("Old England) reminding me of an Everton great!

I said today the defence picks itself, and perhaps now that people in the media are calling it a Championship defence, Lampard might realize they need protecting much better.

I don't want to keep banging the drum, but there's only one formation for Everton away from home, and it's not the one that we are currently playing, considering that's 10 goals conceded in Lampard's first 3 away fixtures.

We are asking for top 4 form to get out of this. It will be luck not play that will save us.

Frank for the future may be? We needed big Sam for his experience of our situation. Please accept relegation now as the pain won't be as bad come may. Terrible night!

Spot on, Lad. Lampard's and Clement's tactics were poor.

We went toe-to-toe on an away game, for fuck's sake??? We should have taken a leaf of a big Sam side, but we went toe-to-toe????

I sense the Arsenal win, before Christmas, may still just keep Everton up, only just.

But the basic mistakes by the defence and goalkeeper can't be afforded by any team, and with such a ragged midfield, Everton defaulted to usual crap clueless numbing football.

This is looking worse than 1994, and 1998, as there's very little moral and courage in this squad and total lack of leadership on the pitch.

Frank and his coaching team have a big job this week to turn the hearts and minds of this squad into believing they can be winners.

The most painful game to watch in some time. Wolves is a must win game and let's hope Demarai Gray is fit to be in the squad.

Concerning that there's no confidence to take shots and no cutting edge in the box.

The fixtures left means Everton have got to stop the rot but with this squad it's the toughest job in the Premier League.

Not enough chances being made but, if they play as against Man City, then they can beat Wolves, but which Everton turns up remains to be seen.

I know where you are coming from. There were few football brains on the pitch for Everton, if they even cared.

It's dire now in that there's very few chances being made and very few efforts on goal.

No supply of crosses for Calvert-Lewin, it's hard to see where the goals will come from vs Wolves.

Which team starts will be interesting.

The battle to stay in this league is well and truly on.

I hope the club refund all travel costs for those that went today, that was as unprofessional a performance by Everton as I've seen in many years.

Pressing Spurs high up the pitch completely plays into their hands. Hence why they beat Man City, then found it tough going against Burnley.

Add to that tactical naivety a diabolical back 4 and it was only ever going to end one way.

And as for Dominant Calvin Klein up top, fuking handbag jockey... FUMING!

Holgate in contrast spends time looking at himself on the big screen when he makes a bad tackle.

Calvert-Lewin and Richarlison were the most ineffective £60 million strikers on the planet.

Okay, I wondered if anyone else had noticed Holgate doing that. Whenever there was a corner tonight, and the camera picked him out, he was looking up at the screen.

Seriously, he should be dropped just for that. What the fuck is he thinking? The only other player I've ever seen doing that is Christiano Ronaldo. And, I really don't think it needs pointing out that Holgate is no fucking Ronaldo.

One of my mates, who is not a Blue but was watching the game, made a very salient point. Holgate smashed the ball into Keane's face bad enough for the ref to stop play and he never even went over to him to see how he was. He said, "What's that all about?" He is spot on!

Kenny at left-back can't happen again; despite his efforts, it's not a long-term fix.

The down side is, if we pick inexperced players at home and they fail will, it destroy their confidence and possible their futures. If Mina and Godfrey were fit, I would bring them back in but they're not ready.

We can't keep picking players who continuinly let us down. Frank wants and is willing them to improve but sometimes you have to hold your hand up and say you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. The pain on Frank's face when the 4th goal went in said it all.

One thing I will say is Frank needs to play differently away. This agresive football at home isn't working away. 3 x 15 mins good starts then, Boom! 0-1 and the damage is unfixable.

I am sure Frank and all his coaches will have some sort of answers, at least I pray so. Please please hold your nerve, take a deep breath, and go with our boss – hard work on the training ground and with a firm resolve, we can and will come though.

Kenny might not be great, but Mykolenko looks worse to me.

Incredible, we sell Digne and buy two full backs, one of whom can't even get on the bench, let alone replace a knackered Seamus Coleman, and the other can't displace a stand-in left-back who's not even a Premier League quality right-back.

The score was not surprising as the defence has been shocking for years. Frank needs to find a way to stop them conceding; otherwise, we are Championship bound. Keep the games tight and try and nick it.

As stated by others, Coleman is well past it, Keane and Holgate are not good enough, Kenny is not a left-back. Playing the same players after each defeat is criminal. May as well play the new lads with Branthwaite and Godfrey for the next few games. Away from home, pack the midfield and then have Gordon off Richarlison.

Calvert-Lewin is not fit and, more importantly, not arsed.

I like Frankie but tactics and set up were completely wrong today. 3 at the back and a high press against a team that loves to counter! Crazy.

We have known for years that Holgate and Kenny are not Premier League quality and they are proving it now. Kenny never makes a tackle, he can't get close enough.

'Old England' came on about 10 minutes after posting that and I thought the exact same thing, only substituted 'Old Everton have died' for 'is dying'

The patient is not looking well but let's hope it's not terminal despite looking hopeless today. Not like Spurs are anything special but we will face some worse opposition and there are a few teams around us that are basically as shite as us. 17th will do me if we can grab a few wins and draws from the remaining fixtures.

Can't usually watch the weekday matches due to work, only watched today because I got in late from holidays last night and booked the day off. Thanks for the welcome home Everton. Providenciales seems like a dream to me now... and it's snowing here to boot.

He now has to root out the shirkers and big egos and give them an extended holiday in Dubai, or as far away from Finch Farm and Goodison Park as is possible, and choose from a squad of players who will work hard for the shirt in all games, home and away. Problem being which players to ditch and which to keep.

Only criticism I have with Lampard's post-match reaction is the mention of not having that bloody magic wand... who has it, why can't we find it?

I saw him away at Norwich and he was very poor. I want to give him a chance but, even with time to switch it on his left and move forward, he stops it and takes the soft option.

I'm not criticising Jonjoe Kenny – just saying he can't keep playing left-back.

We should have played 4-4-2 and left out Calvert-Lewin who added zero.

I suggest we play Kenny at right back and Myolenko on the left. We need Gray back and our attackers need to show more commitment. Gordon was head and shoulders above every other Everton player.

Dele Alli looked slow and disinterested again.

The next two games are crucial. I think Leeds and Brentford are worse than us so not panicking yet. I hope Frank can get us back on track and we don't regret not bringing Eddie Howe home!

My biggest concern now is the fans – they've given their all, but I don't see that bear-pit atmosphere returning any time soon as the team look absolutely done to me.

When the dust settles on this season and the analysis begins, there will be a catalogue of sheer incompetence that will be talked about for the rest of time – the time Everton found a billionaire owner and managed to fuck it up like only Everton could.

I predict, if we can not beat Wolves on Sunday, we are truly fucked. The only hope we might have is three other teams in the relegation battle might just do us a favour.

Seriously, folks, what a fucking mess of a club we have become – we are terrible. These days, if we win a match, it puts a smile on your face for 5 minutes – then we read some comments from the usual bullshitters in the team as if we have won the fucking league!

Keane, Holgate, Coleman, Kenny should be nowhere near our first team if we stay up. I haven't seen enough of our Ukrainian to make my mind up, but it looks like Lampard might not fancy him.

Dele Alli for a possible £40 million is a fucking joke in my opinion. Van de Beek is Klaassen Mk II, Allan tries but just isn't good enough, Doucouré can not pass the fucking ball, Gomes is shite.

Calvert-Lewin to Arsenal for £50 million? If true, this should be seriously considered – never in a million years will he be in the same class as Kane.

Lampard should never have tried to go toe-to-toe with Spurs with the payers at his disposal – he got it wrong.

Rant over!

No manager can legislate for players performing like that. Man Utd players were accused after their derby of giving up in the second half and going through the motions. Our lot best them by 30 minutes.

A bloody disgrace.

Buying other clubs' cast-offs. Something odd going on at the club with recruitment, I just feel the club always wants to take the lazy option than to actually put in the hard graft and scour the leagues and continents to unearth first-teamers.

Next week is now huge, in what essentially I see as win or bust for this club.

Any advantage we gained over the weekend was totally blown away tonight. This is going to be really scary from now on.

The only way out of this is a 4-5-1 formation. Just bore the fuck out of everyone and scrape a few 1-0 wins.

This is going to be totally alien to everyone, manager, coaches and players, and unfortunately it seems none of them can handle the situation.

Lampard and his backroom staff only know one thing… winning, but sure as hell, they need to adapt pretty damn quick as to how to survive a relegation battle.

Any decent centre-backs available? Pity, we can't shift a few of ours out there.

That's a hell of an epitaph, Brent. Someone somewhere will blow dust off a re-connected old screen to reveal those words in a couple of centuries. After a short consideration, they may guess it relates to some type of that old thing they heard of in History lessons – sport.

At least Lampard publicly acknowledged that Everton are actually in a relegation battle; it may help, it may not, but we can't keep playing well in big games and rolling over in others.

Safe journey home, Rob.

I honestly don't know where to start. Individual errors, pressing a quality counter attacking team away from home.

Lots of players are shrinking away from the fight game by game.

We need Godfrey and Mina back asap.

We are in deep shit.

So here we are, once again, on the brink of relegation and heavily relying on other results to help us out. What a shambles!

Keane is an absolute disaster and yet he is one fucking player who very rarely gets injured (except by his team mate). His partner at centre-half is worse than him!!!

Calvert-Lewin is starved of the ball but clearly not at the races when he does get it. He jumps way too early for high balls and can't go past a man when he does get a chance. He's making Rondon look good.

Richarlison, for all his running, is doing next to nothing except rolling around. Gordon was trying his best but kept losing the ball trying to do it alone because Allan was also way off the pace again.

Lampard simply has to get them compact against Wolves as we cannot afford to concede or we are done. Tactical changes needed as the high press is suicidal with this team.

Lose to Wolves and time to start planning for the Championship, I think.

Don't know if you caught it in the interview, Rob. Lampard said he was "Missing two of my central defenders from my first games".

Perhaps he has already figured who the real defenders are.

Calvert-Lewin is only motivated when he's hosting an Ann Summers party. He is now a pseudo celebrity destined for Big Brother. His all too brief pretty woeful career is all but over as he's had his head turned by fancy dress time with Tom.

It's funny you never ever hear anything about these three arseholes being impressive in training (like Walcott and Iwobi) or the hardest trainer (like Kenny) or leaders (Coleman, Townsend)... so why are they at the club? They bring nothing. They are shite and they don't even put in the extra hours in training to improve. Why? Cause they don't care.

It's embarrassing the reasonably good yet punny Anthony Gordon looks like Maradona crossed with Rambo in comparison. They should never wear the shirt again.

Lastly there's £80k-a-week Gomes. The slowest, laziest piece of crap in the squad. Ever see training pictures of him? Always dressed like an Eskimo. How are you going to run and break a sweat with more layers than an onion? Frank should make him train in his Y-fronts so he's forced to run just to warm up.

I wish I could hate Everton.

I can't.

The bad news about FIFA is that Gbamin will probably be back.

Great last paragraph.

He really should have gone 4-5-1 and bored then to death. But even allowing for crazy tactics, throw in Sunday league defensive errors (yet again) and that nullifies any tactics.

Seamus, please, please announce your retirement tomorrow. You must realise that the game is up. Michael and Mason, just fuck off. As Carra said, a Championship defence.

Frank: sort it out, make some bold decisions, even play kids rather than these charlatans.

There's been a few, a very few occasions, that I've walked out of the ground early after watching a shit display, but I've never turned the TV off watching us, until tonight. That's the last time I'll watch the shower of shite away this season.

I heard it was that bad, the coach driver had a whip round and paid the fans on the coach you were on.

Don't like singling players out, but why the hell not? These are fulfilling nearly every supporters dream and getting paid very well for doing it, so I don't feel any apology is due. Holgate, Keane and Calvert-Lewin were awful in different ways. So it was like playing with eight men.

We are in a very precarious position from here on in, and can only hope upon hope that other results go our way, and we can retain our passable home form.

However, I can't argue with much of what Phil McNulty has written:

Everton too bad to stay up?

The problem is that our current squad will not be moved by such an accurate and scathing article as most of them don't have any pride in playing for Everton. Lord knows there have been plenty of attempts by Evertonians in pointing out what's required from them, but they fail to listen and continue to play in the same slovenly manner most weeks.

After 50 minutes, I gave up and went outside to do some gardening. Watching more of it would have been a waste of time and electricity.

We have 8 home games and let's hope that the fans who have the passion can lift the loafers into action. I feel for the fans who traveled to watch that shit-show.

We are going down.

With the exception of Anthony Gordon, that was a shameful display, equalling the highest margin of defeat I've witnessed by an Everton side in almost 60 years.

And we were flattered by the score. An utter disgrace.

I didn't have a problem with the line-up. I did think the full-backs were pushing on too much though. It would have been nice to just be compact and tough it out for 20 minutes at the start; instead, we were 2-0 down in 17 minutes. Coleman and Keane in particular were like the Keystone Cops.

Richarlison did his usual trick of not turning up away from home. So did Calvert-Lewin, although he can at least say he is nowhere near full fitness.

I agree with Rob, we need 4-5-1 now. It was more like 4-3-3 tonight and it was too attacking. Our defenders can't defend so they need all the help they can get. I'm not sure Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin can play in the same side away from home. One of them might have to be sacrificed.

What a depressing night.

It's time for a survival plan. It's March and we're the worst team in the Premier League.

Right now, that plan cannot involve Keane, Holgate or Calvert-Lewin, who is completely unfit and probably not suited to what's about to come.

That was embarrassing tonight.

'If' is a massive word. It should not be used in the context of judging people. We don't know what's going on with this case so best left as it is.

On the subject of Sigurdsson, we may have given him a hard time for some of his on-field performances but one thing is for sure and that is we are a poorer team without him.

We are by far the worst team in the Premier League right now. Even when we get a result or play well in defeat, it is followed by a poor performance. Frank Lampard has to come up with something quickly.

We can't play our way out of this so it's got to be battles all over the pitch with no shirking of responsibilities. He must know that tika taka is not working so don't try it. We need Gray on the field for that game anyway.

Pure hard work and get the ball forward. If we can't do any of them, then we may as well pack it in.

He said we didn't have enough centre backs to play a back 3 and yet Branthwaite came on for Keane?

I've downloaded the 'full 90' but I don't think I'll bother watching it anytime soon, given the highlights gave me the collywobbles.

Sorry, still feeling raw.

And they still have me at Goodsion on Sunday.

This season reminds me increasingly of the Gordon Lee's final season – I was only a kid but remember Joe Royle getting a round of applause from the Gwladys Street when he scored for Norwich against a terrible Everton side. We survived only because there were three worse teams than us. If we go down now, we could be there for years.

I know he got slagged for his deep line and compact set-up away from home, but Frank should get Ancelotti's playbook for away games out and use it until the end of the season. He can implement the high press at home where the intensity generated from the crowd helps the players.

In the summer, we will probably have to sell Calvert-Lewin and/or Richarlison to fund buying players. Let's be honest, it will be year zero for a fundamental restructure of the squad.

Calvert-Lewin rushed back gives us nothing. Desperate playing him again when he's clearly not at it.

Keane… Get Kenny at right-back or anyone else.

Given how easily they roll over in away games, I'd just play Patterson, Branthwaite, Mykolenko with Godfrey as soon as he's fit. The usual suspects of Coleman, Holgate, Keane and Kenny should just play at Goodison from now on.

If the young players take their chances and perform away, they should then just replace the other four in all the games.

I vaguely remember that game at home to Norwich when we lost 2-0, Royle and Fashanu scored for the visitors.

However, there were actually seven teams out of 22 that the poor Everton side finished above in Gordon Lee's final season, and it did reach the Quarter-Finals of the FA Cup too, before losing at Manchester City.

Serious questions need to be answered by some of those players. And to cap it all, the missus just rang to ask where we are, and told me the next door neighbour had just got home.

Everton might find themselves passing through Birmingham next season, who am I kidding? Everton couldn't pass through any team.

Please don't anyone tell me I've bored them with my rants about Michael Keane and our centre-backs.

I called it two years ago.

Ancelotti realised the same last season when we ground out 11 away wins.

Frank was very naive last night in setting up the team as though they could take the game to the opposition. Van de Beek and Doucouré were consistently too far up the field leaving the defence exposed to the quick counterattack. Kane and Son are arguably the two best exponents of the quick counterattack. What did Frank think was going to happen?

While I think Frank could be the right man to take the club forward in the long run, I fear he may be doing so from the Championship. He has no experience of a relegation dogfight, seemingly finding it difficult to make the team tough to beat away from home.

The three away defeats since his arrival have exposed the fallacy that a change of manager was all that was required to improve our results. We have too many players who lack the quality and consistency to perform at this level.

When I review the list of dreadful signings we have made since Moyes departed, I am left apoplectic. Every manager has made poor signings while being given a ridiculous amount of money to waste.

Our naive "Management Team", in retrospect, were absolutely clueless in appointing these managers, all keen to take over a team with the history of Everton plus money to spend.

Quite frankly, I just wish we had appointed someone like Lampard in the first place. Yes, I think he was still playing at the time. Really I probably mean a "Lampard or Moyes" type, but not a Sam Allardyce.

The appointment of Benitez really put the top hat of "Football Mistakes" firmly on the table. What a catastrophic bungle!!!

As regards today's game, awful but I was around when Spurs beat us 10-4 with a Jimmy Harris hat-trick for Everton. However, today gave me even worse vibes because, in those days, we had not been spending huge amounts of money and there were signs of good things to come. Today, with the more serious financial problems, I find it hard to be optimistic about Everton.

However there are ways of putting everything in perspective. Just turn on the news and see about one more day of the situation in Ukraine. My problems shrink significantly and even "relegation" is not so important, but then I stop watching TV and I once more say "We just cannot afford to be relegated."

COYB... And try not to let Everton get you down. If you find out how, please let me know...

They should be treated to just fucking stoney silence, 'cos it's all they deserve... apart from Gordon, doesn't any one of our players give a shit?

Pathetic away day as usual.

We will be even later. Coach One is looking at 3:30 am back at Goodison. The diversion via Dunstable took us on a tour of Hertfordshire.

It's funny Carlo's outspoken critic isn't present here these days.

Danny

Sad thing is Keane will probably vie with Tom Davies for the captain's armband next year when Rooney's relegation battlers tackle Rotherham and MK Dons having sent Richarlison on loan to Fenerbahçe, sold Gordon to Palace, and given Delph a new 2-year deal.

Luckily the EFL isn't on TV here so I won't see Holgate sulking when he's benched for Lewis Gibson and Joe Anderson.

Yes, Moyes did make irritating statements towards and at the end of his tenure, but he could manage and make, if not silk purses, at least passable leather wallets out of sows' ears. What he's achieved at West Ham – more or less the London equivalent of Everton – illustrates that.

Also, why does it look like Van de Beek and the rest of the midfield look sooooo slow and like they've got no idea? Then also why are we playing a clearly unfit Calvert-Lewin? We should have played Richarlison as the #9 or Rondon, for fuck's sake.

Last thing: these guys I don't think like each other, there's no covering for your mate, especially on defence, no-one challenging the opponent when we get a hard tackle, no-one busting a gut, no pride...

We should have made the fuckers take the bus home, with no dinner. I only wish it hurt these pretenders like it hurts the fans.

Thanks but I don't want to see Andre Gomes getting ripped apart by Josh Bowler next year as he Jack Rodwells us: It's bad enough seeing these con-men play in the Premier League but getting Premier League wages for sucking in the Championship will be a bridge too far.

You are fantastic and I only pray that the players and management make up for it on Sunday.

The first goal he was nowhere to be found and indeed Coleman seemed to think it was going out so didn't immediately try to deal with the problem and then he should have slid across the Spurs player to either block the cross or slow him down.

The midfield seemed to have only one idea which was to find Gordon and, if they couldn't do that, then Coleman, who was behind him. In the second half, even that idea seemed to desert them which made it rather pointless having anyone up front. And we seem to have gone back to Benitez's slow start albeit that was the best part of this game for us.

Will we be in the Premier League next season? 10-4, over and out!

Thankfully Spurs seem to give it away after the fifth goal.

They say that they will be better at home with the supporters, but they are slowly trying their best to drive their support away.

I just looked up the final table, although to be fair we only finished 3 points above relegation. I remember that cup run very well and went to all the games - wins over Arsenal, Liverpool and Southampton and we were 2-1 up against Man City before conceding a Paul Power goal. Soundly beaten in the replay at Maine Road.

I hope Frank takes a far more pragmatic approach to our remaining away games, as we played right into Conte's hands with the high press. Did he not watch the Man City v Spurs match?

It was expressly evident under "knives-to-a-gunfight" Moyes, "disappointing" Walter Smith before him, "what-a-manager" Martinez after him, and then the rot really set in after 20 drought-ridden years with the sell-out to the bent Russian money clown, Moshiri.

Just who is responsible for all this mayhem? And why is he and all of his ass-kissing acolytes at the repeatedly useless Finch Farm still allowed to prevail?

I have seen nothing since he's been here to suggest he is what we need long term and I fully expect he will be gone when we're churning out the same results in the Championship.

In over 60 years of following Everton away, this is the worst defence I've seen. They look vulnerable in every game and roll over time and again. They were even 2-down, in 20 minutes, to a Norwich side which hadn't scored for seven games.

I hope Keane was subbed because Lampard had lost patience with him rather than because of being hit in the face; otherwise, he's back in the side for the next game.

Lampard got his tactics completely wrong and, every time we lost the ball high up the pitch, Spurs were scything through our back line. We were flattered by 5-0; it could have been a lot more.

If the relegation issue isn't sorted before the last match of the season, we're down because this side isn't capable of getting anything from Arsenal.

What a shambles of a season!

We have no midfielders who can sit and hold in front of the defenders. We have nobody who can play a through-ball to barren and rusty forwards making very poor runs.

The only bright spark is a teenager who unfortunately doesn't score either, and seems to be as wasteful of set pieces as most of our others.

We haven't had a single match with our best 11 available, before or after sacking the medical team… It's the perfect storm and, as it stands, we are going down. Not even a 'might' after seeing that.

Frank needs to gamble. He has to be brave and try something new and quickly, at least until Godfrey, Mina and Gray are back (no excuse!).

Go to 3-4-2-1 and stick to it, even if means a youngster or two at the back. Make Gordon, Dele Alli, Van de Beek and Gray fight for the 2 behind Richarlison. Put Calvert-Lewinin the U23s for a few so he can remember how to play after the fashion shoot.

Pickford
Welch Holgate Branthwaite
Patterson Allan Doucoure Mykolenko
Gordon Gray
Richarlison

I disagree. To win a game of football, you have to go ahead at some point. Frank set us up in a way for us to try and go ahead in the game and we actually started the game quite well.

Then the defence and Keane make a monumental mistake and the first goal goes in.

The problem is what happens next. Any belief in the team rapidly vacated and most of them thought the game was lost at that point.

That is the mentality and that is the disaster. A game of football is 90 minutes long and these players have to realise that they are obligated to keep going and to keep trying the things that the management are asking them to do. They have to find a way of getting something out of a game.

Lampard is simply trying to encourage his players to invite pressure at the back in order to create space in behind to give us a realistic hope of creating some chances. Clearly this makes Keane a nervous wreck and he is on the verge of a disaster at all times. He has to put this right. He's a professional. It's his job to do this. Easier said than done of course but he has to find a way.

Alternatively, he can't be picked any longer – put Branthwaite in, who may make similar errors but he looks like the type of character who's strong enough to brush them off and carry on.

It all comes down to belief. They have to find a way of believing that they can win games. Whether they actually can or not is another matter but, with no belief, then the outcome is certain.

I think we should not be too critical about Branthwaite. To a degree, he reminds me of a young John Stones. He looks like he has pedigree and should become one of our best defenders- calm and collected, not panicking -- at least with proficient team mates.

Did Calvert-Lewin win even one heading duel? Richarlison gave lots of energy but looked isolated. Hopefully Gray will be available for Wolves and Newcastle games. If we don't win these two we are just about dead certs to go down. After supporting Everton since 1953 I never thought this would be a possible thought.

We just need to give Patterson a go at right-back and give Seamus's legs a rest. It's no good watching Seamus berate himself when he starts falling behind. He's willing but the legs are shot.

I still think we'll be okay, UTFT

I've supported Everton since 1966 and I have never seen such dross as this lot. Only Gordon, Godfrey, Mina, Van de Beek, Pickford, Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin, are Premier League stock – the rest are not good enough.

If Holgate pulls on an Everton shirt again, then that's it for me.

Hats off to those of you who travel the country supporting the club every week, but I have no idea how you do it. My 4 or 5 games every season are spaced in such a way that, by the time the next one comes around, the depressing reality of watching Everton has faded.

But even watching in the comfort of my own home, and without the torture of a 7-hour journey home, last night was excruciating. This is the first time since 97-98 that I genuinely feel like we're getting relegated.

At least in that season, we enjoyed the 2-0 Danny Cadermateri inspired win over ‘them'… what would be the highlight of this season?

It's that very dangerous talk of the likes of you saying we will be okay and Up the Toffs that these players thrive on and cling to. I know you are being positive, I just think you will be saying the same with six games to go in probably the same situation.

This owner has once or twice got involved wrongly with manager selection and more (Iwobi, if true). That's fatal but, besides that, he's not a football man like most owners. He entrusted that part of running the club to you-know-who.

Perfect storm and I hope to god I'm well wide with all this and will be the first to apologise to the likes of Mark.

We can still avoid the drop, and last night wasn't a game anyone expected us to get anything from. But, like I've said a few times, we're running out of winnable games.

If/when we go down, the fightback begins in August.

It was like Newcastle away but on steroids. We looked okay but as soon as Tottenham wanted, they carved us apart with worrying ease. And then, our fragile bunch just folded.

Again.

Anyone who has been blaming this manager and that manager needed to wake up a long time ago. Yes, the managerial fiasco hasn't helped, but the simple fact is we need better players. I'm boring myself of saying that now as I've been banging on about it for ages.

I suppose the two go hand in glove. Give a manager time to build a team. I hope we finally afford this one that.

Calvert Lewin is a passenger up front, yet we have no one else to score. And then look at the back 4, which is an absolute joke. If you can't defend you are toast.

Add in the two new full backs that aren't ready, Gomes, Gbamin, Sigurdsson, Delph, Tosun, Iwobi who are finished, or either not good enough, and you have nothing left.

We are a horrible squad. Ffp makes any changes extremely difficult given past spending. Ukraine sanctions and sponsors ending is the cherry on the top.

This club is falling apart.

We all know that our defence is crap and our midfield is slow. So do our opponents.

I don't understand why people think we have a decent attack as they don't create chances and don't score many goals.

I think we must now be odds on for relegation and we won't get much for our ‘star' players:

Richarlison - 10 goals a season? Very few assists, loses the ball 90% of the time he has it. £35m tops due to his reputation.

DCL - one season wonder? Only effective in the 6 yard box or with long balls. Can't control the ball, pass it or run with it. £25m tops due to his reputation.

We would make a profit on Gray and Gordon, nobody else worth buying in our squad though someone would probably take a punt on Pickford as he is somehow England's No 1. It's that bad.

We're screwed at centre back and I'm not sure the return of Godfrey will fix that, although he'll definitely help somewhere in the back line.

We're similarly restricted in midfield and we have to persist with the three we had last night.

But ahead of that we need to get DCL off, Richy in the middle and get Gray/El Ghazi/Townsend out wide.

The reaction now by the players and the fans on Sunday is key. We're getting Wolves at a good time as they've hit a bit of a wall lately.

Relegation will be a disaster for the club. But it looks like it's happening. And Everton will still be here. And we'll have something to play for for a change.

The one who should be apologising is telling us that we have had good times - the man who looked high and low for an investor as you say who knows little or nothing about football and left the outgoing owner in charge - little wonder the owner was never let near the Arsenal boardroom - they obviously knew a thing or two Kenwright didn't bother to fact check.

Add in the sheer nepotism at Finch Farm - it is simply incredulous that after decades of failure these guys remain fixtures in any regime and it looks grim indeed.

Still in all of this, it's good to see they appoint a man with a wealth of knowledge about football matters to the management committee - although I await to hear the pronouncements of Mr Sharp on how he intends to use such knlwedge

Why did we buy / loan these 5 players in January?

Why has the recruitment been so extraordinarily poor for so long?

It beggars belief that players who failed Silva are still at the club, failing a succession of managers.

With this playing staff, it doesn't matter who the manager is.

Final point: disappointing though he was to many, Sigurdsson is a big miss this season. Absolutely bizarre what has happened there.

Ancelotti leaving was a disaster. At least he had a plan and executed it with some success.

If you can bear it, watch Holgate's positioning on the goals last night. Woeful.

Only Everton could spend £30 million on two full-backs, and then play the right-back( who couldn't get a game) at left-back, whilst leaving the two new signings off the pitch, when it's been obvious for a long time that they've needed a commanding central defender.

Brands had already left and Benitez never really wanted those new players, so who was responsible for their recruitment?

Even if Lampard has to learn on the job, I think it's imperative he's allowed to stay at Everton, long term, to sort out the shambles which Ray Griffin@68 described best, last night.

We are all hurting but saying Benitez wasn't terrible That appointment has put us where we are now. No ifs or buts – he is responsible for this mess.

Disaster of an appointment. Brings in average players because we have no money. Sells ourbest players and then the icing on the cake: buys 2 full-backs that wouldn't get a game for Tranmere for £30M.

The bloke has single-handedly fucked us.

At present, our 2 best players are a sub-standard right-back playing left-back, and a right-midfielder running around like a looney. Any coincidence that both are scousers with a bit of pride left?

The rest of them aren't bothered.

I said last season that Dominic had missed the supply from Lucas Digne and conversely, Digne had no-one when Calvert-Lewin was out.

Good shout, getting rid of Digne, right?

Every time I post I'm changing my mind. One minute I want 4-3-3 (I may well have selected THAT line up before last night) then I want 3-4-2-1, then I want real wingers. The problem is we don't have the tools to play any of those systems consistently.

There just isn't any obvious solution. That is scary and as depressing as shit. Under previous managers at least we had the hope of youth. But, that seems to have been naive (if we trust Frank) and even those on the fringes have now been banished and broken.

I provide solutions as a living. I solve my families problems. Fixing things is in my soul……but I'm beginning to feel utterly helpless here. I doubt I am alone.

All I can say is: play a consistent formation, force Allan and Doucoure to sit and protect like Carlo did, and for the love of Howard make sure only 1 of that back 4 is ever on the pitch at the same time.

The fact that we're playing Kenny at left-back pretty much sums it up.

It's gonna be very tight this season. I voiced my concerns about Lampard and his ability to organise a defense when he was appointed and those concerns have only grown. It doesn't help that the defenders he has at his disposal are mostly very limited (gosh, we miss Mina). Mykolenko and Patterson are increasingly looking like poor buys, for the short-term at least (usually I want long-term players but this was a season to worry about short-term!).

Luckily there are some other very poor teams in this league. It will likely come down to our form at Goodison and the crowd there may need to drag this wretched lot over the line; not that they deserve it. Sorry times.

Lampard has addressed these midfield problems with his immediate signings – even though it may prove too late and Alli is something of a gamble, Lampard's start and the stability he seems to want to offer are worth sticking with. The team he has put around him seem strong, too.

The absence of Calvert-Lewin and MIna for nearly all the season means we have lost five of our best players from last season which was quite mediocre and ended in farce. All in all we've lost the spine of the team.

Two away point since autumn is pathetic. You have to assume that only Watford and Burnley offer the chance of a return and they will fancy their chances. At the same rate of return we can expect one more point which means the pressure on the home games is enormous. We have to win at least five – Palace, Brentford, Burnley, Leicester, Newcastle and Wolves are all critical.

We've all covered the long-term causes of decline – chopping and changing managers, wrong appointments, short term investment, poor transfers, too many underachievers, too much unfulfilled promise, cruel injuries and the rest.

It is now far too easy to see us failing to win the necessary key games and turning into Sunderland, Derby or Reading – nice new ground, new league.

The recruitment since Moyes departed has been shambolic.

It will take the current manager a number of years to sort out this mess. I hope he is up for the task that he faces and is given the necessary support.

We play Wolverhampton next and a case has to be made to play Patterson, Branthwaite, Mykolenko, Alli, Gray and Townsend/Iwobi.

Sad times but this mess did not happen overnight.

The defence wasn't awful. There wasn't any defence to be awful. As many have said for a while, Seamus is past it – the legs aren't there any more. I'll argue with anyone who says he isn't committed – I'm quite sure he is, but he just can't do it any more. The rest just are not good enough.

Allan tried. He's not the fastest though but he got in the way far more than most. Doucouré wasn't too bad all things considered – but was made to look worse by those around him having no ideas. He got the ball but rarely had any way to do much with it. Van de Beek didn't play his best but he still did better than most of the others! Spurs looked like they saw him as the man to close down quickly because he might pose a threat in his distribution and they did it effectively.

Gordon was our most committed but tried to do too much by himself (again). Calvert-Lewin still looks unfit and did virtually nothing all match and didn't look like he wanted to be there. Richarlison as ever blew hot and cold.

But you can't expect an attack to do a lot if you don't get the ball to them – and we didn't.

So to tactics. Now there's a hell of a lot of moaning that he were too offensive early on and should have sat back. I can pretty much guarantee that, if we'd sat back and parked the bus and tried to hold out for nil-ni,l most of the chatter here would have been that we didn't even try.

Let's not forget Spurs are a team on the move – upwards – and away they were always going to be a very tough ask to beat. I wasn't expecting us to lose 5-0 but 2-0 wouldn't have been a surprise.

Are we stuffed? Well, not yet. We do have a few games in hand on some of the others but we're down to having no room to manoeuvre. Somehow I think we'll scrape 17th.

Then what? Well, we need, but cannot easily get, wholesale change at the back. So I suspect that means Calvert-Lewin has to go (for a huge sum – he'll be in demand). Others will go as contracts expire.

We do have a manager proven at bringing the young lads on and I suspect that's got to and going to happen. Next season, perhaps we can crawl towards to the top half but it's going to take time.

Let's hope Gray and a few others are back very soon.

Lampard was the last throw of the dice. He came in and told the players that, despite Rafa's insistence that they weren't good enough to play possession football on the front foot, he thought they could play their way up the table. I'm guessing he knows in his heart that he was wrong. Four defeats out of five league games, including ten goals shipped in the last three away games, tells its own story. Like Carra said last night, our defence is Championship at best.

Our recruitment has been abysmal. We've ended up with an unbalanced squad which, with the very odd exception, isn't Premier League standard. A club that sells a top defender and replaces him with two players who can't even get in the team when the competition is a right-back past retirement age, and a Championship-level right-back being played at left-back, is a very badly run club.

The only thing I can say is that its either a lot harder to run a football club than it appears, or we have just given the masterclass for future students of the game in how to mismanage a great club to the point of self-destruction.

What scares me is that this relegation is possibly not even the worst thing that will happen to us over the next couple of years.

By who?

Anchelotti's Catenaccio tactics was very unpopular.His comments that the players didn't have the technical and tactical ability to play open football.The team effectively down tools when he said they were not putting in enough work and effort.

Take Moshiri who has spent a fortune, players recruited and selected by a Football department and accessed by Medical Services and mostly trained by Everton stalwarts and look how Ancelottis comments sit.

It was them that dictated the selection criteria for Benitez and Lampard , convincing Moshiri it was not them that had wasted the resources he provided, backing their judgement.Everton just needed the right Manager who would have the players play open.attacking football, after all Modhiri had spent enough to win the Champions League.

As ever the problems run deep at Everton.There would be resistant to the Manager tactically trying to set up a defensive formation and nicking a goal on the counterattack.

Everton would have difficulty staying in the Championship with their current defending abilities and lack of defensive tactics.

BIG Sam was ahead of his time in the tactics he used and his assement of those that provided and prepared the team.

They could end a proud traditional.in football.

The Lampard dynasty, not just Everton in the top flight.

We have got to get behind these players, and not look back in anger, at least until the season is over. I just hope Lampard learned enough last night to see why we gave City a game, but capitulated once again away from Goodison Pk.

He could start by looking at the video of when his Chelsea side, systematically destroyed Everton, in the final game before the lockdown intervened, and then get on the phone to Ancelotti, who definitely changed the way he set up his team away from Goodison Pk, after that annihilation.

It won't matter if Patterson and Mykolenko turn out great over the next three years if we spend the next 3 years in the Championship.

Rob Dolby, I do absolutely get what you're saying about Benitez but none of us really know who to credit with Gray and Townsend (where would we be without them?) and for the 5 we got in Jan.

Apart from Gray and Townsend, it all just looks like the same recruitment shambles we've had in place for absolutely years now.

Keane - it's all been said. He's the most aggravating player I think I've ever seen at the club. It's now at a point where if he's playing, he'e guaranteed to make a mistake that leads to a goal. Last night he made several. Terminate contract.

Mason Holgate - I hate him.

Calvert-Lewin - there's a group of us who've never rated him. There's also a group who think he's a £50m striker, or at least used to think that. What a riot. People saying he's getting no delivery - have you seen what he does when the ball goes near him? He's clueless, useless and worthless.

A few have mentioned that Lampard should have gotten the mail on the players from Dunc. Some people still don't see that Dunc was and is a part of the problem and actually isn't all that intelligent.

I was wrong about Benitez. I actually thought he'd do alright. He didn't. However, I really do think the players were/are more to blame than he ever was. Same with Silva and Koeman before him. Ancelotti should be nominated for a Nobel prize in squeezing blood from a stone for what he achieved. Before I cop more abuse, I'm not saying those managers were amazing or even that good, but the players at Everton have gotten away with being far too shit for far too long all the while banking luxury wages to do it.

All in all, this team may survive the season without relegation, but it will be in spite of players like Coleman & Keane, and if they're still at the club next season, I'm going to take a break until they're gone.

The fundamental flaw in this squad is the collective standard of players and mentality.

It hasn't been helped by the managerial circus we have entertained the media with, but ultimately, it is player recruitment and coherence in the squad.

Let's get over the line. It can't get much worse than last night.

Can it?

The fundamental flaw in this squad is the collective standard of players and mentality.

It hasn't been helped by the managerial circus we have entertained the media with, but ultimately, it is player recruitment and coherence in the squad.

Let's get over the line. It can't get much worse than last night.

Can it?

My hope is that Gray and Gordon might provide DCL with some service. It is time to drop Richarlison.
My team for Wolves;
Begovic, Mikolenko, Branthwaite, Astley, Patterson, Van DB, Doucoure, Gordon, Gray, Alli, Rondon.

For Coleman being at the club 3 years too long, the same applied to Baines. The Everton Family, the peoples club tripe, ex players still hanging around and even one as NED. We are going to be relegated this season. A so called 50 million striker? (That can't actually strike a ball)

All of the criticisms on here, over last night's pathetic performance are valid ones, unfortunately that's the only consistency most of these players show in their game and we have to hope, that fuckin' word again, that they can somehow be forced/ persuaded to do what they are supposed to do and have a go and fight for the ball from the first to last minute of every game until this season is over and we eventually beat the drop and start on the long road to respectability with much better displays with a vast change in the playing squad.

Once again respect and admiration for the only brilliant thing belonging to this club us the fans with the away fans the top dogs in the club.

Fixing us long term is a different story, but if the end of the season is point B, then let's hope we've got enough home games to safely navigate us to point B!

He was 29 years old, 25 million was a good price, he hadn't been at his best for 18 months, long-term investment in younger players - all these reasons were deployed on here. We were in the shit at the time and we are now.

And as Tony A has said more than once, Benitez didn't want to spend £30 million on young full backs and Brands had left. So who made that decision? The glaring need for a centre back and box to box midfielder were ignored, as were the need to sign fullbacks who would actually start.

I cannot figure how how decisions are made are Goodison.

Pickford
Kenny Godfrey Mina Mykolenko
Gordon Doucoure Allan VDB Gray
Richarlison

I'd be drilling that team defensively between now and then. Get to half time at 0-0 in both games, and when we get the ball, give it to Gordon and Gray out wide to get us up the pitch.

I agree with what most saying about Coleman, but let's get one thing straight, I think he said a few months back that he shouldn't be playing, but he keeps on getting selected. So what should he do, tell Frank “No, I don't want to play”? Is it the right time now to throw Patterson into a relegation dogfight? If Frank wants “Experience”, then put JJK back into his natural position, and Mykolenko at left back, assuming that most seem to want Ben Godfrey at centre back. Yerry Mina is a big miss and is not scheduled to return until April, so who plays alongside Godfrey? Keane, Holgate or Branthwaite? Defence is our biggest concern right now, and it's something we simply have to put right in the next few games.

It's daft the things that suddenly come to mind, but I woke up thinking about next season, should the unthinkable happen. Have the club not taken into consideration the “Big R” is a possibility when they released the prices of next seasons season ticket prices? Mine works out at just over £30 per match, that's based on nineteen games. In the football league, every team plays twenty three home games, so will there be four free games?

Anyway, it won't come to that. I believe we WILL get out of this whole mess, but FFS, it's going to be mighty close.

So old as to have been about when we' went down' the only time in our history, I can never recall feeling so dejected by not only the team but the whole lousy set up that surrounds it. ( Don't give me Everton in the Community -that is a totally separate entity which was no training ground for a Premier League CEO.)

Already struggling to stay within EPL financial regulations, with ridiculous contracts to honour for often ridiculously inadequate players, there can be little prospect of funding both the building of a new stadium and the building of a new team to get us out of the second tier. Ironic, at this sad time then, that our 'new house' was to be built on sand as our proud City's dockland became a new Russian Front !

We can't blow opponents out of the water, because we don't have the creativity in the middle to feed the forward line.

Pack the midfield with workers and hope to shit we can get another 13-15 points somehow.

In attack, we can't wait for DCL to get back to sharpness, so start with Richarlison, Grey (if fit) and Gordon up front, and make sure they all track back like Gordon does. Bring DCL on for the last twenty minutes if we have to start lumping in crosses. Midfield has to be Allan, Doucoure, VDB because there is no safe alternative - I don't think playing Dele for 90 minutes in our situation is a goer because his mind wanders too often.

WIth regards to season tickets, we may be getting extra games in the Championship, but they're against Preston, Reading and Hull, so it evens itself out I guess.

Having said that we are where we are and the options are nonexistent. So for the remaining away fixtures I'd play the back 4 from last night, the 3 in midfield and have Patterson and Mykalenko as wingbacks with Richie up front in the hope we can bore them to death.

Tell the back 4 don't move further than the 18 yard line; they can't run so just low block it and see if we can squeeze 3/4 points out of the aways

Allan, Branthwaite, Kenny, Gordon, Townsend, Doucoure, Richarlison, Gray, Rondon, Begovic, probably Pickford and maybe Mykolenko. You can add Godfrey to that list when he is fit. Let's hope he is by Saturday.

As I see things it is between us, Leeds, Burnley, and Watford for the drop. I said after the Newcastle game that they wouldn't go down because they have “too many horrible players”. Unfortunately I feel the same way about Burnley.

Things look very grim to me.

The most successful away performances of late where very deep, turgid defensive jobs under Ancelotti. There were times, I think, where this had Holgate, Keane, Mina and Godfrey playing as a flat back 4 of CBs and the likes of Doucoure, Allan and Davies ahead of them.

Ancelotti was often criticised heavily for this if it didn't work and basically called a coward, but he knew what he was doing.

Unfortunately we are stuck with the squad we've got.

In this situation, Allardyce (who also knows what he's doing despite being an arsehole) introduces a low block, gets set pieces organised and uses a consistent set of experienced players to follow clear and simple instructions.

Hodgson does a similar thing.

We can't keep changing the line up, the formation or the style of play. The players can't cope with it.

Credit Frank in a way, he tried to win that game - but courage at home, cowardice away from now on.

Please stop giving the Championship a bad name, the standard is higher than that and nowhere near as error-prone.

A manager in the Championship would be asking, "What the fuck was that?" Championship sides could not afford to have an unproductive Everton backroom or Board and would not have space for an ex-player in the dugout.

I would actually prefer to watch Championship football than the tripe that Everton serve up every other game.

It really is going to be hairy from now on in and the unthinkable is now a distinct possibility. Only those players can do anything about it now. Do they want to? Are they up for it? Only time will tell.

Hopefully Frank's eyes are now wide open in terms of who should stay and who should go.

Losing James and Sigurdsson (cant believe I added him) has been a massive loss as at least they had some creativity.

It is simple – if you continue to play the same people who have been rubbish for the last 4 or 5 years and put us where we are now, you will continue to lose. Why can our managers not see that and give other people a chance to do better?

You can talk about formations, tactics and styles of play but it's all noise when the players you pick are just not up to it. You will only get the results and performances we have seen all season. For the love of god, how many chances do people like Keane, Holgate, Coleman, Iwobi, Gomes, Kenny and Pickford need before you try something different?! Give the young lads like Dobbin, Onyango and Welch a chance. Get Simms back from his loan too. Tell the 'senior pros' who have failed all season, they're done.

Shame on the players for that showing last night – most obviously have no desire, passion or pride in the shirt. The ones that do actually look bothered are just not up to it. Not a good mix.

Mind you, the managers and recruitment we have don't help. Why play a rusty and unfit Calvert-Lewin when you have a striker who had just scored 2 goals in his last game? Play the people in form!

Why fail to sign at least one decent central defender and at least one decent defensive midfielder in numerous transfer windows when everyone can see that's what we need?

I, like all fans, will not give up on the season until the last game is played and will not accept relegation until it happens. Unfortunately the players seem not to share this view and look to have given up already. Shameful.

His piss poor, bend over and take one to please the big boys attitude has ruined this football club, his stench of mediocrity permeates every inch of Everton from the bottom up.

We're going down and I hope we take that bastard with us. Fuck off. See you all in League One in a few years. I'm done with it.

From hindsight, Spurs allow us to have possession instead.

Also, we seems to go back to old days when Silva in charge. Moving the ball left and right then back and big kick. Foreplay after foreplay... And nothing...

Too many players in the team like carrying the ball himself. Then run into dead end. I finally comes to term that relegation seems a real thing now. We're not too good to go down.

It's a gamble. Gotta to be brave in relegation fight.

There is a time for playing good football. Now is not it.

I was not a fan of Ancelotti but some of the abuse he received for his football on here was short-sighted. He recognised the limitations of this squad and somehow got us to 59 points, whereas this season we will be lucky to get around 35 (which would be enough to avoid relegation I reckon).

Next season Lampard can try and get us playing the sort of football we'd like to see but right now practicality is king and away fixtures may well require the sort of 'cowardice' that sometimes harbours unexpected but crucial points.

Carlo's Everton earned 37 of those points on the road, which we wll be lucky to match from the whole campaign this time around.

As for the football under Carlo, it was mind-numbingly boring which, although sucessful away from Goodison, wasn't what was required for a team sitting in the Top 4 at the end of 2020. If the fans had been in attendance for many of those matches he would have been run out of Everton well before he made the choice to leave us.

This current situation is far different and away from home the team has to pinch as many points as is possible, whilst somehow managing to win 3 or 4 at home. I'm not at all confident that we will achieve even that meagre target.

Those games aside – and knowing this mob will mentally collapse if they go a goal down (especially away from home), Frank should be considering adopting a 4-5-1 formation and relying on counter-attacking for the rest of the season.

That in 2 of our last 3 games we have not even registered a shot on target should make this necessity clear.

Is it Coleman's fault that he's asked to play in every game? He's 33 not 23.

Benitez got rid of our only left-back, spent £30M on a left-back who isn't good enough, a right-back who only played 6 games for Rangers, and Benitez didn't even play him, so what does that tell you?

We have too many players getting massive money who are mercenaries. Mina constantly injured, Delph, (don't get me started), Tosun, Iwobi, Gomes, and the invisible man, that's what Frank has to deal with. Hopefully Godfrey is back for Sunday and play him with Branthwaite, play Kenny right-back.

If Frank can keep us up, he'll do a massive cull in the summer, and start afresh.

We played such a high line with defenders who had no pace to get back, and were cut through like the proverbial hot knife with a particular dairy product.

I really feel for the lads who ventured down in their hundreds, to lend their undeserved support. Long bus and train journeys and those who went by bus experienced the all too regular horrors of motorway madness resulting in accidents and long delays.

You could count on one hand the players that put even half of that effort into 90 minutes, the others were just pathetic, going through the motions, with no fear that relegation is a strong possibility, but why should they? In the knowledge that they will still be on megabucks whether they play Good, Bad, or downright Coyote Ugly!

Patterson is young, wasn't getting much playing time at Rangers, has come into a Premier League team struggling at the moment.

Mykolenko is young, playing in a completely different country and has the backdrop of the war going on.

Not easy times for both players.

In the old days, when players were allowed to assimilate into a new club, get a few games here and there, fans used to accept this. Good players will always progress if they are good enough.

Fans need to give players time before saying they're not good enough.

In normal circumstances, you'd be correct, but when you sell the only left-back you have, and the right-back at 33 can't be expected to play every game, the manager buys two established players who can play straight away. Benitez did the complete opposite.

We also probably didn't foresee further injuries to Mina and Godfrey, one who could perhaps cover at left-back. We also of course have one left-back on loan in France.

I still maintain fans need to give players time. It's just a shame we are always struggling or generally playing poorly when young players are chucked in.

Anthony Gordon had a fair amount of comments made against him in his early days. Still early days, but he's settling in okay at the moment.

Going back to the 1980s, I watched Graeme Sharp in what must have been one of his first matches away at Brighton. He may have come on as a sub. He was out of his depth totally and I remember saying to my Dad that I couldn't see him playing many games. Got that one wrong.

It was frustrating standing there watching that last night and travelling home.

We all get a free pass to vent after a performance like that.

I am now going to read all the comments. It's going to be an interesting read...

Their defenders were prepared and new were the danger would come from and as soon as Gordon got the ball the first player he went past he grabbed his shirt then the next one chopped him down. This continued until finally the ref had to book a player.Richarlison was getting the same treatment and how VAR again never asked the referee to look again at that tackle I was amazed, even the commentator said that is a real nasty tackle.

Once the first goal came, due to the high line, you could see the players heads drop,but still played to the same tactics and that is where Lampard should have reacted, surely they must have had more than1 game plan.

All though it is difficult to do, the players and staff have to forget that game, and starting today prepare for the next game. (whats the saying its no use crying over spilt milk.) You cant change a result but you can change a system and players but how many players does Lampard have that he can trust to do better.

I have missed a lot of games as I left for Canada in 1976, but prior to that I had been supporting Everton sinse 1954 as a 14yr old after playing on Goodison in 1952. I was a season ticket holder for 8 yrs but still hurt just as bad now as I did then with a loss but it is difficult to except players in our blue shirt performing like this.

The saying of its not over until the fat lady sings come to mind, and there are worse things going on in the world but that still will not help the anger I am feeling today. Hope someone can get these players some backbone to get us out of this mess sooner than later.

As I get older, my memory fades. I thought you had already given up and quit a few months ago. I guess you may have had another change of heart. All Evertonians are in the same boat: we get mad, frustrated, angry and constantly let down

The difference: most true Evertonians never actually "quit". Through all the problems, I personally have to stick with my team wherever we are in the league. Do you have another team in mind?

I commented on our two new full-backs on another thread. Not criticising them but questioning the logic of buying one who wasn't a regular at Rangers and another who, understandable distractions notwithstanding, hasn't looked much better than ordinary so far.

A view that seems to be shared by our coaching staff who prefer playing Jonjoe Kenny out of position.

Hopefully both will come good in time – but we really need better options now.

Perhaps home games against Wolves, Newcastle, Palace and Brentford are more hopeful, but with this group of players, who knows?

The lad did okay and I'd play him over Seamus right now. Seamus looks spent.

noun

1.an incompetent person:"the Everton player was a known incompetent"

adjective

1.not having or showing the necessary skills to do something successfully:"a forgetful and utterly incompetent, Everton defender"

See Everton, the entire team bar A Gordon.

So I guess the coaching this week will be more kicking up the arses than arms round the shoulder. Our next game is Wolves at home on Sunday, apart from the top 3 Wolves have the best goals against record in the league. But they are home to Watford on Thursday so will have only a couple of days to recover before they play us, that should help us.
There is no doubt that with our next 2 games being at home we have to make the most of that. Maybe Frank had a premonition when he told us fans a while back not to focus to much on our league position till we have played the games in hand, but when your down there its very difficult not to look at every result that effects our position. Lets hope things look a lot brighter after the Wolves and Newcastle games.

Say what you like about Everton, but they don't get relegated very often, and when they do, they do it in style. In fact, they've only been sent down twice. In 1930, a mere two years after Dixie Dean's 60-goal title-winning season, the Ev were relegated despite winning four of their last five games. They drew the other one, 3-3 at Manchester United, having been 3-1 to the good, dropping a point that would have kept them up. Then in 1951, their fate was sealed on the final day in a 6-0 humiliation at Sheffield Wednesday. “To abuse Everton at this stage” wrote Donny Davies in Big Paper, “would be too much like picking up a person badly mauled from a street accident and reading him a lecture on the folly of jay-walking.” Talk about slyly putting the boot in. A drop-kicking, if you will.

Whether the current iteration of the Ev are quite as hopeless as those particular forefathers is a moot point, though Monday night's 5-0 hammering at Tottenham doesn't exactly help. It's true that games between the two clubs are rarely predictable: Everton have won 5-4 and lost 6-2 at Goodison in recent years, while Tottenham's all-time highest goal haul in the league came in a 10-4 win at White Hart Lane in Bill Nicholson's first game in charge. (“It can only get worse” a deadpan Danny Blanchflower told the new boss as he ambled off the pitch and down the tunnel, whistling insouciantly.) But this collapse has come at the worst possible time, with Everton one point above the relegation zone, and what would be only their fifth season out of the top flight since the league began in 1888 now a very real possibility.

“I have no problems with the challenge” insisted Frank Lampard after this latest fiasco. That statement might not survive full scrutiny, given Everton have lost four of the seven games played since he took over, and in two of the other three, his team could only manage five goals in 180 minutes against non-league Boreham Wood and a defence given instructions by Marcelo Bielsa. Those early Goodison parties against Leeds and Brentford in the Cup suddenly look less the start of the honeymoon, more a dead cat bounce.

That may explain why Lampard went on to blame individual errors over any perceived tactical incompetence. “The first 15 minutes looked like I wanted it to” he began, his voice barely audible above the sound of running water and freshly soaped hands, “but the crucial part of Tottenham's game as a counterattacking team is to find space behind you and the players were aware of that and didn't deal with it.” Lampard went on to bemoan “issues that were there before me and don't take care of themselves overnight”, which is fair enough until you consider he's had 37 overnights now to address at least one thing, something, anything, and has only another six to work out a plan for the visit of Wolves that doesn't involve throwing his players under the bus in the post-match presser.

The Fiver

The next few games will be crucial. How well can Frank muster a positive, cohesive reaction from the players?

Talk is cheap. I'm interested in the action of the game itself. Who will be picked, who's will be given another chance, how will the manager set the team up and expect them to perform?

We may be all but relegated before the end of March.

We have been sinking like a stone for several months and the new inexperienced manager hasn't had the impact we all wanted and seems no nearer to finding the tools to reverse the trend.

The fact we carry very little to no threat going forward is more alarming than the shambles at the back.

I also happen to agree with him about Frank's press conference. It was not a good look for the guy who had obviously made mistakes in team setup to be blaming only the team.

If we go down, the financial impact on Moshiri would be catastrophic, even for a billionaire.

He didn't blame anyone individually, and he praised the only Everton player who could take anything positive out of last night's game, and also cited that only hard work would help get us out of our current predicament.

I hope Lampard learns quick, he's got to really, but like the manager before him, his hands are tied because he's got a squad of players with very limited character, and also some injuries to players in key positions, meaning he's got to persist with others who are just patently not good enough.

I also thought the formation was wrong, but Everton did start the game brightly, and every single one of the Spurs goals was down to individual mistakes once again, and only a snide red nosed journalist would call Everton, 'The Ev' – especially whilst we are suffering. He knows what he's doing imo, Mike.

I've only heard my red nose Wooly-back scouse mate call us by that name, David, and I detest it!

There's no question that Frank gives good press conference, but I would have liked it a whole lot better if he'd acknowledged his own mistakes as well. Murray's comment that he threw his players under the bus may have been unfairly harsh, but I'm all aboard with his main point.

Clive #299, that's a very good question to raise, but the answer may not be as dire as you project. Forbes reported this weekend that Moshiri had divested most of his shares of USM over the past 18 months and currently owns only 5%. Forbes also says he's sitting on a big pile of cash.

Everton FC's Russian Connections Could Hurt The Club And Its Owner

Whatever we want to call ourselves though we are in trouble. If we can get behind the team at home and generate a similar atmosphere to the Leeds game, we will be okay. It is a cliche but the crowd has a massive role to play in whether we survive.

However, the confidence of the team is so fragile that anything but 4 points from the Wolves and Newcastle games and we could well be toast.

Everton facing huge financial blow if they go down as players lack significant relegation clauses

Club are among the highest payers in the Premier League, with wage bill believed to be the biggest in the division outside the top six
By Matt Law, Football News Correspondent 8 March 2022 • 7:00pm

I personally don't think Lampard threw anyone under the bus, but these players will definitely throw him under one though, and that's why it's imperative that he learns very quickly, and also makes me question if Duncan Ferguson has much if any input now?

David @304, some other crowd get more credit, but they have got a much better team to get behind, whilst the media have us down as angry Evertonians. But that anger is only because of how much the team means to us, imo, and I'm sure it's something our crowd will prove once again, over the next 8 weeks.

Just on a side note, I'm sure many of the players have a relegation clause in their contract but, in my humble opinion, such clauses shouldn't be allowed – after all, it's these shite that will get us relegated so they should have the fucking decency to get us back up!

But, thinking about it, 'decency' and 'footballer' in the same sentence is stupid… my fault.

I can't get the article because it's behind a paywall; however, he infers that some signings will be on the same salary if the team gets relegated. Normally, there are provisions made to reduce the salary if the club gets relegated. The club won't be able to afford their wages in the Championship, thereby they will be forced to sell those players, probably at reduced fees – should the worst happen.

Obviously the better players will not want to hang around in the Championship, but those hangers-on types that we have signed in recent years will remain at the club on exorbitant wages.

He knows this shower are not good enough. Multiple managers have said it. Lampard knows what it takes to win. Duncan Ferguson doesn't.

We've been blaming managers. It's the random recruitment and incompetent running of the club.

Still simmering of that one.

Well in Farhad, the man who just keeps giving.

Good job the Rocket at King's Cross was open and serving when we eventually got there last night.

Colin Murray is a plonker.

Gabon ?

Derek ! We were like lambs to the slaughter last night.

“Why play a rusty and unfit Calvert-Lewin when you have a striker who had just scored 2 goals in his last game? Play the people in form!”

I think you haven't had a response to that question because no one can come up with an answer that makes sense.

Mike @ 284 no I haven't seen Nkounkou play THIS season but I've seen Kenny, Coleman and Digne put in some dreadful performances and so would of you. We're playing a first division right back at left back.

I was surprised to be honest, to see him start, and for those calling for Rondon's inclusion, we would have had to play differently (not a bad thing in retrospect) but to not even have Dobbin on the bench, strikes me as accepting the outcome, even before the kick off !

That is bollocks. Everybody knows the shithouses, it would take him a 2-minute chat with Dunc to establish who they are. Now if Dunc doesn't tell him, then he should be sacked.

Frank shouldn't be playing Keane unless a low block is required. Frank should have been blooding in the new left- and right- back. The back line has to change totally, the new left- and right-backs need to sink or swim and, if fit, Godfrey has to play with Branthwaite.

Away from home, we ensure no space behind the back four and Calvert-Lewin as a sub at best because we need a combination of Gray, Gordon, Alli and Richarlison up front – even then, they need a huge improvement in the way they play together.

The Goodison Roar won't be enough on its own to get us out of this mire, it will be teamwork and togetherness. Even then, I can't see us staying up.

As for Rondon I look at the last 5 goals he has scored (including his hat trick in the international and ask myself how many of those chances would DCL have converted? My conclusion - maybe one - the header against Boreham Wood.

I think Rondon has found fitness and form.

As for Lampard, I'm afraid that as much as I love his cavalier attitude for attacking football, playing away against Tottenham with Kane and Son, playing a high line with our back four was inviting trouble.

Hoping to sneak an early goal and then park the bus was a might gamble, especially with an unfit DCL.

We need points - we had one stolen against City with the VAR debacle. Against the top teams away, we have to make it as difficult as possible, get lucky and fight for every point at home.

I noticed Son saying a little prayer before kick off and then go out and try to injure any player that crossed his path, hypocrite at best.

The definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over again which does not work but expecting different results. It is a premise none of our recent managers seem to understand. They might tinker with the side but it is taking out the same old rubbish players who can't (or won't run) for more of the usual suspects who let us down constantly.

Time to get brave and give people who have not had a chance yet to show their worth. We can't exactly do any worse can we? We are getting hammered by teams, putting in poor performances and heading towards relegation anyway.

I would actually say one of our last truly impressive performances came when we actually put in some new blood with energy and passion against Chelsea away. Why not try that again before its too late?

The Harry Redknapp interview recently was telling - he might not be everyone's cup of tea but he knows his stuff. He basically said we have no energy in the side and can't run - even called Allan 'that little boy in the middle' as I recall which is telling of how others view us. He is right though - when you have people like Harry Kane outpacing your defenders and people running off your midfield, you are in trouble.

Of course there are exceptions, such as Barry, Digne when he first arrived, and and Lukaku. But our good players tend to be sold anyway, to provide money to buy more dross.

Now it seems we may have points deductions for spending too much money! You really couldn't imagine a worse way to run a football club. If we do get relegated, I don't see an easy way back. The standard in the upper reaches of the Championship is very competitive. At this rate, we seem to be turning into Sheffield Wednesday or Nottingham Forest.

Prior to Moyes I saw lots of terrible football punctuated with a single (plucky?) FA cup win. For me, football only really began in about 1992.

Apart from 1 season under Martinez, Moyes served up the very best. And I'm about to turn 43!

It's desperately sad and just hammers home how long we've been a bad side. It's much longer than 27 years in reality.

We're miles off the position we had with Moyes now. As demonstrated ably by our league position relative to that of West Ham.

For balance, I also found Moyes incredibly frustrating - but he did assemble about 2 different sides at very low cost which didn't quite make us proud but at least stopped us looking a total embarrassment.

Not me. We might be heading down the rapids towards a waterfall without a paddle, but I still have my standards for the club that has dominated large parts of my life and will do until the last breath leaves my lungs. Just because we aren't there now doesn't mean I will drop those standards or expectations.

The day we do that, we are in acceptance of mediocracy or even worse. I'm not accepting that. I'll never take a knife to a gunfight. I take desire, commitment and belief that I can win.

I know it's difficult right now and hard for younger generations to fathom, but the moment you accept that Moyes was a success is paramount to throwing in the towel. He and his Chairman convinced so many to believe we were punching above our weight. It created the plucky little Everton mentality, happy with the odd decent result and a 6th place finish.

No. We are Everton Football Club. 9 times League Champions with an unrivalled support. When we won our 9th title, Manchester United only had 7 to their name.

Sorry, still feeling Monday night. We all have a pass to rant this week right? Sunday can't come around quick enough for me. Fix it for me Everton.

To some degree you are right, Frank is finding out what he's got.

Unfortunately given our back four if he continues to play so open we will keep getting the same results. We have one PL standard centre half and he's continually injured. Ancelotti overcame this weakness by protecting his centre halves. He was of course accused of zombie football but being an experienced manager he set us up to be hard to beat.
It's fine having a football philosophy but if you don't have the raw materials to execute the plan it's all for nowt.

Lampard cannot afford to try and play expansive hight pressing football with our back line.

We need better players. A few managers have now given different interpretations of the "I'm not a magician" phrase.

The glaring obvious is stop blaming the manager and stop firing them. Look at recruitment and coaching.

The sad thing is, this is still predominantly the squad that was one game away from Europe last season.

How damaging to the club and the atmosphere has that Benitez appointment been? Poor judgement at the highest levels even though I suspect an unpopular ally in that sentiment could be Kenwright??

It's bad enough having to settle for mediocrity but I refuse to support the joke we've been for the last five years. Every single year there has been a crisis and with every false dawn comes the shattering reality that we're going backwards and have made the same mistakes.

I tolerated us selling our soul to Moshiri as he had money and thought we'd only get better. We now can't spend money, are worse than under walter smith and have spent half a billion to get there. We appoint kopites to manage us and have the most detestable group of players to have ever played for Everton.

Then I hear the usual “we need the fans to carry the team” rubbish. Goodison used to be the 12th man! We now need it to be a functional team otherwise we pay to see lads on 100k who can't be arsed to run.

Every inch of this club from top to bottom is dysfunctional. There hasn't been an ounce of positive news in years. How about we challenge the statement and say “give us something to cheer about”.

But I definitely do want more than 6th place finishes. I can accept Moyes gave me the best I've seen and still want more, surely?

I want trophies and Europe and some excellent football to watch.

Unfortunately I also know that in the Premier League era the general rule is that money talks. Teams finish more or less in accordance with their wealth (which basically determines how good your players are).

What I find annoying is that we haven't moved to find better ways of improving the playing staff, like investment in the academy, feeder clubs or recruitment from persistently cheap / good value markets.

And that is annoying precisely because I do want to finally (after years of waiting) support the sort of winning team you and others can remember us being but I cannot.

God forbid, I wouldn't want him back here , but there are some lessons to be learned from his management.

We've had the money to do both. But first you have to get to the resilient and hard to beat stage, then add a truly world class creative player to that rock solid foundation. Or in our case gamble on a young future one , then we could fly.

Manager after manager and DoF, scouts etc have failed miserably in achieving stage 1. The foundation.

It has been an, “I want it all and I want it now” attitude, reckless spending without a coherent plan.

Thelwell, Frank, Clement etc, have to build this foundation first and foremost, starting in June.

How can each manager result in the same outcome without actually fixing anything?

Paul Brown {whomever he is ] has weighed in on the situation, saying there is some ‘disillusionment' around the club, singling out the likes of Dominic Calvert-Lewin in the process.

Speaking with GiveMeSport about Calvert-Lewin and the squad, he said:

“He's [DCL] come back but he clearly wasn't 100% fit against Southampton, when I saw him play there. He got a lot of stick for not trying hard enough but Lampard said afterwards that it's going to take him a while to shake off the rust and get back to his best.

“There's a bit of disillusionment, in general, about a lot of the players in the squad.”

Or does Paul Brown mean stick from within the club?

Why not fight back then, do a Kuwait a la the '82 World Cup and threaten to walk? End the game there and fucking then, make a stand, that we're not going to be cheated no more by this VAR shite?

The footy world would know our fucking name then – Everton FC says "No more cheating us!"

Yes, we would be punished to the hilt... but fans around the world would think: "Good on yer, wish my club had the balls!" But we just take this shite, game after game, season after season!

As for the Spurs game, totally shameful from beginning to end... fucking spinless again!

- only a few managers make a real difference. Most just get you to finish more or less in line with the value of your squad. We credit managers with far too much. Potter and Lage, for example, are at well run clubs. I very much doubt they'd have achieved that relative success with us.

- the managers have been getting worse because the playing staff is getting worse. We have an unbelievably badly assembled squad, given the money spent to assemble it. And because we have no sale proceeds to reinvest, we can't even maintain the quality of the squad, let alone improve it.

We fix this by having professional, quality people with clear roles and responsibilities. Lampard needs to his job and others need to do theirs. I'm hoping this Thelwell guy makes a difference. But the interference / incompetence must stop.

Sorry, I haven't a clue whether he meant stick from the supporters or the staff, but I assume he meant the fans as he mentioned Lampard's reasons for Calvert-Lewin not being at full fitness. Much the same as the "There's a bit of disillusionment, in general, about a lot of the players in the squad.”

Does he mean the staff are disillusioned with the players, the players are disillusioned with the staff, or – more likely – the fans are disillusioned with the players?

It's just another example of so-called pundits saying what they like and us mere mortals having no idea what is truth and what is fabricated and of course the clickbait sites taking quotes and printing them with little or no context.

The elusive Paul Brown has popped up again with another apparent statement to GiveMeSport:

He told GiveMeSport: “Some Everton fans have turned a little bit against him because they haven't seen him a lot this season.”

The him being Calvert-Lewin. But while this seems to confirm the disillusionment is from the fans with the players, the reason for it seems odd. I wouldn't say I am disillusioned as I "haven't seen a lot of him"; I would say I am disillusioned because, when I have seen him, he's been crap.

Unless of course he doesn't mean "seen a lot of him" literally and means "seen a lot of him", eg, making an impact?

I know I am.

Paul Brown, Sports journalist for Daily Star, Express, Mirror. London football beat. NBA writer. Half-Finnish. Views mine alone. NSNO

Well it looks as if this blokes an Evertonian given the last 4 letters of his Twitter profile, who'd have thunk it? He does have a lot about Chelsea in his Twitter feed though. I wonder if Calvert-Lewin is half-Finish, cos he doesn't finish too many of his chances when they come along. :)

Oh and let's be honest all them away wins would no way have happened with fans in the ground with these butterfly blues. Especially the derby. He was just as hopeless as the rest of them, or just as limited.

Surely if you're 43 and only 7 years my junior you can recall what it's like to win trophies? My middle brother is 45 and he remembers winning the league in 1987 when I used to tie him to the ledge on the lower Gwladys Street with a scarf. Best view in the house!! He used to get one of those cheap orange juice cartons with a straw and a sausage roll at half time.

My poor youngest brother and son are of the generation that can only listen to me. I hope and believe their time will come. My brother attended Tottenham with me on Monday. Painful experience. My son, when he comes home next month is going to Wembley once we knock Palace out of the cup.

Not all Evertonians hear the call as youngsters. I'm 43 and I was lucky enough to find Everton at the tail end of the 1985-86 season, so I know the feeling – however distant now – of being League Champions.

Oh for such heady days to ever return. Seems almost beyond the realm of possibility now.

I have a notepad from the 1990 World Cup where I wrote down all the names of the players in each match I watched and convinced myself we must sign Tomas Skuhravy the big Czech striker. I haven't changed.

But the point is that your extra 7 years on me makes a hell of a difference.

Basically my formative years were spent watching bad Everton sides and brilliant Italian sides on Channel 4.

I once reminisced on these pages of arguing with my dad, kicking, screaming and, yes, crying. Why? I was only about 4 or 5 years old, but he made me wear a pair of jeans with a patch on them that had "Scouser" emblazoned on it. In my nativity,I asked him what it meant and when he explained it meant I was from Liverpool.

I literally saw red and was distraught. I was forced to wear them, but as soon as I got the chance, I ripped that patch off, threw it in a puddle and stamped on it. And yes, I got disciplined for ruining my jeans, but in my youthful tantrum I just didn't want to be associated!!!

I know, I'm a blind fool. But a Blue one.

But the best experience was without doubt watching us lift the FA Cup in 1984. Unbelievable day. After all those years of hearing my Dad talk about his 60s heroes, I was at Wembley watching my own ones lift a trophy.

I'd broken my leg a month or so earlier, but nothing was stopping me attending that. I was right behind the end when Sharp banged it in off the post. What an experience.

The last time Everton were Champions, Everton could play football as a team. At the moment, Everton are playing football fit for the Championship.

I thought Frank Lampard could get them playing better football, but he has 'fell under the spell' of playing Coleman and a 4-3-3 formation.

But the greatest football mystery so far, there is no starting place for Dele Alli. Yet, he wanted to sign him in the last transfer window. But has he found out that Dele Alli is not good enough for Everton, the same player who was not good enough for Spurs?

On one hand, I thought he was the standard targeted Mourinho scapegoat. He tends to do that at most clubs to tickle his own ego. Benitez was the same.

On the other, was he right? Did the player think he had achieved "it", got complacent and there is an underlying attitude problem?

Or, he's been out of the fold and not played regularly for so long that there's a lot of work to do in bringing him back up to match fitness?

Without knowing, there's probably an element of all of that in the equation.

You can dislike the man, the style of football or the fact he fucked off at the first opportunity.

You can't deny the numbers P67 W31 D14 L22

Patently better than those before him and since he left.

I've said before on these pages, Digne done it in the last game of Ancelotti's reign, at Man City last season. Davies overhit a pass and Digne blew out his cheeks and ran back shaking his head. 10 minutes later, Allan did exactly the same, only for Digne to run back, shout his name, and give him a thumbs up.

A cunts trick of the highest order imo, because anyone looking for excuses in life will always find them, especially some footballers – the ones who will always blame anyone but themselves.

I think the whole club needs a root and branch clear out on the playing side, because I think I see more “character and will to win”, watching some 8-year-olds play on a Saturday and Sunday morning, and I'm genuinely not exaggerating when I say this.

He did absolutely nothing before he was eventually replaced early in the second half, I think he is another one to add to our list of poor central midfield players along with Delle Ali who at least tries to look a bit interested while also providing very little, is he even anywhere near fit, the only positive things I can see in them is that they are both better than Gomes!!

Such is our desperation, it clouds over so many things, and is something we have probably all been guilty of. It's got to stop, but staying calm isn't easy in such desperate times, especially watching a team without leaders, watching players who never seem to get angry, but don't know the meaning of the word “calm”

I think what's even more impressive with Ancelotti's stats is he did it with largely this group of players who all other managers have failed to get a tune out of. I heard all the nonsense spouted on here about his style being anti football and boring, but he quickly assessed that the only way he could get results with this group was sit deep and attack on the break. As Frank is quickly learning this group just cant play in an attacking style, and while I applaud him trying to change our style he may have to revert to a more Ancelotti style certainly away from home.

Although I was sceptical of Mourinho's comment when he said getting Man Utd to 4th was one of his best achievement's it looks as if he was right given how they have struggled since he left.

I am lucky enough to have seen the team in the 60s winning leagues and cups and again in the 80s and playing really entertaining football. But sometimes as Ancelotti found out you have to cut your cloth to what you have to work with, and although that might not please many maybe we have to ditch some of our footballing beliefs to make sure we are still a Premier league team for next season.

I would take Everton results in Covid-empty stadiums with a pinch of salt. The real team you see in most away games with the roar of a crowd or an iffy ref or an injury. Pack of cards after that. Just my opinion.

This is the third manager in a row who has come out with the phrase "I'm not a magician". Neither am I but I'm just one of the idiots who keep believing.

At least be brave, Frank, and start Patterson and Branthwaite. If he's creative, we never have to endure Seamus (god love him) and Gomes again in a first team.

As for Brainthwaith, he's got to play imo, because he was the one player I saw shouting at others in anger the other night, whilst some of the others don't look like they've got the heart for a battle, or simply don't even care.

It's easy to start pointing fingered when things go badly and gloss over them when we're winning, but we're carrying a lot of baggage right now.

Dele Alli is a gamble and I'm not seeing anything that warrants his place in the team.

Calvert-Lewin. We joke about being half-Finnish but wonder if he is actually finished as he's been out for so long with what seems like minor issues.

Davies has his moments and May shine in a quality squad but is second half of the league at best.

Pickford is a player I don't understand. Is he good or is he part of the problem? He's great at shot-stopping but does he have control of our back four? Defensive displays suggest he may not have the control.

The midfield has no marshal, no leader and no guts. The problem is, bringing in an external midfielder who tried to take control is likely to result in resentment from the existing players as they want to take charge over the newbies – but that's what we need.

The thing is, I've never blamed Mirallas for how it transpired. He was a greedy forward, and that's how forwards should be. The blame lays entirely with the senior players who allowed it to happen. I can't even remember if Jagielka was playing that night, but he'd set a very poor example of leadership for the better part of 2 seasons leading up to it.

On the other hand, the defence from Monday night gives me no confidence that they can fight their way out of trouble – particularly Keane and Holgate!

However a defence of Branthwaite, Mina, Godfrey and Kenny or Coleman will be solid enough should they all be available for April and May.

Those training videos make me laugh and sum up why we are where we are. They seem to spend ages practicing shooting and most players are finding the net with decent shots each time. Come game time though, no-one wants to shoot – certainly from any sort of distance. Why practice it, if you will not use it in a game?!

Pickford for me is part of the problem and we should put Begovic in for the rest of the season. I accept he pulls off some excellent saves each game but he also makes mistakes in most games which cost us goals. Plus he unnerves the whole defence and is a big part of how jittery we are back there.

On Dele Alli, I'm not convinced he is totally ready or back to his best but why did Lampard not play him against his old club at Tottenham? We all know how football works and people normally play well and score against former clubs because they try that bit harder. He should have been in for that game from the start.

As for our current 'defence', I agree the usual suspects (Keane, Holgate, Kenny, Coleman) need dropping for good. Patterson must be given his chance at right-back, Mykolenko at left-back, Branthwaite and the best of the U23 centre-backs in the middle.

I know I have left Godfrey out, who might soon be back, but I'm not convinced by him. Another who has played a lot this season and been poor overall. Gets caught ball-watching too much. I left Mina out too as he hasn't got the guts for the fight I don't think and will only play 2 games before getting injured again.

Put some energy and legs into the midfield and up front with players like Dobbin, Price, Onyango etc... and that should help. It's a running game after all. 4-5-1 all the way and keep it tight when not in possession.

After witnessing the apocalypse that was Monday first hand, I realised the trains are all over the place on Sunday.

So I'm flying from Heathrow to Manchester and back to give them a chance to redeem themselves.

Fool. Idiot. Evertonian.

I know that other posters disliked the way that we got after Leeds, booing and whistling when they had the ball (suggesting that it was behaviour more associated with the other lot) but I loved it!

As a fan base, we are angry and frustrated but I hope that we are proactive and set the atmosphere rather than waiting for the players to do so.

On another issue ,I see that we are up first against Palace at 12:30 on Sunday 13th even though we are playing Newcastle on the Thursday. So less rest for the players and a ridiculous departure time on Sunday morning for the travelling fans.

I know how confident you are about a trip to Wembley but we are going to have to do it the hard way.

I'm not bitter or resentful over Carlo walking out. If anything I'm punch-drunk with what happens in L4 for half a century supporting Everton. It's just my opinion that Carlo wasn't all that... the kids derby a case in point.

Anyway, it's gone and we never even got the chance to see Rodriguez live in a game. So Everton that. Unlucky or cursed to the bone. Coyb for Sunday.

Undoubtedly no crowds levelled the playing field for home advantage. But guess what we played home and away.

The FA Cup game was a fucking embarrassment but of course on the flip side he did what no manager had managed in 21 years, he won at Anfield. And I don't remember many of us taking it with a pinch of salt on the night.

As I said you can criticise the style, the record stands up for what it was. Getting the most out of what was available.